WEBVTT - Too Young to Lead? The Truth About Gen Z Entrepreneurs 0:00:07.010 --> 0:00:09.689 Welcome to another episode of Men Explained, where we give 0:00:09.689 --> 0:00:12.729 our most unhinged selves, right, Avery? I think unhinged is 0:00:12.728 --> 0:00:15.210 a perfect word for today because we've got two of 0:00:15.210 --> 0:00:19.809 the most unhinged people on TikTok and it's not. It's 0:00:19.809 --> 0:00:22.329 these two right here with us. Oh my gosh, welcome 0:00:22.329 --> 0:00:24.329 to the show, Dewey and Ryan. How are you guys feeling? 0:00:25.209 --> 0:00:25.850 I'm so happy I'm 0:00:25.850 --> 0:00:28.610 back. OK, but we're going to dissect this because we 0:00:28.610 --> 0:00:30.209 know that we have a lot of different opinions and 0:00:30.209 --> 0:00:34.778 also generational opinions, I would say because entrepreneurs of different 0:00:34.779 --> 0:00:36.130 generations will have different views, I feel. 0:00:36.293 --> 0:00:38.775 Yeah, and today we're going to be breaking down your 0:00:38.775 --> 0:00:41.805 businesses as Gen Zs and how you guys started a 0:00:41.805 --> 0:00:46.034 business and how it feels in the world of entrepreneurship 0:00:46.034 --> 0:00:47.924 as a child, sorry, not child, as a Gen Z. 0:00:48.095 --> 0:00:48.244 How old are you? I don't want to he's still 0:00:48.244 --> 0:00:55.845 a child. My mind is a mind of 11 year olds. Alright, 0:00:56.005 --> 0:00:58.154 so let's break it down first. How old are you guys? 0:00:58.485 --> 0:01:00.334 How old do you think we are? Just answer the question. 0:01:01.950 --> 0:01:02.209 It's 0:01:02.209 --> 0:01:03.099 actually, um, 0:01:04.610 --> 0:01:07.300 I'm gonna say 24 this year, yes, but I'm still 0:01:07.300 --> 0:01:17.279 23 223 I'm 2 this year. You're 20 this year. 0:01:17.290 --> 0:01:17.730 He's very young. 0:01:18.680 --> 0:01:20.750 Wait, how do you guys then meet? Is it through 0:01:20.750 --> 0:01:24.349 the creator community or? Now that we know your ages, 0:01:24.589 --> 0:01:26.510 how old were you guys when you started your first business? 0:01:26.550 --> 0:01:28.429 We know that you guys did this thing called Afterlife 0:01:28.430 --> 0:01:32.379 for a while, right? Or why to laugh in the afterlife. 0:01:34.440 --> 0:01:37.430 I mean, I started, it was 2 years ago, right? 0:01:37.589 --> 0:01:38.309 I was 17. 0:01:39.470 --> 0:01:41.480 I wasn't even allowed to drink. No, but 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:43.629 like I couldn't even enter the club. I still remember 0:01:43.629 --> 0:01:45.510 because at that point in time, you know, when like 0:01:45.510 --> 0:01:47.669 everybody wanted to go party and everything, and I was like, oh, 0:01:47.709 --> 0:01:49.589 I also want to go and then I realized, right, 0:01:49.669 --> 0:01:53.470 that like clubbing is damn expensive in Singapore. OK, especially 0:01:53.470 --> 0:01:55.150 like a 17 year old, right? I was like, Wow, 0:01:55.309 --> 0:01:57.430 paying like $40 to go in first 0:01:57.430 --> 0:01:58.970 of all, 17 year olds are not supposed to club. 0:01:59.989 --> 0:02:00.239 So yeah, 0:02:00.300 --> 0:02:01.790 1717. 0:02:01.989 --> 0:02:03.349 So what made you guys want to do that? 0:02:03.665 --> 0:02:06.334 I was the one that started the idea. I think 0:02:06.334 --> 0:02:09.175 because it was after COVID and then there was a 0:02:09.175 --> 0:02:11.413 rise in like just clubbing culture and then a lot 0:02:11.413 --> 0:02:13.793 of organizers came on the scene and then there was 0:02:13.794 --> 0:02:16.695 this one organizer, so he would invite a lot of 0:02:16.695 --> 0:02:19.054 creators to like events and then like a lot of 0:02:19.054 --> 0:02:21.134 people would turn up to these events because they are 0:02:21.133 --> 0:02:23.095 creators going and then we share about it, right? And 0:02:23.095 --> 0:02:24.654 I was looking at my friend and I was like, wait, 0:02:24.695 --> 0:02:26.774 we can totally do this. We're the one bringing the crowd. 0:02:26.835 --> 0:02:28.895 I also want to do my own kinds of parties 0:02:28.895 --> 0:02:30.975 where we have like our own unique ideas and we 0:02:30.975 --> 0:02:32.815 really build on the community building. 0:02:32.899 --> 0:02:34.880 Aspect of like a club. If you realize through all 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:38.720 our events, right, we always have events or like activities 0:02:38.720 --> 0:02:41.679 throughout the party that will have people mingling, you know, 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:44.519 so we want to have icebreakers or not just like 0:02:44.520 --> 0:02:49.918 go there, drink boring. So I got this other guy 0:02:49.919 --> 0:02:52.270 to do it with me, this other creator, and then 0:02:52.270 --> 0:02:53.839 I was like, oh, I need someone to do PR 0:02:53.839 --> 0:02:56.000 for us, like someone to do marketing, and then that 0:02:56.000 --> 0:02:58.960 was Ryan. So my diploma was in events management, so 0:02:58.960 --> 0:03:00.478 I could do like the on ground and I like 0:03:00.479 --> 0:03:01.919 doing that, like the lights, the music. 0:03:02.115 --> 0:03:04.544 The sets and whatnot and then the other guy was 0:03:04.544 --> 0:03:06.744 doing design and then he was in charge of marketing 0:03:06.744 --> 0:03:09.054 and PR yeah, at that point in time. 0:03:09.184 --> 0:03:10.774 So at that point of time I was just like, OK, 0:03:11.133 --> 0:03:12.764 I like to make money, right? I mean, who doesn't? 0:03:12.865 --> 0:03:14.945 So I was like, let's try to like get as 0:03:14.945 --> 0:03:18.425 many sponsors. It was our first ever event. Um, I 0:03:18.425 --> 0:03:20.425 told them that like I didn't want to like start 0:03:20.425 --> 0:03:23.133 with like a loss, right? So let's let's just try 0:03:23.133 --> 0:03:25.144 to find a way that we can get the money 0:03:25.145 --> 0:03:27.654 to secure the location to get, you know, so we 0:03:27.654 --> 0:03:29.425 are not loaning from anyone, you know, I don't want 0:03:29.425 --> 0:03:31.264 to go through any of that. So our first sponsor. 0:03:31.339 --> 0:03:33.639 I remember they came in clutch, they sponsored our first 0:03:33.639 --> 0:03:36.690 ever event, so all the money that we made from 0:03:36.690 --> 0:03:40.210 our first event throughout the whole entire Afterlife, um, was 0:03:40.210 --> 0:03:42.330 reinvested back into the company. So just kind of 0:03:42.330 --> 0:03:44.440 let it roll. So that's why we started I actually. 0:03:44.529 --> 0:03:47.089 The capital built from Afterlife was used to start up 0:03:47.089 --> 0:03:50.570 IO we actually started with. Why the switch then because 0:03:50.570 --> 0:03:54.648 we noticed that is dying is dying. You think so? 0:03:54.770 --> 0:03:56.770 We saw it coming. Like now if you look at 0:03:56.770 --> 0:03:59.850 the news, no, is empty Holland. 0:04:00.875 --> 0:04:02.384 a lot of the pubs and bars are 0:04:02.384 --> 0:04:04.714 empty. If you look at the analytics of our events, right, 0:04:04.835 --> 0:04:06.785 because after every event I was just looking back into 0:04:06.785 --> 0:04:08.384 like the finance and everything, and I'm just like, wow, 0:04:08.554 --> 0:04:11.514 last time we could like sell out an event like 500, 0:04:11.554 --> 0:04:14.755 700 packs in like what, two weeks and then nearing 0:04:14.755 --> 0:04:17.394 like the start of like, I mean 2 years last year, yeah, 0:04:17.475 --> 0:04:18.915 it was like very slow already. I was like wait 0:04:18.915 --> 0:04:19.554 what is going on? 0:04:19.595 --> 0:04:22.825 I think it's like when the post-COVID revenge partying died down. 0:04:23.274 --> 0:04:25.125 I think it was. Yeah, at one point I think 0:04:25.125 --> 0:04:26.834 Aces and I were going out like 3 times a 0:04:26.834 --> 0:04:27.303 week maybe twice. 0:04:30.059 --> 0:04:31.659 No, but I think, I think it's different for us 0:04:31.660 --> 0:04:34.738 because Sosa and I actually we met at work and 0:04:34.738 --> 0:04:37.250 then we became really close and we started partying together 0:04:37.250 --> 0:04:40.299 and then COVID hit and we stopped, right? Everything became 0:04:40.299 --> 0:04:43.660 super wholesome like she she became domesticated. She cooks, she 0:04:43.660 --> 0:04:47.419 cooks soup for me, you know, yeah, but then after that, 0:04:47.500 --> 0:04:49.339 when it started again and partying happened, that's when we 0:04:49.339 --> 0:04:52.099 were like, oh my God, we missed this, you know, yeah, 0:04:52.700 --> 0:04:56.169 but this is coming from two millennials, right? Were people 0:04:56.299 --> 0:04:58.910 at your parties, right? Were they Gen Z as well? 0:04:59.045 --> 0:05:02.803 Yes, mostly mostly Gen Z. So do you think it's 0:05:02.803 --> 0:05:05.565 because you guys were Gen Z creators or do you 0:05:05.565 --> 0:05:08.005 think it's because you guys were Gen Z entrepreneurs that 0:05:08.005 --> 0:05:10.484 you guys drew a Gen Z crowd to the party scene? 0:05:10.644 --> 0:05:12.924 Definitely Gen Z creators. I don't think anyone saw us 0:05:12.924 --> 0:05:16.125 as entrepreneurs at that point in time. We were just organizers, 0:05:16.244 --> 0:05:18.154 you know. It's a bit of both because you also 0:05:18.154 --> 0:05:20.785 know what you guys like, like what your friends like, 0:05:20.803 --> 0:05:23.654 and that's what you were doing too, right? So like 0:05:23.654 --> 0:05:26.035 Gen Z and whatever was like trending at that point 0:05:26.035 --> 0:05:28.165 in time. We really niche in on like Gen Z. 0:05:28.928 --> 0:05:32.149 trends and like like for example, our Halloween party was 0:05:32.149 --> 0:05:33.910 called Villain era and it's very show up in like 0:05:33.910 --> 0:05:34.279 villain costumes. Yeah, just like an inflatable dick, you know, 0:05:34.290 --> 0:05:45.719 we've seen this guy. OK, so then segueing into your 0:05:45.720 --> 0:05:48.269 new business, how did that change then? So 0:05:48.269 --> 0:05:51.149 like right now I think ever since like the nightlife site, right, 0:05:51.230 --> 0:05:52.510 we were like, OK, it's not working, right, we got 0:05:52.510 --> 0:05:54.950 to like pivot and then the one thing that I 0:05:54.950 --> 0:05:57.350 realized very quickly was that a lot of brands out there. 0:05:57.464 --> 0:05:59.613 I want to get onto the TikTok app, right? But 0:05:59.613 --> 0:06:02.535 then they don't have a team of Gen Zs or 0:06:02.535 --> 0:06:04.535 like people who are actually using the app to actually 0:06:04.535 --> 0:06:07.535 understand the kind of landscape that they are dealing with. 0:06:07.613 --> 0:06:10.295 So we realized that a lot of millennials want to touch, 0:06:10.494 --> 0:06:12.095 like reach out to the Gen Z, but like they 0:06:12.095 --> 0:06:14.695 don't know how. So we were like, hey, TikTok is 0:06:14.695 --> 0:06:17.094 like our realm. I've been doing TikTok for like 5 0:06:17.095 --> 0:06:19.295 years now, you know what I mean? Like it's changed 0:06:19.295 --> 0:06:21.834 so much and like we've right through that change, you know. 0:06:22.015 --> 0:06:23.815 So we were like, OK, you know what, maybe we 0:06:23.815 --> 0:06:26.494 can be the middle ground to help these brands who 0:06:26.494 --> 0:06:26.644 want 0:06:26.779 --> 0:06:28.480 To like grow to like reach out to like the 0:06:28.480 --> 0:06:30.919 Gen Zs and let us help them, you know. So 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:32.880 I think that was that was what we started to 0:06:32.880 --> 0:06:35.209 think of and then moving like a little bit deeper, 0:06:35.279 --> 0:06:36.959 we realized that like Gen Zs will be the next 0:06:36.959 --> 0:06:39.559 replacement market. A lot of brands right now don't look 0:06:39.559 --> 0:06:41.519 at the replacement market which are Gen Z, which will 0:06:41.519 --> 0:06:43.799 eventually be the ones spending on their brand. You can 0:06:43.799 --> 0:06:45.480 focus on the ones that are spending right now, but 0:06:45.480 --> 0:06:47.089 you can't forget about the replacement market, 0:06:48.000 --> 0:06:50.279 yeah, you just need to bring awareness. You know, I 0:06:50.279 --> 0:06:53.040 feel the idea of entrepreneurship has changed so much from 0:06:53.040 --> 0:06:55.799 our parents' generation to our generation to their generation. 0:06:56.149 --> 0:06:58.510 In the past, it was always seen as always very risky. 0:06:58.549 --> 0:07:01.579 It's very like, you got to really be careful with 0:07:01.579 --> 0:07:03.130 what you do if you want to start a business. 0:07:03.260 --> 0:07:05.089 And then I think with the millennials, it was more 0:07:05.089 --> 0:07:09.750 of like they were starting things like starting cafes, it changes, right? 0:07:09.929 --> 0:07:13.369 And then the younger millennials started becoming a bit more 0:07:13.369 --> 0:07:15.779 like risk takers. They're like, OK, we can use social 0:07:15.779 --> 0:07:17.859 media to start and then it comes to you guys. 0:07:17.980 --> 0:07:21.220 I will say that it's it's a shift that even 0:07:21.220 --> 0:07:23.059 while you're talking about it, right? 0:07:23.117 --> 0:07:24.786 Talk about like starting a business, right? The first thing 0:07:24.786 --> 0:07:27.907 that comes to mind is how much capital do we have, right? 0:07:27.946 --> 0:07:29.337 But you see the difference between the two of them 0:07:29.337 --> 0:07:31.467 was I'm not going to have capital. I'm going to 0:07:31.467 --> 0:07:33.986 find sponsors to pay for that. So it's always a 0:07:33.986 --> 0:07:36.187 difference in that risk. Yes, it's a risk, but for 0:07:36.187 --> 0:07:38.307 us it's like we got to have a certain amount 0:07:38.307 --> 0:07:40.187 to blow when they're like, we don't want to spend 0:07:40.187 --> 0:07:42.747 any money and it worked for them. Exactly. So the 0:07:42.747 --> 0:07:46.016 perspective changed over the years I would say. But do 0:07:46.016 --> 0:07:47.457 you think it's because you guys are Gen Zs or 0:07:47.457 --> 0:07:49.756 because you guys were creators that you guys thought. 0:07:50.084 --> 0:07:51.563 We've got a bit more leverage to do this. 0:07:51.674 --> 0:07:52.354 Like realistically 0:07:52.354 --> 0:07:54.824 speaking, I think afterlife at that point in time wasn't 0:07:54.824 --> 0:07:56.674 like our main thing, right? We all had our own 0:07:56.674 --> 0:07:59.473 social media careers before that. So in terms of risk, 0:07:59.553 --> 0:08:01.533 if any of us think we said this before, like 0:08:01.533 --> 0:08:03.473 if we needed to pump in money, we know that 0:08:03.473 --> 0:08:06.713 we can, but like let's just try to not do that, 0:08:06.794 --> 0:08:08.033 you know what I mean. But also at the 0:08:08.033 --> 0:08:10.523 same time, because you guys started so young, right, do 0:08:10.523 --> 0:08:12.593 you think there was a time where people weren't really 0:08:12.593 --> 0:08:14.713 taking you seriously? They were like, Oh, they're just doing 0:08:14.713 --> 0:08:16.003 it for fun. 0:08:17.740 --> 0:08:17.751 Yeah, 0:08:18.601 --> 0:08:21.401 so the other day during, um, we had like lunch 0:08:21.401 --> 0:08:23.489 together with the whole entire team and then one of 0:08:23.490 --> 0:08:25.680 the representatives told us that like, hey, you know, before 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:28.001 we sign you right, actually we didn't really believe in 0:08:28.001 --> 0:08:30.441 like your agency because like you and Dey are like 0:08:30.441 --> 0:08:31.990 and the other partner was like the face of it, 0:08:32.000 --> 0:08:33.921 and then you guys do like just heha kids and 0:08:33.921 --> 0:08:35.559 then we don't know whether to take your seriously to 0:08:35.559 --> 0:08:38.241 like represent our brand. Like it was quite what the 0:08:38.241 --> 0:08:39.559 hell lah, but at the end of the day we 0:08:39.559 --> 0:08:41.200 made them so much money, so I'm just like, you 0:08:41.200 --> 0:08:42.721 know what, you can take that and shove it up 0:08:42.721 --> 0:08:43.531 your ass, you know, like. 0:08:45.229 --> 0:08:47.789 I think a lot of other Gen Zs would actually 0:08:47.789 --> 0:08:50.390 feel the same way because I think age is a 0:08:50.390 --> 0:08:52.640 very big thing, especially in the community and the social 0:08:52.989 --> 0:08:55.190 structure that we live in in Singapore. It's always going 0:08:55.190 --> 0:08:56.950 to be like, you know, oh, you're too young, you 0:08:56.950 --> 0:08:57.859 don't know what you're doing. 0:08:58.270 --> 0:08:58.390 I 0:08:58.390 --> 0:09:01.789 heard that a lot so often and I think like 0:09:01.789 --> 0:09:03.909 a lot of people just and and I still till 0:09:03.909 --> 0:09:05.909 today like just not just finished a meeting, right, and 0:09:05.909 --> 0:09:07.590 then the person asked me, oh, so how old are you? 0:09:07.630 --> 0:09:09.369 And 9 out of 10 times I would never answer 0:09:09.369 --> 0:09:12.108 that question because I just know that once I do, right, 0:09:12.229 --> 0:09:13.299 they'll be like, oh. 0:09:13.619 --> 0:09:15.969 Yeah, do they have the expertise to do this? But 0:09:15.969 --> 0:09:18.049 at the same time, you know, it's like we know 0:09:18.049 --> 0:09:20.030 our shit so well that like we know the space, 0:09:20.090 --> 0:09:22.329 you know what I mean? Like if you don't trust us, 0:09:22.409 --> 0:09:24.010 you can go to another agency, but I just know 0:09:24.010 --> 0:09:26.530 that you're going to regret it because once you come back, 0:09:26.559 --> 0:09:27.760 it's going to be more expensive. 0:09:27.919 --> 0:09:29.369 You know what I mean. Do you think it's wrong 0:09:29.369 --> 0:09:31.729 for people to think that like to look at the 0:09:31.729 --> 0:09:35.359 number of years of experience as something that they want 0:09:35.359 --> 0:09:39.049 to consider before hiring? Because I know sometimes when we talk, OK, 0:09:39.140 --> 0:09:40.609 how long have you been hosting? That's fair. 0:09:40.844 --> 0:09:43.875 For 10 years versus someone 01 year, then likely they 0:09:43.875 --> 0:09:46.505 might go for the person who has had more experience, right? 0:09:46.905 --> 0:09:49.794 So do you feel like the number of years of 0:09:49.794 --> 0:09:50.965 experience is extremely 0:09:50.965 --> 0:09:51.195 important? 0:09:51.265 --> 0:09:52.994 I think it's slightly different. I think the number of 0:09:52.994 --> 0:09:55.955 years of experience definitely matter, but I think the point 0:09:55.955 --> 0:09:57.914 that I want to bring across here was that like 0:09:57.914 --> 0:10:00.695 they ask us how old we are. For example, like 0:10:00.695 --> 0:10:03.114 I started content creation since I was like taking my 0:10:03.114 --> 0:10:05.664 O levels, you know what I mean? 5 years in, 0:10:05.794 --> 0:10:07.994 like that's my experience, but just because I'm 20. 0:10:08.070 --> 0:10:09.940 Oh, it's a bit too young, but I still have 0:10:09.940 --> 0:10:12.210 5 years of experience, you know, like some other agencies 0:10:12.210 --> 0:10:14.739 have never got on TikTok at all, maybe last 1 year, 0:10:14.780 --> 0:10:16.780 2 years, you know, so I think the number of 0:10:16.780 --> 0:10:19.630 experiences do matter, but like when clients see us as like, oh, 0:10:19.650 --> 0:10:22.140 we are too young in terms of like age, I 0:10:22.140 --> 0:10:23.659 think that's why I have a problem with, you know 0:10:23.659 --> 0:10:24.260 what I mean? 0:10:24.440 --> 0:10:24.969 Yeah. 0:10:25.140 --> 0:10:29.978 Obviously, um, we're talking about gender as well. So when 0:10:29.979 --> 0:10:32.459 you guys are there, who's more front facing when you 0:10:32.460 --> 0:10:34.369 guys are meeting clients, you are. 0:10:35.294 --> 0:10:38.135 So I'm going to be very honest about this. Um, 0:10:38.164 --> 0:10:39.885 a lot of the times when we speak to clients, 0:10:40.075 --> 0:10:42.325 I always let Ryan take the lead. I'm very, I 0:10:42.325 --> 0:10:44.164 like to be on the ground. I like to just 0:10:44.164 --> 0:10:46.164 do things behind the doors. I just work with my 0:10:46.164 --> 0:10:48.325 team because I'm not going to lie lah. I don't 0:10:48.325 --> 0:10:50.445 know is it because of my persona online or is 0:10:50.445 --> 0:10:52.325 it because of my gender, you know, I don't want 0:10:52.325 --> 0:10:55.204 to put him on anything, but I do realize that 0:10:55.205 --> 0:10:58.204 sometimes people take him more seriously compared to me when 0:10:58.205 --> 0:11:00.064 they have something serious, they didn't want to bring up 0:11:00.065 --> 0:11:01.965 to like the higher ups in I go right, they 0:11:01.965 --> 0:11:02.405 go to him. 0:11:02.719 --> 0:11:04.900 Yeah, very rarely they come to me, only if I've 0:11:04.900 --> 0:11:07.700 really talked to that person and I've built trust with them. 0:11:08.239 --> 0:11:09.750 So then to me, I will just take a step back. 0:11:09.869 --> 0:11:10.799 I'm OK to let him find you. 0:11:12.530 --> 0:11:15.109 Um, sometimes, but sometimes I will ask myself, oh, is 0:11:15.109 --> 0:11:17.150 it because of my gender, or is it because of 0:11:17.150 --> 0:11:19.270 the persona that I have online, but I try not 0:11:19.270 --> 0:11:21.228 to blame those kind of things because those things are 0:11:21.229 --> 0:11:23.630 not things that I can change, but right now I 0:11:23.630 --> 0:11:26.469 know I'm young, I'm a girl, those are facts, but 0:11:26.469 --> 0:11:29.349 what I can do is to just be credible enough 0:11:29.349 --> 0:11:31.669 that people will respect me, maybe in the future. This 0:11:31.669 --> 0:11:33.510 is what I'm trying to build right now because I 0:11:33.510 --> 0:11:34.900 am still young, you know, 0:11:35.150 --> 0:11:35.390 and 0:11:35.390 --> 0:11:37.909 I see that like sometimes like the clients like reach 0:11:37.909 --> 0:11:39.169 out to me and then Dewey is just like. 0:11:39.224 --> 0:11:40.695 You know, I actually I texted the client already, but 0:11:40.695 --> 0:11:42.255 the client never replied to me, but then I texted 0:11:42.255 --> 0:11:45.214 the client like 2 minutes instant reply, you know, and 0:11:45.215 --> 0:11:47.215 as a business partner, right, I got to tell the 0:11:47.215 --> 0:11:49.854 client like, hey, um, Dey texted you as well, and 0:11:49.854 --> 0:11:52.015 I think I would appreciate like if you could promptly 0:11:52.015 --> 0:11:53.843 reply to her as well because we are the same, 0:11:54.015 --> 0:11:54.174 you know 0:11:54.174 --> 0:11:54.645 what I mean? 0:11:54.655 --> 0:11:56.614 You're trying to make it work, but is there a 0:11:56.614 --> 0:11:59.174 difference in the way that the two of you communicate? 0:11:59.294 --> 0:12:04.135 Like what's your communication style with clients? We're both very formal. 0:12:04.695 --> 0:12:05.684 I cannot imagine. 0:12:06.359 --> 0:12:07.299 It's a difference. 0:12:07.320 --> 0:12:10.900 I mean, for example, I'm a client and you want to, 0:12:11.359 --> 0:12:13.229 if we're just bumping on this, I just need a 0:12:13.229 --> 0:12:14.840 few things back from you and then I'll list it 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:17.150 on point form very clearly. Let me know when I 0:12:17.150 --> 0:12:18.590 can get back to you if you need a call, 0:12:18.630 --> 0:12:21.179 just let me know. I'm very, very like circle back. 0:12:22.539 --> 0:12:24.010 Corporate lingo guys like we're not like that, 0:12:30.510 --> 0:12:33.429 but that's good to know because sometimes people might have 0:12:33.429 --> 0:12:35.789 this preconceived notion of what they see on social media 0:12:35.789 --> 0:12:37.789 and think that that's what they're going to get. I 0:12:37.789 --> 0:12:38.069 think because we 0:12:38.070 --> 0:12:38.309 have very 0:12:38.309 --> 0:12:41.228 loud personalities online, right? But then at the same time 0:12:41.229 --> 0:12:43.669 like people don't know that there's another side of us, 0:12:43.789 --> 0:12:45.789 you know, like, sure, you know, like, but. 0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:47.090 That's what 0:12:47.090 --> 0:12:47.400 the hell? 0:12:48.690 --> 0:12:48.949 You won't 0:12:48.950 --> 0:12:52.760 know until you find out, I always say this, right, 0:12:52.799 --> 0:12:56.080 that as long as you have a personality online, the 0:12:56.080 --> 0:12:57.979 world thinks that they can have an opinion of who 0:12:57.979 --> 0:12:59.890 you are as a person based off that, right? Yeah, 0:13:00.719 --> 0:13:01.719 I always, always. 0:13:05.909 --> 0:13:08.830 I want to ask you as well, right, because I 0:13:08.830 --> 0:13:12.869 know this person? Is this person my podcast partner? No, 0:13:13.070 --> 0:13:14.590 I was going to ask you, right, how old were 0:13:14.590 --> 0:13:16.468 you when you said that you wanted to try and 0:13:16.469 --> 0:13:18.669 do something outside of radio in your own personal space 0:13:18.669 --> 0:13:21.590 like entrepreneurship wise? If you remember, I did do F&B 0:13:21.590 --> 0:13:23.400 for a little bit with a bunch of other partners 0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:26.590 like we ran a barakaya style sort of place, and 0:13:26.590 --> 0:13:28.589 I was about 26 when we started talking about it. 0:13:29.030 --> 0:13:30.929 But it was a period of time where I was 0:13:30.929 --> 0:13:32.968 still building my brand because I didn't start as early 0:13:32.969 --> 0:13:35.599 as you guys. I started like when I was 21 0:13:35.969 --> 0:13:38.700 into radio and into all this, and I'm not naturally 0:13:38.969 --> 0:13:41.010 a person that would be like, yes, I'm in front 0:13:41.010 --> 0:13:44.010 of the camera like that was not actually in my nature. Yeah, 0:13:44.130 --> 0:13:45.609 I was more of like I want to write and 0:13:45.609 --> 0:13:50.440 be a journalist, that kind of person. I'm not this, no, 0:13:50.570 --> 0:13:51.830 I never expected myself to do this. 0:13:52.460 --> 0:13:54.770 I took a while to like build that, you know, 0:13:54.869 --> 0:13:56.449 and we also were at a time where there was 0:13:56.450 --> 0:13:58.909 like no TikTok, it was only Instagram, right? And then 0:13:58.909 --> 0:14:01.650 at 26 there was an opportunity that presented itself. If 0:14:01.650 --> 0:14:05.609 it wasn't an opportunity that came by, maybe I would 0:14:05.609 --> 0:14:08.329 not have even taken it, you know what I mean? 0:14:08.390 --> 0:14:10.130 Based 0:14:10.130 --> 0:14:12.419 on that, right, let's say you're looking at both. 0:14:12.682 --> 0:14:15.352 Kind of entrepreneurship situations, right, as a millennial and as 0:14:15.352 --> 0:14:18.002 a Gen Z, do you guys see any similarities or 0:14:18.002 --> 0:14:19.752 is it a lot of differences? 0:14:19.922 --> 0:14:21.822 I think it's quite similar in the sense that like 0:14:21.822 --> 0:14:24.422 when opportunity is given, right, that's that's where I go. 0:14:24.593 --> 0:14:26.833 You should take it, you should take it because if 0:14:26.833 --> 0:14:28.953 we didn't have our first client, right, it's very hard 0:14:28.953 --> 0:14:30.833 to prove to our other clients that we actually know 0:14:30.833 --> 0:14:32.793 what we're doing. Until today, I'm still so grateful. 0:14:33.455 --> 0:14:36.895 very first client JBL, you know, like, thanks for signing 0:14:36.895 --> 0:14:40.176 with us, you know, because of that, right, we still 0:14:40.176 --> 0:14:44.895 use your account as like um yeah, I need to 0:14:44.895 --> 0:14:46.536 circle back because a lot of people feel like it's 0:14:46.536 --> 0:14:49.466 very tough to be so young and create like an 0:14:49.466 --> 0:14:52.255 impression to like the older people, right? I don't want 0:14:52.255 --> 0:14:55.135 to say this, but like how older people just give 0:14:55.135 --> 0:14:58.335 these young people a chance because you never know they 0:14:58.335 --> 0:15:00.776 could actually make more of a difference than like what. 0:15:01.169 --> 0:15:01.669 Your bubble, 0:15:02.270 --> 0:15:02.590 you know. 0:15:02.710 --> 0:15:06.190 Does it make you more motivated to win over other 0:15:06.190 --> 0:15:08.830 people when you get treated in a sort of a 0:15:08.830 --> 0:15:11.750 not so nice manner or when people doubt you? Does 0:15:11.750 --> 0:15:14.950 that give you more fuel and motivation? Yeah, so circling 0:15:14.950 --> 0:15:20.330 back to the whole thing a lot more corporate lingo. 0:15:20.549 --> 0:15:22.679 My email says sent by my iPhone. 0:15:25.520 --> 0:15:27.440 Yeah, no, going back to the part where I talked 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:30.000 about how I feel um like I'm not taking it 0:15:30.000 --> 0:15:32.010 seriously because I'm a girl and I have my own 0:15:32.010 --> 0:15:35.070 online persona, right? So sometimes I would lie in bed 0:15:35.070 --> 0:15:37.900 and like ask myself, do they see me as a clown? 0:15:39.280 --> 0:15:39.440 No, 0:15:39.840 --> 0:15:40.119 they 0:15:40.119 --> 0:15:43.000 don't. Did you see a clown? Oh well, you know, 0:15:43.099 --> 0:15:44.289 it's not my fault. I'm funny. 0:15:45.690 --> 0:15:48.580 Yeah, I will literally have like identity crisis. I will 0:15:48.580 --> 0:15:50.679 ask myself, like, do I need to change who I 0:15:50.679 --> 0:15:52.840 am online so that they will take Iko seriously? So 0:15:52.840 --> 0:15:55.650 there's this like, I feel this conflict sometimes right between 0:15:55.650 --> 0:15:58.640 like the detri persona and the Iko persona because people 0:15:58.640 --> 0:16:01.039 see me in offices and they're like, Hey, you're actually normal. 0:16:01.280 --> 0:16:03.650 I'm like, yeah, then you think what? You think I'm 0:16:03.650 --> 0:16:09.520 just crazy. This is normal. I mean, yeah, so I've 0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:11.640 always wondered if I should just tone myself down, but 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:12.280 then I realized like. 0:16:12.367 --> 0:16:13.317 No, we 0:16:13.317 --> 0:16:14.078 had this conversation before, 0:16:15.038 --> 0:16:16.437 what I want to work towards now as I say, 0:16:16.478 --> 0:16:20.907 is to just like let my accomplishments speak for itself. Honestly, 0:16:21.047 --> 0:16:23.158 the best way to prove people wrong is through your 0:16:23.158 --> 0:16:25.677 own success. that's what I feel. You don't need to 0:16:25.677 --> 0:16:27.398 even say anything or like they can just 0:16:27.398 --> 0:16:28.578 see for themselves, you know, 0:16:30.197 --> 0:16:32.877 you know, we all see this online as well. You 0:16:32.877 --> 0:16:36.078 don't present yourself as a traditionally masculine man, right? It's 0:16:36.078 --> 0:16:38.907 very prevalent about that and you are very open about that. 0:16:39.356 --> 0:16:43.116 Has clients or people in general ever turned away because 0:16:43.116 --> 0:16:44.585 of this thing or they treated you a little bit 0:16:44.585 --> 0:16:45.116 differently 0:16:45.116 --> 0:16:45.315 because of 0:16:45.315 --> 0:16:48.356 that? Differently definitely have. I think it goes both ways. Like, 0:16:48.515 --> 0:16:52.156 for example, if it is a beauty client, well I 0:16:52.156 --> 0:16:54.786 think 90% I can close, you know what I mean 0:16:54.786 --> 0:16:59.036 like I literally embody what this Sephora Squad, I do 0:16:59.036 --> 0:17:01.026 beauty that's my whole entire content. I'm doing it for 0:17:01.026 --> 0:17:03.276 4 years now, right? But then if it comes to 0:17:03.276 --> 0:17:05.635 like more like those tech lifestyle. 0:17:05.754 --> 0:17:08.513 Kind, I find myself actually like dressing 0:17:08.513 --> 0:17:09.854 down or muting. 0:17:10.374 --> 0:17:12.433 Yeah, so it sucks to say this, you know, but 0:17:12.433 --> 0:17:15.583 there was once I went into a meeting and then 0:17:15.583 --> 0:17:17.953 I had like one of my employees inside as well, right? 0:17:18.154 --> 0:17:20.114 The person didn't even look at me. The person just 0:17:20.114 --> 0:17:22.563 looked at my employee like talking to him as if 0:17:22.563 --> 0:17:24.553 like he runs the place and he knows 0:17:24.553 --> 0:17:24.953 that. 0:17:25.034 --> 0:17:28.473 Do you think it's because some people generally don't know 0:17:28.473 --> 0:17:30.514 what to say or they feel awkward? Are they of 0:17:30.513 --> 0:17:32.312 a different generation or different mindset? 0:17:32.511 --> 0:17:35.031 It is the older generation, right, so maybe they don't 0:17:35.031 --> 0:17:37.391 know how to approach or like 0:17:37.391 --> 0:17:38.891 I mean it could be that um I don't want 0:17:38.891 --> 0:17:41.722 to like say like oh because I wear makeup because 0:17:41.722 --> 0:17:43.751 maybe you could you could maybe they scared, you know 0:17:43.751 --> 0:17:45.631 what I mean, I don't know, but it did like 0:17:45.631 --> 0:17:46.791 it did kind of affect me a little bit because 0:17:46.791 --> 0:17:48.822 I was just like, wow, my son like wow, become 0:17:48.821 --> 0:17:51.222 like a man like what's up bro, you know, like 0:17:51.222 --> 0:17:51.232 I 0:17:51.232 --> 0:17:51.251 mean obviously, 0:17:54.911 --> 0:17:57.682 well, you know, side tracking a little bit, there was, 0:17:57.991 --> 0:17:58.911 this was quite recent. 0:17:59.209 --> 0:18:03.250 I overheard a conversation at another table of older generation, right, 0:18:03.319 --> 0:18:04.938 and there was a guy that walked past that was 0:18:04.939 --> 0:18:07.379 like doing shoots. This guy was wearing like more of 0:18:07.380 --> 0:18:10.739 a feminine outfit with heels, and I overheard this other 0:18:10.739 --> 0:18:13.569 guy say, Wow, guys wear heels now. The other one said, 0:18:13.680 --> 0:18:15.280 don't look, don't look. I 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:15.869 don't know, definitely, 0:18:16.479 --> 0:18:18.719 yeah, so I think they're just awkward, like they don't 0:18:18.719 --> 0:18:20.359 know how to react. They don't want to make you 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:22.770 feel uncomfortable, but in turn they actually so how would 0:18:22.770 --> 0:18:23.160 you 0:18:26.459 --> 0:18:27.170 Navigate this. 0:18:27.420 --> 0:18:29.060 I think for me at the end of the day, right, 0:18:29.260 --> 0:18:31.380 I got to put my personal feelings aside if I 0:18:31.380 --> 0:18:34.099 want to grow the brand, right? So if it makes 0:18:34.099 --> 0:18:36.020 the client more comfortable, and I know it sucks for 0:18:36.020 --> 0:18:37.819 me to say this because I got to like dumb 0:18:37.819 --> 0:18:39.739 myself down, but like if that is what it takes 0:18:39.739 --> 0:18:42.899 to to close the client and make them feel comfortable, 0:18:42.930 --> 0:18:45.170 that's what I would do. But I must say that 0:18:45.170 --> 0:18:46.729 I want I could to go to the day where 0:18:46.729 --> 0:18:48.938 I don't have to do this anymore. Like if you 0:18:48.939 --> 0:18:49.819 want to come to me, you. 0:18:49.875 --> 0:18:51.415 Come to me. If not, I don't need your business, 0:18:51.545 --> 0:18:51.925 you know what I 0:18:51.925 --> 0:18:54.264 mean? I like the confidence here, like, you know, if 0:18:54.265 --> 0:18:55.984 you want to come to you want, don't want, don't want. 0:18:56.025 --> 0:18:58.704 But what if people come through with like, Hey guys, 0:18:58.785 --> 0:19:01.064 I think you could have done this better. Are you 0:19:01.064 --> 0:19:02.734 open to that kind of criticism of course, 0:19:03.625 --> 0:19:06.063 of course. I think, I think our agency grew quite 0:19:06.064 --> 0:19:09.155 a lot from the start and thanks to our interns, 0:19:09.224 --> 0:19:11.744 our employees, yeah, you know what, maybe you can do 0:19:11.744 --> 0:19:13.385 this differently, maybe you all can subscribe to. 0:19:13.479 --> 0:19:16.189 This like HR plan, you know what I mean it 0:19:16.189 --> 0:19:18.389 really it really you know ecosystem, you 0:19:18.390 --> 0:19:18.579 know. 0:19:18.930 --> 0:19:20.869 So you guys are actually very, very much open to 0:19:20.869 --> 0:19:24.589 like change and everything. I always sit down and ask 0:19:24.589 --> 0:19:26.188 them like what do you think can be done better. 0:19:26.589 --> 0:19:29.629 It's really good because I feel that not generalizing it 0:19:29.630 --> 0:19:31.910 as a generational thing or what, but I think I've 0:19:31.910 --> 0:19:34.389 definitely heard this before where people say, if it ain't broke, 0:19:34.469 --> 0:19:36.989 don't fix it. And that also indicates that there's not much. 0:19:37.104 --> 0:19:38.185 Change or progress. 0:19:38.635 --> 0:19:40.935 But also like context is that we are a smaller company, 0:19:41.114 --> 0:19:43.165 so we can do that, you know what I mean 0:19:43.165 --> 0:19:46.034 because I know a lot of bigger companies like oh 0:19:46.035 --> 0:19:49.234 because higher management say already but like in our company especially, 0:19:49.314 --> 0:19:50.474 I think we want to make it very clear that 0:19:50.474 --> 0:19:53.954 like be your intern, your employee, like we all share 0:19:53.954 --> 0:19:55.994 the same level in terms of like how we can 0:19:55.994 --> 0:19:56.944 improve the company together. 0:19:57.915 --> 0:20:00.645 How many people are there in your company? 12. 0:20:01.130 --> 0:20:04.849 Older than you or younger than you guys around all 0:20:04.849 --> 0:20:07.609 right because I was going to say that if you 0:20:07.609 --> 0:20:11.290 guys hired somebody who is older, do you think was 0:20:11.290 --> 0:20:12.489 there an issue? How much older? 0:20:12.810 --> 0:20:13.438 28 0:20:14.010 --> 0:20:15.829 and did they see it in a situation where, oh, 0:20:15.890 --> 0:20:17.530 you're younger, you don't know what you're talking about, even 0:20:17.530 --> 0:20:20.430 though you're my bosses. OK, so the employee was very nice, right? 0:20:20.449 --> 0:20:23.369 He was lovely to work with. But I think when 0:20:23.369 --> 0:20:25.169 it comes down to like conflicts when I have to. 0:20:25.265 --> 0:20:27.155 Tell him you can't do this. And when I'm very 0:20:27.155 --> 0:20:30.155 stunned about it, right? I'm not going to lie, I 0:20:30.155 --> 0:20:32.305 think it kind of like hurt his ego a little bit, 0:20:32.484 --> 0:20:34.925 knowing that someone so much younger is telling him that 0:20:34.925 --> 0:20:37.074 and it never feels great, but it has to be done. 0:20:37.204 --> 0:20:44.155 And don't worry, I'm not an abusive boss. I'm always 0:20:44.155 --> 0:20:45.435 very like no one thought you were. I'm very constructive. 0:20:45.525 --> 0:20:49.125 I'm like, this is wrong. You do this. I'm not 0:20:49.125 --> 0:20:49.563 going to call your name. 0:20:49.650 --> 0:20:51.599 Or whatever, you know what I mean? But then like 0:20:51.599 --> 0:20:53.280 I think he couldn't take it and then I saw 0:20:53.280 --> 0:20:55.040 him broke down because of that and I felt so 0:20:55.040 --> 0:20:56.899 bad for him. Yeah, then he told me that like 0:20:56.900 --> 0:20:58.679 he want to go somewhere else to work. So I 0:20:58.680 --> 0:21:00.688 was like, you know what, I'm happy for you. What 0:21:00.689 --> 0:21:02.119 do you say is completely right, right? The way that 0:21:02.119 --> 0:21:04.640 you approach a situation, it's not about calling them names, 0:21:04.680 --> 0:21:07.079 it's how you say it, right? Not that way where 0:21:07.079 --> 0:21:10.929 it's like it's, you know, yeah, but I'm trying to 0:21:10.930 --> 0:21:13.880 be her, OK, you get, you get my point. 0:21:14.324 --> 0:21:16.775 Wait, wait, wait, you actually spoke to me like that. Yeah, 0:21:18.314 --> 0:21:20.474 sometimes I don't do it no but because sometimes if 0:21:20.474 --> 0:21:21.994 I'm very serious, right, OK, 0:21:22.045 --> 0:21:25.314 wait, wait, I must just say when Dewey is I 0:21:25.314 --> 0:21:25.675 get scared. 0:21:26.155 --> 0:21:28.755 A lot of them just cry. But then again I 0:21:28.755 --> 0:21:31.114 also feel like it's the strawberry generation, and I can 0:21:31.114 --> 0:21:33.814 say that because I'm a Gen Z. Really, you only 0:21:33.814 --> 0:21:35.954 need to stop crying, OK. But 0:21:35.954 --> 0:21:37.034 like genuinely don't how 0:21:37.035 --> 0:21:37.905 to feel. 0:21:39.359 --> 0:21:44.790 Grow up. So you guys seem really close outside of work. 0:21:45.180 --> 0:21:48.199 That's right. Has this ever taken a toll on your 0:21:48.199 --> 0:21:51.239 friendship before and what is the reality of doing a 0:21:51.239 --> 0:21:53.079 business together? I mean, I know that we're talking a 0:21:53.079 --> 0:21:56.400 lot about like your clients dealing with them, the glamorous 0:21:56.400 --> 0:21:59.119 side of things, and almost tell us what is the 0:21:59.119 --> 0:22:02.520 reality of things. It's great. I love Ryan so much. 0:22:02.680 --> 0:22:05.198 He's my best friend. But you have a fight? No, 0:22:05.439 --> 0:22:06.140 we have our fight. 0:22:07.286 --> 0:22:08.115 in one hour. 0:22:09.166 --> 0:22:11.656 we don't, we don't carry on. I feel like don't 0:22:11.656 --> 0:22:11.764 hold 0:22:11.765 --> 0:22:13.125 grudges tiring. 0:22:13.686 --> 0:22:14.975 You want to go and bring on so long 0:22:14.975 --> 0:22:17.086 for one to assess the fight and then we come 0:22:17.086 --> 0:22:20.014 up with solutions and then we conclusion. That's it. Give 0:22:20.015 --> 0:22:22.805 us one very strategic one example of a fight that 0:22:22.806 --> 0:22:26.365 you guys have. I was asking him, oh, I'm gonna 0:22:26.365 --> 0:22:27.285 get to sponsor. 0:22:27.571 --> 0:22:30.001 I ask him, what color you want, you say he 0:22:30.001 --> 0:22:33.182 wants red color. OK, I love you I got you, 0:22:33.241 --> 0:22:35.722 but I'm like, I'm not gonna have 3 red color 0:22:35.722 --> 0:22:39.831 chairs just like spiraling in my office. So he got 0:22:39.832 --> 0:22:41.841 every other thing else for like our office, right? Like 0:22:41.842 --> 0:22:43.630 he got the water dispenser. He didn't run through me, 0:22:43.641 --> 0:22:45.682 but I'm like, get it, whatever. I did the whole 0:22:45.682 --> 0:22:46.921 it also red water. 0:22:49.459 --> 0:22:51.250 Yeah, I let him choose all the colors and the 0:22:51.250 --> 0:22:53.250 things for office. I kind of trust him, but because 0:22:53.250 --> 0:22:55.050 I'm getting a goin chair. So I was like, you 0:22:55.050 --> 0:22:57.050 know what, I'm going to make the decision to choose 0:22:57.050 --> 0:22:58.889 black chairs instead because I just think it's easy on 0:22:58.890 --> 0:23:00.800 the eyes. So you all basically fought over the colors 0:23:00.800 --> 0:23:02.369 of the chairs. Yeah, so then when the chairs, right, 0:23:02.449 --> 0:23:05.359 he realized it was black. I was like, Why didn't 0:23:05.359 --> 0:23:08.430 you tell me that it's gonna become black? I said, uh, 0:23:08.609 --> 0:23:10.729 but you also didn't tell me that the water dispenser 0:23:10.729 --> 0:23:12.949 is gonna be the $80 dispenser. I thought we're getting 0:23:12.949 --> 0:23:16.050 the $3 dispenser from Shopei. You know I mine. Then 0:23:16.050 --> 0:23:17.979 after that it became a fight, he's like, why didn't 0:23:17.979 --> 0:23:19.290 you tell me? I should have been. 0:23:19.380 --> 0:23:20.969 No I'm like, but you didn't tell me other things 0:23:20.969 --> 0:23:24.530 too and I let you have the executive position. So 0:23:24.530 --> 0:23:26.129 you all kind of just worked it out. 0:23:26.250 --> 0:23:26.369 I 0:23:26.369 --> 0:23:28.969 want to share a bit more about um how the 0:23:28.969 --> 0:23:32.050 company started with more than just both of us. I mean, 0:23:32.089 --> 0:23:34.129 as nice as you want to make it seem right, 0:23:34.250 --> 0:23:37.689 like it's not all like happy like this company because 0:23:37.689 --> 0:23:40.329 it really wasn't like it was quite rough, I would 0:23:40.329 --> 0:23:42.929 say like we started off with 3 different people when 0:23:42.930 --> 0:23:45.569 we first incorporated our company and now it's just me 0:23:45.569 --> 0:23:49.169 and Dewey, and I think if like you're a young entrepreneur, right? 0:23:49.510 --> 0:23:52.250 Um, and you and you're planning to like start something 0:23:52.250 --> 0:23:54.319 with like your friend, I think the most important thing 0:23:54.319 --> 0:23:57.929 is to have similar working styles because I think a 0:23:57.930 --> 0:24:00.369 lot of conflicts will come up when you guys work 0:24:00.369 --> 0:24:01.250 very differently. So, 0:24:01.670 --> 0:24:03.510 Like you got to know who you're working with, babes, 0:24:03.670 --> 0:24:06.089 because even for us, right, we kind of didn't like 0:24:06.089 --> 0:24:07.589 each other when we first I 0:24:07.589 --> 0:24:10.020 hated him. We hated each other when we first started working, 0:24:10.130 --> 0:24:11.709 but I saw his value and I knew he was 0:24:11.709 --> 0:24:13.310 a really smart guy, and I was like, I want 0:24:13.310 --> 0:24:15.989 this person on my team. Yeah, and then we actually 0:24:15.989 --> 0:24:19.510 became best friends through working together. So I want to 0:24:19.510 --> 0:24:21.030 debunk this, right? A lot of people always say, Oh, 0:24:21.189 --> 0:24:23.270 will you fight with your friends or like don't go 0:24:23.270 --> 0:24:26.869 into business with your friends. Don't get money. I just 0:24:26.869 --> 0:24:28.209 like to say that. 0:24:29.719 --> 0:24:36.419 We do it now. No, but didn't you just say 0:24:36.420 --> 0:24:38.729 that you guys didn't like each other? Yeah, but because 0:24:38.729 --> 0:24:41.260 of I go we became so close. So technically you 0:24:41.260 --> 0:24:43.430 didn't go into business as friends. We were friends, but 0:24:43.430 --> 0:24:45.660 we weren't like close friends, you know, we were like friend. 0:24:47.010 --> 0:24:51.060 It was like she's just there, you know, but then 0:24:51.060 --> 0:24:51.819 I started to like 0:24:51.819 --> 0:24:53.229 her. No, but I just want to say that. 0:24:53.473 --> 0:24:56.662 I don't believe that businesses breaks friendship. I feel like 0:24:56.662 --> 0:24:58.782 it shows you whether or not your friendship can actually 0:24:58.782 --> 0:25:00.503 tie to hard times. And 0:25:00.503 --> 0:25:03.152 some people are better off as friends than business partners. 0:25:03.223 --> 0:25:05.542 I think that's what we realized and especially when we 0:25:05.542 --> 0:25:08.062 had to like let go one of our business partners, right? 0:25:08.182 --> 0:25:10.743 I think it was, it was not easy definitely. We 0:25:10.743 --> 0:25:12.682 were at our old office, we all sat in the 0:25:12.682 --> 0:25:14.941 room together and we were like, so what is your 0:25:14.942 --> 0:25:18.142 vision for for ICO, you know? And then I think 0:25:18.196 --> 0:25:20.786 We, we sooner or later realized that like the other 0:25:20.786 --> 0:25:23.345 partner had like different plans and we were like, OK, 0:25:23.446 --> 0:25:25.186 you know what, if you're going to double down and 0:25:25.186 --> 0:25:27.504 put 110% because we're gonna, we just moved to our 0:25:27.505 --> 0:25:29.504 new office, so we were like, it's just gonna be 0:25:29.505 --> 0:25:33.836 us then, you know, and then bye bye. I think 0:25:33.836 --> 0:25:37.095 deep down he also kind of wanted to leave, so 0:25:37.095 --> 0:25:37.225 I 0:25:37.225 --> 0:25:39.365 think he wanted to pursue other things. I mean, no 0:25:39.365 --> 0:25:41.936 hard feelings. He just had other pursuits in life. 0:25:43.290 --> 0:25:45.329 I am happy for him and I want him to 0:25:45.329 --> 0:25:47.250 do well, but I have to be very honest and 0:25:47.250 --> 0:25:49.810 say that like the company really tested our friendship and 0:25:49.810 --> 0:25:50.859 I've realized that like. 0:25:51.400 --> 0:25:53.670 We don't align on a lot of things, but that's OK. 0:25:53.880 --> 0:25:55.920 He's still a great person. I think he's still talented 0:25:55.920 --> 0:25:57.760 in his own ways. He's happier now and I'm happy 0:25:57.760 --> 0:26:00.439 for him. So speaking of, yeah, we know friends and 0:26:00.439 --> 0:26:03.130 all that that get involved into businesses. I'm sure you 0:26:03.130 --> 0:26:05.229 guys shared it with your families too. 0:26:05.400 --> 0:26:07.640 My dad is, he's his own entrepreneur, he has his 0:26:07.640 --> 0:26:10.829 own business and whatever he does events like he does weddings. 0:26:11.010 --> 0:26:13.099 So when I told him, I think he was trying 0:26:13.099 --> 0:26:15.198 to relieve his like youth in me, you know, like 0:26:15.199 --> 0:26:16.760 I was like, well, let me give you some advice. 0:26:17.239 --> 0:26:18.040 So it was very nice and the point. 0:26:18.170 --> 0:26:20.399 time when we were doing afterlife as well, right, like 0:26:20.400 --> 0:26:21.879 a lot of props for not that we need, I 0:26:21.880 --> 0:26:24.079 could just like, hi, do you have like extra or whatever. 0:26:24.199 --> 0:26:25.709 So I really felt like there was like a backing, 0:26:25.760 --> 0:26:28.079 you know. I saw my mom, like she was really 0:26:28.079 --> 0:26:30.599 proud of me to just start something on my own 0:26:30.599 --> 0:26:32.439 and when I told her that I was doing with 0:26:32.439 --> 0:26:34.639 Dewey because my mom loves Dewey, you know, so she 0:26:34.640 --> 0:26:36.280 was like, oh my God, let's, you know, can't wait 0:26:36.280 --> 0:26:38.040 to see where she's going, and I think like the 0:26:38.040 --> 0:26:39.839 point that they really was like, OK, this is like 0:26:39.839 --> 0:26:42.069 legit was when we just moved to our recent office. 0:26:42.339 --> 0:26:43.959 They came and stopped by and they were like, wow, 0:26:44.119 --> 0:26:45.010 you're actually like 0:26:45.550 --> 0:26:47.389 Doing it and that was when I almost cried. I 0:26:47.390 --> 0:26:50.228 was like, wow, you know, like, like that validation from 0:26:50.229 --> 0:26:52.188 like my parents just felt like it was everything. 0:26:52.270 --> 0:26:52.900 Oh. 0:26:55.829 --> 0:26:57.989 That's really sweet. What about you? I was doing social 0:26:57.989 --> 0:27:00.899 media and they're just like, What are you doing? I'm like, 0:27:01.030 --> 0:27:04.420 I'm a creator. No, because my, my actually my dad, 0:27:04.469 --> 0:27:07.069 I don't think he understands what I'm doing till now, right? 0:27:07.079 --> 0:27:09.109 He's like, What are you doing? So I tell him like, Oh, 0:27:09.380 --> 0:27:12.020 was she got Mingxing, meaning I'm like a superstar. That's it. 0:27:12.500 --> 0:27:14.469 So I think he still thinks I'm like a superstar. 0:27:14.579 --> 0:27:20.208 Or whatever. So now, now that you own Iko and 0:27:20.209 --> 0:27:22.409 you run Iko and you explain this to him like, Dad, look, 0:27:22.530 --> 0:27:25.410 I run like a marketing agency and whatnot, is he 0:27:25.410 --> 0:27:27.530 more receptive and is he more like, oh, I get 0:27:27.530 --> 0:27:29.810 that now. OK, I'm going to be honest. I feel 0:27:29.810 --> 0:27:32.569 like I'm not at that stage where my parents will 0:27:32.569 --> 0:27:33.479 look at me and be like. 0:27:35.030 --> 0:27:37.449 That's much, you know what I mean, I feel like 0:27:37.449 --> 0:27:40.729 my parents set the standard for me at like the sky. 0:27:40.780 --> 0:27:43.300 I have to be on Forbes or something, then my 0:27:43.300 --> 0:27:44.099 father would be like, oh. 0:27:46.219 --> 0:27:50.079 Legitim own an agency. I thought you were unemployed so 0:27:50.079 --> 0:27:53.079 now they just still think that you're xing. Yeah, no, 0:27:53.109 --> 0:27:54.839 but I think it's very normal for anyone in the 0:27:54.839 --> 0:27:57.679 media industry, right? I'm very lucky that my parents were 0:27:57.680 --> 0:28:00.189 in media, so they were very supportive of like media 0:28:00.189 --> 0:28:03.280 because I had other friends and people whom I've dated before, right, 0:28:03.479 --> 0:28:05.160 you know, whose mom and dad didn't approve of them 0:28:05.160 --> 0:28:07.239 dating me because they're like, what's she doing in media? 0:28:07.359 --> 0:28:11.639 What do they even do? And this is this is pre-TikTok, pre-instagram, 0:28:11.680 --> 0:28:13.569 you know, it's like I'm still in school studying like. 0:28:13.920 --> 0:28:17.329 What? God, what do they do? And that that perception 0:28:17.329 --> 0:28:17.929 is already 0:28:17.930 --> 0:28:18.329 there. 0:28:21.709 --> 0:28:23.290 The I until they see me on the poster or 0:28:23.290 --> 0:28:26.609 the bus stop or the TV, then I'm like, oh, OK, 0:28:26.689 --> 0:28:30.650 she's doing something as a small company, what are some 0:28:30.650 --> 0:28:33.099 things that you guys have experienced that that you guys 0:28:33.099 --> 0:28:35.449 want to spill some tea maybe young 0:28:35.449 --> 0:28:36.689 entrepreneurs 0:28:36.689 --> 0:28:38.170 maybe because I do a lot of the pitching a 0:28:38.170 --> 0:28:43.420 lot of clients. I tell you. 0:28:45.579 --> 0:28:47.300 No, a lot, a lot of them, right, they were like, 0:28:47.380 --> 0:28:50.180 I guess are quite new, ah, maybe, uh, your retainer package, 0:28:50.420 --> 0:28:51.979 you all give us, I can give us free la. 0:28:52.079 --> 0:28:54.099 You give me 3 videos free, OK. Then after I 0:28:54.099 --> 0:28:55.739 will ask my friend sign with you so, trust me, 0:28:55.819 --> 0:28:58.250 the friend doesn't exist, OK. Then like, yeah, or maybe 0:28:58.250 --> 0:29:00.560 ah it too expensive for you're 2 year old only 0:29:00.560 --> 0:29:02.930 you all can charge so high man lower lower for me, OK, 0:29:03.060 --> 0:29:03.459 the thing is like. 0:29:03.569 --> 0:29:05.780 If we say OK, we're just devaluing ourselves, and the 0:29:05.780 --> 0:29:07.119 thing is that we need to pay people, you know, 0:29:07.199 --> 0:29:08.910 so I just feel because we are young, they just 0:29:08.910 --> 0:29:11.560 feel like they can just, OK la, take advantage of 0:29:11.560 --> 0:29:12.459 them because I see 0:29:12.459 --> 0:29:16.250 that we are giving you a chance. That's the thing, yeah. 0:29:16.400 --> 0:29:18.520 They feel like you need them more than they need you, 0:29:19.040 --> 0:29:20.640 but they need the help the social media, you know 0:29:20.640 --> 0:29:21.099 what I mean. 0:29:22.359 --> 0:29:25.140 No, and then also because me and you are creators, right, 0:29:25.300 --> 0:29:27.390 a lot of them will be like, OK, OK, beside you, ah, 0:29:27.550 --> 0:29:30.270 then inside the video you and be inside, OK, it's 0:29:30.270 --> 0:29:33.229 like. They asked us to post on our account, but 0:29:33.229 --> 0:29:35.109 the thing is that we charge for that. That's different, 0:29:35.229 --> 0:29:36.589 you know I mean it's not fair to my other 0:29:36.589 --> 0:29:38.959 clients who actually pay good money for me to produce 0:29:38.959 --> 0:29:41.069 videos for them, and then they want to load our 0:29:41.069 --> 0:29:42.349 face some more. Maybe 0:29:42.349 --> 0:29:44.540 you can try, but you never, you know, like, girl, 0:29:45.030 --> 0:29:46.869 what is something that has happened. 0:29:47.359 --> 0:29:50.959 With Iko, right, or maybe as young entrepreneurs, right, that's 0:29:50.959 --> 0:29:53.160 going to like blow our minds. I think this thing 0:29:53.160 --> 0:29:54.800 happened to us and it made me realize that it 0:29:54.800 --> 0:29:56.920 doesn't matter how many followers I have. I'm a small 0:29:56.920 --> 0:30:01.280 company and and if something happens and I need to 0:30:01.280 --> 0:30:04.040 take legal action, I don't actually have that much backing 0:30:04.040 --> 0:30:06.800 to go against a big company. So this is what 0:30:06.800 --> 0:30:10.310 I'm going to talk about the time that we got scammed. 0:30:10.800 --> 0:30:14.079 So Afterlife is under ICO and before Afterlife was gone, 0:30:14.229 --> 0:30:16.790 ICO was already running. So we actually did an event 0:30:16.790 --> 0:30:19.540 for a client with the Afterlife name. So we actually 0:30:19.670 --> 0:30:22.589 brought in our organic customers. It was a nightlife event. 0:30:22.670 --> 0:30:25.670 So the practice is every time after a night, what 0:30:25.670 --> 0:30:27.750 the club would do, the manager, he will like run 0:30:27.750 --> 0:30:30.310 out the receipt from the cash register to show you 0:30:30.310 --> 0:30:33.540 all the transactions from the night, so we know exactly 0:30:33.540 --> 0:30:34.949 what's our commission because 0:30:35.003 --> 0:30:37.593 As organizers, we do take a commission of all the 0:30:37.593 --> 0:30:42.192 alcohol sold for the sales of the night. So this company, right, 0:30:42.312 --> 0:30:46.953 this sucky company this event right was fully packed. 0:30:47.032 --> 0:30:48.873 We sold out so quick. People were lining up at 0:30:48.873 --> 0:30:50.912 the lift trying to get in. OK, we were 0:30:50.912 --> 0:30:53.792 full rack, right? And then my manager, he closed a 0:30:53.792 --> 0:30:55.473 lot of tables because he's a very buddy buddy guy. 0:30:56.113 --> 0:30:57.392 He closed a lot of tables and a lot of 0:30:57.392 --> 0:30:59.113 those uh openers were like. 0:30:59.206 --> 0:31:00.594 His friends, and then we were like, OK, it's a 0:31:00.595 --> 0:31:02.265 great night. Can't wait to see how much we've made. 0:31:02.355 --> 0:31:03.676 And then at the end of the night, right, when 0:31:03.676 --> 0:31:05.316 my manager asked him, Oh, can you draw out the 0:31:05.316 --> 0:31:07.715 receipt of the transaction, this, they were like, No, no, 0:31:07.836 --> 0:31:09.594 we can't do that. We can't do that. And we 0:31:09.595 --> 0:31:11.495 were like, so it's so strange because let me tell you, 0:31:11.505 --> 0:31:14.086 even some deals, right, can have the decency to draw 0:31:14.086 --> 0:31:15.875 out the receipt for me to show me that, OK, 0:31:15.916 --> 0:31:17.645 DVD is how much you make. This is a commission. 0:31:17.836 --> 0:31:19.786 Got it. OK, then we go home and settle finance. 0:31:20.026 --> 0:31:21.475 And then we were like, it's very strange why he 0:31:21.475 --> 0:31:23.276 die I don't want to draw out the sales check. 0:31:23.810 --> 0:31:25.819 And then after that, the day after, right, he told 0:31:25.819 --> 0:31:26.170 us, 0:31:26.359 --> 0:31:28.380 oh my God, he texted us, he texted us saying 0:31:28.380 --> 0:31:28.790 that like 0:31:28.790 --> 0:31:28.800 I 0:31:34.469 --> 0:31:34.550 I'm catching its 0:31:34.550 --> 0:31:34.599 scared. 0:31:34.609 --> 0:31:37.380 So the next day, OK, so context is that for 0:31:37.380 --> 0:31:39.660 every event, right, our commissions would be around like 4 0:31:39.660 --> 0:31:40.619 to 5 digits, 0:31:41.060 --> 0:31:46.810 5 digits. Our events always do 5 digits in sales, 0:31:47.339 --> 0:31:47.699 always be 0:31:47.699 --> 0:31:49.209 humble a bit, OK. 0:31:49.676 --> 0:31:50.836 OK, OK, OK, 0:31:51.156 --> 0:31:53.456 so when we receive, ah, do you know how much 0:31:53.456 --> 0:31:55.086 the person put, so the person sent us a text, 0:31:55.115 --> 0:31:57.355 you be like, Oh, your total night Carlos, all the 0:31:57.355 --> 0:32:01.426 bottles and all the drinks is $4,339 0:32:01.796 --> 0:32:04.475 which is like 50% of what you would usually no, 0:32:08.375 --> 0:32:08.426 like 20%, 0:32:08.436 --> 0:32:10.056 it was a fully packed event, so it didn't make 0:32:10.056 --> 0:32:10.355 sense at all. 0:32:10.515 --> 0:32:12.635 Wait alcohol is so expensive, right? Let's be real. And 0:32:12.635 --> 0:32:14.916 then I was like, OK, if it's 4K, can you 0:32:14.916 --> 0:32:15.206 show me? 0:32:15.261 --> 0:32:16.161 The proof like 0:32:16.161 --> 0:32:19.171 one table alone right can be up to like 4 0:32:19.171 --> 0:32:20.251 or 5k. Like 0:32:20.251 --> 0:32:23.751 what on earth did they order? It's press a button, 0:32:24.092 --> 0:32:26.852 give me the transaction. If it's 4K, fine, whatever. I'll 0:32:26.852 --> 0:32:28.972 just take my commissions off of that. But he I 0:32:28.972 --> 0:32:31.082 don't want to show me, so I know he's playing 0:32:31.082 --> 0:32:33.521 this stupid ass game. And then I had to tell 0:32:33.521 --> 0:32:36.732 him like, uh, you cannot do this to us. OK. 0:32:36.812 --> 0:32:39.041 I was like, I can speak to your call my lawyer. 0:32:39.291 --> 0:32:39.661 Then you call. 0:32:42.930 --> 0:32:43.689 lie. We're so small. 0:32:45.420 --> 0:32:47.339 But then she called me and then I'm like, what 0:32:47.339 --> 0:32:50.219 to do, so we tried to like to like threatenen 0:32:50.219 --> 0:32:51.949 we will call the police. I wasn't gonna call the police, 0:32:52.020 --> 0:32:54.449 but I was like it was so tough because like 0:32:54.619 --> 0:32:56.459 we couldn't defend ourselves, you know what I mean? Like 0:32:56.459 --> 0:32:59.130 even if you wanted to, right, what lawyer fees over 0:32:59.130 --> 0:33:01.729 like the commission card is like not worth it if 0:33:01.729 --> 0:33:03.109 the lawyer is gonna be so expensive. 0:33:03.244 --> 0:33:07.234 Correct, correct, but after you go for the situation, if 0:33:07.234 --> 0:33:09.515 you win the case, they will pay for your loyal fees. 0:33:09.775 --> 0:33:10.094 If you win, 0:33:10.344 --> 0:33:11.265 we do not know that. But 0:33:11.265 --> 0:33:13.834 that's the thing, we were so small that we cannot 0:33:13.834 --> 0:33:16.194 even now to this day you still haven't got the money. 0:33:16.435 --> 0:33:17.545 So there's no resolution. 0:33:18.194 --> 0:33:19.795 I talked to the boss and then the boss was like, OK, 0:33:19.864 --> 0:33:21.714 if you're not happy with it, then you can proceed 0:33:21.714 --> 0:33:24.165 with like um what is it called filing a lawyer's letter, 0:33:24.194 --> 0:33:25.194 and then I was just like. 0:33:25.939 --> 0:33:27.859 Huh, then now what do I do? You know, I 0:33:27.859 --> 0:33:29.869 really tried to everything and then, OK, you want, you go. 0:33:30.180 --> 0:33:31.199 I'm like, where do I go now have the money 0:33:31.199 --> 0:33:31.339 to drag it out, you know, 10, 0:33:31.349 --> 0:33:38.339 200 is a lot to a small company. If I 0:33:38.339 --> 0:33:42.459 was in your position, wouldn't you use your position as 0:33:42.459 --> 0:33:45.099 influencers and as people to do that and be like, 0:33:45.140 --> 0:33:46.979 you know, look, we've been scammed. Did you guys think 0:33:46.979 --> 0:33:49.619 of that? We didn't, but we don't want to portray 0:33:49.619 --> 0:33:53.430 us as influencers that will wear the dirty laundries of 0:33:53.430 --> 0:33:54.069 like our. 0:33:54.711 --> 0:33:56.190 It will link back to our brand as a whole. 0:33:56.270 --> 0:33:58.350 Like if any new brand will be like, I work 0:33:58.350 --> 0:33:59.581 then they don't like me then I'll make no it's 0:33:59.581 --> 0:33:59.640 a very bad look for us. 0:34:02.161 --> 0:34:05.311 Honestly, the netizens and people already think that if we 0:34:05.311 --> 0:34:09.531 have any sort of influence online like, oh, so you 0:34:09.531 --> 0:34:11.750 know you only get this kind of treatment because you're 0:34:11.750 --> 0:34:14.540 like that of course you and people like attend to you. 0:34:15.111 --> 0:34:16.229 I get what you mean. And also 0:34:16.230 --> 0:34:18.510 because like can you imagine how crazy it sound that 0:34:18.510 --> 0:34:20.111 we say that like oh we didn't get this part 0:34:20.111 --> 0:34:22.111 of money and it's like not small money, a lot 0:34:22.111 --> 0:34:22.469 of money. 0:34:22.801 --> 0:34:25.990 like, hey, I didn't get like 5 digit commission. Like 0:34:25.989 --> 0:34:27.290 they're going to be like, What the hell, you know 0:34:27.291 --> 0:34:28.509 what I mean, wouldn't like 0:34:28.510 --> 0:34:32.281 it's a tough it's a tough situation to be in, 0:34:32.400 --> 0:34:35.081 but like, I don't know if there are any lawyers 0:34:35.081 --> 0:34:37.509 tuning in right now, please advise them what to do 0:34:37.510 --> 0:34:39.641 because it's never too late to turn it around. Do 0:34:39.641 --> 0:34:41.680 you still want to pursue this situation? The guy got fired, 0:34:41.719 --> 0:34:44.000 by the way. Yeah, that's the thing. It's been so long. 0:34:44.391 --> 0:34:45.710 How long has it been? 1 year? 0:34:45.831 --> 0:34:46.801 1.5 years I 0:34:46.801 --> 0:34:47.051 think. 0:34:47.881 --> 0:34:50.081 It's too long to reopen. OK. A grudge can be 0:34:50.081 --> 0:34:51.121 held forever. Do you think that. 0:34:51.221 --> 0:34:52.582 That kind of like set you back and you were like, 0:34:52.592 --> 0:34:55.132 oh this is such a terrible situation like we're going 0:34:55.132 --> 0:34:57.291 to give up or like you know you were so angry, 0:34:57.572 --> 0:34:58.251 let's make more money. 0:34:58.940 --> 0:34:59.291 Don't go 0:34:59.291 --> 0:35:02.812 down without a fight, my friends. Guys, thank you so much. 0:35:02.892 --> 0:35:05.402 That was so much fun. OK, before you leave though, 0:35:05.572 --> 0:35:08.372 since I'm sure a lot of other young entrepreneurs or 0:35:08.372 --> 0:35:12.681 aspiring entrepreneurs look up to you and other Gen Z entrepreneurs, 0:35:12.852 --> 0:35:14.041 what do you have to say to them? 0:35:14.172 --> 0:35:16.691 Actually, just do it. Like don't don't have to think 0:35:16.690 --> 0:35:19.221 that like you must like have like a large amount 0:35:19.221 --> 0:35:19.571 of capital. 0:35:20.104 --> 0:35:21.884 Because actually, right, you can work around it. First of all, 0:35:21.944 --> 0:35:23.223 like you start a party, right, you can collect the 0:35:23.224 --> 0:35:26.783 money first, you know what I mean? You sell the 0:35:26.783 --> 0:35:28.542 tickets first, collect the money, then we use it to 0:35:28.543 --> 0:35:30.063 cover the cost of the rental, and then we just 0:35:30.063 --> 0:35:32.493 tell the vendor, Hey, maybe I pay you after the event, 0:35:32.623 --> 0:35:34.183 you know, like there's always ways to like, you don't 0:35:34.184 --> 0:35:36.104 need to like fork out so much money at the start. 0:35:36.143 --> 0:35:38.503 So don't be afraid by that. Just try because you 0:35:38.503 --> 0:35:39.964 never know where it will go. If you fail, right, 0:35:40.104 --> 0:35:41.864 I always tell myself I'm so young, at least I 0:35:41.864 --> 0:35:44.143 try because if I'm older, right, I have no time 0:35:44.143 --> 0:35:46.272 to try this kind of thing. So just try YOLO, man, 0:35:46.424 --> 0:35:46.743 do it. 0:35:47.063 --> 0:35:48.104 I also a lot of. 0:35:48.205 --> 0:35:50.344 They are launching a new product, right? It's before you 0:35:50.344 --> 0:35:52.955 even actually launch it and sell it on whatever store 0:35:52.955 --> 0:35:55.314 you're selling on. You can already do the marketing, like 0:35:55.314 --> 0:35:57.234 make content about it, see if you actually have a 0:35:57.235 --> 0:35:59.714 crowd for it. Once you feel like, OK, you have 0:35:59.715 --> 0:36:01.715 the crowd for it, you have like 1000 followers or 0:36:01.715 --> 0:36:04.033 500 followers, people are ready to buy your product and 0:36:04.034 --> 0:36:06.274 receive it, then you sell it, right? The win is 0:36:06.274 --> 0:36:08.594 more guaranteed that way, yeah, or you can do pre-order, 0:36:08.635 --> 0:36:11.975 so there's a few ways to go about it. Yeah. 0:36:12.195 --> 0:36:14.875 So I also feel like, especially when you're young, right, 0:36:14.955 --> 0:36:16.554 just do it. You have nothing to lose. 0:36:17.075 --> 0:36:18.726 everything to gain. That's why I always tell myself. Like 0:36:18.726 --> 0:36:20.315 I don't have a family. I might not be able 0:36:20.315 --> 0:36:23.615 to have this freedom when I'm in my 30s, when 0:36:23.614 --> 0:36:25.844 I'm a responsibility. So just do it. You're gonna learn 0:36:25.844 --> 0:36:27.884 so much about yourself and it'll be so fun and 0:36:27.885 --> 0:36:29.716 be consistent. Don't just give up. Don't give 0:36:29.716 --> 0:36:29.825 up. 0:36:30.585 --> 0:36:31.285 It's gonna get tough. 0:36:31.855 --> 0:36:33.325 Yeah, there are some days where you ask yourself, why 0:36:33.325 --> 0:36:34.885 the hell you start your company? Like me every day 0:36:34.885 --> 0:36:36.456 when I walk into my office and I ask myself 0:36:36.456 --> 0:36:39.685 why I have this overhead, so expensive and my blacklet 0:36:39.686 --> 0:36:41.835 chair that I love so much. OK, 0:36:43.406 --> 0:36:43.605 and the 0:36:43.605 --> 0:36:45.085 $80 water dispenser. 0:36:45.616 --> 0:36:48.056 That I love so much. I love so much, OK. 0:36:48.977 --> 0:36:51.777 We're gonna get there someday because we are still getting there. Well, 0:36:51.856 --> 0:36:53.547 thank you guys so much for being here with us 0:36:53.547 --> 0:36:56.376 today on another episode of Men Explained. And if you're 0:36:56.376 --> 0:36:59.056 watching at home, thank you as well. Please make sure 0:36:59.056 --> 0:37:01.656 to follow us on all our socials on Instagram, TikTok 0:37:01.656 --> 0:37:04.576 and on YouTube as well at itsclarity.co. That's right. If 0:37:04.576 --> 0:37:07.457 you're tuning into us from wherever it is and listening 0:37:07.457 --> 0:37:11.336 to us, yap and be super unhinged. That's Apple Podcast, Spotify, 0:37:11.376 --> 0:37:13.576 and me listen. So we'll catch you again next time. 0:37:14.479 --> 0:37:14.888 Bye