1
00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:04,000
Speaker 1: The huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, a name

2
00:00:04,080 --> 00:00:06,240
Speaker 1: you can trust locally and globally.

3
00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:08,160
Speaker 2: On the huddle of this this evening we have Tres

4
00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:10,799
Speaker 2: Sharson of Shearson Willis PR and Joseph Acganni, the chief

5
00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:11,840
Speaker 2: executive of Child Fund.

6
00:00:11,880 --> 00:00:14,600
Speaker 3: Hello you too, Hello Hello Trisha.

7
00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:16,840
Speaker 2: You were nodding your head all the way through, Al Gillespie.

8
00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:21,360
Speaker 3: Why because what has happened over the weekend is we

9
00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:25,120
Speaker 3: have seen these tensions between the US and Iran shift

10
00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:29,240
Speaker 3: from tensions in quotes to a full blown strategic risk,

11
00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,640
Speaker 3: and you touched on some of this also in your editorial.

12
00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:37,239
Speaker 3: The question about whether this is legally right is an

13
00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:40,320
Speaker 3: important one, but that question has now gone. The question

14
00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:44,120
Speaker 3: now is how ugly does this get and how quickly

15
00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:49,320
Speaker 3: does it hit the world economy but also our markets here.

16
00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,520
Speaker 3: So there's a couple of quick points. One is, as

17
00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:56,720
Speaker 3: Al just pointed out, this is regime changed logic, and

18
00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:59,400
Speaker 3: that's where it gets expensive for the US because they

19
00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:02,040
Speaker 3: do not have runs on the board in the examples

20
00:01:02,080 --> 00:01:05,680
Speaker 3: that he just talked about. Even if you think that

21
00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,920
Speaker 3: ran is bad, the method matters. So okay, they've gone

22
00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,399
Speaker 3: in with the air strikes, but the deeply ingrained, deep

23
00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:16,039
Speaker 3: state of Iraq, it's not going to be taken out

24
00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:19,679
Speaker 3: by the air strikes. And then you've got this immediate

25
00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:22,640
Speaker 3: economic shock. So just think about the New Zealand government

26
00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:26,280
Speaker 3: in election year. They are going to have essentially a

27
00:01:26,319 --> 00:01:30,319
Speaker 3: whacking petrol tax that is not going to help their cause.

28
00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,680
Speaker 3: And I think where we're really fragile in New Zealand

29
00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:37,920
Speaker 3: is fuel prices. As we've said, supply chains and insurance

30
00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:42,240
Speaker 3: around shipping to get stuff here. We've got travel and

31
00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:47,840
Speaker 3: consular risk. We've got our foreign policy posture and risk. Again,

32
00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:51,080
Speaker 3: we're in luxe and today he's been forced into trying

33
00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,800
Speaker 3: to kind of ride two horses. And we've also got

34
00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:58,880
Speaker 3: our domestic resilience because we have a huge reliance on

35
00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:01,480
Speaker 3: the oil and we have a huge alliance on the

36
00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:05,400
Speaker 3: shipping lanes. Funnily enough, two weeks ago this sounds weird,

37
00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:08,399
Speaker 3: but I had a guy wander up my driveway who

38
00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:11,239
Speaker 3: was one of the Golden Visa people coming here looking

39
00:02:11,280 --> 00:02:14,160
Speaker 3: at New Zealand's business. He's an energy expert, and he

40
00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:17,799
Speaker 3: said to me, I cannot believe that New Zealand got

41
00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:20,280
Speaker 3: rid of its Marsden point oil right way, I just

42
00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:23,480
Speaker 3: mentioned this exactly. That's what reminded me to say about

43
00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:28,760
Speaker 3: this guy. He just from an energy resilience perspective. It

44
00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:31,720
Speaker 3: blew his mind that we would leave ourselves that exposed.

45
00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:33,320
Speaker 2: Well did you say to him it was Meghan Woods.

46
00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,520
Speaker 2: Many things that Meghan Woods did would have flown your mind.

47
00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:37,120
Speaker 3: He also was not a fan of the aill and

48
00:02:37,160 --> 00:02:39,919
Speaker 3: Gas band just by bye, but by surprise. So this

49
00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:42,120
Speaker 3: is a big deal for the world, but it's a

50
00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:44,400
Speaker 3: big deal from for New Zealand. And let's remember the

51
00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:49,200
Speaker 3: world's economy has not recovered yet from the shocks of COVID.

52
00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:54,640
Speaker 4: Josie, Yeah, I think the international law bit does matter,

53
00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:57,320
Speaker 4: and I'll tell you why. It's we've just signed a

54
00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,960
Speaker 4: trade deal with India. That's a good thing. That is

55
00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,360
Speaker 4: a piece of international law. Every time you get on

56
00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:04,760
Speaker 4: an aircraft, that's a piece of international law. That the

57
00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:07,919
Speaker 4: plane lands and takes off in the right way. Your

58
00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:10,520
Speaker 4: pass border is a piece of international law. So international

59
00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,840
Speaker 4: law does matter. And what you're seeing with the disregard

60
00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:16,040
Speaker 4: for borders and some of the things that you listed,

61
00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:19,800
Speaker 4: Heather were absolutely right. You know, un has completely failed.

62
00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:23,359
Speaker 4: So the mechanisms of international law, like the Yuanna failed

63
00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:26,239
Speaker 4: to stop a war in Ukraine, stop a war in Gaza.

64
00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:30,200
Speaker 4: But the implications of ignoring borders as Trump has done

65
00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,480
Speaker 4: with Ukraine, where he's gone, well that Russia wants a

66
00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:34,760
Speaker 4: bit of it, let them have it. Then you get

67
00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:39,320
Speaker 4: this metastasizing problem where you've got Pakistan and Afghanistan chucking

68
00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:42,560
Speaker 4: bombs at each other. Now because if one border doesn't matter,

69
00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:46,240
Speaker 4: none of them matter. Eritrea, Ethiopia and so on. So

70
00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:50,280
Speaker 4: you break international law and you do unleash some kind

71
00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:54,080
Speaker 4: of hell. And the thing that really depresses me is

72
00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:57,040
Speaker 4: that international law does have muscle if you let it.

73
00:03:57,160 --> 00:04:00,760
Speaker 4: So there's a piece of international law called responsibility to protect.

74
00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:04,520
Speaker 4: It came in after the Rwandan genocide. Now that piece

75
00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:08,080
Speaker 4: of legislation, or that piece of international law could have

76
00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:10,880
Speaker 4: been used in Syria when they crossed the red line

77
00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:14,040
Speaker 4: and dropped the government dropped chemical bonds on its citizens.

78
00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:17,839
Speaker 4: Could have gone in there to protect people citizens against

79
00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,359
Speaker 4: its own government. This could have been used. Responsibility to

80
00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:25,200
Speaker 4: protect could have been used when Homeni and the Iotolas

81
00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:29,680
Speaker 4: were killing Iranian citizens only a few weeks ago. So

82
00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:33,800
Speaker 4: you know there is international law mechanisms. Sometimes when it fails,

83
00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,640
Speaker 4: it's because you haven't got the guts and we haven't

84
00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:39,720
Speaker 4: got the guts to use those mechanisms. And the problem

85
00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,040
Speaker 4: with this is that Trump is not going into around

86
00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,039
Speaker 4: now to help those protests. I mean, I don't He's

87
00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:46,520
Speaker 4: not been clear why he's going in.

88
00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:50,480
Speaker 3: Well, I think the fundamental principle of international law and

89
00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:54,080
Speaker 3: certainly would not claim to be an expert, but that's

90
00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:58,200
Speaker 3: worrying with Trump and Venezuela. Trump and Iran is actually

91
00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:02,400
Speaker 3: the recognition of so states. And as soon as you

92
00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,520
Speaker 3: stop doesn't matter how bad you think that re regimers.

93
00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,040
Speaker 3: As soon as you cross the line and sovereign states

94
00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:11,680
Speaker 3: are no longer sovereign states, everyone and everything is up

95
00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:12,080
Speaker 3: for grabs.

96
00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:13,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a fair point. All right, we'll take a

97
00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:13,920
Speaker 2: break with you guys.

98
00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:18,520
Speaker 1: Come back SHORTLYQUI the huddle with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty,

99
00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:20,680
Speaker 1: the only truly global brand.

100
00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:22,960
Speaker 2: Right, we're back of the huddle, Joseph Ghani and Tricius.

101
00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:24,919
Speaker 2: And I should say, Josie, you're and tongue at the moment,

102
00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:25,359
Speaker 2: aren't you.

103
00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:28,360
Speaker 4: I am in Tonga. Yeah, we've just got the tail

104
00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:33,279
Speaker 4: end of that cyclone that hits Vanuatu and Fiji. But yeah,

105
00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:36,520
Speaker 4: it's poor and pouring with rain and windy as hell,

106
00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:39,840
Speaker 4: but it's lovely to be in. I'm working.

107
00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:41,960
Speaker 2: Is it weird for you to sit in tongue and

108
00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:44,520
Speaker 2: then answer questions about where the councils in New Zealand

109
00:05:44,520 --> 00:05:46,240
Speaker 2: should be able to sign off on the killing of

110
00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:48,840
Speaker 2: native native beasts?

111
00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:51,440
Speaker 4: Almost as weird as it is to talk about bombing

112
00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,440
Speaker 4: and run. Although I have to say I've been in

113
00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:56,520
Speaker 4: a few cafes and that's always been talking about. So yeah,

114
00:05:56,520 --> 00:05:59,400
Speaker 4: the Pacific used to being in the spotlight, right, yes,

115
00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:03,400
Speaker 4: so counts the problem with this. Look, who knows. I

116
00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:04,960
Speaker 4: don't know whether it should be dark or whether it

117
00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,880
Speaker 4: should be counsels. I do know though, that the sort

118
00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:12,800
Speaker 4: of pro the protectors, the sort of anti grossers who

119
00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:16,479
Speaker 4: don't want anything built, they just go too far, you know,

120
00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:21,520
Speaker 4: they save every single spider and snail and fly and whatever,

121
00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:24,120
Speaker 4: so that in the end just nothing gets done. And

122
00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:27,359
Speaker 4: I do think this is quite a split politically, not

123
00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:31,200
Speaker 4: so much left and right, but pro growth and anti growth.

124
00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:34,000
Speaker 4: So you've got big growsers on both sides. Right on

125
00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:37,599
Speaker 4: the right, you've got people who hate housing intensification in

126
00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:40,880
Speaker 4: Auckland and the left who you want to save every

127
00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:45,320
Speaker 4: snail species that ever existed. And also you've got pro

128
00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:49,280
Speaker 4: development on both sides, national and labors. So I do

129
00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:51,720
Speaker 4: think it's quite It could be quite an election issue,

130
00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:52,400
Speaker 4: this kind of thing.

131
00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:53,239
Speaker 2: What do you reckon?

132
00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:55,880
Speaker 3: Well, I thought it was kind of funny. I was

133
00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:59,760
Speaker 3: actually laughing out loud thinking that there's criticizing councils for

134
00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:02,960
Speaker 3: their ridiculous stuff about Kyangora and what you can do

135
00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,920
Speaker 3: in that. But on the other hand he's saying, yeah,

136
00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:08,160
Speaker 3: but it's called let them predict the Kiwi. I mean,

137
00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:11,400
Speaker 3: it just struck me as ridiculous. I mean, I think

138
00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:15,120
Speaker 3: Josie's got to the heart of it. This isn't a

139
00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,120
Speaker 3: planning reform question. It's really a governance question of who

140
00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:21,640
Speaker 3: looks after this. My concern would of this would be

141
00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,680
Speaker 3: if you've got national species, i e. The Kiwi, we

142
00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:28,600
Speaker 3: should have national rules for their protection. And if we

143
00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:30,240
Speaker 3: get down to councils, we're going to get are we

144
00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:35,920
Speaker 3: going to get postcode conservation? And lord knows counsels aren't

145
00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:38,679
Speaker 3: you know, don't have a great track record at the moment.

146
00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,960
Speaker 3: So I do feel a bit nervous about it. What

147
00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:44,880
Speaker 3: I think may also happen, which isn't great on the

148
00:07:44,920 --> 00:07:47,680
Speaker 3: pro growth side, is you're actually going to end up

149
00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:51,520
Speaker 3: with more let litigation, not less, because there will be

150
00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:55,440
Speaker 3: huge disputes over well, one council allowed here, I'm not

151
00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:57,520
Speaker 3: allowed to do it over here, and so it might

152
00:07:57,960 --> 00:07:59,360
Speaker 3: end up in more red tape.

153
00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:00,520
Speaker 2: Could will do you know this?

154
00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:02,680
Speaker 4: One one point on this that I think that would

155
00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:05,000
Speaker 4: make it would make sense is why don't they Why

156
00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:08,320
Speaker 4: don't we just increase the predator free zones that we

157
00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:10,560
Speaker 4: have which actually work really well. We've got one on

158
00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:13,840
Speaker 4: cup of the island. So if you expand those zones

159
00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:15,760
Speaker 4: and do what you were just saying, Trish, where you

160
00:08:15,800 --> 00:08:18,160
Speaker 4: go right, Kiwi matters. We've got to protect the kiwi,

161
00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:21,000
Speaker 4: but not this sort of thing where Dot can say

162
00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:25,320
Speaker 4: whatever insect or what ant or whatever has to be

163
00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:28,040
Speaker 4: protected at this because the problem is you've got no

164
00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:32,400
Speaker 4: consultation with the people who won't have those seven hundred

165
00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:35,720
Speaker 4: jobs that might have been created with a development project

166
00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,640
Speaker 4: or something right, So you end up consulting with the

167
00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:41,320
Speaker 4: people who of course are going to disagree with any development,

168
00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:43,160
Speaker 4: rather than people who will benefit from you.

169
00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:45,439
Speaker 2: True, right, do you choose chewing gum trish?

170
00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,520
Speaker 3: I as a kid, I loved chewing gus, juicy fruit

171
00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:52,560
Speaker 3: and doublement you know, you get the long strips. I

172
00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,160
Speaker 3: like the strip and gum in the foil, you know,

173
00:08:55,280 --> 00:09:00,760
Speaker 3: all those those. Funnily enough, I don't chew chewing anymore.

174
00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:01,600
Speaker 2: I grew out of it.

175
00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:04,160
Speaker 3: I grew out of it. But also because I don't

176
00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:09,280
Speaker 3: like the thought of chewing essentially petroleum based. Yeah, I

177
00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:11,040
Speaker 3: think I'm just not really into that.

178
00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:13,240
Speaker 2: So I got out of it as well. Josie, it

179
00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:16,640
Speaker 2: felt like a natteralie, pointless exercise. There's no upside and

180
00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:17,800
Speaker 2: chewing gum what about you?

181
00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:20,360
Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, me too. And I used to like the

182
00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:22,920
Speaker 4: little foil stuff, but now it's like chewing car tires

183
00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:25,280
Speaker 4: parent It's the same sort of plastic. But also I

184
00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:27,960
Speaker 4: look at this and I go really like, bonds are dropping.

185
00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:31,440
Speaker 4: There's always things happening in the world, you know, It's like,

186
00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:34,280
Speaker 4: for goodness sake, is it safe or not safe? If

187
00:09:34,280 --> 00:09:36,360
Speaker 4: it's not safe, regulate it and don't sell it.

188
00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:37,480
Speaker 3: Don't regulate it.

189
00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:39,840
Speaker 2: God, you can an adult by yourself.

190
00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:41,920
Speaker 3: Can I just say? I think the bigger issue with

191
00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:44,480
Speaker 3: chewing gum these days is that you know there was

192
00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,480
Speaker 3: that old song. Does the chewing gum lose its flavor

193
00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:49,440
Speaker 3: on the bed post overnight? Well, within about five six

194
00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,880
Speaker 3: now of putting in a piece of gum. It's gone

195
00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:53,840
Speaker 3: so fixed the flavor.

196
00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:56,560
Speaker 4: By the old days, not like it was.

197
00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,120
Speaker 2: All right, Enjoy Tongua, stay safe. Thank you very much

198
00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:00,720
Speaker 2: for coming in. Trisha heard of this evening.

199
00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:04,440
Speaker 1: For more from Hither Duplessy, Allen Drive, listen live to

200
00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:07,559
Speaker 1: News Talks it B from four pm weekdays, or follow

201
00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:09,359
Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio