1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,250 Speaker 1: This is a C. N. A. Podcast, 2 00:00:04,780 --> 00:00:09,280 Speaker 1: A 19 year old serving national service to 78 year olds, 3 00:00:09,289 --> 00:00:12,180 Speaker 1: a three year old and her 34 year old father. 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:14,890 Speaker 1: These were some of the people who died from residential 5 00:00:14,890 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 1: fires last year. And the spark that may have started 6 00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:19,930 Speaker 1: these fires is showing now 7 00:00:19,954 --> 00:00:24,485 Speaker 1: no signs of abating anytime soon. Fires involving household content 8 00:00:24,485 --> 00:00:27,185 Speaker 1: and electrical fires are on the rise. Each of us 9 00:00:27,185 --> 00:00:31,155 Speaker 1: today have multiple electrical devices and they all need charging. 10 00:00:31,165 --> 00:00:35,130 Speaker 1: So that often means overloading sockets each night as we sleep. 11 00:00:35,430 --> 00:00:38,060 Speaker 1: And when a fire happens, it doesn't just put your 12 00:00:38,060 --> 00:00:42,349 Speaker 1: family in danger. It also puts everyone around you at risk. 13 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,030 Speaker 1: Welcome to 2023 and to heart of the matter, my 14 00:00:46,030 --> 00:00:48,540 Speaker 1: name is Stephen Chow and I'm your host today. We 15 00:00:48,540 --> 00:00:51,460 Speaker 1: want to get to the heart of residential fires in Singapore. 16 00:00:51,470 --> 00:00:56,260 Speaker 1: What is the spark driving this who is ultimately responsible 17 00:00:56,260 --> 00:01:00,050 Speaker 1: for safety and what might be missing in our understanding 18 00:01:00,060 --> 00:01:01,710 Speaker 1: of residential fires 19 00:01:02,030 --> 00:01:05,740 Speaker 1: to help me dissect this issue are Benedict. Co president 20 00:01:05,740 --> 00:01:09,679 Speaker 1: of Fire Safety Managers Association Singapore. Hello, nice to be here. 21 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: National Director of habitat for humanity, Singapore. 22 00:01:13,530 --> 00:01:15,110 Speaker 2: Hi steven. Hi guys, 23 00:01:15,930 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 1: we'll call him Casey College of Design and Engineering. Hello. Hi. 24 00:01:20,370 --> 00:01:23,130 Speaker 1: All right, gentlemen. Thanks for joining us online. Let's start 25 00:01:23,130 --> 00:01:26,490 Speaker 1: the conversation. You know, unfortunately, this year is off to 26 00:01:26,490 --> 00:01:29,210 Speaker 1: another bad start. In fact, there've been more fires happening. 27 00:01:29,225 --> 00:01:31,585 Speaker 1: We just heard of one in east coast where several 28 00:01:31,584 --> 00:01:34,315 Speaker 1: homes were badly burned. We also heard of a power 29 00:01:34,315 --> 00:01:36,725 Speaker 1: bank catching fire on a scoot plane that was about 30 00:01:36,725 --> 00:01:39,045 Speaker 1: to take off. So Benedict why are we seeing this 31 00:01:39,045 --> 00:01:43,395 Speaker 1: trend of more residential fires? Especially in recent years. Actually 32 00:01:43,395 --> 00:01:46,065 Speaker 1: taking reference from the S. C. D. F. News release, 33 00:01:46,075 --> 00:01:50,475 Speaker 1: The total number of fire incidents decreased actually by 1.8% 34 00:01:50,475 --> 00:01:54,265 Speaker 1: in 2021. While the number of fire incidents in residential 35 00:01:54,265 --> 00:01:56,404 Speaker 1: premises fell by 4.2%. 36 00:01:56,590 --> 00:01:59,500 Speaker 1: But I do not have the data for 2022 at 37 00:01:59,500 --> 00:02:01,940 Speaker 1: this moment because it's January. So it's a bit too 38 00:02:01,940 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: early to have the compilation of the data. But the 39 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: impression is that there seems to be more fires happening. Okay. 40 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:08,970 Speaker 1: Maybe the numbers don't show it. And I know we 41 00:02:08,970 --> 00:02:11,700 Speaker 1: haven't got the latest figures yet. Take ming. What do 42 00:02:11,700 --> 00:02:13,390 Speaker 1: you think? Is it just me or do you feel 43 00:02:13,389 --> 00:02:14,100 Speaker 1: that way too? 44 00:02:14,110 --> 00:02:16,919 Speaker 2: Surely one of the key problem is the use of 45 00:02:16,930 --> 00:02:18,490 Speaker 2: all kinds of battery 46 00:02:18,690 --> 00:02:23,180 Speaker 2: and battery assisted devices. And the problem seems to be 47 00:02:23,180 --> 00:02:27,180 Speaker 2: that these devices, many of which cannot pass the standard 48 00:02:27,190 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 2: power and fire safety requirements, especially those that are bought 49 00:02:31,130 --> 00:02:33,980 Speaker 2: on the chip. So seems like many of these things 50 00:02:33,990 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 2: are flooding the market 51 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:39,100 Speaker 2: in the work that we do at habitat for humanity. 52 00:02:39,100 --> 00:02:42,329 Speaker 2: We have seen many people living in flats with a 53 00:02:42,330 --> 00:02:45,070 Speaker 2: lot of junk put in the house. And so you 54 00:02:45,070 --> 00:02:48,050 Speaker 2: can imagine that if one of these things would catch 55 00:02:48,050 --> 00:02:50,550 Speaker 2: fire in the middle of the night, it will quickly 56 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:52,900 Speaker 2: then spread to the whole place. If 57 00:02:52,900 --> 00:02:55,350 Speaker 1: you raise a few good points we'll touch more on that. 58 00:02:55,350 --> 00:02:57,700 Speaker 1: But first I'll pick up on the fact that you're saying, yeah, 59 00:02:57,700 --> 00:03:01,140 Speaker 1: there's a lot of alternatives to electrical devices. In fact 60 00:03:01,340 --> 00:03:04,980 Speaker 1: a few years back those personal mobility devices, e scooters 61 00:03:04,980 --> 00:03:07,220 Speaker 1: for instance, they were almost one a week. We will 62 00:03:07,220 --> 00:03:10,570 Speaker 1: hear about the fire. The authorities stepped in, regulated them 63 00:03:10,570 --> 00:03:13,690 Speaker 1: and that has eased up somewhat. But it still happens. 64 00:03:13,690 --> 00:03:17,160 Speaker 1: Just in june 2021 we saw young delivery rider who 65 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:20,250 Speaker 1: died when his PMD caught fire in the elevator. So 66 00:03:20,250 --> 00:03:23,660 Speaker 1: Casey would you say such mobility devices are no longer 67 00:03:23,669 --> 00:03:26,340 Speaker 1: as much of a worry. I would say it depends 68 00:03:26,340 --> 00:03:29,060 Speaker 1: because as what has said they are not 69 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:33,010 Speaker 1: more options available for the consumers in the market. It's 70 00:03:33,010 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 1: quite hard for the authorities to really keep track each 71 00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: and every individual consumer whether they would adhere to just 72 00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:45,370 Speaker 1: buying the products from more of the established brands. 73 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:47,450 Speaker 1: Okay, so it's the fact that we have all these 74 00:03:47,450 --> 00:03:50,180 Speaker 1: options to buy the cheaper version of something you buy 75 00:03:50,180 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 1: a cheaper battery and alternative phone charging wire. Is this 76 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,710 Speaker 1: really a big issue because if I go online and 77 00:03:56,710 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 1: I shot the original cost $100. The alternative cost $10. 78 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:02,860 Speaker 1: And I think to myself, well, most of the time 79 00:04:02,860 --> 00:04:06,460 Speaker 1: nothing happens anyway. Right. So Benedict is this that false 80 00:04:06,460 --> 00:04:07,580 Speaker 1: sense of security 81 00:04:07,750 --> 00:04:10,700 Speaker 1: Won't happen to me. It's fine actually it is because 82 00:04:10,710 --> 00:04:12,490 Speaker 1: to be very honest, I mean we all know that 83 00:04:12,500 --> 00:04:16,050 Speaker 1: you just need one fire one incident, 1000 charges is 84 00:04:16,050 --> 00:04:20,289 Speaker 1: going to be a disaster charging electrical appliances. What Casey 85 00:04:20,290 --> 00:04:24,260 Speaker 1: was mentioning we should actually get all those approved items, equipment, appliances. 86 00:04:24,270 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: Even to the simple thing of extension court we should 87 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:29,940 Speaker 1: get approved one with the standard safety labels. 88 00:04:30,150 --> 00:04:34,780 Speaker 1: These are very essential. But as for household fire actually 89 00:04:34,779 --> 00:04:39,010 Speaker 1: the highest in statistics for 2021 is actually unattended cooking 90 00:04:39,020 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: and followed by fire of electrical origins. That's the second 91 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:44,630 Speaker 1: one of course holding of content in the house. This 92 00:04:44,630 --> 00:04:47,850 Speaker 1: is the third. So fire electrical origins is still on 93 00:04:47,850 --> 00:04:48,230 Speaker 1: a very high 94 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:51,390 Speaker 1: high in the list in that sense. Yeah. And many 95 00:04:51,390 --> 00:04:54,360 Speaker 1: come from non approved equipment and items. Yeah. 96 00:04:54,370 --> 00:04:56,900 Speaker 2: May I add also that long time ago I used 97 00:04:56,900 --> 00:04:59,550 Speaker 2: to be an electrical engineer. So I was in charge 98 00:04:59,550 --> 00:05:02,859 Speaker 2: of power supply at one time. I have some understanding 99 00:05:02,860 --> 00:05:06,330 Speaker 2: of the power safety issue. The other problem is that 100 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 2: in order to get your approval rating and seal and 101 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 2: the mark of approval for fire safety, the supplier has 102 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:17,530 Speaker 2: to go through a lot of processes and designing a 103 00:05:17,529 --> 00:05:20,630 Speaker 2: lot of safety features and therefore the product will be 104 00:05:20,630 --> 00:05:23,170 Speaker 2: more expensive. So what's happening now is that other than 105 00:05:23,170 --> 00:05:25,989 Speaker 2: non approved one, you have fixed up, you know, people 106 00:05:25,990 --> 00:05:29,500 Speaker 2: just slammed the logo on the battery and claim that 107 00:05:29,510 --> 00:05:30,940 Speaker 2: this is safe but in 108 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:34,390 Speaker 2: they lack all these safety features. So it's a combination 109 00:05:34,390 --> 00:05:38,180 Speaker 2: of buying fake goods which you don't know it's fake 110 00:05:38,190 --> 00:05:40,210 Speaker 2: or you kind of know that it's fake, but because 111 00:05:40,210 --> 00:05:42,420 Speaker 2: it's very cheap so you don't quite care as well. Yeah, 112 00:05:42,430 --> 00:05:45,510 Speaker 1: it's true. I guess sometimes we want to feel like 113 00:05:45,510 --> 00:05:47,779 Speaker 1: ignorance is bliss. I mean I know for $10 it's 114 00:05:47,779 --> 00:05:50,250 Speaker 1: not the real thing, but yet I kind of don't 115 00:05:50,250 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 1: want to believe that it's not the real thing, you know, 116 00:05:52,210 --> 00:05:54,450 Speaker 1: so is this a danger then moving forward that if 117 00:05:54,450 --> 00:05:55,470 Speaker 1: there are all these fake 118 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:59,730 Speaker 1: is there are people just not willing to pay for 119 00:05:59,730 --> 00:06:01,930 Speaker 1: the proper products and how is that going to change? 120 00:06:01,930 --> 00:06:04,429 Speaker 1: Because a lot of the stuff we buy online comes 121 00:06:04,430 --> 00:06:06,910 Speaker 1: from overseas so we can't control those coming in as well. 122 00:06:06,910 --> 00:06:10,409 Speaker 2: Right? It is a real issue actually. It's not just 123 00:06:10,410 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 2: about this power devices, about everything, you know, like just 124 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,890 Speaker 2: yesterday I saw this very young teenager guy vaping and 125 00:06:17,890 --> 00:06:20,140 Speaker 2: I realized that hey, you know, you could try to 126 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,179 Speaker 2: ban it all you want, but they seem to be 127 00:06:23,180 --> 00:06:25,839 Speaker 2: able to get it quite easily by buying it off 128 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:28,620 Speaker 2: the internet. So I think this is an issue that 129 00:06:28,620 --> 00:06:31,540 Speaker 2: is very tough to solve and all these personal mobile 130 00:06:31,540 --> 00:06:35,470 Speaker 2: devices with the batteries and power banks and all that. 131 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:38,950 Speaker 2: They're just coming from all corners and the authorities, I 132 00:06:38,950 --> 00:06:42,100 Speaker 2: do believe, I'm finding it very tough to deal with 133 00:06:42,110 --> 00:06:44,870 Speaker 2: And we're talking about fire that can cause death here. 134 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:48,360 Speaker 2: I'm assuming that they have really trying their best and 135 00:06:48,589 --> 00:06:50,770 Speaker 2: even as we speak, trying to figure out how to 136 00:06:50,770 --> 00:06:53,690 Speaker 2: really nip this in the butt. But I think it's 137 00:06:53,700 --> 00:06:55,570 Speaker 2: a tough thing to solve. Benedict 138 00:06:55,580 --> 00:06:59,460 Speaker 1: you wanted to say something actually what was saying. Also 139 00:06:59,460 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 1: it's very difficult to control. So on outside I think 140 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:05,700 Speaker 1: we have to have this prevention measures even on the 141 00:07:05,700 --> 00:07:09,010 Speaker 1: electrical appliances knowing that we will not know that mystically 142 00:07:09,010 --> 00:07:11,220 Speaker 1: buying something that's not approved. We have to check our 143 00:07:11,220 --> 00:07:14,510 Speaker 1: electrical system very regularly in that sense because 144 00:07:14,525 --> 00:07:16,525 Speaker 1: most of us, you know, we move into the house, 145 00:07:16,525 --> 00:07:18,005 Speaker 1: you stayed for 10 years, 20 years. You don't even 146 00:07:18,005 --> 00:07:21,055 Speaker 1: check your circuit breakers whether or doesn't actually these are 147 00:07:21,055 --> 00:07:24,415 Speaker 1: life saving devices because anything goes wrong with electrical appliances 148 00:07:24,425 --> 00:07:26,565 Speaker 1: by right. The circuit breaker be the M. C. B. 149 00:07:26,565 --> 00:07:28,215 Speaker 1: Or the R. C. D. They will treat. So let 150 00:07:28,215 --> 00:07:30,965 Speaker 1: me ask you because you're right. I happen to be 151 00:07:30,975 --> 00:07:33,515 Speaker 1: speaking to an electrician recently and he told me I 152 00:07:33,515 --> 00:07:35,935 Speaker 1: have a license to kill and I was like, huh? 153 00:07:36,190 --> 00:07:38,820 Speaker 1: Yeah because he's a licensed electrician and if he doesn't 154 00:07:38,820 --> 00:07:42,060 Speaker 1: do his work properly, people can die. But we forget 155 00:07:42,060 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: that right? So in terms of like rewiring my home 156 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 1: so that it doesn't have the possibility of leading to five, 157 00:07:48,410 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 1: what would you tell people that? How often should we 158 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:53,280 Speaker 1: do it if it's a 20-year home, 3050, some of 159 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:55,450 Speaker 1: us haven't changed wiring in like 50 years? 160 00:07:55,585 --> 00:07:59,685 Speaker 1: Basically if you go by manufacturing recommendation, electrical cables should 161 00:07:59,685 --> 00:08:01,885 Speaker 1: be replaced after 20 years. You have the life span 162 00:08:01,885 --> 00:08:04,595 Speaker 1: of about 20, years. So it depends on the quality. 163 00:08:04,595 --> 00:08:08,925 Speaker 1: And these days, unfortunately again, similar to other appliances, they're 164 00:08:08,925 --> 00:08:12,415 Speaker 1: able to get cheap cables in inferior quality. That's another 165 00:08:12,415 --> 00:08:14,965 Speaker 1: issue that we are facing at this moment. 166 00:08:15,130 --> 00:08:18,270 Speaker 1: Oh no. So even if I rewire my home and 167 00:08:18,270 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 1: it's only five years old, the wiring may have already, 168 00:08:22,090 --> 00:08:24,620 Speaker 1: you know, so it's better to make sure that you 169 00:08:24,620 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 1: get a trustable contractors, contractors to give you so called 170 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:30,030 Speaker 1: good quality products in that sense? Yeah. 171 00:08:30,250 --> 00:08:32,900 Speaker 1: Right. I recently learned again from another story of a 172 00:08:32,910 --> 00:08:36,980 Speaker 1: talking point that we should be using a licensed electrician license, 173 00:08:36,990 --> 00:08:39,660 Speaker 1: you should use the L. E. W to do the 174 00:08:39,670 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 1: job and not just any other so called contractors in 175 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:45,950 Speaker 1: that sense. Yeah. Yeah. The thing is sometimes looks so easy, right? 176 00:08:45,950 --> 00:08:48,819 Speaker 1: I've changed lights at home before my own of course my, 177 00:08:48,820 --> 00:08:50,670 Speaker 1: I got a big scolding from my wife, you know, 178 00:08:50,670 --> 00:08:53,829 Speaker 1: because I did trip the house several times. 179 00:08:54,510 --> 00:08:56,990 Speaker 1: So that was a one off thing. Yeah. In terms 180 00:08:56,990 --> 00:08:59,309 Speaker 1: of the way our homes are designed many of them 181 00:08:59,309 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: are quite old. Have they been equipped to trying to 182 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 1: take on the electrical loads that we require as people 183 00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:08,229 Speaker 1: today with all our many devices with the new devices 184 00:09:08,230 --> 00:09:11,850 Speaker 1: that homeowners may purchase over the time? 185 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:16,210 Speaker 1: We should read the manual carefully to understand hey what 186 00:09:16,210 --> 00:09:21,220 Speaker 1: are these safe conditions in which the devices are made 187 00:09:21,230 --> 00:09:25,060 Speaker 1: to be used safely? Right. But that's the device I'm 188 00:09:25,059 --> 00:09:28,570 Speaker 1: saying the home if I plug in 50 computers, another 189 00:09:28,570 --> 00:09:32,290 Speaker 1: 100 mobile phones I mean is that too much? General 190 00:09:32,290 --> 00:09:37,110 Speaker 1: time will be for appliances we use the war outlets 191 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:39,800 Speaker 1: to really minimize the use of extension 192 00:09:39,980 --> 00:09:43,620 Speaker 1: courts and out list. Benedict you're telling us earlier that 193 00:09:43,620 --> 00:09:46,970 Speaker 1: besides unattended cooking electrical fires are top of the list 194 00:09:46,970 --> 00:09:49,780 Speaker 1: as well. Right? Why does that happen so often? Is 195 00:09:49,780 --> 00:09:53,110 Speaker 1: it because we are overloading our sockets. Overloading is one 196 00:09:53,110 --> 00:09:55,079 Speaker 1: of the issue as well. The other one is as 197 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:57,089 Speaker 1: I mentioned just now if you don't get the qualified 198 00:09:57,100 --> 00:09:59,850 Speaker 1: electricians to do the wiring there may be some issues 199 00:09:59,850 --> 00:10:03,450 Speaker 1: with the terminations or whatever which caused overheating. Of course 200 00:10:03,450 --> 00:10:07,440 Speaker 1: there are so faulty electrical appliances or unapproved equipment like 201 00:10:07,620 --> 00:10:10,620 Speaker 1: charges and a lot of them by charges of the 202 00:10:10,620 --> 00:10:13,709 Speaker 1: party charges and all. And some of these extension cords 203 00:10:13,710 --> 00:10:16,470 Speaker 1: do not have the standard mark which is again inferior 204 00:10:16,470 --> 00:10:19,850 Speaker 1: quality and also the protective device, the circuit breakers are 205 00:10:19,850 --> 00:10:23,630 Speaker 1: actually not functioning properly. So these are the main issues 206 00:10:23,630 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 1: that we have that it causes the fire with electrical origins. 207 00:10:26,570 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 1: So what can we do then? Because it sounds like 208 00:10:28,929 --> 00:10:32,630 Speaker 1: we can't get rid of all the cheaper alternatives. You 209 00:10:32,630 --> 00:10:34,959 Speaker 1: know the fake batteries, the fake wires and all that 210 00:10:34,970 --> 00:10:35,420 Speaker 1: people 211 00:10:35,429 --> 00:10:38,390 Speaker 1: still use them? Is there a way to use them 212 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:41,970 Speaker 1: safely safely? I will say that although we have intention 213 00:10:41,970 --> 00:10:44,710 Speaker 1: to buy the genuine product but you know online sometimes 214 00:10:44,710 --> 00:10:46,580 Speaker 1: you get a perfect product which we don't even know 215 00:10:46,580 --> 00:10:49,079 Speaker 1: about it. So the best way is actually to make 216 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:51,600 Speaker 1: sure that you're protective device are working so that in 217 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:53,900 Speaker 1: case anything happens you know you will treat the device 218 00:10:53,900 --> 00:10:56,220 Speaker 1: and cut off the power supply to prevent the fire. 219 00:10:56,230 --> 00:10:59,250 Speaker 1: You see a protective device. You mean like the circuit breaker? 220 00:10:59,260 --> 00:11:02,220 Speaker 1: That's right. That's right. But even if I'm charging my 221 00:11:02,230 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 1: mobile phone 222 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:06,199 Speaker 1: through an extension cord is there another way? How would 223 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,819 Speaker 1: I know whether that is protected? Normally you go back 224 00:11:09,820 --> 00:11:11,600 Speaker 1: to the main right? The main has all these circuit 225 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:15,809 Speaker 1: breakers up there and if it's overheated the M. C. B. 226 00:11:15,809 --> 00:11:18,570 Speaker 1: Will trade the circuit breaker will trip and there's an 227 00:11:18,580 --> 00:11:20,780 Speaker 1: earth fault the RCD will treat the rest of the 228 00:11:20,780 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 1: current record. So that should happen. It should happen. But 229 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:26,559 Speaker 1: most of us who move in the house many of 230 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:28,910 Speaker 1: us do not test it regularly. You know what I mean? 231 00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:30,670 Speaker 1: Actually yeah we don't know 232 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: whether it works or not. You move into a new 233 00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: flat you assume that everything has been done and taken 234 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: care of? Right? So are you saying we should do otherwise? 235 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:40,550 Speaker 1: We should actually we should do the testing at least 236 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,300 Speaker 1: once every six months or so. Just tripped the breaker 237 00:11:43,300 --> 00:11:45,590 Speaker 1: and see whether it works. Yeah. How do we do 238 00:11:45,590 --> 00:11:48,319 Speaker 1: that again? For example the RCD there's a test button, 239 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:49,910 Speaker 1: you just press the test button to make sure that 240 00:11:49,910 --> 00:11:53,470 Speaker 1: it trips that that's the case protection. So whenever that's 241 00:11:53,630 --> 00:11:56,220 Speaker 1: the case you should treat okay because I understand also 242 00:11:56,220 --> 00:11:57,910 Speaker 1: there are still some flats in Singapore 243 00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:01,750 Speaker 1: that have very old electrical systems. They were not upgraded. 244 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,310 Speaker 1: Some of the cases of fires have been occurring at 245 00:12:04,309 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 1: those places. Taking you brought up another point earlier about 246 00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:11,820 Speaker 1: how very often some people do have too many things 247 00:12:11,820 --> 00:12:13,650 Speaker 1: at home. There are some hoarders as well 248 00:12:13,660 --> 00:12:17,990 Speaker 2: by charity. We serve the lowest income group, usually a 249 00:12:17,990 --> 00:12:21,640 Speaker 2: one room flat and we are talking about people with 250 00:12:21,650 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 2: multiple problems, sometimes dysfunctionality, 251 00:12:25,510 --> 00:12:29,210 Speaker 2: mental problems and stuff like that. So a lot of 252 00:12:29,210 --> 00:12:31,340 Speaker 2: these folks could be hardest and what have you. So 253 00:12:31,340 --> 00:12:35,250 Speaker 2: it's extremely difficult to try to educate them and to 254 00:12:35,250 --> 00:12:38,870 Speaker 2: help them because for example the personal mobile devices, we 255 00:12:38,870 --> 00:12:41,770 Speaker 2: have noticed that a lot of the elderly all of 256 00:12:41,770 --> 00:12:45,319 Speaker 2: a sudden have some type of personal mobile devices that 257 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,290 Speaker 2: look very strange and some of them are very huge. 258 00:12:47,290 --> 00:12:49,700 Speaker 2: You know, they want to modify it with extra battery 259 00:12:49,700 --> 00:12:52,569 Speaker 2: or something like that and you can imagine that many 260 00:12:52,570 --> 00:12:54,990 Speaker 2: of it will not be the kind of approved type 261 00:12:55,230 --> 00:12:58,100 Speaker 2: and when they charge such things in their very, very 262 00:12:58,110 --> 00:13:02,030 Speaker 2: corrupted Holmes, I'm afraid that even if there's a circuit 263 00:13:02,030 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 2: breaker and all that and your battery catch fire first 264 00:13:04,809 --> 00:13:08,329 Speaker 2: whether your circuit breaker or not, the fire will catch on. 265 00:13:08,340 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 2: That's a key problem there. 266 00:13:09,490 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 1: Right. So do you feel that this group of people 267 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,210 Speaker 1: are even more vulnerable to such fires? 268 00:13:14,220 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 2: Yes, absolute. 269 00:13:14,970 --> 00:13:18,780 Speaker 2: Actually unattended fire is already one major thing that we 270 00:13:18,780 --> 00:13:22,270 Speaker 2: are worried about. Actually alongside with that will be things 271 00:13:22,270 --> 00:13:25,350 Speaker 2: like gas stoves that are not turned off because some 272 00:13:25,350 --> 00:13:29,380 Speaker 2: of the elderly dementia or alzheimer's so they could do 273 00:13:29,390 --> 00:13:31,740 Speaker 2: stuff like that and plus the cluttering and all that. 274 00:13:31,750 --> 00:13:34,710 Speaker 2: So these are very serious safety hazards. 275 00:13:34,910 --> 00:13:37,540 Speaker 2: So this is the reason why one of our regular 276 00:13:37,540 --> 00:13:41,689 Speaker 2: activities to move into attempt to help them clean up 277 00:13:41,690 --> 00:13:45,130 Speaker 2: the place to be clutter or the junk. And also 278 00:13:45,130 --> 00:13:48,740 Speaker 2: at the same time keep encouraging and persuading them not 279 00:13:48,750 --> 00:13:52,660 Speaker 2: to put one million and one plugs into one socket 280 00:13:52,670 --> 00:13:56,900 Speaker 2: and try to help them be more safety conscious. But 281 00:13:56,910 --> 00:13:59,140 Speaker 2: it is a pretty uphill task. You need a lot 282 00:13:59,140 --> 00:14:00,040 Speaker 2: of patients. 283 00:14:04,300 --> 00:14:06,780 Speaker 1: Hello, my name is steve Lie and I'm Teresa Tang 284 00:14:06,790 --> 00:14:09,990 Speaker 1: and we are the hosts of Sienna correspondent, a podcast 285 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:12,140 Speaker 1: that takes you to the heart of the work our 286 00:14:12,140 --> 00:14:16,240 Speaker 1: correspondents do across the globe from china's covid response to 287 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,660 Speaker 1: the childcare center massacre in Thailand from the fall of 288 00:14:19,660 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 1: now 289 00:14:20,335 --> 00:14:23,915 Speaker 1: to the rise of Anwar Ibrahim as Malaysia's prime Minister, 290 00:14:24,045 --> 00:14:27,255 Speaker 1: we speak to the people at the reporting front lines. 291 00:14:27,265 --> 00:14:29,935 Speaker 1: So if you want to know how the biggest global 292 00:14:29,935 --> 00:14:33,345 Speaker 1: stories unfold, make sure you follow or subscribe to us 293 00:14:33,455 --> 00:14:35,335 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. 294 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:41,060 Speaker 1: One of the concerns also is about hoarding right in 295 00:14:41,060 --> 00:14:44,710 Speaker 1: a typical home Now even my furniture, my mattress, all 296 00:14:44,710 --> 00:14:48,010 Speaker 1: those are highly combustible items. Take me you're saying some 297 00:14:48,010 --> 00:14:50,640 Speaker 1: homes have way too many things, right and that I'm 298 00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:52,170 Speaker 1: sure the fire safety hazard to. 299 00:14:52,180 --> 00:14:54,870 Speaker 2: Absolutely. This is the reason why we need to help 300 00:14:54,870 --> 00:14:58,070 Speaker 2: the hardest because of two reasons. One is hygiene. 301 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 2: It depends on all kinds of different types of hoarders. 302 00:15:00,730 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 2: Some hoarders will have some psychological issue. For example, there's 303 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 2: this lady I know she only hot things that are 304 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,400 Speaker 2: circular in shape so she will go find things that 305 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,140 Speaker 2: are wheels or something is around. If she cannot find 306 00:15:13,140 --> 00:15:16,660 Speaker 2: anything that's circular, she'll use plastic and make a loop. 307 00:15:16,670 --> 00:15:18,910 Speaker 2: And so her whole house is filled with circular thing. 308 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:23,260 Speaker 2: Another order, I know somehow the fellow just hot real 309 00:15:23,260 --> 00:15:29,489 Speaker 2: estate brochures. So the yeah, it's very strange. And then 310 00:15:29,500 --> 00:15:33,690 Speaker 2: some people who have newspaper, but generally speaking, most hoarders 311 00:15:33,690 --> 00:15:37,070 Speaker 2: are just like junk collector, they just collect all kinds 312 00:15:37,070 --> 00:15:38,989 Speaker 2: of things and a lot of them are combustible. 313 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,680 Speaker 1: Why is it so hard to clear these things from 314 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:42,580 Speaker 1: their homes. 315 00:15:42,590 --> 00:15:45,250 Speaker 2: It's a very tough thing to do because holding is 316 00:15:45,250 --> 00:15:48,040 Speaker 2: a very big topic, you can persuade them not to 317 00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:50,730 Speaker 2: bring things back. The problem is not the holding. The 318 00:15:50,730 --> 00:15:53,470 Speaker 2: problem is getting rid of stuff. You may persuade them 319 00:15:53,470 --> 00:15:56,460 Speaker 2: not to bring things back. But in order to clean 320 00:15:56,470 --> 00:15:58,710 Speaker 2: their house, you want to remove the item. Now that's 321 00:15:58,710 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 2: where the problem is because they will not be willing 322 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:04,450 Speaker 2: to because to you, these things look like junk to them. 323 00:16:04,450 --> 00:16:06,050 Speaker 2: They are like treasures and 324 00:16:06,310 --> 00:16:09,790 Speaker 2: somehow they perceive them something that they really need to have. 325 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,110 Speaker 1: This issue of holding has been discussed even in parliament before. 326 00:16:13,110 --> 00:16:15,500 Speaker 1: I think many mps have tried to address it. Since 327 00:16:15,500 --> 00:16:17,920 Speaker 1: we know it is a danger and hazard. If we 328 00:16:17,920 --> 00:16:20,670 Speaker 1: made it illegal to hold or to block your corridor 329 00:16:20,670 --> 00:16:22,359 Speaker 1: or your doorway, would that do it 330 00:16:22,375 --> 00:16:23,775 Speaker 1: anything to solve this problem? 331 00:16:23,785 --> 00:16:26,145 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a little bit old school on this. So 332 00:16:26,145 --> 00:16:29,715 Speaker 2: I do believe in strict legislation because the problem with 333 00:16:29,715 --> 00:16:32,805 Speaker 2: the hardest is not just his house, but the neighbors 334 00:16:32,805 --> 00:16:35,515 Speaker 2: as well. It's quite a terrible thing to have. A 335 00:16:35,515 --> 00:16:38,425 Speaker 2: neighborhood is a hoarder because it affect your own 336 00:16:38,610 --> 00:16:41,420 Speaker 2: a living condition, cockroaches and all that will come to 337 00:16:41,420 --> 00:16:44,450 Speaker 2: your house and the property price of your unit will 338 00:16:44,450 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 2: fall like a stone because anybody who is interested by 339 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:49,300 Speaker 2: your unit walk by and say, well you have a 340 00:16:49,300 --> 00:16:52,020 Speaker 2: neighbor from hell kind of thing. And of course, most importantly, 341 00:16:52,020 --> 00:16:52,830 Speaker 2: safety 342 00:16:53,060 --> 00:16:58,010 Speaker 2: and when hoarders block the whole corridor with their belongings 343 00:16:58,020 --> 00:17:00,870 Speaker 2: and there's a fire and order and people can really 344 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:04,649 Speaker 2: get into serious problem. So when it comes to that, 345 00:17:04,660 --> 00:17:08,889 Speaker 2: I do believe that very strict enforcement of legislation and 346 00:17:08,890 --> 00:17:12,490 Speaker 2: laws are needed at this point in time. Our observation 347 00:17:12,490 --> 00:17:17,060 Speaker 2: is that the authorities are very careful, they don't want 348 00:17:17,060 --> 00:17:20,410 Speaker 2: to just evict anyone easily. And so therefore 349 00:17:20,580 --> 00:17:23,490 Speaker 2: hoarders who receive a lot of complaints from neighbors and 350 00:17:23,490 --> 00:17:26,139 Speaker 2: all that. They take a long time to keep talking 351 00:17:26,140 --> 00:17:28,490 Speaker 2: to them over and over again and it could take years, 352 00:17:28,490 --> 00:17:32,750 Speaker 2: you know, before any drastic action is taken. So therefore 353 00:17:32,750 --> 00:17:36,530 Speaker 2: some of the places we service and help you can 354 00:17:36,530 --> 00:17:38,939 Speaker 2: see that the corridors are just feel with all kinds 355 00:17:38,940 --> 00:17:43,260 Speaker 2: of junk and furniture. Okay. It's quite strange. Yeah, 356 00:17:43,270 --> 00:17:45,440 Speaker 1: I guess maybe at the point where you draw the line, 357 00:17:45,450 --> 00:17:47,740 Speaker 1: if it's out in the corridor, in my opinion, they 358 00:17:47,740 --> 00:17:49,710 Speaker 1: should have the right to just take it away. 359 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 1: But if it's in my own home then it's true. 360 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:54,210 Speaker 1: Who are you to tell me how I should live 361 00:17:54,210 --> 00:17:56,430 Speaker 1: within my own home Benedict, I will come to you 362 00:17:56,430 --> 00:17:59,419 Speaker 1: in the association. Is this an issue as these are 363 00:17:59,420 --> 00:18:03,430 Speaker 1: all fire safety hazards? Right? All this stuff has actually, 364 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:07,090 Speaker 1: it's very difficult to enforce. But along the common corridor 365 00:18:07,100 --> 00:18:09,929 Speaker 1: in HDB estates notice, I would advise the resident to 366 00:18:09,930 --> 00:18:12,550 Speaker 1: actually approach the town council's see how we can do 367 00:18:12,550 --> 00:18:14,619 Speaker 1: it amicably in terms of getting rid of 368 00:18:14,630 --> 00:18:17,630 Speaker 1: the common corridor items because they're having a few five 369 00:18:17,630 --> 00:18:20,679 Speaker 1: years because of the items along the corridors. And they 370 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:23,810 Speaker 1: also obstruct escape routes as well. So all these are 371 00:18:23,810 --> 00:18:26,939 Speaker 1: very critical, we have to remove them and within the 372 00:18:26,940 --> 00:18:29,820 Speaker 1: house is a bit difficult to enforce because we have 373 00:18:29,820 --> 00:18:32,450 Speaker 1: our own habits and all that. I would also advise 374 00:18:32,450 --> 00:18:35,890 Speaker 1: that even whether residential estate or HD be to work 375 00:18:35,890 --> 00:18:39,100 Speaker 1: with the grassroots because they can actually try to help 376 00:18:39,109 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 1: me 377 00:18:39,369 --> 00:18:41,830 Speaker 1: the asian and all that. It comes in handy. I mean, 378 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,600 Speaker 1: you have the neighborhood committee or the RNC or even 379 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,230 Speaker 1: the C two E the Community Emergency and engagement committee 380 00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:50,359 Speaker 1: which is in charge of fire safety and all. So 381 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:53,140 Speaker 1: they can actually help in all this area to even 382 00:18:53,140 --> 00:18:56,950 Speaker 1: live agencies or town councils or whatever to help. If 383 00:18:56,950 --> 00:19:00,540 Speaker 1: we each new or took responsibility on our own, then 384 00:19:00,540 --> 00:19:02,669 Speaker 1: I guess to be considerate and to think of the 385 00:19:02,670 --> 00:19:04,119 Speaker 1: safety of others as well. 386 00:19:04,380 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 1: But that's a very difficult task Casey. I mean, do 387 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:10,290 Speaker 1: you think technology can play a bigger role in helping 388 00:19:10,290 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 1: keep us safe? Some arguing, maybe we can, I don't know, 389 00:19:12,930 --> 00:19:15,710 Speaker 1: isn't there more technology we can design into our buildings 390 00:19:15,710 --> 00:19:19,050 Speaker 1: to keep them safer from fires, sensors at home would 391 00:19:19,050 --> 00:19:22,650 Speaker 1: help to detect early detection of 392 00:19:22,670 --> 00:19:28,690 Speaker 1: Possible and smoke that is generated due to possible fires 393 00:19:28,690 --> 00:19:31,420 Speaker 1: that's going to come out. Could help yeah, but smoke detectors, 394 00:19:31,420 --> 00:19:34,140 Speaker 1: we've just made it mandatory. But that's only from homes 395 00:19:34,140 --> 00:19:38,629 Speaker 1: built as of 2018 onwards. So if it's that bigger concern, 396 00:19:38,630 --> 00:19:41,060 Speaker 1: why don't we make it mandatory for everyone? 397 00:19:41,070 --> 00:19:45,220 Speaker 2: Anything that's mandatory, the authorities are careful with they don't 398 00:19:45,220 --> 00:19:48,859 Speaker 2: want to have a blanket statement for anything. But for me, 399 00:19:49,030 --> 00:19:51,910 Speaker 2: you really do draw the line with public safety exactly 400 00:19:51,910 --> 00:19:55,609 Speaker 2: as Stephen said earlier, I have no idea why objects 401 00:19:55,609 --> 00:19:58,770 Speaker 2: left on common corridor can be allowed for so many 402 00:19:58,770 --> 00:20:02,550 Speaker 2: years in some estates. Seriously, some people even have a 403 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 2: kind of mini gym in the common area belong to them. 404 00:20:06,330 --> 00:20:08,270 Speaker 2: They just make use of the place they put up 405 00:20:08,270 --> 00:20:09,850 Speaker 2: so far and all that. It's as if it's an 406 00:20:09,850 --> 00:20:12,270 Speaker 2: extension of their home, but that's public area, 407 00:20:12,460 --> 00:20:16,770 Speaker 2: anything that involves public safety. My opinion is there to 408 00:20:16,770 --> 00:20:19,270 Speaker 2: be a lot more strict when you talk about office 409 00:20:19,270 --> 00:20:20,770 Speaker 2: right in office building, 410 00:20:20,940 --> 00:20:24,590 Speaker 2: the fire escape stairwell and all that. If they do 411 00:20:24,590 --> 00:20:26,430 Speaker 2: a spot check on you and they found objects that 412 00:20:26,430 --> 00:20:28,619 Speaker 2: they're going to find you, you know, is quite serious, 413 00:20:28,630 --> 00:20:32,740 Speaker 2: but we come to private residential till now. My observation 414 00:20:32,750 --> 00:20:35,460 Speaker 2: is I think a lot more can be done, especially 415 00:20:35,460 --> 00:20:38,370 Speaker 2: common area. Now, of course, behind closed doors in your 416 00:20:38,369 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 2: own private thing, that's another matter altogether. There is a 417 00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:43,730 Speaker 2: lot harder, but at least that common areas should be 418 00:20:43,740 --> 00:20:47,120 Speaker 2: clear and the fire safety standards are very clear. You know, 419 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:49,180 Speaker 2: you must have a clear walkway, 420 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:51,620 Speaker 1: you raise a good point actually were so strict with 421 00:20:51,619 --> 00:20:54,110 Speaker 1: fire safety when it comes to our commercial buildings, but 422 00:20:54,109 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: yet where miles away in the other respect, when it 423 00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:59,680 Speaker 1: comes to our own homes. Benedict why is that the case? 424 00:20:59,690 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: What do you think? I would say that probably the 425 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:04,650 Speaker 1: government is giving us leave because we are in charge 426 00:21:04,650 --> 00:21:06,719 Speaker 1: of our own home in that sense. Right? So in 427 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,400 Speaker 1: that case we will probably have to be responsible for 428 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,430 Speaker 1: our own safety, you know? Well, but when your home 429 00:21:12,430 --> 00:21:15,690 Speaker 1: burns my home could burn too. Okay if you say 430 00:21:15,690 --> 00:21:17,690 Speaker 1: that yes and no because our 431 00:21:17,700 --> 00:21:19,840 Speaker 1: buildings are built in such a way that for some 432 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:23,149 Speaker 1: of the flat hDB flat, they are all compartmentalized. So 433 00:21:23,150 --> 00:21:25,649 Speaker 1: in other words by right should not spread to the 434 00:21:25,650 --> 00:21:28,820 Speaker 1: next unit. Should not unless you know, expect through the 435 00:21:28,820 --> 00:21:32,090 Speaker 1: curtains and whatever like the common area, expect the common 436 00:21:32,090 --> 00:21:35,490 Speaker 1: area that But right, every unit is compartmentalized. So you 437 00:21:35,490 --> 00:21:38,290 Speaker 1: should not affect the next neighbor. But surely that's not 438 00:21:38,290 --> 00:21:41,210 Speaker 1: a very good reason for not being strict about fire safety. 439 00:21:41,220 --> 00:21:44,270 Speaker 1: We have to be responsible for our own safety. For 440 00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:46,050 Speaker 1: commercial industrial building is different because it's 441 00:21:46,070 --> 00:21:48,439 Speaker 1: community. Right? There's a lot of people in our face 442 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:50,739 Speaker 1: in the factory also. Okay. Maybe I asked you if 443 00:21:50,740 --> 00:21:52,699 Speaker 1: you had a wish list, what would you like to 444 00:21:52,700 --> 00:21:56,170 Speaker 1: see implemented in our homes right now to keep us 445 00:21:56,170 --> 00:21:58,990 Speaker 1: safe from fires. What would be perhaps two things that 446 00:21:58,990 --> 00:22:01,640 Speaker 1: you think we should change. You want to go first? Yeah, 447 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 1: I would say have more sensors, types of sensors to 448 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:09,090 Speaker 1: be able to detect and protect, especially the vulnerable ones 449 00:22:09,100 --> 00:22:13,010 Speaker 1: among us, our elderly parents while we are not at 450 00:22:13,010 --> 00:22:14,439 Speaker 1: home and things like that. Yeah. 451 00:22:14,450 --> 00:22:17,780 Speaker 1: What kind of sensors are we talking about? Like smoke alarms, alarms, 452 00:22:17,780 --> 00:22:22,830 Speaker 1: motion sensors or to detect a normal activities while we 453 00:22:22,830 --> 00:22:26,640 Speaker 1: are not at home? Ok. Benedict personally, a thing we 454 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:29,919 Speaker 1: start from the basic every house should have a fire extinguisher. 455 00:22:29,930 --> 00:22:33,859 Speaker 1: Fire blanket with cooking. There's a fire, you need a 456 00:22:33,859 --> 00:22:35,620 Speaker 1: fire blanket to cover it, which most of us do 457 00:22:35,619 --> 00:22:38,810 Speaker 1: not have. Then of course, the home fire alarm device, 458 00:22:38,810 --> 00:22:41,190 Speaker 1: which is the smoke detector because a lot of people 459 00:22:41,190 --> 00:22:42,820 Speaker 1: are succumbed by smoke and fire 460 00:22:42,830 --> 00:22:45,889 Speaker 1: when they sleep. The night room is still cool in 461 00:22:45,890 --> 00:22:48,500 Speaker 1: the room, but the living room on fire. So that's 462 00:22:48,510 --> 00:22:51,290 Speaker 1: how it beeps and wakes you up. Yeah, that's that's 463 00:22:51,290 --> 00:22:53,380 Speaker 1: the whole idea, right. These are the things that I 464 00:22:53,380 --> 00:22:56,300 Speaker 1: would like to see that everyone is having it. In fact, 465 00:22:56,300 --> 00:22:59,450 Speaker 1: the grassroots and even the National Fire and Emergency preparedness 466 00:22:59,450 --> 00:23:04,109 Speaker 1: Council smes is already encouraging people educating the public to 467 00:23:04,109 --> 00:23:07,210 Speaker 1: have that. And those we could quite easily by online 468 00:23:07,220 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 1: a fire blanket extinguisher and a smoke alarm. In fact, 469 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:11,200 Speaker 1: sometimes during 470 00:23:11,210 --> 00:23:15,010 Speaker 1: event they give for free, it's important actually is really 471 00:23:15,010 --> 00:23:18,919 Speaker 1: important because it's overheating fire in the kitchen where you 472 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:21,500 Speaker 1: can just cover it because we shouldn't be throwing water 473 00:23:21,500 --> 00:23:24,670 Speaker 1: on it. That is something many of us may forget taking, 474 00:23:24,670 --> 00:23:26,300 Speaker 1: What do you think? What would you like to change? 475 00:23:26,310 --> 00:23:30,450 Speaker 2: I think that anything that affects other people, you should 476 00:23:30,450 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 2: have very strict laws against it when the holder's action 477 00:23:35,730 --> 00:23:39,590 Speaker 2: affect the neighbors in safety and in hygiene. 478 00:23:39,830 --> 00:23:43,440 Speaker 2: I do believe that the strict laws should be enforced. Now, 479 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:46,890 Speaker 2: earlier you ask the question why this is allowed compared 480 00:23:46,890 --> 00:23:50,820 Speaker 2: to commercial building. My observation is that the authorities are 481 00:23:50,820 --> 00:23:55,179 Speaker 2: very careful when it comes to personal lives and public 482 00:23:55,180 --> 00:23:57,720 Speaker 2: opinion and stuff like that. They don't want to be 483 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,950 Speaker 2: seen to be bullying or being very harsh on, especially 484 00:24:01,950 --> 00:24:03,530 Speaker 2: the lower income group of people, 485 00:24:03,690 --> 00:24:08,760 Speaker 2: which is understandable. However, really when it crosses the safety line, 486 00:24:08,770 --> 00:24:12,410 Speaker 2: I think that is non negotiable straight away. If I 487 00:24:12,410 --> 00:24:16,290 Speaker 2: see stuff on the balcony or the corridor that is 488 00:24:16,290 --> 00:24:18,680 Speaker 2: going to become a fire hazard, I'm going to give 489 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 2: you a warning and say please remove me by this day. 490 00:24:21,530 --> 00:24:23,400 Speaker 2: If you don't do it, we will move in and 491 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:24,030 Speaker 2: remove it. 492 00:24:24,390 --> 00:24:27,200 Speaker 2: Really this we do not see happening because they will 493 00:24:27,210 --> 00:24:29,959 Speaker 2: keep persuading and on and on and go. So there 494 00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:32,370 Speaker 2: are many cases that we have encountered, whether thing has 495 00:24:32,369 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 2: been done like however, that's not something that is too 496 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,350 Speaker 2: about you. You just simply need to go and do 497 00:24:38,350 --> 00:24:41,480 Speaker 2: something about it and within the household itself, if you're 498 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:45,090 Speaker 2: holding behavior causes a very clear 499 00:24:45,340 --> 00:24:48,410 Speaker 2: threat to your neighbor in terms of fire hazard and 500 00:24:48,420 --> 00:24:52,010 Speaker 2: even hygiene. Again, I do believe stricter laws should be 501 00:24:52,010 --> 00:24:54,400 Speaker 2: enforced at this point of time. You will be surprised. 502 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,590 Speaker 2: You know, the laws do not allow, for example, the 503 00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:01,159 Speaker 2: police to just go into your house and to enforce whatever. 504 00:25:01,170 --> 00:25:05,650 Speaker 2: So they are very mindful and respectful of your privacy. 505 00:25:05,660 --> 00:25:08,170 Speaker 2: But like I said, once it crosses certain red line, 506 00:25:08,180 --> 00:25:10,490 Speaker 2: I do believe we need to be more careful. 507 00:25:10,500 --> 00:25:12,340 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point. Once 508 00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,740 Speaker 1: safety is at stake then we shouldn't be taking the risk. 509 00:25:15,750 --> 00:25:17,940 Speaker 1: You just need that one time for it to happen 510 00:25:17,940 --> 00:25:20,609 Speaker 1: and lives could be lost. And if we think about 511 00:25:20,609 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 1: it like Benedict's point of fire extinguishers and blankets, why 512 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:27,390 Speaker 1: not just buy one and give it to every household. 513 00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:29,510 Speaker 1: We are a fairly rich country and that is one 514 00:25:29,510 --> 00:25:31,590 Speaker 1: of the perks that we can perhaps right on to 515 00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:34,689 Speaker 1: keep our people safe. So maybe they'll do it closer 516 00:25:34,690 --> 00:25:39,250 Speaker 1: to the elections. Who knows? All right gentlemen, 517 00:25:39,380 --> 00:25:41,790 Speaker 1: thanks so much for sharing with us. Just want to 518 00:25:41,790 --> 00:25:43,959 Speaker 1: tell folks because many of us have seen fires on 519 00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:46,449 Speaker 1: tv but of course it's not the same and encountered 520 00:25:46,450 --> 00:25:48,290 Speaker 1: this when I worked on an episode of talking point 521 00:25:48,290 --> 00:25:51,180 Speaker 1: where we tested these fires in a facility and I 522 00:25:51,190 --> 00:25:55,780 Speaker 1: saw how fast it could quickly could spread within two minutes. 523 00:25:55,780 --> 00:25:58,970 Speaker 1: The entire room was ablaze. And when you see that, 524 00:25:58,970 --> 00:26:02,510 Speaker 1: that it becomes really scary because fires do kill people 525 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:05,130 Speaker 1: and also firefighters risk their lives daily to keep us 526 00:26:05,130 --> 00:26:06,400 Speaker 1: safe from these fires. And 527 00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:09,210 Speaker 1: not too long ago we unfortunately had the tragedy of 528 00:26:09,210 --> 00:26:12,439 Speaker 1: a young national serviceman dying because he was trying to 529 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:13,379 Speaker 1: put out the fire. 530 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,930 Speaker 1: So thank you gentlemen for sharing your insights with us. 531 00:26:17,940 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: We hope this discussion has also shed light for those 532 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 1: of you who are listening in on how our behaviors 533 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,030 Speaker 1: can be dangerous. Our own behaviors not just to us 534 00:26:26,030 --> 00:26:29,160 Speaker 1: but to those around us to just remember that scented 535 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,460 Speaker 1: candle may seem nice at home, but if you leave 536 00:26:32,460 --> 00:26:36,710 Speaker 1: it unattended is possibly another fire waiting to happen. So 537 00:26:36,710 --> 00:26:37,870 Speaker 1: do bear that in mind. 538 00:26:38,380 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 1: I want to thank my guest for taking the time 539 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,450 Speaker 1: to give us their views and to the team behind 540 00:26:42,450 --> 00:26:46,980 Speaker 1: this episode, Jacqueline chan, Joanne chan solution and Christina robert 541 00:26:47,030 --> 00:26:49,590 Speaker 1: and I'm Stephen chow signing off, I'll see you next week.