1 00:00:01,639 --> 00:00:01,960 Speaker 1: Hello. 2 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:05,160 Speaker 2: I am Paula Bennett and welcome to season six of 3 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 2: my New Zealand Herald podcast. 4 00:00:07,520 --> 00:00:18,920 Speaker 3: Asked me anything, It's so. 5 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 2: Good to be back, and one thing I've learned in 6 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:23,000 Speaker 2: life is it's never too late to learn something new. 7 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:25,479 Speaker 2: So on this podcast, I talked to people from all 8 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:28,040 Speaker 2: walks of life to hear about how they got to 9 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:30,320 Speaker 2: where they are and get some advice and guidance on 10 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:33,839 Speaker 2: some of life's biggest questions. My first guest for this 11 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:37,360 Speaker 2: season is a man who has a wonderfully varied CV 12 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 2: and a pioneer in our sports media. Starting us out 13 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,239 Speaker 2: as a sports reporter, he went on to become the 14 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 2: first ever all Blacks media man. He's been a tally host, creator, 15 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:51,320 Speaker 2: and producer. He created shows like nineties cult hit Sports 16 00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 2: Cafe you already know it is now also sports news 17 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 2: show The Crowd Goes Wild. He's recently returned from the 18 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:00,840 Speaker 2: US where he was CEO of New York's professional rugby 19 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:03,720 Speaker 2: union team, and that is probably only touching the surface, 20 00:01:03,800 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 2: so let's talk more about it. For his latest project, 21 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:09,880 Speaker 2: He's brought back Sports Cafe, this time in podcast form. 22 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 2: Was Sports Cafe ish Rick Salizo, Hi, how was that. 23 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:18,080 Speaker 1: That's good. There's a lot more impressive than I really am. 24 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: But that was sounding good. 25 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's all right. That's what we do, isn't it. 26 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 2: You know? 27 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:23,960 Speaker 3: So thanks for writing that all out for me. I 28 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:25,520 Speaker 3: just thought i'd read it out on you. 29 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 1: There's a bit longer, but you've missed the page for 30 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 1: that school. 31 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 3: Oh that's a right. You will get to it as 32 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:31,080 Speaker 3: we sort of go in. 33 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 2: So I'm going to ease in first some quickfire questions. 34 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:39,040 Speaker 2: If you could go to the pub with any celebrity, 35 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 2: who would it be. 36 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 1: That's a good question. My growing up, my hero is 37 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 1: Nadia kamen Each, the Romanian gymnast, and I mentioned not 38 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:51,960 Speaker 1: be yes, she's about the same age. And so I 39 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: was a four en year old kid watching the seventy 40 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 1: six Montreal Olympics. So I mentioned that to Mark and 41 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 1: he's been giving me grief for the last year about it. 42 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 1: So so that would be my most steel beee. 43 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 2: Some young men out there now that in what forty 44 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:11,240 Speaker 2: years time will say Simon, Yeah, well. 45 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 1: I mean you know she was when you think about, 46 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 1: you know, the idea of a perfect ten, well she was. 47 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 1: She did several perfect tens. Yeah, yeah, And I think fascinating. 48 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: She had a fascinating life, you know, being brought up 49 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 1: in Romanire and then going over to the US and 50 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 1: stuff like that. She'ld be cool. 51 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, she would be really so unexpected that and. 52 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 1: If we couldn't get in, she could sort of jump 53 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:36,399 Speaker 1: and climb and stuff get into the top. 54 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 3: She could somersault over. 55 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 1: So she'd be ready handed in the pub. 56 00:02:39,919 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, and then even somersault back with a drink probably 57 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 2: and not spill a drop exactly. Yeah, we presume she 58 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 2: can still do it at sixty. But you know, okay, 59 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:49,639 Speaker 2: then what was the drink of choice? 60 00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 3: Bee? 61 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 1: I'm styl like, I'm pretty. 62 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 3: You're pretty easy. It's not that fancy, is. 63 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: That I did. I lived in Austin, Texas for a year, 64 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: and I really started to appreciate mescal. And but not 65 00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:07,919 Speaker 1: like we drink tequila like you know, it's four o'clock 66 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 1: in the morning, we just have some shots. They'll just 67 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:12,760 Speaker 1: put it a nice and sip it and it'll be nice. 68 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:16,839 Speaker 1: And I really really enjoy a nice messcal. Actually, oh 69 00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:17,360 Speaker 1: there you go. 70 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm I'm on a currently on a hunt for 71 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 2: the perfect bloody mary right, because I think that with 72 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:31,440 Speaker 2: all respect it's my podcast. People are bastardizing them, right, 73 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 2: they're getting too fancy, they're trying to modernize them. I 74 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 2: can't get to the drink through the freaking stupid garnish. 75 00:03:38,520 --> 00:03:41,120 Speaker 1: Then this idea is that they for garnish and a drink. 76 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: It's just like we actually want a drink another salad. Yeah, 77 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 1: I'll have a drink and a salad separately. 78 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:51,560 Speaker 2: One the other day it had three different types like 79 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:55,520 Speaker 2: a gurk and a bloody olive, a something else ENSLAMI. 80 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, too much. We should report that person to 81 00:03:57,840 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 1: the police. 82 00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 2: We should really favorite bar pub restaurant in the world, 83 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 2: in the world. 84 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, you've been all over the World's. 85 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: A good question. There's a One of my favorite restaurants 86 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 1: is a restaurant in New York called Beauty and Essex. 87 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:13,000 Speaker 3: And usually and Essex and. 88 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 1: So it's on Essex Street. Okay, well, Beauty one of them. 89 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: The cool thing about it is it's in New York. 90 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 1: They have a lot of speakeasy, so they're hidden behind 91 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: something else the restaurant. So you walk in and there's 92 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:28,200 Speaker 1: a second hand porn shop. And you walk in there 93 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 1: and there's all this old stuff on the and it's tiny, 94 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: and you sort of go o, where's the restaurant And 95 00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 1: they open the door and ban there's this massive restaurant 96 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,359 Speaker 1: and behind it and the food's unbelievable. One of the 97 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 1: things that they make is a ferris wheel dessert, so 98 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:43,840 Speaker 1: they put all these different desserts in the restrold you 99 00:04:43,920 --> 00:04:46,839 Speaker 1: spin it around. But I told him, mate, that we 100 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 1: meet them there. And he was a key week coming 101 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:51,600 Speaker 1: up to New York, and he walked up and down 102 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:53,159 Speaker 1: the road for about half an hour trying to find 103 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:55,120 Speaker 1: the place. Because it's not a restaurant. It was a 104 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:55,600 Speaker 1: porn shop. 105 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 3: But did you say secondhand porn shop? 106 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: When I say porn sho, I don't mean sort of 107 00:05:01,160 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: like the sort of place that Mark Alice. I'm talking 108 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: about a second hand shop where you can buy old stuff, 109 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:07,600 Speaker 1: and they call them porn shops. 110 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:11,040 Speaker 3: Porn is in w Yeah, but I can't. 111 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 1: I can't say porn something wrong. 112 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:18,560 Speaker 2: That he was absolutely and then I'm like, I want that's. 113 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,119 Speaker 1: The whole idea of the restaurant going to the wrong place. 114 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 2: So you know, because I think the porn was an 115 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:26,799 Speaker 2: r is entirely people's choices, But I think I would 116 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 2: be judging on the second hand part of that. 117 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, second hand porne. I'm not sure if it's 118 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: a big market. I don't know. I've never been to 119 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 1: a second hand porn shop, you know, no, no, but 120 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: they have been to a secondand porn shop, as in 121 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:42,400 Speaker 1: like chest Pea's. 122 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:46,720 Speaker 2: Well, all porn porn shops are second here, aren't they. 123 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 3: Have we gone down a rabbit hold? 124 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:52,160 Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, okay, varied career. 125 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 3: That's what we've talked. 126 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 2: About, and so we're can talk about that but later on. 127 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:59,279 Speaker 2: But let's talk about sports. Cafe is back kind of right, 128 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:01,159 Speaker 2: So why podcast? Why did you bring it back? 129 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,520 Speaker 1: I caught up with Mark during the Rugby World Cup 130 00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 1: in Paris. I caught up with with them. He was 131 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,480 Speaker 1: over there and I hadn't been home for a while, 132 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,400 Speaker 1: and I already enjoyed talking to him. We had a 133 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:15,840 Speaker 1: lot of fun. We were in hysterics. And then when 134 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:17,159 Speaker 1: I got back to New Zealand, I caught up with 135 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: Lee Lee Harp the same thing, you know, Lana as well, 136 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 1: and I just really enjoyed their company and I said, well, 137 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:30,159 Speaker 1: want we do something, you know, and originally it was 138 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 1: going to be called that has been cafe but then 139 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 1: we thought, why don't we just do it use our 140 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:40,280 Speaker 1: old name, you know, because that will help us get 141 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:45,360 Speaker 1: an audience. And it's just fun. It's just for us. 142 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: It's just an opportunity to get to get and have fun. 143 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 1: And that's what we miss. 144 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,599 Speaker 2: And I mean like Sports Cafe itself was what nineteen 145 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:53,920 Speaker 2: ninety six, so about twenty eleven. 146 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, we stopped in two thousand and five. I put 147 00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 1: it enough and then and then I got a call 148 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: one night at three four o'clock in the morning and 149 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 1: it was Mark and he was out in Ponsonby Road 150 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 1: and he's like, I've got the lady from TVNZ. She's 151 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 1: just bumped her in the bar and she wants us 152 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 1: to bring Sports Cafa back. And I told her you 153 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 1: won't do it, so. 154 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 3: You know, you tell her. 155 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 1: And then she got on the phone and she's like, 156 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 1: why don't you bring it back? And I said, oh, 157 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: just you know, had its time and blah blah blahah oh, 158 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 1: I bring it back, bring it back, come and see me, 159 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 1: you know. And so so he brought it back in 160 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: two thousand and eight. 161 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,239 Speaker 3: These decisions yeah morning, right. 162 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:36,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, And it was fun. But we did it 163 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: for a long time and it just got to the 164 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 1: point where it was time to stop. Yeah, but now 165 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: it feels really but it. 166 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 3: Was hugely successful. 167 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 2: And you mentioned when you were talking about bumping into 168 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:49,559 Speaker 2: the old crow and then deciding you'll get back together again. 169 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 3: Is part of its. 170 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 2: Success that it is good mates that did have got 171 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 2: to share a sense of humor, that can have a 172 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:57,320 Speaker 2: great laugh together. 173 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 1: I think, you know, when you're the worst thing you 174 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: can do is try and be funny, and we're not 175 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: trying to be funny, we're just being ourselves and some 176 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 1: of them are really funny. So it's really And when 177 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 1: we started Sports Cafe, I mean it was a pretty 178 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 1: small show to start with, and it was just I'd 179 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: finished doing the All Black Job. I knew that that's 180 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 1: how sports people talk to each other. You know, it's 181 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 1: been a long time on the road with them, and 182 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: it wasn't quite the way that interviews were done. So 183 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:33,720 Speaker 1: I thought one, you know, recreate life on the road 184 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: into into a chat show. And at that stage there'd 185 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:42,640 Speaker 1: never been a successful New Zealand chat based show. I 186 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 1: think Bob Jones tried one. I mean there'd been a 187 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: futures Neil Roberts tried one, and they'd never quite worked, 188 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 1: and there was always this sort of perception that we 189 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:53,439 Speaker 1: couldn't do humor and we couldn't do chat shows. And 190 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:56,079 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, that's fine, we'll just we'll call 191 00:08:56,080 --> 00:09:01,199 Speaker 1: it something else and so yeah, and it's just I 192 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: think it's I think the beauty of sports Cafe is 193 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,199 Speaker 1: it's just a group of mates talking to each other. 194 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:10,720 Speaker 2: So here you are back and like text changed, So 195 00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 2: the way we get and watch and consume our entertainment 196 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 2: has changed traumatically. But equally what's changed is society's acceptability 197 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:24,560 Speaker 2: of certain things as well. 198 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 3: Have you noticed. 199 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 2: I mean it's we're in a very different world from 200 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:28,559 Speaker 2: nineteen ninety six. 201 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:33,079 Speaker 1: People aren't that haven't changed that there's a layer above 202 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 1: them that's changed, a layer of rule setters. And someone 203 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: wrote a piece I can't even remember where it was 204 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 1: when we came back saying, oh, the last thing we 205 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,199 Speaker 1: need is this sort of blokey crap, you know, back again, 206 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 1: and I was like, that's cool. If you don't like it, 207 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 1: don't watch it. Like it's really easy to be a 208 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 1: critic because if you don't like something, you have the 209 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: ability not to watch it. So it's really simple, like, 210 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:01,640 Speaker 1: I don't know why people get offended by stuff that 211 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 1: they watch, because if they don't like it, they shouldn't 212 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 1: watch it or or listen to it. And there's stuff 213 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:09,599 Speaker 1: that annoys me, lots of stuff that annoys me. I 214 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:11,080 Speaker 1: don't I don't consume it. 215 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 3: No, do you moderate at all? 216 00:10:14,679 --> 00:10:16,640 Speaker 2: And do you think? Do you think you or if 217 00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:19,240 Speaker 2: you maybe? Well I was gonna say, maybe you've all 218 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:21,680 Speaker 2: grown up. A. We had a conversation before we turn 219 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 2: the mics on, and you're still twenty four, aren't you? 220 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:28,000 Speaker 1: Yeah? Twenty five? Okay, I think I'm in horror a 221 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 1: lot of the things that have said during the show 222 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:36,760 Speaker 1: every week, and you know, and they Mark in particular 223 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:39,960 Speaker 1: love seeing me squirm. So he'll go to places that 224 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:43,559 Speaker 1: he knows make me feel uncomfortable and he enjoys that, 225 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:48,120 Speaker 1: and the audience enjoy because they always side with him. 226 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 1: But we're pretty I wouldn't say we're careful. It's not fair, 227 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 1: but we're aware. I mean, Maca's got a good and 228 00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: Lee has got a good sense of you know, pushing 229 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 1: the boundaries, but being good people. Yeah. 230 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,439 Speaker 2: I was going to say, they've got families and and 231 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 2: you know, even you're in Kids Team for you a 232 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:09,640 Speaker 2: bit right, And I've got. 233 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: Lana sitting next to me, and I can tell from 234 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,040 Speaker 1: I can just tell from the look that she's searing 235 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: through my head that you know, we're going into the 236 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:22,199 Speaker 1: wrong space. So but what's fun is what I really 237 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 1: enjoy about the show is when so two people are 238 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 1: going off into a into a direction and I might 239 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:32,360 Speaker 1: feel uncomfortable, and then I get sucked into it, and 240 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:34,520 Speaker 1: then I start going with them into that direction because 241 00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:37,080 Speaker 1: I get I start getting amused by where they're going, 242 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 1: and then Lana will pull me back, or or Lana 243 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,679 Speaker 1: might get sucked into the conversation and I pulled her back. 244 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 1: So that's the fun. That's when it's So. 245 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:50,360 Speaker 3: Are we more easily offended these days? 246 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:53,080 Speaker 1: I think we. I think there's a group of people 247 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 1: that like the work on being offended. You know. Yeah, 248 00:11:57,080 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 1: they're sort of you know, finding things, you know, to 249 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 1: mock out age. You know, it's like, oh this is terrible. 250 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:04,120 Speaker 1: How dare they? 251 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:04,360 Speaker 2: You know? 252 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:08,440 Speaker 1: And as I say, I mean, I don't really get 253 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:10,199 Speaker 1: sort of annoyed by too much stuff because I just 254 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 1: don't watch the stuff that annoys me. 255 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:16,120 Speaker 2: Well, but then I get annoyed and I'm offended, but 256 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:18,560 Speaker 2: I'm offended at how much everything's bloody watered down and 257 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 2: you can't say what you really think, and so you're right. 258 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 2: But then that means I pretty much don't. I can't 259 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 2: say don't watch news because there's only one now, but 260 00:12:27,160 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 2: I could get so irritated journalism, I mean. 261 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 1: Do you yeah, because I was a journalist. I started 262 00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 1: out as a journalist and I actually wasn't a sports journalist. 263 00:12:36,160 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: I was a police journal for a long time, and 264 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: then I was a foreign correspondent and stuff. I've still 265 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:42,920 Speaker 1: come back and gone, don't I don't know if we 266 00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:46,800 Speaker 1: have an hour's news, like this is how long new show? 267 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 1: And like it's almost like a game whe year, So 268 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,360 Speaker 1: when are they going to run out? You know, because 269 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 1: you know when then they're doing a story about the 270 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 1: pig that got out of the thing or something. Because 271 00:12:57,960 --> 00:12:59,440 Speaker 1: you know, we're a small country, don't have a lot 272 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 1: of people, we don't have a lot of big news. 273 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 3: And take me, the weather's good, what do you. 274 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:09,400 Speaker 1: Do for news as everyone's out at the beach? So 275 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:15,800 Speaker 1: but yeah, I mean what I'm getting frustrated with a 276 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 1: little bit at the moment, and sports journalism is you 277 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:23,880 Speaker 1: knows that sort of start acting like fans, you know, 278 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:28,200 Speaker 1: or I suppose it's the same political journalism where people 279 00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:32,520 Speaker 1: are taking sides. You know. You know a lot of 280 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:36,679 Speaker 1: a lot of journalists write opinion pieces and columns and 281 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:38,240 Speaker 1: stuff like that, and half the time I don't even 282 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 1: know who they are. Yes, Like, you've sort of got 283 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:44,080 Speaker 1: to you've got to really build a CB before you 284 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 1: sort of have the right to have a column or 285 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 1: an opinion. You know, have an opinion, but it just 286 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 1: don't publish it. 287 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:53,160 Speaker 2: And I do think that in certain news and that 288 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:54,640 Speaker 2: sort of thing. What I really want you to do 289 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 2: is tell me, lay out the facts as they've been 290 00:13:56,679 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 2: exposed to you, so that I can inform an opinion. 291 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:01,280 Speaker 3: You don't idea, Yeah, I don't need to hear you. 292 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: Again, living in the US, that's not the case. 293 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:09,800 Speaker 3: And you sort of but at least it's out there, well. 294 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 1: You know, you know, we I stand, Yeah, you know exactly. 295 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:14,520 Speaker 1: Then they don't hide it, so you sort of have 296 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: to watch both sides to find out what the truth 297 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: might be. 298 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know that, But yeah, I've had an investigative journalism. 299 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 2: I mean, I know it sounds but I just meant 300 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 2: two notes in Australia for work, and I, you know, 301 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 2: at night in the hotel and you switch on the 302 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 2: TV and I just absolutely misterized it. Investigative journalist piece 303 00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 2: in it, you know, sixty minutes sort of thing. I 304 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:36,640 Speaker 2: was like, oh, I miss it already, you know, like 305 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 2: something that actually made me think. 306 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 1: We have some brilliant journalists in this country and some 307 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:46,000 Speaker 1: and some of them do some great stuff, but they're 308 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 1: really dictated to by what the audience reaction is and 309 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:51,760 Speaker 1: what the mass audience reaction is going to be, because 310 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:53,760 Speaker 1: you know, when you're driven by clacks, when you're driven 311 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:55,680 Speaker 1: by sort of how big your audiences and stuff, you've 312 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:58,480 Speaker 1: got to you've got to produce the output that is 313 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:02,520 Speaker 1: going to get that reaction. So I mean, I remember 314 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 1: I did it. When I first started at TVNZ in 315 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 1: the newsroom, there was a thing called the Mari Loan scandal. 316 00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 1: So basically what happened was a group of Maori businessmen 317 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 1: that met some businessmen in Hawaii and they said that 318 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 1: they could give them a massive loan and it was 319 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: in the millions of dollars and somehow Maori affairs got 320 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 1: involved and stuff, and then it was sort of a 321 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:30,040 Speaker 1: bit embarrassing because no one was really sure if the 322 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 1: loan was real or not. And so Bill Rolston and 323 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 1: I was a junior reporter. I was pretty much like 324 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: a sports reporter who just was interested in the story. 325 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 1: And they sent me up to Hawaii to investigate this 326 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:45,320 Speaker 1: group of businessmen, and then Bill came up to join me, 327 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 1: and we did this this is before the home show 328 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 1: and stuff. We did it like a twenty five minute 329 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:53,520 Speaker 1: piece on the news and it was really complicated. I 330 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:56,160 Speaker 1: couldn't even understand it. And I always one of the reporters, 331 00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 1: and we made all these sorts of accusations, and then 332 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:03,359 Speaker 1: the next day I had six lawsuits. 333 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 3: Wow. 334 00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:06,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, I was like a twenty one year old journalist 335 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 1: and Billy's going, right, there's the price of being a 336 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 1: journal you know. I'm yeah, what I gonna do? I've 337 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 1: got no money. 338 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 3: And probably a perfect place to be in here. 339 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:19,520 Speaker 2: Money. 340 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, but it was a really interesting experience. I 341 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:26,480 Speaker 1: can still see Angela de Ordinary was reading the story 342 00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 1: and I remember looking at her face and she's like, 343 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 1: I can't understand this complicated. 344 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 3: So New York you went, you were how long you 345 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:33,880 Speaker 3: went back? 346 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:37,720 Speaker 1: Back? So the eight months something like that, and. 347 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 3: You've been running a rugby club the year. 348 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 1: Yeah. So there's a professional league in the US called 349 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 1: Major League Rugby and it's really growing, and. 350 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 3: It is growing. I think that was my christ Yeah. 351 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:50,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's been going for five or six years now. 352 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 1: A lot of New Zealand players come over and I 353 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 1: was in charge of the New York team and it 354 00:16:56,920 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 1: was really it's really interesting. It's a rugby joy, but 355 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 1: it's also a brand building, a storytelling job, you know, 356 00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:05,199 Speaker 1: so you're trying to grow an audience. So it's not 357 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:08,479 Speaker 1: a million miles different to what I've done before. I 358 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 1: loved it. I loved the challenge. The people were amazing. 359 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:14,879 Speaker 1: New York's just the greatest city. So yeah, it was 360 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 1: a great experience. 361 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 3: But it was time to come home. 362 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,719 Speaker 1: Yeah. I just thought I did the four seasons. One 363 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:24,280 Speaker 1: season got cut short by COVID, but yeah, I just 364 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 1: sort of felt that was, you know, I've done my time. 365 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, fair enough. 366 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:29,800 Speaker 2: Okay, we're going to take a break and when we 367 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:32,720 Speaker 2: come back, we're going to chat about your career and 368 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 2: about how you managed to be a bit ahead of 369 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:48,359 Speaker 2: the game. Okay, this is our advice segment. And I 370 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:50,239 Speaker 2: think there are a few things we can explore here. 371 00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:53,399 Speaker 2: I want to start with you being a pioneer really 372 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,199 Speaker 2: in sports media, and well you are. 373 00:17:56,240 --> 00:17:57,680 Speaker 3: You're like almost ahead of the. 374 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:01,200 Speaker 2: Game in many respects, right, I mean that's what sports 375 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:03,919 Speaker 2: You know. You were the first ever sports media liaison, 376 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 2: weren't you. 377 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, it was sort of. So the Australians had had 378 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:10,600 Speaker 1: one of ninety one will cut and have been really successful, 379 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:13,639 Speaker 1: and they sort of. When New Zealand played Australia in 380 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:16,439 Speaker 1: Dublin in the semi final, everyone was loving Australia and 381 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:18,560 Speaker 1: hating on the All Blacks and so I wrote a 382 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: paper for New Zealand Rugby saying this is quite important, 383 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:23,280 Speaker 1: you know, looking up the media is really important and 384 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: you need to sort of replicate this idea. And originally 385 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:30,120 Speaker 1: they said no. And then I was doing a documentary 386 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 1: with them and halfway through a tour and they had 387 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:35,159 Speaker 1: done a tour of Australia and they're getting ready to 388 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:36,760 Speaker 1: go back to South Africa and it was the first 389 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:39,400 Speaker 1: time since the lifting of the boycott the All Blacks 390 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,399 Speaker 1: had been back, so it was a pretty important time. 391 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:45,199 Speaker 1: And I got called into the manager's hotel room at like, 392 00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 1: I know, two in the morning and stuff. You know, 393 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:49,600 Speaker 1: it's amazing to me and my hey decisions in the 394 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:53,200 Speaker 1: middle of the night. And they said, you're right, we're 395 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:55,640 Speaker 1: already struggling with the media and we're going to South 396 00:18:55,680 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 1: Africa and we're going to cop it if we don't 397 00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 1: get it right. So you're on board. You start tomorrow. Wow, 398 00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:02,479 Speaker 1: And so I did it. 399 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 3: So what is that job? 400 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,080 Speaker 2: So, like, you literally liaised with the media. So you're 401 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 2: trying to put good stories out there. You're making players 402 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:11,639 Speaker 2: become available, You're trying to hear a negative stuff that 403 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 2: might be coming before it does. You're getting the all 404 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:16,800 Speaker 2: black player that jumped out the window and went and 405 00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:18,080 Speaker 2: partied at two in the morning. 406 00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:20,760 Speaker 1: To be honest, when they hired me, I had no 407 00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 1: idea what I was. No So I was a journalist 408 00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:29,440 Speaker 1: and journalism is quite different the PR. And so I 409 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 1: blundered my way through the first tour and then I 410 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:32,879 Speaker 1: decided at the end of that I needed to go 411 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: and learn about PR because PR is more about journalists 412 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:40,840 Speaker 1: about capturing the story, whereas PR is more about getting 413 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,360 Speaker 1: your messages and working out how to get them out 414 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 1: and you know, managing the pliers in terms of their 415 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 1: media appearances. I mean that's just basically good manners, treating 416 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:52,960 Speaker 1: people well, you know, and the media deserve to be 417 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,679 Speaker 1: treated well. You know. They they're putting some sort of 418 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 1: strategy in place, you know, having some sort of crisis managements. 419 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 1: All sort of things do go on. You you're able 420 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:04,479 Speaker 1: to sort of manage that. But I didn't know what 421 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:06,520 Speaker 1: I was doing when I firsted the job, so you know, 422 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 1: I probably only worked it out by the time I left. 423 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, but that's part of being I mean, you were one. 424 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:14,280 Speaker 2: Of the first, so you do get to remember those 425 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:16,080 Speaker 2: blaze a bit and make it up as you go. 426 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:19,199 Speaker 1: I said that the manager in the CEO of New 427 00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:21,119 Speaker 1: Zealand Raubia. I said, what do I do? And they said, well, 428 00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: that's your job to work it out. 429 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:26,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know that most of your audience will only 430 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:30,520 Speaker 2: liken media liaison in a sports team to Kaylee from 431 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:32,200 Speaker 2: tid LESSO. 432 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:36,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly who I looked like, which was a 433 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:37,000 Speaker 1: scary hell you. 434 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:39,679 Speaker 2: Go around with Pink Pear similar were fluffy on the outside. 435 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think and it was hard for the 436 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 1: media because suddenly one of their own was saying, sorry, 437 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:48,080 Speaker 1: you can't do that in the view, yeah, or you know, 438 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:50,360 Speaker 1: I was. I was in the middle of their relationship 439 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,359 Speaker 1: and it took them a while to come to grips 440 00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 1: with that, and and it was a long time. I 441 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: was called the media prevention officer for a long time. Yeah, 442 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 1: because suddenly there was another person in the way of 443 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:02,600 Speaker 1: their ability to talk to the coach or talk to 444 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:04,240 Speaker 1: the players. 445 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:05,960 Speaker 2: Because they used to have direct excess and now they've 446 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:06,440 Speaker 2: got you in. 447 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 3: The middle of it. 448 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:08,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, and then they put me in the middle. 449 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 3: Yeah. 450 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,000 Speaker 2: Well, I mean I suppose my whole experience is political, 451 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 2: and you know, and obviously journalists and then our own 452 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:18,880 Speaker 2: and yes, sometimes when they'd bring you to react, i'd 453 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 2: go ask. 454 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:20,840 Speaker 3: Sorry, just you have to go through you. 455 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: You know. My favorite was there, you know, you know, 456 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 1: you know Willie Jackson. So Willie was a radio reporter. Yeah, 457 00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:30,720 Speaker 1: mana radio I think it was. And he rang me 458 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:33,920 Speaker 1: out one night and it was a Friday evening before 459 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 1: a test match on Saturday. And back then the protocols 460 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:40,200 Speaker 1: we didn't do interviews on the products. And he rang 461 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:41,440 Speaker 1: me up and he said, oh, I want to talk 462 00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: to Frank once. And I said, we'll make you know 463 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,160 Speaker 1: the rules like it's Friday, Friday evening. You can't talk 464 00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:50,399 Speaker 1: to an all blog Friday and shut up shop. He said, well, 465 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:52,400 Speaker 1: I've already spoken to him. I just rang his room. 466 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:56,359 Speaker 1: I said, we why are you ringing me things? Just 467 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:59,640 Speaker 1: telling you I've already done that? Just supposed to ask permission, 468 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:01,639 Speaker 1: not do it, and then tell me you've done it. 469 00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:04,640 Speaker 2: Forgiveness, that's what they say. 470 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,359 Speaker 1: And he laughed too. And because he'd gone to school 471 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:10,119 Speaker 1: with Frank and so they knew each other. Yeah, And 472 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, why'd you bother ring of me? 473 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:13,439 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 474 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 2: So being in the middle like that, having been on that, 475 00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:18,680 Speaker 2: you know, been on the journalist side, I mean, so 476 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,159 Speaker 2: what did you learn from it? What's that kind of 477 00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 2: advice that you give to someone that's like trying to 478 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 2: sort of be the gatekeeper as well as being transparent 479 00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:27,760 Speaker 2: and open. 480 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 1: And I think it's really changed. I think, like one 481 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: of the reasons I started Sports Cafe in ninety six 482 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:35,360 Speaker 1: is I finished the All Black job in ninety five 483 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,000 Speaker 1: and no one really liked me because I've been in 484 00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:40,639 Speaker 1: the middle. So I'd been annoying the players and the 485 00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:42,439 Speaker 1: coaches because I was saying, you've got to do this 486 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 1: media stuff and I've been annoying all the media organizations 487 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:46,919 Speaker 1: because I was saying, no, you can't do that. 488 00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 3: Yeah. 489 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 1: So I came out of there and I was like, man, 490 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:52,359 Speaker 1: I was like New Zealand's most unpopular man in sport, so, 491 00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:56,439 Speaker 1: which is not unusual. But now it's changed. I think. 492 00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:58,640 Speaker 1: I think it used to be like a drafting gate 493 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: where you were all the media attentions coming inwards and 494 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:03,679 Speaker 1: you're managing who comes in and who doesn't come in. 495 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:07,080 Speaker 1: I think now there's so much competition for attention that 496 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:08,640 Speaker 1: doesn't matter who you are. It doesn't matter if you're 497 00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,520 Speaker 1: the Prime Minister or the All Blacks or whatever. You 498 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:14,880 Speaker 1: need to connect with your audience. And so now it's 499 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:19,040 Speaker 1: an outward job. Now it's looking for opportunities. And if 500 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:22,120 Speaker 1: you think of the media, I mean they're really they're 501 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: important because they have an audience. But lots of people 502 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 1: have audiences now. Yeah, So if you're in that role, 503 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:31,680 Speaker 1: I think you're looking for opportunities as opposed to managing 504 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,439 Speaker 1: inward media. So you're like, how do I get my 505 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,679 Speaker 1: message out? How do I get people to connect with me? 506 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,159 Speaker 1: How do I get people? Because when you run a 507 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,800 Speaker 1: sports team you're really trying to sell t shirts and 508 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,400 Speaker 1: sell tickets. That's the job. That's how you generate revenue 509 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:48,680 Speaker 1: and get eyeballs for your sponsors. So you don't get 510 00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: that from sort of saying no to things. 511 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 2: And I suppose you're just you talking in to me 512 00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:57,600 Speaker 2: thinking about it. The other thing I often tell people 513 00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:59,760 Speaker 2: that are either going into politics or we're thinking about 514 00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:03,199 Speaker 2: it is that if you're not outward and thinking about it, 515 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,160 Speaker 2: I don't believe in the kind of the brand stuff 516 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:06,920 Speaker 2: if you like, But I do believe that if you're 517 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 2: not protecting in politics, if you're not careful, other people 518 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:13,160 Speaker 2: will write your narrative and it may not be Yes, 519 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 2: they're not going to do the most positive narrative in 520 00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:18,080 Speaker 2: your life, you know what I mean. So you know, 521 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 2: my opposition would have said that I'm a horrible Tory 522 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,399 Speaker 2: that pulled up the letter behind her and hates poor people, 523 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:26,680 Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Whereas I would go, I 524 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:28,639 Speaker 2: was solow, mother knew how to struggle, and now I 525 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:29,720 Speaker 2: want to make it better for everyone. 526 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:31,720 Speaker 1: See what you're trying to do. You're trying to get 527 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,800 Speaker 1: your story out, so you're looking for opportunities and audiences 528 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,080 Speaker 1: to talk to. So the last thing you need is 529 00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: a mediately aisonon person or a PR person that's saying 530 00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:42,520 Speaker 1: no to things. Yeah, but they might say no to 531 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 1: the wrong opportunity, but they've got to look for opportunities, 532 00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:46,919 Speaker 1: not look for reasons to say no. 533 00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:47,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 534 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:50,359 Speaker 1: I think it's a different mindset now. I think it's like, man, 535 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 1: I need to talk to this influencer, I need to 536 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,880 Speaker 1: talk to this brand, I need to talk to this 537 00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:58,439 Speaker 1: podcast I need to talk to and I need to 538 00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:01,200 Speaker 1: look after the HELD reporter, I need to talk after 539 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 1: the look after the TV and Z reporter. You know, 540 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: there's a lot of opportunities and it's going to. 541 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,480 Speaker 2: Keep changing and evolving right in that way, and that 542 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 2: you know, if we were talking a year ago, I 543 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:11,840 Speaker 2: would have spoken to you and just said everything needs 544 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:14,359 Speaker 2: to be in thirty second and sixty second sound bites 545 00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 2: and if you're not, you know, getting the tip top 546 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:19,040 Speaker 2: thing right, then you're you're out. But actually, I feel 547 00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 2: like in the last few months we're equally now seeing 548 00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:22,320 Speaker 2: a bit of a craving for something a. 549 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 3: Bit more in depth, you know, a combo. 550 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 2: So I don't mind seeing the light aside, and I 551 00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 2: love to see them all blacks having a bit of 552 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 2: fun and doing the bloky good good stuff. But I 553 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:33,120 Speaker 2: equally would like to know them a little bit better 554 00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 2: as well. 555 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:36,720 Speaker 1: I think to like someone, you've got to know them. 556 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 1: So the first thing you've got to do is, you know, 557 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: whether it's sport or politics, you've got to work out 558 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:46,200 Speaker 1: how you how you let people know you. You know, 559 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 1: and once they get to know you, whether you're an 560 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:51,880 Speaker 1: all black or a politician or whatever, then then they've 561 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: got the ability to like and connect with you. Yeah. 562 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,119 Speaker 2: So you're an ideas man, right, so you create a 563 00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:58,400 Speaker 2: you're an ideas man. 564 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:00,960 Speaker 1: The will disclosure are a lot of the ideas come 565 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:01,960 Speaker 1: from John Cowan. 566 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:04,360 Speaker 3: So where does the ideas come from? 567 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,320 Speaker 2: But then what you've equally got is the ability to execute, 568 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:10,399 Speaker 2: and that's something that not many people do. 569 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 1: So JK and I grew up together. Yeah, so we 570 00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 1: went to school together, played rugby together. 571 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:16,639 Speaker 3: He has an idea is man, Yeah. 572 00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:20,280 Speaker 1: And so him. Yeah, and so quite often he'll give 573 00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: me a call and it calls me Riccardo is like Riccardo, 574 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 1: we need to do this, yeah, and then and then 575 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,359 Speaker 1: it'll let me work out how to do it. 576 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:27,760 Speaker 2: Yeah. 577 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, Sometimes it's my idea. But so a classic was 578 00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:33,919 Speaker 1: when he was an All Black. He came to me 579 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:36,879 Speaker 1: and I'd give him a little some offcuts of some 580 00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 1: of the stories I'd done, you know, on a VHS, 581 00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:42,920 Speaker 1: and he said, we should do a documentary. We should 582 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,879 Speaker 1: do it behind the scenes All Black documentary. But not 583 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 1: that they used to do these books. Let's not do 584 00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 1: a box because no one reads box anymore. This is 585 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:53,919 Speaker 1: like plate eighties. Let's do a VHS. And so we 586 00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:55,640 Speaker 1: did this thing called The Good, The Bed and the Rugby, 587 00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,439 Speaker 1: I remember it, and it went nuts and we just 588 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 1: had no there about business at that stage. So yeah, 589 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: we didn't do particularly well out of it, but other 590 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:10,119 Speaker 1: people did. But it sold like one hundred thousand plus copies. 591 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,159 Speaker 1: That did really well. But that's sort of how we 592 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,119 Speaker 1: tend to work. You know. We might have a coffee 593 00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 1: or beer or something like that. 594 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,639 Speaker 3: You know, since VHS is gone. That would have been 595 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:21,080 Speaker 3: the perfect Father's Day press. 596 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, wouldn't it? Yeah, the bullet Father's Day Yeah. 597 00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:25,000 Speaker 3: Yeah. 598 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:28,159 Speaker 1: Now this is an idea. How old sports cafe is 599 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:33,919 Speaker 1: now they talk about user generated content? Is it UGC. 600 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,679 Speaker 1: We used to get people that would hire a video camera, 601 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 1: film something onto a VHS, then get another VHS machine 602 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:46,159 Speaker 1: dubbed editor from VHS to VHS and then mail that 603 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:50,480 Speaker 1: entry to us by the post. It's how we used 604 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 1: to do our competitions. 605 00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:52,280 Speaker 3: Wow. 606 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 1: And we used to do this thing called New Day 607 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:55,920 Speaker 1: where people would send us in the footage of themselves 608 00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,919 Speaker 1: doing crazy things naked. And now all the students that 609 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:02,119 Speaker 1: were sitting in the footage and our lawyers and doctors 610 00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 1: and stuff like that, yeah, yeah, quite up, and they'll come, hey, 611 00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 1: you know that footage from nineteen you know, ninety eight. 612 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: You don't still have that. You couldn't make sure that 613 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 1: no one ever sees it. 614 00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:11,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. 615 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:12,920 Speaker 2: And the difference is that it is on tape. It's 616 00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:15,080 Speaker 2: still like it's an electronic. 617 00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 1: I digitized all of them. So for all those lawyers 618 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:19,800 Speaker 1: and doctors out there, yeah you watch it. 619 00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 3: Take your breath right. 620 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,200 Speaker 2: Honestly, I grew up in the eighties and I think 621 00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:26,520 Speaker 2: my saving grace. 622 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 3: Of why I could go public was that cell phone's there. 623 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:33,479 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, like really going through the fun crazy stuff. 624 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,400 Speaker 1: It was just like, it's a lot of pressure on 625 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:41,240 Speaker 1: our sort of you know, younger audience now because they 626 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 1: are I got a really interesting education where I went 627 00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 1: to a concert and the artist got up on stage, 628 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,040 Speaker 1: and as soon as the artists got up on stage, 629 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:54,240 Speaker 1: everyone started filming themselves at the concert. And I realized, 630 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 1: you know, when you can film yourself, you know, twenty 631 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 1: four seven, you become the star of your own show. 632 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: And unless you treat people like that, unless you they're not. 633 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:05,560 Speaker 1: They just don't know what to do, you know. So 634 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:07,760 Speaker 1: they're all that when I start. 635 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:11,040 Speaker 3: Do you mean so you're treating your audience. 636 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:13,240 Speaker 1: As if they're the star of Yeah, yeah, they're part 637 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,240 Speaker 1: of it. Like they're not passive, you know, they don't 638 00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:20,960 Speaker 1: sit back and sit back and applaud when you do something. Well, 639 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 1: you know that they've got the ability to comment, they've 640 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:24,840 Speaker 1: got the ability to send you video, they've got the 641 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 1: ability to, you know, be treated like stars. They see 642 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:31,080 Speaker 1: themselves as almost equals, you know. 643 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:33,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's quite I hadn't thought. 644 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:34,640 Speaker 1: Of it, like, treat them like I reckon. 645 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, And it's pretty freaky. 646 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,320 Speaker 2: You're at a concert and everyone turns to sit back 647 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:41,840 Speaker 2: on the artist, yeah, and look at me and chuse 648 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:43,000 Speaker 2: themselves with the artists. 649 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 1: And when I start out on TV, no one knew 650 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 1: how to do it, like no one knew how to 651 00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:50,240 Speaker 1: film things, edit things and put things on TV. Now 652 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:52,720 Speaker 1: everyone knows how to do it. There's no mystery to 653 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,760 Speaker 1: it at all, no so, and I still think there's 654 00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 1: some TV people that sort of pretend that there's a mystery. Yeah, 655 00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: you know, it's like, know what we're doing. This is 656 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: really clear. It's like, yeah, I just did that with 657 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 1: one bone. 658 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:04,880 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. 659 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 2: So you started you started a lot of things, right, 660 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,240 Speaker 2: so many different projects. And we've talked about the media Liaison. 661 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:13,200 Speaker 2: We've talked about the good, the bad, and the rugby. 662 00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:16,320 Speaker 2: We've talked about the Sports Cafe. You know the crowd 663 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 2: goes wild yep. I mean that's another one, right, So 664 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:22,680 Speaker 2: how do you discover talent? How do you know who's 665 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,040 Speaker 2: going to connect and not connect? Because you seem to 666 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:26,600 Speaker 2: have a real ability for that as well. 667 00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:30,640 Speaker 1: Well. The thing I really enjoy is is working out 668 00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,600 Speaker 1: where the audiences are now. So audiences shift all the time, 669 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 1: you know. So you know, when we started Sports Cafe, 670 00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 1: Sky had a seventy thousand subscribers, you know, and now 671 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,280 Speaker 1: there are a million, you know. So when we started 672 00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 1: there was no one there, but we knew that it 673 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 1: would grow. Same with Craig as well. We started that 674 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:54,240 Speaker 1: when when Prime came out. Now with you know, now 675 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 1: it's YouTube and podcasts and stuff like that, because that's 676 00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:00,479 Speaker 1: where the audience is now. In terms of talent, you know, 677 00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:04,160 Speaker 1: there's just some people that in an environment that just 678 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: tend to stand out. They tend to dominate dinner conversations, 679 00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:13,960 Speaker 1: and people tend to hang on their every word or 680 00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 1: like them. So I remember running into James mcconey and 681 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 1: he'd been working, he'd just been made redundant for The Herald, 682 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:22,160 Speaker 1: and he was at the press conference. It was his 683 00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: last day, and I said, oh, you know, come and 684 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: do some stuff for us. You know, we're doing Crag 685 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,720 Speaker 1: as well. And then straight away you could see that 686 00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 1: he just had something. He's just had something. He just 687 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:34,480 Speaker 1: had to refine it in a few different ways, you know, 688 00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:38,080 Speaker 1: became a star, you know. I mean Mark Ellis used 689 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:40,280 Speaker 1: to sit behind me on the all Black bus. So 690 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 1: I used to sit next to Shan Fitzpatrick and then 691 00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,440 Speaker 1: behind me was Mecca and he would just go on 692 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 1: and on all day and have us in hysterics. So 693 00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:49,800 Speaker 1: you just knew he was funny. 694 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well, Julie Christie's a great friend of mind. 695 00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 2: She just mean the guys talent, you know it just 696 00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 2: from day. 697 00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 1: The way his mind works is like just the front. 698 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah yeah. So I mean you beat yourself? Do 699 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:07,280 Speaker 3: you bet yourself? 700 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah I. 701 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 2: Am So where does that kind of confidence come from? 702 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,520 Speaker 1: Do you think a blind faith for myself? But I 703 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 1: think like I have the same I remember when I 704 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 1: was playing rugby at school, the teacher said the worst 705 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,120 Speaker 1: thing that I think anyone could ever say. I was. 706 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:27,239 Speaker 1: I was lining up a conversion from the sideline to 707 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 1: win the game. I missed it, and he said to me, sal, 708 00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:32,640 Speaker 1: so you're not as good as you think you are. 709 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 1: Yeah he was. He was my manager. I was like 710 00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:38,040 Speaker 1: trying to win the game for this team. But that's 711 00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:40,040 Speaker 1: a really horrible thing to say to someone, You're not 712 00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:45,120 Speaker 1: as good as you think you are. I I just trust. 713 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:47,640 Speaker 1: I know that I'm going to get it wrong, and 714 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,160 Speaker 1: I know that I'm going to make mistakes, and I've 715 00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:53,479 Speaker 1: made I've done some terrible shows and some you know, 716 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,240 Speaker 1: lots of things haven't worked, but I've learned from them. 717 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 1: But just yeah, just trust myself. 718 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, so what now, what's next? 719 00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:08,640 Speaker 1: You again, that's a massive question. I mean, I don't know. 720 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:12,440 Speaker 1: I really enjoyed. I really enjoyed doing what I did 721 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:14,280 Speaker 1: in New York because it was something different to what 722 00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:18,840 Speaker 1: I've done before, done before. I'm loving, absolutely loving doing 723 00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 1: the Sports Cafe podcast YouTube show because I'm just getting 724 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 1: to hang out with good mates and just have fun. 725 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: I think, you know, when you're in your twenties and 726 00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,640 Speaker 1: your thirties, you're driven by how do I prove myself 727 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,840 Speaker 1: to the world. And then you get a bit older, 728 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,360 Speaker 1: and I was going to say wise, but that's not true. 729 00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 1: You just get older and then then your motivation changes 730 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,480 Speaker 1: a little bit, and your motivation changes to how can 731 00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:46,200 Speaker 1: I just get the most out of life? How can 732 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:50,000 Speaker 1: I have the most fun and make that a job? Yeah? 733 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:50,400 Speaker 3: Why not? 734 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:53,520 Speaker 1: That's what I'm trying to do, is like, how can 735 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:57,360 Speaker 1: I just have as much fun influence the things that 736 00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 1: are important to me, but and make that a job? 737 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:05,320 Speaker 1: You know, because I'm like the world's worst handy man, 738 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:07,720 Speaker 1: Like I couldn't could never have been a carpenter and 739 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,759 Speaker 1: a plumber. I'm a or of those people, like you know, 740 00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:15,120 Speaker 1: how people can make stuff like that? Like I've never 741 00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:20,440 Speaker 1: thought of myself as being creative or artistic, you know, 742 00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 1: which is sort of surprise and considering. 743 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:24,360 Speaker 3: Because you are. I'm about to disagree with you. 744 00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:26,880 Speaker 1: But I don't think of myself like that, like because 745 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:30,319 Speaker 1: I can't draw. So when I was at school again, 746 00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:32,480 Speaker 1: I couldn't draw, So I was like, get out of art. 747 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:34,680 Speaker 1: You're an idiot, you know. So I think I was 748 00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:40,000 Speaker 1: conditioned to think that, like I have no creativity, but 749 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:43,160 Speaker 1: like I don't really know what I do. I just 750 00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:44,000 Speaker 1: keep doing it. 751 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:45,520 Speaker 3: And we'll wait and see what comes next. 752 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:47,719 Speaker 2: Because sometimes it's just being open to the opportunities, right, 753 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:50,880 Speaker 2: and that's kind of exciting in it. So, okay, so 754 00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 2: with who perhaps the worst advice you were given, which 755 00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:55,759 Speaker 2: was you know, as good as you think you are. 756 00:34:56,200 --> 00:34:59,960 Speaker 2: So to finish the advice segment, what was the best 757 00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:01,200 Speaker 2: piece of advice? 758 00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:02,440 Speaker 1: Just trust yourself? 759 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:03,360 Speaker 3: Trust yourself? 760 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:07,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, just trust yourself. And and you know, everyone has 761 00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:09,880 Speaker 1: sort of a small number of people in their lives 762 00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:13,680 Speaker 1: that they trust and that you can talk to and 763 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:16,960 Speaker 1: stuff like that. And when they when they believe in you, 764 00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:18,840 Speaker 1: you sort of believe in yourself. 765 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 3: To trust yourself, do you need to be able to 766 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:21,600 Speaker 3: listen to yourself? 767 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:26,839 Speaker 1: Yep? Yeah, I mean I think like I'm going. I mean, 768 00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 1: it's a fascinating time at the moment because like I'm 769 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:35,960 Speaker 1: starting to learn about meditation, I'm starting to learn about 770 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:42,440 Speaker 1: rewiring your brain. Some of the Buddhist techniques that they use. 771 00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:48,719 Speaker 1: I find fascinating, you know, because I'm I've always been 772 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 1: pretty driven. I've always been pretty driven. You had a 773 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:53,239 Speaker 1: bit of a chip on the shoulder, like a lot 774 00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:55,560 Speaker 1: of people. It's like, you know, you don't think I'm 775 00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:56,960 Speaker 1: good enough. I'll show you sort. 776 00:35:56,800 --> 00:35:59,479 Speaker 3: Of thing and that can get you through some times. 777 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,920 Speaker 1: It's really important. That's really important. It's really draining. 778 00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:04,719 Speaker 3: Underestimate me go on. 779 00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:11,200 Speaker 1: That's absolutely who I was. Like, I was a pretty 780 00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:15,400 Speaker 1: loose unit growing up. I failed journalism school because I 781 00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:18,400 Speaker 1: got in trouble in my first week. I was with 782 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:20,440 Speaker 1: the group people who got arrested for climbing Santa Clause 783 00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,880 Speaker 1: at Farmers. They got charged with unlawfully on the building. 784 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:28,040 Speaker 1: I got away because I lifted them up because I 785 00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:29,600 Speaker 1: was the tallest. But I hadn't gone on the building 786 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:34,520 Speaker 1: when the police caught us. Black So yeah, So I 787 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 1: had a fair few situations where I wasn't the best 788 00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:43,800 Speaker 1: behaved person in the world. But always when I started 789 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,719 Speaker 1: to learn to trust myself and realize that I wasn't 790 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:48,160 Speaker 1: good at everything, but the things I was good at, 791 00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:50,359 Speaker 1: I was good at and I could just focus on those. 792 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:50,879 Speaker 3: Yeah. 793 00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:53,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, I like it, And I like the listening side 794 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:58,000 Speaker 2: of it because I think, yeah, I've always had yourself. 795 00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:00,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, my own head and out loud. 796 00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:02,239 Speaker 1: I talk to myself all the time, all the. 797 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:04,880 Speaker 2: Time, and I stop and go, oh, I've been thinking 798 00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:05,239 Speaker 2: about that. 799 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:14,239 Speaker 1: Do you ever walk along listening to music and dance? Yeah, yeah, yeah, 800 00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:19,239 Speaker 1: I've only learned to enjoy that. Like, so have you 801 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:21,600 Speaker 1: see me wandering along my headphones? Don't I suddenly stop 802 00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,160 Speaker 1: and dance. I'm having a great time. 803 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:25,680 Speaker 2: Well, I'm lucky because I live out in Westalkland and 804 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:27,719 Speaker 2: we've got a woman out there that dances on the 805 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,360 Speaker 2: side of the street with her headphones on, and anyone 806 00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,360 Speaker 2: from we Storkland will have seen her. She's just on 807 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 2: the main No, but she is amazing, Like, she brings 808 00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:38,640 Speaker 2: you joy and that's why she does it. So if 809 00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,640 Speaker 2: I see you dancing walking down the street, it will 810 00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:41,400 Speaker 2: bring me joy. 811 00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:45,560 Speaker 1: So I grew up in South Auckland, Yeah, and loved 812 00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:49,359 Speaker 1: it and it was such a great place to grow. 813 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:55,719 Speaker 1: It's tough, but really there's a real sense of humor 814 00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:59,400 Speaker 1: out there. There is a man and some of the 815 00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 1: funniest people I met have met have been growing up 816 00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:04,800 Speaker 1: in South Aukland. That would be insane. JK is the 817 00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:06,239 Speaker 1: same thing you grow up out there as. 818 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:06,960 Speaker 3: Well, fantastic. 819 00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:20,680 Speaker 2: The podcast is called Ask Me Anything, right, yep, So 820 00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:21,239 Speaker 2: this is your. 821 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:22,880 Speaker 3: Chance to ask me something if you'd like to. 822 00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:27,560 Speaker 1: You sort of intimate it before. But I've been away 823 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:30,279 Speaker 1: for four or five years something like that, and I've 824 00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:35,800 Speaker 1: come back and do you think the country has changed? 825 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:39,440 Speaker 3: H It's interesting. 826 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,200 Speaker 2: So I'll reflect back on something you said, which is, 827 00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:45,040 Speaker 2: actually we're all still the same people, you know, like 828 00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,160 Speaker 2: we're sort of the same as we were in in 829 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:49,439 Speaker 2: the mid nineties that we are now, And I would 830 00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:53,000 Speaker 2: kind of agree with that at many levels. I think 831 00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:57,040 Speaker 2: that society around us has changed, and so we probably 832 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,239 Speaker 2: question who we are a lot more now. So, yes, 833 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,600 Speaker 2: some things have changed for the better. I think how sexuality, 834 00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:05,560 Speaker 2: I think gender identity, I think all of those things. 835 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,200 Speaker 2: I celebrate that we're actually more advanced now thinking people 836 00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:13,160 Speaker 2: don't feel as marginalized and they shouldn't, right one hundred percent, 837 00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 2: So I think some of that changes definitely for the better. 838 00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:19,200 Speaker 2: But as you say, if you've been stepped away from 839 00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:21,759 Speaker 2: New Zealand for four years and stepping back and it 840 00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:22,840 Speaker 2: feels different. 841 00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:27,080 Speaker 1: It feels to me like we're a bit scared and angry. 842 00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:30,200 Speaker 2: And when you're scared, you don't actually go, oh, I'm 843 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:32,080 Speaker 2: a bit scared and fearful right now. What you do 844 00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:37,200 Speaker 2: is you express it through generally through anger and yeah. 845 00:39:37,239 --> 00:39:40,040 Speaker 1: And it's almost like Shop is scared to try stuff, 846 00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:43,320 Speaker 1: you know, it's like, or push the boundaries or whatever, 847 00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:46,480 Speaker 1: just in case everyone jumps on them. So I know, 848 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:50,879 Speaker 1: when we're starting this, the overwhelming reaction I got from 849 00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:54,360 Speaker 1: everyone was, oh man, how's that going to survive? You know, 850 00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:56,359 Speaker 1: you're going to get canceled within the first week, etc. 851 00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:56,799 Speaker 2: Etc. 852 00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:01,000 Speaker 1: And I was like, so, like, why is there a 853 00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:04,160 Speaker 1: reason not to do something? Yeah, but that seemed to 854 00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:05,919 Speaker 1: be and I hit that a lot, you know, that 855 00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:07,919 Speaker 1: that sort of oh man, you can't do that because 856 00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:09,000 Speaker 1: what if it goes wrong? 857 00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:09,600 Speaker 3: Yeah? 858 00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:12,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, which is the opposite to what I was experiencing 859 00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:14,359 Speaker 1: when I was in the US, because in the US, 860 00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:16,719 Speaker 1: everyone thinks they're a special for it. Well, everyone thinks 861 00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:19,160 Speaker 1: they're going to be massively successful, so they don't care 862 00:40:19,160 --> 00:40:21,960 Speaker 1: if you're massively successful because I'm going to be successful anyway. 863 00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:22,799 Speaker 3: Yeah. 864 00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:25,520 Speaker 1: But yeah, it's just it's just seemed a bit different 865 00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:27,560 Speaker 1: coming home. Yeah, And I don't know. That's why I'm 866 00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:28,120 Speaker 1: asking you. 867 00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:31,080 Speaker 2: Because I don't know if it's changed or if because 868 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:32,680 Speaker 2: when you asked it, I thought, well, I've just been 869 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,360 Speaker 2: living it every day and sometimes that change kind of 870 00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:39,600 Speaker 2: creeps up on you, you know, as opposed to being is. 871 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:44,439 Speaker 1: Another question, with everything you've been through and changed since 872 00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:48,240 Speaker 1: you left politics, would you go back into politics today? 873 00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:51,560 Speaker 2: No? Yeah, no, yeah, I don't even think about that. 874 00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:53,319 Speaker 3: Yeah, like absolutely not. 875 00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,759 Speaker 1: And is that because of who you are now or 876 00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:57,359 Speaker 1: is because of what politics is like now? 877 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,480 Speaker 3: A combination of both. I've done it. I think there 878 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:02,440 Speaker 3: is elements of being there, done that. 879 00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:04,840 Speaker 2: So and I don't I always don't think you should 880 00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:07,080 Speaker 2: kind of look backwards, particularly in a big job like that. 881 00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:11,160 Speaker 2: But equally, you know, it takes it does it takes 882 00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:15,000 Speaker 2: your life, and it takes your family's life, you know. 883 00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:17,400 Speaker 2: And I'm at a stage now where I want to 884 00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,279 Speaker 2: you know, my mother's not well, so you know that, 885 00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:22,200 Speaker 2: and I and it shouldn't be but it's a luxury 886 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,359 Speaker 2: to be able to spend time with her, and if 887 00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:26,919 Speaker 2: I was in that job, I couldn't. And the relationship 888 00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:29,920 Speaker 2: with my kids and my husband and my hobbies and 889 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,520 Speaker 2: my work and you know, being able to do things 890 00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,560 Speaker 2: like this. So whereas when you're in politics, it is 891 00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:38,239 Speaker 2: honestly all encompassation. 892 00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:39,960 Speaker 1: Quite selfish being a politician, yes, because there has to 893 00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:40,839 Speaker 1: be all about what you. 894 00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,600 Speaker 2: Do, all about you, and then even going and having 895 00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:45,480 Speaker 2: a cup of coffee, you know someone's going to talk 896 00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:47,480 Speaker 2: to you about, you know, whatever it is, and it's 897 00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:50,520 Speaker 2: just like so even if you're not on, you sort 898 00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:51,520 Speaker 2: of you're always on. 899 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:55,120 Speaker 1: And i'd imagine being a politician really you've got too focus. 900 00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:56,799 Speaker 1: As one is, doing what you think is the right thing, 901 00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:59,560 Speaker 1: what you believe is the right thing. But then the 902 00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,239 Speaker 1: second hard is having the ability to do that. You 903 00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:04,520 Speaker 1: have to get re elected. Yeah, you know, you're constantly 904 00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:07,080 Speaker 1: trying to sort of balance that between doing the right 905 00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:10,160 Speaker 1: thing and making sure that you still have the votes 906 00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:11,480 Speaker 1: make sure you can keep doing that. 907 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:12,960 Speaker 2: I was doing this QR and a thing you know, 908 00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:15,440 Speaker 2: because I still do in seeing and speaking and all 909 00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:16,960 Speaker 2: that sort of thing. I seem seeing and I said, oh, 910 00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:19,680 Speaker 2: I'm taking questions and you know, any questions. And someone 911 00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:21,239 Speaker 2: asked me something and I mean, oh, I'm not going 912 00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:22,480 Speaker 2: to answer that, and he goes, what do you mean 913 00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:24,439 Speaker 2: you're not going to answer it. I don't really care 914 00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:27,319 Speaker 2: if you don't like what I said. I need your 915 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:31,000 Speaker 2: vote exactly. But when you're a politician, that's different. Yeah, 916 00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:33,080 Speaker 2: I would have I would have fudged around that right, 917 00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:35,359 Speaker 2: Whereas he was like, you know, what are the three 918 00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:37,719 Speaker 2: things that you're going to judge success on and you know, 919 00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:40,080 Speaker 2: on this particular date, and I'm like, oh, I don't know. 920 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:44,399 Speaker 1: There is is my So, I come from a long 921 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:51,040 Speaker 1: labor family. So when they so my great grandfather was 922 00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:54,759 Speaker 1: the leader of the unemployed during the depression. They made 923 00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:57,919 Speaker 1: sort of a movie about them. And then my grandfather 924 00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 1: was the deputy mayor of Monk and he wanted to 925 00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:05,560 Speaker 1: be the MP for Monery and Labor told me he 926 00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:08,000 Speaker 1: was going to get it, and at the selection meeting 927 00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:10,319 Speaker 1: he was assured. And then this other guy, this big, 928 00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:12,400 Speaker 1: heavy set guy, got up and spoke and was this 929 00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:15,840 Speaker 1: incredible orator. It was David Longie. And so my grandfather 930 00:43:15,880 --> 00:43:19,279 Speaker 1: got left behind. So I've been asked a couple of 931 00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:22,000 Speaker 1: times whether I'd put my head in the ring for labor. Yeah, 932 00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:27,040 Speaker 1: I just and I thought about it. I just don't 933 00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:31,640 Speaker 1: think I'm willing to make the sacrifices. 934 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:35,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it is a huge sacrifice. And then in 935 00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:39,759 Speaker 2: the public's expectations on you and having to you know, 936 00:43:39,880 --> 00:43:43,040 Speaker 2: go with the paddy. There was an example when it 937 00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:44,719 Speaker 2: was but you know, for fairly recently in the last 938 00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,080 Speaker 2: few months. But once you're over fifty, you can say 939 00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:50,239 Speaker 2: the other day it could mean two weeks ago, or 940 00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:51,479 Speaker 2: it could mean two years ago. 941 00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:54,480 Speaker 3: The other day, but it was. 942 00:43:55,000 --> 00:44:00,320 Speaker 2: Someone had literally walked past and secretly videoed Gold and 943 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:05,120 Speaker 2: Jerry Brownlee having a cup of coffee on the footpath 944 00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:08,799 Speaker 2: outside of cafe. It's not like they were doing you know, 945 00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:11,360 Speaker 2: they were having a cup of coffee in a public place, 946 00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:14,719 Speaker 2: but they secretly recorded it and there it was, and 947 00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:18,080 Speaker 2: I just see that makes me feel ill. I mean, 948 00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:19,920 Speaker 2: they weren't doing anything wrong, they weren't even trying to 949 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,719 Speaker 2: hide it, right, And then then off goes you know, 950 00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:25,520 Speaker 2: all the social media on the rights and wrongs of it, 951 00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:26,120 Speaker 2: and I don't know. 952 00:44:26,239 --> 00:44:28,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I suppose that's the hard thing about being 953 00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:31,000 Speaker 1: a politician. Is you have to you have to sort 954 00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:34,440 Speaker 1: of be you know, up there really in terms of 955 00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:37,399 Speaker 1: how you behave, et cetera, et cetera, and you are 956 00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:40,719 Speaker 1: held to a fairly high standard which sometimes can be 957 00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:43,960 Speaker 1: hard to live up to when you're the host of 958 00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:47,440 Speaker 1: a sports show that the standards a lot lower. 959 00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:48,920 Speaker 3: My advice, don't do it. 960 00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:54,279 Speaker 2: Yeah, good, Yeah, thanks for coming in today. 961 00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:55,640 Speaker 1: Sorry thing question. 962 00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:59,040 Speaker 2: No, it's okay, So thanks for coming in today. We 963 00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:02,680 Speaker 2: can people find out war from you in sports Cafe. 964 00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:04,799 Speaker 1: Ish yeah, or sports Cafe. I mean, we're sort of 965 00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:07,680 Speaker 1: called sports Cafe Ish because I didn't want to sort 966 00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:09,759 Speaker 1: of pretend that we were making the same show. But 967 00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:14,520 Speaker 1: everyone it's calling it Sports Cafe. YouTube, YouTube, all podcasts, 968 00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:18,440 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and social media Instagram. 969 00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:20,800 Speaker 2: Yeah you know. Okay, go and check it out, guys, 970 00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,240 Speaker 2: And that except for another episode of as not my Space. 971 00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:25,120 Speaker 1: Our my space is shut down at the moment, so 972 00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:26,280 Speaker 1: we'll be getting their backup. 973 00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,360 Speaker 2: And that except for another episode of Asking Me Anything. 974 00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:32,320 Speaker 2: If you've enjoyed this episode, please follow Ask Me Anything 975 00:45:32,600 --> 00:45:35,799 Speaker 2: on iHeartRadio wherever you get your podcasts. While you were there, 976 00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:38,239 Speaker 2: check out some of our past episodes plenty there to 977 00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:41,560 Speaker 2: choose from some absolutely amazing people. Are we back next 978 00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:43,319 Speaker 2: Sunday with another fabulous guest. 979 00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:44,320 Speaker 3: I'm Paula Bennett. 980 00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:51,720 Speaker 2: Ask me anything, Goodbye,