1 00:00:01,600 --> 00:00:05,120 Speaker 1: Dressing the newsmakers to get the real story. It's Heather 2 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: Duper Clan drive with One New Zealand to coverage like 3 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 1: no one else News sor ZIB. 4 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:13,400 Speaker 2: That afternoon. 5 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:16,160 Speaker 3: It turns out our secondary teacher shortage is worse than 6 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:18,599 Speaker 3: we thought it was. Officials originally thought we would be 7 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 3: short eight hundred and eighty secondary teachers this year. It 8 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:23,639 Speaker 3: is now a shortage of twelve hundred and twenty. Chris 9 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 3: Abercrombie is the president of the Post Primary Teachers Association 10 00:00:27,160 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 3: and with us Hi, Chris great, Why is the shortage 11 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 3: so much worse than we thought? 12 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:35,800 Speaker 2: Well, we knew this would becoming. We've been talking about 13 00:00:35,800 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 2: the shortage for a very long time, so it's great 14 00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:40,720 Speaker 2: to see that the government's finally sort of acknowledging it 15 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 2: and coming to the party. And we know it's about 16 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 2: terms and conditions, about the rapid change happening in the sector. 17 00:00:46,760 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 2: And unfortunately, even though it's a fantastic careers not attractive 18 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 2: at the moment. 19 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 3: It does seem though that the thing is going to 20 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 3: resolve itself, mostly by twenty twenty eight, so in a 21 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:57,560 Speaker 3: couple of years from now, and the shortage will be 22 00:00:57,560 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 3: reduced to about two hundred. Why is that? 23 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 2: What it seems to be that there's more people coming online, 24 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 2: coming through training. But I wouldn't suggest that having two 25 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:09,920 Speaker 2: hundred less teachers is a success either. So I think 26 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 2: there's a long way to go in this space. 27 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:15,120 Speaker 3: But so the argument maybe then is not terms and conditions. 28 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:17,039 Speaker 3: It's simply that we haven't trained enough teachers. 29 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 2: Well, that could be part of it, but the terms 30 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:22,320 Speaker 2: and conditions are better, it's easier to train teachers. We're 31 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 2: also heavily reliant on overseas recruitment and that's been a 32 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:29,120 Speaker 2: significant number. And if the carries on in the projected way, 33 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:31,640 Speaker 2: around thirty percent of our teachers in New Zealand will 34 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:34,320 Speaker 2: be overseas trained in the next few years. 35 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 3: Why is there a surplus of primary teachers? Why are 36 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 3: there so many teachers at the primary level? 37 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,320 Speaker 2: Well, is there actually a significant issue of workforce planning? 38 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:48,200 Speaker 2: For some reason, successive governments have not done any workforce 39 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 2: planning for education. They don't know how many science teachers 40 00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 2: are going to need, how many primary teachers we're going 41 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 2: to need, how many pe teachers are going to need. 42 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:59,720 Speaker 2: Successive governments have done zero workforce planning. Something We've been 43 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 2: pushed for for decades, but no government wants to touch it. 44 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:05,200 Speaker 1: Is there. 45 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 3: Does pay parity between these two workforces play a part 46 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:08,919 Speaker 3: of this? 47 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 2: I don't think so. I mean it is pay parody 48 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 2: is about qualification, so having a bachelor's degree, having a 49 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 2: postgraduate diploma, et cetera. So that's reliant on where you 50 00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 2: start on the on the pay scale. So I don't 51 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 2: think it has a significant impact. 52 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 3: Note all right, Chris, thank you very much, appreciate it. 53 00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 3: I'm Chris Abercrombie, the president of the Post Primary Teachers Association. 54 00:02:30,760 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 1: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to 55 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 1: news talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 56 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:38,799 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.