1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,040 Speaker 1: It started last week with David Seymore State of the 2 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:04,560 Speaker 1: Nation's speech, and now is back in a back to 3 00:00:04,600 --> 00:00:06,960 Speaker 1: the future sort of way, we're suddenly debating potential asset 4 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 1: sales all over again. National may or may not go 5 00:00:10,039 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: into the next election, presumably along with act on a 6 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:16,279 Speaker 1: platform of selling off some of the state. Excuse me, 7 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:18,079 Speaker 1: silver Web. Last time we did this, of course, was 8 00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:21,080 Speaker 1: under John Key, who is with us. Very good morning 9 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:24,160 Speaker 1: to you, Morning Mite. I'm kind of reluctant to even 10 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:25,919 Speaker 1: talk about this. Don't we have a bigger fish to 11 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: fry in this country at the moment. 12 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 2: I'd probably say is look in the scheme of things, 13 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 2: we want the boat to go faster. There's a million 14 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 2: things you can do from canning, bureaucracy and Texas and 15 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 2: you know, making it more from the society, better foreign investment, 16 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:42,520 Speaker 2: all those kinds of things. If you want my view, 17 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 2: they'll make the boat go a lot faster than a 18 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 2: few ys it sells, because frankly, there ain't a hell 19 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:48,200 Speaker 2: of a lot to sell. 20 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: Good. I'm glad you said that, because I was trying 21 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 1: to work out what we would sell. Somebody says Land Corp. 22 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: But I mean beyond that, what's left of genuine value. 23 00:00:56,720 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 2: Well, unless you went down and we sold center of 24 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:03,960 Speaker 2: the gen Taylor's, you know, the contacts and Genesis and 25 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 2: that sort of stuff. So unless you actually sold out 26 00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:10,080 Speaker 2: the balance of that, I'm not really sure what's around. 27 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 2: I mean, the certain assets you wouldn't sell Transpowers one 28 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 2: of them, just because it's the national grid. There's some things, 29 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 2: as you identify the think in your minute this morning, 30 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:21,080 Speaker 2: like you know Tip New Zealand, where you know, yeah, 31 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 2: maybe one day it was with the billion, but now 32 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 2: you almost paying someone to take it off your hand. 33 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 2: So there's no real money. The elen length, I don't 34 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:31,759 Speaker 2: even know look at something. But I mean the blunt 35 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 2: reality with the thing was that it was it was 36 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 2: designed actually to be farmer for for ballot farmers, and 37 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:43,280 Speaker 2: and you know I didn't really count as a state 38 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:46,320 Speaker 2: asset in the same way that you would say Gen Taylor. 39 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 1: So what would if Nationally enters the contest next year 40 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: looking to sell Is it selling for money or is 41 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:56,320 Speaker 1: it selling for ideology? In other words, when we get 42 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 1: rid of it, we can it will be run better. 43 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 2: Well, I think you just look at the whole principle 44 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 2: of why you do it. I mean, why are people opposed, 45 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 2: in my opinion, ideological mumbo jumbo. You know, they just 46 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 2: want to sit there and tell you everything's fantastic when 47 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:11,560 Speaker 2: it's run by the state and you can't trust the 48 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 2: private sector. But ninety percent of what we do is 49 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 2: done by the private sector, probably a lot more than that. 50 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,079 Speaker 2: So I don't see why we can't trust a few 51 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:22,839 Speaker 2: things here. Secondly, why wouldn't you recycle your balance sheet? 52 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 2: To me, if you're a householder, the house you buy 53 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 2: it thirty is often very different to the one you 54 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:29,200 Speaker 2: buy at forty five and the one you buy at 55 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:32,240 Speaker 2: seventy five. Why because your lifestyle changes, So you don't 56 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:34,959 Speaker 2: go there and buy the first little unit you buy 57 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 2: at thirty and say that's going to be the thing 58 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 2: I'm going to want to raise my family because not 59 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 2: big enough's not for purpose. Well, the government's no different fairly, 60 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,919 Speaker 2: you know, in the bureaucracy you are paid to say no, 61 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 2: wherea isn't. It's paid to say yes because yes is 62 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:55,239 Speaker 2: what makes them again the performance better. But why there's 63 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,799 Speaker 2: risks in the pub And I think the one thing 64 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 2: that PEO will sort of well, you know most of 65 00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 2: us have Q we save everybody's involved in acc in 66 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 2: New Zealand super where there's guy's going to put their money. 67 00:03:07,600 --> 00:03:08,839 Speaker 2: You know, if you don't want to give them any 68 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:11,400 Speaker 2: assets to invest them, they're going to have to invest 69 00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:14,799 Speaker 2: in Australian roads, in Australian assets, you know. So it 70 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 2: doesn't making sense really to stop them. 71 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 1: What about things like qe we Rail. This person in 72 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 1: the herall this morning from Richard Prebble, of course, was 73 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,120 Speaker 1: in charge of selling ke We Rail in the first place. 74 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:24,239 Speaker 1: So sold it off, didn't go well, brought it back 75 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 1: isn't going well. So is government owning stuff a bad thing? 76 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 1: Or is it? Is it it's site or business specific? 77 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's a site specific. I mean, look, 78 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 2: it may have changed, and I could be well and 79 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 2: truly the other day. But I'll tell you when I 80 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 2: was pronounced and we used to look at q rail 81 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 2: and all have, you know, the executives and stuff in 82 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 2: our office. I'll tell you now the main trenk mine 83 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 2: made money. You can't make money on rail for a 84 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 2: for something that you can do that's prety much under 85 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:55,840 Speaker 2: one hundred kill mees like you need distance. So it 86 00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:58,600 Speaker 2: worked for the Golden Triangle down to tower on the 87 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:01,600 Speaker 2: in land portal, that sort of stuff. It works along 88 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 2: the main line and everything else doesn't make money. So 89 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 2: if you were selling it, the question would be and 90 00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 2: by the way, the state is those assets are saw, 91 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 2: as I understand it, pretty ropey, so there'd be a 92 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 2: huge amount of investment. I'm not sure what cash you'd get, 93 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,039 Speaker 2: so if you did sell parts of it or soul 94 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 2: that you'd be really in the camp of saying I 95 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:25,279 Speaker 2: think someone else will run it better. And there's nothing 96 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,800 Speaker 2: actually wrong with saying someone else could own an asset 97 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:32,360 Speaker 2: that you still might cross subsidized. I mean, well this 98 00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 2: a while I look at it. If I needed a 99 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 2: major health procedure this afternoon, frankly, I don't care who 100 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:41,039 Speaker 2: owns that. I don't care it's the private sector. I 101 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 2: don't care it's the public sector. I tell what I 102 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:48,159 Speaker 2: care about the surgeons and medical professionals that are around me, right, 103 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 2: and that they have the drugs that I need for 104 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:54,159 Speaker 2: that procedure. That's what I care about. What the actual 105 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:56,359 Speaker 2: ownership of the bricks and water exactly. 106 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 1: What's your vibe on mood? How much political capital do 107 00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 1: you think gets spent if it gets spent next year. 108 00:05:01,560 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: Are we still angsty about this or not? 109 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, because I think the people that are opposed are 110 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:10,799 Speaker 2: sort of disposed to everything really in a lot of ways. 111 00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 2: I mean they've been fed aligned that they all have 112 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 2: to pay a lot more and that it will be 113 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 2: sold offshore and that won't work. And it's like the 114 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 2: same argument around foreign investments, the same answer around it. 115 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:23,560 Speaker 2: You know, so many of these things, more tourists coming, 116 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:26,600 Speaker 2: more people coming to work in New Zealand. I'll tell 117 00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 2: you a little interesting thing, right, You've been talking about 118 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:32,719 Speaker 2: DTZ recently and I mess It talked about you know 119 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:36,360 Speaker 2: chet GPT this to go on to chet GPT. Here's 120 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 2: a cluin and say how do I get rich? Here's 121 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:42,479 Speaker 2: the answer, earn more, spend less. Well, last time, a 122 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 2: lot all the people that are opposed and most of 123 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 2: those things that will make the vote go faster do 124 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 2: not want to spend less because that means the provision 125 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 2: of poorer public services. So the answer is we have 126 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,360 Speaker 2: to earn more. And I think for Chris and the government, 127 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:01,520 Speaker 2: I think he's on absolutely track. He's talking about economic 128 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 2: growth because in the end, we all want a higher 129 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:07,280 Speaker 2: standard of living. To do that we have to earn more, 130 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 2: and I just go back to what it was used 131 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 2: to saving us PM. You know, we're a little country. 132 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:13,360 Speaker 2: We're at the bottom of the world. No one knows 133 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:17,040 Speaker 2: what's a living So we better start being more attractive, 134 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:20,400 Speaker 2: more permissive, more more a better place to do business. 135 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:22,599 Speaker 2: And when we do that, there's so many people that 136 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 2: want to do things in our country, and we shouldn't 137 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 2: be afraid of that because honestly, they make a massive 138 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 2: difference to the economic growth and therefore the tax revenue 139 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,160 Speaker 2: and the you know, the beneficial things that you get 140 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 2: from all that. 141 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,040 Speaker 1: And on that note, how much energy if you had 142 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 1: Winston alongside you're running the place right now, would you 143 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 1: put him too trying to twist his on foreign house investment? 144 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 2: Foreign house investment? Definitely, because I think again that's sort 145 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 2: of crazy. I mean, look, when I was around, not 146 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,719 Speaker 2: necessarily well known that, but I pushed quite hard for 147 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 2: a stamp duty, a foreign a foreign buyers stamp duty. 148 00:06:56,839 --> 00:06:58,600 Speaker 2: And the reason being I used to say to our 149 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 2: guys that one day we'll lose an election and if 150 00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 2: we don't, they'll put a foreign buyers ben And that's 151 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 2: exactly what's happened. And it did. Look, we had the 152 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 2: fastest writing House Brothers in the New Zealand history. Here's a 153 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:13,240 Speaker 2: clear of what makes House Brothers go up low interest rates. 154 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:16,960 Speaker 2: You know, it's not it's not basically the fact that 155 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 2: someone who lives in Manhattan might be to go and 156 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:22,520 Speaker 2: buy the odd house in New Zealand. I think. And 157 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 2: if you want to attract people to New Zealand and 158 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 2: would you migrate to New Zealand if I said you are, 159 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 2: by the way for a quite a period of time 160 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 2: you can't buy house or well, that is way more 161 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 2: important in my mind than something like, you know, can 162 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:41,400 Speaker 2: I hock off a bit of q rail for which 163 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 2: I'll get nothing for it? 164 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: Then why can't Peter's understand that, Given he's out in 165 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:49,960 Speaker 1: the world as foreign minister, and I think most people 166 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,920 Speaker 1: see him as a successful foreign minister. Given that message 167 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: to the world, why can't Why does he then come 168 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: back home and go, no, you can't buy house. 169 00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 2: Look, I think it's just that a logicul doo that says, essentially, 170 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:11,320 Speaker 2: you know, foreign foreign and foreign engagement is bad. I 171 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:13,600 Speaker 2: know that sense weird as a foreign minister, but in 172 00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 2: an economic sense, he hasn't changed that's been New Zealand's 173 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 2: first philosophy for or thirty or forty years. Are basically 174 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 2: pretty much opposed to all of those things, asset sales, 175 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:27,400 Speaker 2: foreign investments, all of this. But you know, it is 176 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:32,720 Speaker 2: a very very It might work under Donald Trump's will. Weirdly, 177 00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 2: it works because it works better because you've got such 178 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:42,640 Speaker 2: an enormous enclosed economy that's got two hundred and thirty millions. Basically, 179 00:08:42,880 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 2: you know, middle income seeds, the wealthiest people are out 180 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:48,200 Speaker 2: and they drive that economic growth. But in the New 181 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 2: Zealand context, we don't have that. So the only way 182 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,640 Speaker 2: we really succeed grow and prosper is when we have 183 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 2: other middle income consumers doing things with us and high 184 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:00,760 Speaker 2: income consumers. And part of that is said, buy a house. 185 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:05,719 Speaker 2: And I mean, look, I understand that, but honestly have 186 00:09:05,880 --> 00:09:07,680 Speaker 2: to Tari to you have a lot. You know, in 187 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:12,319 Speaker 2: Tiari there's just dozens now of these teen twenty to 188 00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:17,200 Speaker 2: thirty million dollar houses being built. They have provided enormous 189 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 2: work for the people of fromong A Fire and the 190 00:09:19,520 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 2: surrounding area. We are so much better off for having 191 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:25,720 Speaker 2: those assets, you know. And so foreigners and foreigners often 192 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:29,319 Speaker 2: very often they're Americans and Australians who are very philanthropic. 193 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:30,839 Speaker 2: They give away a lot of money. 194 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 1: Exactly right, good and so I appreciate it as always 195 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 1: to John Key, can you please stop texting saying John Key? 196 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:37,680 Speaker 1: What a breath of fresh year? God, I miss John Key. 197 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: Text machines are burning, Burning up. 198 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:43,920 Speaker 2: For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to 199 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,120 Speaker 2: news Talks it'd be from six am weekdays, or follow 200 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.