1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:01,720 Speaker 1: Right. We've got an update for you now on the 2 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: story of the Juicy Fest and Timeless Summer Tour liquidation. 3 00:00:06,120 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: You remember this, it was in the news. The promoter 4 00:00:08,360 --> 00:00:12,399 Speaker 1: for these gigs canceled the events and went bust. The 5 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:16,080 Speaker 1: company owes two point four million dollars to creditors. Thousands 6 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 1: of ticket holders still not got any refund. Some people 7 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: paid if you got the VIP package, paid more than 8 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: three hundred dollars per person, so potentially, you know, thousands 9 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: of dollars for a household. The ticketing company some of 10 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 1: these for some of these events is called the Ticket Ferry, 11 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: and the ticket Fery teams say that since the liquidation 12 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:39,840 Speaker 1: they and their families have been receiving online abuse, even 13 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 1: racial hatred from kiwis who missed out. Ratsh Patel is 14 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:47,200 Speaker 1: the CEO of the Ticket Ferry, joining us from the uses. 15 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,599 Speaker 1: Good to have you on the show, hey nicely, So 16 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:53,120 Speaker 1: just give us an idea. You guys basically collect the 17 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: money for the tickets and then hand it on to 18 00:00:55,840 --> 00:00:56,440 Speaker 1: the promoters. 19 00:00:56,480 --> 00:01:01,040 Speaker 2: Is that right, That's actually not right. No, So we 20 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 2: act as the technology provider and the vast majority of 21 00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 2: larger events in in New Zealand connect their own merchant 22 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 2: accounts into the system, so they use the software that 23 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:16,800 Speaker 2: we provide, but they connect their own merchant accounts and 24 00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 2: it's quite a common practice across most. 25 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:24,960 Speaker 1: Platforms actually, So you're just the interface absolutely, but you've 26 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:25,720 Speaker 1: been getting abuse. 27 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 3: What sort of abuse, it's been pretty broad, actually, I 28 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 3: mean the I think the thing that the one that's 29 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 3: been very interesting is people think that where the company 30 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:43,640 Speaker 3: actually running the show or the shows, and I think that, 31 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 3: like maybe because Timeless was a new brand. 32 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 2: It's not a new promoter, but it's a new brand. 33 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 2: It was something new that they launched because they wanted 34 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 2: to do something that was kind of retro on the 35 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 2: music side, so they called it Timeless. Maybe people hadn't 36 00:01:57,280 --> 00:02:01,560 Speaker 2: been familiar with that before, and also the Timeless shows 37 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 2: were a bit of an older crowd, so maybe they 38 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 2: weren't also familiar with our brand. So maybe they just 39 00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 2: thought that the website and the promoter with the same people. 40 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 2: But that's definitely not the case. But we had a 41 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 2: lot of people basically think that we were the ones 42 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 2: running the show and we'd stolen everyone's money, which which 43 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 2: is a lot of saddening because we've been in We've 44 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 2: been around as a platform for well over a decade 45 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,400 Speaker 2: and worked with some of the biggest, biggest events in 46 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 2: New Zealand, and it was a bit weird to be 47 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 2: told or for people to claim that we were actually 48 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 2: the promoter. 49 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:37,800 Speaker 1: I think the confusion might have come because in ticket 50 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:39,519 Speaker 1: tick here in New Zealand, like they did the tickets 51 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:42,240 Speaker 1: for the time this summer New Plymouth show and they 52 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 1: refunded all the ticket holders even though the promoter went 53 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,640 Speaker 1: bus because they held the money. I mean, that's the 54 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 1: difference between you two. Did you tell people you weren't 55 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:52,640 Speaker 1: going to hold their money when they paid you? And 56 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 1: do you have to hold their money? Is there a 57 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 1: legal requirement or clearly not? 58 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 2: So during the Chechop Ross were actually really clear. So 59 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 2: if the there's there's two scenarios. So when a venue 60 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 2: or a promoter uses the technology, they have a choice 61 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 2: of either using their merchant account or using ours. If 62 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:14,639 Speaker 2: they use ours, we actually do hold all funds and 63 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 2: don't pay until after the show. If they the bigger shows, 64 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:21,840 Speaker 2: they tend to use their own merchant accounts and then 65 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 2: they have to go through onboarding with the with what 66 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 2: with the payment processor and go through. Yeah, there are 67 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:30,200 Speaker 2: they know your business processes for the payment processor, and 68 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: that's what most of the big promoters in New Zealand do. 69 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 1: Because money then they want the money straight away to 70 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:38,320 Speaker 1: be able to use that presumably. 71 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 2: And they also take on the risk. Yeah, but what 72 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 2: what when that happens? And in that scenario, during the 73 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 2: checkout process on the payment form, we actually show that 74 00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:50,440 Speaker 2: very clearly that the payment's been taken by the promoter 75 00:03:51,240 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 2: the refund terms of theirs and that also is in 76 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:55,480 Speaker 2: the confirmation email. 77 00:03:56,120 --> 00:04:00,160 Speaker 1: Do you obviously you regret partnering with these guys, but 78 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: do you check them out before you partner with them? 79 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 3: Yeah? 80 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 2: Absolutely absolutely, And the there's a second level of diligence 81 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 2: that happens with the payment processor as well to make 82 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 2: sure and they have to put all their business information, 83 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 2: they have to upload their incorporation documents, so there's two 84 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 2: levels of checks. Absolutely, right. 85 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 1: Does this put you off doing stuff with New Zealand 86 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:23,800 Speaker 1: promoters or was this just a one off big No? 87 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 2: I mean, look, we've we've sold it. We've sold hundreds 88 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 2: of millions of dollars of tickets. I would estimate a 89 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 2: couple of hundred million dollars in New Zealand. So it's 90 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,200 Speaker 2: a market that we really love. We have a team 91 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,680 Speaker 2: on the ground. You know, we've been we've been in 92 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 2: using for a very long time. It's actually, i would 93 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 2: say in our top three big It's markets. So nothing, 94 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 2: it doesn't put me off, but we did have obviously 95 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 2: the the misunderstanding of people thinking that we'd actually taken 96 00:04:57,360 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 2: the money and then just given it to the promoter. 97 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 2: It is disheartening. I mean, the biggest thing is that, 98 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 2: you know, families who have paid a lot of money 99 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 2: for their tickets have not got that money anymore, right, 100 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:13,160 Speaker 2: and that's a big shame. Obviously the promoter's not in 101 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:16,159 Speaker 2: business right now, but individual families who don't have that 102 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 2: cash that that's a big deal. 103 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 3: And we we've. 104 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 2: Spent a lot of We put a lot of effort 105 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 2: into making sure that fans have been protected over the years. 106 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 2: So we were one of the first platforms in the 107 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 2: world to have a secure resale system. It stops scalping, 108 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,039 Speaker 2: it stops from being ripped off with fake tickets, it 109 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 2: stops tickets from being resold above face value. So we've 110 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:38,559 Speaker 2: put a lot of effort over the years into making 111 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:42,840 Speaker 2: sure that fans are protected just because we know how important. 112 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 1: Though, would you consider not offering the option for promoters 113 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:49,600 Speaker 1: to collect the money directly themselves so that you are 114 00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: a beck stop for those people who are missing out. 115 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, of course. But what I would say 116 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 2: would happen is that most of the promoters in New 117 00:05:58,440 --> 00:06:01,200 Speaker 2: Zealand would no longer be able to run shows because 118 00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:05,120 Speaker 2: almost every other platform, apart from say the tickettecs, do 119 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:08,280 Speaker 2: offer the ability to connect the promotero merchant account. 120 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 1: Right, why do people go with you and see the 121 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 1: ticket ticket to you guys cheaper? 122 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:15,120 Speaker 2: No, it's not even that. We've put a lot of 123 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 2: work into building technology that helps to drive more sales 124 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 2: for the promoter. It helps them with marketing. At the 125 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:24,919 Speaker 2: same time the fans are protected from scalping. You know, 126 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,599 Speaker 2: there's a closedly resale system that makes sure that no 127 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 2: one gets ripped off, like I was saying before, So 128 00:06:31,520 --> 00:06:35,040 Speaker 2: we kind of come in as this almost like a 129 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:40,680 Speaker 2: marketing layer that allows the Ironically, it de risks the 130 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 2: promoter because it helps them to drive more sales and 131 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 2: actually give them a better chance of breaking even on 132 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 2: their gig. And what happened with Juicy and Timeless is 133 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 2: it's very much an unusual event. It's one of the 134 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 2: it's actually the first time we've had something like this happen. 135 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,120 Speaker 2: And they got canceled because there at the very last 136 00:06:58,120 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 2: minute their permits were not granted for the alcohol and 137 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 2: so had that not happened, the shows would have gone ahead. 138 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 2: Like so, I think a few people thought that the 139 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 2: shows were fake, but as far as we're aware, all 140 00:07:10,880 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 2: of the artists had had their deposits paid and they 141 00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:17,880 Speaker 2: were ready to tour and Juicy in Australia did actually happen. 142 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 2: That went ahead and so the permit's not being granted 143 00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 2: in New Zealand, that's actually what caused the cancelations. 144 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 1: Interesting, British, thanks for coming on, British Prattel who's the 145 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 1: CEO and co founder of the Ticket Theory. 146 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 2: For more from Hither Duplessy Alan Drive, listen live to 147 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:36,119 Speaker 2: news talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 148 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.