1 00:00:07,133 --> 00:00:10,453 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Saturday Morning with Jack tam podcast 2 00:00:10,573 --> 00:00:11,693 Speaker 1: from News Talks at Me. 3 00:00:12,693 --> 00:00:15,973 Speaker 2: I'm Jack Tayne with you through to midday today and 4 00:00:16,053 --> 00:00:19,973 Speaker 2: my guest this morning live in Studio is a bona 5 00:00:20,093 --> 00:00:23,853 Speaker 2: fide legend of the New Zealand visual arts scene. Dick 6 00:00:23,893 --> 00:00:27,493 Speaker 2: Frizell is of course known for his keiwana icons think 7 00:00:27,533 --> 00:00:30,253 Speaker 2: the four Square Man with morec or Mickey Diticki, but 8 00:00:30,333 --> 00:00:32,893 Speaker 2: has worked across so many mediums and is about to 9 00:00:32,933 --> 00:00:37,093 Speaker 2: release a fantastic new memoir. The book is called Hastings, 10 00:00:37,253 --> 00:00:40,533 Speaker 2: A Boy's Own Adventure, and it's a collection of stories 11 00:00:40,693 --> 00:00:43,973 Speaker 2: that Dick has written about life growing up on the 12 00:00:43,973 --> 00:00:47,133 Speaker 2: East Coast in the nineteen fifties and early nineteen sixties. 13 00:00:47,413 --> 00:00:48,253 Speaker 2: Dick's here with us this. 14 00:00:48,213 --> 00:00:49,973 Speaker 3: Morning, held a good morning, Good morning. 15 00:00:50,093 --> 00:00:52,613 Speaker 2: Hey, I just love the concept. I've just said this 16 00:00:52,653 --> 00:00:55,413 Speaker 2: to off microphone. I just I love how you've gone 17 00:00:55,453 --> 00:00:58,853 Speaker 2: about writing this. You've really illustrated a kind of vivid, 18 00:01:00,373 --> 00:01:03,093 Speaker 2: a vivid picture of your childhood and I really delighted 19 00:01:03,133 --> 00:01:04,213 Speaker 2: in the way you've gone about this. 20 00:01:04,573 --> 00:01:04,933 Speaker 3: Thank you. 21 00:01:05,053 --> 00:01:07,853 Speaker 2: But just tell us about tell us about how your 22 00:01:07,893 --> 00:01:09,773 Speaker 2: family ended up in Hastings in the first place, because 23 00:01:09,773 --> 00:01:10,893 Speaker 2: you were actually born in Auckland, right. 24 00:01:10,973 --> 00:01:13,373 Speaker 3: I was born in Auckland, out at Mount Albert, a 25 00:01:13,453 --> 00:01:18,453 Speaker 3: little nursing home that's still there, funnily enough. But when 26 00:01:18,813 --> 00:01:21,413 Speaker 3: my father was in the Merchant Navy, an engineer in 27 00:01:21,453 --> 00:01:23,453 Speaker 3: the Merchant Navy, and the deal was that he'd come 28 00:01:23,493 --> 00:01:26,693 Speaker 3: ashore when I was born. So he came ashore and 29 00:01:26,733 --> 00:01:29,573 Speaker 3: got a job on the Dredge and the Auckland. But 30 00:01:29,693 --> 00:01:31,333 Speaker 3: as I said in the book, I think the Dredge 31 00:01:31,373 --> 00:01:34,333 Speaker 3: was a bit of an anti climax after the convoys 32 00:01:34,333 --> 00:01:38,133 Speaker 3: in the Pacific, and his sister's back in Hastings, which 33 00:01:38,173 --> 00:01:40,453 Speaker 3: is sort of the family seat if you like it 34 00:01:40,533 --> 00:01:46,853 Speaker 3: sounds grand, They offered him this really cheap loan to 35 00:01:47,253 --> 00:01:51,573 Speaker 3: if you go back to Hastings, back to where all 36 00:01:51,613 --> 00:01:56,013 Speaker 3: the other Frazels were, And Dad, who was a bit 37 00:01:57,173 --> 00:02:02,253 Speaker 3: strangely unambitious, thought, oh yeah, he just kind of just 38 00:02:02,293 --> 00:02:06,173 Speaker 3: did it. So we left our lovely little sunny flat 39 00:02:06,213 --> 00:02:09,893 Speaker 3: and Pickton Street and went to the dim little cottage 40 00:02:09,893 --> 00:02:12,573 Speaker 3: and the shadow of Tomato. 41 00:02:13,413 --> 00:02:16,053 Speaker 2: Which is which is I mean, you moved around a 42 00:02:16,053 --> 00:02:18,813 Speaker 2: little bit, but that's that's where you spent your childhood, 43 00:02:18,813 --> 00:02:20,573 Speaker 2: and you you kind of I mean the boys own 44 00:02:21,253 --> 00:02:25,013 Speaker 2: is totally such a such a good description, because really, 45 00:02:25,053 --> 00:02:27,413 Speaker 2: this is a collection of adventures that you had as 46 00:02:27,413 --> 00:02:27,933 Speaker 2: a little boy. 47 00:02:28,413 --> 00:02:31,053 Speaker 3: I didn't want to. I didn't see that to write 48 00:02:31,053 --> 00:02:33,973 Speaker 3: a memoir as such. You know. Then I did this, 49 00:02:34,053 --> 00:02:35,533 Speaker 3: and then I did that, and then I went on 50 00:02:35,613 --> 00:02:39,613 Speaker 3: here and I write. I wrote that thing about me 51 00:02:39,653 --> 00:02:42,373 Speaker 3: writing a short story for a short story competition on 52 00:02:43,413 --> 00:02:47,733 Speaker 3: national radio, and then I couldn't submit it. I think 53 00:02:47,773 --> 00:02:50,253 Speaker 3: I got it wrong. It said if you were I 54 00:02:50,293 --> 00:02:52,093 Speaker 3: thought it said if you were a published author, you 55 00:02:52,133 --> 00:02:54,453 Speaker 3: couldn't submit, but I think it actually said if the 56 00:02:54,493 --> 00:02:57,533 Speaker 3: story had been published, you couldn't submit. And I got 57 00:02:57,573 --> 00:03:00,093 Speaker 3: it wrong, as usual, which is a story in my life. 58 00:03:00,373 --> 00:03:03,093 Speaker 3: My great guiding principle, just get everything wrong and it 59 00:03:03,173 --> 00:03:07,493 Speaker 3: would be better than ever. I I didn't submit it, 60 00:03:07,813 --> 00:03:10,413 Speaker 3: but it got me going, and I've got me thinking 61 00:03:10,493 --> 00:03:16,293 Speaker 3: about how the memory works. And I just all those stories, 62 00:03:16,693 --> 00:03:20,573 Speaker 3: Why don't I just write them down? Because I can write, 63 00:03:20,733 --> 00:03:22,813 Speaker 3: you know, writing. I taught myself to write with that 64 00:03:22,973 --> 00:03:28,413 Speaker 3: diret journal and things, and and once I started, I 65 00:03:28,493 --> 00:03:34,013 Speaker 3: just couldn't get over the phenomena of recall, fake or otherwise, 66 00:03:34,053 --> 00:03:36,693 Speaker 3: you know what I mean. It just poured out of 67 00:03:36,693 --> 00:03:38,573 Speaker 3: the pen. I write with a pencil because I can 68 00:03:39,133 --> 00:03:42,653 Speaker 3: write longhand quicker than I can type. And then if 69 00:03:42,693 --> 00:03:45,493 Speaker 3: I write into those moleskin notebooks, and that became a thing, 70 00:03:45,733 --> 00:03:49,213 Speaker 3: the romantic idea of the mole skin notebooks and everything else. 71 00:03:49,893 --> 00:03:52,453 Speaker 3: Of course, you can carry it with you, you carry 72 00:03:52,493 --> 00:03:55,053 Speaker 3: there's your pen and your pencil and your pad. You 73 00:03:55,053 --> 00:03:56,813 Speaker 3: can write them right on the moon, you know. 74 00:03:57,093 --> 00:04:00,853 Speaker 2: Yeah. Of course that story you're referencing is one of 75 00:04:01,133 --> 00:04:03,053 Speaker 2: thirty that's in the book, and that's called Fish in 76 00:04:03,053 --> 00:04:06,533 Speaker 2: the Barrel. Yes, yes, it's the story of you and 77 00:04:06,653 --> 00:04:09,693 Speaker 2: you and you and a couple of mates who, as 78 00:04:09,813 --> 00:04:12,693 Speaker 2: kids decided that you have a go at literally shooting 79 00:04:12,693 --> 00:04:16,853 Speaker 2: a fish in a barrel. Right, how did that go down? 80 00:04:17,533 --> 00:04:21,133 Speaker 3: Well, it was a disaster. It should be called shooting 81 00:04:21,133 --> 00:04:24,213 Speaker 3: fish and a half barrel, really standing over a half 82 00:04:24,213 --> 00:04:30,293 Speaker 3: barrel with a three O three right, Yeah, yeah, that 83 00:04:30,453 --> 00:04:33,533 Speaker 3: was funny. That was That was That story was a 84 00:04:33,533 --> 00:04:38,813 Speaker 3: collection of incidents that I kind of wove together. It 85 00:04:38,933 --> 00:04:41,653 Speaker 3: wasn't sort of quite as straight out as it sounds 86 00:04:41,693 --> 00:04:45,013 Speaker 3: in the book, but it kind of more or less was. 87 00:04:45,053 --> 00:04:47,013 Speaker 2: Because this is the funny thing, isn't it I mean 88 00:04:47,053 --> 00:04:50,933 Speaker 2: it's a it is you know, a few decades since 89 00:04:50,973 --> 00:04:54,333 Speaker 2: the fifties and early sixties, and yeah, and I mean 90 00:04:54,373 --> 00:04:58,293 Speaker 2: there's a These are beautifully collected stories, but I mean 91 00:04:58,413 --> 00:05:01,373 Speaker 2: I struggled to remember things from a couple of weeks ago, clearly, 92 00:05:01,413 --> 00:05:02,933 Speaker 2: And so I suppose that this has been a kind 93 00:05:02,973 --> 00:05:04,813 Speaker 2: of interesting experience in that perspective. 94 00:05:05,253 --> 00:05:09,933 Speaker 3: Well, I mean people have often, my family whatever, have 95 00:05:10,013 --> 00:05:13,613 Speaker 3: commented about my memory is if I'm just making it 96 00:05:13,693 --> 00:05:15,293 Speaker 3: up all the time. There he goes again, you know, 97 00:05:16,213 --> 00:05:20,173 Speaker 3: like the silly old uncle. And then I thought, well, 98 00:05:20,213 --> 00:05:24,293 Speaker 3: there is maybe I have got an interesting memory, and 99 00:05:24,653 --> 00:05:28,533 Speaker 3: could I assumed everyone remember things like that. I think 100 00:05:28,533 --> 00:05:31,213 Speaker 3: it's something to do with my visual memory too, Being 101 00:05:31,253 --> 00:05:35,533 Speaker 3: an artist, I do remember things like like a movie 102 00:05:35,613 --> 00:05:40,693 Speaker 3: or like a painting, like a tableau that'ssed that way before. 103 00:05:40,773 --> 00:05:44,853 Speaker 3: That's exactly like every story is an assemblage of tableaus. 104 00:05:44,973 --> 00:05:48,133 Speaker 3: If you read them, you can see those boys standing 105 00:05:48,173 --> 00:05:51,133 Speaker 3: around the barrel while that kid gets up climbs up 106 00:05:51,133 --> 00:05:53,133 Speaker 3: on top of it, you know, and you can just 107 00:05:53,173 --> 00:05:55,573 Speaker 3: see them, can't you, Even though I'm one of them. Yeah, 108 00:05:55,653 --> 00:05:57,933 Speaker 3: you know, but I was like, I'm there, but I'm 109 00:05:57,973 --> 00:06:01,173 Speaker 3: actually standing back watching as well, like a time traveler. 110 00:06:01,773 --> 00:06:03,693 Speaker 2: That's the trick, steering down on it. 111 00:06:03,853 --> 00:06:06,173 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, no, just standing back under the 112 00:06:06,173 --> 00:06:11,333 Speaker 3: makarp is watching thinking, oh god, you know, get out 113 00:06:11,373 --> 00:06:12,133 Speaker 3: of the way, guys. 114 00:06:12,333 --> 00:06:13,813 Speaker 2: I hope we're not giving too much a way to 115 00:06:13,853 --> 00:06:16,973 Speaker 2: say that the fish survived. It's lucky the boys did too. 116 00:06:17,173 --> 00:06:19,653 Speaker 3: It's only one of them surviving. Yes, yes, but when 117 00:06:19,693 --> 00:06:22,493 Speaker 3: I keep I try to keep it alive with snacks, biscuits, 118 00:06:22,493 --> 00:06:23,733 Speaker 3: and I think the salt might. 119 00:06:24,493 --> 00:06:25,293 Speaker 2: Got them in the end. 120 00:06:25,413 --> 00:06:25,613 Speaker 1: Yeah. 121 00:06:25,773 --> 00:06:34,973 Speaker 2: Yeah. As someone who we associate so strongly with visual art, 122 00:06:35,173 --> 00:06:39,173 Speaker 2: how do you find storytelling and writing for the eye, 123 00:06:39,213 --> 00:06:41,813 Speaker 2: how do you find that as a different creative pursuit. 124 00:06:42,573 --> 00:06:46,973 Speaker 3: Well, the only the only difference that is the mobility, 125 00:06:46,973 --> 00:06:49,453 Speaker 3: of the astonishing mobility of it. You don't need all 126 00:06:49,453 --> 00:06:52,253 Speaker 3: the paraphernalia of the paints and the easels and the 127 00:06:52,333 --> 00:06:59,053 Speaker 3: space and the god knows what, And it's the the 128 00:06:59,173 --> 00:07:02,253 Speaker 3: kind of transparency is the trick is That's what I mean. 129 00:07:02,293 --> 00:07:06,893 Speaker 3: I think my paintings, that's what they're about. There's no 130 00:07:07,053 --> 00:07:12,053 Speaker 3: sort of conceptual skullduggery or whatever you want to call it. 131 00:07:12,053 --> 00:07:15,813 Speaker 3: It's just like the thing just laid out, like the 132 00:07:15,893 --> 00:07:20,133 Speaker 3: landscapes just completely laid out. There's no well, I mean 133 00:07:20,133 --> 00:07:23,653 Speaker 3: there's conceptual ideas involved in there about construction and whatever, 134 00:07:23,733 --> 00:07:26,733 Speaker 3: but it's the same with the writing. But if you 135 00:07:27,373 --> 00:07:31,253 Speaker 3: it's about openness really like leaving yourself wide open and 136 00:07:31,893 --> 00:07:35,573 Speaker 3: just risking some sort of integrity to leak through. I 137 00:07:35,613 --> 00:07:39,333 Speaker 3: mean something like that. Yeah, it's the same spirit. Yeah, 138 00:07:39,373 --> 00:07:39,813 Speaker 3: if you like. 139 00:07:39,933 --> 00:07:42,453 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'm just going to give our listeners a 140 00:07:42,453 --> 00:07:43,933 Speaker 2: bit of a kind of flavor of some of the 141 00:07:44,013 --> 00:07:46,333 Speaker 2: stories that are in there. So as well as shooting 142 00:07:46,333 --> 00:07:49,733 Speaker 2: fish in the barrel, there are stories about kind of 143 00:07:50,373 --> 00:07:53,093 Speaker 2: foundational things in your childhood. I love the story about 144 00:07:53,173 --> 00:07:56,253 Speaker 2: when you went to hospital after an appendix issue and 145 00:07:56,533 --> 00:07:59,613 Speaker 2: the different characters who were turning up and not because 146 00:07:59,613 --> 00:08:02,013 Speaker 2: you got put in in an adult ward as opposed 147 00:08:02,013 --> 00:08:02,533 Speaker 2: to in the kids. 148 00:08:02,973 --> 00:08:05,333 Speaker 3: Well this is see, this is the magic thing that 149 00:08:05,373 --> 00:08:08,933 Speaker 3: how things happen. Yeah, you know, like these things that 150 00:08:09,053 --> 00:08:11,693 Speaker 3: happened to you like that, I mean that was magic that. 151 00:08:11,893 --> 00:08:14,573 Speaker 3: Then it became the sort of mascot figure in the ward, 152 00:08:14,693 --> 00:08:15,053 Speaker 3: you know. 153 00:08:16,013 --> 00:08:19,333 Speaker 2: And the nurses, the nurses were preparing for a ball. 154 00:08:20,133 --> 00:08:24,013 Speaker 3: Gorgeous. Yeah, honestly, I goosebumps and I wrote that. 155 00:08:24,333 --> 00:08:28,813 Speaker 2: Yeah, so, yeah, there's that. It's funny because my dad 156 00:08:28,893 --> 00:08:32,213 Speaker 2: is of a very similar generation, same generation, and he 157 00:08:32,973 --> 00:08:34,733 Speaker 2: when we asked him about his childhood, I remember he 158 00:08:34,733 --> 00:08:36,333 Speaker 2: would always tell us about the time that he broke 159 00:08:36,373 --> 00:08:38,973 Speaker 2: his femur and spent a couple of months in hospital attraction. 160 00:08:39,053 --> 00:08:42,613 Speaker 2: And it's funny, how you know, just reading your story 161 00:08:42,693 --> 00:08:44,493 Speaker 2: reminded me of that, and how you know, going to 162 00:08:44,533 --> 00:08:48,253 Speaker 2: hospital as a little boy is like a really kind 163 00:08:48,293 --> 00:08:53,413 Speaker 2: of exciting and you know, quite affecting experience learning to drive. 164 00:08:53,453 --> 00:08:56,053 Speaker 2: Of course, in an Austin Sherborne. 165 00:08:55,733 --> 00:08:57,893 Speaker 3: We called it the Shoeborn. We didn't know it was a. 166 00:08:57,893 --> 00:09:01,253 Speaker 2: Shoe now, of course, he just called it the Austin Yeah. Yeah, 167 00:09:01,293 --> 00:09:05,573 Speaker 2: so but it's sort of it does kind of throw 168 00:09:05,653 --> 00:09:07,973 Speaker 2: back to what feels like a more innocent time. 169 00:09:08,493 --> 00:09:11,733 Speaker 3: Well it was innocent because there were so many I mean, 170 00:09:12,413 --> 00:09:15,173 Speaker 3: the media was limited and it's access to anything, and 171 00:09:15,213 --> 00:09:17,533 Speaker 3: we used to see newsreels at the cinema that was 172 00:09:17,533 --> 00:09:20,733 Speaker 3: about it, really, with all those soldiers marching along with 173 00:09:20,773 --> 00:09:24,973 Speaker 3: black and white, you know, yeah, and that was all 174 00:09:25,093 --> 00:09:27,653 Speaker 3: over there. It's kind of vague that you never got 175 00:09:27,933 --> 00:09:29,653 Speaker 3: updates on the war or anything, you. 176 00:09:29,573 --> 00:09:31,613 Speaker 2: Know, because you would have just you were born in 177 00:09:31,693 --> 00:09:34,693 Speaker 2: forty three, right, so you yeah, yeah, So I suppose 178 00:09:34,773 --> 00:09:38,293 Speaker 2: Korea was still you know, was maybe underway when you 179 00:09:38,333 --> 00:09:39,933 Speaker 2: were old enough to remember it better. 180 00:09:39,973 --> 00:09:41,493 Speaker 3: Well, I don't think most of the time we didn't 181 00:09:41,493 --> 00:09:44,253 Speaker 3: know watch which war we were watching. They're all the same, 182 00:09:44,693 --> 00:09:47,533 Speaker 3: They're all troops on ships and stuff, you know. Yeah, 183 00:09:47,653 --> 00:09:52,533 Speaker 3: And it was a very abstract commodity and there was 184 00:09:52,613 --> 00:09:55,933 Speaker 3: no I mean, the whole book was written in the 185 00:09:55,973 --> 00:09:58,773 Speaker 3: time and there was like only you wrote letters, you 186 00:09:58,773 --> 00:10:02,653 Speaker 3: know what I mean. So communication was so abstract, you know. 187 00:10:02,813 --> 00:10:05,333 Speaker 2: That was one one point that struck out to me. 188 00:10:05,573 --> 00:10:08,333 Speaker 2: It's the little detail that you've that you've recorded that 189 00:10:08,373 --> 00:10:09,413 Speaker 2: make this so special. 190 00:10:09,493 --> 00:10:10,733 Speaker 3: It's about details. 191 00:10:11,293 --> 00:10:12,813 Speaker 2: Well, no, this is the one where you talk about 192 00:10:12,853 --> 00:10:15,173 Speaker 2: your mum because you're you're one of six kids. You 193 00:10:15,213 --> 00:10:18,893 Speaker 2: talk about your mum writing letters to you for years 194 00:10:18,933 --> 00:10:20,933 Speaker 2: to come. Once you'd left, once she left Hastings and 195 00:10:20,973 --> 00:10:22,733 Speaker 2: you'd spread your wings and you're all in different parts 196 00:10:22,773 --> 00:10:24,893 Speaker 2: of the country or the world, and your mum would 197 00:10:24,893 --> 00:10:30,173 Speaker 2: send you all I think five pages like a carbon copy. Yeah, 198 00:10:30,253 --> 00:10:32,693 Speaker 2: and then she would have one page original for each child. 199 00:10:33,733 --> 00:10:35,253 Speaker 2: I mean, that's there's delightful. 200 00:10:35,453 --> 00:10:39,893 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's delightful. It's so lovely. You know, she's of course, 201 00:10:39,933 --> 00:10:43,413 Speaker 3: she just wrote, she just wrote, or anything about having 202 00:10:43,413 --> 00:10:45,453 Speaker 3: a cup of tea with a lady next door or whatever. 203 00:10:45,813 --> 00:10:48,573 Speaker 3: And I actually got such a little prick really the 204 00:10:48,653 --> 00:10:50,613 Speaker 3: varsity and I wrote to mom and I said, look, 205 00:10:51,493 --> 00:10:53,693 Speaker 3: just why why didn't you wait till you've got something 206 00:10:53,733 --> 00:10:57,933 Speaker 3: to say? What aral thing? I didn't realize it was 207 00:10:57,973 --> 00:10:59,053 Speaker 3: just fatic communion. 208 00:10:59,493 --> 00:11:03,453 Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't know what that was. So you listen 209 00:11:03,533 --> 00:11:05,373 Speaker 2: to Jack Tame on New Books. He'd be speaking with 210 00:11:05,413 --> 00:11:08,333 Speaker 2: Dick Frizzell about his book Hastings, A Boy's Own Adventure. 211 00:11:08,533 --> 00:11:11,253 Speaker 2: It's a meanwhile of sort, the collection of short stories 212 00:11:11,293 --> 00:11:14,533 Speaker 2: from his childhood growing up in Hawks Bay. Do you 213 00:11:14,893 --> 00:11:17,973 Speaker 2: do you reflect fondly on your childhood on that innocent time? 214 00:11:18,213 --> 00:11:21,493 Speaker 3: Oh, very much. I had it. I had it all 215 00:11:21,493 --> 00:11:25,933 Speaker 3: to myself. I mean really, I was the firstborn boy 216 00:11:26,293 --> 00:11:29,573 Speaker 3: prince with his own room, and it went like those 217 00:11:30,013 --> 00:11:32,413 Speaker 3: McDonald duck comics. My sisters weren't allowed to read them 218 00:11:32,493 --> 00:11:35,173 Speaker 3: till i'd read them, because I used to like every 219 00:11:35,173 --> 00:11:37,013 Speaker 3: time you open a page, you get all that ink, 220 00:11:37,093 --> 00:11:39,493 Speaker 3: fresh ink smell and stuff and if they read them first, 221 00:11:39,533 --> 00:11:41,453 Speaker 3: they all those molecules would have escaped. 222 00:11:41,493 --> 00:11:47,373 Speaker 2: You see, yeah you said that. So you moved to 223 00:11:47,413 --> 00:11:50,013 Speaker 2: Hastings because your dad got a good deal on a 224 00:11:50,053 --> 00:11:52,213 Speaker 2: mortgage and he had a good job there. But he 225 00:11:52,253 --> 00:11:55,533 Speaker 2: was an engineer, so he was very he wasn't artistically minded. 226 00:11:55,533 --> 00:11:57,373 Speaker 2: He was very kind of utilitarian mind. 227 00:11:57,693 --> 00:12:02,493 Speaker 3: Utilitarian. He couldn't like, he couldn't understand the point of art, 228 00:12:02,693 --> 00:12:06,213 Speaker 3: because in his mind everything could be solved with engineering. 229 00:12:06,733 --> 00:12:10,253 Speaker 3: You didn't need art. It was. He was totally bewildered 230 00:12:10,293 --> 00:12:12,373 Speaker 3: by the idea where did it fit? And yet he 231 00:12:12,573 --> 00:12:18,093 Speaker 3: read a lot. He liked his novels Raphael Sabatini and 232 00:12:18,133 --> 00:12:21,893 Speaker 3: all that sort of stuff, and he got me onto reading. 233 00:12:22,453 --> 00:12:25,173 Speaker 3: But he somehow he didn't he quate literally with art, 234 00:12:26,053 --> 00:12:29,173 Speaker 3: literature with art. It was art was art was just 235 00:12:29,213 --> 00:12:32,253 Speaker 3: a swanky rubbish over here, you know, funny, really weird. 236 00:12:32,293 --> 00:12:35,373 Speaker 3: And he was terrified because he'd been in the navy. 237 00:12:36,253 --> 00:12:42,253 Speaker 3: He seemed to have a really interesting idea about gay 238 00:12:42,813 --> 00:12:46,173 Speaker 3: what it wasn't called gay then, you know queers and things. Yeah, 239 00:12:46,333 --> 00:12:49,533 Speaker 3: it's funny saying words like that out loud. But he 240 00:12:49,573 --> 00:12:52,693 Speaker 3: would say, always say strange elliptical things like to me, like, 241 00:12:53,053 --> 00:12:57,093 Speaker 3: just stay away from the bo'swin Richard Bosin, what's that? 242 00:12:57,773 --> 00:13:00,213 Speaker 3: And then I used to a favorite comic that he 243 00:13:00,453 --> 00:13:02,093 Speaker 3: used to he bought me when I was six months 244 00:13:02,093 --> 00:13:05,253 Speaker 3: called Chocolate and the Bo'swain, which was a little black 245 00:13:05,333 --> 00:13:11,253 Speaker 3: kid with you know, stereotype looking big round eyes and everything. 246 00:13:11,813 --> 00:13:14,093 Speaker 3: And I used to think, what's this? He was a 247 00:13:14,173 --> 00:13:17,133 Speaker 3: bos And yeah, it's so complicated. I can't tell you, Jack, 248 00:13:17,613 --> 00:13:20,373 Speaker 3: and and so if I just but if I did 249 00:13:20,573 --> 00:13:24,733 Speaker 3: anything like sigh deeply or whatever, Dad would panic and think. 250 00:13:27,893 --> 00:13:30,293 Speaker 2: It's because it was a different time. 251 00:13:30,533 --> 00:13:31,933 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a different time. 252 00:13:32,053 --> 00:13:33,013 Speaker 2: It was a different times. 253 00:13:33,893 --> 00:13:37,413 Speaker 3: It's weird. It's it's amazing how we've got Yeah. 254 00:13:37,613 --> 00:13:42,293 Speaker 2: Yeah, so so, I mean I imagine that a lot 255 00:13:42,293 --> 00:13:44,653 Speaker 2: of the time when people write memoirs, they do it 256 00:13:44,693 --> 00:13:46,893 Speaker 2: to kind of, you know, in their own mind and 257 00:13:46,933 --> 00:13:49,853 Speaker 2: and their readers distinguish between nature and nurture and all 258 00:13:49,893 --> 00:13:52,253 Speaker 2: that kind of thing and see see the different events 259 00:13:52,293 --> 00:13:55,133 Speaker 2: and people that help shake them become who they become. 260 00:13:55,173 --> 00:13:56,773 Speaker 2: Do you feel like that was that was part of 261 00:13:56,773 --> 00:13:57,653 Speaker 2: this process as well? 262 00:13:57,693 --> 00:14:00,453 Speaker 3: Do you know? I honestly, like I wrote on the 263 00:14:00,693 --> 00:14:05,413 Speaker 3: forward or the introduction that you can you can do that. 264 00:14:06,213 --> 00:14:10,293 Speaker 3: You can you can set out to try and understand yourself, 265 00:14:10,773 --> 00:14:13,893 Speaker 3: or you can just write stories about yourself. And as 266 00:14:13,973 --> 00:14:17,693 Speaker 3: I said, I think the former just leaks into the ladder. 267 00:14:17,813 --> 00:14:22,813 Speaker 3: If you're just open, if you just let it go, 268 00:14:23,413 --> 00:14:26,213 Speaker 3: your personality is quickly going to be exposed. You know, 269 00:14:26,813 --> 00:14:29,253 Speaker 3: that's who you are and how you came to be. 270 00:14:29,533 --> 00:14:33,373 Speaker 3: And this kind of slightly dopey observer because I never 271 00:14:33,413 --> 00:14:38,853 Speaker 3: seem to initiate anything. I was never like that participated 272 00:14:38,853 --> 00:14:42,453 Speaker 3: all these adventurous layabouts from Havelock North, and that would 273 00:14:42,493 --> 00:14:45,573 Speaker 3: be they would say, let's go and play snooker. The 274 00:14:45,573 --> 00:14:47,173 Speaker 3: next thing you know, you're up in the snooker hole 275 00:14:47,253 --> 00:14:49,893 Speaker 3: and I would never have dreamed of doing that. Or 276 00:14:49,973 --> 00:14:51,733 Speaker 3: let's go up here, let's go up here, and let's 277 00:14:51,773 --> 00:14:54,493 Speaker 3: do this. And they say let's drive up to the 278 00:14:54,493 --> 00:14:56,973 Speaker 3: top of the Tomato Peak and your mum's car. I'd think, 279 00:14:57,173 --> 00:15:00,213 Speaker 3: oh god, and I could never say no. So it was. 280 00:15:00,573 --> 00:15:03,053 Speaker 3: But the thing I had to myself was the art. 281 00:15:03,213 --> 00:15:07,213 Speaker 3: You see, I initiate. That was my world and they 282 00:15:07,413 --> 00:15:11,173 Speaker 3: weren't in it at all. So the rest of it 283 00:15:11,653 --> 00:15:14,053 Speaker 3: I just went along with it and that's kind of 284 00:15:14,093 --> 00:15:14,933 Speaker 3: how the book happened. 285 00:15:14,973 --> 00:15:18,173 Speaker 2: Really, it's a real delight. It really is. Hastings a 286 00:15:18,173 --> 00:15:21,093 Speaker 2: Boy's Owned Adventure as a new memoir by Dick Frizell, 287 00:15:21,213 --> 00:15:24,533 Speaker 2: a collection of wonderful stories about life growing up in 288 00:15:24,573 --> 00:15:26,693 Speaker 2: Hastings in the fifties and early sixties. Thank you so 289 00:15:26,773 --> 00:15:27,493 Speaker 2: much for being here. 290 00:15:27,893 --> 00:15:28,573 Speaker 3: It was a pleasure. 291 00:15:28,773 --> 00:15:30,813 Speaker 2: Yeah, good, No, it really was. We'll make sure all 292 00:15:30,853 --> 00:15:33,453 Speaker 2: of the details for Dick's book are up and available 293 00:15:33,493 --> 00:15:35,933 Speaker 2: on the News Talks He'd big website. 294 00:15:35,853 --> 00:15:38,973 Speaker 1: For more from Saturday Morning with Jack Tame. Listen live 295 00:15:39,053 --> 00:15:41,853 Speaker 1: to News Talks he'd be from nine am Saturday, or 296 00:15:41,933 --> 00:15:43,853 Speaker 1: follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.