1
00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,427
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine

2
00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:12,787
Speaker 1: from Newstalk zedb SO.

3
00:00:12,947 --> 00:00:15,387
Speaker 2: News broke late on Thursday evening New Zealand Time that

4
00:00:15,427 --> 00:00:18,547
Speaker 2: Liam Lawson has been demoted from the Red Bull Formula

5
00:00:18,587 --> 00:00:22,187
Speaker 2: One team, confirming widespread speculation in the early part of

6
00:00:22,187 --> 00:00:24,907
Speaker 2: the week. Liam Lawson lasted just two Grand Prix behind

7
00:00:24,947 --> 00:00:28,427
Speaker 2: the wheel Melbourne and Shanghai, after winning the race to

8
00:00:28,467 --> 00:00:31,467
Speaker 2: partner defending champion Max for Stappin at the end of

9
00:00:31,547 --> 00:00:35,147
Speaker 2: last year. He's been replaced by Japanese driver Yuki Sonoda

10
00:00:35,467 --> 00:00:39,107
Speaker 2: for his home event next weekend at Suzuka, less than

11
00:00:39,147 --> 00:00:42,627
Speaker 2: one hundred days after he was signed, so Lawso will

12
00:00:42,707 --> 00:00:45,947
Speaker 2: joined the Racing Bulls team and race for them. Team

13
00:00:46,147 --> 00:00:50,267
Speaker 2: principal Christian Horner says watching Liam Lawson's struggle has been

14
00:00:50,307 --> 00:00:53,707
Speaker 2: difficult and they've decided to make the switch early to

15
00:00:53,827 --> 00:00:57,507
Speaker 2: help him develop. There are widespread reports that Max for

16
00:00:57,587 --> 00:01:01,187
Speaker 2: Stappin himself does not agree with the decision. Red Bull

17
00:01:01,307 --> 00:01:06,107
Speaker 2: Motorsport advisor Helmet Marco has confirmed that Barry Tomlinson has

18
00:01:06,107 --> 00:01:08,827
Speaker 2: found under of the Toyota Racing Series, which many of

19
00:01:08,827 --> 00:01:12,707
Speaker 2: our top drivers, including Liam Lawson, raced in Barry, thanks

20
00:01:12,707 --> 00:01:14,907
Speaker 2: for joining us on weekend Sport. Before we get into

21
00:01:14,947 --> 00:01:18,187
Speaker 2: some specifics, what did you make of this decision by

22
00:01:18,267 --> 00:01:20,467
Speaker 2: Red Ball in general terms?

23
00:01:21,627 --> 00:01:29,107
Speaker 3: Very good morning, Jason. Well it's actually afternoon, isn't it. Yeah. Look, yeah,

24
00:01:29,147 --> 00:01:31,507
Speaker 3: of course, like most of the New Zealand, we're you know,

25
00:01:31,547 --> 00:01:34,667
Speaker 3: in a state of shock as to you know, why

26
00:01:35,507 --> 00:01:38,427
Speaker 3: this has happened. But you know, I guess most of

27
00:01:38,507 --> 00:01:40,707
Speaker 3: us would also know, you know, if we follow the

28
00:01:40,747 --> 00:01:43,147
Speaker 3: sport that you know, we saw Liam at the first

29
00:01:43,187 --> 00:01:48,987
Speaker 3: two rounds enduring some pretty difficult situations that frankly, you know,

30
00:01:49,027 --> 00:01:52,867
Speaker 3: would to test the world did test is confidence? And

31
00:01:52,987 --> 00:01:54,787
Speaker 3: you know, so it's just one of the things that

32
00:01:55,227 --> 00:01:57,027
Speaker 3: have happened unfortunately.

33
00:01:57,067 --> 00:01:59,787
Speaker 2: Two races though Barry was he given long enough?

34
00:02:02,667 --> 00:02:05,987
Speaker 3: No in terms of not long enough. But if we

35
00:02:06,027 --> 00:02:09,627
Speaker 3: go back a step, Jason, I think you know what

36
00:02:09,667 --> 00:02:14,227
Speaker 3: they've done by making this move. Really Red Bull have

37
00:02:14,307 --> 00:02:17,147
Speaker 3: admitted that they probably made an era last year by

38
00:02:17,147 --> 00:02:20,667
Speaker 3: putting Daniel in the car for that first part of

39
00:02:20,667 --> 00:02:23,747
Speaker 3: the season in twenty twenty four and stood Liam down.

40
00:02:24,067 --> 00:02:26,987
Speaker 3: And I think you know, when you look backwards, that's

41
00:02:27,027 --> 00:02:30,267
Speaker 3: the big era that Red Bull made, you know, because

42
00:02:30,707 --> 00:02:34,707
Speaker 3: Daniel obviously did Melbourne, he did all early tracks and

43
00:02:34,747 --> 00:02:38,747
Speaker 3: while Liam sat on the sidelines and really suffered for

44
00:02:38,867 --> 00:02:42,587
Speaker 3: not having the opportunity to gain the experience in a

45
00:02:43,147 --> 00:02:46,027
Speaker 3: less pressured environment. And then of course the step them

46
00:02:46,027 --> 00:02:49,827
Speaker 3: into this highly pressured environment with a four time world champion,

47
00:02:50,347 --> 00:02:53,307
Speaker 3: a driver that's been in the sport for ten years,

48
00:02:53,627 --> 00:02:57,667
Speaker 3: driving in the same team is very very high pressure.

49
00:02:57,747 --> 00:03:00,787
Speaker 3: So you know, it was very difficult for Liam to

50
00:03:01,187 --> 00:03:03,867
Speaker 3: step in there on tracks that he didn't know in

51
00:03:03,867 --> 00:03:06,587
Speaker 3: a car that was, you know, they've obviously admitted now

52
00:03:06,707 --> 00:03:10,787
Speaker 3: is extremely difficult to drive and very much centered around,

53
00:03:11,267 --> 00:03:13,547
Speaker 3: you know, the driving style of Max, which is a

54
00:03:13,747 --> 00:03:17,587
Speaker 3: very you know, different driving style to probably most racing

55
00:03:17,667 --> 00:03:18,587
Speaker 3: driver's preference.

56
00:03:19,267 --> 00:03:20,347
Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to pick up on a couple of

57
00:03:20,387 --> 00:03:24,227
Speaker 2: comments there, including including the car itself. But we're we're

58
00:03:24,307 --> 00:03:27,027
Speaker 2: red bull right to give Liam the full time seat

59
00:03:27,227 --> 00:03:27,827
Speaker 2: for this year.

60
00:03:29,027 --> 00:03:31,147
Speaker 3: Well obviously, you know, if we look at it, no,

61
00:03:32,187 --> 00:03:35,027
Speaker 3: you know, if you know with what's happened, you know

62
00:03:35,107 --> 00:03:37,107
Speaker 3: you'd have to say no, they weren't right to give

63
00:03:37,107 --> 00:03:41,507
Speaker 3: it to them, you know, he look, it's a high

64
00:03:41,507 --> 00:03:45,267
Speaker 3: performance sport, Jason, and in the end, you know, Liam's

65
00:03:45,267 --> 00:03:49,587
Speaker 3: been thrown into the deep end really and you know

66
00:03:49,667 --> 00:03:52,707
Speaker 3: it's it's it's not worked. And I think also important

67
00:03:52,907 --> 00:03:56,387
Speaker 3: to remember that, you know, unfortunately in Melbourne f P Three,

68
00:03:56,507 --> 00:03:59,347
Speaker 3: for Liam, he sat in the in the in the garage,

69
00:03:59,627 --> 00:04:05,027
Speaker 3: and that particular practice session on the Saturday morning really

70
00:04:05,427 --> 00:04:09,907
Speaker 3: instigated Limb's lies. And I think also you know that

71
00:04:10,027 --> 00:04:13,427
Speaker 3: you know, doctor Marco's kind of intimated the same thing

72
00:04:13,507 --> 00:04:17,067
Speaker 3: that you know to sit out that session, which was

73
00:04:17,147 --> 00:04:20,267
Speaker 3: so important because that's where you know, build confidence, find

74
00:04:20,307 --> 00:04:22,987
Speaker 3: the speed to go into that first qualifying session. And

75
00:04:23,027 --> 00:04:25,867
Speaker 3: it didn't didn't work for Liam, you know, sitting in

76
00:04:25,907 --> 00:04:28,587
Speaker 3: the garage. So there's a whole bunch of things that

77
00:04:28,667 --> 00:04:31,427
Speaker 3: can spied against Limb unfortunately.

78
00:04:31,187 --> 00:04:35,067
Speaker 2: Indeed, and many beyond his control. He hasn't even driven

79
00:04:35,147 --> 00:04:37,907
Speaker 2: yet Barry on a track that he knows. That opportunity

80
00:04:37,907 --> 00:04:40,467
Speaker 2: would have come next weekend and will still come in

81
00:04:40,507 --> 00:04:42,587
Speaker 2: the racing balls car. Why wouldn't they have given him

82
00:04:42,627 --> 00:04:45,507
Speaker 2: a chance to at least race in Japan a track

83
00:04:45,547 --> 00:04:46,107
Speaker 2: that he knows.

84
00:04:47,507 --> 00:04:51,147
Speaker 3: I think also importantly Jason, that you know, yes, the

85
00:04:51,187 --> 00:04:54,147
Speaker 3: word demoted has been used, but we've got to remember

86
00:04:54,187 --> 00:04:56,947
Speaker 3: he's not been demoted to a back of the Grid team.

87
00:04:57,147 --> 00:05:01,067
Speaker 3: So you know, I say, you know, yes, it's difficult, Yes,

88
00:05:01,267 --> 00:05:04,267
Speaker 3: you know it would be nice to have been quite different.

89
00:05:04,387 --> 00:05:06,947
Speaker 3: But and again he has the opportun unity to go

90
00:05:07,027 --> 00:05:10,507
Speaker 3: into really what effectively is last year's Red Bull you know,

91
00:05:10,667 --> 00:05:13,347
Speaker 3: RB twenty. A lot of the parts that are on that,

92
00:05:13,627 --> 00:05:17,587
Speaker 3: you know RB twenty are now on the current Racing

93
00:05:17,667 --> 00:05:20,987
Speaker 3: Bulls car. So you know, in the end he's moved

94
00:05:20,987 --> 00:05:25,347
Speaker 3: to a very competitive team, proved by the qualifying results

95
00:05:25,387 --> 00:05:27,667
Speaker 3: in the first two rounds by Yuki and by you know,

96
00:05:28,227 --> 00:05:33,147
Speaker 3: Hazar Hedger. So in the end, you know, you've got

97
00:05:33,147 --> 00:05:35,627
Speaker 3: a great opportunity in a very competitive car to score

98
00:05:35,667 --> 00:05:37,547
Speaker 3: a lot of points this year. And I think let's

99
00:05:37,547 --> 00:05:39,507
Speaker 3: look at the positives on that side, and I think

100
00:05:39,587 --> 00:05:42,107
Speaker 3: probably with a little bit of thought. You know, I

101
00:05:42,147 --> 00:05:44,587
Speaker 3: know that Limb would have been very down about the decision,

102
00:05:44,667 --> 00:05:47,067
Speaker 3: but now I think he'll be on the up and

103
00:05:47,107 --> 00:05:51,187
Speaker 3: he'll be looking forward to going forward and being showing

104
00:05:51,227 --> 00:05:53,867
Speaker 3: why he deserves a top role in the future.

105
00:05:54,267 --> 00:05:57,267
Speaker 2: Oh, no doubt. And you've led me into the next

106
00:05:57,307 --> 00:05:58,667
Speaker 2: thing I was going to ask you about, and that

107
00:05:58,747 --> 00:06:01,787
Speaker 2: is whether Liam could actually drive better in the Racing

108
00:06:01,787 --> 00:06:04,027
Speaker 2: Balls team. I know he hasn't done you know, any

109
00:06:04,027 --> 00:06:06,347
Speaker 2: good in the in the Red Bull car only too races,

110
00:06:06,427 --> 00:06:09,467
Speaker 2: but could he be better inside an environment with lease

111
00:06:09,547 --> 00:06:14,427
Speaker 2: pressure and the chance to rebuild some confidence one and

112
00:06:14,667 --> 00:06:15,187
Speaker 2: you know, I.

113
00:06:15,147 --> 00:06:18,107
Speaker 3: Think, you know, it's it's well proven. The Racing Balls

114
00:06:18,107 --> 00:06:21,307
Speaker 3: car is highly competitive, certainly in qualifying and even in

115
00:06:21,347 --> 00:06:24,347
Speaker 3: the race. I think it's doing, you know, done very well.

116
00:06:24,627 --> 00:06:27,627
Speaker 3: The other part is that the Racing Balls team is

117
00:06:27,707 --> 00:06:30,907
Speaker 3: run by Lawrence Mecki. Now Mecky came. He's had a

118
00:06:31,067 --> 00:06:34,227
Speaker 3: very long career in junior formula with young drivers and

119
00:06:34,267 --> 00:06:37,827
Speaker 3: then before going to Racing Balls was the Ferrari if

120
00:06:37,867 --> 00:06:40,507
Speaker 3: one team is a sporting director. He worked with a

121
00:06:40,507 --> 00:06:44,547
Speaker 3: lot of young drivers at Junior Drivers in Ferrari to

122
00:06:44,667 --> 00:06:48,387
Speaker 3: work with some drivers, one of which was Brendan Hartley.

123
00:06:48,507 --> 00:06:51,307
Speaker 3: Brendan not well probably not well known, but Brendan drove

124
00:06:51,387 --> 00:06:54,827
Speaker 3: the Ferrari if one simulator for a season in his

125
00:06:55,227 --> 00:06:59,147
Speaker 3: time after you know, his various career changes, but as

126
00:06:59,227 --> 00:07:02,067
Speaker 3: part of his roles so you know, Lawrence will will

127
00:07:02,147 --> 00:07:05,067
Speaker 3: really help along with the engineers who are used to

128
00:07:05,147 --> 00:07:08,507
Speaker 3: working with young drivers, but they will really helped Liam

129
00:07:08,587 --> 00:07:11,427
Speaker 3: and get around them give him opportunity to show that

130
00:07:11,467 --> 00:07:13,747
Speaker 3: he actually, you know, a world class driver.

131
00:07:14,747 --> 00:07:17,347
Speaker 2: The Red Bull card clearly set up for Max Vistappen

132
00:07:17,467 --> 00:07:21,587
Speaker 2: and clearly very difficult to drive. Will Yuki Sanoda be

133
00:07:21,707 --> 00:07:23,867
Speaker 2: able to drive it any better than Liam Lawson's been

134
00:07:23,907 --> 00:07:24,267
Speaker 2: able to?

135
00:07:25,587 --> 00:07:28,067
Speaker 3: Well, you know, Yuki's made a lot of comment, isn't he.

136
00:07:28,307 --> 00:07:31,027
Speaker 3: You know, he's ended his fifth season in Formula One,

137
00:07:31,027 --> 00:07:34,147
Speaker 3: and I think that's important to understand as well. You know,

138
00:07:34,227 --> 00:07:38,067
Speaker 3: Liam has done eleven twelve Grand Prix and Yuki's done

139
00:07:38,827 --> 00:07:42,747
Speaker 3: well and his five fifth season now, so you know,

140
00:07:43,067 --> 00:07:45,867
Speaker 3: Yuki has been thrown into the deep end, and now

141
00:07:45,947 --> 00:07:47,947
Speaker 3: he has to show that he is a world class

142
00:07:48,027 --> 00:07:51,707
Speaker 3: driver capable of being a teammate to Max Vstappen. Look,

143
00:07:51,907 --> 00:07:55,267
Speaker 3: he's had a lot more experience in various set up cars.

144
00:07:55,667 --> 00:07:58,627
Speaker 3: He will have probably a little bit more skill and

145
00:07:58,747 --> 00:08:01,147
Speaker 3: knowledge on how to get the best out of the

146
00:08:01,187 --> 00:08:03,707
Speaker 3: car that Max, you know, drives. And I know now

147
00:08:03,827 --> 00:08:08,627
Speaker 3: I believe that Red Bull looking to set up the

148
00:08:08,667 --> 00:08:11,827
Speaker 3: second car in a different way than they do Maxis,

149
00:08:11,907 --> 00:08:14,587
Speaker 3: which is a new thing for Red Bull. I've always

150
00:08:14,627 --> 00:08:17,147
Speaker 3: i think, really followed Maxis set up the whole way.

151
00:08:17,347 --> 00:08:21,107
Speaker 3: So I think we'll find in Japan, that Max will

152
00:08:21,107 --> 00:08:24,427
Speaker 3: have his car, which I know you know is being developed.

153
00:08:24,907 --> 00:08:28,547
Speaker 3: You know, in the week weeks since the last Grand Prix,

154
00:08:28,627 --> 00:08:32,467
Speaker 3: they will be furiously frantically developed trying to redevelop that

155
00:08:32,507 --> 00:08:34,627
Speaker 3: car because in the end it's probably the fourth best

156
00:08:34,747 --> 00:08:37,627
Speaker 3: car at the moment, and the second car with Yuki

157
00:08:37,667 --> 00:08:40,667
Speaker 3: in it will be probably running quite a different setup

158
00:08:40,827 --> 00:08:43,227
Speaker 3: and I think, you know, so it'll be very interesting

159
00:08:43,267 --> 00:08:46,747
Speaker 3: to see how that goes. And you know, time will

160
00:08:46,787 --> 00:08:48,107
Speaker 3: tell on that one. Jason.

161
00:08:49,147 --> 00:08:52,347
Speaker 2: Red Bull have never promoted a driver back into the

162
00:08:52,387 --> 00:08:56,107
Speaker 2: top team that they have previously demoted. Can you see

163
00:08:56,147 --> 00:08:59,787
Speaker 2: a scenario under which Liam Lawson drives for Red Bull again?

164
00:09:01,867 --> 00:09:05,507
Speaker 3: Look, the fact is, you know that Max will leave

165
00:09:05,907 --> 00:09:08,507
Speaker 3: Red Bull at some point. There's just you know, in

166
00:09:08,787 --> 00:09:10,947
Speaker 3: the end, Max has been ten years at red Bull,

167
00:09:12,027 --> 00:09:16,107
Speaker 3: you know, as with Lewis Hamilton, Max will look for

168
00:09:16,187 --> 00:09:20,267
Speaker 3: new opportunities and so at some stage Red Bull need

169
00:09:20,307 --> 00:09:22,987
Speaker 3: two quality drivers to be able to step into the

170
00:09:23,107 --> 00:09:25,867
Speaker 3: Nimbu team. So if Limb can show that he's a

171
00:09:25,867 --> 00:09:28,227
Speaker 3: world class drug, which we all in New Zealand believe

172
00:09:28,267 --> 00:09:31,307
Speaker 3: he is, by going to racing balls doing a really

173
00:09:31,347 --> 00:09:35,387
Speaker 3: good job this year and importantly beating his teammate, then

174
00:09:35,707 --> 00:09:39,107
Speaker 3: absolutely they will promote him back into that Red Bull

175
00:09:39,187 --> 00:09:41,787
Speaker 3: team at some stage. There's just no doubt in my mind.

176
00:09:42,667 --> 00:09:45,187
Speaker 2: Very interesting, Barry, thanks so much for learning us your expertise.

177
00:09:45,387 --> 00:09:46,947
Speaker 2: I've learned a lot. Thanks for taking the time for

178
00:09:46,947 --> 00:09:47,907
Speaker 2: the chat this afternoon.

179
00:09:48,627 --> 00:09:50,387
Speaker 3: My nsure, Jason, thank you very much.

180
00:09:50,627 --> 00:09:53,707
Speaker 2: All the best, mate, Barry Tomlins in there. It's Barry Tomlinson,

181
00:09:53,747 --> 00:09:56,667
Speaker 2: the founder of the Toyota Racing Series with some really

182
00:09:56,707 --> 00:09:59,707
Speaker 2: interesting thoughts. There a good insight as well. Keen to

183
00:10:00,427 --> 00:10:02,707
Speaker 2: hear your views now. As I said, your chance to react.

184
00:10:02,987 --> 00:10:05,147
Speaker 2: Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighty. I'm sure you've

185
00:10:05,347 --> 00:10:09,947
Speaker 2: read and listened to plenty of reaction to this. What

186
00:10:09,987 --> 00:10:12,547
Speaker 2: Red Ball have done to Liam Lawson, for me is

187
00:10:12,587 --> 00:10:17,427
Speaker 2: an absolute disgrace. He's been given an opportunity to be

188
00:10:17,467 --> 00:10:20,467
Speaker 2: the second driver in their team and has been given

189
00:10:21,667 --> 00:10:27,067
Speaker 2: almost zero support whatsoever and now demoted with Yuki Sonoda

190
00:10:27,107 --> 00:10:30,307
Speaker 2: given that seat. Now, you will not convince me, and

191
00:10:30,347 --> 00:10:32,467
Speaker 2: of course I stand to be corrected, but you will

192
00:10:32,467 --> 00:10:34,707
Speaker 2: not convince me Yuki Sonoda is a better driver than

193
00:10:34,747 --> 00:10:38,227
Speaker 2: Liam Lawson. Lawson was put in that seat for a

194
00:10:38,307 --> 00:10:42,827
Speaker 2: number of reasons, one of which is his mental resilience,

195
00:10:43,387 --> 00:10:44,747
Speaker 2: and he is going to need all of that hours.

196
00:10:44,787 --> 00:10:47,427
Speaker 2: He tries to bounce back from this in many ways.

197
00:10:47,467 --> 00:10:49,227
Speaker 2: As I said to Barry, the pressure comes off. Now

198
00:10:49,587 --> 00:10:52,667
Speaker 2: he goes into the Racing Balls team. Yuki Sonoda, though,

199
00:10:52,787 --> 00:10:54,667
Speaker 2: isn't going to be able to drive a car that's

200
00:10:54,987 --> 00:10:57,907
Speaker 2: set up for Maxvstappen any better than Liam Lawson can.

201
00:10:58,307 --> 00:11:01,187
Speaker 2: Interesting to hear Bowry say, then Red Ball are now

202
00:11:01,227 --> 00:11:03,107
Speaker 2: looking to set that car up differently. Well, that would

203
00:11:03,107 --> 00:11:07,467
Speaker 2: have been helpful for Liam, wouldn't it. Two races on

204
00:11:07,667 --> 00:11:10,227
Speaker 2: unfamiliar tracks, one of which was in the pouring rain

205
00:11:10,267 --> 00:11:14,347
Speaker 2: in Melbourne. It's far too small a sample size for

206
00:11:14,427 --> 00:11:17,587
Speaker 2: his driving to be accurately assessed. And we're about to

207
00:11:17,587 --> 00:11:21,187
Speaker 2: get to Japan, a track he actually knows, and I've

208
00:11:21,267 --> 00:11:25,547
Speaker 2: taken the keys off him. Look, he'll recuperate, he'll bounce back.

209
00:11:25,587 --> 00:11:28,427
Speaker 2: He is resilient and no doubt he'll drive well for

210
00:11:28,547 --> 00:11:32,507
Speaker 2: Racing Balls. But it paints Red Ball in an absolutely

211
00:11:32,987 --> 00:11:37,147
Speaker 2: appalling light. Yes, I know they are massive results drive

212
00:11:37,187 --> 00:11:41,387
Speaker 2: an organization, but they have been utterly negligent in their

213
00:11:41,467 --> 00:11:43,667
Speaker 2: duty of care to Liam Lawson. And this is where

214
00:11:44,227 --> 00:11:49,947
Speaker 2: we now are in an elite sporting landscape of instant gratification.

215
00:11:50,067 --> 00:11:53,547
Speaker 2: We have lost any ability, any ability at all to

216
00:11:53,547 --> 00:11:58,627
Speaker 2: be patient. Imagine if you opened a restaurant and after

217
00:11:58,667 --> 00:12:00,307
Speaker 2: a couple of nights you didn't get the tables as

218
00:12:00,347 --> 00:12:04,587
Speaker 2: full as you wanted, so you sacked the chef. Things

219
00:12:04,707 --> 00:12:07,787
Speaker 2: take time. You cannot Some say okay, well he's had

220
00:12:07,787 --> 00:12:10,187
Speaker 2: a couple of races, hasn't done the job. We're dropping in. Well,

221
00:12:10,227 --> 00:12:11,987
Speaker 2: they have done that, but it's not the right thing

222
00:12:12,027 --> 00:12:13,827
Speaker 2: to do. You might have listened to Mark Webber on

223
00:12:13,827 --> 00:12:16,507
Speaker 2: the radio with me last week. In the first seven

224
00:12:16,787 --> 00:12:20,787
Speaker 2: years of Mark Weber's Grand Prix career, he made the

225
00:12:20,787 --> 00:12:25,427
Speaker 2: podium twice. In the next five years he made the

226
00:12:25,427 --> 00:12:29,707
Speaker 2: podium forty times, forty four to zero. It takes time.

227
00:12:30,667 --> 00:12:33,307
Speaker 2: Red Ball have been shown here to have absolutely no

228
00:12:33,467 --> 00:12:36,947
Speaker 2: patience at all, and I know they're under pressure, but

229
00:12:37,027 --> 00:12:39,947
Speaker 2: we've lost the ability across a lot of elite sport

230
00:12:40,027 --> 00:12:43,387
Speaker 2: to just hover above things, take a breath and say, actually,

231
00:12:43,827 --> 00:12:45,427
Speaker 2: this is going to take a bit of time. Imagine

232
00:12:45,427 --> 00:12:47,747
Speaker 2: if we've got rid of Sir Graham Henry after the

233
00:12:47,787 --> 00:12:50,387
Speaker 2: two thousand and seven Rugby World Cup, we never would

234
00:12:50,387 --> 00:12:52,027
Speaker 2: have had twenty eleven, he never would have been Sir

235
00:12:52,107 --> 00:12:56,227
Speaker 2: Graham Henry. Same goes for Phoenix coach John Kloertaliana. Right

236
00:12:56,267 --> 00:12:58,987
Speaker 2: now they're calling for his head. A year ago he

237
00:12:59,067 --> 00:13:00,707
Speaker 2: was top of the pops, guiding the NIXT to their

238
00:13:00,707 --> 00:13:05,107
Speaker 2: best ever finish. It's endemic across elite sport, this drive

239
00:13:05,707 --> 00:13:09,307
Speaker 2: for instant results, and it's not helping anybody. In fact,

240
00:13:09,347 --> 00:13:14,347
Speaker 2: it's hurting players, drivers, coaches, everybody associated with elite sport

241
00:13:14,387 --> 00:13:19,027
Speaker 2: because those in charge simply cannot see pass the end

242
00:13:19,027 --> 00:13:19,707
Speaker 2: of next week.

243
00:13:20,507 --> 00:13:23,707
Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live

244
00:13:23,827 --> 00:13:27,107
Speaker 1: to News Talk set B weekends from midday, or follow

245
00:13:27,147 --> 00:13:28,747
Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio