1 00:00:02,829 --> 00:00:06,730 Speaker 1: We're back with our ask me anything segment. And today's 2 00:00:06,739 --> 00:00:09,170 Speaker 1: question was sent to our producer, 3 00:00:09,539 --> 00:00:11,979 Speaker 1: I'm going to read it. It says I have a 4 00:00:11,989 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 1: coworker who is not pulling her weight and has absolutely 5 00:00:15,529 --> 00:00:19,959 Speaker 1: no interest in doing her job. Despite interventions from the team, 6 00:00:20,170 --> 00:00:23,090 Speaker 1: our boss is waiting for her to resign instead of 7 00:00:23,100 --> 00:00:26,069 Speaker 1: letting her go as a result, my team and I 8 00:00:26,079 --> 00:00:29,750 Speaker 1: are bearing the brunt of it. What should I do? Ok. Cheol, 9 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 1: I don't get it. Why are bosses waiting for poor 10 00:00:32,848 --> 00:00:35,759 Speaker 1: performers to resign instead of firing them? 11 00:00:35,770 --> 00:00:37,519 Speaker 2: I have the same question in my mind as well, 12 00:00:38,950 --> 00:00:41,430 Speaker 2: right. But offhand, if I were to imagine what is 13 00:00:41,439 --> 00:00:43,580 Speaker 2: really happening, there could be a few reasons for this. 14 00:00:43,590 --> 00:00:45,509 Speaker 2: The first one is perhaps the boss might be waiting 15 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:49,278 Speaker 2: for the employee to turn around at work, maybe still 16 00:00:49,290 --> 00:00:53,069 Speaker 2: being hopeful about something being done. That's one, the second 17 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,060 Speaker 2: reason could be the employee could be in a grace 18 00:00:55,069 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 2: period currently going through some performance improvement program. But sometimes 19 00:00:59,689 --> 00:01:02,009 Speaker 2: these things are not made known to the rest of 20 00:01:02,020 --> 00:01:04,919 Speaker 2: the teams. So this is like a grace period for 21 00:01:04,930 --> 00:01:08,379 Speaker 2: them to improve it could also be that grace period 22 00:01:08,389 --> 00:01:08,539 Speaker 2: for 23 00:01:08,625 --> 00:01:11,244 Speaker 2: them to find a job because sometimes we often don't 24 00:01:11,254 --> 00:01:13,304 Speaker 2: want to leave a job without having another job. So 25 00:01:13,315 --> 00:01:14,934 Speaker 2: maybe this person is in the midst of a job 26 00:01:14,944 --> 00:01:18,364 Speaker 2: search already, right? And then their heart is not in 27 00:01:18,375 --> 00:01:21,863 Speaker 2: the current work. So the yeah, so they're still not performing, 28 00:01:21,875 --> 00:01:23,644 Speaker 2: but they are trying their best to look for something 29 00:01:23,654 --> 00:01:27,285 Speaker 2: else outside. And maybe the last one is perhaps the 30 00:01:27,294 --> 00:01:30,144 Speaker 2: boss is unsure how to deal with this, how to 31 00:01:30,154 --> 00:01:31,684 Speaker 2: have that difficult conversation 32 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:35,199 Speaker 2: about performance to let this person go. Never done it before. 33 00:01:35,209 --> 00:01:36,980 Speaker 2: Especially if the boss is a new manager. 34 00:01:36,989 --> 00:01:40,470 Speaker 1: Well, I'll propose 1/4 1 actually that maybe some bosses 35 00:01:40,510 --> 00:01:42,550 Speaker 1: don't want to fire because they are afraid that they 36 00:01:42,559 --> 00:01:44,900 Speaker 1: won't be able to bring back the head count as 37 00:01:44,910 --> 00:01:47,059 Speaker 1: quickly as they want to. So in that sense, they 38 00:01:47,069 --> 00:01:50,730 Speaker 1: rather have a living breathing thing in their team. 39 00:01:51,129 --> 00:01:53,769 Speaker 1: At least you know, do the admin the menial work 40 00:01:53,830 --> 00:01:56,669 Speaker 1: then trying to go and find somebody else could be. Yeah. 41 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 1: And 42 00:01:57,129 --> 00:01:59,230 Speaker 2: in that situation, everybody suffers. Exactly. 43 00:01:59,239 --> 00:02:02,050 Speaker 1: So everyone's waiting for this person to leave the team 44 00:02:02,059 --> 00:02:04,529 Speaker 1: according to, you know, the person who wrote in because 45 00:02:04,540 --> 00:02:08,130 Speaker 1: interventions don't work. So interventions have already been done. What's 46 00:02:08,139 --> 00:02:09,059 Speaker 1: your advice? 47 00:02:09,649 --> 00:02:12,190 Speaker 2: So I think as the other employee looking at the 48 00:02:12,199 --> 00:02:15,429 Speaker 2: situation of this poor performer and the boss, I think 49 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,228 Speaker 2: for this employee maybe try not to judge first OK, 50 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:20,339 Speaker 2: like I mentioned earlier, there could be reasons beyond our 51 00:02:20,350 --> 00:02:24,649 Speaker 2: understanding for the poor performance, not judging the employee, perhaps 52 00:02:24,660 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 2: allows us to focus more of our energies on our work, right? 53 00:02:28,610 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 2: Because sometimes when we talk about how this person is 54 00:02:31,169 --> 00:02:32,119 Speaker 2: like not pulling their weight, 55 00:02:32,486 --> 00:02:34,745 Speaker 2: it really rounds you up and it takes off, you know, 56 00:02:34,757 --> 00:02:37,867 Speaker 2: your own productivity. So I think this is one and 57 00:02:37,876 --> 00:02:39,477 Speaker 2: of course, the second thing is if there is a 58 00:02:39,486 --> 00:02:43,625 Speaker 2: good open relationship between you and the underperform employee, maybe 59 00:02:43,636 --> 00:02:46,356 Speaker 2: you can seek to understand what is happening, what is happening, 60 00:02:46,367 --> 00:02:49,495 Speaker 2: the employee, what's happening at work, more understanding can bring 61 00:02:49,507 --> 00:02:51,126 Speaker 2: about more empathy. So 62 00:02:51,136 --> 00:02:53,306 Speaker 1: kind of take them out for coffee or meal and 63 00:02:53,317 --> 00:02:54,667 Speaker 1: say is there anything 64 00:02:54,764 --> 00:02:57,214 Speaker 1: that's happening in your life? So not in a work 65 00:02:57,223 --> 00:02:59,904 Speaker 1: setting and use a more social setting to try and 66 00:02:59,913 --> 00:03:00,782 Speaker 1: tease a little bit 67 00:03:00,794 --> 00:03:03,093 Speaker 2: out. Yeah, exactly. I mean, we don't have to wait 68 00:03:03,104 --> 00:03:05,194 Speaker 2: for our bosses to do that. Yeah, we can do 69 00:03:05,203 --> 00:03:08,093 Speaker 2: that as human beings as colleagues just by saying that hey, 70 00:03:08,104 --> 00:03:10,703 Speaker 2: I noticed that you don't look really happy these days 71 00:03:10,714 --> 00:03:11,853 Speaker 2: is everything OK? But 72 00:03:11,863 --> 00:03:13,893 Speaker 1: I think at that stage, you are already so upset 73 00:03:13,904 --> 00:03:17,222 Speaker 1: with that person because you're probably taking a bit more work, right? 74 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:18,151 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. 75 00:03:18,231 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 2: So if that's not possible and that person's performance is 76 00:03:20,610 --> 00:03:23,020 Speaker 2: really affecting you when you are working with the employee, 77 00:03:23,031 --> 00:03:26,329 Speaker 2: try to have some clarity on the roles and the expectations, 78 00:03:26,341 --> 00:03:30,410 Speaker 2: seek some agreement on the work deliverables and expectations, maybe 79 00:03:30,421 --> 00:03:33,701 Speaker 2: in writing or even having that conversation to really agree. Ok, 80 00:03:33,710 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 2: what is the part that you can do? And you 81 00:03:36,091 --> 00:03:38,110 Speaker 2: have to really do it by this particular date? So 82 00:03:38,121 --> 00:03:39,781 Speaker 2: I think having that clear expectations 83 00:03:40,190 --> 00:03:42,889 Speaker 2: and clarity is important and of course, to have that 84 00:03:42,899 --> 00:03:45,330 Speaker 2: discussion with your boss about the impact on the team. 85 00:03:45,339 --> 00:03:47,570 Speaker 2: So when you have your own time with the boss, 86 00:03:47,660 --> 00:03:51,210 Speaker 2: talk about maybe perhaps possible solutions to limit the impact 87 00:03:51,220 --> 00:03:54,139 Speaker 2: because maybe your boss doesn't know what's happening, knows about 88 00:03:54,149 --> 00:03:56,149 Speaker 2: the poor performance, but doesn't know the impact of the 89 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:00,619 Speaker 2: poor performance, the operations. So discussing possible solutions to limit 90 00:04:00,630 --> 00:04:03,580 Speaker 2: the impact, perhaps this person should be reassigned to a 91 00:04:03,589 --> 00:04:07,169 Speaker 2: role that's less time pressing less urgent 92 00:04:07,509 --> 00:04:10,100 Speaker 2: so that the person can their space while you can 93 00:04:10,110 --> 00:04:11,570 Speaker 2: focus on your work. Yeah, 94 00:04:11,809 --> 00:04:14,940 Speaker 1: I guess oftentimes not everybody wants to be a poor performer, 95 00:04:14,949 --> 00:04:17,589 Speaker 1: like you say, they could have many reasons, things that 96 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 1: happen at home, they could be facing also mental health 97 00:04:20,769 --> 00:04:23,649 Speaker 1: issue and it's a bit hard for them to get 98 00:04:23,660 --> 00:04:26,769 Speaker 1: out of this rut. But I think as the person 99 00:04:26,779 --> 00:04:28,130 Speaker 1: who has to pick up the slack, 100 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 1: it's important to hold that boundary because I think oftentimes 101 00:04:32,010 --> 00:04:35,040 Speaker 1: we try and be a bit too nice and then 102 00:04:35,049 --> 00:04:38,380 Speaker 1: that eventually starts wearing us out as well. 103 00:04:38,428 --> 00:04:41,558 Speaker 2: Yes, I think it's important to remember that the person 104 00:04:41,570 --> 00:04:43,779 Speaker 2: if they are underperform. I mean, staying on in a 105 00:04:43,790 --> 00:04:46,230 Speaker 2: job is really difficult for them. You know, they are 106 00:04:46,238 --> 00:04:48,609 Speaker 2: not enjoying what they're doing or maybe there's other things 107 00:04:48,619 --> 00:04:50,200 Speaker 2: that are going on in their life. So it's not 108 00:04:50,209 --> 00:04:50,820 Speaker 2: easy for them. 109 00:04:51,049 --> 00:04:53,380 Speaker 2: But at the same time, if today these conversations can 110 00:04:53,390 --> 00:04:55,730 Speaker 2: help them to move on in a way that they 111 00:04:55,738 --> 00:04:58,410 Speaker 2: feel comfortable. I think that could work out for everybody. 112 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:01,750 Speaker 1: So many good tips. I love it. Well, we hope 113 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:04,750 Speaker 1: you found this conversation helpful to you. Let us know 114 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:07,579 Speaker 1: if you have any feedback again, we are on our 115 00:05:07,589 --> 00:05:10,589 Speaker 1: usual CN a social channels or you can 116 00:05:10,695 --> 00:05:14,024 Speaker 1: leave a comment on Spotify. Remember to send us your 117 00:05:14,035 --> 00:05:17,214 Speaker 1: burning questions for Gerald if you found it helpful because 118 00:05:17,225 --> 00:05:20,144 Speaker 1: I did and I will help you ask them the 119 00:05:20,154 --> 00:05:23,954 Speaker 1: team behind the work it podcast is Christina Robert Joan Chan, 120 00:05:24,415 --> 00:05:27,625 Speaker 1: Jaini Johari and Sye Wind. This is Tiffany 121 00:05:27,635 --> 00:05:30,234 Speaker 2: and I'm Gerald. Have a good work week ahead. 122 00:05:33,470 --> 00:05:33,500 Speaker 2: Mhm.