Speaker 1: This is AC N A podcast.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Climate Conversations. I'm your host, Julie Yu.
Speaker 1: But today we are taking on a topic that might
Speaker 1: make some of you a little uncomfortable death,
Speaker 1: but do stick with me here because we are going
Speaker 1: to explore how we can make our final footprint on
Speaker 1: the planet a little greener when my time comes, I
Speaker 1: want my funeral to be a celebration of my life
Speaker 1: but also a way to minimize my impact on the environment.
Speaker 1: Are you curious about how you can do the same? Well,
Speaker 1: I have the right person joining me today who knows
Speaker 1: a thing or two about death care practices and sustainability.
Speaker 1: His name is an,
Speaker 1: the managing director of Ang Mo funeral directors, one of
Speaker 1: the oldest and largest funeral companies in Singapore, Duan. Thank
Speaker 1: you for joining me on the Climate conversations. Thank you
Speaker 1: for having me here. I understand that this is a
Speaker 1: family business with a long history that was started by
Speaker 1: your great grandfather and you officially started as director almost
Speaker 1: 20 years ago. You must have witnessed or received different
Speaker 1: kinds of the special request
Speaker 1: from families. Were there any particular end of life ceremonies
Speaker 1: that you found just powerfully poignant or memorable one way
Speaker 1: or the other. There are many in my 1st 10 years.
Speaker 1: I actually served more than 3000 families. So, you know, families,
Speaker 1: they come from all walks of life. I have served
Speaker 1: family who has multiple spouses serve families who have quarl
Speaker 1: over religion, which is very common, especially in Singapore. We
Speaker 1: also have served with no families who want for green
Speaker 1: conservation efforts as well. We have done funerals, for example,
Speaker 1: when a person likes golf so much, then we decorate
Speaker 1: the entire place just like a country club. So this
Speaker 1: S S C C table, that's a Sentosa table. That's
Speaker 1: another country club table. So that's interesting and this is
Speaker 1: how he wants his loved ones, his golf k to
Speaker 1: remember him. So we try to fulfill all wishes as
Speaker 1: much as we can within the legal boundaries. Yeah, every
Speaker 1: funeral is unique and special in its own way. Trend wise,
Speaker 1: have much
Speaker 1: changed or evolved in how funerals are carried out in
Speaker 1: Singapore over the years. I think trends wise. It has
Speaker 1: changed a lot. I entered in the profession in 1995.
Speaker 1: It was very traditional. You have more burials today. You
Speaker 1: have about 82% cremation back then in the 19 eighties
Speaker 1: and nineties, the numbers for cremation is very low. Singaporeans
Speaker 1: do their funeral predominantly based on two factors. One is
Speaker 1: how the regulations shapes behavior and second is acceptance by
Speaker 1: people as well.
Speaker 1: So for instance, burials used to be on perpetual freehold land.
Speaker 1: And in the year 1998 the government agencies changed the
Speaker 1: land policy of 15 years to optimize land policy. And
Speaker 1: that shapes the behavior between burial versus cremation. Ok. So
Speaker 1: please walk us through the process from when you received
Speaker 1: the body from the family to the actual funeral or
Speaker 1: the ceremony when we receive the first call. And through
Speaker 1: the first call, we will get some basic information when
Speaker 1: the disease is
Speaker 1: pass on, what's the primary cause of death? And we
Speaker 1: will go over to the place of death to transport
Speaker 1: the beloved to our care center. And this is where
Speaker 1: the family will have funeral arrangements together with us. And
Speaker 1: from there, we will understand the preferences of the families.
Speaker 1: What are the last wishes of the deceased person which
Speaker 1: we call beloved. One can choose to have embalming and
Speaker 1: one can choose not to have embalming. Once embalming is performed,
Speaker 1: it allows the family to view from the first day
Speaker 1: to the last day, which typically in singing
Speaker 1: funs are conducted on average of five days. Is it
Speaker 1: an intricate process to embalm? It is definitely an intricate
Speaker 1: process because embalming is art and science. So it requires
Speaker 1: qualified embalmers, good quality embalming chemicals and also dependent on
Speaker 1: the cause of death. And we will just make sure
Speaker 1: that the disease appear good in the next few days
Speaker 1: to allow the family members to grieve. So there are
Speaker 1: multiple ways to return to the earth. But just how
Speaker 1: much
Speaker 1: impact they have on the environment is the question here.
Speaker 1: So let's go through some of the methods. Maybe you
Speaker 1: can walk us through, maybe the benefits, the drawbacks. What
Speaker 1: goes into the process? Let's start with the cremation. You
Speaker 1: did mention it's the most common method in Singapore. Surely
Speaker 1: it takes up a little space. But the environmental impact
Speaker 1: in Singapore, we have a very interesting situation. As compared
Speaker 1: to other countries. We are relatively small in size. Cremation
Speaker 1: does emits a lot
Speaker 1: of carbon emissions. But it is also the same for
Speaker 1: other forms. It's just whether is it directly or indirectly,
Speaker 1: it there are many different methods but of course, the
Speaker 1: most natural way is to do burial. But burrow in
Speaker 1: what forms burial in the way that Singapore de takes
Speaker 1: or burial in the most natural form as in, you know,
Speaker 1: going into the forest, just bury it just wearing biodegradable
Speaker 1: clothings and without any graveyards. So for instance, there is
Speaker 1: a lot of bars over this green world called aqua.
Speaker 1: Then process also has the use of energy as well.
Speaker 1: What goes into that process? A is actually alkaline hydrolysis.
Speaker 1: It uses water and strong chemicals. Example, sodium hydroxide, potassium
Speaker 1: hydroxide with a mix of them. How toxic is that?
Speaker 1: There aren't many studies to say how toxic it is
Speaker 1: because the adoption rate is not very high. But what
Speaker 1: we must also remember here is actually a measurement, some
Speaker 1: of them might say it is very green. You are
Speaker 1: not using,
Speaker 1: burning more fuel for the cremation, but you are also
Speaker 1: actually using energy for this process as well. Next will
Speaker 1: be after this is being done, there are also waste
Speaker 1: water and how is this waste water being discharged into
Speaker 1: our public sewage system which eventually leads to our new
Speaker 1: water that we consume. How about human composting? Not many
Speaker 1: countries have legalized it yet, human composting is not available
Speaker 1: in Singapore. I wouldn't know
Speaker 1: if it will be available soon or will there be
Speaker 1: a demand? Human composting is actually the acceleration for the
Speaker 1: human to decompose. So if one is being buried in
Speaker 1: the ground, it will actually decompose over a number of years.
Speaker 1: Human composting is one way that you introduce ingredients and
Speaker 1: materials to actually accelerate the entire process and this process
Speaker 1: requires energy as well, but it shortens the entire period
Speaker 1: to just a few months. So I see that human
Speaker 1: composting is no different of a natural barrier except the
Speaker 1: introduction of some form of industrialization to accelerate the entire process.
Speaker 1: So I feel that if this is something that the
Speaker 1: people want, there must be more studies into this and
Speaker 1: to see how it can be implemented. But of course,
Speaker 1: in all decisions where there's a barrier, there's a cremation,
Speaker 1: a cremation and many different things. There are many benefits
Speaker 1: and there are also a lot of tradeoffs.
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Speaker 1: So we just touched on a new spin on resting
Speaker 1: in peace, but there really is no standard industry definition
Speaker 1: of green or eco funeral, right? What are some of
Speaker 1: the practices that you think that we could change or implement? So,
Speaker 1: for instance, slightly more than 10 years ago, we actually
Speaker 1: brought in what we call the biodegradable sea short. And
Speaker 1: this sea shell urns allow the family members to place
Speaker 1: the cremated remains into
Speaker 1: by sea shorten. Lower down to the sea surface, it
Speaker 1: floats about 20 to 45 minutes before it sinks down
Speaker 1: to the bottom of the sea bed and you will
Speaker 1: slowly disintegrate. So that's a very beautiful way. And the
Speaker 1: reason I brought this in more than 10 years ago
Speaker 1: was because of two reasons one is that I really
Speaker 1: dislike the idea of sinking porcelain urns, marble urns, granite
Speaker 1: urns into the sea. And I felt that it actually
Speaker 1: affects the marine biodiversity and
Speaker 1: environment as well. So that's a no, no to me.
Speaker 1: So I went high and low search for the solutions.
Speaker 1: The second is actually how beautiful it is for the
Speaker 1: family members to, you know, hold their hands together, bid farewell.
Speaker 1: It helps the grieving journey of the families. And that's
Speaker 1: the last moment I remember as opposed to, you know,
Speaker 1: you think that and that's it. So today, this is
Speaker 1: a common site for families to choose sea barrier. Oh, wow,
Speaker 1: that's very beautiful. Any other ideas or
Speaker 1: options out there that you think is eco-friendly? Many years ago,
Speaker 1: we also brought in what we call the willow cascades,
Speaker 1: willow cascades are natural materials and which we actually we
Speaker 1: it because it's flexible, it is able to weave it
Speaker 1: into a shape of cascades. Today, there are more people
Speaker 1: asking for this option. Of course, not as many as
Speaker 1: the traditional options, but there are more family members who
Speaker 1: choose this option. I noticed that in the us that
Speaker 1: the green trend seems to be picking up, especially
Speaker 1: among young, you know, the the youth. But would you
Speaker 1: say you see much of that here in Asia? Actually,
Speaker 1: the green adoption by people here are not necessarily the young,
Speaker 1: it really depends on the person. So we do have
Speaker 1: people who are senior in age and they opt for that,
Speaker 1: not because of the green movement just because he enjoy
Speaker 1: going to forest hiking and he just want to do
Speaker 1: it that way. So sometimes it's not so much of
Speaker 1: the green, but because of their preferences,
Speaker 1: costs are greener funerals more expensive than traditional ones. The
Speaker 1: green options in today's terms is more expensive than the
Speaker 1: usual ones. That's because the demand is not as high.
Speaker 1: And that's why all of these products has to be
Speaker 1: brought in from overseas. And sometimes if you look just
Speaker 1: at the product itself, it is 100% green because of
Speaker 1: the material, the processor is green. But is it truly
Speaker 1: green green? I would say that no, it is depends
Speaker 1: on
Speaker 1: how you define it. Because for this product to be
Speaker 1: able to be sold in Singapore, you need to fly
Speaker 1: caskets in willow caskets, you need to fly in this
Speaker 1: by the sea and also contribute indirectly in the entire
Speaker 1: supply chain for coming emissions. But it's good to have
Speaker 1: this product because it actually brings out the green consciousness
Speaker 1: of people. So I would always say that the end matters,
Speaker 1: but the journey to the end matters equally as well.
Speaker 1: That's a very good point.
Speaker 1: And in the future, do you think we would see
Speaker 1: more of these eco alternatives becoming more popular or commonplace?
Speaker 1: I think it goes back to demand and supply. Funeral
Speaker 1: directors generally provides what the family wants. When there is
Speaker 1: higher demand, naturally, there will also be more products available
Speaker 1: at the same time. And green products have to evolve.
Speaker 1: If it has to have a greater adoption, it has
Speaker 1: to evolve in terms of its technology and also how
Speaker 1: it's being done. So I'm sure
Speaker 1: a lot of people are wondering, religious or non religious,
Speaker 1: plain or fancy. How can we pick what's right for us?
Speaker 1: I would say that pick something that represents your life.
Speaker 1: I think that's important and how you want to be remembered.
Speaker 1: There's no right and wrong when it comes to funerals.
Speaker 1: No two funeral is the same. No two Christian funeral
Speaker 1: is the same because we all have different personalities and
Speaker 1: how we want to be remembered. I think it's important
Speaker 1: to convey this wishes to the people that you love
Speaker 1: and not
Speaker 1: just keep it to yourself because you need someone to
Speaker 1: execute on your behalf. Because when you leave this world,
Speaker 1: I'm sure that everyone wants their loved ones to have
Speaker 1: a meaningful life after our departure. What would you say
Speaker 1: is the biggest misconception that people have about, you know,
Speaker 1: funeral industry and what's the one thing that you would
Speaker 1: like to change? There are many things that I want
Speaker 1: to change. I would like to change how our cemeteries
Speaker 1: are today in Singapore because to me, these are not cemeteries,
Speaker 1: these are Gravier.
Speaker 1: I've been to more than 20 countries to visit all
Speaker 1: different cemeteries and we can have something like a memorial
Speaker 1: park as opposed to a cemetery, a cemetery, a Columbarium
Speaker 1: actually is a physical location that brings families together. There
Speaker 1: is a physical end to a body, but it's definitely
Speaker 1: not an end to our relationships. I think having a
Speaker 1: dignified place for people to come, helps to bind society together.
Speaker 1: Next thing if I can change is
Speaker 1: that I hope that funeral parlors can be part of
Speaker 1: a community and not be located in industrial parks. They
Speaker 1: have a lot of noise, they have a lot of dust.
Speaker 1: It's not very dignified to have a funeral to be conducted.
Speaker 1: And unfortunately, that's the reality in Singapore. But I have
Speaker 1: confidence that policymakers will have wisdom to go into that direction.
Speaker 1: I look forward to that soon. I hope before I die.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your insights and your candid answers.
Speaker 1: Now, remember choosing a green funeral is a personal choice
Speaker 1: that aligns with your values and beliefs. While it may
Speaker 1: not have a significant impact on climate change, it's still
Speaker 1: a step towards sustainability, especially if more of us are
Speaker 1: conscious of the options available. We hope you enjoyed this episode.
Speaker 1: Remember to subscribe and like this podcast. So, you know,
Speaker 1: when a new episode drops, you can find C N
Speaker 1: A S climate and sustainability coverage online at C N
Speaker 1: A dot Asia. The team behind this podcast is Joan Chen,
Speaker 1: Jacqueline Chan and Christina Robert and I'm Julie Yu signing off.