1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,440 Speaker 1: Thomas Coglan, the Herald's political editors, with me right now. Hello, Thomas, 2 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: good afternoon. So I want to talk to you about 3 00:00:05,559 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: what happened this morning. On Nick Mills's show This is 4 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 1: Wellington Mornings, Chris Hopkins was talking about ram raids. Things 5 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: took quite a turn. 6 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 2: If quickly ask you there, we don't ever hear of 7 00:00:14,520 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 2: ram raids anymore. Is that because of the system that 8 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:19,720 Speaker 2: you put in place? Or is it since the coalition's 9 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:21,760 Speaker 2: come in now it's because your Tory owners that Ends 10 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 2: and me have just decided not to put it on 11 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:26,040 Speaker 2: the front page anymore. It's still happening. It's just Ends 12 00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 2: and Me have decided that it's not in the government's 13 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 2: best interests. And they do the National parties singing for them, 14 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 2: so they are. They're not covering it as much anymore. 15 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:35,960 Speaker 2: Oh gosh, that's a bit tough to jog. Do you 16 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:36,800 Speaker 2: think that that. 17 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:38,880 Speaker 1: Is he saying that with a straight face. 18 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:45,639 Speaker 3: Well, fortunately with radio you can't really tell. But I'm 19 00:00:45,680 --> 00:00:51,520 Speaker 3: honestly it's look, obviously, I'm deeply conflicted here being someone 20 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 3: who works for the company that puts together that front page. 21 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 3: But I did pull together some stats on those ram raids. 22 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 3: So in twenty twenty two we were having about fifty 23 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 3: nine RAM raids a month. So twenty thirty two, the 24 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:05,399 Speaker 3: last year of full year of the Labor government, seven 25 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 3: hundred and fourteen ram raids that year. Now we've had 26 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,680 Speaker 3: forty five ram raids total this year, about nine ram 27 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 3: raids a month for each month that we have data. 28 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:21,040 Speaker 3: So so the reason I don't put together the front page, 29 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 3: and so I don't know what what how it's put together, 30 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:27,399 Speaker 3: but I would imagine the reason why there aren't so 31 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 3: many ram raids on the front page is that there 32 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 3: are just far fewer ram raids. And you know, the 33 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 3: government's not perfect, but one area you would. 34 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: Say that to defend your owners. 35 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 3: Yes, we're also I mean we're a publicly traded company, 36 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 3: so that so many people own stocks and enzer the 37 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 3: me and I'm sure some of them are Tories and 38 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 3: some of them are not Tories. It's it is part 39 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:49,000 Speaker 3: of being a listed company. 40 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: So is this chippy just kind of you know, just 41 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: just riffing or is this part of strategy? 42 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 3: Well, it's I mean, it's interesting. It's interesting that he 43 00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 3: leaned into this thing because that IPSOS issues monitor that 44 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 3: came out a few months ago. Labor is ahead of 45 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 3: the government on most issues that are affecting voters, cost 46 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 3: of living, even inflation, housing areas where labor traditionally does 47 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 3: not lead national. One area where labor is behind national 48 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 3: still is on law and order. So it is maybe 49 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 3: he's looking for an excuse to explain why labor's behind 50 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:26,679 Speaker 3: national and law and order. The government is obviously making 51 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:28,239 Speaker 3: a big virtue of law and order this week, but 52 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 3: look of what you know. You can't Crime statistics are 53 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:36,040 Speaker 3: a mercurial thing, but it is difficult to fudge these numbers. 54 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:39,200 Speaker 3: The RAM raids to be fear to the government, they've 55 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:41,800 Speaker 3: had a massive success in bringing those down, and to 56 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:46,120 Speaker 3: be fear to labor. Ram raids dropped by it was 57 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 3: seven hundred and fourteen in twenty two and they dropped 58 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 3: to four hundred and ninety five and twenty three, so 59 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 3: that they did start coming down under labor too. 60 00:02:53,440 --> 00:02:56,040 Speaker 1: But what about what about blaming the media, because this, 61 00:02:56,080 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 1: I think is a fascinating thing. Right, this has been 62 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: going on. Parties across the spectrum have been doing it. 63 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:03,440 Speaker 1: Just Cinda pulled out of the interviews with Mike. You've 64 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:07,440 Speaker 1: had new Zealand first deliberately deliberately trying to bait our 65 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:10,920 Speaker 1: n Z into arguments you've had, act refusing to go 66 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 1: on morning report you've had now the Labor Party have 67 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 1: a crack at end Z meet like it feels to 68 00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: me like it suits. You're certainly seeing enough of it 69 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 1: for me to think that it could potentially be a 70 00:03:20,320 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 1: strategy to have a crack at at whichever media organization 71 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 1: you feel as your enemy. 72 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 3: I certainly agree to me. It always feels like like 73 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 3: blaming the ref. And now, obviously you know reefs do 74 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,760 Speaker 3: get things wrong, the media gets things wrong, but everyone 75 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:41,280 Speaker 3: knows that it's usually not the ref that causes the 76 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:43,800 Speaker 3: game to go one way or the other. A good 77 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:48,000 Speaker 3: team will prevail in more games than not because of 78 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 3: their performance rather than the ref. And I think it's 79 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 3: the same in politics. You know that the media will 80 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 3: get things right sometimes, they'll get things wrong sometimes, but 81 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 3: if you've got the solutions, then you'll be able. 82 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 1: Having said that, provoked Thomas, I mean you and I 83 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: both work in this industry, in the sector, right we 84 00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: understand that we are gatekeepers and that there is a 85 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: fair amount of blame to be laid at the feet 86 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 1: of people who are choosing the news angles, choosing the subjects, 87 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:15,520 Speaker 1: deciding deciding how to write the thing, choosing what words 88 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:15,880 Speaker 1: to use. 89 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 3: Right, absolutely, and like I'm not you know that with 90 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:22,919 Speaker 3: with this, I think it's fair to point out that 91 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 3: I just think that the data doesn't really batter what 92 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:29,720 Speaker 3: Chris that's saying. But you know, I back all politicians 93 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:35,320 Speaker 3: publicly grumbling about about things, specific things that they don't like. 94 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 3: I think it's you know, the media does have a 95 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 3: powerful role to playing society, and politicians of every right 96 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 3: if they don't think that something's been handled appropriately to 97 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:43,720 Speaker 3: call it out, you. 98 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 1: Make a fair point. It's just Chippy has chosen a 99 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 1: bad example because actually he just his government just let 100 00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 1: the rand rays happen, didn't they? Yes, okay, listen, talk 101 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:53,119 Speaker 1: me through this business with New Zealand First and the flags. 102 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:55,839 Speaker 1: Okay they want to. They've got as a private member's 103 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:58,119 Speaker 1: bill where it would only allow the New Zealand flag 104 00:04:58,120 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: to be flown on government buildings. 105 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:03,480 Speaker 3: What what's going they would? I tried to get in 106 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:05,360 Speaker 3: touch with the New Zealand First before coming on the show. 107 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:08,840 Speaker 3: They didn't return my call. The the yessue they have 108 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 3: is that the spudin me that the legislation, it's Andy 109 00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 3: Foster's Members Bill would ban symbols and flags of politically 110 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,880 Speaker 3: motivated ideology and division from being displayed on government buildings 111 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:21,240 Speaker 3: and the words of Winston Peters. One of the issues 112 00:05:21,240 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 3: that the party has had and passed has been the 113 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,760 Speaker 3: display of the Pride flag, the transgender flag outside parliament. 114 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:30,039 Speaker 3: You know the big line of flagpoles outside Parliament. They 115 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:32,480 Speaker 3: display a number of flags. You know, it's sort of 116 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:37,000 Speaker 3: whatever particular week or issue it is, you know, the 117 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 3: Pride month and then there's you know, other months. You 118 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 3: know what it's like, the Parliament tends to display those flags. 119 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:46,039 Speaker 3: New Zealand First has raised issues with that in the past. 120 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:50,160 Speaker 3: This would basically ban that would also bean bean non 121 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:54,279 Speaker 3: national flags from local authority buildings and state schools, only 122 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:56,719 Speaker 3: the official flag of New Zealand. So it seems like 123 00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 3: a wee bit of an overreaction if you ask me. 124 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 1: But however, they are a nationalistic party and this is 125 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 1: this is you. 126 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 3: Know, I think you'd want to you'd want to allow like, 127 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 3: you know, like local local government should be able to 128 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:12,960 Speaker 3: display you know, the absolutely positively Wellington flag. No No, 129 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:13,920 Speaker 3: It's sadly. 130 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:17,719 Speaker 1: I vote in favor of taking more decisions away from 131 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,400 Speaker 1: local government, absolutely not giving them any more. Thomas, you 132 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:22,719 Speaker 1: are such a soft touch. Thank you man, I really 133 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:25,479 Speaker 1: appreciate it. Thomas Coglan, the Herald's Political Edit. 134 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 2: For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to 135 00:06:29,440 --> 00:06:32,479 Speaker 2: news Talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 136 00:06:32,520 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.