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Speaker 1: This is a C. N. A. Podcast

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Speaker 1: And the US Democrats have defied historic trends in the

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Speaker 1: midterm elections. The party has sealed control of the Senate

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Speaker 1: after victories in close contests in Nevada and Arizona? It

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Speaker 1: means that Democrats now have 50 Senate seats to Republicans

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Speaker 1: 49 seats. It's a major feat as voters often give

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Speaker 1: the president's party a beating during the midterms.

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Speaker 1: CNN's Jill new Bronner there with news of the democrats

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Speaker 1: holding the Senate with the remaining Georgia's seat set for

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Speaker 1: a december runoff.

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Speaker 1: Hello, I'm steve lie. And it's been a week since

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Speaker 1: the U. S. Midterm elections. And while the Senate has

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Speaker 1: been decided the fate of the House of Representatives still

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Speaker 1: hangs in the balance. The republicans are currently on course

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Speaker 1: to take control. But with a much smaller majority than expected.

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Speaker 1: While the press and the pundits are predicting a giant

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Speaker 1: red wave, it didn't happen. That's US President joe biden

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Speaker 1: speaking positively of his party's performance after the midterms, I

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Speaker 1: thought we were going to do fine while any seat

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Speaker 1: lost as painful. Some good democrats didn't win the last night.

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Speaker 1: Democrats had a strong night and we lost fewer seats

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Speaker 1: in the House of Representatives than any Democratic presidents. First

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Speaker 1: midterm election in the last 40 years

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Speaker 1: In this episode, we want to find out what the

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Speaker 1: new political landscape in Washington looks like and what that

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Speaker 1: means going forward as focus shifts to the presidential election

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Speaker 1: in 2024. Will biden run again will trump be challenged

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Speaker 1: from within the Republican Party. Why does vote counting in

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Speaker 1: the us just take so long,

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Speaker 1: so many questions and to answer them And to give

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Speaker 1: you the inside track on all things midterms and US politics.

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Speaker 1: I'm joined by our Washington correspondent. Nick harper. Good to

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Speaker 1: have you on. Nick.

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Speaker 2: Thanks steve. Good to be here.

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Speaker 1: Nick. You spent several weeks in the run up to

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Speaker 1: the midterms on a cross country road trip, finding out

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Speaker 1: what was on the minds of voters. And I'm really

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Speaker 1: looking forward to hearing how that went. But let's start

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Speaker 1: with the big elephant in the room, if you like.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about the

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Speaker 1: Red wave, that didn't happen. Why was that? They had

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Speaker 1: everything going for them? An unpopular president inflation at 40-year

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Speaker 1: highs and a fear of a recession looming.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Alright, Steve. I mean, it's quite incredible when you

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Speaker 2: mentioned all those things, it should have been easy for

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Speaker 2: the Republicans to make the argument that the Democrats were

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Speaker 2: doing a terrible job running the country. We've got rampant

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Speaker 2: inflation in the us at the moment. We've got a

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Speaker 2: president with a popularity rating that's below 50% and

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Speaker 2: the republicans had history on their side, precedent shows that

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Speaker 2: the party that controls the White House just simply does

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Speaker 2: badly in the midterm elections? So the democrats even they

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Speaker 2: didn't think that they were going to do well in

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Speaker 2: the run up to the election. They were playing down expectations,

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Speaker 2: really trying to lower them. We saw a whole host

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Speaker 2: of democrats strategist pundits all coming out reminding people how

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Speaker 2: many former Democratic presidents like Barack Obama like Bill Clinton,

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Speaker 2: how many seats they law

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Speaker 2: During their midterm elections, huge numbers running into the dozens.

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Speaker 2: It simply appears I think save the Republicans chose candidates

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Speaker 2: that just weren't that palatable to some of the undecided

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Speaker 2: voters out there, candidates who denied the 2020 election win

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Speaker 2: for Joe Biden candidates who they themselves were involved in

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Speaker 2: storming the us Capitol on January. The sixth candidates who

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Speaker 2: had links to right wing groups simply put many of

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Speaker 2: the candidates that the Republicans chose were just too extreme.

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Speaker 2: Some voters out there to stomach

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Speaker 1: and the blame game for the republicans failings then is

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Speaker 1: moving into high gear and a lot of fingers are

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Speaker 1: starting to point towards the former president Donald trump. And

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Speaker 1: you mentioned numerous candidates that he endorsed failed to deliver

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Speaker 2: Hundreds of candidates, all of them like minded people who

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Speaker 2: felt like he did that that 2020 election was stolen

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Speaker 2: from him, who refused publicly to say that Joe Biden

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Speaker 2: was the democratically elected leader of the country

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Speaker 2: and that blame game. Yeah. All being directed at Donald trump.

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Speaker 2: I was reading a headline in fact, just a couple

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Speaker 2: of minutes ago before we started chatting, the headline was

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Speaker 2: how Donald trump torpedoed his own party. We saw during

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Speaker 2: sunday talk shows, there's lots of them in the U. S.

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Speaker 2: They spent several hours dissecting the past week, a number

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Speaker 2: of hype

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Speaker 2: so far republicans on those talk shows on sunday coming

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Speaker 2: out and vocally very publicly blaming Donald trump. One of

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Speaker 2: them had said that he had driven the Republican Party

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Speaker 2: off the side of the cliff. Quite simply, it was

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Speaker 2: a rejection of Donald trump that. I don't think we

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Speaker 2: would have even considered being thinkable just a few weeks

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Speaker 2: ago before this election.

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Speaker 1: And on the democrat side, is there something that they

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Speaker 1: did right perhaps or is focused stateside purely on what

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Speaker 1: Donald trump and the Republican Party did wrong?

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Speaker 2: Well, I think that candidate selection, the quality of candidates

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Speaker 2: that some of the republicans were speaking about before the

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Speaker 2: Midterms plays a very large part in this. But also

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Speaker 2: the Democrats had this strategy that they gambled on a

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Speaker 2: strategy that it really wasn't clear whether or not it

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Speaker 2: was going to work. They prioritized two issues that Republicans

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Speaker 2: didn't want to talk about. They prioritized abortion and the

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Speaker 2: fight for democracy. They thought that they would be motivating

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Speaker 2: issues that would get voters to turn out especially abortion

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Speaker 2: off the back of that Supreme Court decision in the

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Speaker 2: summer that overturned nearly 50 year ruling

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Speaker 2: that granted abortion access across the country. And they also

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Speaker 2: had one crazy strategy back in the nominating primary phase

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Speaker 2: of all of this democrats were spending millions of dollars

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Speaker 2: on ad campaigns backing far right republican candidates. People who

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Speaker 2: were election deniers because they felt that republican voters in

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Speaker 2: these primaries would choose these people, that they were putting

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Speaker 2: forward over

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Speaker 2: More moderate Republicans and then these right wing candidates would

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Speaker 2: be easier for the Democrats to then beat on election day.

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Speaker 2: By one estimate, the Democrats spent more than $50 million

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Speaker 2: Republican candidates.

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Speaker 1: So just so I've got this understood, the democrats were

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Speaker 1: spending money to try and get certain candidates elected because

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Speaker 1: they thought those were the candidates, they could

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Speaker 2: That's right in the primary phase. So this was several

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Speaker 2: months ago ahead of the actual midterm election when the

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Speaker 2: Republican Party was choosing between different Republican candidates that they

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Speaker 2: then wanted to put forward to run against the Democrat

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Speaker 2: on the November eight election. And the Democrats were spending

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Speaker 2: millions promoting these very far right extremist Republican candidates spending

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Speaker 2: money on ad campaigns so that

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Speaker 2: republican voters were hearing more about that far right candidate

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Speaker 2: than they were the moderate candidate out there.

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Speaker 1: That sounds like quite a gamble to take. We saw

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Speaker 1: what happened in 26 when Trump swept to power. I mean,

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Speaker 1: a bit aghast about this, it seems like quite a

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Speaker 1: gamble to take given what had happened in the past.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, huge gamble, but I think it perhaps shows that

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Speaker 2: the democrats realized they needed to do something

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Speaker 2: to try and switch the common thinking that the republicans

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Speaker 2: were gonna sweep this, that they were going to get

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Speaker 2: this red wave that they were going to push the

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Speaker 2: democrats on inflation, that they were going to push them

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Speaker 2: on high levels of crime. So they did really all

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Speaker 2: they could to turn the tables. And it seems that

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Speaker 2: plus the combination

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Speaker 2: of rights issues like abortion, like the fight for democracy

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Speaker 2: that President biden has spoken so much about it seems

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Speaker 2: that those things really helped to flip the tables in

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Speaker 2: a way that we didn't think was going to be possible.

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Speaker 1: Well at the evidence bore out republicans that did win

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Speaker 1: places in office are the ones that tried to distance

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Speaker 1: themselves away from donald trump Rhonda Santis being one in question.

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Speaker 1: We'll talk about more about him in the second part.

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Speaker 1: But just then

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Speaker 1: to get a sense nick, I mentioned that you did

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Speaker 1: a road trip before the midterms took place. Getting a

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Speaker 1: sense of what everyday americans thought about the upcoming midterms

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Speaker 1: and what did you find?

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Speaker 2: I think being here in Washington D. C. Is sometimes

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Speaker 2: very easy to get caught up in that Washington bubble.

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Speaker 2: So we headed out to the southwest of the country

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Speaker 2: to new Mexico Arizona southern California Nevada two states where

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Speaker 2: there are very rural republican areas, but there are also

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Speaker 2: large urban centers where there's lots of democrat voters. Unsurprisingly

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Speaker 2: the republicans, they were all saying that inflation, the economy

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Speaker 2: cost of living

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Speaker 2: was going to be the big issue for them. They

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Speaker 2: were predicting red wave democrats again moving towards those rights

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Speaker 2: issues including things like climate change. And they said, although

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Speaker 2: they worried about the economy, many of them said they

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Speaker 2: felt biden was doing a good job as possible. One

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Speaker 2: man I do want to mention though, that I met

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Speaker 2: an african american man, kevin young. He told me he

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Speaker 2: was a lifelong republican that he voted for donald trump

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Speaker 2: in 2016, but he didn't vote for him

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Speaker 2: In 2020. He told me that he was not predicting

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Speaker 2: a red way. For one reason he felt that Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump by choosing these candidates was going to ruin the

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Speaker 2: Republican Party's chances in the midterm elections. It seems that

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Speaker 2: this guy should have a crystal ball for all events

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Speaker 2: because yeah, his prediction seems to have been spot on.

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Speaker 1: Did you ask him about 2024?

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Speaker 2: I should have done

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Speaker 1: All right, Stay right there. Nick. Next on CNN correspondent.

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Speaker 1: I'll ask Nick what the next years in Washington could

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Speaker 1: look like for biden's legislative agenda and what it means

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Speaker 1: for us here in Asia and what a wounded trump

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Speaker 1: is likely to do with the presidential election. Two years away.

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Speaker 1: Hi, my name is julie, you and I'm the host

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Speaker 1: of the new season of the climate conversations from chefs

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Speaker 1: to scientists join me as we get personal with the

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Speaker 1: people driving change and sustainability look out for our episodes

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Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts,

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Speaker 1: you're back with me steve lion nick harper as we

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Speaker 1: look to give you the low down on what to

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Speaker 1: expect Following the U. S. Midterms nick, let's start with

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Speaker 1: the democrats and president joe biden. What would losing the

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Speaker 1: House but retaining and possibly strengthening in the Senate mean

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Speaker 1: for his legislative agenda?

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Speaker 2: Well, his domestic legislative agenda is still heading towards gridlock.

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Speaker 2: If that is the situation, that agenda would be dead

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Speaker 2: on arrival in the House of Representatives to get a

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Speaker 2: bill passed through Congress. It needs to go through both

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Speaker 2: the House and the Senate to have approval from both

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Speaker 2: of them before the president can sign it into law.

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Speaker 2: He may also struggle on foreign policy as well. For example,

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Speaker 2: the republic

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Speaker 2: have said that they want to reduce funding to Ukraine

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Speaker 2: that there will not be this blank check as they've

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Speaker 2: put it going forward if they win the house. That's

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Speaker 2: been the biggest complaint from many republicans, even some of

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Speaker 2: the ones I spoke to on the road trip that

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Speaker 2: I did, that they were very concerned the amount of

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Speaker 2: money going to Ukraine that they felt should have been

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Speaker 2: spent in the U. S. For the sea

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Speaker 2: Senate though retaining that it means that biden will be

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Speaker 2: able to confirm cabinet members. That's something the Senate does.

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Speaker 2: They also are all about appointing federal court judges. If

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Speaker 2: a Supreme Court seat becomes available over the next couple

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Speaker 2: of years, then the Senate would have to approve biden's nominee.

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Speaker 2: So it certainly helps having a majority.

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Speaker 2: Of course we've got to wait until the Georgia runoff

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Speaker 2: election to find out whether the democrats will win one

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Speaker 2: more seat. It would give them 51 seats versus the

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Speaker 2: republicans 49. That would be helpful because over the last

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Speaker 2: couple of years the democrats have sometimes run into trouble

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Speaker 2: in the Senate with joe Manchin, the west Virginia senator

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Speaker 2: unhappy with some of Biden's policies and has stood against them.

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Speaker 2: So having one more seat in hand would help them

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Speaker 2: in the Senate if they were to pick up Georgia

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Speaker 2: in a few weeks time.

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Speaker 1: Yes, So that's a look on the domestic front. If

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Speaker 1: you look at some of the international politics side of things.

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Speaker 1: And for us here in Asia, how will this impact

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Speaker 1: Biden's plans for Asia and his relationship with china in particular.

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Speaker 1: He has just met with Chinese President Xi Jinping in

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Speaker 1: bali their first in person talks since biden became US President.

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Speaker 1: It

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Speaker 2: probably won't change that agenda very much. I mean, it's

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Speaker 2: one thing china that both parties agree on that the U. S.

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Speaker 2: Has to stand up has to counter china. They see

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Speaker 2: it as a relationship based on competition

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Speaker 2: and republicans and democrats, they both agree on that. So

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Speaker 2: we probably won't see much change if anything, if there

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Speaker 2: is more gridlock at home. If the republicans have the

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Speaker 2: house then biden might push more on his foreign policy.

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Speaker 2: That's something that we've seen presidents do in the past.

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Speaker 2: So we may see more engagement with the indo pacific region.

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Speaker 2: And just on that biden she meeting, I think from

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Speaker 2: the dynamics and optics point of view, it certainly helped

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Speaker 2: biden going into that meeting.

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Speaker 2: He would have had more confidence more spring in his step.

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Speaker 2: He certainly had a strengthened hand when he met the

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Speaker 2: chinese leader. And I think it also has helped to

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Speaker 2: reassure allies in the indo pacific region in these meetings

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Speaker 2: at the G 20 summit to show that the U. S.

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Speaker 2: Is a perhaps more reliable partner. That the democrats have

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Speaker 2: more staying power than allies might have seen being the case.

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Speaker 2: If the republicans had swept both the House and the Senate,

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Speaker 1: Let's stay with biden then. He was born on 20

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Speaker 1: November 1942. He'll be 80 very soon, which means if

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Speaker 1: he were to run again and win, he would be

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Speaker 1: 82 years old when he would be sworn in in

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Speaker 1: January of 2025. I don't want to sound like an ageist.

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Speaker 1: But

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Speaker 1: is that a concern for the democrats and for voters

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Speaker 1: as well. It's a four year term.

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Speaker 2: It is yep, biden's birthday his 80th. On sunday, Happy

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Speaker 2: birthday joe biden coming up. It is a huge concern though.

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Speaker 2: I mean there have been questions about biden's physical and

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Speaker 2: mental fitness throughout really, ever since. He said that he

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Speaker 2: was running back in 2019. His aides in the White

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Speaker 2: House have been trying

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Speaker 2: To demonstrate his vigor, demonstrate his mental agility, but there

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Speaker 2: was some very damning exit polls out of the back

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Speaker 2: of those midterm elections, two thirds of Americans said that

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Speaker 2: biden should not run again. More than 70% said they

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Speaker 2: were dissatisfied by the country under his leadership. However, we

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Speaker 2: have seen Democrats do much better

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Speaker 2: than was expected. That strengthened joe biden's hand if he

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Speaker 2: decides to run for reelection. But there is that concern,

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Speaker 2: I think at the back of democrats minds as well,

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Speaker 2: if it's not joe biden, who else could it possibly be?

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Speaker 2: Do they have a strong enough candidates waiting in the

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Speaker 2: wings to take on the republican nominee? Whoever that might

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Speaker 2: end up being.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he has said that he's going to think about

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Speaker 1: it over the christmas period, speak with his wife, dr

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Speaker 1: Jill biden and then decide so we'll have to wait

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Speaker 1: and see on that front.

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Speaker 1: In the wake of the midterms though, not just republicans,

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Speaker 1: but right leaning media starting to distance themselves from the

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Speaker 1: former president Donald trump. He said he's going to run again.

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Speaker 1: Is anyone from within the party going to challenge him?

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Speaker 2: Undoubtedly the biggest name? I think there is Ron de Santis,

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Speaker 2: the florida governor who just got reelected in a landslide

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Speaker 2: victory coming out of the elections, looking much much stronger

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Speaker 2: than Donald trump. I think perhaps this one consideration though

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Speaker 2: is Ron de Santis is very popular in florida. Is

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Speaker 2: he as popular across the other side of the country.

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Speaker 2: He doesn't perhaps have the same name recognition as Donald trump.

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Speaker 2: Also Marco rubio a florida senator who just won re election.

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Speaker 2: Ted Cruz a senator

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Speaker 2: in texas. Both of them have political ambitions. They ran

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Speaker 2: against trump before ted Cruz has said that he would

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Speaker 2: run again in a heartbeat. So yes, there are challenges

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Speaker 2: out there. Rhonda Santis undoubtedly the strongest of the bunch

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Speaker 2: so far

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Speaker 1: while we wait for the final results to come in

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Speaker 1: on the house and of course we have to wait

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Speaker 1: till december for their last Senate seat in Georgia.

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Speaker 1: The question we have from watching over here is why

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Speaker 1: does it take so long for vote counting in the

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Speaker 1: United States? It seems remarkable.

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Speaker 2: It is the million dollar question simply put though. It

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Speaker 2: is because there is no centralized system here in the

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Speaker 2: United States. Every single one of the 50 states can

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Speaker 2: do it their own way. They all have their own rules.

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Speaker 2: It is this patchwork of rules that we see in

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Speaker 2: so many walks of life in the

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Speaker 2: Us. How much you pay in tax, what your gun

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Speaker 2: rules are. It's all decided by the state. So some

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Speaker 2: states have machine voting, others have paper voting, some allow

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Speaker 2: you to vote early. Others say you can only do

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Speaker 2: it on the day themselves and we've got some states

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Speaker 2: that will allow votes to turn up up to 10

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Speaker 2: days after the election has ended Alaska. And Ohio. So

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Speaker 2: there is still this long lead time afterwards

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Speaker 2: where votes can arrive and be counted. So it's not

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Speaker 2: uncommon that it takes a long time to vote. What

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Speaker 2: has become a problem these last few years is obviously

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Speaker 2: those widespread claims of voter fraud from Donald trump and

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Speaker 2: his supporters claiming that just because it's taking a long time,

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Speaker 2: it is evidence of tampering by the democrats.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. When transparently, you're waiting for all the results to

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Speaker 1: come in and then suddenly there's like a hold up

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Speaker 1: and you're waiting for more balance to come in.

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Speaker 1: That's the speculation it comes from I don't even remember

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Speaker 1: the term election denier being a thing before the 2020 election,

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Speaker 1: let alone having such people actually having their own names

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Speaker 1: on the ballots. People that are saying that the 2020

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Speaker 1: election didn't happen and yet they're running in this election

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Speaker 1: for the midterms by and large, though

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Speaker 1: we haven't seen so much controversy on that front this

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Speaker 1: time around.

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Speaker 2: No, not this time. You're right Steve. It's incredible that

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Speaker 2: we had people running on this very idea that 2020

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Speaker 2: was a stolen election piggybacking on Donald Trump's claims and

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Speaker 2: dozens of them doing so 19 of the Republican nominees

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Speaker 2: for Senate were all election denies 22 of the Republican

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Speaker 2: governors that were running same again. So

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Speaker 2: Some of them won. Many of them didn't largely a

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Speaker 2: rejection from voters of those election deniers. We haven't seen

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Speaker 2: really any of the controversies that we saw in 2020

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump did put out at least one video one

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Speaker 2: on the night in particular saying that the vote counting

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Speaker 2: in Arizona that taking a long time was because the

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Speaker 2: Democrats were trying to cheat. But really nothing along the

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Speaker 2: lines of those widespread claims that Donald Trump was put

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Speaker 2: a couple of years ago.

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Speaker 1: And just one last question for you, what's your biggest takeaway?

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Speaker 1: You've been on the road traveling across different parts of America?

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Speaker 1: You've been reporting in Washington D. C. As well. What's

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Speaker 1: your biggest takeaway from this year's midterms?

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Speaker 2: Don't trust the polls, but that's my takeaway after the

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Speaker 2: last few elections. I mean, they have been spectacularly wrong.

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Speaker 2: They were wrong for Hillary Clinton back in 2016 when

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Speaker 2: everyone said that she was going to say

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Speaker 2: sweep to victory. Be the winning democrat. Of course Donald

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Speaker 2: trump came in and they will run again this time around.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, polls are very interesting. They're great to read

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Speaker 2: but perhaps can't always be trusted

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Speaker 1: to wait for these results before. We can discuss it all.

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much nick for your time as always. And

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Speaker 1: where can our listeners find and follow you to keep

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Speaker 1: up with your reporting from the U. S. Capitol.

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Speaker 2: I'm on twitter nick harper Fsn I must admit. I

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Speaker 2: don't tweet that frequently. But that

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Speaker 1: all right, thanks so much. Now. We might not have

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Speaker 1: the full picture of the midterms yet as there are

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Speaker 1: still some races that are yet to be confirmed. But

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Speaker 1: we do know a few things. The economy is not

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Speaker 1: the only issue important for americans, abortion rights and the

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Speaker 1: preservation of democracy are as well. Also donald trump's brand

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Speaker 1: of politics has yet again been rejected by the majority

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Speaker 1: of voters in America.

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Speaker 1: So what influence will he have on the Republican Party

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Speaker 1: as it regroups ahead of the presidential election in 2024

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Speaker 1: and who will be running for the Democrats? Will have

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Speaker 1: to leave that for another episode.

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Speaker 1: The tv version of CNN correspondent airs on CNN every

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Speaker 1: Wednesday at 9:30 p.m. You can also catch up with

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Speaker 1: it whenever you like on CNN dot asia do you

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Speaker 1: like and subscribe to this podcast version that takes you

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Speaker 1: behind the scenes with our correspondents and thank you for

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Speaker 1: listening to our podcast team is made up of Jacqueline

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Speaker 1: chan daniel, lee, joan chan Christina robert, Clara yong and

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Speaker 1: me steve lie