1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,427 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:14,187 Speaker 1: from Newstalks EDB coming up ten past one. If it's 3 00:00:14,227 --> 00:00:16,907 Speaker 1: out for Jorgensen, Max Jorginson. 4 00:00:16,707 --> 00:00:19,147 Speaker 2: Max Jorginson, No, they didn't. 5 00:00:19,307 --> 00:00:20,547 Speaker 1: Oh my goodness me. 6 00:00:21,267 --> 00:00:22,787 Speaker 2: Oh, it's unbelievable. 7 00:00:24,627 --> 00:00:28,267 Speaker 1: It's one of the greatest moments in Wallaby's history and 8 00:00:28,387 --> 00:00:31,147 Speaker 1: it belongs to Jorganson. 9 00:00:33,187 --> 00:00:36,347 Speaker 2: They have stunned England here. That was the Wallaby's beating 10 00:00:36,627 --> 00:00:38,787 Speaker 2: England at Twickenham as part of the end of year 11 00:00:38,867 --> 00:00:41,867 Speaker 2: tour last year. But of a bright spot and what 12 00:00:41,947 --> 00:00:45,387 Speaker 2: was another challenging year for Australian rugby. Joe Schmidt of 13 00:00:45,427 --> 00:00:48,147 Speaker 2: course was at the Helm, but still no real clarity 14 00:00:48,747 --> 00:00:52,787 Speaker 2: over Joe Schmidt's future as Wallaby's coach. He has committed 15 00:00:53,147 --> 00:00:56,227 Speaker 2: to guiding the side in this year's series against the 16 00:00:56,267 --> 00:00:59,347 Speaker 2: British and Irish Lions, which is mid year. Beyond that, 17 00:00:59,627 --> 00:01:04,027 Speaker 2: even into the Rugby Championship, things are unclear. Rugby Australia 18 00:01:04,067 --> 00:01:05,707 Speaker 2: want them to stay. They want them to stay on 19 00:01:05,827 --> 00:01:09,227 Speaker 2: until the Wall's host the Rugby World Cup or Australia 20 00:01:09,307 --> 00:01:12,307 Speaker 2: do anyway on home soil in twenty twenty seven, but 21 00:01:12,387 --> 00:01:14,827 Speaker 2: that seems to be very much in the hands of 22 00:01:14,947 --> 00:01:18,907 Speaker 2: Joshmitt himself. Let's bring in rugby editor at the raw 23 00:01:19,187 --> 00:01:22,147 Speaker 2: dot com dot Au, Christy Dooran Christy Good to get 24 00:01:22,187 --> 00:01:25,147 Speaker 2: the chance to chat to you about this. Joshmitt was 25 00:01:25,227 --> 00:01:29,347 Speaker 2: supposed to let Rugby Australia know of his plans in December, 26 00:01:29,387 --> 00:01:32,307 Speaker 2: but he didn't. Do you think that means that he's 27 00:01:32,427 --> 00:01:34,947 Speaker 2: more likely to stay on beyond twenty twenty five or 28 00:01:34,987 --> 00:01:37,987 Speaker 2: do you think it's it's more likely that he will go. 29 00:01:38,107 --> 00:01:41,227 Speaker 2: What does this delay in the announcement actually mean. 30 00:01:43,347 --> 00:01:46,187 Speaker 3: Yeah, very good warning to you. It's a really interesting 31 00:01:46,307 --> 00:01:49,827 Speaker 3: question because it's at a journey. You're constantly trying to 32 00:01:49,827 --> 00:01:52,787 Speaker 3: make phone calls and work out what's happening, and it's 33 00:01:52,827 --> 00:01:56,307 Speaker 3: really just swung with it every passing week almost what's 34 00:01:56,347 --> 00:01:59,467 Speaker 3: he going to do? And you're right, put him He 35 00:01:59,547 --> 00:02:02,627 Speaker 3: put this timeline on himself and a Rugby show weren't 36 00:02:02,667 --> 00:02:05,307 Speaker 3: expecting him to come out in a paper and say, 37 00:02:05,307 --> 00:02:08,747 Speaker 3: you know what, Yeah, by December, I'll have a decision. 38 00:02:08,827 --> 00:02:11,067 Speaker 3: So they've actually put it back on him and gone, 39 00:02:11,107 --> 00:02:13,467 Speaker 3: you know what, we don't min you know, he can 40 00:02:13,507 --> 00:02:15,387 Speaker 3: take as long as he wants. They're not trying to 41 00:02:15,387 --> 00:02:18,707 Speaker 3: put any pressure on him because they know that he's 42 00:02:18,787 --> 00:02:20,587 Speaker 3: the man that they want to guide through to the 43 00:02:20,587 --> 00:02:25,747 Speaker 3: twenty twenty seven World Cups. So it's a fascinating one 44 00:02:26,147 --> 00:02:29,707 Speaker 3: I think, and I've been even throughout the last week 45 00:02:29,827 --> 00:02:32,867 Speaker 3: thinking what way is this going. I still think that 46 00:02:32,907 --> 00:02:36,547 Speaker 3: he's very unlikely to be the head coach beyond twenty 47 00:02:36,707 --> 00:02:41,867 Speaker 3: twenty five. I wrote just recently that he could go 48 00:02:41,907 --> 00:02:45,107 Speaker 3: throughout the Rugby Championship, starts just two weeks after the 49 00:02:45,147 --> 00:02:49,547 Speaker 3: third British and Irish Lions Test, two weeks in South Africa. 50 00:02:49,587 --> 00:02:51,787 Speaker 3: We know how difficult it was for New Zealand to 51 00:02:51,907 --> 00:02:53,707 Speaker 3: go over there in twenty twenty four and try to 52 00:02:53,747 --> 00:02:56,307 Speaker 3: come away with a win, let alone the Wallabies, who 53 00:02:56,787 --> 00:03:00,547 Speaker 3: of course haven't had a winning year since twenty fifteen. 54 00:03:00,827 --> 00:03:03,867 Speaker 3: So yeah, so much writing on this, but I think 55 00:03:03,907 --> 00:03:06,427 Speaker 3: the decision will come in the next week or so. 56 00:03:06,467 --> 00:03:08,947 Speaker 2: It has to come soon, doesn't it. Christy and Joshment 57 00:03:09,787 --> 00:03:12,227 Speaker 2: can't just keep you know, Rugby Australia hanging on. Kenny 58 00:03:12,347 --> 00:03:15,427 Speaker 2: can't keep them on tenterhooks. As you've written, you know, 59 00:03:15,667 --> 00:03:18,427 Speaker 2: he has to allow them to come up with a 60 00:03:18,467 --> 00:03:21,427 Speaker 2: contingency plan if he decides to call it a day 61 00:03:21,747 --> 00:03:24,227 Speaker 2: either after the Lions or after the Rugby Championship this year. 62 00:03:25,307 --> 00:03:27,867 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's exactly right. Like it's fascinating though as well 63 00:03:27,907 --> 00:03:32,107 Speaker 3: because in twenty thirteen Robbie Deans was sacked after the 64 00:03:32,147 --> 00:03:34,747 Speaker 3: Third Test in Sydney and a couple of weeks later 65 00:03:34,827 --> 00:03:37,867 Speaker 3: new and mackenzie was there and he walks straight into 66 00:03:37,907 --> 00:03:40,227 Speaker 3: it and everyone was the worst kept secret that new 67 00:03:40,267 --> 00:03:42,027 Speaker 3: and McKenzie is going to become the next coach to 68 00:03:42,107 --> 00:03:45,667 Speaker 3: all of his So look, these decisions can happen on 69 00:03:45,707 --> 00:03:48,867 Speaker 3: a whim very quickly. So in many respects you go, well, 70 00:03:48,867 --> 00:03:51,507 Speaker 3: why do you have to make a decision seven months beforehand? 71 00:03:51,507 --> 00:03:54,787 Speaker 3: But I think given what Joe Schmid has said about 72 00:03:54,827 --> 00:03:57,627 Speaker 3: his coaching future, with obviously the health of his son, 73 00:03:58,147 --> 00:04:00,707 Speaker 3: that there's probably a little bit more expectation that this 74 00:04:00,827 --> 00:04:04,067 Speaker 3: is why it's going to come out out quicker. The 75 00:04:04,067 --> 00:04:05,987 Speaker 3: the rugby words moved on a little bit as well. 76 00:04:06,147 --> 00:04:09,627 Speaker 3: Think about all the pressure that clubs that overseas clubs 77 00:04:09,667 --> 00:04:12,347 Speaker 3: are putting on Australia and New Zealand clubs to try 78 00:04:12,347 --> 00:04:15,267 Speaker 3: to get their players, their top players, even their middle 79 00:04:15,307 --> 00:04:19,707 Speaker 3: tier players up into Japan, into France. There's million dollar 80 00:04:19,787 --> 00:04:23,227 Speaker 3: contracts being handed out left, right and center, so players 81 00:04:23,227 --> 00:04:25,867 Speaker 3: want clarity. And the other thing about this is Robbie 82 00:04:25,907 --> 00:04:28,747 Speaker 3: James was coach for what fast six years between twenty 83 00:04:28,827 --> 00:04:31,187 Speaker 3: and eight and thirteen. The Wall of Hes have had 84 00:04:31,227 --> 00:04:34,107 Speaker 3: three coaches in three years. So if Joe Shmit moves 85 00:04:34,627 --> 00:04:37,227 Speaker 3: on in August this year, it will be a fourth 86 00:04:37,267 --> 00:04:39,747 Speaker 3: coach in four years coaching the Wall of You. So 87 00:04:40,307 --> 00:04:43,787 Speaker 3: for a nation that desperately needs stability, that's why this 88 00:04:44,347 --> 00:04:47,347 Speaker 3: is so important because there's been none of it. All 89 00:04:47,387 --> 00:04:50,267 Speaker 3: the players have had ever since they've come on to 90 00:04:50,347 --> 00:04:53,507 Speaker 3: their professional careers, with the exception of James Slipper, who's 91 00:04:53,507 --> 00:04:59,627 Speaker 3: still ticking along. Is instability is negative, headlinves And finally 92 00:04:59,787 --> 00:05:01,227 Speaker 3: it seemed like there was a bit of a pulse 93 00:05:01,227 --> 00:05:02,987 Speaker 3: on the end of season two last year when the 94 00:05:03,027 --> 00:05:05,947 Speaker 3: worll of Hiss beat England Twickenham. It had the nation 95 00:05:06,107 --> 00:05:10,227 Speaker 3: really came with the Wallabies and that's why it's important now. 96 00:05:10,267 --> 00:05:14,667 Speaker 3: And I found it really surprising last week where Lannie Gleason, 97 00:05:15,147 --> 00:05:17,747 Speaker 3: young kid, twenty three year old, he's played thirteen to 98 00:05:17,787 --> 00:05:21,987 Speaker 3: fourteen Test matches, he signs with Montpelliger. It's not yet official, 99 00:05:22,027 --> 00:05:25,067 Speaker 3: but he does so, and as a result, the Wallabs 100 00:05:25,067 --> 00:05:27,347 Speaker 3: and Rugby Sha say thanks, but no thanks. He's not 101 00:05:27,347 --> 00:05:31,027 Speaker 3: now welcome at the preseason camp where he was included 102 00:05:31,067 --> 00:05:34,507 Speaker 3: as one of pretty players. I found that really surprising, 103 00:05:35,627 --> 00:05:39,067 Speaker 3: especially given the fact that Joe Smith's been noncommittable about 104 00:05:39,067 --> 00:05:41,387 Speaker 3: what his own future is. He's not going to stand 105 00:05:41,467 --> 00:05:44,907 Speaker 3: himself down, is he if he decides to go after 106 00:05:44,987 --> 00:05:47,587 Speaker 3: the Lions tour. But that's what you're defectively doing with 107 00:05:47,667 --> 00:05:50,547 Speaker 3: other players if they don't kick on beyond this year. 108 00:05:50,907 --> 00:05:53,227 Speaker 2: Yeah. I read with interest your article or your your 109 00:05:53,267 --> 00:05:56,747 Speaker 2: peace on that. Yeah, about the ruthless message, but yeah, 110 00:05:56,747 --> 00:06:00,627 Speaker 2: the slight hypocrisy around players and coaches. Christy, is there 111 00:06:00,747 --> 00:06:03,707 Speaker 2: any chance that Joe Schmidt will do a one eighty 112 00:06:03,787 --> 00:06:06,707 Speaker 2: year and say, you know what I will state twenty 113 00:06:06,747 --> 00:06:07,307 Speaker 2: twenty seven? 114 00:06:09,707 --> 00:06:11,667 Speaker 3: Look, you have to think there's a slight one. You know, 115 00:06:12,387 --> 00:06:14,827 Speaker 3: why has it taken this long? You know we're into 116 00:06:14,827 --> 00:06:18,387 Speaker 3: the third week of January now, well, second, they're just 117 00:06:18,427 --> 00:06:22,387 Speaker 3: about the third Anyhow, Everyone that you speak to from 118 00:06:22,467 --> 00:06:26,027 Speaker 3: that's worked with him in Ireland, those that know him 119 00:06:26,107 --> 00:06:30,507 Speaker 3: very well, know that rugby is Joseph's identity, isn't it. 120 00:06:30,547 --> 00:06:32,587 Speaker 3: You take that away and then where's the meeting in 121 00:06:32,667 --> 00:06:36,107 Speaker 3: life that you get the excitement, the desire to get 122 00:06:36,187 --> 00:06:39,427 Speaker 3: up out of bed And they think that, look, why 123 00:06:39,467 --> 00:06:43,467 Speaker 3: wouldn't he You know, he hasn't taken a coach, sorry 124 00:06:43,507 --> 00:06:45,947 Speaker 3: a team as head coach to the World Cup and 125 00:06:45,987 --> 00:06:48,107 Speaker 3: gone past the quarterfinal. Obviously it was with You All 126 00:06:48,147 --> 00:06:50,907 Speaker 3: Blacks last year and they go through to the final. 127 00:06:51,187 --> 00:06:53,787 Speaker 3: But he's an assistant coach, so you know that maybe 128 00:06:53,787 --> 00:06:56,667 Speaker 3: there's a bit of a legacy but that he wants 129 00:06:56,707 --> 00:07:00,707 Speaker 3: to rewrite there. But that's probably looking from the external view, 130 00:07:00,787 --> 00:07:03,787 Speaker 3: isn't it. Joshmi has got a decision about with his 131 00:07:03,787 --> 00:07:06,187 Speaker 3: family whether or not he can do it himself just 132 00:07:06,427 --> 00:07:10,307 Speaker 3: fire and if he can, then then Rugby Australia will 133 00:07:10,347 --> 00:07:12,947 Speaker 3: be desperate to have him and I know that the 134 00:07:13,027 --> 00:07:16,827 Speaker 3: nation will as well, because he's not unassuming kind of 135 00:07:16,867 --> 00:07:21,467 Speaker 3: guys and he's got a lovely smile. He's a nice bloke. 136 00:07:22,627 --> 00:07:26,227 Speaker 3: But I don't know if the media they don't know him. 137 00:07:26,227 --> 00:07:27,747 Speaker 3: He didn't do an interview when he was with You 138 00:07:27,747 --> 00:07:30,987 Speaker 3: All Blacks. He's not like a Dave or any will 139 00:07:31,027 --> 00:07:32,667 Speaker 3: go out of his way to have, you know, with 140 00:07:33,347 --> 00:07:35,507 Speaker 3: a bloke or go to the pub to catch a apple, 141 00:07:35,907 --> 00:07:39,227 Speaker 3: come over during training and say good guys. He's he's 142 00:07:39,347 --> 00:07:42,467 Speaker 3: very much himself and I've seen him in a sense 143 00:07:42,547 --> 00:07:43,867 Speaker 3: going you know what, I've got a one and a 144 00:07:43,907 --> 00:07:47,107 Speaker 3: half year mission in Australia. I'm going to do it myself. 145 00:07:47,107 --> 00:07:48,827 Speaker 3: I'm going to kick on now. I'm going to have 146 00:07:48,827 --> 00:07:50,907 Speaker 3: my head dan how I'm going to try to turn 147 00:07:50,947 --> 00:07:53,387 Speaker 3: the fortunes around of the Wallabies because the world rug 148 00:07:53,467 --> 00:07:56,427 Speaker 3: you desperately needs it. That's been my gap feeling right 149 00:07:56,467 --> 00:08:00,187 Speaker 3: for me, the outset and what sources have told me 150 00:08:00,227 --> 00:08:02,867 Speaker 3: as well. I'd be surprised if he kicks on to 151 00:08:02,947 --> 00:08:05,867 Speaker 3: twenty seven, but jeez would love it if he would. 152 00:08:05,867 --> 00:08:08,187 Speaker 2: I find it if he does finish. Who are the 153 00:08:08,267 --> 00:08:11,227 Speaker 2: candidates to take over post the Lions or post the 154 00:08:11,307 --> 00:08:12,267 Speaker 2: Rugby Championship. 155 00:08:14,227 --> 00:08:17,147 Speaker 3: Well, Let's Kiss has been the favorite for a long time. 156 00:08:17,227 --> 00:08:20,067 Speaker 3: He's got a great working relationship with Joe, having spent 157 00:08:20,147 --> 00:08:22,747 Speaker 3: time with him in twenty thirteen fourteen fifteen with Ireland. 158 00:08:24,227 --> 00:08:27,147 Speaker 3: Let's Kiss are only just returned to the Reds. He's 159 00:08:27,147 --> 00:08:30,267 Speaker 3: going into his second years. Princeland Rugby want him to 160 00:08:30,347 --> 00:08:33,667 Speaker 3: continue on, but he's definitely one and there'd be an 161 00:08:33,747 --> 00:08:36,147 Speaker 3: arrangement that could be made, which would be pretty easy, 162 00:08:36,507 --> 00:08:40,067 Speaker 3: I think, or easy enough. Dan mckel has just returned 163 00:08:40,067 --> 00:08:43,547 Speaker 3: after a stint at Lester and we know that he 164 00:08:43,627 --> 00:08:48,227 Speaker 3: had some successful relative success the Brumbies anyway, consistent, disciplined, 165 00:08:48,427 --> 00:08:52,947 Speaker 3: hard working, lots of great characteristics for a coach. I 166 00:08:52,987 --> 00:08:54,867 Speaker 3: still think it's perhaps a year or two or two 167 00:08:54,987 --> 00:08:59,547 Speaker 3: premature for Dan, but Michael Checker, you can't rule him 168 00:08:59,587 --> 00:09:02,587 Speaker 3: out that. Whilst Phil wall is the rugby shot to see, 169 00:09:03,107 --> 00:09:05,467 Speaker 3: I'm not sure if he's the sort of person that 170 00:09:05,507 --> 00:09:08,347 Speaker 3: they'd be looking at, because he's a guy that does 171 00:09:08,387 --> 00:09:12,227 Speaker 3: things his way, but at the moment he's not despite 172 00:09:12,267 --> 00:09:14,027 Speaker 3: the faith that less the Tigers are going very well, 173 00:09:14,627 --> 00:09:16,307 Speaker 3: having a great win at home right now at the 174 00:09:16,347 --> 00:09:22,227 Speaker 3: moment in the European Champions Cup, and I don't think 175 00:09:22,227 --> 00:09:25,067 Speaker 3: that Phil will have him come back, and it's set 176 00:09:25,147 --> 00:09:27,987 Speaker 3: up perfectly for him a one to two year hit 177 00:09:28,027 --> 00:09:30,067 Speaker 3: and run job. He's done it everywhere. He did it 178 00:09:30,067 --> 00:09:33,147 Speaker 3: with the Wallas in twenty fourteen fifteen, turned around their fortunes. 179 00:09:33,667 --> 00:09:37,507 Speaker 3: But he's the sort of guy that Rabia Shaw is 180 00:09:37,547 --> 00:09:40,467 Speaker 3: still a little bit spooched by by how things ended 181 00:09:40,547 --> 00:09:43,667 Speaker 3: up under raylank Castle in twenty eighteen twenty nineteen where 182 00:09:44,027 --> 00:09:48,347 Speaker 3: he was somewhat out of control when Phil will was 183 00:09:48,707 --> 00:09:50,667 Speaker 3: a board member there at the time of twenty eighteen 184 00:09:50,667 --> 00:09:54,627 Speaker 3: and nineteen, so it's really fascinating. The real left field 185 00:09:54,667 --> 00:09:58,707 Speaker 3: one to finish up is Leon Donald. He's clearly finished 186 00:09:58,787 --> 00:10:01,787 Speaker 3: up with the All Blacks at the start of the 187 00:10:01,867 --> 00:10:05,747 Speaker 3: Rugby Championship. He's got a great relationship with Joe Schmidt. 188 00:10:05,827 --> 00:10:08,747 Speaker 3: Does him on board at the moment this year there 189 00:10:08,787 --> 00:10:12,587 Speaker 3: was only four assistant coaches like a four man coaching 190 00:10:12,587 --> 00:10:17,427 Speaker 3: team this year with Judgment, so they can definitely have 191 00:10:17,547 --> 00:10:20,547 Speaker 3: space for another person. Schmid was doing the attack with 192 00:10:20,667 --> 00:10:23,987 Speaker 3: Liam McDonald's at the attack and then perhaps they're very 193 00:10:23,987 --> 00:10:27,547 Speaker 3: a bit of a transition period for Leon, so there's 194 00:10:27,547 --> 00:10:30,067 Speaker 3: definitely scope and coaches out there. It wouldn't be all 195 00:10:30,147 --> 00:10:33,747 Speaker 3: doom and gloom if Josement left, but for his consistency 196 00:10:33,747 --> 00:10:36,587 Speaker 3: and what he's done and his detail around the game, 197 00:10:37,027 --> 00:10:40,467 Speaker 3: that's the thing, the missing element of Shane Roby's needed 198 00:10:40,547 --> 00:10:41,027 Speaker 3: for some time. 199 00:10:41,227 --> 00:10:43,827 Speaker 2: Leon McDonald in charge of the Wallabies, well, we'll watch 200 00:10:43,907 --> 00:10:46,307 Speaker 2: with interest from over the side of the Tasman Christy, 201 00:10:46,347 --> 00:10:48,907 Speaker 2: thanks so much for joining us and giving us your expertise. 202 00:10:49,747 --> 00:10:51,467 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a lot of postal on cheers now. 203 00:10:51,267 --> 00:10:54,187 Speaker 2: Thanks man. That's Christy Duran. You can read him at 204 00:10:54,227 --> 00:10:57,067 Speaker 2: the raw dot com dot au. He's rugbieda to there. 205 00:10:57,987 --> 00:11:00,707 Speaker 2: Leon McDonald in charge of the Wallabies. Tell you what 206 00:11:00,707 --> 00:11:03,707 Speaker 2: stranger things have happened? It may well happen. Is a 207 00:11:03,747 --> 00:11:08,307 Speaker 2: good coach without a job gets on well with Joe Schmidt? 208 00:11:08,827 --> 00:11:11,587 Speaker 2: Is this the reason for the delay? Are they starting 209 00:11:11,587 --> 00:11:15,467 Speaker 2: to just put these things together? How would the Australian 210 00:11:15,547 --> 00:11:17,987 Speaker 2: rugby public go I've already got one or they've had 211 00:11:17,987 --> 00:11:21,827 Speaker 2: plenty of New Zealand coaches, haven't they, Dave Rennie, Robbie Deans, 212 00:11:22,587 --> 00:11:25,547 Speaker 2: now Joe Schmidt. Would they tolerate another one? And Leon 213 00:11:25,667 --> 00:11:30,507 Speaker 2: McDonald I think they probably would. The another interesting storyline 214 00:11:30,587 --> 00:11:32,707 Speaker 2: last year we had Joe Schmidt coming up against his 215 00:11:32,787 --> 00:11:35,867 Speaker 2: former team and the All Blacks as Wallaby's coach. Who 216 00:11:35,867 --> 00:11:37,707 Speaker 2: knows what the future might hold As far as Leon 217 00:11:37,787 --> 00:11:41,187 Speaker 2: McDonald is concerned, could he also be there singing as 218 00:11:41,187 --> 00:11:47,107 Speaker 2: advance Australia fair against the All Blacks? Looky, they could 219 00:11:47,107 --> 00:11:49,467 Speaker 2: do worse than Lionill McDonald. They could do a lot 220 00:11:49,507 --> 00:11:50,987 Speaker 2: worse the Wallabies. 221 00:11:52,107 --> 00:11:55,267 Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live 222 00:11:55,387 --> 00:11:58,667 Speaker 1: to News Talk zed be weekends from midday, or follow 223 00:11:58,707 --> 00:12:00,267 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio