WEBVTT - Meet Melbourne’s chief heat officers 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.598 You're listening to a CNA podcast. 0:00:05.280 --> 0:00:08.939 Welcome back to the Climate Conversations. I'm your host, Julie Yu. 0:00:09.279 --> 0:00:12.640 And when you hear the words, Chief and Officer, what 0:00:12.648 --> 0:00:17.200 comes to mind, corporate boardrooms, suits and ties perhaps. But 0:00:17.209 --> 0:00:21.200 as cities around the world grapple with debilitating heat, governments 0:00:21.209 --> 0:00:25.159 are turning to a different kind of chief is partnering 0:00:25.170 --> 0:00:30.049 with cities around the world to appoint Chief Heat Officers 0:00:30.059 --> 0:00:31.049 C O. 0:00:31.149 --> 0:00:33.389 Athens and Miami are hiring their own 0:00:33.564 --> 0:00:36.744 Chief Heat Officers to respond to increasingly hot weather. 0:00:36.755 --> 0:00:40.014 That's right. They're called Chief Heat Officers who lead in 0:00:40.025 --> 0:00:43.305 the fight against extreme heat. So what exactly does a 0:00:43.314 --> 0:00:47.345 Chief Heat Officer do? And more importantly, could your city 0:00:47.354 --> 0:00:50.214 benefit from having one to help us shed light on 0:00:50.223 --> 0:00:53.865 these questions? We are joined by Tiffany Crawford and Krista 0:00:53.875 --> 0:00:57.685 Milne and they are Co Chief Heat Officers of Melbourne Australia. 0:00:58.259 --> 0:01:00.919 Uh Ladies, welcome to the climate conversations. Thank you so 0:01:00.930 --> 0:01:03.200 much for joining me. It's a pleasure to be here. 0:01:03.209 --> 0:01:05.949 Thank you, Julie. Thank you. Lovely to meet you. So 0:01:05.959 --> 0:01:10.269 I would like to start by unpacking this relatively new position, 0:01:10.279 --> 0:01:14.209 Chief Heat Officer because it didn't exist 34 years ago. 0:01:14.220 --> 0:01:16.279 So Tiffany let me start with you. Could you just 0:01:16.290 --> 0:01:19.690 give us a sense of what AC O actually does? Yeah. Sure. 0:01:19.699 --> 0:01:24.389 So Chief Heat Officers are principally engaged with the community 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:26.410 to really elevate heat as 0:01:26.484 --> 0:01:30.453 a critical health issue. How that does impact our bodies 0:01:30.462 --> 0:01:33.013 on our health on the way that we go about 0:01:33.024 --> 0:01:37.704 our lives that is being exacerbated by climate change. Melbourne 0:01:37.712 --> 0:01:41.053 is the only city with two CHS Tiffany. Can you 0:01:41.063 --> 0:01:44.363 share your journey to becoming Melbourne's C? My background is 0:01:44.374 --> 0:01:47.844 in law and I was legal counsel for 10 years 0:01:47.853 --> 0:01:51.094 here at the city of Melbourne. And my education was 0:01:51.103 --> 0:01:54.634 very much in environmental policy and Chris and I started 0:01:54.708 --> 0:01:57.258 working together when she was leading some of the city 0:01:57.267 --> 0:02:01.398 of Melbourne's early work on sustainability, working on the Melbourne 0:02:01.407 --> 0:02:05.797 Renewable Energy Project on the 1200 buildings program on environmental 0:02:05.807 --> 0:02:08.897 upgrade finance. And I guess you could say we started 0:02:08.907 --> 0:02:11.798 scheming together way back then. So when this role became 0:02:11.806 --> 0:02:14.667 available as director, you know, has all good things start 0:02:14.677 --> 0:02:17.167 over coffee. Thought two heads are better than one and 0:02:17.177 --> 0:02:21.358 with our complementary skills, we were successful in taking that role. 0:02:21.367 --> 0:02:22.858 And since then, we have 0:02:23.031 --> 0:02:27.061 11 extremely supportive councilors who have declared a climate and 0:02:27.072 --> 0:02:31.901 biodiversity emergency. Recognizing that we are facing an unprecedented challenge 0:02:31.912 --> 0:02:35.242 but also an opportunity around climate change to build a 0:02:35.251 --> 0:02:38.340 city that is healthy, that is resilient and that people 0:02:38.352 --> 0:02:41.621 are thriving. I see, OK, I mean, we see dangerous 0:02:41.632 --> 0:02:45.882 hot weather becoming more common, more extreme on every continent. 0:02:45.891 --> 0:02:48.611 But I wonder how Melbourne has been affected? What is 0:02:48.621 --> 0:02:51.082 the scale of the problem you're facing? Christine 0:02:51.156 --> 0:02:54.606 and cities by their nature can be much hotter than 0:02:54.615 --> 0:02:57.906 regional environments. Because of all the concrete, the way we've built, 0:02:57.916 --> 0:03:01.386 cities really absorbs the heat. And the urban heat island 0:03:01.395 --> 0:03:04.255 effect in Melbourne can be up to 4 to 8 0:03:04.266 --> 0:03:08.585 degrees hotter than our surrounding regional areas. At the moment, 0:03:08.595 --> 0:03:13.585 we experience about 11 or 12 days per year of 0:03:13.595 --> 0:03:17.445 extreme heat. And those days are when it's over 35 0:03:17.455 --> 0:03:19.305 degrees during the day, but 0:03:19.380 --> 0:03:23.759 also over 20 degrees Celsius at night. That's when people 0:03:23.770 --> 0:03:27.949 experience a heat stress, particularly when the night time temperature 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:30.928 doesn't drop. So there's not a chance to recover and 0:03:30.940 --> 0:03:34.809 seek reprieve from that stress during the day. We know 0:03:34.820 --> 0:03:37.630 with the climate heating up, that average is likely to 0:03:37.639 --> 0:03:40.740 go up to somewhere between 16 and 20 days out 0:03:40.750 --> 0:03:43.600 of extreme heat. And again, that being an average. So 0:03:43.610 --> 0:03:45.800 some years there might be 30. So that's a whole 0:03:45.809 --> 0:03:47.529 month in a year of 0:03:47.604 --> 0:03:51.253 extreme heat. So it's also quite a dry heat that 0:03:51.264 --> 0:03:54.093 makes it even more challenging to deal with. From a 0:03:54.104 --> 0:03:57.944 health perspective, we know our most vulnerable people that can 0:03:57.953 --> 0:04:01.774 be Children, the elderly people with health conditions and people 0:04:01.783 --> 0:04:06.033 who are socially disadvantaged, their housing situations doesn't give them 0:04:06.044 --> 0:04:09.664 a place to escape and that's really where we're focused 0:04:09.673 --> 0:04:13.134 is ensuring that we are protecting our most vulnerable and 0:04:13.143 --> 0:04:15.753 providing places of refuge Christo. You 0:04:15.828 --> 0:04:19.066 earlier mentioned the equity issue because it's no secret that 0:04:19.077 --> 0:04:23.858 heat disproportionately affects marginalized communities and those with limited resources. 0:04:23.868 --> 0:04:26.838 How is Melbourne supporting those who may struggle to afford 0:04:26.847 --> 0:04:30.937 cooling solutions? Yes, it's a really important issue. And the 0:04:30.947 --> 0:04:33.287 first step that we've taken is really to seek to 0:04:33.298 --> 0:04:37.888 understand the challenges that those community members face. So throughout 0:04:37.898 --> 0:04:40.977 this summer, we had some direct engagement where we went 0:04:40.988 --> 0:04:43.977 out to our communities. We provided heat, help 0:04:44.252 --> 0:04:48.861 get some seminars to help them understand how to prepare 0:04:48.872 --> 0:04:50.902 what they should be looking for in terms of when 0:04:50.911 --> 0:04:54.601 heat waves are come, but also to listen and understand 0:04:54.611 --> 0:04:56.092 what do they do in a heat wave. And we 0:04:56.101 --> 0:04:59.981 heard some really challenging stories about people sleeping under trees 0:04:59.992 --> 0:05:04.022 or in stairwells of housing complexes because they simply couldn't 0:05:04.032 --> 0:05:08.062 get refuge in their own units. We know that there 0:05:08.071 --> 0:05:12.201 are community groups that operate around these vulnerable communities 0:05:12.276 --> 0:05:16.075 is that open up air conditioned rooms overnight. So part 0:05:16.085 --> 0:05:18.876 of our work is making sure that everyone has access 0:05:18.885 --> 0:05:22.006 to somewhere cool during the day at home and night, 0:05:22.015 --> 0:05:24.936 making sure that people know each other in the community 0:05:24.946 --> 0:05:29.686 because part of building community resilience is connection between community 0:05:29.696 --> 0:05:32.246 members so that we can check on each other. And 0:05:32.255 --> 0:05:35.506 then one of the things is really just understanding where 0:05:35.515 --> 0:05:38.295 in Melbourne are the hot spots and how do they 0:05:38.305 --> 0:05:40.425 relate to where our vulnerable community 0:05:40.670 --> 0:05:43.450 are living and then looking at what can we do 0:05:43.459 --> 0:05:47.100 to make those areas cooler through whether it's raining or 0:05:47.109 --> 0:05:51.390 other sorts of shading. We're exploring, you touched on human health, 0:05:51.399 --> 0:05:54.488 but Tiffany here it is also impacting food and water 0:05:54.500 --> 0:05:58.409 security as well. I wonder how you are managing resources 0:05:58.420 --> 0:06:02.019 also mitigating the impacts of water scarcity. It's going to 0:06:02.029 --> 0:06:04.589 be more of an issue now that La Nina is 0:06:04.600 --> 0:06:07.368 definitely over. So we're looking at a much hotter and 0:06:07.380 --> 0:06:08.649 drier summer 0:06:08.723 --> 0:06:12.164 or series of summers than we have been experiencing over 0:06:12.174 --> 0:06:15.484 the past three years. What that will bring is increased 0:06:15.493 --> 0:06:19.234 water scarcity. So we're not the only players in this space. 0:06:19.243 --> 0:06:22.984 We have water authorities, state governments, federal governments who are 0:06:22.993 --> 0:06:27.074 also well attuned and planning for a water scarce future. 0:06:27.113 --> 0:06:30.153 Part of our function here at the city is water 0:06:30.164 --> 0:06:34.894 sensitive urban design, ensuring that we are capturing as much 0:06:34.903 --> 0:06:36.873 rainwater in storm events as possible and 0:06:36.947 --> 0:06:40.217 storing those for the times when we need those. Because 0:06:40.226 --> 0:06:43.507 if we are going to have a successful urban forest 0:06:43.517 --> 0:06:45.757 that is able to cool our city by up to 0:06:45.767 --> 0:06:49.316 four degrees, we need water to sustain that forest. We 0:06:49.327 --> 0:06:53.018 need water to sustain our beautiful parks and gardens and 0:06:53.028 --> 0:06:55.958 all of the green infrastructure that we're starting to plan 0:06:55.967 --> 0:06:59.287 and see come to fruition across the city in places 0:06:59.298 --> 0:07:02.007 such as green walls and green roo. One of the 0:07:02.017 --> 0:07:04.308 things that Chris De also touched on is that with 0:07:04.317 --> 0:07:05.097 our really dry 0:07:05.171 --> 0:07:09.361 climate, it's bringing water to people's attention as an opportunity 0:07:09.372 --> 0:07:12.522 to cool. So that doesn't just mean going and jumping 0:07:12.532 --> 0:07:14.782 into the swimming pool because not everybody's going to have 0:07:14.791 --> 0:07:18.161 access to places like that. But how can we integrate 0:07:18.171 --> 0:07:23.921 water into our landscape through say water fountains, water play 0:07:23.932 --> 0:07:28.082 misters around the city places that without even realizing that 0:07:28.092 --> 0:07:31.182 people can experience so that they really do consider the 0:07:31.191 --> 0:07:33.321 city as a place of cool respite. 0:07:40.790 --> 0:07:43.239 Hello, my name is Steve Lai and I'm Theresa Tang. 0:07:43.250 --> 0:07:46.470 And we are the hosts of CNN correspondent, a podcast 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:48.589 that takes you to the heart of the work our 0:07:48.600 --> 0:07:52.720 correspondents do across the globe from China's COVID response to 0:07:52.730 --> 0:07:56.040 the Child Care Center massacre in Thailand from the fall 0:07:56.049 --> 0:07:56.160 of 0:07:56.760 --> 0:08:00.519 to the rise of Anwar Ibrahim as Malaysia's Prime Minister, 0:08:00.540 --> 0:08:04.309 we speak to the people at the reporting frontlines. So 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:07.570 if you want to know how the biggest global stories unfold, 0:08:07.579 --> 0:08:10.679 make sure you follow or subscribe to us wherever you 0:08:10.690 --> 0:08:11.809 get your podcasts. 0:08:19.450 --> 0:08:23.459 Tiffany, I wonder how you are engaging businesses to adopt 0:08:23.470 --> 0:08:27.619 sustainable practices. Could you give us some examples that actually worked? Yeah, 0:08:27.630 --> 0:08:30.239 it's a great question because we are in the early 0:08:30.250 --> 0:08:33.340 stages of our heat work and we don't hold all 0:08:33.349 --> 0:08:37.330 the levers and need to be working collaboratively with our 0:08:37.340 --> 0:08:42.059 stakeholders across the municipality to achieve our climate objectives. An 0:08:42.070 --> 0:08:46.140 example of that is the development of our zero carbon 0:08:46.150 --> 0:08:49.200 buildings plan. So 60% of our emissions 0:08:49.280 --> 0:08:53.119 in the city are actually generated by commercial buildings and 0:08:53.130 --> 0:08:56.348 we need to bring down that emissions profile rapidly. So 0:08:56.359 --> 0:09:00.150 we've led a series of workshops with the private sector 0:09:00.159 --> 0:09:04.590 and particularly those in the property sector. We've actively engaged 0:09:04.599 --> 0:09:07.869 with the property council here in Australia around the development 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:10.799 of a whole suite of tools that might be effective 0:09:10.809 --> 0:09:13.159 and then really going back to understand, well, what are 0:09:13.169 --> 0:09:15.659 our levers of control that we could use? How can 0:09:15.669 --> 0:09:18.329 we advocate to the state and federal governments here in 0:09:18.340 --> 0:09:19.030 Australia 0:09:19.109 --> 0:09:22.880 to make some changes? What funding and finance might be needed? 0:09:22.890 --> 0:09:27.340 Can we look at facilitating leases to incentivize the commercial 0:09:27.349 --> 0:09:30.940 building sector to more rapidly upgrade their buildings and make 0:09:30.950 --> 0:09:34.049 their buildings better places as well for their tenants. We 0:09:34.059 --> 0:09:38.020 also work really strongly with the Bureau of Meteorology and 0:09:38.030 --> 0:09:43.030 the research institutions to really understand data. So unfortunately, there 0:09:43.039 --> 0:09:45.159 can be a lag between when that heat event has 0:09:45.169 --> 0:09:48.650 happened and where we have knowledge of it. So that's 0:09:48.659 --> 0:09:48.859 one 0:09:48.940 --> 0:09:51.960 of the reasons why heat is known as a silent killer. 0:09:52.169 --> 0:09:56.130 Is it unlike a bushfire or a flood where there's 0:09:56.140 --> 0:09:59.169 a very strong visual hazard that heat is silent and 0:09:59.179 --> 0:10:02.069 where it just unfortunately led to a number of deaths. 0:10:02.080 --> 0:10:05.750 So we need to collaborate with those. So relationships are critical, 0:10:05.760 --> 0:10:10.429 all hands on deck and speaking of collaboration and knowledge sharing. 0:10:10.440 --> 0:10:13.349 I understand there is a sizable group of cos out 0:10:13.359 --> 0:10:15.770 there around the world. I wonder how often do you 0:10:15.780 --> 0:10:18.520 speak to each other? Engage, share lessons, 0:10:18.770 --> 0:10:23.630 practices. Yes, we have a wonderful coordination through Ash Rock 0:10:23.640 --> 0:10:26.630 who are really focused on creating this network through the 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:30.859 Urban Heat resilience alliance. And brought the idea of establishing 0:10:30.869 --> 0:10:33.609 the Chief Heat Officer role at seven cities or eight 0:10:33.619 --> 0:10:37.859 cities now. So we connect probably about monthly formally, but 0:10:37.869 --> 0:10:40.960 there's certainly a lot of informal connection as well. Learning 0:10:40.969 --> 0:10:46.340 from a wonderful group of women from Freetown in Sierra Leone, DACA, 0:10:46.349 --> 0:10:48.099 Miami L A 0:10:49.010 --> 0:10:53.309 and Monterey and Santiago. So such a diversity in cities. 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:56.650 But the reality is that the challenges and the focus 0:10:56.659 --> 0:10:59.280 and the actions, there's a lot of alignment in terms 0:10:59.289 --> 0:11:01.890 of what we're doing and learning from each other. I 0:11:01.900 --> 0:11:04.919 also found it very interesting. You mentioned it briefly that 0:11:04.929 --> 0:11:07.880 all of the Chief Heat Officers and the world are women. 0:11:07.890 --> 0:11:09.939 Do you think this is a coincidence or what are 0:11:09.950 --> 0:11:12.909 your thoughts on this? A not a coincidence. It was 0:11:12.919 --> 0:11:17.080 quite deliberate on the part of the Aro Foundation and 0:11:17.090 --> 0:11:18.349 that is for a 0:11:18.429 --> 0:11:22.960 reason. And that is that heat disproportionately impacts women around 0:11:22.969 --> 0:11:25.689 the world, particularly in the global South. But it is 0:11:25.700 --> 0:11:28.559 an issue that impacts disproportionately women and that's borne out 0:11:28.570 --> 0:11:33.119 by data that's very interesting and recently hearing worrying reports 0:11:33.130 --> 0:11:35.340 where they talk about scenarios in which the world is 0:11:35.349 --> 0:11:39.159 almost certain to miss that 1.5 degrees Celsius of global warming. 0:11:39.169 --> 0:11:43.219 And let's face it. There have been numerous agreements, recommendations 0:11:43.229 --> 0:11:46.700 and proposals, but the reality is the planet is still warming. 0:11:46.710 --> 0:11:47.479 So I wonder 0:11:48.260 --> 0:11:50.320 in light of this reality, how would you respond to 0:11:50.330 --> 0:11:52.689 those who say that it's now too late to versus 0:11:52.700 --> 0:11:55.599 trends to mitigate the impact of global warming? Who would 0:11:55.609 --> 0:11:58.739 you like to go first? Yes, I have days like 0:11:58.750 --> 0:12:01.909 that as well. And Tiffany and I are lucky to 0:12:01.919 --> 0:12:04.539 be working on both sides of the equation in terms 0:12:04.549 --> 0:12:09.390 of working on innovative strategies to transition Melbourne to be 100% 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:13.599 renewable energy and zero net emissions by 2040. And it 0:12:13.609 --> 0:12:17.309 is very easy to only see the negative stories, but 0:12:17.320 --> 0:12:17.989 also 0:12:18.090 --> 0:12:21.469 you see progress every day in terms of making that 0:12:21.479 --> 0:12:25.079 transition and that comes from all sectors. You know, governments 0:12:25.090 --> 0:12:30.299 continually funding and taking action towards mitigating and getting to 100% 0:12:30.309 --> 0:12:33.659 renewable energy. The markets are driving at renewable energy in 0:12:33.669 --> 0:12:37.380 Australia is now a lot cheaper than establishing new forms 0:12:37.390 --> 0:12:40.840 of fossil fuels. So while it feels like there's slow progress, 0:12:40.849 --> 0:12:42.820 when you look at where we were 10 years ago, 0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:46.119 progress is ramping up every day. But on the same time, 0:12:46.130 --> 0:12:47.840 we are crossing those thresholds. 0:12:47.919 --> 0:12:49.929 So we also need to work on the adaptation and 0:12:49.940 --> 0:12:53.280 accept that our reality and our future is likely to 0:12:53.289 --> 0:12:57.229 be hotter in Melbourne, we will experience less rainfall but 0:12:57.239 --> 0:13:00.260 more extreme rainfall events. So we're also working on how 0:13:00.270 --> 0:13:03.590 do we prepare the community from flooding, et cetera. So 0:13:03.809 --> 0:13:06.570 I guess I get hope from that. The pace of 0:13:06.580 --> 0:13:10.869 change continues to grow and continue to focus on those 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:15.090 positive stories every day rather than being dragged down because 0:13:15.099 --> 0:13:17.669 otherwise it's hard to keep going. 0:13:17.750 --> 0:13:21.130 You focus on the fact that the climate is changing 0:13:21.140 --> 0:13:24.059 and Tiffany, what gives you hope? Oh, I have so 0:13:24.070 --> 0:13:26.598 much hope and you wouldn't be human or it would 0:13:26.609 --> 0:13:28.718 be unusual working in this space. If you didn't have 0:13:28.729 --> 0:13:33.368 some days of some despair, I have hope because we 0:13:33.380 --> 0:13:37.940 are surrounded by some pretty incredible, inspiring young people who 0:13:37.950 --> 0:13:42.020 are so talented. They keep us on our toes. The knowledge, 0:13:42.030 --> 0:13:45.780 the energy that the younger generations are bringing to this 0:13:45.789 --> 0:13:47.500 problem is astounding 0:13:47.580 --> 0:13:52.950 and sometimes our biggest challenges become our biggest opportunities. And 0:13:52.960 --> 0:13:56.549 what we have now is an opportunity to transform our 0:13:56.559 --> 0:14:01.739 cities into really brilliant, beautiful, healthy places where we're integrating 0:14:01.750 --> 0:14:06.098 green infrastructure into the way that we build our buildings 0:14:06.109 --> 0:14:09.859 and our roads and our public spaces where we can 0:14:09.869 --> 0:14:12.949 transform people's homes the way that they live, whether they're 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:16.169 not spending hours and hours commuting, they might instead be 0:14:16.179 --> 0:14:17.330 adopting a 20 minute 0:14:17.409 --> 0:14:20.099 neighborhood. So I think that we've got this moment in 0:14:20.109 --> 0:14:24.460 time that feels painful, but that could be quite transformative 0:14:24.469 --> 0:14:26.780 and it's really important to have hope and to talk 0:14:26.789 --> 0:14:30.820 to people and find those opportunities and those glimmers. Isn't 0:14:30.830 --> 0:14:34.770 it a great message to end on Tiffany Krista? Thank 0:14:34.780 --> 0:14:38.419 you both for enlightening and engaging conversation. Thank you so 0:14:38.429 --> 0:14:41.349 much for sharing your insight and also experiences as a 0:14:41.359 --> 0:14:44.820 chief hit officers in Melbourne. Stay cool and stay resilient. 0:14:44.830 --> 0:14:47.140 Thanks so much, Julie. A pleasure. Thank you. 0:14:47.820 --> 0:14:49.830 Well, thanks to my guest and thanks to all of 0:14:49.840 --> 0:14:52.570 you for tuning in. We hope you enjoy this episode 0:14:52.580 --> 0:14:55.590 but do remember to subscribe and like this podcast. So, 0:14:55.599 --> 0:14:58.380 you know, when a new episode drops, you can find 0:14:58.390 --> 0:15:01.390 the C N A S climate and sustainability coverage online 0:15:01.400 --> 0:15:04.140 at C N A dot asia. The team behind this 0:15:04.150 --> 0:15:10.200 podcast is Joan Chan Charlene. So Jacqueline Chan and Christina 0:15:10.210 --> 0:15:12.789 Robert and I'm Julie Yu signing off.