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Speaker 1: When Tatsuo Horrucci retired, he suddenly found himself with time

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Speaker 1: and lots of it. He felt the creative urge, and

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Speaker 1: he had always been interested in digital art, but the

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Speaker 1: software for it was too expensive and a bit intimidating.

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Speaker 1: But on his computer, already installed and ready to go,

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Speaker 1: was Microsoft Excel. For most of us, Excel represents rules

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Speaker 1: and restrictions, basically the opposite of creativity. It's where we

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Speaker 1: go to battle with budgets and perform painful data entry.

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Speaker 1: It's a place for frustration when our formulas break, and

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Speaker 1: often guilt over impulse spending or failed commitments. But when

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Speaker 1: Tatsuo looked at the endless cross ears of his Excel spreadsheet,

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Speaker 1: he saw past those limitations. As unlikely as it sounds,

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Speaker 1: he saw it as a canvas, a structure. To work

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Speaker 1: with it. He started experimenting with Excel's shaped tool curves, arcs, gradients.

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Speaker 1: He laid them up, stacking those tiny components to form

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Speaker 1: digital brushstrokes. He constructed rivers, mountains, cherry blossoms, eventually entire landscapes.

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Speaker 1: He entered an art contest and one when people saw

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Speaker 1: his work, they were stunned Excel. They asked, you made

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Speaker 1: this an Excel, but the Excel artist insisted he chose

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Speaker 1: the program for a simple reason. He didn't have to

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Speaker 1: pay for it. He was making do with what he

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Speaker 1: already had, and it turns out that gave him an edge.

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Speaker 2: Well, welcome back to the shares his WEALTHCAC. I hope

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Speaker 2: that story inspires you to do great things in Excel.

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Speaker 2: Because today's episode is all about budgeting.

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Speaker 3: This is where I think Kui's a bad When you

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Speaker 3: go budget people be roll rising it. Let's kind of

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Speaker 3: scoff at it.

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Speaker 1: Do we all really need a budget?

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Speaker 4: People can get away with not budgeting, but if the

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Speaker 4: income stocks they hit into panic mode.

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Speaker 5: And what are the key.

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Speaker 2: Things to focus on even if you've been budgeting for years.

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Speaker 4: I love it when people who make good money budget

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Speaker 4: because they create that gap between what they earn and

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Speaker 4: what they spend and they can then plan to do

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Speaker 4: more of the awesome stuff.

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Speaker 2: So, before we get into it, investing involves risk. You

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Speaker 2: might lose the money you start with. We recommend talking

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Speaker 2: to a licensed financial advisor. We also recommend reading product

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Speaker 2: disclosure documents before deciding to invest. And everything in today's

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Speaker 2: episode is current at the time.

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Speaker 5: Of recording.

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Speaker 2: I found that story of Tatsuo Huiyuci, and I was

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Speaker 2: quite inspired. I feel like a lot of people will

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Speaker 2: avoid budgeting because, like spreadsheets are so intimidating, But I reckon,

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Speaker 2: it's probably a lot harder to use EXL to make

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Speaker 2: art than it would be to create a budget in EXCEL.

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Speaker 1: I like the fact that this guy was so committed

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Speaker 1: to just saving on subscription costs that he ended up

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Speaker 1: making art with probably one of the ugliest software interfa

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Speaker 1: that I could think of.

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Speaker 2: I did wonder though it might be like a little

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Speaker 2: window into myself, but maybe he was. I was wondering,

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Speaker 2: do you reckon Tatsuo was maybe avoiding doing his budget,

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Speaker 2: you know, maybe it was like his wife was like, okay, Tatsuo,

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Speaker 2: time for the household expenses, and he's like, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 2: I'm just going to do a couple of smiley faces

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Speaker 2: just to like get myself into it.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Right, So, like you go outside to mow the lawns

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Speaker 1: and then you make like a hedge in the shape

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Speaker 1: of like a deer. So a budget is it's kind

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Speaker 1: of a reflection of your priorities, what you really value,

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Speaker 1: and your money's going to look totally different day to

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Speaker 1: day depending on sort of what life stage you're at.

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Speaker 1: Here's what she is. His co CEO, Sonya had to

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Speaker 1: say about how becoming a parent for the first time

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Speaker 1: changed how she sees her budget.

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Speaker 7: Something I wasn't quite prepared for was, you know, you

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Speaker 7: talk about saving and having these runny day accounts, but

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Speaker 7: also then the reality of when you're in that moment

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Speaker 7: use that. I felt a little bit stressed by that,

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Speaker 7: and I just said, actually, this is a season of

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Speaker 7: using that money. You know, this is what I put

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Speaker 7: it aside for Like, once I named that that this

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Speaker 7: is a season of life that's about that, I felt

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Speaker 7: a lot more comfortable. And so that was about understanding

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Speaker 7: and just going money and expectations. It doesn't always have

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Speaker 7: to be the same for your whole life.

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Speaker 3: This is where I think kwi's a bad When you

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Speaker 3: go budget, people really rother rizing it. Let's kind of

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Speaker 3: scoff at it.

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Speaker 2: This is Reagan White. Reagan is the host of the

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Speaker 2: Where Is My Money Podcast, and you may remember him

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Speaker 2: from our previous episode.

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Speaker 3: It sounds like restriction, and it sounds like rules, and

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Speaker 3: it sounds like you cannot enjoy things. But once you've

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Speaker 3: realized again having someone tell you what this is. Budget

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Speaker 3: is not a bad thing. Budget is guardrails to stop

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Speaker 3: you from falling off the edge, right. Budget is what

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Speaker 3: you make it.

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Speaker 2: Reagan tells the story in his podcast in season one

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Speaker 2: about how his mortgage became kind of over whelming.

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Speaker 3: We were really close to having to pull a lot

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Speaker 3: of levers, like hardship levers, that kind of thing. Wow,

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Speaker 3: And we did end up taking a three month mortgage,

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Speaker 3: complete mortgage break in order to get like to find

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Speaker 3: that time to get our ducks back in a row,

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Speaker 3: because it was like, we were that close. We needed it,

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Speaker 3: Like you need someone to help you to see the

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Speaker 3: wood for the trees, Like we just needed someone else

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Speaker 3: to look at the numbers totally objectively and go sort

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Speaker 3: of shit out, you have to do this now. Cool,

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Speaker 3: but this is what is going to save you and

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Speaker 3: stop you from having to sell your house, which was

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Speaker 3: obviously the last thing we wanted to do.

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Speaker 2: A Part of the process to get back on track

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Speaker 2: was putting a clear budget in place. Reagan explains how

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Speaker 2: his perception of budgeting changed.

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Speaker 3: If you want to budget down to the scent and

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Speaker 3: be real tight, then that's awesome because you'll have amazing

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Speaker 3: quick progress to where you want to go and be,

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Speaker 3: but also it might stop you from living your life

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Speaker 3: as happy or as comfortable as you want. So a

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Speaker 3: budget can mean anything, but there's no negative connotations around

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Speaker 3: it anymore.

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Speaker 5: But there was sort of maybe maybe beforehand, do you

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Speaker 5: think or I was considered, we just didn't have one,

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Speaker 5: like you apply for a mortgage and you're going to

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Speaker 5: fill out your expenses, but that those just were what

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Speaker 5: they were.

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Speaker 3: There was never any rhyme or reason to why. It

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Speaker 3: was just we spend what we need to spend, so

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Speaker 3: there was no limits. Yeah, and that makes it sound

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Speaker 3: like we were living really frivolously. We weren't, like we

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Speaker 3: weren't going on holidays and stuff. But if the groceries

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Speaker 3: cost five hundred bucks, it costs five hundred bucks. If

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Speaker 3: the car neate's felling, you just feel it like we

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Speaker 3: were just kind of doing the things we needed to

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Speaker 3: do just to live our pives. Now we achieved the

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Speaker 3: exact same stuff, but just with guardrails and sort of

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Speaker 3: boundaries around certain things.

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Speaker 2: We have more from Reagan later in the.

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Speaker 1: Series, moving from something personal into something a bit more practical.

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Speaker 1: We asked Ruth Henderson Oka The Happy Savior. Does everyone

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Speaker 1: do all of us need a budget?

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Speaker 4: Yes? I think they do. However it's different for everybody.

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Speaker 4: I've found some people that are really quite wealthy, they

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Speaker 4: can kind of out earn their stupidity, and so they

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Speaker 4: might spend up large all months long and go, oh

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Speaker 4: my gosh, that credit card arrived in. I didn't realize

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Speaker 4: I spent that much. But what here comes the febulau's income,

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Speaker 4: and so they can cover over their mistakes all their time,

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Speaker 4: all the time. So people like that can get away

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Speaker 4: with not budgeting. But if the merry go round stops,

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Speaker 4: the income stops, they head into panic mode. I love

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Speaker 4: it when people who make good money budget because they

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Speaker 4: create that gap between what they earn and what they spend,

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Speaker 4: and they can then plan to do more of the

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Speaker 4: awesome stuff they want to do. Anyway, so they're the

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Speaker 4: wealthy group, they still should budget. And in people who

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Speaker 4: are trying to find traction, they absolutely have to budget,

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Speaker 4: because you've got to be earning more than you're spending

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Speaker 4: and creating that gap, and that GAP's going to go

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Speaker 4: towards debt, and hopefully soon it's going to go towards

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Speaker 4: investing in the likes of ad and budgeting will show

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Speaker 4: you where your weaknesses are. You know, can you work more,

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Speaker 4: can you reduce spending? So those are two ends of

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Speaker 4: the spectrum. And then everybody in the middle, which you

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Speaker 4: know I'm probably in the middle, is budgeting is just

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Speaker 4: immensely helpful. Like this morning was a case in point.

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Speaker 4: I said to Johnny, I had a reminder come up

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Speaker 4: on my calendar. One of the apps that we use

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Speaker 4: is up for renewal this week. Had I not budgeted,

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Speaker 4: I wouldn't know that. And top tip, if you cancel

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Speaker 4: any app, they immediately offer you a fifty percent discount.

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Speaker 4: And so we managed to resubscribe to the app we

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Speaker 4: do use, we want it for fifty percent off. So

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Speaker 4: everybody doesn't need to budget in my view, but it

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Speaker 4: is different for everybody, and it's a matter of finding

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Speaker 4: what works for you. Whether you've got an elaborate spreadsheet

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Speaker 4: that's taking you two hours a week to update knock

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Speaker 4: yourself out, or whether it's pen and paper, or whether

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Speaker 4: it's just like me using a budgeting app you find

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Speaker 4: you but just doing it consistently is really important.

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Speaker 1: How does your personality influence how you structure your budget.

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Speaker 4: Personality and budgeting is interesting. There's generally, if you're in

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Speaker 4: a couple, there's generally one of you that likes it

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Speaker 4: more than the other. And I say, lean into that.

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Speaker 4: And Johnny and I were the same way. I'm interested

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Speaker 4: in the nitty gritty. He's not, and as a graphic designer,

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Speaker 4: he's a very visual person. But we're completely on the

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Speaker 4: same page. And people in a relationship, there's a lot

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Speaker 4: of people who check out. They're like, ah, I'm not

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Speaker 4: interested in budgeting. They're into that. I really couldn't care.

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Speaker 4: I just think that's really disrespectful to your partner because

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Speaker 4: nine times out of ten they might get it right,

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Speaker 4: but if they get it wrong, there's so much pressure

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Speaker 4: on them to be getting it right for the family.

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Speaker 4: And I think what I've found over the years, just

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Speaker 4: talking to a lot of people and just talking to Johnny,

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Speaker 4: that I'm looking at our budgets and I'm thinking about things,

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Speaker 4: and i'm playing and I've found the answer to something,

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Speaker 4: and I'll run it past Johnny and I'll say anything

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Speaker 4: to add and he will say, oh what about this,

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Speaker 4: And it's like, man, I think I'm pretty good at this.

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Speaker 4: Didn't think about that thing. And so two heads are

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Speaker 4: always better than one. But it's respecting each other to

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Speaker 4: both be involved and respecting each other that you both

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Speaker 4: loarn differently, you both think about your money differently, and

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Speaker 4: you've got to navigate a path through doing that. Here,

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Speaker 4: if you're budgeting alone, well that's fabulous because you've got

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Speaker 4: nobody to have to agree or disagree with, and it

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Speaker 4: will just give you confidence to plan the weeks and

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Speaker 4: months and years ahead. When you know where your money

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Speaker 4: is coming from and where it's going to, it just

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Speaker 4: gives you the ability to pivot and take up great opportunities,

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Speaker 4: let things go that you Sikov. It's so powerful if

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Speaker 4: you can manage your money.

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Speaker 1: Well, if we really get down to brass tacks on

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Speaker 1: a practical level, what should actually be and your budget,

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Speaker 1: like what are the line items in there?

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Speaker 4: Line items in your budget are big broad categories. So

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Speaker 4: I always use the supermarket as one, big category for food,

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Speaker 4: big category for cars, big category for like health and

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Speaker 4: well being for house, et cetera. So I probably have

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Speaker 4: about fourteen categories all up, but just keep it big

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Speaker 4: and broad. But if you go to granular, you'll bore yourself.

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Speaker 4: You'll bore anybody in your house. You're trying to tell

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Speaker 4: about your budget and you won't maintain it. So keep

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Speaker 4: it broad. What did I spend on groceries in X month?

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Speaker 4: Full stop? The whole point is your financials is just

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Speaker 4: data that you want to collate in such a way

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Speaker 4: that it can help you drive your life going forward.

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Speaker 4: So if you're getting bogged down in the detail and

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Speaker 4: it's not helping you plan what's coming up, well that's

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Speaker 4: potentially not working.

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Speaker 2: For For those of us organized enough to have a budget,

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Speaker 2: is there any advanced tips? Is there any ways to

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Speaker 2: make it better or things that they should consider.

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Speaker 4: Sometimes you don't need to overcomplicate things. And if you

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Speaker 4: have a budget and it's working for you, if it ain't,

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Speaker 4: don't fix it. And just money in general, keep it simple, simple, simple,

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Speaker 4: because that way you can look forward and when opportunities

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Speaker 4: come you kind of ready for them. But if you

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Speaker 4: have gone, oh, I got a budget, it kind of

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Speaker 4: is working for me. And then a mate rings you

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Speaker 4: up and says, hey, a in two weeks time. I

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Speaker 4: know this is short notice, but I need to go

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Speaker 4: to Australia and I want you to come with me.

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Speaker 4: You know you're good at budgeting if during that call

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Speaker 4: mental math, yep, I'll see at the airport. You know

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Speaker 4: that I got a budget. It's kind of working for me.

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Speaker 4: If you're that person and you're like, oh mate, I'll

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Speaker 4: just have to come back to you because I'm not

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Speaker 4: quite sure will your budget sort of needs tweaking. Is

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Speaker 4: there any other tools or resources you recommend? Pocket Smith

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Speaker 4: is still the one I use all the time and

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Speaker 4: love the most. I know that some banks have a

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Speaker 4: budgeting type tool that you can use, and they're probably

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Speaker 4: a really good place to start. I tried quite a

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Speaker 4: number of different apps, and particularly free apps, but the

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Speaker 4: problem with them was I still had to manually load

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Speaker 4: all my data. That was the thing I was trying

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Speaker 4: to get rid of. I would rather go running in

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Speaker 4: the hills and input, you know, five dollars spent on

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Speaker 4: an ice cream. So that's why pocketsmith remains good. That's

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Speaker 4: why I'm happy to pay for it. But talk to

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Speaker 4: your friends who do you use? They might not use anybody.

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Speaker 4: But what the cool thing that we'll do as well

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Speaker 4: is it actually starts a conversation. Like one of the

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Speaker 4: main things. I'm going off topic here, but one of

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Speaker 4: the main things I get in my inboxes. I've got

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Speaker 4: no one to talk about money with, and talking about

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Speaker 4: budgeting software could be that little in that some people need.

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Speaker 1: So Funnily enough, when we were prepping this episode, the

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Speaker 1: topic of budgeting came up over a drink with some mates.

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Speaker 1: I was really struck by how much everyone's kind of

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Speaker 1: the personalities and like different life stages really impacted our

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Speaker 1: approaches to how we deal with our budget.

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Speaker 2: How are they different without exposing all your mates habits.

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Speaker 1: So one person, like a software developer, and was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: well there's an app for that. My partner is an engineer,

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Speaker 1: and he was like, oh, I've created for myself this

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Speaker 1: very complicated system, and he kind of jeery rigged his

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Speaker 1: own solution.

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Speaker 2: I've built it out of iron I found in the garage.

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Speaker 1: And then it was me being like, I'm the creative

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Speaker 1: I have no budget.

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Speaker 2: That's so funny because I feel like the only time

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Speaker 2: I will use Excel as like when it gets really bad.

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Speaker 2: And then I'm like, right, I've got to solve my

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Speaker 2: life problems. The nuclear option, Yeah, exactly, as it helps

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Speaker 2: me get serious.

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Speaker 4: I'm like, I'm going a.

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Speaker 2: Spreadsheet now, to get them to excel very good. We'll

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Speaker 2: hear from Ruth again shortly with and we've made sure

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Speaker 2: that we get a budgeting activity, because we do have

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Speaker 2: an activity at the end of every episode. But first

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Speaker 2: let's do a cheeky plug. We're bringing Sarah back to

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Speaker 2: chat about budget backing features in the Charsias app.

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Speaker 1: We are back with Sarah. Sarah, we have been talking

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Speaker 1: about budgeting right and we're looking for some ways that

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Speaker 1: we can kind of hit some consistent habits or goals.

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Speaker 4: With their budget.

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Speaker 1: Is there anything that we could do maybe in the

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Speaker 1: Shares's app to help make that happen totally yes.

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Speaker 6: So I think one of the things that comes up

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Speaker 6: a lot in budgeting that you've probably already talked about

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Speaker 6: is doing a bit of automation and just going, hey,

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Speaker 6: I'm really motivated to move my money around by myself now,

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Speaker 6: but in a few months time when life gets busy,

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Speaker 6: I don't want to have to think about it. I

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Speaker 6: just want the stuff to happen. So in the Chasas app, back.

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Speaker 4: In the wallet, we're back in the wall again.

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Speaker 6: So I keep ening up. There are a couple of

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Speaker 6: things that you can do, so from your Cheese's Wallet,

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Speaker 6: you can set up a recurring transfer into a savings account,

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Speaker 6: and that might be a saving account that you are

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Speaker 6: saving for something fun. It might be a savings account

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Speaker 6: that's just your rainy day account, which is of course

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Speaker 6: a really important part of England's budget. Or for people

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Speaker 6: who are using Cheesi's the Cheesy's Key Resaver scheme, you

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Speaker 6: could make a recurring voluntary contribution. So if part of

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Speaker 6: your budget looks like really nailing that first home or

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Speaker 6: that retirement goal, that could be something you could consider. Two,

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Speaker 6: if your budget is focusing on things like investing, then

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Speaker 6: auto invest might be something that's really useful. So by

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Speaker 6: making an automatic payment into your Cheesy's Wallet every pay

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Speaker 6: cycle or every week or every month, whatever works for you,

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Speaker 6: you can make sure that money is landing and then

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Speaker 6: you can distribute it out across whatever you're using. For

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Speaker 6: auto invest, you're going to want to head into your

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Speaker 6: portfolio so that lives in the investment space. And with

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Speaker 6: auto invest, you can say I want to invest this

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Speaker 6: much every week, fortnite, months, whatever that looks like for you,

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Speaker 6: into these particular investments and we'll kind of do all

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Speaker 6: the heavy lifting for you. So You just need to

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Speaker 6: make sure that that money fligs across just.

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Speaker 1: In time automate your way.

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Speaker 4: To good habits. Thanks er, have you been listening along?

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Speaker 1: You know that every episode we like to provide you

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Speaker 1: with a little activity that you can do in keeping

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Speaker 1: with the episode's theme. So to give you today's activity,

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Speaker 1: here's Ruth again.

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Speaker 4: So one tiny, simple exercise, which is time specific, is

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Speaker 4: sit down, work out what did you spend on gift

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Speaker 4: giving in the last twelve months and come up with

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Speaker 4: a figure. And when you see that figure, does that

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Speaker 4: surprise you? Does it horrify you? What does it do?

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Speaker 4: And then know that I don't know about you, guys,

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Speaker 4: but I'm pretty sure that there will be birthdays in

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Speaker 4: Christmas next year as well that are going to probably

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Speaker 4: cost something similar. So how can you budget for that now?

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Speaker 4: And it's simply whatever amount you spend, divide it by

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Speaker 4: fifty two weeks, and from here on in put that

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Speaker 4: about money in that account, and then when those birthdays

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Speaker 4: and Christmas roll around again, you'll be financially prepared for them.

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Speaker 2: I don't know about you, Laura, but I do wonder

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Speaker 2: if this is going to unfortunately maybe influence a few

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Speaker 2: more secret Santas at the family Christmas party.

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Speaker 1: Quite possibly, it might be quite confronting to see that number,

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Speaker 1: but in a way, it's kind of nice to find

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Speaker 1: out how generous you've really been.

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Speaker 2: I sort of prefer the old Secret Santa steel because

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Speaker 2: I feel like you can get away with buying worse gifts.

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Speaker 2: I'm a terrible gift buyer, so that's why I love

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Speaker 2: a Secret Sands steel because you can always go and

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Speaker 2: just buy some like socks or like. One of the

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Speaker 2: best presents that a Secret Sanda steel we had was

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Speaker 2: literally a photo of Dad, and that has now become

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Speaker 2: a tradition, you know, to regift that photo every Secret

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Speaker 2: stand a year.

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Speaker 1: Well, and it also adds like a little extra ritual

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Speaker 1: into the whole, like Christmas festivity, isn't which, like I'm

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Speaker 1: always a fan of that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and if it saves money even better.

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Speaker 1: Well that's a wrap for today. In our next episode,

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Speaker 1: We're going to hear a little bit more of Reagan's

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Speaker 1: journey and take some time to hear his story about

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Speaker 1: dealing with some seriously scary mortgage debt.

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Speaker 8: Imagine a world where every dollar you have is working

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Speaker 8: towards your wealth goals. Now you can on cheers, EA's

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Speaker 8: see your shares alongside your kiwisaver, balance, your crypto and

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Speaker 8: your savings. And for every dollar you spend on your

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Speaker 8: spend cat and one percent towards your wealth, your wealth

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00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:32,280
Speaker 8: finally together on cheers e's. Chasy's Investment Management Limited is

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Speaker 8: the issuer of the Chasy's Kiwisavers scheme. View the Lodge

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Speaker 8: b das on our website.