Speaker 1: You're listening to a CNA podcast.
Speaker 1: If we're honest, every single one of us would admit
Speaker 1: to following a social media influencer online. They may be
Speaker 1: a funny personality who does bad impressions, an impossibly thin
Speaker 1: model who flies business class with her pet pooch or
Speaker 1: someone who tells her fellow mummies how to eat whatever
Speaker 1: you want and still stay slim,
Speaker 1: love them or loathe them. They are part of what
Speaker 1: is now known as the creator economy. Goldman Sachs estimates
Speaker 1: this could double in size to hit half a trillion
Speaker 1: by 2027. And the thing is data shows that only 4%
Speaker 1: of global creators make more than $100,000 a year. And
Speaker 1: that's what we want to talk about today. How does
Speaker 1: one create a stable income by being a content creator?
Speaker 1: How do you plan your finances when you've got money
Speaker 1: coming in?
Speaker 1: It's me, Elizabeth Neo and thank you for listening to
Speaker 1: Money Talks. I'm back with my limited series. Am I adulting? Right?
Speaker 1: Where I figure out some of life's money issues and
Speaker 1: chat with people who may have the answers and joining
Speaker 1: me to talk more about this is a local content creator,
Speaker 1: Dian who runs his own multichannel network and manages other
Speaker 1: content creators and,
Speaker 1: and business owner Demi. So who is also the wife
Speaker 1: of Tian Ha. Thank you for joining us today. I
Speaker 1: just want to start off by asking the two of
Speaker 1: you how you got started as a content creator or
Speaker 1: an influencer. I
Speaker 2: got started when I was in high school. 10 years.
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, 12 years ago when I lived in Vietnam.
Speaker 2: So I actually lived in Cambodia first for five years
Speaker 2: and then Vietnam for six years. So we started around
Speaker 2: 2010
Speaker 2: and the, the first video was actually a school project video.
Speaker 2: And our job was to create an anti-bullying video. Then
Speaker 2: we picked up some skills and then me and my
Speaker 2: friends thought, hey, actually we could make this a thing.
Speaker 2: So we started doing some sketches, how to cut the queue,
Speaker 2: how to cut the line and even how to cross
Speaker 2: the road in Vietnam. So giving tips like this, our
Speaker 2: youtube channel, it took off a little and then after that,
Speaker 2: I came back to Singapore
Speaker 2: and I started my media agency four years later. Did
Speaker 1: you think that creating videos would propel you into starting
Speaker 1: your own multichannel network? You've got so many followers online,
Speaker 1: you also manage other content creators. Did you ever think
Speaker 1: that starting a youtube channel making videos would set you
Speaker 1: on that path?
Speaker 2: It initially wasn't the plan at the start, I just,
Speaker 2: my dream was just to not work for anyone.
Speaker 1: Ok.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, it seems to have come true for
Speaker 1: you because you don't work for anyone. You work
Speaker 2: for yourself. It took me a few years to realize
Speaker 2: that there's no such thing as not working for anyone
Speaker 2: that you will always be accountable for people in the end. I,
Speaker 2: I work for work for more people.
Speaker 1: Ok, Debbie. Did you always want to be a content creator?
Speaker 1: I think in the
Speaker 2: beginning. No. Um oh, I'm not done with my story
Speaker 2: after, after high school, I started the agency and then
Speaker 2: we brought in a few creators under the network. And
Speaker 2: when Debbie and I first got together, I always knew
Speaker 2: Debbie had what it takes to be a content creator.
Speaker 2: I east her in slowly
Speaker 2: and then um everything just naturally happened.
Speaker 1: I want to know about getting started and, and whether
Speaker 1: this was actually part of your career plan to become
Speaker 1: a content creator and make that like a full time job. Oh, definitely.
Speaker 2: It was never in my plans and I'm, I'm not
Speaker 2: a person that plans very, very fine to the future.
Speaker 2: And I took it one step at a time. I mean,
Speaker 2: when we first met, when we fell in love,
Speaker 2: it was just me going to school and stuff and
Speaker 2: we started the cafe business when I was in school.
Speaker 2: So at that point of time, I was helping to
Speaker 2: manage the cafe. And then slowly, slowly, we just eased
Speaker 2: into it. He was asking me to appear in some
Speaker 2: of the videos and that's where like started to pick
Speaker 2: up and I started to get my own like audience
Speaker 2: and
Speaker 1: followers. So which point did you find that? Hey, actually,
Speaker 1: I can make this into a job that brings me
Speaker 1: an income?
Speaker 2: I think when their clients started coming in, when the
Speaker 2: brand start working with
Speaker 1: her for you, when did you realize that this could
Speaker 1: be a job? Maybe when you started to see money clients?
Speaker 1: Even when
Speaker 2: I first started seeing money come in, I wasn't sure
Speaker 2: what the industry will be like, how long I will
Speaker 2: be here for because the typical shelf life for an
Speaker 2: influencer or content creator is around four years. So that's
Speaker 1: very interesting. I want to actually hear more about that
Speaker 1: when you say shelf life, meaning
Speaker 2: meaning after four years, they kind of either drop off
Speaker 2: or they no longer be relevant or someone in the
Speaker 2: same field becomes newer and they come in with more
Speaker 2: skills or something fresher. So
Speaker 1: how do you drop off? Do you get less sponsorships?
Speaker 1: Do brands start to not want to work with you
Speaker 1: as much?
Speaker 2: I think it's the same like a product life cycle
Speaker 2: for any brand that brings in a product or like
Speaker 2: shampoo or something. They always still have to refresh their
Speaker 2: product or do a rebrand or just the same as
Speaker 2: content creators, they have to stay relevant, reinvent themselves. And
Speaker 2: it's quite rare to see
Speaker 2: content creators remain at the top level for a very
Speaker 2: long time. No, no, no, no.
Speaker 1: Very supportive.
Speaker 2: Yes, she's very supportive. But generally they are so jaded
Speaker 2: from content creation that they, they usually take a break
Speaker 2: and find something else. Or
Speaker 2: um it could even be on the upside where you
Speaker 2: leverage on your influence to build something bigger than just
Speaker 2: being an influencer. And then you realize that is the
Speaker 2: path that you want to go. So that being a
Speaker 2: content creator is often a stepping stone to something else.
Speaker 2: But at the same time, it could be your main
Speaker 2: career if you put your heart and soul
Speaker 1: into it. So you make plenty of good points. I
Speaker 1: actually want to follow up on some of them.
Speaker 1: For some, it is a stepping stone to something bigger,
Speaker 1: but for others, it is the end goal I think
Speaker 1: for some people who want to convert influencing as their
Speaker 1: part time hustle into a full time career. Have you
Speaker 1: seen examples of people who are like that? And
Speaker 2: we manage a lot of influences. So,
Speaker 2: so we've seen all kinds of influences and there are
Speaker 2: the kinds that doing content while they are studying, they
Speaker 2: are the ones who quit school to do it full time.
Speaker 2: There are also people who work and do content creation
Speaker 2: on the site. So there's all, all of the different
Speaker 2: types of influences I would say.
Speaker 1: So how does one get into making a full time
Speaker 1: career out of content creation?
Speaker 2: I think it comes down to what they plan to achieve.
Speaker 2: It's easy for youths or people to say they want
Speaker 2: to be a content creator.
Speaker 2: But what does that actually mean? Does that just mean
Speaker 2: that they want to be famous or does that mean
Speaker 2: that they don't want to work for someone or does
Speaker 2: it mean that they just want to take pictures and
Speaker 2: look nice travel? It's because it does seem like a
Speaker 2: very glorious and fun life. But oftentimes that's not the case. Yeah,
Speaker 2: there are many things that happen behind the scenes that
Speaker 2: are not seen by the public like for him doing
Speaker 2: youtube and social media, like everyone's just like, you know, hey,
Speaker 2: it's just a 10 minute video and what
Speaker 2: say, how can I drive such a nice car and like,
Speaker 2: you know, have such a luxurious life but the struggles
Speaker 2: that they don't see behind the scenes, the scripting, the editing,
Speaker 2: the production, everything that happens are not seen, right? And
Speaker 2: they think that it's a very like straightforward and simple,
Speaker 2: like 10 minute video, but a 10 minute video takes
Speaker 2: more than a week to produce. It's far from straightforward
Speaker 2: and now that the industry is so saturated, there's influences everywhere.
Speaker 2: Almost everyone is an influencer, it then becomes hard for
Speaker 2: someone to want to pursue
Speaker 2: this if they do not have the right goals in
Speaker 2: mind and the right
Speaker 1: plan. Another thing you said earlier was that some people
Speaker 1: use a leverage on their positions as a content creator
Speaker 1: influencer to, you know, start businesses and sort of that
Speaker 1: extends their shelf life. So I know you have a
Speaker 1: jewelry business. Is this something that's right. Um This is
Speaker 1: a path that you took, talk about how you were
Speaker 1: able to extend shelf life or this was starting your
Speaker 1: own
Speaker 1: own jewelry business. Part of your long term plan as
Speaker 1: an influencer because bear in mind what said some people
Speaker 1: you fall out, you fall behind. There always be younger,
Speaker 1: more popular people coming on to the space. I
Speaker 2: never stepped in meeting him wanting to become a content creator.
Speaker 2: It happened along the way, but ever since I was young,
Speaker 2: I knew I wanted to start my own business. Um
Speaker 2: So before I started,
Speaker 2: so I actually run a dog bakery called the Wolf Bakery.
Speaker 2: So I was baking doggie cakes from home and I
Speaker 2: really enjoyed that. But I realized there was a little
Speaker 2: bit of limitations when it comes to baking cakes by
Speaker 2: myself because it was very difficult. We were traveling a lot.
Speaker 2: At that point of time, we had a lot of
Speaker 2: like commitments. We were going to like different countries every
Speaker 2: other few weeks. And at that point of time, I was,
Speaker 2: I think a few customers because we take in orders,
Speaker 2: like in advance and then last minute I'll be like, sorry,
Speaker 2: I really have to go on a trip and then
Speaker 2: I have to cancel. And so eventually I stopped doing
Speaker 2: the wolf. Although it was a very, very fun and
Speaker 2: exciting time for me. It was very personal because she
Speaker 2: baked every cake herself. Yeah, I, I have to see
Speaker 2: the potato. Yes, she was my unpaid stuff.
Speaker 2: But yeah, it was really fun. So all along, I
Speaker 2: kind of knew that I wanted to run my own business.
Speaker 2: I like making decisions like being creative and doing a
Speaker 2: lot of hands on things. So um after I stopped
Speaker 2: the Wolf Bakery, I think not long after we got married,
Speaker 2: I realized how girls really like accessories and diamonds and
Speaker 2: for myself personally, I'm very, very clumsy. So I will
Speaker 2: lose my expensive things, right?
Speaker 2: So I was looking for a good alternative for girls
Speaker 2: or anyone who likes diamonds. So that's why I got
Speaker 2: into a co creating my own brand. So
Speaker 1: starting your jewelry brand was born from your passion as
Speaker 1: when you were younger to eventually run your own business.
Speaker 1: Do you find that it is something that influences content
Speaker 1: creators these days are actually pivoting
Speaker 1: to especially those that are much older, you know, in
Speaker 1: order to extend their shelf life, so to speak.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. It's, it's a pattern we see because to
Speaker 2: follow and influences brand, it's very exciting as an audience
Speaker 2: to understand their journey, to follow them for a long
Speaker 2: time and then to see them launch a brand,
Speaker 2: a business. Um You just want to support them. I
Speaker 2: think they feel like it's very personal and they were
Speaker 2: part of the entire journey, building the business together with
Speaker 2: you and watching it grow. I think they feel like
Speaker 2: it's a very personal journey. Like we share like all
Speaker 2: aspects of the business.
Speaker 1: So this podcast, right? We talk a lot about finance,
Speaker 1: financial advice, personal finances for someone who is intending to
Speaker 1: become a full time content creator.
Speaker 1: How do you make sure that this is a lucrative career?
Speaker 1: How do you work with brands, negotiate payment, that sort
Speaker 1: of thing because you are your own boss at the
Speaker 1: end of the day,
Speaker 2: right? Yes, you are however, not all creators are entrepreneurs
Speaker 2: or should be. So a lot of them are. No,
Speaker 2: it's true. Some are amazing and so talented in
Speaker 2: the view of content creation, in video making in photos,
Speaker 2: in articulating their words, in podcast, stuff like this, right?
Speaker 2: You have, you see a lot of these, but how
Speaker 2: many of them actually have the business skills are? Exactly.
Speaker 1: So how do you convert that into a
Speaker 2: um So for people like this to earn money, my
Speaker 2: suggestion for them would be to work closely with an
Speaker 2: agency that they trust for me. 10 years ago when
Speaker 2: I first started, I actually signed to an agency. And
Speaker 2: through that, it gave me the chance to create
Speaker 2: and focus on creating. While at the same time, I
Speaker 2: have a manager representing me and a good company who
Speaker 2: negotiates for me
Speaker 1: as a content creator yourself. And you also manage other
Speaker 1: content creators. I think I want to ask this question,
Speaker 1: how much can you realistically expect to make? How much
Speaker 1: does a content creator make?
Speaker 2: I think it can range from anywhere from like zero millions.
Speaker 2: Like if you
Speaker 2: the top creators in the world, Mr be Logan Paul
Speaker 2: K si they are earning such big bucks. Even Ryan's
Speaker 2: world who just does toys, toy
Speaker 1: reviews. What about in Singapore? Don't compare with the US
Speaker 1: guys because there is also a much bigger market there.
Speaker 1: How much are content creators making? For example, one tiktok
Speaker 1: post one Instagram post one Instagram story. How many a
Speaker 1: month do you do then at the end of the day?
Speaker 1: How much do you make in a year?
Speaker 2: It can really range from 00 to anything I would
Speaker 2: say millions
Speaker 1: even in Singapore. Why not? How much could we realistically
Speaker 1: expect to pay for one Instagram post for someone who
Speaker 1: is quite well known in
Speaker 1: the creator scene?
Speaker 2: Maybe 2 to 10,000. If you if you are working
Speaker 2: a brand, if you're a smaller influencer, the budget will
Speaker 2: of course be a little bit smaller and then they will.
Speaker 2: But the three of you for example, um they will,
Speaker 2: they will send you some of their product and hope
Speaker 2: that you can post about it. And then on the
Speaker 2: more macro influencer side, then the fee tends to get
Speaker 2: a little bit higher and it can range up to
Speaker 2: five digits.
Speaker 1: And that's just for one post. How many requests for
Speaker 1: post do you get a month? For example, me
Speaker 1: in general it doesn't have to be you. But how
Speaker 1: about the people that you manage? Maybe 34 requests for posts? Yeah,
Speaker 2: 3 to 4 is reasonable. If they work harder, it
Speaker 2: would be more, for example, it will be less.
Speaker 1: So how many, what's the most you've seen
Speaker 2: the most? I've seen? 0 to 10, 0 to 10
Speaker 2: is 10 a
Speaker 1: month
Speaker 1: possible 10 Instagram posts a month.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there are also like IG stories, I GREs tiktok,
Speaker 2: different platforms also that your brain can share appearing in videos.
Speaker 1: So on. How many sort of engagements on average do
Speaker 1: you see a month? So this can be um your
Speaker 1: Instagram post, your reals, plus your tiktok videos and appearing
Speaker 1: youtube videos. How many you know these sort of engagements
Speaker 1: do you see in a month
Speaker 1: back then?
Speaker 1: 10 is the average
Speaker 2: 10 would be a good number if you want to
Speaker 2: take up the job, I'm sure there is a formula
Speaker 2: to calculate the comfort of a content creator on on.
Speaker 2: I think everybody has a different equation. Some may do
Speaker 2: it for you know, literally nothing for just free products
Speaker 2: and like,
Speaker 2: yeah, yeah, until they, until they see that it's a
Speaker 2: sustainable career and some will reject all the free stuff
Speaker 2: and only demand money. Everyone is different.
Speaker 1: OK? So you're saying it doesn't matter how many you
Speaker 1: have at the end of the day, how many followers
Speaker 1: you have at the end of the day, it's
Speaker 2: not the only metric. There are multiple consideration factors that
Speaker 2: come into play
Speaker 2: and followers are just one of them. Followers, oftentimes also
Speaker 2: just give credibility to the influencer like, OK, we know
Speaker 2: this person has a certain amount of subscribers followers throughout
Speaker 2: their platforms. We know that um they have built a
Speaker 2: following over the years, something like that. Then you start
Speaker 2: to see their engagement
Speaker 2: and then you see the quality of the content that
Speaker 2: they make, do they understand the trends? Um Is there
Speaker 2: a certain creativity in their content?
Speaker 2: So these are all the factors that we consider when
Speaker 2: working with an influencer and even bring an influencer on board?
Speaker 2: I can, I can tell you the truth right now,
Speaker 2: a 50,000 follower creator can go from zero, they can
Speaker 2: literally earn $0 for like 6 to 12 months. And
Speaker 2: there's there could be another 50,000 follower influencers who can
Speaker 2: earn up to 100,000
Speaker 2: per year.
Speaker 1: And what sets those two influencers apart?
Speaker 2: Then? Well, then, then it comes down to um the
Speaker 2: sources of revenue for the influencer? Like what, what does
Speaker 2: the influencer encompass? How hard does the influencer work and
Speaker 2: what is their niche? What is their audience? Let me
Speaker 2: give you an example. If you are a parents and
Speaker 2: you look up to a certain parenting influencer,
Speaker 2: when you go to look for maybe stuff like milk powders,
Speaker 2: diapers or other other stuff, maybe clothes, you would tend
Speaker 2: to trust their recommendations. And then if you are a brand,
Speaker 2: this is the influencer that you will go to. So
Speaker 2: as an influencer to earn more money, they need to
Speaker 2: have a niche and they need to gain the trust
Speaker 2: of their audience. So for somebody like this, they would
Speaker 2: tend to earn more as compared to someone who just
Speaker 2: takes nice photos, for example.
Speaker 1: So developing area.
Speaker 2: So if you ask me, followers do not play that
Speaker 2: much of a part in how much you earn. It's,
Speaker 2: it's just a range of your audience. But
Speaker 2: even as an agency, we tend to not segregate influences
Speaker 2: by their follower number, but through their engagement and their influence,
Speaker 1: if I'm interpreting this right, you're trying to say that
Speaker 1: it depends on the niche area and that particular audience
Speaker 1: that you are engaging.
Speaker 2: So even your niche may be a more lucrative industry.
Speaker 2: For example, if your niche is in tech, in gaming,
Speaker 2: in parenting, it could be a lot more than if
Speaker 2: you were in the business of, I don't know something
Speaker 2: else
Speaker 1: So would you say, would you attribute that to, you know,
Speaker 1: part of your success as quite a well known influencer?
Speaker 1: Because we see a lot of them out there, but
Speaker 1: only very few make it to the top, have big
Speaker 1: brands that they work with and also have a longer
Speaker 1: shelf life than most others. So would you say that
Speaker 1: having a niche? And now that would you attribute that
Speaker 1: to be part of your success?
Speaker 2: Um Yes or no. For me, I focused on the
Speaker 2: mass audience. So I did not focus on a niche.
Speaker 2: So the way I grew, my audience was through a
Speaker 2: mass audience and, and through viral topics
Speaker 2: that got me quite international and grew a pretty international
Speaker 2: fan base. And it also helped my standing in the
Speaker 2: Singapore market
Speaker 1: for Debbie. How did you raise your profile as a creator?
Speaker 2: I focus a lot on being myself and being a wife,
Speaker 2: a mom and a business owner. I show different aspects
Speaker 2: of my life and I
Speaker 2: to be as real as I can to share like
Speaker 2: the struggles, the successes. And that's when I feel like
Speaker 2: I really get to connect with my audience and also
Speaker 2: build the trust. Yeah, she's very chill just what she wants.
Speaker 2: Sometimes I have to tell her like that this post
Speaker 2: is too dark, like shoot it outside. I'm like just
Speaker 2: let
Speaker 1: me post, maybe authenticity is key and it's something that
Speaker 1: people like to see.
Speaker 1: Hello everyone. My name is Christina and I'm Adrian and
Speaker 1: we're the host of a podcast called Work It If
Speaker 1: you never heard of it. Well, it's a good time
Speaker 1: to tap in. In the last three episodes. We've discussed
Speaker 1: topics like how to negotiate for a salary increase or
Speaker 1: how to get along with younger colleagues who have different
Speaker 1: values from you.
Speaker 1: Incidentally is our top performing episode. If work consumes your
Speaker 1: life and you want some perspective on issues like management stress,
Speaker 1: even office romance. This podcast should be on your list.
Speaker 1: A new episode drops every Monday. Catch us on the
Speaker 1: CN A app or wherever you get your podcast.
Speaker 1: Um I also think that a lot of your income
Speaker 1: streams comes from working with, with brands, right? So from
Speaker 1: your experience, some tips that you may have, how do
Speaker 1: influencers or content features determine their worth when they work
Speaker 1: with brands, how do you negotiate better deals with
Speaker 2: brands? Join the right agency? I think you have to
Speaker 2: trust the right agency to represent you first
Speaker 2: because at this day and age with so many influencers
Speaker 2: around the world, the market is so saturated, it's also
Speaker 2: very normal for a brand to not know who to
Speaker 2: work with. So if you work with an agency that
Speaker 2: is able to sell you, well, I think that is
Speaker 2: very important and at the same time, you can focus
Speaker 2: on your content creation.
Speaker 1: What are some common mistakes that people starting out as
Speaker 1: content creators or influencers make
Speaker 2: a lot of them are trying to imitate someone or
Speaker 2: trying to be someone. And it does take a very
Speaker 2: long time for youtubers to find their style. Even Mr
Speaker 2: Bees took ages to finally become who he is today.
Speaker 2: I myself took maybe 4 to 6 years to truly
Speaker 2: understand what my style is. So as a youtuber or
Speaker 2: content creator, I just think it comes down to just
Speaker 2: doing posting and just getting your work out there
Speaker 2: until you realize that there's something that works, then just
Speaker 2: keep doing it in different ways. I think consistency, consistency
Speaker 2: and having that discipline to post every day. I I
Speaker 2: think that's very important. You can have someone who is
Speaker 2: super creative, has a lot of opinions, but only post
Speaker 2: once a week or post a blurry photo with a
Speaker 2: long caption. Then it would not work as well as
Speaker 2: somebody who post seven times a week,
Speaker 1: Debbie from your experience. So what do you think are
Speaker 1: some misconceptions that come with being a content creator?
Speaker 2: Misconceptions?
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people like, like I said earlier, right?
Speaker 2: That they think that it's like a very, very straightforward job,
Speaker 2: but to achieve consistency is not
Speaker 2: the easiest for you to, you know, think of constant content,
Speaker 2: how to make it funnier or more engaging it, it's
Speaker 2: really a struggle. So sometimes your brain really goes like
Speaker 2: dry and then you have to like chill out, find
Speaker 2: some inspiration. Another mistake is when influencers work with a
Speaker 2: brand and they become too hard sell and then there's
Speaker 2: that lack of creation.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's one of the biggest
Speaker 2: mistake that content creator can make, especially in their early age,
Speaker 1: which brings me to my next point. How do you
Speaker 1: plan your finances, your financial goals, your future needs when
Speaker 1: your income streams, of course, may or may not be
Speaker 1: so consistent, especially with every month. If you work with
Speaker 1: a big brand, then you know, of course, the income
Speaker 1: is more and then some months dr periods,
Speaker 2: that's why those who
Speaker 2: pursue a full time content creation career are risk takers.
Speaker 2: And for a lot of them, they are willing to
Speaker 2: live with this, to live with the unknown because they
Speaker 2: aren't able to forecast their finances. But generally if one
Speaker 2: takes the step to quit, whatever they are doing to
Speaker 2: pursue a content creation career,
Speaker 2: it's highly likely that they have plans and it's, it's
Speaker 2: very rare to see somebody quit whatever they are doing
Speaker 2: school or work and not know what's coming forward. The
Speaker 2: content creators who I've seen generally know that they are
Speaker 2: on the rise and this is a step worth taking.
Speaker 2: Aside from the norm
Speaker 1: for the two of you, you have a little family,
Speaker 1: you have a daughter. How do you plan your future,
Speaker 1: your finances? How do you deal with emergency costs for example,
Speaker 2: investment building businesses, buying hospital insurance. It is super important
Speaker 2: for real. Like
Speaker 2: we experienced that like twice. Unfortunately, when staley was younger,
Speaker 2: she was hospitalized and I realized, you know, how important
Speaker 2: it actually is to have a good hospital for real.
Speaker 1: Yeah, from your experience and how do you have a
Speaker 1: fixed income stream because you
Speaker 1: manage influence from
Speaker 2: my company. I draw a salary and then through my
Speaker 2: work on my branded content, there is another source of revenue.
Speaker 2: It's two different job scripts and two different revenues. Um
Speaker 2: So I play a job as a CEO in Titan
Speaker 2: digital media. And at the same time, I'm also a
Speaker 2: content creator, just like Debbie, she's the owner of her
Speaker 2: brand and she's also a content creator.
Speaker 1: So another point that you brought up earlier was that,
Speaker 1: you know, if people don't rejuvenate and update and basically
Speaker 1: stay relevant, they lose out to younger or newer people
Speaker 1: on the scene with more followers. What happens also if
Speaker 1: you age out, if you get too old, is that
Speaker 1: a thing? No, it's not
Speaker 2: anti aging as you grow older, it's in fact easier
Speaker 2: to have your own niche and to have the credibility
Speaker 2: and trust of your audience and brands,
Speaker 2: those who have been in the industry for at least
Speaker 2: 5 to 10 years. If I were a brand or
Speaker 2: an agency, I will not be afraid that this person
Speaker 2: may get into the news for something that may affect
Speaker 2: our campaign. They are a safer choice and a more
Speaker 2: credible choice because of the audience and the work they
Speaker 2: have done over the years that plays a big part
Speaker 1: as well. So you're saying that influencers are content creators
Speaker 1: who have been in this role for longer tend to
Speaker 1: be more legitimate and it is easier to navigate the
Speaker 1: space get more. Is that true? Being in the game
Speaker 1: for longer is easier than those who are starting out.
Speaker 1: It
Speaker 2: is actually not easier than those who are starting out
Speaker 2: because those who are on the rise, it's very exciting.
Speaker 2: The brands want to put their names on them. Everyone
Speaker 2: wants a piece of them. But at the end of
Speaker 2: the day, it comes down to different strategies as well
Speaker 2: and understanding the trends of the market and with a
Speaker 2: more effective marketing strategy for a brand, you would want
Speaker 2: a more diverse range of influences to work with.
Speaker 1: Do you two of you see yourself doing this for
Speaker 1: a long time
Speaker 2: for me? Yes, I would love to do it forever.
Speaker 2: It does not change over the years, the passion and
Speaker 2: the creativity in my blood to create videos and to
Speaker 2: work with content creators. And at this age, I feel
Speaker 2: like I can also be a mentor to a lot
Speaker 2: of creators. I'm able to inspire them, I'm able to
Speaker 2: guide them, I'm able to
Speaker 2: share with them the mistakes and the shortcomings that I
Speaker 2: face throughout my last 10 years so that they can
Speaker 2: reach my level in two years. And that, that's what
Speaker 2: I aspire to be and that's what I hope I
Speaker 2: can do for the influencers and the content creators around
Speaker 2: me and in tighten digital media
Speaker 2: because at the end of the day, I want to
Speaker 2: see this greater economy grow. I do believe that in
Speaker 2: the coming years in the future influencers, content creators will
Speaker 2: be a real and stable job. The current generation aspires
Speaker 2: to be youtubers aspire to be um tiktoker influencers. And
Speaker 2: as they grow older, we will actually see it come
Speaker 2: to fruition and it won't take long.
Speaker 1: Well, how you think that you know, this creative space
Speaker 1: will only grow and more people turn to. Yeah. And
Speaker 2: and it's also my part to build this creative ecosystem
Speaker 2: being in my position. Give
Speaker 1: us your best financial advice for someone who is a
Speaker 1: content creator or thinking of being a content creator
Speaker 1: but is concerned about streams of income losing out to
Speaker 1: other content creators. You know, the the issue of being
Speaker 1: competitive in this space and basically planning for their future.
Speaker 1: My
Speaker 2: answer would be a bit biased because I am after
Speaker 2: all a CEO of a talent agency. However, I really
Speaker 2: encourage the younger influencers or those who are starting out
Speaker 2: to look into working with an agency, not like selling
Speaker 2: your soul to the agency, but just having a good
Speaker 2: relationship with agencies because at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: these agencies that will sell you, that eventually have a
Speaker 2: certain comfort with working with you.
Speaker 2: And in fact, they will help you plan your finances.
Speaker 2: If you have discussions with them, they will be able
Speaker 2: to share more of their plans. And at the end
Speaker 2: of the day also invest your money and time wisely.
Speaker 2: That
Speaker 1: is the dream, right. I'm sure people
Speaker 1: and look at your car as well and be like, hey,
Speaker 1: I want to get there. I mean, he worked really,
Speaker 1: really
Speaker 2: hard. Yeah, he deserves it. But a few more, I
Speaker 1: have to ask him for his financial advice because everybody
Speaker 1: would aspire to
Speaker 2: my advice would be, don't ask me for advice.
Speaker 1: Oh, but you know, this is a perfect example of
Speaker 1: someone who or rather an example of someone who has
Speaker 1: in the eyes of many young people out there, made
Speaker 1: it managed to start his own business, manage other content creators.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, definitely there will be questions on
Speaker 1: how I can do that too, how a young or
Speaker 1: someone else out
Speaker 2: there passion, you must work hard, be consistent
Speaker 1: and how do you manage your finances,
Speaker 2: discipline and how to manage the finances? But should
Speaker 1: I be buying my first supercar with? Is this something
Speaker 1: that you,
Speaker 2: I mean, if it, if it makes you happy, if
Speaker 2: it justifies the work you have done, if you know what,
Speaker 2: what your priority go for it. I think in life,
Speaker 2: whether you are a content creator or not, you should
Speaker 2: just enjoy and be happy. And there's not always an
Speaker 2: absolute need to follow the traditional way of thinking. Life
Speaker 2: is already very difficult work can be tough going out
Speaker 2: with your friends buying something that is a little bit
Speaker 2: more expensive.
Speaker 2: It's fun. And if it makes you happy, you know,
Speaker 2: if it makes everything more justifiable, then sure. OK. Takes
Speaker 2: away the
Speaker 1: misery. That's a wise word. So while many are drawn
Speaker 1: to the flexibility of working at your own pace and
Speaker 1: being your own boss and recognize that it is possible
Speaker 1: to monetize your hobby. It's really not as rosy as
Speaker 1: it seems, but as we heard, it can be a
Speaker 1: legitimate career and not just because Oxford Dictionary added the
Speaker 1: word influencer
Speaker 1: back in 2022. So how and Debbie thank you so
Speaker 1: much for coming on the show and thank you to
Speaker 1: our listeners for tuning in. If you've enjoyed this episode
Speaker 1: of Money Talks, do check out our other content on Spotify,
Speaker 1: Apple or Google Podcasts. And we're also gonna be taking
Speaker 1: a short break, do follow us so that, you know,
Speaker 1: when the new episodes drop. Now the team behind Money
Speaker 1: Talks is Joanne Chan, Jacqueline Chan, Christina Robert and me,
Speaker 1: Liz Neil.