1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,320 Speaker 1: So let's get into the world of headspace, shall we 2 00:00:02,360 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: an elite performance? Gilbert and Oka, as the All Black's 3 00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 1: mental skills coach of course for years, retired from the 4 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:09,719 Speaker 1: team back in twenty three. Sinchmon with England's cricket or 5 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:12,440 Speaker 1: England Cricket and the new South Wales origin side as 6 00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:15,320 Speaker 1: well as Chelsea in the epl anyways book is called 7 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: Become Unstoppable. Gilbert Andoka is with us. 8 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:21,280 Speaker 2: Good morning, Good morning Mike, thanks for having me on 9 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:21,639 Speaker 2: the show. 10 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:25,239 Speaker 1: Great pleasure. Talk me through whether what you do is 11 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 1: age old. In other words, you subscribe today or prescribe 12 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 1: exactly what you did twenty years ago, or as your 13 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:33,520 Speaker 1: field evolved dramatically. 14 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:39,599 Speaker 2: Well, the underlying principles are the same. I you know, 15 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:43,479 Speaker 2: pressure wears a new face every season, every year, but 16 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:48,680 Speaker 2: the principles for managing and navigating your way through I 17 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 2: believe in timeless. And you know the ways of enabling 18 00:00:55,520 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 2: athletes to get better at handling pressure has evolved. The 19 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 2: principles of what you've got to do have been timeless. 20 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 1: Do you need to be open to the idea or 21 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 1: can you present to me something that is so obvious? 22 00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:11,399 Speaker 1: I can't help But implement it. 23 00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 2: Well. I think once you understand that, you don't get 24 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 2: an external shift unless you get an internal shift. So 25 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 2: if I want you to embrace something, then I've got 26 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 2: to move you internally. So in the early days when 27 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 2: we were getting people to look at the mental game 28 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 2: in the mental area, people had fixed mindsets. They weren't 29 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:33,959 Speaker 2: open to it, and so you needed to be able 30 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 2: to shift them, to break the frame, to make them 31 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 2: look at things in a different way. Once you do that, 32 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:42,440 Speaker 2: then you open the door and they become more receptive 33 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 2: to what you present. 34 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: See. What you've been doing is interesting, so so much 35 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 1: time with the All Blacks, but then you've also worked 36 00:01:47,760 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 1: with Lori daily in the Origin, you've gone with McCallum 37 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 1: at the cricket and with Chelsea. The EPL does it 38 00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:58,360 Speaker 1: very widely, depending on sport or level of sport or 39 00:01:58,480 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 1: type of sport. 40 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 2: People ask me that question and I quite often say 41 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 2: it's completely different but exactly the same. Every time you 42 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 2: walk into a group. The dynamics of the group are different, 43 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:17,520 Speaker 2: the principles aren't you know. Again, it's connecting with the individuals, 44 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:21,040 Speaker 2: getting them to respect and being open to you. But 45 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:23,920 Speaker 2: in the end, what we're aiming to do is to 46 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:26,640 Speaker 2: give them skill sets that enable them to be reliable 47 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 2: under pressure, because what we hate in sport at any 48 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 2: level is unpredictability. And so whether it's cricket, whether it's football, 49 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:37,480 Speaker 2: whether it's league, whether it's union, when the heat comes 50 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:40,679 Speaker 2: on and you are tested, we need you to be reliable. 51 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 2: And if you're not, your reliability and it won't last long. 52 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: How different is it within a team, within the team environment, 53 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 1: where you would have vastly experienced people who have heard you, 54 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:54,160 Speaker 1: listen to you, applied their own pieces of information for pressure, 55 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:56,160 Speaker 1: versus the guy who's just been selected yesterday. 56 00:02:57,919 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 2: I think it's you know that the crazy thing about 57 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 2: this area is that it's not something that you really 58 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 2: really get great at. You've got to keep working at it, 59 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:09,360 Speaker 2: and the things that didn't provide an issue to you 60 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 2: last week, last month, last year sometimes can So it's 61 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 2: a skill set that's constantly evolving, and it's an area 62 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:22,640 Speaker 2: that people have got to give attention to and once 63 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,359 Speaker 2: they do and they move into it, then they can 64 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:26,600 Speaker 2: get advancement with it. 65 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,000 Speaker 1: How long does it take? Because I know, for example, 66 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:31,800 Speaker 1: origins are here now it's only on for a very 67 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:34,239 Speaker 1: short period of time. I mean your contract for example, 68 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 1: at the moment of Chelsea. Do you need time to 69 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: make it work? 70 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 2: Yes? I think you know if you apply it to 71 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:47,040 Speaker 2: the same as a skill set, you know, it's an area. 72 00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 2: It's like your strength and conditioning, it's like the nutrition. 73 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 2: It's a performance enhancement area, you know, like I've earned 74 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:57,520 Speaker 2: in my work that you know, people say you've got 75 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 2: to rise above pressure, and you will know from the 76 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 2: book where we I challenge that paradigm a little bit 77 00:04:03,160 --> 00:04:06,200 Speaker 2: to say that everyone's saying precious a privilege and you've 78 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 2: got to walk towards it, and you've got to do that. 79 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 2: But I've learned that you've just got to work inside it. 80 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 2: You accept it as a lifestyle and you don't try 81 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 2: and rise above it. You get inside the bubble and 82 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 2: you get comfortable exploring and navigating your way around it. Well, 83 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:23,040 Speaker 2: once you do that, then it's a skill set you've 84 00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:26,000 Speaker 2: got to develop every day, because your skill sets won't 85 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 2: work if your mindset it's not right. And that won't 86 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 2: just come about purely because you're a human being and 87 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,159 Speaker 2: you're in a team or you're in a room with 88 00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 2: other people, so you know, application to enhancing your ability 89 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,240 Speaker 2: in these areas is an absolute must if you want 90 00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 2: to actually achieve all you're capable of. 91 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 1: Okay, Chelsea, I'm really interested in Gilbert because in the 92 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:51,279 Speaker 1: sense it's most I would have thought cultural thing. Often 93 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:53,720 Speaker 1: language must be an issue. You're dealing with guys too, 94 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: at a level of money finance that's not seen in 95 00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 1: this country. It's really, I guess, a different world. Does 96 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 1: it feel different and therefore does what you do need 97 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 1: to be different? 98 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:07,960 Speaker 2: Absolutely? Look, I've I had a period with them. I'm 99 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 2: no longer with them now because it's just you need 100 00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 2: to be over there living inside the bubble to do 101 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 2: the job effectively, and I haven't got the tide to 102 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:19,560 Speaker 2: do that. But when I went in there, there were 103 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 2: thirteen different languages. During my time there. They've been through 104 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 2: five different coaches, and so when they go they just 105 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 2: spit everyone else out with them, and so a whole 106 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 2: new crew starts and if the players no good, they 107 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 2: just spit him out and spend one hundred million buying 108 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:39,039 Speaker 2: somebody else. And I said to the owner, Todd Bowley, 109 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:42,640 Speaker 2: I said, the first EPL team that adopts an all 110 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 2: black esque type culture, we'll get a significant advantage inside 111 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:50,400 Speaker 2: the EPL. And from my observation, no one has really 112 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:53,240 Speaker 2: taken up the mantra or taken up the challenge of 113 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 2: doing that. But it's a world of opportunity for someone 114 00:05:56,760 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 2: to walk through that door and to open it up 115 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 2: and to make the most of it. 116 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: And when you said an all black type mantra, one, 117 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 1: did they know what that meant? And two for us, 118 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: what does it mean? 119 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 2: Well, they certainly know what it is. It's the brand 120 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 2: that's universal. You know, Like I got up in front 121 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 2: of the players and spoke several times to them and 122 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:23,040 Speaker 2: there wasn't a person in the room there that didn't 123 00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 2: know who the all Blacks work. And you know, the 124 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 2: all black esque type culture is where they still the 125 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:31,560 Speaker 2: all Blacks don't have their name on the back of 126 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:34,720 Speaker 2: the jersey. You know every other sports team does. They 127 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 2: don't have their name on the back of the jersey 128 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 2: because no one owns it. Their job is to fill it, 129 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:42,599 Speaker 2: to fill it with honor and so that it pays 130 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:45,359 Speaker 2: respects to those people that have gone before them and 131 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 2: sets an example for those that follow. And when you 132 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 2: understand that the team towers above the individual and that 133 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 2: while me can serve. We we then strengthens me and 134 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:00,120 Speaker 2: you get that circular motion right, and then all of 135 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:03,039 Speaker 2: a sudden you're creating something that is greater than the 136 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 2: individual parts. And that's the uniqueness and the specialness of 137 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 2: the All Black culture, and it lingers long after you've 138 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 2: finished playing and being involved with the sport. 139 00:07:14,320 --> 00:07:17,080 Speaker 1: Is there an impediment though, because at least part of 140 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 1: the all Black story is about patriotism in a country. 141 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:22,760 Speaker 1: Chelsea's not about patriotism. Chelsea's about a club. 142 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 2: Yes it is, and I think and that's where you know, 143 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 2: driving the personal motives about what's important to you. You know, 144 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 2: I've always felt any victory without character has been hollow. 145 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 2: And once an individual understands that their own character is 146 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 2: defining and what they do inside the team or organization 147 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 2: they're working with is an expression of their culture, then 148 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 2: it does create its own legacy. So you know, wherever 149 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 2: I go, I want to do my best inside that 150 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 2: specific area. And the greatest teams buying around something bigger 151 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:03,000 Speaker 2: than themselves. But we understand that in today's day and age, 152 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:07,640 Speaker 2: me's important. Personal branding and all that is terrific, but 153 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,480 Speaker 2: you can get so much more if you allow that 154 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:13,320 Speaker 2: to serve something bigger than yourself, and then at the 155 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:15,440 Speaker 2: same time that thing that's bigger than you will actually 156 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 2: make you even better now, So you know there's merit 157 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 2: for those that I tell you a lot got it. 158 00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 2: You know if guys like Reece James and people like 159 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 2: that inside that bubble that they get it. It's just 160 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 2: that if everything's fluid, like the loaners are changing and 161 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 2: the coaches are changing, it's damn hard to get the 162 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 2: stability you need to give yourself a foundation. 163 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 1: What I would and this is not a personal session 164 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:44,560 Speaker 1: for me, what I reckon I would under have real 165 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 1: trouble with is the outside stuff I can't control. Like 166 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 1: I don't mind being part of a team that's good, 167 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 1: but I look around and go that guy's a dickhead 168 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 1: and they keep changing the coach and the owners are 169 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,079 Speaker 1: more on And that's what I would struggle with. How 170 00:08:57,080 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 1: do I buy into that the stuff I can't fix? 171 00:09:01,400 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 2: Well, you know that that's a great comment, Like it's 172 00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:07,199 Speaker 2: in all my years of working with all these different sports. 173 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:10,040 Speaker 2: It's unwinnable if it's not right at the top. So 174 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,600 Speaker 2: that's the first thing, you know, it's unwinnable in a family, 175 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 2: it's unwinnable in a classroom, it's unwulnable in a sports team. 176 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 2: And then you know, the whole notion of you know 177 00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:25,800 Speaker 2: that of talking about being unstoppable is understand understanding that 178 00:09:25,840 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 2: you work on the things that that you that no 179 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 2: one else can control. The two things that other people 180 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 2: can't take away from you. One is your character and 181 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 2: two as your mindset. And so you'll only win when 182 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:40,760 Speaker 2: your mind is stronger than your emotions. So for you 183 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 2: and for us experiencing sport and life, we can't stop 184 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 2: our emotions that happen all the time. So what we 185 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:49,120 Speaker 2: have to do is we have to get better at 186 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:52,160 Speaker 2: managing our responses to those to the things we can't control. 187 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:54,960 Speaker 2: So in a rugby game, when somebody brasses us off 188 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 2: or does something illegal, we don't we don't want to 189 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 2: punch them in the head because that causes problems. And 190 00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 2: so for Mike hosting, we've got to understand what are 191 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:08,559 Speaker 2: the things that that rise raise your emotions and how 192 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 2: can we help you to ensure that your mind can 193 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 2: get some degree of control over them. That that's that's 194 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:19,000 Speaker 2: that's the challenge. It's the duel. The jewel is the 195 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 2: battle between your emotions and your mind. And once you 196 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 2: win that battle, then you'll win more of those moments 197 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 2: than you'll lose them. 198 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 1: Can you still could you do it with Rory mcelroyal 199 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: Djokovic as an individualist with no real team per se. 200 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 2: Well, absolutely, they can teach us a lot too, by 201 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 2: the way, you know they I marvel at some of 202 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 2: the things. I hear them say they get it, but no, 203 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,080 Speaker 2: but it's not an end point, you know, like it's 204 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:46,960 Speaker 2: you know, some people with can be I can handle 205 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:49,079 Speaker 2: pressure really well today, but in the next game and 206 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 2: the same situation, I can't. So it's ever evolving. I've 207 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 2: had lots of conversations with body over the years, with 208 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:58,079 Speaker 2: Rory because he's a great mate of his and saying 209 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 2: the one area he needs work on, mates area, and 210 00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 2: and I think that he could, he could really be 211 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:09,160 Speaker 2: a superstar, And I think he's had conversations. But it's 212 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 2: it's applying it like you do other areas that you 213 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,320 Speaker 2: work on it as a skill set, not just as 214 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:18,040 Speaker 2: a motivational pep talk. And you know you've got to 215 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:20,600 Speaker 2: you've got to lay yourself down, You've got to you 216 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 2: can't train what you won't talk about. So we've got 217 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 2: to get these athletes to talk about the things that 218 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 2: cause problems for them, issues for them, struggles for them 219 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:32,520 Speaker 2: that test them, that stretch them. Once we identify those, 220 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:33,480 Speaker 2: we can then train. 221 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 1: Them and we can and that we can presumably apply 222 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: this to the country as a whole. Can't we? 223 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:43,960 Speaker 2: Absolutely? You know, it's a When I first started in 224 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 2: this area, and you would have noticed, you know, from 225 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 2: the book, it was it was sort of a poohood subject. 226 00:11:51,160 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 2: I always called himself the ugly duckling, and everyone accepted 227 00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 2: all the other disciplines, but not this one. This one 228 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 2: was considered if you're worked in this area, your week. 229 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 2: And I still think that does pervade a lot of 230 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 2: the landscape, Mike. You know, I think it's a lot 231 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 2: of people think that if you need work and you 232 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: need to strengthen your mental gain, that there is a 233 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 2: weakness in you. But Grichy, I'd love to see it 234 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 2: toward as a curriculum, you know, like somebody has Actually 235 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 2: you know, I always told people I got on the 236 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 2: all black bus fifteen minutes before they went to training 237 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 2: or a game. I went to meetings fifteen minutes before 238 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:28,680 Speaker 2: they came to a meeting, and all I did is 239 00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:30,440 Speaker 2: looked at the door. So when they came in, I 240 00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:33,440 Speaker 2: wanted to know where are you at today? Because I 241 00:12:33,440 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 2: can't move anyone unless I get that right. And that 242 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,400 Speaker 2: changes every day, changes when we walk home at night 243 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 2: into classrooms. So I think it is applicable right across 244 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 2: the board. 245 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:45,760 Speaker 1: Fantastic, Well, good luck with the book. Great to talk 246 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 1: with you, and I appreciate your time very much. 247 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:51,800 Speaker 2: Thanks Mike, enjoy your show and enjoy your perspectives, and 248 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:53,400 Speaker 2: thanks for the conversation. 249 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 1: You're with an okap. 250 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 2: For more from the Mike Asking Breakfast, listen live to 251 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 2: news talks it'd be from six am weekdays, or follow 252 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:02,040 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.