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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from news Talks B. Follow

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Speaker 1: this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: It's time for all the attitude, all the opinion, all

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Speaker 1: the information, all the debate, Now the lighton Smith podcast

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Speaker 1: powered by News Talks B.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Podcasts two hundred and sixty four on seven

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Speaker 2: November twenty twenty four. Now, at the conclusion of podcast

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Speaker 2: two sixty three, well, at the conclusion of the interview

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Speaker 2: with Patrick Basham, I made a suggestion that we do

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Speaker 2: a follow up the morning after, which was of course

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Speaker 2: today if it was warranted. Well it was warranted and

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Speaker 2: in multiples, so we got together around midnight New Zealand

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Speaker 2: time last night. Patrick has been sensational over this election.

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Speaker 2: He is a wonderful man and his commentary for those

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Speaker 2: interested in this amazing election, his commentary is insightful. Have

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Speaker 2: a listen, Actually hold the horses, because I have just

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Speaker 2: received an email from Patrick. I mean literally our final

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Speaker 2: Democracy Institute Daily Express US poll Trump up three fifty

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Speaker 2: percent to forty seven percent. Our Democracy Institute Daily Express

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Speaker 2: US Exit poll Trump up four fifty one to forty

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Speaker 2: seven percent. Trump's popular vote win up four fifty one

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Speaker 2: percent to forty seven in Princess in twenty twenty eight,

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Speaker 2: we pledged to do better with our final poll. Congratulations

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Speaker 2: to them. It was headed by the way most accurate

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Speaker 2: US presidential election polster. Congratulations and well done. Now let's

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Speaker 2: have a listen.

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Speaker 3: Indeed, latent, they're great to be back with you in

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Speaker 3: your audience again, it seems but for me yesterday, I

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Speaker 3: guess it was technically, but when the night goes well

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Speaker 3: personally and professionally, it doesn't seem so long or so hard.

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Speaker 3: But as you say, one of the more significant aspects

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Speaker 3: of Trump's victory is that it wasn't his victory alone.

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Speaker 3: That is, his party has regained control of the Senate,

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Speaker 3: held onto control of the House of Representatives. And this

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Speaker 3: is you know, this is a tremendous significance because Trump

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Speaker 3: is apparently going to attack his second term in a

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Speaker 3: more uncompromising and more focused and disciplined way in policy

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Speaker 3: terms and personnel terms, etc. And to do that, he

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Speaker 3: can have all of that planning and all of that help, etcetera.

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Speaker 3: But he's if he had been facing come January twenty five,

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Speaker 3: a hostile Democratic run Senate and or House, then his

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Speaker 3: chances of doing things that are truly consequential that might

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Speaker 3: outlive his own presidency let alone himself personally, would have

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Speaker 3: been heavily reduced. So there's far more opportunity now potential

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Speaker 3: if one favors Trump's program or parts of it, that

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Speaker 3: they may actually come to life, let alone to fruit

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Speaker 3: bear fruit. Of course, one of the tests will one

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Speaker 3: of the tests that will be one of the experiments

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Speaker 3: during this process will be to determine to what extent

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Speaker 3: Trump has remade the Republican Party in his own image.

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Speaker 3: By that, I mean his first term. He yes, he

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Speaker 3: fought the Democrats, He fought many fellow Republicans on Capitol

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Speaker 3: Hill in Congress as well. So how many of that

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Speaker 3: new Senate majority are truly on site within how many

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Speaker 3: in the House majority with him? You'll find out pretty.

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Speaker 2: Quickly, I think, indeed, except that I get the impression

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Speaker 2: that there won't be too much opposition, I think it's

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Speaker 2: even crossed my mind Patrick that in the victory that

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Speaker 2: he has driven, there could be a little danger, a

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Speaker 2: little danger, and I mean that he might upset some

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Speaker 2: people in the party because he is he assumes quite

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Speaker 2: rightly that he's the man.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he is in a it's interesting for

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Speaker 3: a second term president. You know, usually it's some there

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Speaker 3: were immediately inducts in terms of the electoral calendar, and

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Speaker 3: often much of the energy and momentum has gone despite

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Speaker 3: the second victory. But Trump, it seems he's going to

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Speaker 3: the nature of his comeback, the fact that he has

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Speaker 3: a popular vote majority, can claim a legitimate democratic mandate, etc.

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Speaker 3: This whole country has moved in his direction. Whether he

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Speaker 3: won a state or not, every state has moved in

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Speaker 3: his direction. He is a more formidable president. I think

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Speaker 3: that's one of the great ironesy. A more formidable president

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Speaker 3: in January of twenty twenty five than he was in

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Speaker 3: January of twenty seventeen. And so there will be a

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Speaker 3: honeymoon period. For sure. Everyone on his side of the

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Speaker 3: aisle will say nice things about him, and I think

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Speaker 3: that far more are genuinely onside, and far more will

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Speaker 3: be wanting to go along to get along. But there

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Speaker 3: will be items, but in particularly on foreign policy, where

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Speaker 3: some of the more senior not necessarily majority representing, but

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Speaker 3: senior foreign policy establishment types on the Republican side are

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Speaker 3: going to try to from their point of view, talk

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Speaker 3: some sense into him over things like Ukraine and one

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Speaker 3: or two areas of contention around the world. But you know,

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Speaker 3: obviously ought to be decided, but he's never been in

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Speaker 3: you know, he begins his second term with an enormous

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Speaker 3: amount of capital. And I remember when George W. Bush

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Speaker 3: in two thousand and four, twenty years ago, sort of tonight, virtually,

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Speaker 3: when he won what for some was a surprising second mandate,

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Speaker 3: he said, you know, I've earned all this political capital,

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Speaker 3: and I'm now I'm going to spend it. Whether we

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Speaker 3: spend it wisely or not. You know, that's for the historians,

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Speaker 3: but it's a recognition that, you know, when you are

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Speaker 3: electorally victorious, you should do something with that. After all,

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Speaker 3: that wasn't at the point. I mean, Barack Obama famously said,

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Speaker 3: you know, elections have consequences, yes, and this won't be

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Speaker 3: any exception to that. In fact, probably quite the opposite.

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Speaker 2: Well, he appears to have won the popular vote. I

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Speaker 2: was asked today, actually, what is the popular vote? And

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Speaker 2: I answered, I answered it, of course, but I would

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Speaker 2: like your answer.

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Speaker 3: Sure. Well, of course, technically it doesn't matter in American

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Speaker 3: in presidential American presidential politics, it is merely something that's

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Speaker 3: nice to win but doesn't dictate whether or not you

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Speaker 3: actually win the election. But you know, in practical political terms,

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Speaker 3: it usually goes along with your electoral college win. And

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Speaker 3: most importantly, it's a way of keeping the opposition at

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Speaker 3: bay a little because if you're Trump in his first

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Speaker 3: term or George W. Bush in his first term, in

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Speaker 3: both cases not having won the popular vote rightly or wrongly,

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Speaker 3: the opposition always go back to it, always used that

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Speaker 3: as a stick to beat you with, always that you're not,

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Speaker 3: you know, the people's choice. It's, you know, the peculiarities

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Speaker 3: of the system have produced you as the victor. Uh,

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Speaker 3: it's you know, it's whoever, whoever wins the popular vote,

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Speaker 3: it's going to say that if they don't win the

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Speaker 3: electoral college, even though you know, they all know the

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Speaker 3: rules when they start playing the match. So it's it's

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Speaker 3: an unusual thing about the American system, but it's by design.

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Speaker 3: It's how the folks who wrote the Constitution wanted it

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Speaker 3: to be, and so far it's largely served the country

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Speaker 3: fairly well.

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Speaker 2: In fact, I heard quite a bit of talk today

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Speaker 2: on various channels with regard to this is the way

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Speaker 2: the system was designed to work, and it's worked. It's

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Speaker 2: worked either well through perfectly.

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Speaker 3: What would you say, Yeah, I think it has worked

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Speaker 3: pretty well because one of thee something that from a

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Speaker 3: distance can be hard to appreciate is that America is

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Speaker 3: so vast in every sense, not just geographically, and that

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Speaker 3: the authors of the Constitution they recognized that their new

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Speaker 3: country was literally a United States. It's a collection of

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Speaker 3: otherwise independent countries who did and could sort of operate

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Speaker 3: self sufficiently with their own own sovereignty. And therefore the

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Speaker 3: only way to make it anybody to grow them together

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Speaker 3: in an effective fashion was to allow mean sure that

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Speaker 3: all of them had some power, had some say, so

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Speaker 3: aside from all of the delegation of a lot of

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Speaker 3: powers to the lower level of states and further down

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Speaker 3: the chain, it meant that when choosing a president, there

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Speaker 3: would be disproportionate influence given to the agricultural states, the

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Speaker 3: smaller population, and states, et cetera, to ensure that basically

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Speaker 3: the minority majority didn't gang up on the minority and

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Speaker 3: that everyone everyone had had to say, which would help

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Speaker 3: ensure that no one felt the need to, you know,

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Speaker 3: to break away. So it's just one of those one

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Speaker 3: of those interesting elements of the American system that we

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Speaker 3: can it's very trendy, has been for some time to

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Speaker 3: look at it and say, well, you know, a bunch

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Speaker 3: of old white guys other they were particularly old, but

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Speaker 3: you know, old, old racist white guys came up with

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Speaker 3: this elitist system designed to keep you know, democracy down,

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Speaker 3: but give it this sort of big leaf mirage effect

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Speaker 3: that we're actually electing a president in a democratic fashion.

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Speaker 3: But like most trendy progress so called progressive critiques of

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Speaker 3: old school approaches and processes and instruments, they generally, upon

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Speaker 3: close inspection closer in spectrum, they generally fall flat because

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Speaker 3: they don't understand the history behind them, and they also

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Speaker 3: don't understand the historical evolution and how in most cases,

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Speaker 3: and I think the electoral College is a good example.

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Speaker 3: They've proved to have been worthwhile, and you know, it's

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Speaker 3: you know, apologies to Churchill, or the least worst system available.

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Speaker 2: It was during an at break on Fox that I

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Speaker 2: turned to CNN and there were a few of us watching,

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Speaker 2: and I did it just in time to hear somebody

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Speaker 2: make comment on the on the system and talk about

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Speaker 2: talk about the structure the structure of the Constitution and

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Speaker 2: how it needs needs to change, and they must do it.

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Speaker 2: They must do it as quickly as possible. And I thought,

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Speaker 2: I thought you were a crook, uh, And then I

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Speaker 2: thought you're stupid, and then after that I thought I

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Speaker 2: thought you were an idiot. And it was It was

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Speaker 2: frustrating for me because I because I don't have a

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Speaker 2: program on the radio tomorrow and the day after and

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Speaker 2: the day after that, and at times like this, I

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Speaker 2: feel like I want one. I want it back again,

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Speaker 2: because what he was criticizing is what holds the American

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Speaker 2: system together, and anybody with half a brain is aware

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Speaker 2: of that. He patently is short in that department.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, I mean what it's really starred. You know

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Speaker 3: when al Gore lost to Bush but won the popular

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Speaker 3: vote narrowly, but you know, one then it really picked

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Speaker 3: up steam when Hillary was quote unquote denied the presidency

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Speaker 3: are despite winning by a couple of points. And these days,

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Speaker 3: of course, they only want the electoral college gone because

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Speaker 3: they figure they will they with enough enough of legal

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Speaker 3: immigrants turned into US citizens overnight, you know, they'll always

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Speaker 3: have more votes on the other side. And they don't

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Speaker 3: like the they don't like a lot of Supreme Court decisions,

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Speaker 3: so they want to add justices to the court to

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Speaker 3: ensure they always have a majority. They want to end

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Speaker 3: the filibuster and the Senate so they can run through

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Speaker 3: anything they want they want to get, you know, all

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Speaker 3: these sorts of things they want to change, you know,

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Speaker 3: the number of senators or required to override a presidential veto,

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Speaker 3: all these things that you know have been around forever

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Speaker 3: for good reason, but they view as some of them

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Speaker 3: view them as not so charming relics of a antiquated past,

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Speaker 3: and others just view them as cold blooded terms. Is

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Speaker 3: just hindrances to ensuring that when they have the reins

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Speaker 3: of power, they can basically do what the heck they

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Speaker 3: like with that power. And assuming of course they'll they'll

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Speaker 3: never be on the other side, which is the classic

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Speaker 3: mistake of authoritarian types. You know, throughout history they always

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Speaker 3: think that they'll be in charge.

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Speaker 2: Did you see perhaps speech?

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Speaker 3: I caught little bits of it. I was I was

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Speaker 3: in transit.

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Speaker 2: Unfortunately much of it, Okay, I thought it was. I

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Speaker 2: thought it was very good. I wonder whether you think

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Speaker 2: that there might be a swing, a big swing, even

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Speaker 2: in support of Trump, having having won the election, A

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Speaker 2: support of Trump in setting out to do what he

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Speaker 2: intends to greater, greater than greater than might be expected.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's certainly possible. It might even be probable.

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Speaker 3: He is so he has become so humanized. Clearly, you know,

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Speaker 3: it's incontroversible that a majority of voters support him. You

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Speaker 3: presume they support his program. And although it's mocked by

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Speaker 3: his opponents, he has genuinely built a coalition broader than

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Speaker 3: the Republican Party. And whether you think of it it's

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Speaker 3: a coalition of convenience or of principle, the fact is

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Speaker 3: it is a political coalition that extends, you know, to

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Speaker 3: many former Democrats and many independents. And they don't agree

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Speaker 3: on everything, but they agree on a lot of first principles,

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Speaker 3: and more to the point, they agree on what some

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Speaker 3: of the fundamental crises are in American society and politics

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Speaker 3: and have broad agreement on how to address them, and

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Speaker 3: the sort of worry about the other smaller stuff later on.

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Speaker 3: And I think that while obviously that appeals to arguably

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Speaker 3: and narrow small majority of Americans right now, if the

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Speaker 3: likes of Kennedy and Musk and gathered and JD. Varnce

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Speaker 3: and obviously Trump and Ron Paul. They put their shoulders

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Speaker 3: to the wheel and actually try to do as Trump

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Speaker 3: did in his first term, try to actually do what

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Speaker 3: they promised to do. And as some of us believe,

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Speaker 3: if they do that, they probably will have some fairly

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Speaker 3: good result. Then the year eighteen months, two years from now,

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Speaker 3: Trump may be maybe viewed as somebody, who, oh, wow,

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Speaker 3: isn't it too bad he can't run again? You know,

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Speaker 3: you know, you have a poppy a second term president

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Speaker 3: like Ronald Reagan, and people, oh, jeez, what this term

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Speaker 3: limit thing happened? A shame. He's such a great president.

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Speaker 3: And that would be one of the great ironies, wouldn't

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Speaker 3: it if Trump went from the the prior president to

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Speaker 3: the one that really had a legacy of not just accomplishment,

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Speaker 3: but a certain amount of goodwill amongst the the general public.

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Speaker 2: What is your what are you what are your thoughts

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Speaker 2: on the court cases in New York in particular, that

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Speaker 2: are still confronting the sentencing, for instance, of the of

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Speaker 2: the of the of the of the of the Court

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Speaker 2: of the Judge. And I'm trying to think of a

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Speaker 2: lion that Ralph Harris, the Australian singer, Yeah, put into

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Speaker 2: put into a song about the Court of and I

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Speaker 2: can't think what it was, but it was an idiot.

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Speaker 2: So I think we've I think we've got a parallel

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Speaker 2: what what what do you think this might what a

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Speaker 2: think might this have?

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Speaker 3: Well, it's this victory guarantees that all this stuff is

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Speaker 3: going to go away. It's going to be the end

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Speaker 3: of it. I mean, you know, he was on a

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Speaker 3: he was on an upward trajectory legally because you know,

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Speaker 3: he was winning cases within dismissed, he was winning appeals,

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Speaker 3: and so they there was a lot of light at

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Speaker 3: the end of the tunnel. But he wasn't out of

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Speaker 3: jeopardy yet. And although the you know, the more dangerous

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Speaker 3: cases were gone or going. But as this whole thing

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Speaker 3: has been politically driven, this decision, fairly recent decision to

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Speaker 3: postpone his sentencing till after the election was clearly very political.

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Speaker 3: I mean, an extremely political judge under the thumb of

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Speaker 3: extremely political prosecutors were deciding that well, Trump could win,

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Speaker 3: so why don't we wait till we find out whether

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Speaker 3: he's won to decide whether he really needs to go

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Speaker 3: to prison? And you know, these are cowardly, unprincipled types,

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Speaker 3: and so they're acting in that way. And I'm sure

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Speaker 3: they will have an epiphany sometime between now and January

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Speaker 3: nineteenth and decide that for the greater good, they can

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Speaker 3: see the other side of this, and that, you know,

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Speaker 3: I think that's the way. I think it will sort

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Speaker 3: of peter out right, and none of these people are

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Speaker 3: ever going to say they're sorry or wrong, but he has.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's a shame that you have to be

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Speaker 3: elected president to avoid bankruptcy in prison. But you know,

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Speaker 3: you know, Elon must say that. I think I was

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Speaker 3: at the taper caston on one of the podcasts you

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Speaker 3: know that Trump doesn't win, the question is how long

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Speaker 3: will I go to prison for? And it's a funny line,

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Speaker 3: but it's also cuts to the very core of what

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Speaker 3: Trump has been dealing with on a personal level these

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Speaker 3: last couple of years. This is not you know, this

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Speaker 3: is not your father's or your grandfather of America at all.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, spending a little time thinking while you were talking,

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Speaker 2: but listening all the same. The Court of King Correctus

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Speaker 2: was the name of the song, and it was a

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Speaker 2: very successful one. Now on the other side of the

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Speaker 2: ledger on Carmela's team, who was responsible for this scenario?

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Speaker 2: Who's to blame? Who can be held accountable?

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Speaker 3: Well, in Washington, d C. So we don't hold people accountable.

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Speaker 3: We just we just they just fail upwards. But it's

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Speaker 3: I think it's a combination. I mean, some of the

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Speaker 3: blame is her own, but she's so in cape and

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Speaker 3: limited you can't say it's mostly her fault. It's more

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Speaker 3: the fault of those who put her in this position,

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Speaker 3: and I mean her, the people that she's had on

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Speaker 3: her campaign, the people who survived working for her, and

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Speaker 3: the Vice President's office, et cetera. You know, these are

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Speaker 3: folks who are fully paid up members of the woke

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Speaker 3: DEI identity politics club. And they immediately either concluded or

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Speaker 3: already thought had thought for some time that she ever

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Speaker 3: ran the president again. That you you know, you just

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Speaker 3: play the identity card, and that is how you collect

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Speaker 3: votes from the you know, the requisite groups, the women,

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Speaker 3: the people of color, this that and the other, and

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Speaker 3: you you you know you and when you pander to

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Speaker 3: the you know, the gay groups and the lesbian groups

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Speaker 3: and the Chinese grenda and all the rest of it,

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Speaker 3: and you you know, you just you do the arithmetic

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Speaker 3: and you add up that group and that group and

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Speaker 3: that group. You end up with a majority, and you

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Speaker 3: noly ignore, but you actually denigrate the other groups because

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Speaker 3: obviously woke politics succeeds in theory by you know, raising

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Speaker 3: your side up by knocking the other side down. And

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Speaker 3: so everything from their advertising to their what passed the

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Speaker 3: policy positions, Etcaster the way that the rallies were choreographed.

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Speaker 3: You know that everything was that and it stayed that

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Speaker 3: way the whole time because fortunately for Trump, these folks

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Speaker 3: don't tend to learn from their mistakes, right, and then

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Speaker 3: were there were a couple of moments when Obama Biden

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Speaker 3: people weren't allowed anywhere near and Obama people tried to

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Speaker 3: sort of grab the reins as they saw the thing going,

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Speaker 3: you know, going off the cliff, but to little avail.

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Speaker 3: So it's you know, it's it's a lot of you know,

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Speaker 3: if you're to have the Democrats, we're going to have

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Speaker 3: a firing squad and put put down all the people responsible.

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Speaker 3: You're basically talking about a couple of dozen twenty thirty

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Speaker 3: somethings who've spent their lives to this extent. You know,

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Speaker 3: in graduate school and in political jobs, and most are

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Speaker 3: mostly themselves in the positions they are because they have

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Speaker 3: the right skin color, the right gender if I can

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Speaker 3: use that word, in democratic circles, and you know, all

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Speaker 3: the right sexual orientation, etc. So it's it's just everyone

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Speaker 3: likes to see people, you know, take a beating after

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Speaker 3: a failure. However, in this case you might say it's

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Speaker 3: more deserved than is often the case.

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Speaker 1: Latens with.

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Speaker 2: Look on the international scene, what do you think, what

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Speaker 2: do you think the world is thinking right now? And

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Speaker 2: when I say the world, I mean I mean the

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Speaker 2: parts of the world would matter.

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Speaker 3: Ah, okay, I think it's it's it's mixed, not because

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Speaker 3: most of them are ambivalent, because where you stand on

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Speaker 3: Trump from a foreign perspective depends very much on where

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Speaker 3: you fit, you know, So you have well, I maybe

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Speaker 3: I'm about to contradict myself, not for the first time.

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Speaker 3: Like the Chinese, for example, they're very concerned about would

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Speaker 3: be tariffs, you know, Trump returning to getting tough on

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Speaker 3: on intellectual property protection, all these sorts of things, Concerned

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Speaker 3: that Trump is going to push back over Taiwan and

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Speaker 3: all of this. However, at the same time, the Chinese,

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Speaker 3: I think actually rather like dealing with Trump the way

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Speaker 3: that they back in the day, like dealing with Reagan

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Speaker 3: rather than Carter say, they like they understand the Chinese

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Speaker 3: and the Russians and others. They understand and strong leaders,

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Speaker 3: you know, they can they can not necessarily anticipate their moves,

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Speaker 3: but they understand then their headspace, their perspective, whereas these

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Speaker 3: sort of wishy washy liberal types, you know, preaching humanitarianism

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Speaker 3: and without much of a political spine, they don't really

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Speaker 3: know what to do with them. They're so you know,

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Speaker 3: so literally and figuratively foreign to them. So I think

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Speaker 3: on a on a person to person level, they the

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Speaker 3: Chinese will be quite happy that Trump's back. They know

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Speaker 3: what they're dealing with. But in terms of policy outcomes,

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Speaker 3: there's going to be some anxiety there, I mean Putin

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Speaker 3: and Russia. I'm sure he may have publicly endorsed Kamala Harris,

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Speaker 3: which I think is quite clever on his part. I

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Speaker 3: think he'll be very pleased, not because I think, as

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Speaker 3: the Democrats do, that Trump wishes to do his bidding,

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Speaker 3: but because Putin views Trump I think as as an

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Speaker 3: American version of himself, that is the patriot, nationalistic, self

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Speaker 3: interested America first to match Putin's Russia first again, someone

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Speaker 3: who he's not going to fall in love with, but

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Speaker 3: someone who he thinks he can under he understands, who

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Speaker 3: he can do business with. You know, they can reach

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Speaker 3: mutual agreements and accommodations. You know. Then you you know,

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Speaker 3: you have your your Western Europeans, You're particularly your EU,

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Speaker 3: who of course are not going to be happy. But

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Speaker 3: that's rather wonderful because they'll be unhappy for lots of

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Speaker 3: good reasons. You know. Trump is obviously everything that they

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Speaker 3: dislike culturally, politically, ideologically, and you know, he just he

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Speaker 3: calls them out, he shows them up. You have to

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Speaker 3: add the UK to that now now that there they

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Speaker 3: officially have a woke globalist government is rather than one

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Speaker 3: just in in practice, the likes of Justin Trude in

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Speaker 3: Canada for whatever months he has left in power. You know,

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Speaker 3: he's this is this is a nightmare for him. Uh.

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Speaker 3: And you know, when I think it isn't Trump, who

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Speaker 3: who says that Fidel Castro's Justin Trudeau's real father? And uh,

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Speaker 3: which is a rather delicious way of kicking off a conversation.

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Speaker 3: So I mean, I think a lot of the Asian

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Speaker 3: important Asian countries, you know, in addition to China, are

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Speaker 3: going to have that mix of economic trade repredation. But

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Speaker 3: at the same time, I think they know what they're

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Speaker 3: dealing with. And then of course you get the Middle

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Speaker 3: I say, the Middle East and many African countries, the

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Speaker 3: ones that are going to be most pleased outside of

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Speaker 3: probably Eastern Europe, because they in both cases, particularly in

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Speaker 3: the Middle East, the Arab State and obviously Israel thought

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Speaker 3: they had a very productive relationship and which it had

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Speaker 3: continued just having got back you know, from Saudi Arabia

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Speaker 3: and Qatar. I mean, it's incredible actually how widespread the

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Speaker 3: support for Trump's election was. You know, to a person,

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Speaker 3: they couldn't believe that America would even consider not re

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Speaker 3: electing him. And then many many of the more important

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Speaker 3: African in Nigeria's, in South Africa and South Africa's et cetera.

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Speaker 3: You know, they they there's two things about Trump that

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Speaker 3: stand out to them. One is the man himself. That is,

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Speaker 3: they they culturally are drawn to a strong figure of

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Speaker 3: which you know, for good or for ill he represents.

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Speaker 3: And then also they recognize more openly than and with

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Speaker 3: more experience than most other countries and cultures what a

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Speaker 3: corrupt political state looks and acts like. And so, you know,

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Speaker 3: I mean my experience. You're talking with your average African

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Speaker 3: about you know, the US, each state, and they just

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Speaker 3: not away because they recognize that and his critique of

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Speaker 3: it rings true to them because that's what many cases

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Speaker 3: they are have been, have dealt with, or are dealing with.

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Speaker 3: And uh, you know, so they don't they don't see

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Speaker 3: him as paranoid or conspiratorial. They just see him as

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Speaker 3: a realist. And so yeah, it's I mean in America

430
00:28:40,093 --> 00:28:42,893
Speaker 3: and I think probably in Canada, and I dare to

431
00:28:42,973 --> 00:28:45,813
Speaker 3: say maybe in New Zealand and Australia as well. The

432
00:28:46,333 --> 00:28:49,653
Speaker 3: sort of working assumption is that the when he was president,

433
00:28:49,773 --> 00:28:53,493
Speaker 3: the rest of the world was very unhappy, was very unhappy,

434
00:28:53,533 --> 00:28:56,213
Speaker 3: and that they would be again. And I think it's

435
00:28:56,333 --> 00:29:00,293
Speaker 3: more accurate to say that Western Europe was and would be,

436
00:29:01,053 --> 00:29:04,573
Speaker 3: and everywhere else it's a mixed, much more shade of grain.

437
00:29:04,653 --> 00:29:08,333
Speaker 3: In some cases you know, actually quite work, quite happy,

438
00:29:08,533 --> 00:29:09,933
Speaker 3: would be quite happy because.

439
00:29:09,733 --> 00:29:13,213
Speaker 2: That speaking speaking of the rest of the world and

440
00:29:13,733 --> 00:29:19,373
Speaker 2: the the other countries that are making shall we say,

441
00:29:19,453 --> 00:29:23,013
Speaker 2: some headway of their own, and I'm talking maybe the bricks,

442
00:29:24,933 --> 00:29:28,733
Speaker 2: and I'm talking other other countries, especially in the Middle East,

443
00:29:28,773 --> 00:29:33,453
Speaker 2: who are carving out a future for themselves beyond what anybody,

444
00:29:33,573 --> 00:29:37,173
Speaker 2: I think expected. What sort of influence would would they

445
00:29:37,413 --> 00:29:40,413
Speaker 2: get out of this Trump being returned to the to

446
00:29:40,533 --> 00:29:43,733
Speaker 2: the White House and the effects that he might have

447
00:29:43,933 --> 00:29:46,573
Speaker 2: on them. Would they be nervous or would they be

448
00:29:46,693 --> 00:29:51,413
Speaker 2: anticipatory in a much more common, a much more positive sense.

449
00:29:52,893 --> 00:29:57,093
Speaker 3: I think the latter. I think that in a sort

450
00:29:57,133 --> 00:30:03,413
Speaker 3: of political, diplomatic, war and peace sense, they viewed Trump

451
00:30:03,453 --> 00:30:07,333
Speaker 3: as someone based on his record and his sort of pledges,

452
00:30:07,973 --> 00:30:10,893
Speaker 3: somet who thinks first about how do we stop people

453
00:30:10,933 --> 00:30:13,333
Speaker 3: from fighting right or prevent them from fighting in the

454
00:30:13,373 --> 00:30:16,253
Speaker 3: first place, rather than how many countries can I invade?

455
00:30:16,333 --> 00:30:20,333
Speaker 3: Or which which wars can I keep going? Which is

456
00:30:20,373 --> 00:30:25,213
Speaker 3: the stereotype caricature, often with a lot of substance behind it,

457
00:30:25,453 --> 00:30:29,573
Speaker 3: of American foreign policies, whether it's Democrat or Republican led.

458
00:30:30,533 --> 00:30:34,573
Speaker 3: So I think, you know, the the Arab States, for example,

459
00:30:35,133 --> 00:30:39,293
Speaker 3: think that whatever Trump says in support of Israel, his

460
00:30:39,453 --> 00:30:43,453
Speaker 3: priority will be ending conflict and preventing it from kicking off.

461
00:30:44,093 --> 00:30:46,733
Speaker 3: You know, so there's there's that part of it. I

462
00:30:46,813 --> 00:30:49,653
Speaker 3: think the other part of it is, you know, more

463
00:30:49,693 --> 00:30:55,413
Speaker 3: on the economic side, where Trump's view of economic policy

464
00:30:56,613 --> 00:31:02,333
Speaker 3: through a businessman's eyes and brain and his sense of

465
00:31:02,973 --> 00:31:07,213
Speaker 3: trade deals being you know, corporate deals. You know, he's

466
00:31:07,253 --> 00:31:09,013
Speaker 3: the CEO of America and he's going to make a

467
00:31:09,053 --> 00:31:11,933
Speaker 3: good deal. I think they view them as someone who

468
00:31:12,053 --> 00:31:18,253
Speaker 3: is welcoming the opening up of many of the bricks countries,

469
00:31:18,533 --> 00:31:22,733
Speaker 3: particularly in the Arab world global self, where he's going

470
00:31:22,813 --> 00:31:24,653
Speaker 3: to be looking for a good deal for America, but

471
00:31:24,813 --> 00:31:27,933
Speaker 3: he's happy for them to prosper. He's happy for them

472
00:31:28,453 --> 00:31:35,013
Speaker 3: to be more globally facing. Economically, it favors trade deals,

473
00:31:35,053 --> 00:31:36,893
Speaker 3: but you know, his notion of what a good trade

474
00:31:36,933 --> 00:31:38,973
Speaker 3: deal is is different from a lot of his predecessors.

475
00:31:39,893 --> 00:31:43,213
Speaker 3: So again, I think it's this sense outside of Western Europe,

476
00:31:43,573 --> 00:31:47,133
Speaker 3: the sense of whether they are on paper ideologically in sync,

477
00:31:48,293 --> 00:31:51,133
Speaker 3: or whether they think he's a nice guy or not,

478
00:31:52,813 --> 00:31:55,053
Speaker 3: just a sense that this is somebody that you can

479
00:31:55,173 --> 00:31:59,973
Speaker 3: work with, right, This is somebody who's very bottom line oriented,

480
00:32:00,693 --> 00:32:04,773
Speaker 3: who isn't so concerned about what you may have said

481
00:32:04,773 --> 00:32:07,373
Speaker 3: about him in the newspaper last week. The way that

482
00:32:07,493 --> 00:32:12,453
Speaker 3: some sort of insecure leaders are He's just, you know,

483
00:32:13,173 --> 00:32:17,893
Speaker 3: let's get this done. And because he's so overtly America first,

484
00:32:19,093 --> 00:32:22,053
Speaker 3: it sort of clears the decks a little bit and

485
00:32:22,373 --> 00:32:26,053
Speaker 3: just focuses people's minds on the fact that, you know,

486
00:32:26,333 --> 00:32:28,493
Speaker 3: he's looking for a good deal for his country. That's

487
00:32:28,853 --> 00:32:31,293
Speaker 3: really all he cares about. But he doesn't think that

488
00:32:31,413 --> 00:32:35,213
Speaker 3: you benefiting is mutually exclusive from him achieving his objective.

489
00:32:36,933 --> 00:32:40,373
Speaker 2: So from your perspective, what do you think Trump's view

490
00:32:40,733 --> 00:32:44,173
Speaker 2: of his fellow Americans is? And when I when I

491
00:32:44,293 --> 00:32:49,333
Speaker 2: asked that question, I mean of all classes, of all groupings,

492
00:32:51,053 --> 00:32:55,493
Speaker 2: and especially those who he has considered to be dumb,

493
00:32:55,853 --> 00:32:58,853
Speaker 2: stupid and dealt with them accordingly. Now that he's in

494
00:32:58,933 --> 00:33:01,253
Speaker 2: this position, what do you think his reaction is to

495
00:33:01,373 --> 00:33:01,893
Speaker 2: those people?

496
00:33:02,893 --> 00:33:06,933
Speaker 3: Well, I mean he thinks generally. I think he's somebody

497
00:33:06,933 --> 00:33:11,733
Speaker 3: whose default position is to think very favorably upon you know,

498
00:33:11,933 --> 00:33:16,693
Speaker 3: his fellow Americans in an individual case basis, until they

499
00:33:16,813 --> 00:33:21,573
Speaker 3: prove themselves otherwise sort worthy of respect and all the

500
00:33:21,653 --> 00:33:25,173
Speaker 3: rest of it. He is someone who has I don't

501
00:33:25,213 --> 00:33:27,453
Speaker 3: think he's such a conversion. But because of the way

502
00:33:27,493 --> 00:33:29,933
Speaker 3: he was brought up, the time he was forced to

503
00:33:30,013 --> 00:33:32,933
Speaker 3: spend you know, working on his father's construction sites and

504
00:33:33,013 --> 00:33:35,573
Speaker 3: that kind of thing, whether it was in his DNA

505
00:33:35,813 --> 00:33:38,493
Speaker 3: or it was something environment because the environment that he

506
00:33:39,173 --> 00:33:42,413
Speaker 3: spent time in as a youngster, you know, he has

507
00:33:42,533 --> 00:33:48,653
Speaker 3: this lifelong rapport with working class, blue collar people work

508
00:33:48,813 --> 00:33:51,093
Speaker 3: you know, who work with their hands, make things, fix things,

509
00:33:51,133 --> 00:33:53,613
Speaker 3: and all that kind of stuff. He he doesn't just

510
00:33:54,533 --> 00:33:57,333
Speaker 3: know them and what they do, but he actually gets

511
00:33:57,453 --> 00:34:01,773
Speaker 3: them right. That's something that most obviously most billionaires don't.

512
00:34:01,853 --> 00:34:07,533
Speaker 3: But most these days politicians are usually from a pretty nice, comfortable,

513
00:34:07,613 --> 00:34:10,533
Speaker 3: class back background and all the rest of it, and

514
00:34:11,133 --> 00:34:16,373
Speaker 3: their exposure to those those folks who you know, belong

515
00:34:16,453 --> 00:34:19,213
Speaker 3: to unions or you know, do make things and build things,

516
00:34:19,533 --> 00:34:22,813
Speaker 3: fix things is pretty limited, you know, except for maybe

517
00:34:22,853 --> 00:34:26,133
Speaker 3: when somebody comes to fix something at their house. So

518
00:34:26,773 --> 00:34:32,893
Speaker 3: he has a lifelong kind of respect for quote unquote

519
00:34:32,973 --> 00:34:36,053
Speaker 3: ordinary people doing this, I'm putting words in his mouth,

520
00:34:36,093 --> 00:34:39,053
Speaker 3: but the ordinary things that make the world go around, right,

521
00:34:40,373 --> 00:34:44,893
Speaker 3: and that's his natural those are his natural. Those those

522
00:34:44,933 --> 00:34:48,293
Speaker 3: are whom he feels, he naturally automatically feels the need

523
00:34:48,413 --> 00:34:54,053
Speaker 3: to protect and speak for, you know. And and the

524
00:34:54,133 --> 00:34:59,053
Speaker 3: way that American society culture has evolved, they have become

525
00:34:59,133 --> 00:35:02,973
Speaker 3: increasingly marginalized economically, socially, et cetera, et cetera, insistence of

526
00:35:03,013 --> 00:35:07,333
Speaker 3: the Western phenomenon. But there are there are more of

527
00:35:07,373 --> 00:35:11,333
Speaker 3: them in America and in most places, and the changes

528
00:35:11,893 --> 00:35:15,613
Speaker 3: is more pronounced, probably and more painful. And so he

529
00:35:15,813 --> 00:35:21,213
Speaker 3: is ironically truly a spokesperson for those in the bottom half,

530
00:35:21,373 --> 00:35:23,373
Speaker 3: even though he comes from the top of the top half.

531
00:35:24,853 --> 00:35:28,733
Speaker 3: That means that many in his class and the class

532
00:35:28,933 --> 00:35:33,093
Speaker 3: of the strata just below him no only disagree with

533
00:35:33,253 --> 00:35:37,893
Speaker 3: him about the innique, goodness and utility of those in

534
00:35:37,933 --> 00:35:43,093
Speaker 3: the bottom half, but they resent him for his affinity

535
00:35:43,493 --> 00:35:47,893
Speaker 3: and the devotion and support and true affection that many

536
00:35:47,933 --> 00:35:50,813
Speaker 3: in the bottom half have for him, because they know

537
00:35:51,213 --> 00:35:54,853
Speaker 3: these are his critics in the middle and upper classes.

538
00:35:54,893 --> 00:35:59,613
Speaker 3: They recognize that not in a million years would their

539
00:36:00,213 --> 00:36:04,293
Speaker 3: plumber want to have a beer with them, unless you

540
00:36:04,373 --> 00:36:06,853
Speaker 3: know he was paid well for his time were in

541
00:36:06,933 --> 00:36:09,893
Speaker 3: Trump's case, you know, ordinary people just like to hang

542
00:36:09,973 --> 00:36:12,493
Speaker 3: with him because he just he's just a pleasant guy,

543
00:36:13,733 --> 00:36:15,653
Speaker 3: you know, who listens to their stories and actually seems

544
00:36:15,653 --> 00:36:18,213
Speaker 3: to care about their lives. So, but that means that

545
00:36:19,293 --> 00:36:22,693
Speaker 3: at this point he's far more acutely aware of the

546
00:36:22,773 --> 00:36:25,813
Speaker 3: people he thinks are lazy and stupid and what the

547
00:36:25,933 --> 00:36:29,293
Speaker 3: threat that they pose to him and to indirectly the

548
00:36:29,373 --> 00:36:32,693
Speaker 3: people he's trying to represent. And he recognizes that the people,

549
00:36:32,973 --> 00:36:35,813
Speaker 3: the people that he was putting those categories today at least,

550
00:36:36,493 --> 00:36:41,333
Speaker 3: are those who are very well credentialed and have impressive resumes.

551
00:36:42,013 --> 00:36:44,773
Speaker 3: But as Trump's always said, you know, when you're hiring somebody,

552
00:36:45,813 --> 00:36:47,853
Speaker 3: you know, the resume is the last thing you look at.

553
00:36:47,893 --> 00:36:49,533
Speaker 3: You know, it's like, what have they done, where they

554
00:36:49,613 --> 00:36:52,653
Speaker 3: achieved and what kind of person are they? And I

555
00:36:52,773 --> 00:36:56,893
Speaker 3: think that when he assesses, as he apparently does very quickly,

556
00:36:57,333 --> 00:37:00,653
Speaker 3: somebody he goes very much of first impressions, wisely or unwisely,

557
00:37:02,173 --> 00:37:05,013
Speaker 3: he pretty much very quickly knows and will know is

558
00:37:05,093 --> 00:37:07,373
Speaker 3: they work out who they want to hire. You know,

559
00:37:07,453 --> 00:37:10,533
Speaker 3: these several thousand ob every president get gets to fill

560
00:37:11,973 --> 00:37:15,853
Speaker 3: which of these categories people fall into. And He's going

561
00:37:15,933 --> 00:37:17,853
Speaker 3: to be pretty brutal about it, far more brutal than

562
00:37:17,893 --> 00:37:19,693
Speaker 3: he was the first time, because he thinks he's learned

563
00:37:19,773 --> 00:37:21,653
Speaker 3: lessons on that experience.

564
00:37:21,773 --> 00:37:25,533
Speaker 2: Oh yes, so I saw him on television tonight walking

565
00:37:25,693 --> 00:37:31,893
Speaker 2: into the walking onto the stage to make his acceptance speech,

566
00:37:32,933 --> 00:37:36,973
Speaker 2: and he was accompanied by his wife, Millenia, and his

567
00:37:37,133 --> 00:37:41,133
Speaker 2: son Baron. Did you witness that I didn't. I didn't

568
00:37:41,133 --> 00:37:44,293
Speaker 2: write that's all right, No, So I now need to

569
00:37:44,373 --> 00:37:48,053
Speaker 2: explain it. So he walked in with them at the

570
00:37:48,093 --> 00:37:52,653
Speaker 2: head of the rest of the family, and the uz

571
00:37:52,693 --> 00:37:57,493
Speaker 2: Andahs were quite stunning because of one thing, you know what,

572
00:37:57,613 --> 00:38:02,773
Speaker 2: That was the height of his son. They thought they

573
00:38:02,853 --> 00:38:06,133
Speaker 2: thought they thought that he was about six foot six

574
00:38:06,293 --> 00:38:09,013
Speaker 2: or something like that, and I said, no, he's six

575
00:38:09,133 --> 00:38:12,333
Speaker 2: foot ten. This is before he came in. And they

576
00:38:12,373 --> 00:38:15,013
Speaker 2: walked in and everyone went old and wow, look at that.

577
00:38:15,733 --> 00:38:22,613
Speaker 2: And I wonder your thoughts on Trump's thoughts and attitude

578
00:38:22,733 --> 00:38:26,133
Speaker 2: and approach to having a son, because he's got others

579
00:38:26,533 --> 00:38:29,373
Speaker 2: as we know, but having a son, his youngest son,

580
00:38:29,893 --> 00:38:37,893
Speaker 2: who is outstandingly tall, apparently apparently very intelligent. I can't

581
00:38:38,013 --> 00:38:41,853
Speaker 2: verify that, but so I'm told. And what effect that

582
00:38:42,093 --> 00:38:46,293
Speaker 2: might have on the father as far as the son

583
00:38:46,413 --> 00:38:48,573
Speaker 2: is concerned. Do you know what I'm asking? I'm asking,

584
00:38:48,773 --> 00:38:51,133
Speaker 2: what does he what do you think he might think

585
00:38:51,173 --> 00:38:55,333
Speaker 2: about the son? And what the son thinks about all this,

586
00:38:55,573 --> 00:38:57,693
Speaker 2: and what impression he tries to make on him or

587
00:38:57,733 --> 00:39:02,893
Speaker 2: what he's what he's trying to encourage his son to do, be, etc.

588
00:39:03,693 --> 00:39:06,573
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's an interesting one, but quickly because the age wise,

589
00:39:07,173 --> 00:39:11,213
Speaker 3: this las most recent son is more of a traditionally

590
00:39:11,253 --> 00:39:15,093
Speaker 3: a sort of grand grandson age right, difference in age,

591
00:39:15,493 --> 00:39:18,853
Speaker 3: So it's a yeah, I know, it's I think it's

592
00:39:18,853 --> 00:39:21,853
Speaker 3: something that's sort of really crept up, not creptal on people.

593
00:39:22,013 --> 00:39:24,573
Speaker 3: People feel that it's come out of nowhere because you know,

594
00:39:24,813 --> 00:39:27,573
Speaker 3: when he was first elected, his son with ten you know,

595
00:39:28,893 --> 00:39:32,053
Speaker 3: and suddenly he's a young man whose you know, towers

596
00:39:32,093 --> 00:39:36,213
Speaker 3: over his tall father and his son has been parent

597
00:39:36,413 --> 00:39:40,253
Speaker 3: not apparently. I mean, it's well documented, incredibly influential in

598
00:39:40,373 --> 00:39:44,693
Speaker 3: a positive way in directing his father towards all these

599
00:39:44,853 --> 00:39:49,973
Speaker 3: various uh general all these zoomored you know generation Z

600
00:39:51,133 --> 00:39:54,293
Speaker 3: podcast as an influence and all of that. Right, he's

601
00:39:54,293 --> 00:39:56,853
Speaker 3: sort of really got his head on straight into me.

602
00:39:56,933 --> 00:39:59,533
Speaker 3: He's obviously, however intelligent he is and like you, I

603
00:39:59,573 --> 00:40:02,253
Speaker 3: can't prove the years there isn't, but it seems he is.

604
00:40:02,493 --> 00:40:07,453
Speaker 3: He's obviously very astute and politically, he's obviously absorbed a

605
00:40:07,533 --> 00:40:10,733
Speaker 3: lot over the time he was in the White House

606
00:40:10,773 --> 00:40:13,133
Speaker 3: and ever since and he looks. I mean he was

607
00:40:13,533 --> 00:40:16,093
Speaker 3: I mean literally, I mean literally figuratively appears to be

608
00:40:16,253 --> 00:40:19,213
Speaker 3: somebody who you know, if this was the Kennedy family,

609
00:40:19,293 --> 00:40:21,373
Speaker 3: you'd say, oh, well, you know, in ten years he's

610
00:40:21,373 --> 00:40:22,653
Speaker 3: going to be in Congress and they're going to be

611
00:40:22,693 --> 00:40:24,493
Speaker 3: in the Senate and all that kind of thing, that

612
00:40:24,613 --> 00:40:28,533
Speaker 3: traditional sort of trajectory, And that may be the case.

613
00:40:28,613 --> 00:40:31,293
Speaker 3: The interesting but gut's really interesting with the Trunk family,

614
00:40:31,373 --> 00:40:35,613
Speaker 3: of course, is his two elder sons, Don Junior and Eric,

615
00:40:36,133 --> 00:40:38,493
Speaker 3: are quite formidable in their own right and in the

616
00:40:38,573 --> 00:40:45,133
Speaker 3: political sense. The working assumption is that Don Junior wants

617
00:40:45,213 --> 00:40:48,533
Speaker 3: to have a political future and it might not be

618
00:40:48,693 --> 00:40:51,573
Speaker 3: long before he jumps into a Senate race or a

619
00:40:51,653 --> 00:40:56,253
Speaker 3: gubernatorial race or maybe even you know, presidential race. You know,

620
00:40:56,373 --> 00:41:00,133
Speaker 3: he's impressed a lot of people. His brother has too,

621
00:41:00,173 --> 00:41:02,573
Speaker 3: but his brother's a little more I think keen on

622
00:41:02,653 --> 00:41:04,733
Speaker 3: the background, and I don't think has the desires on

623
00:41:04,813 --> 00:41:06,973
Speaker 3: being a candidate. But so it's I'm not trying to

624
00:41:07,013 --> 00:41:14,573
Speaker 3: suggest there's a Don Junior versus versus basketball playing son,

625
00:41:16,493 --> 00:41:19,853
Speaker 3: you know, Baron Baron versus John Junior competition coming to

626
00:41:19,933 --> 00:41:24,013
Speaker 3: be the next candidate, But you could see how both

627
00:41:24,053 --> 00:41:27,093
Speaker 3: of the Trump might look at both of them and

628
00:41:27,333 --> 00:41:31,053
Speaker 3: think there's somebody, you know who could follow in my footsteps.

629
00:41:32,533 --> 00:41:34,173
Speaker 3: And he you know, he may be right about both

630
00:41:34,293 --> 00:41:37,053
Speaker 3: or certainly you know one or the other. But given

631
00:41:37,053 --> 00:41:40,653
Speaker 3: the difference at an age, I think barren any any

632
00:41:40,653 --> 00:41:43,893
Speaker 3: opportunity of a baron, they may come, but they're they're

633
00:41:43,933 --> 00:41:46,893
Speaker 3: going to come a little while after his eldest brother

634
00:41:47,493 --> 00:41:49,253
Speaker 3: has already you know, tried his hand.

635
00:41:50,293 --> 00:41:52,853
Speaker 2: Let me ask you, finally, what do you think the

636
00:41:52,893 --> 00:41:54,653
Speaker 2: first thing he will do will be?

637
00:41:55,693 --> 00:41:59,333
Speaker 3: Uh, the first thing he will do, I think will

638
00:41:59,413 --> 00:42:03,933
Speaker 3: be something over the border, deportation, that kind of thing.

639
00:42:04,573 --> 00:42:08,973
Speaker 3: Partly because it's so central to people's concern is partly

640
00:42:09,053 --> 00:42:13,693
Speaker 3: because it's essentral to his his sort of his promise

641
00:42:13,813 --> 00:42:16,813
Speaker 3: to his voters. And also because and this is why

642
00:42:16,893 --> 00:42:20,173
Speaker 3: Biden worked on this issue in Biden and Kamala literally

643
00:42:20,253 --> 00:42:22,413
Speaker 3: day one, is that a lot of this stuff can

644
00:42:22,453 --> 00:42:25,453
Speaker 3: be done through executive order. You know, the executive orders

645
00:42:25,453 --> 00:42:29,653
Speaker 3: that Trump brought in on day one, Harrison Biden rescinded them,

646
00:42:30,453 --> 00:42:34,333
Speaker 3: and you know, Trump can you know, go reverse that.

647
00:42:35,653 --> 00:42:38,533
Speaker 3: And it's a way of being active on an important

648
00:42:38,573 --> 00:42:40,973
Speaker 3: issue right out of the gate. I think that's I mean,

649
00:42:40,973 --> 00:42:43,173
Speaker 3: I think what he would like to do right off

650
00:42:43,253 --> 00:42:46,893
Speaker 3: for that he may do is all of the releasing

651
00:42:46,973 --> 00:42:50,133
Speaker 3: all of the you know, jfk assassination files and all

652
00:42:50,173 --> 00:42:54,253
Speaker 3: this sort of deep state cover up stuff. Obviously Kennedy

653
00:42:54,613 --> 00:42:57,333
Speaker 3: would like that to happen yesterday. But I think the

654
00:42:57,613 --> 00:43:01,933
Speaker 3: Trump's own experience with the people want the institutions, the

655
00:43:02,013 --> 00:43:05,813
Speaker 3: people who run the institutions today, the people and institutions

656
00:43:05,853 --> 00:43:08,453
Speaker 3: he thought he could work with in one one to

657
00:43:08,533 --> 00:43:12,253
Speaker 3: work with him. Now he knows to say the opposite

658
00:43:12,333 --> 00:43:17,173
Speaker 3: is true. Is putting it diplomatically. I think he on

659
00:43:17,293 --> 00:43:21,013
Speaker 3: a personal level, would just like to just lift, you know,

660
00:43:21,213 --> 00:43:24,373
Speaker 3: take the top off it, turn the snow globe upside

661
00:43:24,413 --> 00:43:27,533
Speaker 3: down and shake it up and see how many of

662
00:43:27,613 --> 00:43:28,493
Speaker 3: them fall out, you know.

663
00:43:28,813 --> 00:43:32,293
Speaker 2: Yeah, indeed, so it's going to be very interesting times.

664
00:43:32,693 --> 00:43:36,693
Speaker 2: And again I want to thank you. We have spoken

665
00:43:36,773 --> 00:43:40,653
Speaker 2: three times in the last three days, twice today, and

666
00:43:41,053 --> 00:43:44,453
Speaker 2: it is well twice yesterday and today, because it's now

667
00:43:45,253 --> 00:43:49,133
Speaker 2: twelve o seven am on the morning of the sixth

668
00:43:49,253 --> 00:43:53,093
Speaker 2: your time, sorry, on the morning of the seventh, out time,

669
00:43:53,533 --> 00:43:56,493
Speaker 2: and you're a day behind. I'm probably holding it up

670
00:43:56,533 --> 00:44:01,773
Speaker 2: from much industrial achievement today, but again.

671
00:44:02,813 --> 00:44:06,293
Speaker 3: Holding up from anything approaching the level of enjoyment.

672
00:44:07,373 --> 00:44:11,253
Speaker 2: Well, it has been an enjoyable day. I have to say.

673
00:44:11,933 --> 00:44:15,973
Speaker 2: I've taken phone calls from all over, texts from even beyond,

674
00:44:16,413 --> 00:44:20,133
Speaker 2: and everybody, everybody I know, seems to be very pleased

675
00:44:20,173 --> 00:44:23,133
Speaker 2: about it. I know I am, and I believe you are.

676
00:44:23,613 --> 00:44:28,173
Speaker 3: Yes, we have our share of bad days, so we

677
00:44:28,333 --> 00:44:30,293
Speaker 3: must take our victories where we find them.

678
00:44:31,253 --> 00:44:36,293
Speaker 2: Indeed, so thank you, and we will talk sometime in

679
00:44:36,413 --> 00:44:40,133
Speaker 2: the not too distant future. And it's always welcome, oh

680
00:44:40,293 --> 00:44:40,813
Speaker 2: my pleasure.

681
00:44:41,013 --> 00:44:55,133
Speaker 3: Always look forward to it. Now.

682
00:44:55,253 --> 00:44:58,613
Speaker 2: As you can imagine, there is so much being written

683
00:44:58,853 --> 00:45:03,573
Speaker 2: and published on this particular day for obvious reasons that

684
00:45:03,693 --> 00:45:06,973
Speaker 2: there is a massive choice of contributors that one could adopt.

685
00:45:07,333 --> 00:45:10,293
Speaker 2: But I've picked a couple come from people to who

686
00:45:10,333 --> 00:45:17,333
Speaker 2: I either admire or respect or both. Firstly, firstly, historian

687
00:45:17,413 --> 00:45:21,533
Speaker 2: Neil Ferguson, Trump's victory is a blow to political law,

688
00:45:21,653 --> 00:45:26,733
Speaker 2: fair critical race theory, woke campuses, legacy media, and Hollywood.

689
00:45:27,133 --> 00:45:29,653
Speaker 2: It's also a win for a new generation of builders

690
00:45:29,893 --> 00:45:33,293
Speaker 2: like Elon Musk. That was just the opening paragraph for

691
00:45:33,893 --> 00:45:37,733
Speaker 2: the article he wrote. There is in the Epic Times.

692
00:45:38,053 --> 00:45:42,133
Speaker 2: There is an article from Jack Phillips. I'm unfamiliar with him,

693
00:45:42,133 --> 00:45:45,253
Speaker 2: to be honest, but he's written Trump has sweeping plans

694
00:45:45,293 --> 00:45:48,893
Speaker 2: for second administration. Here's what he has proposed. I only

695
00:45:48,973 --> 00:45:51,653
Speaker 2: mentioned that because it's worth looking up if you can.

696
00:45:52,453 --> 00:45:56,333
Speaker 2: And we come to Melanie Phillips, who I interviewed many

697
00:45:56,813 --> 00:45:59,133
Speaker 2: I don't know years ago, it seems now. She's a

698
00:45:59,173 --> 00:46:01,893
Speaker 2: British journalist, but she was in Jerusalem at the time

699
00:46:02,413 --> 00:46:04,453
Speaker 2: and we had a terrible line. We must do her

700
00:46:04,493 --> 00:46:08,133
Speaker 2: again sometime. But she has written something that I think

701
00:46:08,653 --> 00:46:12,373
Speaker 2: really covers it for a lot of people. The unfortunate

702
00:46:12,453 --> 00:46:16,093
Speaker 2: thing is its five pages. So what I'm going to

703
00:46:16,213 --> 00:46:20,853
Speaker 2: do is start reading and see where we go. Maybe

704
00:46:20,893 --> 00:46:24,733
Speaker 2: we'll get the whole lot against all odds by Melanie Phillips.

705
00:46:25,133 --> 00:46:28,053
Speaker 2: But those so shocked by Trump's victory have only themselves

706
00:46:28,093 --> 00:46:31,733
Speaker 2: to blame. The relief for some of us is overwhelming,

707
00:46:32,253 --> 00:46:35,133
Speaker 2: even among people who dislike Donald Trump or worry about

708
00:46:35,173 --> 00:46:38,933
Speaker 2: his temperament. The possibility that Carmala Harris might win that

709
00:46:39,093 --> 00:46:44,333
Speaker 2: yesterday's US presidential election produced the deepest fear and dread,

710
00:46:44,933 --> 00:46:51,453
Speaker 2: fear for America and fear for civilization others, however, died

711
00:46:51,493 --> 00:46:57,213
Speaker 2: in the world. Democrats, formerly Republican, never Trumpers and progressives

712
00:46:57,653 --> 00:47:01,213
Speaker 2: in Britain and elsewhere are clutching their heads today and

713
00:47:01,413 --> 00:47:05,253
Speaker 2: moaning how good this have happened. It would take a

714
00:47:05,333 --> 00:47:08,213
Speaker 2: heart of stone not to laugh. The election result is

715
00:47:08,453 --> 00:47:12,733
Speaker 2: by any standard extraordinary. This is a man who the

716
00:47:12,853 --> 00:47:16,733
Speaker 2: Left has spent the past eight years trying to destroy

717
00:47:17,573 --> 00:47:20,853
Speaker 2: through every possible means other than a stake through the Hut.

718
00:47:21,693 --> 00:47:25,413
Speaker 2: He was subjected to an attempted rolling coup, impeachment twice,

719
00:47:25,853 --> 00:47:29,773
Speaker 2: law fare, prosecutions, and legal harassment. He was found guilty

720
00:47:29,853 --> 00:47:33,333
Speaker 2: of sexual assault and improperly reporting hush money payments. His

721
00:47:33,493 --> 00:47:37,373
Speaker 2: house was raided over the official documents that, like Joe Biden,

722
00:47:37,573 --> 00:47:40,493
Speaker 2: he had taken home. He was defamed non stop with

723
00:47:40,613 --> 00:47:43,893
Speaker 2: malicious distortions of his comments and claims that he was

724
00:47:43,973 --> 00:47:48,853
Speaker 2: a Nazi, fascist and dictator who would destroy democracy. Then

725
00:47:48,893 --> 00:47:52,173
Speaker 2: he survived, it would be assassin's bullet. Yet Trump and

726
00:47:52,253 --> 00:47:55,053
Speaker 2: the Republicans have now come through to win the presidency,

727
00:47:55,213 --> 00:47:59,853
Speaker 2: the Senate, and the popular vote. Moreover, in every constituency

728
00:47:59,973 --> 00:48:03,333
Speaker 2: that the Democrats had assumed was their own and in

729
00:48:03,413 --> 00:48:05,653
Speaker 2: which they were confident that they had the vote sewn

730
00:48:05,733 --> 00:48:09,973
Speaker 2: up African Americans, Hispanics, and other minority is, women, young people,

731
00:48:10,493 --> 00:48:15,733
Speaker 2: first time voters. Trump actually increased his support and crushed

732
00:48:15,853 --> 00:48:21,053
Speaker 2: his opponent. Why oh why, cry the traumatized liberals. How

733
00:48:21,133 --> 00:48:23,853
Speaker 2: could this possibly have happened when we said it wouldn't.

734
00:48:24,373 --> 00:48:28,973
Speaker 2: We stated definitively that Kamala would win by an overwhelming majority,

735
00:48:29,613 --> 00:48:31,653
Speaker 2: So how could it possibly be the case that she

736
00:48:31,773 --> 00:48:36,333
Speaker 2: didn't achieve what we had said would happen. The arrogance

737
00:48:36,493 --> 00:48:41,253
Speaker 2: and hoovers are overwhelming, a rich source of mockery and

738
00:48:41,373 --> 00:48:45,213
Speaker 2: comic memes which are now doing the realms. However, these

739
00:48:45,293 --> 00:48:48,693
Speaker 2: come from a mindset which is far from amusing. As

740
00:48:48,813 --> 00:48:51,853
Speaker 2: the default position of those screaming about the threat that

741
00:48:51,973 --> 00:48:56,213
Speaker 2: Trump is said to pose to democracy, this mindset is

742
00:48:56,253 --> 00:49:00,093
Speaker 2: actually based on profound and venomous contempt for millions of

743
00:49:00,213 --> 00:49:03,613
Speaker 2: regular folks. This was summed up in an unusually clear

744
00:49:03,653 --> 00:49:07,213
Speaker 2: eyed analysis by a member of the American media. As

745
00:49:07,293 --> 00:49:10,653
Speaker 2: the result was become clear last night, CNN's political commentator

746
00:49:10,653 --> 00:49:15,493
Speaker 2: Scott Jennings said, this is a mandate forgetting the economy

747
00:49:15,573 --> 00:49:19,573
Speaker 2: working again for millions of working class Americans. Fix immigration,

748
00:49:20,333 --> 00:49:23,333
Speaker 2: try to get crime under control. Try to reduce the

749
00:49:23,453 --> 00:49:25,933
Speaker 2: chaos in the world. This is a mandate from the

750
00:49:25,973 --> 00:49:30,013
Speaker 2: American people to do that. I'm interpreting the results tonight

751
00:49:30,133 --> 00:49:33,693
Speaker 2: as the revenge of the regular, old, working class American,

752
00:49:34,053 --> 00:49:38,413
Speaker 2: the anonymous American who had been crushed, insulted, condescended to

753
00:49:39,253 --> 00:49:43,053
Speaker 2: They're not garbage, They're not Nazis. They're just regular people

754
00:49:43,333 --> 00:49:45,333
Speaker 2: who just get up and go to work every day,

755
00:49:45,453 --> 00:49:47,853
Speaker 2: trying to make a better life for their kids. And

756
00:49:47,973 --> 00:49:50,773
Speaker 2: they feel like they've been told to just shut up

757
00:49:50,933 --> 00:49:53,853
Speaker 2: when they have complained about the things that are hurting

758
00:49:53,933 --> 00:49:56,853
Speaker 2: them in their own lives. Jennings was a rare voice

759
00:49:56,893 --> 00:50:00,733
Speaker 2: of odesty from within a liberal establishment that has thus

760
00:50:00,893 --> 00:50:05,693
Speaker 2: dismissed and defamed ordinary Americans for years. The reason that

761
00:50:05,893 --> 00:50:09,253
Speaker 2: so many liberals simply can't believe what's happened, the reason

762
00:50:09,293 --> 00:50:12,133
Speaker 2: why they were absolutely certain in their predictions that Trump

763
00:50:12,253 --> 00:50:18,013
Speaker 2: couldn't possibly win, the reason they never registered Carmala's manifold

764
00:50:18,133 --> 00:50:22,333
Speaker 2: and disqualifying flaws, is that the world they inhabit is

765
00:50:22,413 --> 00:50:26,933
Speaker 2: a fantasy world. What they want to happen is what

766
00:50:27,053 --> 00:50:30,573
Speaker 2: they tell themselves must happen. Because it must happen, it

767
00:50:30,653 --> 00:50:34,373
Speaker 2: will happen, and if they tell themselves lies, and where

768
00:50:34,453 --> 00:50:37,773
Speaker 2: it is undeniably not happening, they have a duty to

769
00:50:37,813 --> 00:50:40,053
Speaker 2: make it happen by foul means as well as fair,

770
00:50:40,173 --> 00:50:43,653
Speaker 2: because it cannot be allowed not to happen. So, when

771
00:50:43,693 --> 00:50:46,853
Speaker 2: faced with the evidence of the disaster that saw Kamala

772
00:50:46,933 --> 00:50:50,253
Speaker 2: Harris's candidacy, they simply didn't see what the rest of

773
00:50:50,333 --> 00:50:53,653
Speaker 2: us saw. They didn't see that her inability to answer

774
00:50:53,653 --> 00:50:57,493
Speaker 2: any question other than her gibberish word salads was evidence

775
00:50:57,533 --> 00:51:01,493
Speaker 2: of someone who was totally unsuited to public office. Instead,

776
00:51:01,733 --> 00:51:05,093
Speaker 2: the mainstream media censored those episodes on the grounds that

777
00:51:05,573 --> 00:51:07,733
Speaker 2: it was their duty to ensure that she was elected

778
00:51:07,773 --> 00:51:11,453
Speaker 2: because the all alternative couldn't be allowed to happen. They

779
00:51:11,493 --> 00:51:15,253
Speaker 2: didn't register the copious evidence on social media of African

780
00:51:15,333 --> 00:51:19,973
Speaker 2: Americans and Hispanics declaring themselves Trump voters. They did not

781
00:51:20,173 --> 00:51:25,693
Speaker 2: acknowledge couldn't possibly acknowledge the disaster of americ Obama's arrogant

782
00:51:25,813 --> 00:51:28,693
Speaker 2: attempt to bully young black men into voting for Carmela,

783
00:51:29,213 --> 00:51:32,693
Speaker 2: a desperate move which backfired so very badly when these

784
00:51:32,813 --> 00:51:36,173
Speaker 2: young men declared themselves insulted by a man who had

785
00:51:36,613 --> 00:51:40,133
Speaker 2: done nothing for them while he was president. But when

786
00:51:40,213 --> 00:51:44,773
Speaker 2: they deem unconscionable, really does happen despite all their efforts.

787
00:51:45,493 --> 00:51:48,133
Speaker 2: It's as if the world has turned backwards on its axis.

788
00:51:48,493 --> 00:51:51,493
Speaker 2: It's an offense against nature itself. It simply cannot be.

789
00:51:52,733 --> 00:51:56,253
Speaker 2: Hence the titanic effort by the liberal establishment in Britain

790
00:51:56,573 --> 00:52:00,853
Speaker 2: to reverse the twenty sixteen Brexit vote. Hence the unconstitutional

791
00:52:00,933 --> 00:52:03,933
Speaker 2: and probably illegal three year attempt by elements in the

792
00:52:04,133 --> 00:52:09,213
Speaker 2: Justice Department, the FBI and Democratic Party forcilvie d by

793
00:52:09,453 --> 00:52:14,653
Speaker 2: a shockingly partisan media suppressing the truth to leave Trump

794
00:52:15,253 --> 00:52:19,173
Speaker 2: out of office the first time. Round Lo and behold,

795
00:52:19,293 --> 00:52:22,373
Speaker 2: there are already threats to repeat that attempted coup against

796
00:52:22,373 --> 00:52:26,133
Speaker 2: democracy by those who, in the same breath are intoning

797
00:52:26,213 --> 00:52:30,053
Speaker 2: that Trump will now destroy democracy. In the Atlantic, Tim

798
00:52:30,293 --> 00:52:33,893
Speaker 2: Nichols writes, after Barack Obama was elected president in two

799
00:52:33,893 --> 00:52:37,373
Speaker 2: thousand and eight, then Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell vowed

800
00:52:37,373 --> 00:52:40,733
Speaker 2: to make Obama a one term president and obstructed him

801
00:52:40,773 --> 00:52:44,333
Speaker 2: at every turn. McConnell, of course, cared only about seizing

802
00:52:44,373 --> 00:52:47,093
Speaker 2: power for his party, and later he could not muster

803
00:52:47,253 --> 00:52:50,693
Speaker 2: that same bravado when faced with Trump's assaults on the government.

804
00:52:51,413 --> 00:52:56,453
Speaker 2: Patriotic Americans and their representatives might now make a similar commitment,

805
00:52:57,253 --> 00:53:00,973
Speaker 2: but for better aims. Although they cannot remove Trump from office,

806
00:53:01,253 --> 00:53:04,453
Speaker 2: they can declare their determination to prevent Trump from implementing

807
00:53:04,933 --> 00:53:09,173
Speaker 2: the ghastly policies he committed himself to while campaigning. The

808
00:53:09,333 --> 00:53:12,573
Speaker 2: kinds of actions that will stop Trump from destroying America

809
00:53:12,653 --> 00:53:15,333
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty five are the same ones that stopped

810
00:53:15,413 --> 00:53:18,973
Speaker 2: many of his plans the first time around. They're not planshy,

811
00:53:19,493 --> 00:53:23,213
Speaker 2: and they will require sustained attention. Because the next battles

812
00:53:23,253 --> 00:53:26,533
Speaker 2: for democracy will be fought by lawyers and legislators in

813
00:53:26,733 --> 00:53:30,893
Speaker 2: Washington and in every state capital. They will be fought

814
00:53:30,973 --> 00:53:34,933
Speaker 2: by citizens banding together and associations and movements to rouse

815
00:53:35,053 --> 00:53:38,573
Speaker 2: others from their sleepwalk that has led America into this moment,

816
00:53:39,133 --> 00:53:43,893
Speaker 2: and Philip's writes get that patriotic Americans must now prevent

817
00:53:44,693 --> 00:53:46,973
Speaker 2: Trump from carrying out the pledges he made to the

818
00:53:47,013 --> 00:53:50,013
Speaker 2: American people on the basis of which they voted for him,

819
00:53:50,333 --> 00:53:55,453
Speaker 2: the essence of a democratic election. Liberals having this smeltdown

820
00:53:55,493 --> 00:53:58,413
Speaker 2: are accusing Trump of behavior of which they themselves are guilty,

821
00:53:58,973 --> 00:54:06,173
Speaker 2: contempt for democracy, subborting the constitutional order, lying bullying extremism,

822
00:54:06,413 --> 00:54:11,133
Speaker 2: suppressing contrary opinions, and promoting hatred and division. Psychologists call

823
00:54:11,213 --> 00:54:16,413
Speaker 2: this kind of accusatory behavior projection. It's a mental disorder.

824
00:54:17,573 --> 00:54:20,813
Speaker 2: The chances that projection word has come into play from

825
00:54:20,813 --> 00:54:24,373
Speaker 2: out of nowhere. Maybe it's been part of the psychologists

826
00:54:24,733 --> 00:54:30,093
Speaker 2: or psychiatrists lexicon for a long time, but I've never

827
00:54:30,173 --> 00:54:33,893
Speaker 2: heard it before, just recently. But it is a mental disorder.

828
00:54:34,293 --> 00:54:38,333
Speaker 2: The chances of this election resulting in such people questioning

829
00:54:38,413 --> 00:54:42,253
Speaker 2: their own mindset and assumptions which have now so spectacularly

830
00:54:42,333 --> 00:54:45,373
Speaker 2: blown up in their faces, the chances are very slim.

831
00:54:46,053 --> 00:54:49,253
Speaker 2: A notable exception has been Scott Jennings, who, in his

832
00:54:49,493 --> 00:54:54,653
Speaker 2: rare media copper also said the following, I also feel

833
00:54:54,773 --> 00:54:58,573
Speaker 2: like this election was something of an indictment of the

834
00:54:58,693 --> 00:55:01,973
Speaker 2: political information complex. We've been sitting around it for the

835
00:55:02,053 --> 00:55:05,093
Speaker 2: last couple of weeks, and the story that was portrayed

836
00:55:05,333 --> 00:55:08,973
Speaker 2: was not true. All these gimmicks we were we're going

837
00:55:09,013 --> 00:55:11,733
Speaker 2: to push Harris over the line, and we were ignoring

838
00:55:11,773 --> 00:55:15,893
Speaker 2: the fundamentals inflation. A feeling like they were barely able

839
00:55:15,933 --> 00:55:18,813
Speaker 2: to tread water at best. For all of us who

840
00:55:18,973 --> 00:55:23,573
Speaker 2: cover elections and talk about elections and do this on

841
00:55:23,693 --> 00:55:26,133
Speaker 2: a day to day basis. We have to figure out

842
00:55:26,213 --> 00:55:29,293
Speaker 2: how to understand, talk to and listen to the other

843
00:55:29,373 --> 00:55:32,653
Speaker 2: half of the country that rose up tonight and said

844
00:55:33,693 --> 00:55:40,253
Speaker 2: we've had enough. Absolutely correct elsewhere, says Phillips. Elsewhere, However,

845
00:55:40,853 --> 00:55:46,173
Speaker 2: liberal commentators are employing funereal tones today, as if they

846
00:55:46,253 --> 00:55:50,133
Speaker 2: are in mourning, and of course they're lashing out at

847
00:55:50,173 --> 00:55:52,533
Speaker 2: the people they say at a blame. They blame Harris

848
00:55:52,613 --> 00:55:55,453
Speaker 2: for failing to be different enough from Joe Biden. They

849
00:55:55,533 --> 00:55:59,093
Speaker 2: blame women for unaccountably failing to vote for her. They

850
00:55:59,173 --> 00:56:01,453
Speaker 2: blame people without a college degree for not having the

851
00:56:01,533 --> 00:56:05,453
Speaker 2: intelligence to agree with them. They blame the dark forces

852
00:56:05,533 --> 00:56:10,333
Speaker 2: of human nature. They blame Elon Musk for existing. What

853
00:56:10,533 --> 00:56:13,573
Speaker 2: such people can't see and never will see, is that

854
00:56:13,733 --> 00:56:19,453
Speaker 2: the people to blame are themselves very good piece. Don't

855
00:56:19,493 --> 00:56:23,213
Speaker 2: you think it covers? It covers so much, so much

856
00:56:23,293 --> 00:56:27,013
Speaker 2: that hasn't been recognized, so much that wasn't broadcast, wasn't

857
00:56:27,053 --> 00:56:30,733
Speaker 2: put into print, and now they're faced with the consequences,

858
00:56:31,933 --> 00:56:34,413
Speaker 2: and that will take us out For podcasts number two

859
00:56:34,533 --> 00:56:37,933
Speaker 2: hundred and sixty four For those of you who've stuck

860
00:56:38,013 --> 00:56:41,733
Speaker 2: with it and have enjoyed it and appreciated it. I

861
00:56:41,893 --> 00:56:45,493
Speaker 2: thank you. We shall No, there's no Mai room because

862
00:56:45,653 --> 00:56:49,373
Speaker 2: well there's no momorroom this week, so we shall. We

863
00:56:49,653 --> 00:56:52,053
Speaker 2: shall return next week with the podcast two hundred and

864
00:56:52,093 --> 00:56:56,373
Speaker 2: sixty five. Until then, as always, thank you for listening

865
00:56:56,493 --> 00:56:57,413
Speaker 2: and we shall talk soon.

866
00:57:05,373 --> 00:57:05,733
Speaker 3: Thank you.

867
00:57:07,133 --> 00:57:10,013
Speaker 1: For more from News Talks, be listen live on air

868
00:57:10,253 --> 00:57:12,893
Speaker 1: or online, and keep our shows with you wherever you

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00:57:13,013 --> 00:57:15,413
Speaker 1: go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio