Speaker 1: The ziti In podcast Network.
Speaker 2: It took me.
Speaker 3: A while to realize that I wasn't happy, and I
Speaker 3: was very blind to that. He looked at me and
Speaker 3: he said, one more time. Let's just try one more time.
Speaker 3: It's not always going to be this way, and you
Speaker 3: have to stick around to see that through.
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, welcome back to another episode of Hope Is Real,
Speaker 1: the podcast. The podcast designed to help you feel a
Speaker 1: little less alone, a bit more inspired, and of course
Speaker 1: a lot more hopeful. Now, today's guest is one that
Speaker 1: I know that I always say this that I'm very
Speaker 1: excited about it, but it's because it's very true, and
Speaker 1: I'm very excited about every single guest, but this one.
Speaker 1: This person is one of my closest friends. It's someone
Speaker 1: that I met on TikTok. If you're on TikTok, you've
Speaker 1: probably seen this person before. Anna Muller. Anna's story went
Speaker 1: viral last year. I think it was a story of
Speaker 1: a paramedic that saved Anna's life when they were struggling
Speaker 1: at their worst kind of point, at the point of
Speaker 1: not wanting to be here anymore. And it tells the
Speaker 1: crazy story that led up to that moment and everything
Speaker 1: that has happened since Anna went through a divorce, got
Speaker 1: diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and then decided to share all
Speaker 1: of these struggles publicly in order to try and help people.
Speaker 1: And Anna, like I said, is one of one of
Speaker 1: my best friends at someone that I met on on
Speaker 1: social media, which I know don't talk to strangers on
Speaker 1: social media, but this is one that worked out. We've
Speaker 1: been able to travel together. We have a thing of
Speaker 1: going to horror nights on Halloween. I don't know why,
Speaker 1: I'm terrified at all times, but we do it and
Speaker 1: we're going again this year, of course. But this episode
Speaker 1: is one that Anna is so raw and is so
Speaker 1: real about the struggles that they faced, everything that they
Speaker 1: went through, and also just the reality of what it
Speaker 1: is to live with mental illness, to live in a
Speaker 1: survival mechanism, to live kind of constantly on edge. But
Speaker 1: the bravery that Anna has shown the ability to tell
Speaker 1: the story in such a beautiful and meaningful way. And
Speaker 1: I will, of course, as always, put a trigger warning
Speaker 1: on this episode. Anna does talk about suicide attempts by
Speaker 1: Paula and all of that kind of thing, So please,
Speaker 1: as always, if you need to take a break, come
Speaker 1: back to it, call it text to help line, a friend,
Speaker 1: a family member. You are not in this alone, but
Speaker 1: Anna's story is coming up right after this. Anna, Welcome
Speaker 1: to Hope It through the podcast. Oh my goodness, it
Speaker 1: has been a minute. We've been trying to get you
Speaker 1: on since season one and then season two, and now
Speaker 1: here we are season three.
Speaker 2: And you'll meet it only two seasons later. But we
Speaker 2: met it will.
Speaker 1: I think our calendars just consistently we're clashing.
Speaker 2: But I know they were just like we're not working together.
Speaker 1: But I'm glad that this is happening now because we
Speaker 1: can talk about before I get into literally anything else
Speaker 1: in this episode. Major news. You have a ring on
Speaker 1: your finger. You are engaged. Yeah, yeah, what the heck?
Speaker 1: I need to tell everybody because I think that Cameron
Speaker 1: has set like a standard that everyone should be following
Speaker 1: to the point that he messaged me asking for permission,
Speaker 1: like me, your friend on the other side of the world,
Speaker 1: asking for permission and being like I assume you're okay
Speaker 1: with this, Like if I propose to Anna, and I'm like, yes, yes.
Speaker 1: It was the hardest secret I've had to keep, Like
Speaker 1: I just, oh my goodness. But we will talk about
Speaker 1: that soon because I've got so many questions and there's
Speaker 1: so many stories that will go into it. But first
Speaker 1: of all, let's just literally start all the way back
Speaker 1: to where we met. Social media it's a big thing.
Speaker 1: And I remember starting to see you on my TikTok
Speaker 1: and being like this person's cool and following you. But
Speaker 1: you had seen girl on the bridge before social media, right, yeah.
Speaker 3: Before I was even online, Like I was not doing
Speaker 3: anything online.
Speaker 1: That's wild. And then you join TikTok. What made you
Speaker 1: join TikTok?
Speaker 3: Not the way most people would think. I like, when
Speaker 3: I joined, I was going through it. I was in
Speaker 3: a very rough space. I think it was shortly after
Speaker 3: I came out of the hospital, actually, and I was
Speaker 3: so frustrated with like the mental health, like how that
Speaker 3: was portrayed in media.
Speaker 2: Which like not really at all.
Speaker 3: So I literally just set up my phone and recorded
Speaker 3: during my mental breakdowns and just talked to my camera
Speaker 3: and but.
Speaker 2: We're like, wait, this is me.
Speaker 3: I'm also having a breakdown over this, like I'm not alone,
Speaker 3: And so it started really crazy like that, but then.
Speaker 2: Turn into a whole different thing.
Speaker 1: And I'm so grateful that you did because it meant
Speaker 1: that we got to meet. I can't remember who slid
Speaker 1: into whose dms, but there was some form of DM
Speaker 1: sliding that happened.
Speaker 2: I don't remember either.
Speaker 1: I just I remember the first time we met was
Speaker 1: in La. Was it yes?
Speaker 2: La? Yeah?
Speaker 1: It was La. It was La La. And then we
Speaker 1: went to New York and then we did LA again.
Speaker 1: We have the tendency to be going to horror nights,
Speaker 1: which is our favorite thing to do. I love horror nights.
Speaker 1: There's much footage of both of us just losing it
Speaker 1: and you nearly breaking my hand, and some of the
Speaker 1: horror houses.
Speaker 2: And knocking us to the floor.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, because we're small as well, and so these massive
Speaker 1: guys with the chainsaws were just like bloody chase us
Speaker 1: around all the time and leave everyone else alone, just
Speaker 1: be following us through. It was terrifying, and yet we
Speaker 1: just kept going back because.
Speaker 3: Cursed feel good scary said something about us. I.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's not think about that too much. You
Speaker 1: can't overthink that.
Speaker 3: Hey.
Speaker 1: I obviously your story is has been widely known online.
Speaker 1: You've been very very open about it and the things
Speaker 1: that you've been through. But I would love to kind
Speaker 1: of go right back to the start, what was your childhood?
Speaker 2: Like, Oh, that's a question.
Speaker 3: And I say that because there's so much duality in it.
Speaker 3: I had so many great moments in my very young
Speaker 3: childhood that I remember and I loved, I'm very grateful for,
Speaker 3: but I had so many painful ones, and unfortunately those
Speaker 3: ones to go out a lot more and a lot
Speaker 3: of us. I actually didn't realize until I went to
Speaker 3: therapy and processed everything that happened in my childhood, and
Speaker 3: I was like, okay, so everything adds up. You know,
Speaker 3: I was a kid who had normal kid behaviors. I
Speaker 3: was a kid. The issue was it was mishandled and
Speaker 3: I was failed in a lot of ways. And I
Speaker 3: think at six I saw my first psychiatrists really just
Speaker 3: from behavioral issues. But again they were more behavioral issues
Speaker 3: because I wasn't being helped. I was very misunderstood and
Speaker 3: I wasn't being seen. And I remember I actually recently
Speaker 3: found those files from my psychiatrist when I was six,
Speaker 3: never got to read them before until now, and I
Speaker 3: remember reading them and the psychiatrist describing me at that time,
Speaker 3: and he said, you know, he described me as anxious,
Speaker 3: which I knew, but He also said I had learned helplessness,
Speaker 3: which shook me because.
Speaker 2: I don't know how a six year old has.
Speaker 3: Learned helplessness, and I really had to like look into that,
Speaker 3: and basically, it's like, you go into so many difficult,
Speaker 3: stressful events where you don't have control and you don't
Speaker 3: have a voice and you can't help yourself or it's
Speaker 3: being taken away from you, that you under you start
Speaker 3: to understand that it's not worth trying, like there's no
Speaker 3: point in trying, so you just stop.
Speaker 1: And that was in your files at six years old.
Speaker 4: Yeah, wow, yeah, that's that is not even something I
Speaker 4: can comprehend that as a six year old.
Speaker 1: A professional can sit you down and you are presenting
Speaker 1: so much in a way that that is what they
Speaker 1: are seeing, right, this?
Speaker 3: What that?
Speaker 1: So what do you think you were kind of like
Speaker 1: early signs were that there were behaviors, that things weren't
Speaker 1: quite okay.
Speaker 3: I really struggled academically, and that was noticed as soon as.
Speaker 2: I entered school, you know, first grade.
Speaker 3: I was getting help academically, and that really wasn't because
Speaker 3: I wasn't trying or not understand these concepts. I just
Speaker 3: learned outside of the academic box, which is common.
Speaker 2: For a lot of people.
Speaker 3: I didn't learn the standard way, and I really struggled
Speaker 3: to conform to that, and that's where help was pushed
Speaker 3: onto me in a way that made it was good intent,
Speaker 3: but it made me understand myself as broken and something
Speaker 3: needed to be fixed. So things really started going downhill,
Speaker 3: I would say third grade and then just kind of
Speaker 3: I feel like intensified up until my early twenties.
Speaker 1: Do you remember like a key moment when you realized, like,
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not normal and comparable you know what
Speaker 1: even normal is where you realized that your brain was
Speaker 1: working differently to your peers. Was it like a key
Speaker 1: moment that stands out to you for that?
Speaker 3: I would say it was sometime closer to third grade
Speaker 3: as well. I was being pulled out of the classrooms
Speaker 3: a lot. I was seeing different kinds of therapists like
Speaker 3: speech pathologists, I was seeing tutors. I was having people
Speaker 3: come into the classroom to be there to support me.
Speaker 3: I'm again, I'm sure it was good, intense, but I
Speaker 3: was seeing all these different services that were being given
Speaker 3: to me, and I would made me feel so different,
Speaker 3: And that was really when it sunk into my brain.
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm different, and not a positive way.
Speaker 1: What impact did that have on your teenage years?
Speaker 3: A huge one, A huge one, And I like get
Speaker 3: so frustrated looking back because I was like, there were
Speaker 3: so many things that could have been done differently to
Speaker 3: prevent what happened after that, you know it that kind
Speaker 3: of translated into bullying later on, and then trauma. It
Speaker 3: was like a mesh of just really horrible events all
Speaker 3: at the same time. I remember I was like thirteen,
Speaker 3: so that was my first sexual assault at thirteen, and
Speaker 3: that's when again.
Speaker 2: I say it's bullying, but it's very hard for me to.
Speaker 3: Describe it that way because sometimes you think of bullying
Speaker 3: and you think of people just saying mean things or
Speaker 3: making you feel bad, And for me, it was, you know,
Speaker 3: people were coming to my home and destroying it. We
Speaker 3: had the police at my home frequently. I was getting
Speaker 3: death threats, I was getting suicide encouragements.
Speaker 2: It was.
Speaker 3: That really really messed me up, and I was very
Speaker 3: very unwell. So as I was, I turned into a
Speaker 3: teenage addict essentially, like I had so much, so many
Speaker 3: distortions about myself and genuinely believed I was a broken, horrible,
Speaker 3: horrible person who was not loved, and I, as a
Speaker 3: young teen, I couldn't tolerate it. I didn't know what
Speaker 3: to do with that I had. I never learned those
Speaker 3: coping skills or how to regulate that. So drugs were
Speaker 3: the only thing that were there to make me feel like,
Speaker 3: okay for a minute.
Speaker 1: How old were you when you first had your first substance?
Speaker 2: Thirteen?
Speaker 3: Wow?
Speaker 1: Thirteen years old. If you could talk to the people
Speaker 1: that were sending you those death threats encouraging you to
Speaker 1: take your own life now, at the age that you're at,
Speaker 1: if you could face them head on, what would you
Speaker 1: say to them.
Speaker 2: I'm not angry, I think that's the thing.
Speaker 3: I feel bad that they were in a place that
Speaker 3: they were able to be so cruel to someone else, right,
Speaker 3: because you think of people who do cruel things to
Speaker 3: others and are hateful, and those things were taught, you know, like,
Speaker 3: people don't just come out of the womb being mean.
Speaker 3: I wasn't always that way. I was angry for a
Speaker 3: long time, but that was also very toxic to me,
Speaker 3: and I just I feel bad for them that they
Speaker 3: were in a place where something happened to them that
Speaker 3: they were there and that's kind of how that resulted
Speaker 3: for them. But it took a lot of a lot
Speaker 3: of therapy for me to get to a place where
Speaker 3: I'm not angry anymore.
Speaker 1: The maturity in that is phenomenal. I think, you know,
Speaker 1: I spend a lot of my time with high school students,
Speaker 1: and the message that we always put out is that
Speaker 1: usually bullies have a bigger bully in their life and
Speaker 1: that's what makes them feel like it's an okay or
Speaker 1: an appropriate behavior. And to get to a place where,
Speaker 1: even though the impact it had on you literally nearly
Speaker 1: cost you your life, alongside a whole bunch of other things,
Speaker 1: to be in a position of understanding that the common
Speaker 1: saying of her people hurt people is something that's so
Speaker 1: different to just hear the sentence and then to actually
Speaker 1: believe it and to walk with that and to have
Speaker 1: that kind of forgiveness almost is a completely different thing.
Speaker 1: And like I know that you know your teenage years
Speaker 1: very kind of similar but very different as well to mine.
Speaker 1: Of realizing that it was so different to what a
Speaker 1: lot of people grew up with. And I used to
Speaker 1: get so jealous of, like other people just living their
Speaker 1: best lives and like going on family holidays or waking
Speaker 1: up and being happy and being like, why can't I
Speaker 1: have that? When you started using substances, did you feel
Speaker 1: like that was like helping you escape what was going
Speaker 1: on in your head?
Speaker 3: Very temporarily? It never lasted, if anything. I mean, alcohols
Speaker 3: are depressent. It that one, that one really spiraled me.
Speaker 3: It was super temporary, and I immediately like bounced back
Speaker 3: into my other mental spirals, you know, it just and
Speaker 3: that translated to so many other mental health things where
Speaker 3: you know, I was engaging in other behaviors like self
Speaker 3: harm behaviors and then I was just in the hospital often.
Speaker 3: So like, yes, it took the edge off momentarily, but
Speaker 3: it never lasted.
Speaker 2: It never lasted for long.
Speaker 1: Did that obviously? When you started at thirteen and then
Speaker 1: kind of went through or teenage years, were you starting
Speaker 1: to try and experiment with different kinds of drugs as
Speaker 1: you were going on?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so it's like at thirteen I had my
Speaker 3: first drink, But actually alcohol never ended up being something
Speaker 3: I had an issue with, which is funny, especially now
Speaker 3: when I say I'm sober, people associate sober with alcohol
Speaker 3: when really what happened for me was I quickly went
Speaker 3: to things that were harder because I that wasn't enough.
Speaker 3: So I did that, and then I did start experimenting
Speaker 3: with really anything I could get my hands on. But
Speaker 3: I did have very specific like drugs of choice that
Speaker 3: I fell into more so than others, and those kind
Speaker 3: of like became my normal.
Speaker 1: What do you think you could say to people to help,
Speaker 1: especially like family and friends of people who are addicts,
Speaker 1: to understand how those behaviors and reliance on substance can form,
Speaker 1: because I think that society has already kind of boxed
Speaker 1: addicts into being one thing. But no one is born
Speaker 1: and goes, I'm going to do this one day and
Speaker 1: like that. It's just not that's not in the human nature, right,
Speaker 1: Like that's something that has come from needing an escape
Speaker 1: or needing to feel something else. Like what would you
Speaker 1: say to people who do are in that kind of
Speaker 1: more judgmental phase and don't yet understand how someone could
Speaker 1: get to that point.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's really important to know that no one,
Speaker 3: like like you said, no one wakes up and it's
Speaker 3: like I want to be an addict. You know, for
Speaker 3: some people it can start with experimenting with you know,
Speaker 3: it does happen with kids who are in middle school,
Speaker 3: high school. You know, drugs are around, drugs are prevalent.
Speaker 3: Some kids try it here and there, but a lot
Speaker 3: of times with addicts is they seek it out as
Speaker 3: a way to cope with pain. That's why typically you know,
Speaker 3: when you see an addict, they have like a typically
Speaker 3: a dual diagnosis right where they have they're an addict,
Speaker 3: but they also have depression, anxiety, bipolar, huge amounts of
Speaker 3: trauma PTSD, like these things coexist so frequently that it's
Speaker 3: not people don't quite understand with addicts that these are
Speaker 3: people who are really really hurting and they're not being
Speaker 3: resistant to be mean or to be difficult. They genuinely
Speaker 3: that's their way of handling things, and most of it
Speaker 3: comes from huge, huge amounts of pain and really not
Speaker 3: knowing where to place it.
Speaker 1: Do you or you've been very open online about getting
Speaker 1: diagnosed with bipolar, do you remember kind of what the
Speaker 1: process of that was. Were you diagnosed differently before you
Speaker 1: got the bipolar diagnosis, because I know that that can
Speaker 1: often manifest in ways that might mimic other mental illnesses.
Speaker 1: What was your process of getting that diagnosis, and then
Speaker 1: how did it feel when you did get that diagnosis.
Speaker 3: I didn't get that diagnosis until I was twenty six,
Speaker 3: twenty seven, but I can absolutely pinpoint when it really started,
Speaker 3: and I was twenty two, so I got it much later.
Speaker 3: And I never got misdiagnosed for anything that was never
Speaker 3: even on my radar. I didn't even think about that.
Speaker 3: So getting diagnosed was I mean, it was a difficult reality,
Speaker 3: but also a big relief in a way because it
Speaker 3: made so much sense, Like it made me understand that
Speaker 3: I wasn't like a crazy person. I had something that
Speaker 3: was impacting me that explained why I was behaving the
Speaker 3: way I was, because it was so confusing, you know,
Speaker 3: when I would come out of these episodes, it was
Speaker 3: like that.
Speaker 2: Like that wasn't me. I don't know how that happened.
Speaker 3: So there was a lot of relief that came with
Speaker 3: it because I could treat it. It was treatable and
Speaker 3: I could help myself, and that took such a whet.
Speaker 2: Off of me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I fully understand that. I felt like I felt
Speaker 1: similar when I got the ADHD diagnosis of going, oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, all of these things that I thought was
Speaker 1: just like wrong with who I am. It's just an illness,
Speaker 1: like my inability to reach out and remember that people
Speaker 1: exist if they're not in my everyday world, or forgetting
Speaker 1: everything and never finishing tasks like I was like, oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, this makes so much sense. And obviously you
Speaker 1: went through so much in your early years and then
Speaker 1: your teenage years, and then you got married, and then
Speaker 1: you had a kid, and then you imploded your whole life,
Speaker 1: and you did so on the internet so that everyone
Speaker 1: could see it. Can you tell the people that are
Speaker 1: listening that maybe have not heard the story before, or
Speaker 1: maybe haven't seen it on social media. You get married,
Speaker 1: you have a kid, what happens?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 3: I did the I did the marriage thing, I did
Speaker 3: the kid thing, and it took me a while to
Speaker 3: realize that I wasn't happy, and I was very blind
Speaker 3: to that for a long time.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: I developed postform depressions soon after I had my son,
Speaker 3: so that I'm sure contributed to how unhappy I was.
Speaker 2: But I remember.
Speaker 3: I almost nightly had to go on drives for hours
Speaker 3: at a time. I would drive by myself, really late
Speaker 3: at night, and it was the only way I could
Speaker 3: prevent panic attacks.
Speaker 2: I was so tired of suffering.
Speaker 3: I was so tired of upbringing that I stopped it
Speaker 3: in the most drastic way I possibly could, which essentially
Speaker 3: was asking for a divorce. I moved back into my
Speaker 3: parents with my son. I came out to everyone of
Speaker 3: the same day because I kind of had to. I
Speaker 3: quit my job. I had nothing, I'd have a cent
Speaker 3: to my name. I just left and that, even though
Speaker 3: I had nothing and there was so much loss with that,
Speaker 3: at least I was alive, Like that was my win.
Speaker 3: At least I'm alive and the most terrifying thing I've
Speaker 3: done and the most painful thing I've done, but looking
Speaker 3: back into hindsight, like I would have a hundred percent
Speaker 3: do it all over again.
Speaker 1: There's a story that has gone so viral online every
Speaker 1: time that you've told it, and I think it's so
Speaker 1: impactful because it resonates with so many people. And you
Speaker 1: obviously you were in this process of like you said,
Speaker 1: you were going to these intersections you I mean, you
Speaker 1: just so blatantly said that it was either imploded your
Speaker 1: life or you were going to die, which is such
Speaker 1: a massive, massive statement and I think is just shows
Speaker 1: how much pain you were in this this viral story
Speaker 1: that you've told for maybe people who haven't heard it before.
Speaker 1: Was this something that happened before you? Basically I keep
Speaker 1: saying imploded your life because that's the phrase that you've
Speaker 1: seen online before you before you did that or was
Speaker 1: it after.
Speaker 3: I So the incident with the paramedic, that the big viral,
Speaker 3: long more time story that happened while I was still
Speaker 3: with my ex.
Speaker 1: Can you tell us the story, what happened, what led
Speaker 1: up to it, And I guess the story up to
Speaker 1: the words that ultimately changed and saved your life.
Speaker 3: I was in the depths of my postpartum depression and
Speaker 3: that actually amplified my bipolar disorder. So those were really
Speaker 3: big things that were happening at the same time, aside
Speaker 3: from already being very miserable in my life. I you know,
Speaker 3: I had been passively suicidal at that point for like
Speaker 3: over a year, and.
Speaker 2: No one noticed.
Speaker 3: I don't know how no one noticed, and I tried
Speaker 3: very hard to make it noticeable, to do anything I
Speaker 3: could to ask for help without explicitly being like I
Speaker 3: want to die, because those are very hard words to verbalize.
Speaker 2: So I did my best.
Speaker 3: When I went to my last therapy session, and I
Speaker 3: don't think I could have been more clear about where
Speaker 3: I was at and was not heard, and that I
Speaker 3: went into that session knowing like this is my last effort,
Speaker 3: this is the last time I'm going to try. And
Speaker 3: after that, I'm I can't do it. And he let
Speaker 3: me leave, He let me walk, and I was so defeated,
Speaker 3: and I was like, no one sees me, No one
Speaker 3: sees me. So I drove home, and halfway through my drive,
Speaker 3: I started hyperventilating very quickly and to the point where
Speaker 3: I just wasn't it wasn't safe for me to drive.
Speaker 2: And as I'm.
Speaker 3: Trying to find a place to pull over and like hyperventilating,
Speaker 3: it's hard for me to see. I'm having this full,
Speaker 3: full blown panic attack. And I drive over this inner
Speaker 3: pass and I see this huge bridge, and I pulled over.
Speaker 3: I pulled over at the nearest parking lot, and I
Speaker 3: think I sat there for a good like five minutes,
Speaker 3: just panicking, staring at the wall. And the weirdest thing
Speaker 3: I randomly looked up into my rear view mirror and
Speaker 3: my son's car seat in the back, which was empty.
Speaker 3: Because with my mom, I feel like I always have
Speaker 3: to clarify that. But I saw his car seat and
Speaker 3: I was like, fuck, Like, I so badly don't want
Speaker 3: to be here, but I have a kid, and in
Speaker 3: like thirty seconds of courage, I super fast picked up
Speaker 3: my phone. I mean it helps that I was a
Speaker 3: little bit in like a blackout phase with my panic
Speaker 3: attack that I was not thinking clearly, but I just
Speaker 3: picked up my phone and I dialed nine one one,
Speaker 3: and I I struggled to you remember what I said.
Speaker 3: I essentially it was like, you have to come here now,
Speaker 3: Please send someone out, and they did.
Speaker 2: They came very quickly, which I'm grateful for. Now.
Speaker 3: By the time they got there, I was still panicking.
Speaker 3: They helped me get out of my car, they sat
Speaker 3: me down on the curb, and I'm sobbing. I'm having
Speaker 3: a hard time breathing. At this point, they're just taking
Speaker 3: care of me physically. They're getting my breathing under control,
Speaker 3: They're getting my blood pressure under control, they're getting my
Speaker 3: shaking under control. And eventually, when I kind of came
Speaker 3: out of that, we were able to have a little
Speaker 3: bit more of a conversation and I came down from
Speaker 3: that panic attack, and I remember being like I can't.
Speaker 2: I can't do this.
Speaker 3: And I think I just repeated that, I don't even
Speaker 3: know how many times, over and over again. I can't
Speaker 3: do this, I can't do this, I can't do this anymore.
Speaker 3: And I remember the paramedic was like level with me
Speaker 3: at this point. He was like squatting down and made
Speaker 3: very direct eye contact with me. And that's where this
Speaker 3: viral line came from. Was he looked at me and
Speaker 3: he said, one more time, Let's just try one more time.
Speaker 3: And that was the first time I felt seen in
Speaker 3: over a year. That was the first moment that someone
Speaker 3: saw me and broke it down into a piece that
Speaker 3: felt manageable, because the pain and feelings are so big
Speaker 3: that you don't know what to do with it, and
Speaker 3: it's really hard to process and regulate. But he broke
Speaker 3: it down for me in such a simple way and
Speaker 3: saw me in such a simple way.
Speaker 2: That I became willing enough.
Speaker 3: To go with them and help myself. And I think
Speaker 3: that if he didn't say that, I don't know that
Speaker 3: I would have come with them.
Speaker 1: I just it makes me emotional every single time that
Speaker 1: I hear it, for multiple reasons. I think seeing you know,
Speaker 1: the photos and the videos of you and your son
Speaker 1: now and going, oh my gosh, this kid still has
Speaker 1: you here because of that thirty seconds of courage, that
Speaker 1: thirty seconds where you pecked up a phone and you
Speaker 1: asked for help, This one moment that meant that this
Speaker 1: kid still has you here and when I get to
Speaker 1: see the incredible things that you do now and the
Speaker 1: life that you get to live, and the statement that
Speaker 1: I feel like both of us often say of like
Speaker 1: you haven't met everyone who's gonna love you yet, Like
Speaker 1: Cameron wasn't in your life yet, and you had no
Speaker 1: idea that there would come a time where you would
Speaker 1: know that kind of love, where you would know that
Speaker 1: life can be so shit that no matter what it
Speaker 1: is that you're facing, that there's just always hope. And
Speaker 1: I think the courage that you had to share that
Speaker 1: story is massive and it's one that has just helped
Speaker 1: millions of people. And I still to this day keep seeing,
Speaker 1: you know, videos of people who've got the tattoos of
Speaker 1: it done, and like the statement is really stuck with people.
Speaker 1: Why why do you think that one sentence of let's
Speaker 1: just try one more time has resonated with millions of
Speaker 1: people around the world.
Speaker 3: I think it comes down to that aspect of taking
Speaker 3: it like in such small pieces, because again, like when
Speaker 3: you're in a place where you don't want to exist,
Speaker 3: where you don't want to be here anymore, you're dealing
Speaker 3: with a pain that is huge, that is not manageable,
Speaker 3: and that doesn't feel tolerable, and it's really hard to
Speaker 3: know what to do with that, Like what do you
Speaker 3: do when you feel like you don't want to be
Speaker 3: here anymore and you don't want to try, and you
Speaker 3: don't want to help yourself, you know, Like it's people
Speaker 3: don't know what to do with that, and that's so
Speaker 3: valid because it's such a big and hard thing to manage.
Speaker 2: But that phrase.
Speaker 3: Made it possible for me to feel like I could
Speaker 3: manage one single moment and it wasn't all of it.
Speaker 3: I didn't need to fix the whole thing, but I
Speaker 3: could maybe hang in for one day, like maybe I
Speaker 3: can hang in there for the rest of the day.
Speaker 2: And I think.
Speaker 3: That's really helpful for a lot of people to hear,
Speaker 3: because again, it is so big, but we can condense it,
Speaker 3: we can condense it, and we can start with one day,
Speaker 3: like let's focus on today.
Speaker 2: That's it. We're not worrying about the future. We're not
Speaker 2: worrying about the past. We're going to do.
Speaker 3: Today and then we'll figure out tomorrow when we get there.
Speaker 3: And I think that perspective of making it super small
Speaker 3: and tangible when things are huge, it is kind of
Speaker 3: you know, one of the only ways for people with
Speaker 3: that much pain to feel like they can hang on
Speaker 3: is one day, one time, one moment, one second, one
Speaker 3: hour at a time, however small.
Speaker 2: You need to break it down.
Speaker 1: If you were standing outside that car, if you could
Speaker 1: say anything to yourself, what would you say.
Speaker 2: That's such an emotional question, Jazz.
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I'm gonna make myself emotional with it, but
Speaker 4: I literally just physically picturing it of like that intensive
Speaker 4: crisis that you're feeling that in that moment, this is never.
Speaker 1: Going to change, and you all these years later just
Speaker 1: being the third person standing outside watching this happen. Because
Speaker 1: there are people right now right that are in that space.
Speaker 1: What are you saying to yourself? It's as you're sitting
Speaker 1: in that car, I.
Speaker 3: Think a couple things, you know, One it's not worth it.
Speaker 2: It's not worth it, and two that.
Speaker 3: It's not always going to be like this, It's not
Speaker 3: always going to be like this, And at the time,
Speaker 3: it felt like the end of the world and I
Speaker 3: couldn't see past that. I was not able to see
Speaker 3: past that. But if I was able to understand that
Speaker 3: it wasn't always going to be like this, I might
Speaker 3: have been a little more inclined to help myself because
Speaker 3: I didn't believe it would get better in any way.
Speaker 3: So if I could really sit down and look at
Speaker 3: myself and just be like, this isn't worth it. It's
Speaker 3: not always going to feel this way, It's not always
Speaker 3: going to be this way, and you have to stick
Speaker 3: around to see that through. Otherwise you're taking away that
Speaker 3: opportunity from yourself. And that wasn't a thought that I
Speaker 3: think that was even evile to create for myself at
Speaker 3: that time.
Speaker 1: I feel that so deeply. I think when you've been
Speaker 1: in that space of literally life and death and believing
Speaker 1: that there's no possible way out to I feel like
Speaker 1: to then even just make it to the next birthday
Speaker 1: is so wild and I feel like, I don't know
Speaker 1: if it's the same for you. But even throughout my
Speaker 1: teenage years, like never believing that I would make it
Speaker 1: to my twenties and then suddenly it's like, oh, I
Speaker 1: have to like adult now, and I don't know how
Speaker 1: to do that because I didn't think I was going
Speaker 1: to be here and I haven't planned for that. But
Speaker 1: the thing that I always say is that like, as
Speaker 1: long as you're still breathing, there's still hope for change.
Speaker 1: And I think that just rained so true through both
Speaker 1: of our stories and through you in that moment and
Speaker 1: even all throughout your childhood and your teenage years, Like
Speaker 1: I just want to reach through the screen and just
Speaker 1: hug little Anna who I feel like even you're going
Speaker 1: through like the schooling system and you're realizing these behaviors
Speaker 1: that are developing. I remember one of the most powerful
Speaker 1: things that my therapist ever said was jazz, the behaviors
Speaker 1: make sense, Like you did the best that you could
Speaker 1: given the situation at the time. And I think for
Speaker 1: so long there was so much self hatred of like
Speaker 1: and being so angry at myself for these behaviors and
Speaker 1: the way that I would lash out and the things
Speaker 1: that I would do, and being like, why are you
Speaker 1: doing this jazz, Like you're so stupid, and then being like, oh,
Speaker 1: these things came from somewhere like this little kid who
Speaker 1: was just trying to protect themselves, who was just trying
Speaker 1: to feel loved in a world that is so chaotic
Speaker 1: around them. And so, I mean, I'm just so profoundly
Speaker 1: proud of you, and I'm so thankful that the world
Speaker 1: has you hear and that you've been willing to just
Speaker 1: share your story and share your voice because there are
Speaker 1: so many people that are struggling that feel the same way,
Speaker 1: that feel misunderstood, that feel misrepresented, and to just know
Speaker 1: that there is so much hope is just phenomenal. And
Speaker 1: I'm so glad that you made the decision to share
Speaker 1: this online like it's I know it's not an easy thing,
Speaker 1: and I know that you've been met with a lot
Speaker 1: of hate, just purely from when you came out and
Speaker 1: even now that you're engaged, and I see it all
Speaker 1: and I just want to bloody reach through the screen
Speaker 1: sometimes and just brush someone when I see these comments.
Speaker 1: But the bravery you've had is just incredible, and I
Speaker 1: will never forget. Just to kind of slightly transition that
Speaker 1: at I think we were at Universal Studios, one of
Speaker 1: the bloody theme parks that we went to, and you
Speaker 1: decided to film a video, and it was one of
Speaker 1: the videos that was like was it from the one
Speaker 1: of the like we don't talk about Bruno songs, not
Speaker 1: that specific song, but whatever the secret one was. And
Speaker 1: you turned to me and you told me something that
Speaker 1: the world didn't know yet. And my reaction in that
Speaker 1: video is my raw and real reaction, and I am
Speaker 1: so incredibly glad that it was captured because it was
Speaker 1: around the moment that you met Cameron, something that would
Speaker 1: have never happened, a person you would have never met
Speaker 1: had your story ended that day. And I just need
Speaker 1: you to talk us through, talk the people through, did
Speaker 1: what happened? How did you meet?
Speaker 3: What?
Speaker 1: Just tell us tell us the story and I will
Speaker 1: tell us the story.
Speaker 3: I will talk about the story forever. It's my favorite.
Speaker 3: I think, you know, to first touch on the hen
Speaker 3: around coming out. I think that comes from just so
Speaker 3: many miscons conceptions about gender sexuality. And in that video,
Speaker 3: I even told you like that was me telling you
Speaker 3: how things were evolving for me. And as I did that,
Speaker 3: you know, I was dating here and there, but nothing
Speaker 3: was sticking. I was really really having a part time
Speaker 3: connecting and I thought something was wrong with me.
Speaker 2: I remember it was.
Speaker 3: Two weeks before I went on my first date with
Speaker 3: Cameron that I remember talking to my therapist and I
Speaker 3: was like, maybe it's just like not meant for me,
Speaker 3: Like maybe I'm not capable of love because I've tried
Speaker 3: so hard and it doesn't work, Like maybe it's just
Speaker 3: not for me. And it was around that time that
Speaker 3: Cameron and I met up in person, so we met
Speaker 3: on a dating app, and at the.
Speaker 2: Time him and I were both very.
Speaker 3: We were not seeking anything serious. We were both very
Speaker 3: overcoming at that time, but we got along really well
Speaker 3: over our messages via text and we're like, oh, why not,
Speaker 3: Like let's just meet up, Like what's it gonna hurt?
Speaker 2: And Cameron and I will talk about it this.
Speaker 3: Day that we both can clearly identify that after that date.
Speaker 2: And it's so funny because he called all.
Speaker 3: Of his friends after that date and I was talking
Speaker 3: to my friends after that date, and we were both like,
Speaker 3: I don't know what's happening, but I feel like this
Speaker 3: is it.
Speaker 2: And that's crazy for me to say.
Speaker 3: It was crazy for him to say because all our
Speaker 3: friends knew we were so avoidant and so hyper independent.
Speaker 2: So we both left.
Speaker 3: Shocked and it was so different, and I never ever
Speaker 3: believed in that, Like I was one hundred percent of
Speaker 3: those people who were like, people are exaggerating love, like
Speaker 3: no one actually loves someone that much. That's not real.
Speaker 3: This fairy tale loves stuff like love at first sight,
Speaker 3: that's real. Like fully fully believed that. And then in
Speaker 3: that moment, I feel like everything I knew about love
Speaker 3: and connection with another human just he threw that right
Speaker 3: up the windows so quickly, And that said so much.
Speaker 2: That said so much.
Speaker 1: I remember you first telling me about him, and even me,
Speaker 1: I was just amazed at the way that you were
Speaker 1: talking because I was like, I know you, and I
Speaker 1: know you very well, and you don't talk about people
Speaker 1: like this, like this is not something that you do.
Speaker 1: And seeing like that, even just the cute, freaking videos
Speaker 1: that you guys make online, and just constantly being like, oh, like,
Speaker 1: if your story had ended that day, camera would still
Speaker 1: just be walking around the avoidant type, not like you
Speaker 1: literally haven't met everyone who's gonna love you yet and
Speaker 1: you are living proof of that. And then you have
Speaker 1: this man who then asks your friends of he can
Speaker 1: propose to you. And I just need to point this out.
Speaker 1: One I was so close to booking flights to coming
Speaker 1: over for the surprise engagement. However it was going to
Speaker 1: be forty hours of travel each way, so like eighty
Speaker 1: hours all up, and I was like, I really do
Speaker 1: love you Anna, but I will come over for the wedding,
Speaker 1: And so I got face timed into it and he
Speaker 1: proposed off camera. You guys were just like you just
Speaker 1: moved out of frame. And so when you came around
Speaker 1: and you had I was like, did you say yes?
Speaker 1: Like I didn't see it. I didn't see what happened,
Speaker 1: but obviously you did and you got engaged and you
Speaker 1: get to live a moment and I guess a section
Speaker 1: of your life that you would have never thought possible.
Speaker 1: And I really love seeing the kind of stuff that
Speaker 1: you post around how understanding and helpful Cameraon has been
Speaker 1: through your mental health journey, because it's not just something
Speaker 1: that immediately goes away or like is there one day
Speaker 1: and has gone the next, Like, it's this ever evolving
Speaker 1: process and journey. And to have someone that understands that
Speaker 1: and is willing to sit with you through that. How
Speaker 1: did you first like explain to Cameron what had gone
Speaker 1: on and what your mental health was and kind of
Speaker 1: the stuff that you struggle with. Was that a hard
Speaker 1: conversation to have?
Speaker 3: Typically it is, but like again, with him, everything was
Speaker 3: so different. And I don't know if it was because
Speaker 3: I wasn't looking for anything serious. I felt comfortable to
Speaker 3: just like throw everything out on the table. I told
Speaker 3: him I had bipolar two via text before we got together,
Speaker 3: and I think a lot of that was because I
Speaker 3: wanted to show all my cards so that if you're
Speaker 3: going to run, like, do it early, because I don't
Speaker 3: want to get attached. But he never thought anything like
Speaker 3: he was just like, okay, cool, I need ADHD and
Speaker 3: we're just like cool, okay, so we.
Speaker 2: Both have these diagnoses.
Speaker 3: Great like no judgment and even beyond that, he followed
Speaker 3: up with questions.
Speaker 2: He was like, what does this look like? How do
Speaker 2: people support you?
Speaker 3: Like? What do you need in these moments? Like how
Speaker 3: can I recognize these moments? And just worked so hard
Speaker 3: to understand me instead of judging me and making me
Speaker 3: feel bad for showing up with these symptoms that I
Speaker 3: just I can't control.
Speaker 2: It was such a different.
Speaker 3: Approach that I felt incredibly safe and comfortable to share
Speaker 3: and disclose basically anything like there was not a moment
Speaker 3: that it was hard.
Speaker 1: That is phenomenal and such a testament to his character
Speaker 1: and also just your real lifeationship that you felt like
Speaker 1: you were able to do that. And I'm really interested
Speaker 1: for maybe people who have never experienced living with bipolar.
Speaker 1: I think that again, it's another thing that has a
Speaker 1: lot of stigma that's been attached to it from society
Speaker 1: that people like know what it is, but they don't
Speaker 1: actually understand. Can you explain from the lived experience kind
Speaker 1: of perspective what it is like living with bipolar.
Speaker 3: I think people hear bipolar and they think of I
Speaker 3: think a lot of the extremes that you see in movies.
Speaker 2: And that's what I thought too, And that's why I thought.
Speaker 3: I never considered that I had it, because I was like,
Speaker 3: I'm not doing like that crazy stuff, like I'm not
Speaker 3: jumping off of like roofs and like hallucinating, you know,
Speaker 3: like that's how the media portrayed it.
Speaker 2: So that never crossed my mind. But so there's bipolar.
Speaker 3: One and there's bipolar two, and they look different, and
Speaker 3: I have bipolar two. So for me, I would and
Speaker 3: this is unmedicated, because medicated me is a completely different
Speaker 3: version so if I was not medicated, it would look
Speaker 3: like a three month stint of deep, deep depression. Like
Speaker 3: I'm talking, I can't get out of bed, I can't
Speaker 3: take care of myself. The suicidal thoughts are very loud.
Speaker 3: I'm hopeless.
Speaker 2: I could not function as a human being. I could
Speaker 2: not function.
Speaker 3: And then you wake up one day and a switch
Speaker 3: slips and you turn into this like productive, confident, happy
Speaker 3: version of yourself that is really like confusing, but with
Speaker 3: like bipolar two. So it's it's called hypomania with bipolar two,
Speaker 3: which is a less extreme than mania that comes with
Speaker 3: bipolar one. So for me, I'm crazy productive, I don't
Speaker 3: really sleep. I'm I remember like rearranging my furniture at
Speaker 3: three am for like three hours for what I don't know,
Speaker 3: I just did. And you know, there are there is
Speaker 3: some aspects of reckless behavior, like there were times where
Speaker 3: I about like a thousand dollars appliance.
Speaker 2: I didn't need to do that, like that was just
Speaker 2: reckless spending.
Speaker 3: Or I just like glorified confidence where I'm like I'm
Speaker 3: the best, like but.
Speaker 2: Really over the top.
Speaker 3: So it's such it's like two opposite extremes and you
Speaker 3: bounce back and forth, and if you don't know what
Speaker 3: it is, it can be very exhausting. It can be
Speaker 3: very very confusing, not only for you, but from the
Speaker 3: people on the outside who are watching it, very confusing,
Speaker 3: especially if you can't even communicate what's happening because.
Speaker 2: You don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I thank you for giving that explanation. I think
Speaker 1: so many people just even the bloody phrase of just
Speaker 1: like oh, just snap out of it, or like just
Speaker 1: can't comprehend or think of just being lazy when you
Speaker 1: can't get out of bed, and it's just it's just
Speaker 1: not the case. And so this is why stories like
Speaker 1: this is so important and why I'm so thankful that
Speaker 1: we have such a quite large community of people that
Speaker 1: are sharing their stories, and that we get to be
Speaker 1: a part of that, and we get to see other
Speaker 1: people kind of coming through and sharing these stories of hope.
Speaker 1: And I would really love to know kind of obviously
Speaker 1: you had this not just a moment. There was a
Speaker 1: lot of times that were really really really hard for you.
Speaker 1: But to go from the person who was thirty seconds
Speaker 1: away from not being here to where you are now,
Speaker 1: can you identify some like k things that helped you
Speaker 1: get from A to B because obviously I think people
Speaker 1: can sometimes hear these stories and be like, this is
Speaker 1: where I am now and relate to that, But then
Speaker 1: they see you now and they're like, but how how
Speaker 1: did you do it? What are some key things that
Speaker 1: helps you get from from THEA to where you are now?
Speaker 3: I think a lot of different things, and it was
Speaker 3: a combination of things. And it also just wasn't like
Speaker 3: a complete upward trajectory, you know, like it was an incredibly.
Speaker 2: Bumpy road, and there were so many moments.
Speaker 3: After that that I would go through a period of
Speaker 3: time where I didn't want to be here. That was
Speaker 3: not the last time, but learn like every time I
Speaker 3: went through it though, I learned to handle it better.
Speaker 3: And being really consistent with therapy, being really consistent with
Speaker 3: asking for help and priority tizing myself was really really important,
Speaker 3: and also not beating myself up if I hit a
Speaker 3: low again, because I used to hit a low and
Speaker 3: I'd be like, cool, we're doing this again, Like I'm
Speaker 3: not going to try because I already know what's going
Speaker 3: to happen. I'm going to end up back in the hospital,
Speaker 3: and it's a repeating cycle that's going to happen over
Speaker 3: and over and over and over again, and I think
Speaker 3: that was some of my helplessness kind of coming in.
Speaker 3: So there was the therapy, the medication, the support, but
Speaker 3: then there was a really really big shift in my
Speaker 3: mindset that had to happen and in a mindset where
Speaker 3: I felt like I could take control. And I think
Speaker 3: that was really a moment where I took my power back.
Speaker 3: That was essential for me to help myself. Was feeling
Speaker 3: capable of helping myself and getting there takes practice.
Speaker 2: You know, you don't get there overnight. You don't have these.
Speaker 3: Distortions and then suddenly change it. You know, like, that's
Speaker 3: not how bit of affirmations work. It took a lot
Speaker 3: of practice and consistency and repetition to really work on
Speaker 3: myself and prove to myself that I could do these things,
Speaker 3: that I had control, that I could take my power back,
Speaker 3: that I could overcome these really hard things, even if
Speaker 3: the road was really bumpy. You just you can't give
Speaker 3: up when shit hits the fan, because it's life, and
Speaker 3: shit is always going to hit the fan. It's always
Speaker 3: going to happen. Things aren't going to work out the
Speaker 3: way you want. All the time, and I had to
Speaker 3: learn how to navigate that, I had to reteach myself
Speaker 3: how to be regulated, how to cope, and I had
Speaker 3: a lot of different resources that I used for that,
Speaker 3: but I really had to learn. I had to teach
Speaker 3: myself because I didn't know how to do it, and
Speaker 3: that took a lot of time. It did not happen
Speaker 3: in a year or two years. I'm still learning every day.
Speaker 3: You know, like I'm not a perfect person. I still
Speaker 3: have moments where things slip up and I have to
Speaker 3: pick myself up again. And I think it's always going
Speaker 3: to be that way, because that's just the human experience.
Speaker 3: But when you can shift your mindset into a way
Speaker 3: of like, Okay, this is really hard right now, but
Speaker 3: I know I'm going to be okay, and I know
Speaker 3: it's not always going to be like this, and I
Speaker 3: know I'm capable of helping myself. I don't think i'd
Speaker 3: be able to be where I am now if I
Speaker 3: wasn't able to shift my perspective in what I was
Speaker 3: capable of doing for myself.
Speaker 1: I think that's so incredibly important, and I know that
Speaker 1: there was It was kind of a similar thing for
Speaker 1: me where I began to realize that so much of
Speaker 1: my healing was going to lay in my own decisions,
Speaker 1: the moments where I would want to run pulsively go
Speaker 1: and do something and just go right now in this
Speaker 1: moment where this impulses come, like I have the choice
Speaker 1: for that to not be the reality, Like same as
Speaker 1: you're like, you know the process, you're gonna bet up
Speaker 1: in hospital again, Like you have a choice right now,
Speaker 1: And not saying that it's easy like at all, but
Speaker 1: all of those little choices, the choices to pick up
Speaker 1: the phone and message someone, the choice to not put
Speaker 1: on sad music and make self feel worse and let
Speaker 1: it dwell, but like actively try to do something else.
Speaker 1: And there is times where it just comes in waves
Speaker 1: and it's harder to do those things. But this is
Speaker 1: why I'm always so big when people come up to
Speaker 1: me and they say, like, Jazz, you saved my life,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, no, Like I didn't do that. All
Speaker 1: I did was go, hey, there's another way. You are
Speaker 1: the one that made these decisions. You're the one that
Speaker 1: chose to fight. And I think that's so empowering for
Speaker 1: people to know that, like these other external things can
Speaker 1: be a part of your healing can help you, and
Speaker 1: songs and artists and all these things are a part
Speaker 1: of it. But at the end of the day, you
Speaker 1: are the one that makes those decisions. And I'm so
Speaker 1: glad that you made those decisions over and over and
Speaker 1: over again, because it means that I get my friend here,
Speaker 1: it means that the world gets you. It means that
Speaker 1: your son gets you, and Cameron does and I'm just
Speaker 1: so incredibly grateful that you are here with us and
Speaker 1: that you are in a position where you are sharing
Speaker 1: your story. And you know, this podcast is called Hope
Speaker 1: is Real, and I think your life is just so
Speaker 1: evident of that, and I would love to know, just
Speaker 1: kind of as a final question, what does the word
Speaker 1: hope mean to you?
Speaker 3: I think hope to me means the possibility for change,
Speaker 3: possibility for recovery, possibility for better experiences, a better.
Speaker 2: Life, possibility for things to.
Speaker 3: Get better, for you to get better, you know, like
Speaker 3: it's not black and white, like hope is always there.
Speaker 3: And I think hope is kind of like this space
Speaker 3: that if you choose to step into it, you give
Speaker 3: yourself the opportunity to have more possibility, right Because I
Speaker 3: also think having hope is a mindset and a choice
Speaker 3: to believe that you can have that. You know, it's
Speaker 3: like similar to how can you change your perspective? You know,
Speaker 3: if you can believe for just a moment that there's hope,
Speaker 3: you are leaving the door open essentially or good things
Speaker 3: to come and allowing or good things to come.
Speaker 1: Gosh, I just I love you. I am so grateful
Speaker 1: to have you in my life and that you've been
Speaker 1: willing and we could finally make our calendars and schedules work.
Speaker 1: To come on. I know that you're very busy and
Speaker 1: you're doing a million things, and you've got a kid
Speaker 1: and you go. You just you've got so much going
Speaker 1: on in your world, and so for you to take
Speaker 1: the time to come and to chat on here and
Speaker 1: to be able to inspire the people that are listening
Speaker 1: to know that one thing right that no matter what
Speaker 1: it is that you're facing, that hope is real. So
Speaker 1: thank you for fighting, thank you for choosing to stay,
Speaker 1: thank you for choosing to share your story, and for
Speaker 1: being such a cool friend. And I'm so excited for
Speaker 1: you to get married. And I don't even care if
Speaker 1: you're like eloping, I will be there, Okay, So you
Speaker 1: just tell me when where. If it's a wedding, if
Speaker 1: it's a loping, I don't care. If it's forty hours away,
Speaker 1: I will be there because I am so excited. But
Speaker 1: where where can people find you? Where can people follow you?
Speaker 1: Not physically find your house, obviously, but where can people
Speaker 1: find anna? Yell?
Speaker 2: We just hand out my address for you, guys.
Speaker 1: I address, my bank account, details.
Speaker 2: My social Security number. No, I'm primarily on.
Speaker 3: TikTok and Instagram. That's really where I'm the most active.
Speaker 3: But I do like to work more intimately with people,
Speaker 3: So I do also do when I want to work
Speaker 3: with people within the coaching business that I have as well.
Speaker 1: So are you taking new clients for that? Or no,
Speaker 1: what are you taking new clients for that? At the moment.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of like a rolling thing, like as
Speaker 3: people graduate from the program or as people feel like
Speaker 3: they don't need more, they've got all they can out
Speaker 3: of it and they move on, then I'll take in
Speaker 3: a couple more people.
Speaker 2: So it's always kind of going.
Speaker 1: How can people get in touch about that if that's
Speaker 1: something that might be interested in.
Speaker 3: So all of my socials have a link on it,
Speaker 3: which gives you all the resources to either things I'm
Speaker 3: doing or other resources. But one of those links will
Speaker 3: basically be a place where you can give me your name,
Speaker 3: your email, what you're struggling with, and so I can
Speaker 3: see those and go through and I can respond and offer.
Speaker 2: You know, hey, do you want to work together? Is
Speaker 2: still something you want to pursue because I have space amazing?
Speaker 1: Well, Hey, thank you so much again for taking the
Speaker 1: time to come on this podcast. It really means a
Speaker 1: lot and I cannot wait to see you again, hopefully soon.
Speaker 3: I know, thank you so much for having me. I
Speaker 3: need you to come back to the States.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'll get on a plane right now. I'll just
Speaker 1: drive to the airport.
Speaker 2: I mean you should probably just come here for Horror Nights.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, we need to. We need to read
Speaker 1: you horr nights. Yeah, every year. We've done it since
Speaker 1: we first met, so we're going.
Speaker 3: To have to. I feel like if we if we
Speaker 3: break that chain now, we can't it happens.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, okay, Well, I will obviously be there for
Speaker 1: Horror Nights, but otherwise, have a fantastic Christy your day night.
Speaker 1: I don't know what time is where you are right now,
Speaker 1: but again, thank you so much for coming on.
Speaker 2: Of course thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: Well there you have it, guys, thank you so much
Speaker 1: for staying and for listening to this episode. And like
Speaker 1: I've said at the beginning, and I always say, if
Speaker 1: anything in this episode that's been talked about has brought
Speaker 1: anything up for you, you feel like you need to
Speaker 1: talk to someone, then please remember and know that the
Speaker 1: bravest thing that you can do right now is to
Speaker 1: talk to someone, is to ask for help, whether that's
Speaker 1: from a friend, a family member, or if you don't
Speaker 1: know who to talk to, then if you live in
Speaker 1: Altaiola here you can call or text one seven three
Speaker 1: seven at any time to talk to a trained counselor.
Speaker 1: Or if you live overseas, go to dub dub dub
Speaker 1: dot the Voices of Hope dot org for a list
Speaker 1: of international helplines. Remember that no matter what it is
Speaker 1: that you're facing, no matter what it is that you're
Speaker 1: going through, that in all things, hope is real and
Speaker 1: change is possible. I'll see you guys next week