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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine

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Speaker 1: from News Talks EDB.

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Speaker 2: It's been wonderful traveling around with the All Blacks Test

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Speaker 2: matches over the last three weeks. We find ourselves in

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Speaker 2: Hamilton at the Roaming Giants Heafy Terraces and joined by Wow.

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Speaker 2: I was gonna say White Cuto Rugby Royalty. I think

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Speaker 2: I've probably got it right. Sixty three games for Hawks

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Speaker 2: Bay first of all, one hundred and twenty three for

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Speaker 2: White Cuttle fifteen hundred out eighty seven points, easily the

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Speaker 2: most in Mulu history. In fact, nearly nine hundred and

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Speaker 2: fifty more than the next best. Eight Super Rugby games

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Speaker 2: for the Highlanders, twenty five for the Chiefs. All Blacks

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Speaker 2: debut in nineteen eighty seven, Black Jersey twenty six times,

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Speaker 2: including eight Test matches, two hundred and twenty four points.

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Speaker 2: Are now President of New Zealand Rugby, Matthew Cooper.

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Speaker 3: Nice to see you, mate, Yeah, great to be here, Piney.

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Speaker 3: I'm really looking forward to having a Test match in Hamilton,

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Speaker 3: my home and.

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Speaker 4: I'm through.

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Speaker 3: This is rugby country and we could say that about

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Speaker 3: most of New Zealand, but yeah, pretty special.

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Speaker 4: For this region.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you can genuinely say it about the

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Speaker 2: White Catta. They love their rugby here, you know, back

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Speaker 2: to and I want to talk about your playing days

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Speaker 2: in a while, but it seems a long toime since

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Speaker 2: we had a Test match here twenty twenty two.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it is, it's it's a while, it's a it's

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Speaker 3: it's a challenge because you balance, you balance gate revenue

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Speaker 3: and against against the importance of sharing the game around

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Speaker 3: our nation. And we get that. And if ever a

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Speaker 3: place in New Zealand deserves test matches, it's christ Church

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Speaker 3: when they come online next year with Takaha and and

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Speaker 3: we're looking forward to that. But this place here, it's

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Speaker 3: a I heard you earlier today around what we'll see tonight,

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Speaker 3: and we'll see a passionate, close crowd twenty five four

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Speaker 3: to twenty five thousand and Yeah, it's true.

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Speaker 4: And I mentioned not only mention the.

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Speaker 3: White Coatto, but you know, I always I'm really really

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Speaker 3: big on in my other role around Thames Valley, King

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Speaker 3: Country and across the Kaims the backplaney they'll be here

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Speaker 3: and droves as well and up the road at County.

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Speaker 4: So it's a it's a good part in New Zealand.

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Speaker 3: I'm I'm you know, I was just a kid growing

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Speaker 3: up in Hawk's Bay, and I was all gravitated by

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Speaker 3: the wayato I gravitate how they played their game, how

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Speaker 3: they played rugby, you know, the back line, the innovation

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Speaker 3: about Whiteatto and I suppose thirty odd years on this

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Speaker 3: place is about innovation, you know.

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Speaker 4: The White Cutter was. You know, there's a lot good

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Speaker 4: things happened in this in this province.

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Speaker 2: Well, you were part of a of a fantastic White

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Speaker 2: Cuttle side. When you think back, and I'm not sure

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Speaker 2: how often you do, but when you do, what stands

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Speaker 2: out most to you about your playing days for White Cuttle.

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Speaker 3: Oh, they were they they were special. I mean, the

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Speaker 3: red girl on black, the Mulu, you know, the.

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Speaker 4: The great crowds of Rugby.

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Speaker 3: Park, thirty odd thousand. They creamed they, you know, crammed

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Speaker 3: them in. And it was just the team. I mean,

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Speaker 3: we were a good team. We had great players, you know,

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Speaker 3: good players, but we were at stars.

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Speaker 4: But we were we were a really solid side.

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Speaker 3: I mean we would play we would play the great

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Speaker 3: Auckland side. And that's one game ninety three, the Shield

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Speaker 3: Game and ninety three up at Eden Park in front

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Speaker 3: of forty eight thousand, and you know, Auckland brilliant, our

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Speaker 3: standing there, brilliant side fourteen all blacks, one Manu Samoa.

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Speaker 4: We had three all blacks and we went up there and.

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Speaker 3: I always vividly remember that it was one of those

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Speaker 3: ones where you say you look at your mate and

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Speaker 3: you save yourself in a whyk cut tho Jersey, I'm

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Speaker 3: not going to let your mate down, And that's sort

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Speaker 3: of what it's like when you're in this place.

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Speaker 4: It's it is very much about matship.

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Speaker 3: It's about working hard, it's about you know, pushing yourselves

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Speaker 3: to limits.

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Speaker 2: I love hearing that that I mean because that Auckland side,

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Speaker 2: it was sixty two challenges successfully repelled. Ye when you

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Speaker 2: went up that day, did you feel like something special

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Speaker 2: was going to happen?

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Speaker 3: Well, we had a bit of an insight Piney the

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Speaker 3: year before in a semi final we played Auckland that

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Speaker 3: Eden Park, which led to our the first ever Grand

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Speaker 3: final and provincial rugby on national provincial rugby against Otago

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Speaker 3: in ninety two.

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Speaker 4: So we came away there perby did a pretty good hook.

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Speaker 4: There the hand of.

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Speaker 3: God, there was a it was not a bad tide

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Speaker 3: head from Perby at tight head, but we but we

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Speaker 3: know we dominated. But yeah, we knew that we had

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Speaker 3: a side to match them up front and if you

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Speaker 3: didn't match the great Auckland forward pack, you'd come second

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Speaker 3: all the time.

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Speaker 4: And we were strong on defense. We really very much

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Speaker 4: like the French.

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Speaker 3: We we had a very suffocating French there with Rhyce

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Speaker 3: Ellison myself.

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Speaker 4: We had an absolute superstar.

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Speaker 3: And an eighteen year old Todd Miller at fullback and

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Speaker 3: just some really you know, your Monkies, your Mitchell's, your Jerrems,

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Speaker 3: your Gordon's, your Anderson's, your Low's, your your Gatlands. It

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Speaker 3: was just a good side Stephenson. So we I think

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Speaker 3: there was an there was that mystique and fear of

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Speaker 3: Auckland had gone, and so that day it had to

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Speaker 3: you had to play really well, it had to walk,

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Speaker 3: click and it did.

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Speaker 2: What were the early days of super rugby like.

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Speaker 4: For you, Yeah, really interesting.

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Speaker 3: It was that navigation of it was probably a little

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Speaker 3: bit like your conversation.

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Speaker 4: I heard earlier around a league.

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Speaker 3: You know, we were we're in the midst of the

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Speaker 3: world rugby corporation and and and there was so much

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Speaker 3: going on, and once it was once it was a

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Speaker 3: line there, you know, once it's all sorted, it was okay.

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Speaker 3: The the the contracts Piney that were offered are a

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Speaker 3: little bit different today that so I don't I don't

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Speaker 3: know if it was true professionalism, but it was.

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Speaker 4: It was great that navigation.

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Speaker 3: I think it took a while here in terms of

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Speaker 3: letting go of Waikato Mulus being the number one and

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Speaker 3: then forming that bond with the Chiefs, and that did

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Speaker 3: take a little while. And now it's positioned really well.

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Speaker 3: I mean everyone knows that it's Chiefs and then the

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Speaker 3: Waikato and it's positioned really well.

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Speaker 4: And yeah, they were good days.

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Speaker 3: I missed the cut in year one and I got

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Speaker 3: drafted to become an Otago Highlander and so that was

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Speaker 3: really special to play with that brilliant Otago southn side

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Speaker 3: of the time. So just another great experience for me

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Speaker 3: in my career was to be a Highlander and then

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Speaker 3: lucky enough to come back and have three years with

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Speaker 3: the Chiefs.

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Speaker 2: You've been in Dania and Wellington the last two weekends.

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Speaker 2: What have you made of the All Blacks Fronts test

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Speaker 2: matches one and two?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, really good I think that was a very good

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Speaker 3: French performance. I wasn't surprised because I go back to

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Speaker 3: nineteen eighty six and the Cavaliers are over in South

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Speaker 3: Africa and they picked Brian Lahore and the team pick

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Speaker 3: a new team, a young team called the Baby Blacks,

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Speaker 3: and they're down at Lancaster Park. These men, these twenty two,

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Speaker 3: I think it would have been at the time, not

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Speaker 3: twenty three. They put on an All Black jersey and

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Speaker 3: then they were part of that legacy. They were having

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Speaker 3: to be the legacy of all Black rugby at the time.

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Speaker 4: Then you know in nineteen eighty six and they were,

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Speaker 4: they were, They.

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Speaker 3: They created something quite special. They had Serge Blanco, they

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Speaker 3: had Philips, they had Jean Pierre Reeve, the Gui la Porte,

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Speaker 3: they had absolute superstar team. But the All Blacks beat

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Speaker 3: them and it didn't matter. It wasn't the Baby Blacks.

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Speaker 3: The All Blacks beat the French. And I felt that

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Speaker 3: was a bit like that last a couple of weeks

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Speaker 3: ago in Dunedin, and I thought that that preach team

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Speaker 3: played really well. A caveat that by saying that was

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Speaker 3: the first time the All Blacks had got together in

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Speaker 3: twenty five after the Super Rugby season, so they put

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Speaker 3: it together. They they then they went to Denise, then

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Speaker 3: they went to Wellington and I was super impressed with

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Speaker 3: that side. I've been super impressed with the new boys

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Speaker 3: coming into the All Blacks.

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Speaker 4: I think that there's that the.

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Speaker 3: What I've seen last year in terms of what the

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Speaker 3: coaching group under Razer are trying to do here is

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Speaker 3: play a pretty quick game.

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Speaker 4: Is to play a fast game. But this year they

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Speaker 4: want to finish.

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Speaker 3: They if they finished a couple of times last year,

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Speaker 3: they would they would have.

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Speaker 4: Won in Johannesburg. They should have won Harris. They know that.

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Speaker 3: And then and then to see this philosophy of having

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Speaker 3: winning the much treasured Dave Gallaher Cup, which is which

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Speaker 3: means a lot to to the All Blacks to then

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Speaker 3: do what he talks about, I want to be four deep,

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Speaker 3: Scott Robinson talks about, I want to be four deep.

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Speaker 4: I want to make sure two.

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Speaker 3: Years out from Australia we've got depth in all position.

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Speaker 4: The Wellington performance has enabled that.

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Speaker 3: It's enabled the All Blacks to to give and and

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Speaker 3: and I really hope it works. I really want it

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Speaker 3: to work tonight because we've got this is an exciting team.

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Speaker 3: It's a I'm particularly excited about the new players coming

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Speaker 3: through and you know the chance of a new a

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Speaker 3: new debutante as well. Ruben Love coming in at for

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Speaker 3: that Quins a Pie coming back after a long time.

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Speaker 3: The great story of Anton Lenett Brown. Luke Jacinbson's another

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Speaker 3: good story because he's a very powerful loose forward, but

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Speaker 3: he hasn't had game time. So you know, I think

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Speaker 3: you know this is a really good opportunity. It gears

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Speaker 3: up for the Rugby Championship, so you know, really looking forward.

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Speaker 2: To Yes, So I can't wait. So you're now president

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Speaker 2: of New Zealand Rugby. Does that mean you can watch

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Speaker 2: the game or do you have to shake too many

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Speaker 2: hands for that?

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Speaker 1: Oh?

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Speaker 4: No, I always do. I always make sure I watch

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Speaker 4: a game.

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Speaker 3: I'm a I'm a very passionate fan and I always

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Speaker 3: will be and very proud of of this whole group.

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Speaker 3: This whole all black group are incredible people. The staff

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Speaker 3: are amazing. Tonight well, there will be a lot of

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Speaker 3: good partners that will be with us tonight, and our

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Speaker 3: events team are incredible. So I'll be up there with

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Speaker 3: board members and Robo and we will we will.

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Speaker 4: Entertain our people who look after us, and and yeah, I'm.

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Speaker 3: I'm in a very privileged role and I don't underestimate it, Piney.

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Speaker 3: It's it's an absolute dream. It's a pleasure to be

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Speaker 3: involved with the All Blacks. It's a pleasure to be

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Speaker 3: involved with the Black Ferns. It's a you know, it's

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Speaker 3: it's a pleasure to be involved with our domestic game.

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Speaker 3: So I'm you know, I'm looking forward to tonight and

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Speaker 3: I'm you know, I love the opportunity of what this presents.

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Speaker 4: There's a lot of good things happening. I'm so looking forward.

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Speaker 3: Round the twenties tomorrow and Rovigo and Italy as they

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Speaker 3: take on the South Africa and the World Cup Under

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Speaker 3: twenty final. The Black Ferns are tracking all right, we're

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Speaker 3: looking we're looking to head away shortly and we've got

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Speaker 3: a domestic competition about to start in both the f

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Speaker 3: PC and the NBC and the Heartland.

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Speaker 4: So yeah, this is great. I'm I'm loving it.

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Speaker 3: Good.

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Speaker 2: How's your brother Greg getting on?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Good, He's Greg's an international coach. He's been in Utah

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Speaker 3: and he's he's actually on the plane now to Japan.

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Speaker 3: So he's got another surjouron in Japan and no special brother.

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Speaker 4: He's him and I him and.

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Speaker 3: I are still talking after replace him in ninety two

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Speaker 3: as the All Black fallback against the Irish.

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Speaker 2: So so I must sad time the hold a grudge

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Speaker 2: of he is.

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Speaker 3: And they're very very very good brother and know he's

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Speaker 3: doing well, and yeah, no, we're you know, it's it's

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Speaker 3: just nice at the moment, Piney, I sense that our

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Speaker 3: focus at.

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Speaker 4: The moment, and it's a it's a big it's a

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Speaker 4: big organization.

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Speaker 3: We think about our commercial, you think about international, you

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Speaker 3: think about global. We know that we could play France

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Speaker 3: anywhere and we would draw massive crowds, and the same

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Speaker 3: with South Africa. There is that brand, the brand All

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Speaker 3: Blacks is massive globally, and it's also really important this

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Speaker 3: game domestically, and there's a lot of work going on

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Speaker 3: about competitions and so all that complexity.

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Speaker 4: But I'm really feeling.

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Speaker 3: Good about our game because we're in a good space

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Speaker 3: of focusing on rugby and and you know, tonight's another

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Speaker 3: exciting night. And I have said to everyone, to the

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Speaker 3: board and to members of the staff, welcome to Paradise.

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Speaker 3: At the start of the week, and I remember Raiser

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Speaker 3: come up to me and he said, yesterday he said,

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Speaker 3: he said, Coops, he said, you talk about paradise and

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Speaker 3: he said, We've had the weirdest week we've ever.

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Speaker 4: Had an international rugby.

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Speaker 3: So I don't know how much I can do that,

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Speaker 3: but I wouldn't live anywhere else fighting.

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Speaker 2: Good on your mate, It's so good to see Matthew.

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Speaker 2: Your enthusiasm is infectious. Great day of your popping in

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Speaker 2: on such a busy day, mate. We'll see you tonight.

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Speaker 4: Very good. Thanks punning Matthew Cooper there.

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Speaker 2: President New Zealand Rugby and former All Black joining us

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Speaker 2: at the Roaming Giant here as we build towards kickoff tonight.

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Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live

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Speaker 1: to News Talk Set B weekends from midday, or follow

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Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio