1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,427 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:11,907 Speaker 1: from News Talks, EDB. 3 00:00:12,827 --> 00:00:15,467 Speaker 2: News talksb Les Elder twenty two tests for New Zealand, 4 00:00:15,507 --> 00:00:18,067 Speaker 2: captain the side and won the World Cup in twenty seventeen, 5 00:00:18,107 --> 00:00:21,707 Speaker 2: now a rugby commentator and analyst with Sky Sport. At least, 6 00:00:21,707 --> 00:00:23,587 Speaker 2: can we start with Canada? How good were they? 7 00:00:24,107 --> 00:00:26,347 Speaker 3: Well, you have to start with Canada, right, because they 8 00:00:26,427 --> 00:00:31,707 Speaker 3: were just too good. They outplayed us. They I actually 9 00:00:31,787 --> 00:00:34,747 Speaker 3: think we were out coached as well. Their game plan was, 10 00:00:35,427 --> 00:00:37,547 Speaker 3: you know, everything that you'd expect from the Black Friends. 11 00:00:37,587 --> 00:00:39,787 Speaker 3: They canceled it out and then they executed it on 12 00:00:39,827 --> 00:00:40,627 Speaker 3: the side of the board. 13 00:00:41,027 --> 00:00:42,987 Speaker 2: Can you talk a bit more about that in terms 14 00:00:42,987 --> 00:00:45,627 Speaker 2: of the game plan Canada came with on both sides 15 00:00:45,627 --> 00:00:47,707 Speaker 2: of the ball. What did you see from them that 16 00:00:47,867 --> 00:00:49,267 Speaker 2: was particularly effective? 17 00:00:50,427 --> 00:00:53,067 Speaker 3: They flooded the edges, which is where we gain a 18 00:00:53,107 --> 00:00:56,027 Speaker 3: lot of our traction and momentum. Right, We've got outstanding 19 00:00:56,067 --> 00:01:00,227 Speaker 3: outside backs and we create momentum on the edge of 20 00:01:00,227 --> 00:01:02,867 Speaker 3: the fields. They shut that down, and when they shut 21 00:01:02,907 --> 00:01:04,747 Speaker 3: that down, it means we need to adapt. And I 22 00:01:04,747 --> 00:01:07,827 Speaker 3: don't think we adapted fast than we did adapt at 23 00:01:07,827 --> 00:01:09,587 Speaker 3: the start of the second half by playing through the 24 00:01:09,587 --> 00:01:11,267 Speaker 3: middle of the field with our pick and goes and 25 00:01:11,307 --> 00:01:13,427 Speaker 3: our boards going to work. But it was probably an 26 00:01:13,427 --> 00:01:15,347 Speaker 3: adaptation that came a little bit too. 27 00:01:15,347 --> 00:01:17,787 Speaker 2: Late and with ball in hand for Canada. Do you 28 00:01:17,787 --> 00:01:19,747 Speaker 2: think the Black Ferns were caught out in any way 29 00:01:19,827 --> 00:01:24,147 Speaker 2: by how high tempo the Canadian game plan was. 30 00:01:24,947 --> 00:01:26,827 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think we were actually, and I think we 31 00:01:26,827 --> 00:01:29,467 Speaker 3: were very mindful of their outside backs because they've got 32 00:01:29,467 --> 00:01:32,707 Speaker 3: some speedsters. Mikayla break off camera told us that Asia 33 00:01:33,067 --> 00:01:36,427 Speaker 3: Hogan Rochester is as fast as her, so that means 34 00:01:36,427 --> 00:01:38,867 Speaker 3: they're all faster than the Black Ferns because Mikayla is 35 00:01:38,907 --> 00:01:41,747 Speaker 3: one of the fastest in New Zealand. So I think 36 00:01:41,787 --> 00:01:44,427 Speaker 3: maybe because we were aware of that speed and flare 37 00:01:44,507 --> 00:01:48,347 Speaker 3: out wide, it changed how we defended internally and they 38 00:01:48,547 --> 00:01:51,547 Speaker 3: took the opportunities there. And that's why Justine, the halfback 39 00:01:51,627 --> 00:01:54,427 Speaker 3: that Pelithier, had such a great game because she's seen 40 00:01:54,547 --> 00:01:57,387 Speaker 3: our defense fanning and then she took up opportunities and 41 00:01:57,427 --> 00:01:58,227 Speaker 3: gaps through the middle. 42 00:01:58,507 --> 00:02:00,227 Speaker 2: There were also a number of handling erarors from the 43 00:02:00,227 --> 00:02:03,507 Speaker 2: Black Ferns. That's uncharacteristic really, was that a result of 44 00:02:03,547 --> 00:02:07,067 Speaker 2: the on field and scoreboard pressure Canada built. 45 00:02:08,507 --> 00:02:11,547 Speaker 3: Quite possibly, we have seen a little bit so riddled 46 00:02:11,587 --> 00:02:14,707 Speaker 3: through the Blackburns throughout the i'd say the past year. 47 00:02:15,627 --> 00:02:18,267 Speaker 3: They did seem to capitalize on that in some of 48 00:02:18,267 --> 00:02:22,787 Speaker 3: these later games, but let's be we weren't tested other 49 00:02:22,867 --> 00:02:25,427 Speaker 3: than the half against South Africa. We haven't been tested 50 00:02:25,467 --> 00:02:30,107 Speaker 3: by quality side this Rugby World Cup. So yeah, that pressure, 51 00:02:30,267 --> 00:02:33,547 Speaker 3: not only the pressure that Canada applied on us defensively 52 00:02:34,427 --> 00:02:37,427 Speaker 3: done things to our attack, but also chasing such a 53 00:02:37,467 --> 00:02:40,427 Speaker 3: score line, right, we started too slow. They put seventeen 54 00:02:40,467 --> 00:02:42,787 Speaker 3: points on us and we were chasing the clock for 55 00:02:42,827 --> 00:02:43,707 Speaker 3: a long time. 56 00:02:44,867 --> 00:02:47,627 Speaker 2: Would Georgia Miller have made a significant difference. 57 00:02:48,187 --> 00:02:52,507 Speaker 3: Absolutely, I do think so. It's what she creates on 58 00:02:52,547 --> 00:02:55,227 Speaker 3: the edge of the field, and like I said, they 59 00:02:55,267 --> 00:02:57,747 Speaker 3: shut down our edge. But imagine if we had Georgia 60 00:02:57,787 --> 00:03:00,347 Speaker 3: out there, it could have played games with their defense. 61 00:03:00,387 --> 00:03:03,947 Speaker 3: At least she would have beaten the first defender. So yeah, 62 00:03:03,987 --> 00:03:06,147 Speaker 3: I think losing her was a massive loss. 63 00:03:06,507 --> 00:03:08,347 Speaker 2: You talk there as well about not being tested up 64 00:03:08,427 --> 00:03:10,707 Speaker 2: until now in the tournament. The same goes for Canada though, 65 00:03:10,787 --> 00:03:13,187 Speaker 2: Les you know, they sort of rolled through Paul play 66 00:03:13,467 --> 00:03:16,707 Speaker 2: Put forty odd on Australia. How were they able to 67 00:03:16,747 --> 00:03:18,827 Speaker 2: keep their standards nice and high despite the fact they 68 00:03:18,827 --> 00:03:19,907 Speaker 2: weren't really tested either. 69 00:03:20,587 --> 00:03:22,747 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a good point you make that, and I 70 00:03:22,787 --> 00:03:25,907 Speaker 3: think again it just comes down to the quality of 71 00:03:25,947 --> 00:03:28,547 Speaker 3: the team, the quality of the coaching, the game plan 72 00:03:28,627 --> 00:03:32,467 Speaker 3: that they executed. We heard Poorsha Woodman Whickliffe post game say, 73 00:03:32,507 --> 00:03:34,267 Speaker 3: we knew the game plan they were going to bring. 74 00:03:34,507 --> 00:03:37,347 Speaker 3: We knew what they were going to do. Unlike Canada, 75 00:03:37,387 --> 00:03:40,027 Speaker 3: though they didn't shut them, we didn't shut them down 76 00:03:40,227 --> 00:03:43,707 Speaker 3: knowing that game plan. So again I'm not going to 77 00:03:43,747 --> 00:03:47,307 Speaker 3: take away from Canada. They outplayed us. They executed a 78 00:03:47,307 --> 00:03:47,987 Speaker 3: great game plan. 79 00:03:48,347 --> 00:03:49,907 Speaker 2: So the Black Ferns will now play off the third 80 00:03:49,947 --> 00:03:52,667 Speaker 2: and fourth again. Nobody, I'm sure once you reach the 81 00:03:52,667 --> 00:03:55,707 Speaker 2: semis wants to be involved. And how challenging will it 82 00:03:55,747 --> 00:03:57,027 Speaker 2: be to get up for another game. 83 00:03:58,107 --> 00:04:00,067 Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, it's going to be tough. But like I 84 00:04:00,107 --> 00:04:02,547 Speaker 3: said on air, for hours, to soak that all in, 85 00:04:02,547 --> 00:04:03,987 Speaker 3: you've got to feel it. You've got to hurt it, 86 00:04:04,147 --> 00:04:05,867 Speaker 3: you know, feel the hurt, but you've got to go 87 00:04:05,907 --> 00:04:07,987 Speaker 3: again because that's that's your job. That's what you've got 88 00:04:08,027 --> 00:04:11,027 Speaker 3: to do. You don't pick and choose which moment she's 89 00:04:11,067 --> 00:04:14,427 Speaker 3: turned up for, so they'll one d flick the switch 90 00:04:14,427 --> 00:04:17,467 Speaker 3: and they'll go again because they have to. 91 00:04:17,507 --> 00:04:19,187 Speaker 2: The end of a World Cup cycle always sees the 92 00:04:19,267 --> 00:04:21,027 Speaker 2: changing of the guard in some respects, and we know 93 00:04:21,107 --> 00:04:23,747 Speaker 2: that we're likely not going to see Porscha Woodman Wickliffe 94 00:04:23,747 --> 00:04:26,747 Speaker 2: again beyond this World Cup obviously, and maybe some others too. 95 00:04:26,787 --> 00:04:31,747 Speaker 2: Do you expect a reinvigoration of the playing group now, well. 96 00:04:32,227 --> 00:04:35,067 Speaker 3: I think looking at the positives of it, they have 97 00:04:35,147 --> 00:04:37,347 Speaker 3: the coaching group have done quite a good job at 98 00:04:37,427 --> 00:04:39,907 Speaker 3: bringing some depth into the side, right So there are 99 00:04:39,907 --> 00:04:42,147 Speaker 3: players that didn't even make this World Cup still at 100 00:04:42,147 --> 00:04:44,987 Speaker 3: home who are young in the early twenties. Those girls 101 00:04:44,987 --> 00:04:48,747 Speaker 3: will start featuring in the coming years, so I think, yes, 102 00:04:48,787 --> 00:04:50,907 Speaker 3: we're going to see so the exodus of some players, 103 00:04:50,907 --> 00:04:54,427 Speaker 3: but we're going to see I think more young Braxton 104 00:04:54,507 --> 00:04:57,387 Speaker 3: Thornton McGee's turn up on our tellies as well. 105 00:04:57,867 --> 00:04:59,227 Speaker 2: Could Canada win the World Cup? 106 00:04:59,987 --> 00:05:05,347 Speaker 3: Absolutely, and I hope they do. That's the reason why 107 00:05:05,467 --> 00:05:08,907 Speaker 3: I hope they do. Obviously, the long rivalry with England 108 00:05:08,987 --> 00:05:10,787 Speaker 3: just sort of still sits there as an old player, 109 00:05:11,147 --> 00:05:16,347 Speaker 3: but Canada have the semi professional on top of that, 110 00:05:16,507 --> 00:05:19,827 Speaker 3: they don't have the legacy of the infrastructure of a 111 00:05:20,267 --> 00:05:24,747 Speaker 3: men's game. New Zealand has a strong men's program, France 112 00:05:24,747 --> 00:05:27,547 Speaker 3: has a strong men's program, England have a strong men's program. 113 00:05:27,747 --> 00:05:30,907 Speaker 3: Canada's men's team and you know, we don't know much 114 00:05:30,947 --> 00:05:33,867 Speaker 3: about them, let's be honest. So they have created what 115 00:05:33,907 --> 00:05:36,907 Speaker 3: they have created. This women's team, have created this off 116 00:05:36,907 --> 00:05:40,267 Speaker 3: their own back and to me is a proud female 117 00:05:40,307 --> 00:05:43,467 Speaker 3: rugby player and supporter of the women's game. It shows 118 00:05:43,507 --> 00:05:45,587 Speaker 3: how women can do it on their terms. 119 00:05:46,147 --> 00:05:48,907 Speaker 2: Leers, have really enjoyed your analysis across the tournament on 120 00:05:48,987 --> 00:05:51,107 Speaker 2: Sky and here this afternoon. Thanks for taking our. 121 00:05:51,027 --> 00:05:53,547 Speaker 3: Call, no problems, thanks for having me, no thanks. 122 00:05:53,347 --> 00:05:55,507 Speaker 2: For joining us. There's Elder, their former Black Firms captain. 123 00:05:56,027 --> 00:05:59,187 Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live 124 00:05:59,307 --> 00:06:02,707 Speaker 1: to News Talk ZB weekends from midday, or follow the 125 00:06:02,747 --> 00:06:04,267 Speaker 1: podcast on iHeartRadio.