WEBVTT - On dealing and overcoming self doubt and imposter syndrome 0:00:00.000 --> 0:00:03.240 Happy New Year, Welcome to Men explain. 0:00:11.200 --> 0:00:13.780 I think you know, I've got the perfect guest for 0:00:13.780 --> 0:00:16.779 this episode because New Year new me. What better way 0:00:16.780 --> 0:00:19.930 to ring it in than a fitness trainer? Please welcome 0:00:19.930 --> 0:00:21.139 look hello 0:00:21.140 --> 0:00:22.890 everybody, pleasure to be here. 0:00:22.900 --> 0:00:27.090 Okay, so Lucas you are like a celebrity trainer almost 0:00:27.090 --> 0:00:27.410 in some 0:00:27.410 --> 0:00:27.940 sense, right? 0:00:27.960 --> 0:00:30.560 You're not going to say that okay, I'll say it 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:33.600 for you, but because this episode we're talking about goals, 0:00:33.610 --> 0:00:35.920 success and imposter syndrome, I thought would be perfect to 0:00:35.920 --> 0:00:38.130 bring you on board because not only do you help 0:00:38.140 --> 0:00:41.620 people with transformation in that sense, it's not just physical, 0:00:41.620 --> 0:00:42.830 it's also mental. Right? 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:44.720 Totally, totally, totally agree. Like 0:00:44.890 --> 0:00:48.160 I mean people always emphasize on that physical element, but 0:00:48.159 --> 0:00:50.410 you know, a lot of times about molding your character, 0:00:50.420 --> 0:00:53.640 you know, becoming a better version of yourself and true 0:00:53.640 --> 0:00:56.870 fitness is really just another medium for that. Yeah, so 0:00:56.870 --> 0:00:58.040 it's nice. Okay, 0:00:58.040 --> 0:00:59.700 so tell tell us a bit more about how you 0:00:59.700 --> 0:01:02.360 got started and why you're even in this industry in 0:01:02.360 --> 0:01:03.000 the first place, 0:01:03.010 --> 0:01:05.140 I think for me, you know, fitness has always been 0:01:05.140 --> 0:01:06.950 a very big part of my life ever since I 0:01:06.950 --> 0:01:09.610 was young. You know, I was playing volleyball competitively 0:01:09.900 --> 0:01:13.140 and I had the opportunity to really just study what 0:01:13.140 --> 0:01:15.790 I love, which is sports science came out, I didn't 0:01:15.790 --> 0:01:17.120 know what I want to do, but I want to 0:01:17.120 --> 0:01:20.800 do something related, something active. So yeah, tried out as 0:01:20.800 --> 0:01:24.899 a personal trainer, met some good people along the way, 0:01:24.910 --> 0:01:27.390 trained people from all walks of life and the goal 0:01:27.390 --> 0:01:30.820 is really to impact life through fitness. Yeah. And you know, 0:01:30.819 --> 0:01:34.420 like a decade has passed. It's been amazing clients who 0:01:34.430 --> 0:01:35.630 came on walking stick, 0:01:36.010 --> 0:01:40.330 The 84 year old lady, you know, and she's jumping now, 0:01:40.340 --> 0:01:41.650 she's jumping now, 0:01:41.660 --> 0:01:44.539 She's jumping, she's doing jumping jacks and moving well and 0:01:44.540 --> 0:01:47.150 like she inspired a whole bunch of people, you know 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:49.170 in the 50s and 60s to start training 0:01:49.410 --> 0:01:52.400 and this really resonates with me because you know now 0:01:52.400 --> 0:01:54.080 it's really about aging population. 0:01:54.090 --> 0:01:56.460 Yeah, I like how you brought that up because I 0:01:56.460 --> 0:01:58.760 think when we think personal trainer, fitness trainer, all that, 0:01:58.770 --> 0:02:00.760 we always think like all people who want to get, 0:02:00.770 --> 0:02:02.860 get fit or want to get lean or want to 0:02:02.860 --> 0:02:05.100 get their ideal body, but we also forget that there 0:02:05.110 --> 0:02:09.359 is a group of people who may have neglected fitness 0:02:09.370 --> 0:02:10.350 a big 0:02:10.350 --> 0:02:12.829 part of their life and now they have to try 0:02:12.830 --> 0:02:13.170 and stop 0:02:13.190 --> 0:02:13.530 getting 0:02:13.530 --> 0:02:16.550 totally, totally, like, I mean elderly training is one thing, 0:02:16.550 --> 0:02:19.639 but a lot of times people, they were once very active, 0:02:19.650 --> 0:02:21.620 you know? But life caught up, People get busy with 0:02:21.620 --> 0:02:23.450 their jobs, which is totally fine, you know, pursuing your 0:02:23.450 --> 0:02:26.280 dreams then one day they realized that something in my 0:02:26.280 --> 0:02:27.510 body is not moving, right? 0:02:27.520 --> 0:02:29.870 Oh my gosh, honestly, I'm not gonna lie, that's me, 0:02:29.870 --> 0:02:33.410 I haven't been working out in months. So I was 0:02:33.410 --> 0:02:36.520 like a little bit nervous coming to this episode because 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:36.950 I think he 0:02:37.090 --> 0:02:37.230 one 0:02:37.230 --> 0:02:37.989 100% 0:02:38.000 --> 0:02:42.310 Exactly. Oh God, that'd be horrible. But this journey of 0:02:42.310 --> 0:02:45.150 you creating your own business, setting up your own gym. 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:47.470 That is not easy at all. I mean a lot 0:02:47.470 --> 0:02:49.220 of us always talk about, we want to do our 0:02:49.220 --> 0:02:51.220 own thing, like, you know, we want to, this is 0:02:51.220 --> 0:02:53.100 the year, this is it, we're going to do it. 0:02:53.110 --> 0:02:56.800 So tell me when you just transition from being like, 0:02:56.800 --> 0:02:59.270 say a personal trainer to owning your own business, what 0:02:59.270 --> 0:03:00.750 was the mindset behind that? 0:03:01.320 --> 0:03:04.380 Well, it's a very long story, but it's always about 0:03:04.380 --> 0:03:08.200 the feeling because, you know, as one person, right? I 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:11.309 always believe that only can impact this amount of people 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:13.649 as a personal trainer. You have this amount hours. Yes, 0:03:13.650 --> 0:03:16.180 you can train and inspire, but you know, as you 0:03:16.180 --> 0:03:18.029 start to do a job a little bit better. People 0:03:18.030 --> 0:03:20.260 start to appreciate it. Then that's when I get a 0:03:20.260 --> 0:03:23.519 whole team of like minded people come together, you know, 0:03:23.830 --> 0:03:27.000 make our impact stronger. Yeah. And we actually open during 0:03:27.000 --> 0:03:27.760 Covid by the way, 0:03:27.770 --> 0:03:32.369 how did you, why what they blocked out jim's 0:03:32.380 --> 0:03:34.000 you 0:03:34.000 --> 0:03:36.920 started the business knowing that they gyms. 0:03:36.930 --> 0:03:39.510 I wasn't really focused on that. When things start closing, 0:03:39.520 --> 0:03:41.380 I'm still doing what I do, send a message that 0:03:41.390 --> 0:03:44.150 we shouldn't hide and we shouldn't let this fear of 0:03:44.160 --> 0:03:47.339 the virus and everything consume us until we forget about 0:03:47.340 --> 0:03:50.300 taking care of ourselves. So training fitness can be done 0:03:50.300 --> 0:03:53.520 anywhere as well, right? So we can actually start doing 0:03:53.530 --> 0:03:55.210 more training. That's when the whole 0:03:55.520 --> 0:03:58.770 enthusiasm for fitness came about workouts, everything. So I thought 0:03:58.770 --> 0:04:00.570 it was great. Of course, you know, all these measures 0:04:00.570 --> 0:04:03.890 came about things get tough, we have to train outdoors, 0:04:03.900 --> 0:04:06.990 you have to drag document out, but you really taught 0:04:07.000 --> 0:04:11.790 us the whole idea about resilience and determination. Yeah. Like 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:14.490 just to go out under the hot sun, you know, 0:04:14.500 --> 0:04:18.849 I never do that, like, go on the house and exercise, like, 0:04:18.860 --> 0:04:19.570 it's not easy, 0:04:19.570 --> 0:04:22.440 It's not easy. Yeah, we're all sweating, you know, we're 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:24.580 all like fighting to get the 0:04:24.770 --> 0:04:28.410 fitness corner. But there was this there was this community 0:04:28.410 --> 0:04:34.230 spirit outside where jim started to share equipment, share space, 0:04:34.230 --> 0:04:38.460 you know, respect the public public started to understand that, 0:04:38.460 --> 0:04:41.940 you know, we needed this place to do what we 0:04:41.950 --> 0:04:43.100 do to work, 0:04:43.310 --> 0:04:46.200 and I think generally everything was very positive, 0:04:46.210 --> 0:04:48.760 but the vibe that I'm getting is that overall you're 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:51.110 very confident guy, or at least you exude a lot 0:04:51.110 --> 0:04:53.260 of confidence, you know, and to be able to set 0:04:53.260 --> 0:04:55.729 up your own business requires a lot of that as well. 0:04:55.740 --> 0:04:59.370 I mean, I haven't really gone out to aside from 0:04:59.370 --> 0:05:01.559 some F and B. I haven't gone out to, like, okay, 0:05:01.560 --> 0:05:02.420 I want to 0:05:02.430 --> 0:05:05.080 do this, and like, I'm just gonna leave whatever I 0:05:05.080 --> 0:05:07.280 have behind it and do it. Do you think that 0:05:07.290 --> 0:05:11.090 confidence is something that you you possess? 0:05:11.100 --> 0:05:14.140 I would say it grew over time. Yeah. Yeah. When 0:05:14.140 --> 0:05:17.580 I was younger I had a lot of obstacles that 0:05:17.580 --> 0:05:20.530 I faced as an athlete that many people don't see 0:05:20.540 --> 0:05:23.510 other than my teammates. You know, I was playing volleyball right? 0:05:23.510 --> 0:05:25.700 So it was a team sport. But I had a 0:05:25.710 --> 0:05:26.750 huge ego, 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:28.020 huge 0:05:28.020 --> 0:05:29.040 man, like 0:05:29.110 --> 0:05:30.779 self aware, he's very self aware 0:05:30.790 --> 0:05:31.730 last. I'm not I'm 0:05:31.730 --> 0:05:32.100 not, 0:05:32.930 --> 0:05:34.489 I'm just like, do whatever you 0:05:34.500 --> 0:05:37.339 get attention and just yeah, 0:05:37.350 --> 0:05:38.110 just grind, 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:41.450 don't think just Yeah, but over time, you know, like 0:05:41.460 --> 0:05:44.029 I was kind of at this point, the star player 0:05:44.029 --> 0:05:47.120 for my team, I follow this coach by this coach 0:05:47.130 --> 0:05:51.219 from china who grounds me. Yeah. So literally like, you know, 0:05:51.230 --> 0:05:54.850 he taught me all the values as an athlete. I 0:05:54.850 --> 0:05:56.800 think sports is great because they teach you this sort 0:05:56.800 --> 0:05:57.230 of thing. 0:05:57.510 --> 0:06:02.120 And I had this point where I was being very arrogant. Yeah, 0:06:02.130 --> 0:06:04.320 kind of at some point, even look down on the team. 0:06:04.330 --> 0:06:07.290 Do we have pictures and clips from his past to 0:06:07.290 --> 0:06:08.729 flash up right now? 0:06:09.420 --> 0:06:09.870 Yeah, 0:06:09.870 --> 0:06:11.580 but it was crazy because we were all tall. We're 0:06:11.580 --> 0:06:13.460 all very dominating. We jump high. But 0:06:13.470 --> 0:06:15.330 he's really, he's really tall. Like when he came in 0:06:15.330 --> 0:06:17.779 to say hi, I live when I hugged him, I 0:06:17.779 --> 0:06:21.570 was at a level. I think it was about the point. 0:06:21.580 --> 0:06:27.440 So literally like it was this experience of like being 0:06:27.450 --> 0:06:30.120 very dominating. Then I got blocked. 0:06:30.370 --> 0:06:32.890 I got my balls got defended, my spikes, got 0:06:33.140 --> 0:06:34.429 balls got defended 0:06:34.440 --> 0:06:35.919 like the spike 0:06:36.150 --> 0:06:38.800 spike spike play volleyball, it's 0:06:38.800 --> 0:06:40.350 like attack. You know like 0:06:40.390 --> 0:06:42.950 you're talking about the volleyball, you're the volume 0:06:43.120 --> 0:06:43.770 itself 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.880 so my balls got blocked. I was like what is going, 0:06:47.880 --> 0:06:50.320 what show are we on again? Like what's the topic again? 0:06:50.320 --> 0:06:51.010 I forgot 0:06:51.490 --> 0:06:56.610 defend your boss. But anyway, yeah it was really tough 0:06:56.620 --> 0:06:58.630 because at the night itself you know we lost the 0:06:58.630 --> 0:06:59.820 game by the way it was a game we were 0:06:59.820 --> 0:07:00.380 supposed to win. 0:07:00.390 --> 0:07:01.600 It was a it was a big game, 0:07:01.610 --> 0:07:04.060 it was just a group stage game you know and 0:07:04.070 --> 0:07:06.520 my school N. Y. J. C. We're known for volleyball 0:07:06.520 --> 0:07:08.969 and every year people expect us to be the final time. 0:07:09.270 --> 0:07:10.760 So we are almost on the verge of getting out 0:07:10.760 --> 0:07:11.160 of the group 0:07:11.160 --> 0:07:12.290 stage because 0:07:12.290 --> 0:07:16.660 of me because my team trusted me and I got 0:07:16.660 --> 0:07:17.250 consumed by my 0:07:17.250 --> 0:07:18.410 ego. Yeah 0:07:18.420 --> 0:07:21.360 it was stuff then the same night my coach bumped 0:07:21.360 --> 0:07:24.330 into the reserve team right and I was still being arrogant, 0:07:24.330 --> 0:07:25.530 I was like how did you do this to 0:07:25.530 --> 0:07:26.340 me? Right, 0:07:26.350 --> 0:07:28.010 so I against my 0:07:28.020 --> 0:07:30.190 my teammates and 0:07:30.200 --> 0:07:33.150 in that moment it felt like everything was against you 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:33.410 and you 0:07:33.410 --> 0:07:37.390 just wanted to prove a point and I did you 0:07:37.390 --> 0:07:39.820 know we won the main team and just with me 0:07:39.820 --> 0:07:42.610 the other side. But then after that my coach gathered 0:07:42.610 --> 0:07:45.650 us all together right? Just sit down, you know, very 0:07:45.660 --> 0:07:49.460 intimate setting and just directed it to me. Okay. Yeah 0:07:49.470 --> 0:07:50.630 and you told me like he 0:07:50.630 --> 0:07:51.560 gave it to, you gave 0:07:51.560 --> 0:07:52.670 it to me, but he gave it in a very 0:07:52.670 --> 0:07:54.330 different way, not like a scolding way. 0:07:54.480 --> 0:07:56.540 He said like, you know, like what are you doing? 0:07:56.550 --> 0:07:59.300 Like you were never like that when I first saw you, 0:07:59.310 --> 0:08:01.450 my God, we have to queue some emotional music right now. 0:08:01.500 --> 0:08:02.230 You know, it's 0:08:02.230 --> 0:08:04.310 so character turning point 0:08:04.310 --> 0:08:08.170 totally totally and say that you know is you know, 0:08:08.170 --> 0:08:11.410 this is a team sport, it's not about you only right? Yeah. 0:08:11.420 --> 0:08:12.320 And that hit you hard. I 0:08:12.390 --> 0:08:14.500 mean I cried, I cried for my team. You know, 0:08:14.500 --> 0:08:16.630 I was this guy who is so much you just 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:18.930 trying to point out that my team is surprisingly they 0:08:18.930 --> 0:08:22.820 were all very supportive. Yeah. So at that time really 0:08:22.820 --> 0:08:24.330 just pull everything out and 0:08:24.550 --> 0:08:29.150 Like that really, that was at my lowest point in 0:08:29.160 --> 0:08:31.860 my prime. I was my lowest, I got bench but 0:08:31.860 --> 0:08:33.870 my coach gave me a chance to actually make it 0:08:33.870 --> 0:08:36.819 up for the next game. So there was one last 0:08:36.820 --> 0:08:40.000 ball I went in, it was like 25, if I 0:08:40.000 --> 0:08:43.270 got the point we want, then we proceed, he substitute 0:08:43.270 --> 0:08:46.550 me in and I scored. 0:08:46.640 --> 0:08:47.840 Yeah, he sent 0:08:47.840 --> 0:08:50.050 me a message in chinese. 0:08:54.540 --> 0:08:56.589 Yeah. So basically it says like, you know, like 0:08:56.590 --> 0:08:57.979 you have to translate one spike, 0:08:57.990 --> 0:09:02.170 I got back my confidence and I proved my worth. Yeah. 0:09:02.179 --> 0:09:05.069 So that moment was pivotal. We went on to win 0:09:05.080 --> 0:09:08.420 next year. He made me captain everyone. Yeah. So like 0:09:08.429 --> 0:09:11.760 why I thought about this moment is because every time 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:14.349 when I'm feeling down, I think I feel defeated. You 0:09:14.350 --> 0:09:16.080 just think about it. Like I was once like that, 0:09:16.400 --> 0:09:18.219 you know, and stuff what my coach did to me 0:09:18.220 --> 0:09:21.740 was really like this mentorship that was like to me 0:09:21.740 --> 0:09:23.360 it's a huge lesson then. No, 0:09:23.360 --> 0:09:25.340 thank you for sharing that story with us because I 0:09:25.340 --> 0:09:27.870 know that, you know, in moments like that it really 0:09:27.870 --> 0:09:30.400 shapes who you are and you know, when, like you 0:09:30.400 --> 0:09:31.209 mentioned earlier on, 0:09:31.580 --> 0:09:35.380 whenever you revisit certain memories like that you still get emotional. 0:09:35.380 --> 0:09:37.140 You know, I can see that it's still very fresh 0:09:37.140 --> 0:09:39.420 for you, even though it was probably like many years ago, 0:09:39.429 --> 0:09:40.550 More than 10 years ago, 0:09:40.650 --> 0:09:43.070 you still carry it with you. I think a lot 0:09:43.070 --> 0:09:43.490 of athletes 0:09:43.490 --> 0:09:44.250 have that moment in 0:09:44.250 --> 0:09:45.360 that. Yeah. 0:09:45.370 --> 0:09:49.240 And because whenever there's always this moment in you that 0:09:49.250 --> 0:09:49.580 you 0:09:49.580 --> 0:09:50.370 always something, 0:09:50.380 --> 0:09:53.600 something like you just recall and I did it before, 0:09:53.870 --> 0:09:54.970 I can definitely do it again. 0:09:54.980 --> 0:09:57.550 So on that note, you know, clearly you have learned 0:09:57.550 --> 0:10:00.120 a lot and you're more self aware now, you know, 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:02.590 you're more mature as well in that sense, which is great. 0:10:02.590 --> 0:10:06.620 Everyone matures and grows up. What is your understanding then 0:10:06.630 --> 0:10:09.429 of imposter syndrome when you go into the industry when 0:10:09.429 --> 0:10:11.800 you started your own business, when you think back on 0:10:11.800 --> 0:10:13.970 these moments, you reflects you want to be a better person, 0:10:13.980 --> 0:10:15.190 what is your understanding of 0:10:15.200 --> 0:10:21.730 that? I think is something that's very prevalent these days. Yeah, 0:10:21.900 --> 0:10:25.339 yeah, but um I feel that it's just this state 0:10:25.340 --> 0:10:31.699 of like self doubt, lack of belief and maybe undermining 0:10:31.700 --> 0:10:36.180 your worth when you are actually worth that much more. Yeah, 0:10:36.190 --> 0:10:38.610 and I feel that this world, you know, like it 0:10:38.610 --> 0:10:40.900 can be translated into so many things, you know, you 0:10:40.900 --> 0:10:43.200 did not be the most successful person, not be the, 0:10:43.510 --> 0:10:46.950 you know, the most famous person or not be exactly 0:10:46.950 --> 0:10:49.260 the best at what you do, but you just need 0:10:49.260 --> 0:10:51.940 to know that you do your best, right, then. I 0:10:51.940 --> 0:10:54.770 think that is really worth commending, What do you think 0:10:54.770 --> 0:10:55.040 about it? 0:10:55.050 --> 0:10:59.070 I'm not gonna lie, I definitely definitely visit that headspace 0:10:59.070 --> 0:11:01.080 once in a while and I don't know what your 0:11:01.080 --> 0:11:03.400 star sign is, but I'm Capricorn, as I said like 0:11:03.400 --> 0:11:07.040 many times and I'm very work driven, so a lot 0:11:07.040 --> 0:11:10.600 of my goals revolve around career and you know, when 0:11:10.600 --> 0:11:12.100 we talk about goals in the new year 0:11:12.110 --> 0:11:14.360 and stuff like that, and also successes of what we 0:11:14.360 --> 0:11:16.500 have achieved. I feel like I tie a lot of 0:11:16.500 --> 0:11:20.540 my self worth to work related success or what related 0:11:20.540 --> 0:11:24.960 goals and sometimes I neglect my personal life in a 0:11:24.960 --> 0:11:27.590 lot of that sense and that's why also, like, you know, 0:11:27.590 --> 0:11:29.880 when I look back, I've had so many relationships, right? 0:11:29.890 --> 0:11:32.689 But none of them really sort of came to a 0:11:32.690 --> 0:11:35.170 conclusion in a sense, like I never really settled down. 0:11:35.170 --> 0:11:37.500 I never really you know, you know what I mean, right? 0:11:37.510 --> 0:11:40.000 Because I always feel like I put that in the 0:11:40.000 --> 0:11:40.700 back seat, 0:11:41.080 --> 0:11:43.320 not that I'm putting my relationship in the backseat right now. 0:11:43.320 --> 0:11:45.579 I think that as we grow older or we mature 0:11:45.590 --> 0:11:46.770 change for you. 0:11:46.780 --> 0:11:51.020 Thanks for interviewing me by the way. So no, I 0:11:51.020 --> 0:11:55.689 wouldn't say what changed in a sense. I think in 0:11:55.690 --> 0:11:59.030 a way being in the industry for quite some time already, 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:01.900 I realized that you cannot win all the battles, right? 0:12:01.910 --> 0:12:04.309 You have to be very selective when it comes to it. 0:12:04.320 --> 0:12:06.730 You win some you lose some and you have to 0:12:06.730 --> 0:12:08.640 make a choice sometimes as well. So like you mention 0:12:08.653 --> 0:12:11.173 early on, you know, when you're younger, you had more ego, 0:12:11.173 --> 0:12:13.233 you have more pride and stuff like that. And I'm 0:12:13.232 --> 0:12:16.863 sure that also affected your decision making for me. I 0:12:16.863 --> 0:12:19.173 used to always take it very personally if I didn't 0:12:19.173 --> 0:12:22.283 get a job or like, you know, I'm very competitive, 0:12:22.283 --> 0:12:25.153 so if likewise, I don't play sports clearly, and I 0:12:25.153 --> 0:12:28.603 cannot play team sports. But anyway, the point is, it 0:12:28.602 --> 0:12:30.743 doesn't feel great when you lose, 0:12:30.753 --> 0:12:31.223 no one 0:12:31.232 --> 0:12:33.783 clearly no one likes to lose, right? And I also 0:12:33.783 --> 0:12:36.210 like to win, you know, and this competitive streak 0:12:36.226 --> 0:12:38.966 in me was quite self destructive in a sense that 0:12:38.976 --> 0:12:41.016 I always saw it if I didn't get this or 0:12:41.016 --> 0:12:42.655 didn't score a trial, I didn't do that, I was 0:12:42.655 --> 0:12:45.756 like why, why someone else better than me? And I 0:12:45.756 --> 0:12:48.466 always saw it that way, but I realized as we 0:12:48.466 --> 0:12:50.696 mature and we grow in the industry sometimes it's not 0:12:50.696 --> 0:12:54.206 all about us, you know, it's not always about you, likewise, 0:12:54.206 --> 0:12:56.705 you know, with your story about the sports and all that, 0:12:56.716 --> 0:13:00.126 you also came to that conclusion, you realize that moment right? 0:13:00.136 --> 0:13:03.376 Totally. I mean once we start comparing people, there's always 0:13:03.376 --> 0:13:03.795 like 0:13:03.950 --> 0:13:08.350 no limit to how that person might be better because 0:13:08.350 --> 0:13:10.490 I also go for some castings, you know and doable 0:13:10.490 --> 0:13:13.650 acting and stuff. So when I first entered this industry 0:13:13.650 --> 0:13:16.470 as well to try oh my God, it was not 0:13:16.470 --> 0:13:18.030 the most encouraging because 0:13:18.050 --> 0:13:20.950 it can be very toxic in your own mind, right? 0:13:20.960 --> 0:13:21.300 Because 0:13:21.309 --> 0:13:24.300 you might do the best audition and stuff, but the 0:13:24.300 --> 0:13:26.780 producer might choose another person for another reason, that's right, 0:13:26.800 --> 0:13:29.309 and it's not nothing against you. Then you start to 0:13:29.309 --> 0:13:30.360 accept that you have to 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:31.600 shift your mindset, 0:13:31.610 --> 0:13:33.860 your mindset and just know that you give your best, 0:13:33.870 --> 0:13:34.900 that's all that matters. Right? 0:13:34.910 --> 0:13:38.410 So, I'm curious to know because you know, in our industry, 0:13:38.410 --> 0:13:40.850 in the media it can be competitive, it can be toxic. Yes, 0:13:40.850 --> 0:13:44.720 but in any other industry as well, it's yours. Okay, 0:13:44.730 --> 0:13:48.650 is there that same level of competitiveness that could give 0:13:48.650 --> 0:13:51.939 rise to you sort of falling for you know an 0:13:51.940 --> 0:13:53.870 impostor syndrome moment every once in a 0:13:53.870 --> 0:13:54.480 while? 0:13:55.050 --> 0:14:00.179 Well, I think um there is actually like in a sense, 0:14:00.179 --> 0:14:04.180 like we always want to be better than another, like 0:14:04.190 --> 0:14:06.140 in a sense, like especially in fitness, you know, you're 0:14:06.140 --> 0:14:09.290 always striving to look better. You always trying to hit 0:14:09.290 --> 0:14:10.150 your pr 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:11.100 that's really tough. 0:14:11.110 --> 0:14:13.650 Yeah, you're always the goal is always not to be 0:14:13.650 --> 0:14:16.460 at the plateau, Right? Yeah. So for trainers, we always 0:14:16.460 --> 0:14:19.830 have this in us and there's always this idea about 0:14:19.830 --> 0:14:21.760 how can we do better than the other and sometimes 0:14:21.760 --> 0:14:23.180 you might go another way, 0:14:23.350 --> 0:14:26.200 but I think generally for us, everyone is working towards 0:14:26.200 --> 0:14:30.770 the direction of like building this community, such as when 0:14:30.780 --> 0:14:34.060 everyone starts to work out when everyone starts to train 0:14:34.070 --> 0:14:37.940 the share of the pie is bigger and generally like, 0:14:37.950 --> 0:14:40.510 fitness and health is great for everyone. So now 0:14:40.535 --> 0:14:43.875 I feel that, you know, with the covid pandemic, everything, 0:14:43.885 --> 0:14:46.365 we are all working towards that, more gyms opening up 0:14:46.375 --> 0:14:48.785 more people want to be trainers to inspire life. So 0:14:48.785 --> 0:14:49.535 I think it's great. Do 0:14:49.535 --> 0:14:51.055 you have a lot of female trainers? 0:14:51.065 --> 0:14:52.585 Yeah. 0:14:52.595 --> 0:14:53.495 Industry in general, 0:14:53.495 --> 0:14:59.005 not as many as guys. Yeah, definitely like, but definitely 0:14:59.005 --> 0:15:02.825 there's more that is coming up and I think they 0:15:02.825 --> 0:15:04.235 bring a whole different like, 0:15:04.390 --> 0:15:05.730 approach to training 0:15:05.740 --> 0:15:07.690 in what way? 0:15:07.700 --> 0:15:11.710 I'll say they're coaching star. Yeah, because for guys, you know, 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:12.140 we tend 0:15:12.150 --> 0:15:14.500 to do that push up now, 0:15:14.510 --> 0:15:15.130 but it's not 0:15:15.140 --> 0:15:15.490 really 0:15:16.150 --> 0:15:19.000 like that. I know some people who are very gentle, 0:15:19.010 --> 0:15:22.650 like really like gentle, giant, kind of some trainers who 0:15:22.660 --> 0:15:23.410 that and 0:15:23.730 --> 0:15:25.610 but what we learned and what I observed from female 0:15:25.610 --> 0:15:29.460 trainers that they show of course a lot more empathy. Yeah, 0:15:29.460 --> 0:15:32.710 they can, you know that soft approach is very important 0:15:32.710 --> 0:15:35.920 and we use that, you know, and for training and 0:15:35.930 --> 0:15:38.020 for male trainers we always tell them that you know, 0:15:38.020 --> 0:15:41.530 we always have to relate, we have to understand because 0:15:41.530 --> 0:15:42.590 sometimes it's not that 0:15:42.830 --> 0:15:43.070 you 0:15:43.070 --> 0:15:44.180 don't want to go forward, 0:15:44.190 --> 0:15:45.940 it's not that you don't want to push it just 0:15:45.940 --> 0:15:48.050 that maybe you had a very long day, you know, 0:15:48.050 --> 0:15:50.160 you just don't have that in you today, but you 0:15:50.160 --> 0:15:53.690 made it to training, you want that first battle come 0:15:53.690 --> 0:15:57.930 here just do a simple session and this adrenaline, this 0:15:57.930 --> 0:15:58.630 endorphins 0:15:58.640 --> 0:15:59.630 make you feel better 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:02.730 totally, and that is really considered good session. It's not 0:16:02.730 --> 0:16:04.820 always about having the most 0:16:05.020 --> 0:16:09.260 like high calorie burning session, having the food pumpin. Yeah, 0:16:09.270 --> 0:16:13.030 and I feel it's great now things are changing. 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:15.710 It's nice to see that because I do notice, you know, 0:16:15.710 --> 0:16:17.940 you guys do a lot of social media, you know 0:16:17.940 --> 0:16:19.580 you have a lot of content going out as well, 0:16:19.580 --> 0:16:22.680 that's why I always wondered how competitive was that is 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:24.010 that industry, You know, 0:16:24.020 --> 0:16:27.820 I would say that everyone is doing their their content 0:16:27.830 --> 0:16:30.750 and I mean now, you know like digital content is 0:16:30.750 --> 0:16:31.480 very important 0:16:31.690 --> 0:16:34.390 to really reach out to people because people will know 0:16:34.390 --> 0:16:38.030 who you are, but for myself, for our team, it's 0:16:38.030 --> 0:16:41.100 always about promoting the idea about fitness as a lifestyle. Yeah, 0:16:41.110 --> 0:16:44.140 so we don't don't really like to go towards the 0:16:44.140 --> 0:16:48.290 side of making things too difficult, making things too like 0:16:48.300 --> 0:16:50.170 you must do this in order to get this result. 0:16:50.180 --> 0:16:53.390 It's more like you can you can try this, you know, 0:16:53.390 --> 0:16:53.680 if this 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:55.430 helps you time on your own, That's good. 0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:56.910 You know, like this is our take on it, but 0:16:56.910 --> 0:16:58.950 it doesn't mean that the other method is bad. 0:16:59.260 --> 0:17:02.070 Yeah. And if you like it quit, you know share 0:17:02.070 --> 0:17:03.720 your friends and 0:17:03.730 --> 0:17:05.730 that sounds actually okay because the reason why I brought 0:17:05.730 --> 0:17:08.429 that up was I feel like there were some moments 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:11.740 earlier on in my career that really I still revisit 0:17:11.740 --> 0:17:14.340 also once in a while in not such a good way, 0:17:14.350 --> 0:17:17.920 but you know, hearing about how competitive it is as 0:17:17.920 --> 0:17:20.300 well in your industry in mind. I mean obviously every 0:17:20.300 --> 0:17:23.830 industry has its toxic side and the positive side. But 0:17:23.840 --> 0:17:26.230 I remember this one moment, this was quite quite some 0:17:26.230 --> 0:17:28.370 time ago. I was still very junior. I was very 0:17:28.369 --> 0:17:29.220 new at the time 0:17:29.520 --> 0:17:31.950 and I was still kind of figuring my way out 0:17:31.950 --> 0:17:33.359 trying to figure out what is it I want to 0:17:33.359 --> 0:17:36.280 specialize in what's my branding and branding I'm sure is 0:17:36.280 --> 0:17:37.040 so important, 0:17:37.040 --> 0:17:40.420 right? Like Sonja's branding is like so good. Thank you really, really, 0:17:40.430 --> 0:17:42.649 really respect the things that you do and stuff. I 0:17:42.650 --> 0:17:44.909 feel that really resonates with her. Thank you. This is 0:17:44.910 --> 0:17:46.550 really being authentic. 0:17:46.560 --> 0:17:49.590 Yeah, exactly. So that, that's authenticity, right, is so important. 0:17:49.590 --> 0:17:52.560 Being genuine, being real. But one thing that really impacted 0:17:52.560 --> 0:17:55.250 me quite some time ago was when a male colleague 0:17:55.260 --> 0:17:58.920 not in the company anymore from, from a long time ago, 0:17:59.210 --> 0:18:03.350 he was kind of gossiping to other people saying Sonja 0:18:03.350 --> 0:18:06.650 will only make it because she looks a certain way 0:18:06.660 --> 0:18:08.700 and that's it. And he was like, she's not even 0:18:08.700 --> 0:18:11.270 that good or whatever. And when I heard it, you 0:18:11.270 --> 0:18:14.649 know what travels, you know, it came back. I was 0:18:14.660 --> 0:18:17.619 very upset, okay, at first I was extremely upset. I 0:18:17.619 --> 0:18:19.810 was like, how dare you like this bit, this whole, 0:18:19.810 --> 0:18:22.310 this is okay, you can leave that out. I was like, 0:18:22.310 --> 0:18:24.859 this bit like, how do you say that, whatever, But 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:28.540 as I moved along in the industry and I revisit 0:18:28.540 --> 0:18:31.780 that moment and like, you know what, from that moment onwards, right? 0:18:31.780 --> 0:18:35.109 I felt like they need to prove myself increased by 0:18:35.109 --> 0:18:38.290 tenfold and I wasn't sure whether that was a good 0:18:38.290 --> 0:18:40.609 or bad thing, because I know for a lot of women, 0:18:40.609 --> 0:18:42.160 we also feel like we need to 0:18:42.340 --> 0:18:45.140 prove a lot more in the industry at the workplace, 0:18:45.150 --> 0:18:47.669 in our line of work, you know, in career and 0:18:47.670 --> 0:18:49.940 stuff like that, and I hate to see it that, 0:18:49.950 --> 0:18:52.310 you know, when people say, oh, she's only cute or 0:18:52.310 --> 0:18:54.430 she's got a good body or she's got a good face, 0:18:54.430 --> 0:18:56.170 that's why she's going to make it like that, but 0:18:56.180 --> 0:18:59.440 it is so much more than just physicality, right? And 0:18:59.440 --> 0:19:02.380 how you look that will take you far. So in 0:19:02.380 --> 0:19:02.860 a sense 0:19:02.880 --> 0:19:05.270 when I look back at that moment, I don't know 0:19:05.270 --> 0:19:08.190 whether that caused me to develop more of an imposter 0:19:08.190 --> 0:19:09.639 syndrome than before. 0:19:09.650 --> 0:19:13.220 I think women tend to have it more like harder 0:19:13.220 --> 0:19:14.150 than men in 0:19:14.150 --> 0:19:16.560 a way you feel, why do you feel that way? 0:19:16.570 --> 0:19:19.479 I'll say a little bit more in a sense like 0:19:19.490 --> 0:19:23.399 your self worth? Probably you feel me 0:19:23.410 --> 0:19:24.889 need to actually prove your worth more 0:19:24.900 --> 0:19:25.869 right? Yeah, 0:19:25.890 --> 0:19:28.389 guys, you know, we always, we have a lot of 0:19:28.400 --> 0:19:28.880 ego 0:19:28.890 --> 0:19:31.200 and you walk into a room with confidence right? We're 0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:33.620 always about the ego, you don't break my ego, you know, 0:19:33.630 --> 0:19:38.520 that masculine approach and stuff and I guess for us, 0:19:38.520 --> 0:19:41.570 you know, we feel that there is this kind of 0:19:41.570 --> 0:19:46.209 pressure to actually perform at a certain level so that 0:19:46.210 --> 0:19:47.020 we can match, 0:19:47.230 --> 0:19:50.100 especially if you were from a background of competitive sports 0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:53.130 and that definitely highlights it more. 0:19:53.140 --> 0:19:55.900 Yeah, I really like, I feel that there's this but 0:19:55.910 --> 0:20:00.080 I think it's about just understanding our differences and finding 0:20:00.090 --> 0:20:03.400 like learning from each other right in order to actually 0:20:03.410 --> 0:20:06.180 try because I do see a lot of like female 0:20:06.180 --> 0:20:08.649 entrepreneurs and stuff, I look at them and they manage 0:20:08.650 --> 0:20:12.260 a team in a different way Yeah, they somehow has 0:20:12.260 --> 0:20:14.790 this in them that they are very enterprising for sure, 0:20:15.100 --> 0:20:17.400 yeah and I learned a lot, I learned a lot 0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:19.469 just by observing just like looking at the way they 0:20:19.470 --> 0:20:23.980 do things, so it is a very different learning experience, 0:20:23.990 --> 0:20:26.610 but do you feel like also perhaps you know these 0:20:26.609 --> 0:20:30.060 insecurities and moments of self doubt that you have, you 0:20:30.060 --> 0:20:33.710 don't necessarily open up too much about it, you guys 0:20:33.710 --> 0:20:34.100 try and 0:20:34.100 --> 0:20:35.320 like mask 0:20:35.320 --> 0:20:38.310 that up with overcompensating, 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:40.629 you don't want to appear weak, you know, I mean 0:20:40.640 --> 0:20:41.780 especially 0:20:41.780 --> 0:20:45.330 I would say as an entrepreneur, you know it's harder 0:20:45.330 --> 0:20:46.730 to showcase 0:20:46.730 --> 0:20:47.860 this vulnerable 0:20:47.869 --> 0:20:49.919 because you know when you're vulnerable you always tend to 0:20:49.920 --> 0:20:53.070 think that people want to take advantage of you and 0:20:53.080 --> 0:20:56.690 for me I was very vulnerable before, so I felt 0:20:56.690 --> 0:21:00.070 that you know someone just, someone told me like it's 0:21:00.070 --> 0:21:01.600 okay to show this side of, 0:21:01.619 --> 0:21:02.909 you can't 0:21:02.910 --> 0:21:03.980 always be the tough guy, 0:21:03.990 --> 0:21:07.359 people then know that you actually have feelings for them, 0:21:07.369 --> 0:21:10.109 you know, you actually care about them because sometimes you 0:21:10.109 --> 0:21:13.240 know as entrepreneurs, although you want to care for people, 0:21:13.240 --> 0:21:16.560 you have to make decisions that are tough, very tough 0:21:16.570 --> 0:21:18.750 and sometimes you know as a stuff you might not 0:21:18.750 --> 0:21:22.470 understand why, but I always think like there's different ways 0:21:22.470 --> 0:21:24.679 I approach things like for my guys, you know 0:21:24.900 --> 0:21:29.340 the team always feel that reasoning is key, you always 0:21:29.340 --> 0:21:31.570 have to explain why I do certain things, you know, 0:21:31.570 --> 0:21:33.020 why is it not done the other way and you 0:21:33.020 --> 0:21:36.149 understand and guys very broad and once you understand totally 0:21:36.160 --> 0:21:38.830 no qualms about it, ladies, I feel that I will 0:21:38.830 --> 0:21:41.730 spend some time, you know, like asking them how they 0:21:41.730 --> 0:21:44.320 feel about it, you know, what can be done differently, 0:21:44.330 --> 0:21:49.630 you know? So there's this like, you know, different approach. Yeah, 0:21:49.640 --> 0:21:50.950 and that's fine, it's totally 0:21:50.950 --> 0:21:52.590 fine, it's totally fine, and 0:21:52.980 --> 0:21:56.530 that's just the way things work and that's how I observe, 0:21:56.540 --> 0:21:58.520 you know, and 0:21:58.970 --> 0:22:00.739 we learn from each other, it's nice, you know, it's 0:22:00.740 --> 0:22:04.159 a process like to me, fatherhood has really like shaped 0:22:04.160 --> 0:22:06.200 me in another way, you know, you told me about 0:22:06.210 --> 0:22:07.030 a lot about empathy, 0:22:07.040 --> 0:22:08.330 I'm sure has softened you 0:22:08.340 --> 0:22:11.180 totally, like, you know, there's no module that issue about parenting, 0:22:11.180 --> 0:22:14.310 so since we're going into fatherhood and parenting right at 0:22:14.310 --> 0:22:17.300 this point, have you had moments of self doubt when 0:22:17.300 --> 0:22:20.010 it came to being a good dad, being a good 0:22:20.010 --> 0:22:21.859 role model, a good example, 0:22:21.869 --> 0:22:23.710 totally, totally, because 0:22:23.950 --> 0:22:28.400 it's like when my girl just came into this world, 0:22:28.410 --> 0:22:30.560 I was like what 0:22:30.570 --> 0:22:31.350 do you do, what I do? 0:22:31.359 --> 0:22:34.530 How do I hold her? You know, like, is it 0:22:34.530 --> 0:22:37.920 okay if she react this way, you know, what is 0:22:37.920 --> 0:22:43.280 her next growing like, milestone and is so much, there's 0:22:43.280 --> 0:22:45.410 so much like, question marks and me and my wife 0:22:45.410 --> 0:22:47.409 were just really figuring out, I think our parents would 0:22:47.410 --> 0:22:48.270 say the same thing that 0:22:48.480 --> 0:22:51.350 Yeah, but it's so incredible because it teaches you so 0:22:51.350 --> 0:22:54.120 many things, it really teaches you so many things and 0:22:54.130 --> 0:22:56.360 once you see that happening, you realize that they have 0:22:56.359 --> 0:22:59.070 their own journey to follow, they have their own like 0:22:59.080 --> 0:23:01.750 milestones to hit, just go at their own pace, and 0:23:01.750 --> 0:23:04.690 this resonates with what I do. So yeah, so it 0:23:04.700 --> 0:23:07.160 seems like when you manage a team and stuff, let 0:23:07.160 --> 0:23:10.820 everyone grow at their own pace, you know, like show 0:23:10.820 --> 0:23:14.940 them and recognize their efforts in different milestones 0:23:15.290 --> 0:23:18.859 and you'll support them in their progression in every single way. Yeah, 0:23:18.869 --> 0:23:21.639 and you've been through different phases of life, right? You know, 0:23:21.640 --> 0:23:25.550 first it was that competitive sportsman, then business owner now, 0:23:25.550 --> 0:23:28.910 also your dad, so you've hit all those milestones as, 0:23:28.910 --> 0:23:30.830 so we call it in life, right? I'm going to 0:23:30.830 --> 0:23:32.500 ask you a very simple question if you had to 0:23:32.500 --> 0:23:36.119 rate your confidence level now from a scale of like 0:23:36.130 --> 0:23:39.800 1 to 10, what would it be versus back then, 0:23:41.510 --> 0:23:42.700 back then it was like 0:23:42.710 --> 0:23:46.090 12, 12, 10, 0:23:46.090 --> 0:23:50.060 but I'm just like, trying to be too full myself now, 0:23:50.060 --> 0:23:51.290 I would still say 0:23:51.550 --> 0:23:54.420 I'm quite a 10 out of 10 person in a sense, like, 0:23:54.420 --> 0:23:58.960 I don't really like to doubt myself, it's not okay, 0:23:58.970 --> 0:24:01.030 it's not that I don't I have moments like that, 0:24:01.030 --> 0:24:03.359 but I always feel that, you know, as long I 0:24:03.359 --> 0:24:07.410 give my best, you know, that's really enough, Yeah, and 0:24:07.420 --> 0:24:09.610 it just, it just because now I have so many 0:24:09.609 --> 0:24:11.609 roles to play, right? Yeah. I always have to be 0:24:11.609 --> 0:24:13.180 this pillar, you know, 0:24:13.430 --> 0:24:14.460 strong person, 0:24:14.470 --> 0:24:15.360 whatever I do. 0:24:15.520 --> 0:24:18.950 And it helps when I'm so supportive. Your parents, I'm 0:24:18.950 --> 0:24:21.370 the only son, I'm the only child. So now they're retired, 0:24:21.369 --> 0:24:25.290 I support them, my wife, you know, my team, you know, 0:24:25.300 --> 0:24:28.629 the sole owner of the business and stuff. So everyone's 0:24:28.630 --> 0:24:29.350 relying on me. 0:24:29.619 --> 0:24:31.540 Yeah. And I feel that I have no chance to 0:24:31.540 --> 0:24:34.110 really let go and take it easy. I'm a bit 0:24:34.109 --> 0:24:35.449 hard myself, just like you, I 0:24:35.450 --> 0:24:37.609 AM hard on myself 100%. 0:24:37.619 --> 0:24:40.520 It just feels that there's this expectation on me then 0:24:40.530 --> 0:24:43.910 causes me to be there every day. It most me 0:24:43.910 --> 0:24:48.770 to be stronger and more confident and just take the 0:24:48.780 --> 0:24:51.210 leap of faith because if I don't, if I don't 0:24:51.210 --> 0:24:54.320 set my an example, how do I expect my team 0:24:54.320 --> 0:24:55.080 to follow? 0:24:55.090 --> 0:24:56.140 I'm yeah, I can 0:24:56.150 --> 0:24:58.510 relate to what you're saying. I mean on a different level, 0:24:58.510 --> 0:25:01.190 I'm also an only child. I support my family as well. 0:25:01.200 --> 0:25:03.790 There are moments where I'm like, I don't know if 0:25:03.800 --> 0:25:06.480 you know I can do this and also pursue what 0:25:06.480 --> 0:25:08.210 I want to do and you know what I mean? 0:25:08.220 --> 0:25:10.990 I don't want to call it, it's not baggage, it's 0:25:10.990 --> 0:25:14.419 your responsibilities and it's also our choice to do what 0:25:14.420 --> 0:25:18.810 we do, right? But in certain moments I while people 0:25:18.810 --> 0:25:21.560 think I'm a very confident person at least that's what 0:25:21.560 --> 0:25:22.670 people perceive. 0:25:22.890 --> 0:25:26.330 I actually have many moments in a day where I 0:25:26.340 --> 0:25:29.649 just wallow in self doubt and I'm like, that's something 0:25:29.650 --> 0:25:31.690 that I can't tell, I can't tell 0:25:31.700 --> 0:25:34.240 You because obviously, you know, on social is not what 0:25:34.240 --> 0:25:35.930 you see, right? I mean what you see is not 0:25:35.930 --> 0:25:38.430 exactly 100% the truth, right? And 0:25:38.430 --> 0:25:42.020 what moments in your day that you know, like before, 0:25:42.109 --> 0:25:44.520 I think I over think like, okay, what am I 0:25:44.520 --> 0:25:47.040 going to do in five years or 10 years and 0:25:47.320 --> 0:25:50.600 am I on the right path there? 0:25:50.609 --> 0:25:51.320 It 0:25:51.320 --> 0:25:53.260 plagues me every day, you know, I don't know why, 0:25:53.260 --> 0:25:55.820 but I don't know whether it's that I was going 0:25:55.820 --> 0:25:57.500 to ask you, is it a man versus woman thing? 0:25:57.500 --> 0:25:59.790 Like is because I'm an over thinker actually 0:25:59.790 --> 0:26:01.510 I have that too. Like, you know, like, you know, 0:26:01.510 --> 0:26:04.640 like what I do in five years, 10 years time, 0:26:04.650 --> 0:26:06.399 you know how the industry change, you 0:26:06.400 --> 0:26:07.650 know, so 0:26:07.650 --> 0:26:09.950 much tech, you know, will I be able to live 0:26:09.950 --> 0:26:12.630 up to that expectation then 0:26:12.800 --> 0:26:15.990 we'll be able to innovate now to make sure that 0:26:16.000 --> 0:26:18.240 I can have that hit start then 0:26:18.250 --> 0:26:21.740 and then from there I start to spiral into am 0:26:21.740 --> 0:26:24.699 I doing OK now I am I am I the 0:26:24.700 --> 0:26:26.980 best at what I do now, you know, can I 0:26:26.980 --> 0:26:29.960 do more, is this? It's like sometimes I question before 0:26:30.080 --> 0:26:32.640 like is this it is this the peak? Is this 0:26:32.650 --> 0:26:33.090 all that 0:26:33.180 --> 0:26:35.649 never ending? Like path of chasing. 0:26:35.660 --> 0:26:37.720 Exactly. Like we're always chasing something that 0:26:37.720 --> 0:26:38.150 really well, 0:26:38.650 --> 0:26:40.890 that's why we feel tired actually. I have that if 0:26:40.890 --> 0:26:43.590 you're talking about that. No, I definitely have that. I 0:26:43.600 --> 0:26:45.730 tend to like chase a lot and sometimes you also 0:26:45.730 --> 0:26:47.379 feel that, you know, I mean you want to be 0:26:47.380 --> 0:26:49.619 the best fitness trainer and stuff 0:26:49.630 --> 0:26:50.700 constituency that. 0:26:50.710 --> 0:26:53.760 What does that mean? You know, people say like, you know, 0:26:53.760 --> 0:26:56.130 have some haters, you know, like, you know, this guy 0:26:56.130 --> 0:27:01.430 only can train celebrities and stuff like that, but then 0:27:01.440 --> 0:27:03.310 I didn't start off training celebrities. 0:27:03.830 --> 0:27:07.469 Yeah. And it's just a journey that I now have 0:27:07.470 --> 0:27:09.169 the opportunity to like, okay, I'm going to do it 0:27:09.170 --> 0:27:11.980 well despite everyone's hectic scale, I'm gonna try to make 0:27:11.980 --> 0:27:14.360 it work whatever it is. Very important to actually like 0:27:14.359 --> 0:27:17.570 work on ourselves. Now focus on the present, you know, 0:27:17.580 --> 0:27:21.490 except for as I asked for what we are and 0:27:21.490 --> 0:27:25.060 just slowly as long you're chasing that goal that you 0:27:25.060 --> 0:27:28.910 set for yourself, step by step, even just a slight improvement, 0:27:29.060 --> 0:27:32.840 a slight milestone. We have to really comment ourselves and 0:27:32.840 --> 0:27:34.730 give ourselves a pat on the back. So 0:27:34.730 --> 0:27:37.040 you sound like you've always nipped in the butt when 0:27:37.040 --> 0:27:40.000 it came to moments of self doubt because sometimes I 0:27:40.000 --> 0:27:42.909 will spiral mentally and then I'll have no conclusion. Then 0:27:42.910 --> 0:27:45.470 the next day I'll just wake up feeling miserable all 0:27:45.470 --> 0:27:48.679 over again. So how do you deal with in moments 0:27:48.680 --> 0:27:50.170 of self doubt, How do you deal with 0:27:50.170 --> 0:27:52.490 it? I'll say 0:27:52.780 --> 0:27:55.750 I always like talk to myself like in a sense 0:27:55.750 --> 0:27:56.050 like 0:27:56.060 --> 0:27:58.020 isn't only shouting, we always, I don't know, we have 0:27:58.020 --> 0:28:01.940 not talked to nobody, no friends like when I was Yeah, 0:28:01.940 --> 0:28:03.939 but I think it shapes us, you know like in 0:28:03.940 --> 0:28:05.609 a sense like okay what I'm gonna do, I'm not 0:28:05.609 --> 0:28:07.250 going to rely on my parents, I'm trying to face 0:28:07.250 --> 0:28:10.949 it myself and like I guess that really helps you 0:28:10.950 --> 0:28:13.610 just reflect, you know, you start to like think about 0:28:13.609 --> 0:28:16.090 like what lessons you have learned, you know, is this 0:28:16.090 --> 0:28:18.629 as bad last time? You know it's actually just okay, 0:28:18.640 --> 0:28:22.680 this is just another challenge that we face now and 0:28:22.910 --> 0:28:25.220 I can overcome it then I can overcome it now 0:28:25.230 --> 0:28:27.990 if I can't ask for support. So like my wife 0:28:27.990 --> 0:28:30.070 supports me, you know, I talk, what 0:28:30.070 --> 0:28:31.080 did she do? She 0:28:31.090 --> 0:28:34.609 Yeah, she does marketing for airline company and she's a 0:28:34.609 --> 0:28:38.640 very different person comment to me, she's really 0:28:38.650 --> 0:28:39.510 balances you out 0:28:39.520 --> 0:28:42.200 totally, totally. I always ask her about things and 0:28:42.520 --> 0:28:45.380 sometimes she's quite tired about hearing me talk about this 0:28:45.380 --> 0:28:48.530 stuff like very boring like work stuff, but she really 0:28:48.530 --> 0:28:51.640 balances me out in a sense like you know she 0:28:51.650 --> 0:28:54.190 encourages me to think about the other side of things, 0:28:54.860 --> 0:28:57.580 the emotional side of things, you know, like maybe 0:28:57.590 --> 0:28:59.160 you can try it the other way, maybe it's not 0:28:59.160 --> 0:29:01.840 always good to go on figure a way out, you 0:29:01.840 --> 0:29:04.520 know I mean you're fine, you're doing good, okay, take 0:29:04.520 --> 0:29:04.960 a break, 0:29:04.970 --> 0:29:07.070 I think it's good to have a supportive partner as 0:29:07.070 --> 0:29:09.340 well who gives a different perspective friends 0:29:09.340 --> 0:29:10.330 as well as well. 0:29:10.340 --> 0:29:12.660 Exactly, absolutely. Like sometimes when I 0:29:12.850 --> 0:29:15.640 um yeah, and bit about my day to my partner, 0:29:15.640 --> 0:29:18.300 sometimes I see his eyes just glaze over and he's 0:29:18.300 --> 0:29:21.480 probably like, oh my God, this is the same thing again. 0:29:21.490 --> 0:29:24.090 But sometimes, you know, you just, you don't need a solution, 0:29:24.090 --> 0:29:26.200 you just need someone who is listening and who is 0:29:26.200 --> 0:29:29.440 understanding and who may give you a more practical point 0:29:29.440 --> 0:29:30.470 of view or something 0:29:30.470 --> 0:29:32.080 that you don't need someone to be there to just 0:29:32.080 --> 0:29:34.960 feel the answer just here, be listening here 0:29:35.310 --> 0:29:37.960 and you know sometimes true that talk, you start to 0:29:37.960 --> 0:29:41.170 realize something about yourself and you figure out the answer. 0:29:41.180 --> 0:29:45.210 So I'm curious, you know, being a business owner yourself 0:29:45.210 --> 0:29:48.600 currently have you know, we talked about self doubt, but 0:29:48.600 --> 0:29:51.720 have you ever thought what if I fail? Like what 0:29:51.720 --> 0:29:54.810 if what I set out to do doesn't work out 0:29:54.820 --> 0:29:56.580 at some point. Have you ever, do you ever think 0:29:56.580 --> 0:29:56.890 of those 0:29:56.890 --> 0:29:57.480 moments? 0:29:58.020 --> 0:29:58.730 Have you 0:29:58.730 --> 0:30:00.200 had to deal with moments of failure 0:30:00.210 --> 0:30:04.080 definitely. Like there's so many points where you feel so down, 0:30:04.460 --> 0:30:07.950 but it's always like, I can never let this fear 0:30:07.960 --> 0:30:12.840 consume me this fear is going to inspire me Yeah, 0:30:12.850 --> 0:30:15.230 fear of failure, like I cannot afford to, 0:30:15.240 --> 0:30:16.050 you 0:30:16.060 --> 0:30:19.020 know, so like even before we go down there without, right? 0:30:19.030 --> 0:30:23.000 It's always about like psyching myself up, you know, like 0:30:23.010 --> 0:30:26.890 to really create this moment, this energy in myself, that 0:30:26.900 --> 0:30:29.600 how do I feel then, you know, this is just 0:30:29.600 --> 0:30:32.330 a down moment. I'll get through it, I really will 0:30:32.330 --> 0:30:32.660 get through it. 0:30:32.690 --> 0:30:33.670 So there's a lot of self 0:30:33.670 --> 0:30:35.980 talk that really, like, you know, spurs me on, like 0:30:35.980 --> 0:30:41.370 to say that there's nothing I can't handle. Yeah. If 0:30:41.380 --> 0:30:43.600 someone else had been through this before, they might have 0:30:43.600 --> 0:30:45.540 it worse. This is just another obstacle, 0:30:45.550 --> 0:30:48.080 you know? Yeah. I used to think that I was 0:30:48.090 --> 0:30:50.850 a perfectionist like my entire life, but I realized as 0:30:50.850 --> 0:30:53.380 I grew a bit older that perhaps I'm more afraid 0:30:53.380 --> 0:30:56.600 of failure than actually wanting to achieve perfection in that sense. 0:30:56.610 --> 0:30:59.230 Why do you think that there's this like part of 0:30:59.230 --> 0:31:00.910 you that exists in terms of the failure? 0:31:01.100 --> 0:31:06.260 Okay, so I would say when I started out doing 0:31:06.260 --> 0:31:09.670 F&B just a couple of years back, right? And it 0:31:09.670 --> 0:31:13.900 was very happening, you know, it was like 2018, peak 0:31:13.900 --> 0:31:16.500 of things, you know, I was really doing so much 0:31:16.500 --> 0:31:17.180 and I was like 0:31:17.330 --> 0:31:19.910 so excited to start a new venture like with new 0:31:19.910 --> 0:31:23.630 partners and people that I'm excited to do a business 0:31:23.630 --> 0:31:26.750 with and things were going so good, right, we're full 0:31:26.750 --> 0:31:29.820 house every night, people were queuing up, you know, just 0:31:29.820 --> 0:31:32.080 to get into the bar on weekends and stuff like that, 0:31:32.090 --> 0:31:33.770 Then the pandemic hit, 0:31:33.780 --> 0:31:34.260 right? 0:31:34.270 --> 0:31:35.250 And it 0:31:35.250 --> 0:31:40.040 changed everything because we weren't really we're not exactly a 0:31:40.050 --> 0:31:43.990 food focused place. It was also like lifestyle is also 0:31:43.990 --> 0:31:44.670 a bar 0:31:44.680 --> 0:31:45.390 interaction. 0:31:45.570 --> 0:31:49.200 Yeah, it's the atmosphere, it's, you know, the music, the lights, 0:31:49.200 --> 0:31:50.220 the everything right? 0:31:50.580 --> 0:31:54.160 And when that happens, we struggle, like we really struggled 0:31:54.170 --> 0:31:57.020 to make a comeback and eventually we decided, you know, 0:31:57.020 --> 0:31:59.700 I think we're gonna close this chapter and move on 0:31:59.700 --> 0:32:02.750 to something different maybe now, maybe in the future, maybe 0:32:02.750 --> 0:32:04.310 in a year or two, who knows? Right? 0:32:04.540 --> 0:32:07.340 So we still have that partnership, we still have, you know, 0:32:07.340 --> 0:32:09.770 the company shares and all that. But we decided, I 0:32:09.770 --> 0:32:11.700 think this is not working out in this area 0:32:11.700 --> 0:32:13.130 anymore and 0:32:13.130 --> 0:32:15.830 I think we're gonna call it a day, surprisingly in 0:32:15.830 --> 0:32:18.090 that moment, I think I took it quite well because 0:32:18.090 --> 0:32:20.150 the reason why I almost didn't want to do a 0:32:20.150 --> 0:32:22.570 business in F M. B in the first place was 0:32:22.570 --> 0:32:24.720 that I was afraid, oh my gosh, what if we fail? 0:32:24.720 --> 0:32:27.290 What if no one comes, what if we closed? What 0:32:27.290 --> 0:32:29.390 am I going to say to like the press or 0:32:29.390 --> 0:32:31.960 in an interview? Like what am I going to do? Right? 0:32:32.280 --> 0:32:35.690 And I was overcome by all those thoughts, but in 0:32:35.690 --> 0:32:37.700 that moment, I was like, you know what, I'm just 0:32:37.700 --> 0:32:41.270 gonna stop this Self doubt, I'm just gonna try. I'm 0:32:41.270 --> 0:32:43.380 just going to give it a shot. Besides, I'm doing 0:32:43.380 --> 0:32:45.950 it with a bunch of partners, right? Support. Yeah, we 0:32:45.950 --> 0:32:50.090 have support and eventually we decided collectively let's move on 0:32:50.090 --> 0:32:53.500 to something else. It's not serving us anymore. We got 0:32:53.500 --> 0:32:56.370 hit so bad during the pandemic. So let's just move 0:32:56.380 --> 0:32:56.580 so 0:32:56.580 --> 0:32:58.380 many like restaurants because in my neighborhood, 0:32:58.590 --> 0:33:02.040 yeah, we have so many like restaurants and we've seen 0:33:02.050 --> 0:33:05.180 the whole change, you know, from a bustling street. Everything 0:33:05.180 --> 0:33:07.560 got so quiet. It felt so weird. 0:33:07.570 --> 0:33:11.150 Yes, exactly where you are is the entire stretch, right? 0:33:11.160 --> 0:33:14.280 It's all like nightlife is all like fine dining restaurants. 0:33:14.290 --> 0:33:14.830 Every 0:33:14.830 --> 0:33:16.440 time when we walk to the gym we always see 0:33:16.450 --> 0:33:19.190 people gathering, you know, they're having a good time bustling 0:33:19.190 --> 0:33:22.420 music everywhere. But at that point, you know, the covid 0:33:22.440 --> 0:33:24.910 heightened alert the whole stretch, It was so quiet, 0:33:25.110 --> 0:33:26.180 want to change 0:33:26.190 --> 0:33:29.530 all my neighbors, you know, restaurant owners and stuff, you know, 0:33:29.540 --> 0:33:31.420 we talk to them, you know, and they were all 0:33:31.420 --> 0:33:35.860 very like I would say they already determined that everyone 0:33:35.860 --> 0:33:37.420 was quick to take away. 0:33:37.430 --> 0:33:38.330 Yes, Yes, I saw 0:33:38.330 --> 0:33:42.120 this fine dining restaurant, they just let everything outside the menu, 0:33:42.130 --> 0:33:44.210 you know to say, then people come in to do 0:33:44.210 --> 0:33:47.420 like take away orders and stuff so they just really innovative, 0:33:47.430 --> 0:33:48.220 try to innovate. 0:33:48.230 --> 0:33:50.060 Yeah, so really respect to everyone 0:33:50.070 --> 0:33:53.400 push through this time. But those who like, you know, 0:33:53.400 --> 0:33:57.570 decide not to, it's totally fine. It's just like pivoting, right? Yeah, pivoting. 0:33:57.580 --> 0:33:59.970 Yeah. So, so in that sense it was a big 0:33:59.970 --> 0:34:02.570 turning point for me as well when it came to 0:34:02.580 --> 0:34:05.800 co owning a business, right? You have to be prepared 0:34:05.810 --> 0:34:09.430 that it may not work out. And to me it's 0:34:09.430 --> 0:34:12.660 like I don't ever want to, you know, stumble upon 0:34:12.660 --> 0:34:15.030 a moment where it feels like I failed, 0:34:15.210 --> 0:34:18.350 but you don't have to see it as failure. Right? Totally, 0:34:18.360 --> 0:34:21.530 totally. It's a learning experience because now, you know, you 0:34:21.530 --> 0:34:23.509 and your partners might come up with something even more 0:34:23.510 --> 0:34:26.550 exciting when the opportunity comes when someone has the idea. 0:34:26.550 --> 0:34:28.190 It might just click and you might just 0:34:28.380 --> 0:34:31.160 use your previous experience like this. Yeah. And you might 0:34:31.160 --> 0:34:33.280 just elevate and escalate everything up. 0:34:33.290 --> 0:34:35.190 And I think, you know, if there's one thing that 0:34:35.190 --> 0:34:37.200 I've learned in being in this industry as well, there's 0:34:37.200 --> 0:34:39.350 so many ups and downs, right? You could be the 0:34:39.350 --> 0:34:42.140 talk of the town today and you could be canceled tomorrow. 0:34:42.140 --> 0:34:44.200 I've had a few close brushes with it. I'm not 0:34:44.200 --> 0:34:46.710 going to lie. You know, and and it's okay. It's 0:34:46.719 --> 0:34:48.480 New Year, New me don't have to bring it up 0:34:48.489 --> 0:34:49.040 in the past. 0:34:49.050 --> 0:34:53.259 But it's certain things that you've experienced that will also 0:34:53.260 --> 0:34:56.270 shape you for who you are in the coming years, right? 0:34:56.280 --> 0:34:59.379 And honestly I am actually in a weird to step 0:34:59.380 --> 0:35:02.890 away right now thankful that I've been through some really 0:35:02.890 --> 0:35:07.250 down moments in my life and you see the real 0:35:07.250 --> 0:35:09.700 people that will stand by you and who are genuine 0:35:09.710 --> 0:35:12.779 and the clients who will back you up knowing who 0:35:12.780 --> 0:35:14.860 you are as a real authentic person 0:35:14.880 --> 0:35:16.980 Yes, I think 0:35:17.150 --> 0:35:20.060 as a business owner, So you tend to start to 0:35:20.060 --> 0:35:23.779 trust lesser people along the way, but you know, along 0:35:24.060 --> 0:35:26.820 that process you also start to realize, you know, like 0:35:26.830 --> 0:35:30.509 you have this support system with you, right? And for yourself, 0:35:30.510 --> 0:35:31.160 just curious like, you 0:35:31.160 --> 0:35:32.870 know, celebrity 0:35:32.870 --> 0:35:37.219 DJ, everyone wants to know, right? Like what's your, when 0:35:37.219 --> 0:35:40.509 you first got into this industry, you know, and you 0:35:40.510 --> 0:35:44.259 see your career rise and stuff, Everything everyone wants to know, like, 0:35:44.260 --> 0:35:46.730 you know, how do you deal with all this, like 0:35:46.739 --> 0:35:47.640 a self 0:35:47.739 --> 0:35:50.300 or will you be more more mindful that you have 0:35:50.300 --> 0:35:52.170 to portray yourself? You have to put yourself in a 0:35:52.170 --> 0:35:56.410 certain way, you know, social media, you know, persona, whenever 0:35:56.410 --> 0:35:58.670 I talk to you have to answer a certain way that, 0:35:58.680 --> 0:35:59.160 you 0:35:59.160 --> 0:36:02.780 know, the very real answer is that I didn't give 0:36:02.790 --> 0:36:06.030 a sh it at the time, and I still feel 0:36:06.040 --> 0:36:08.350 like social media should be an extension of you and 0:36:08.350 --> 0:36:11.279 not a completely different persona altogether. 0:36:11.590 --> 0:36:15.780 Um obviously I took some time to understand all this, right? 0:36:15.790 --> 0:36:17.930 Because when I just joined the industry, it was the 0:36:17.930 --> 0:36:21.710 beginning of instagram for example, like it started becoming very 0:36:21.710 --> 0:36:24.060 big in Singapore and at that point I was like, 0:36:24.070 --> 0:36:26.870 like I have to join another app, like what, you know, 0:36:26.880 --> 0:36:30.649 you're just like your groaning about it, right? But I 0:36:30.650 --> 0:36:33.160 don't regret it obviously because it has become such a 0:36:33.170 --> 0:36:35.320 big part of our career in our life, 0:36:35.520 --> 0:36:38.800 but you're right to ask whether, you know, I built 0:36:38.800 --> 0:36:40.690 some sort of a wall or some sort of 0:36:40.700 --> 0:36:41.669 facade 0:36:41.680 --> 0:36:46.330 that people only see that, but doing this podcast, even 0:36:46.330 --> 0:36:49.060 doing my own radio program or doing whatever it is 0:36:49.060 --> 0:36:50.600 on social media, I try to keep 0:36:50.830 --> 0:36:54.640 some of myself in it regardless, regardless of what the 0:36:54.640 --> 0:36:56.980 client wants. They may want something that's completely not you, 0:36:56.980 --> 0:36:59.320 but you still have to find a way to weave 0:36:59.320 --> 0:37:01.110 in a little bit of yourself and not lose yourself 0:37:01.110 --> 0:37:04.910 completely right. And I notice that in this journey, this 0:37:04.910 --> 0:37:07.830 very interesting journey in this industry, that is not for everyone. 0:37:07.840 --> 0:37:10.930 I've seen people come and go because they cannot kind 0:37:10.930 --> 0:37:13.430 of find that balance so they cannot handle that and 0:37:13.430 --> 0:37:14.820 that's completely fine as well, 0:37:14.969 --> 0:37:17.180 it's okay to do something and then in a few 0:37:17.180 --> 0:37:19.450 years you realize this isn't for me and move on 0:37:19.450 --> 0:37:22.390 to something else that will make you happier because eventually 0:37:22.390 --> 0:37:25.450 you want to make decisions for yourself, not just for 0:37:25.450 --> 0:37:27.770 everyone around you or for the sake of right? 0:37:27.780 --> 0:37:30.180 I don't agree. Like we all want to build a 0:37:30.180 --> 0:37:33.030 world that is more authentic, right? We all want to 0:37:33.030 --> 0:37:37.140 see that side of each other that is really, you know, 0:37:37.150 --> 0:37:40.010 our daily lives and you know, although of course brands 0:37:40.010 --> 0:37:41.750 look at our social media for like 0:37:41.900 --> 0:37:44.930 engagements and stuff, but we want them to recognize us 0:37:44.930 --> 0:37:47.520 for what we are right? You know, we don't want 0:37:47.520 --> 0:37:50.120 to suddenly do something that this is not really me. 0:37:50.120 --> 0:37:51.910 I'm not actually very funny, but I'm doing like, 0:37:53.000 --> 0:37:53.790 oh my 0:37:53.790 --> 0:37:56.300 God, one week to prepare for this, not what you 0:37:56.310 --> 0:38:00.359 want us to just be ourselves, right? Yeah. So I 0:38:00.370 --> 0:38:02.739 start to recognize that also, I always thought that, you know, 0:38:02.739 --> 0:38:02.950 something 0:38:02.960 --> 0:38:05.970 now, these have Tiktok and everything. Should I create like 0:38:05.969 --> 0:38:08.730 fitness content? That is very funny. Yeah. Is this the 0:38:08.730 --> 0:38:09.280 trend now? 0:38:09.290 --> 0:38:10.190 Like, what can I do? 0:38:10.200 --> 0:38:12.130 Because I'm not a very funny person, you know, and stuff. 0:38:12.130 --> 0:38:13.509 I take things quite seriously. I'm 0:38:13.510 --> 0:38:16.339 not, I'm not saying that you don't take things seriously? 0:38:16.340 --> 0:38:19.140 Clearly he does, but like you're a serious person. You 0:38:19.140 --> 0:38:21.140 don't feel like you're a funny person? I think 0:38:21.150 --> 0:38:22.940 my humor comes in another sense, 0:38:22.950 --> 0:38:23.950 which is fine. 0:38:24.030 --> 0:38:26.820 So what is your type of, you were like, I 0:38:26.830 --> 0:38:29.550 don't know, like you like sarcastic dark cuba like 0:38:29.560 --> 0:38:32.930 not even those kind of like maybe a more intimate setting? 0:38:32.930 --> 0:38:35.560 I don't even like to, I don't suddenly crack a 0:38:35.560 --> 0:38:38.760 joke out of nothing. It's just me. But then you 0:38:38.760 --> 0:38:40.610 say you have to portray this 0:38:40.770 --> 0:38:42.820 more slapstick, is it? That's totally 0:38:42.820 --> 0:38:45.089 and like, do I want to create content like that? 0:38:45.380 --> 0:38:48.950 You know, then I tried, you know, some friends and 0:38:48.950 --> 0:38:50.930 stuff they did with me. I was like, okay, that's cool, 0:38:50.940 --> 0:38:52.920 that's on his profile, that's cool, but do I want 0:38:52.920 --> 0:38:54.350 something like that, you know, like I felt that I 0:38:54.350 --> 0:38:57.270 wanted to do something more. Yeah. Yeah. So so like, 0:38:57.280 --> 0:39:00.080 you know, I tried to do some stuff that's really related, 0:39:00.090 --> 0:39:03.570 you know, in terms of like fitness, but it's more me. Yeah. Yeah, 0:39:03.580 --> 0:39:04.140 so 0:39:04.150 --> 0:39:06.640 it works, it works. If it doesn't then it doesn't right, 0:39:06.640 --> 0:39:08.480 It's not necessarily a point of failure, I'm 0:39:08.480 --> 0:39:09.060 not doing it. 0:39:09.070 --> 0:39:11.219 So that really want to get viral or anything like that. 0:39:11.219 --> 0:39:14.339 Just me and I just want to showcase this on me. Yeah. 0:39:14.340 --> 0:39:16.580 I think, you know, you brought up a good point 0:39:16.590 --> 0:39:21.530 like being going viral for example. I think that was 0:39:21.540 --> 0:39:24.529 a point where um it was very toxic for a 0:39:24.530 --> 0:39:26.670 lot of people, especially in our industry because we're so 0:39:26.670 --> 0:39:29.189 fixated on, we must make the next thing go viral. Okay, 0:39:29.190 --> 0:39:30.969 if not we didn't do our job or like we 0:39:30.969 --> 0:39:32.770 failed to do our job, you know, that kind of thing. 0:39:32.980 --> 0:39:35.610 And I realized that when we joined Tiktok, when we joined, 0:39:35.620 --> 0:39:38.010 when reels came about or like even when I g 0:39:38.010 --> 0:39:41.770 started getting more more prevalent in Singapore, right? If our 0:39:41.770 --> 0:39:43.870 photo doesn't get enough likes or what we're like, should 0:39:43.870 --> 0:39:44.460 I feel on this 0:39:44.460 --> 0:39:46.940 one now? Because the algorithm is better. 0:39:46.950 --> 0:39:50.840 Yeah, exactly. So, you know, it costs a lot of 0:39:50.840 --> 0:39:53.490 us to kind of spiral into that very dark space, 0:39:53.489 --> 0:39:57.290 which please do not spiral okay, it's not worth it. 0:39:57.350 --> 0:40:00.610 Yeah. I think you just create content that is, you 0:40:00.620 --> 0:40:02.589 have fun of it of course with friends and stuff, 0:40:02.590 --> 0:40:03.050 but 0:40:03.060 --> 0:40:05.270 it's easier said than done though. I think it's a 0:40:05.270 --> 0:40:06.530 journey to get there. 0:40:06.540 --> 0:40:09.140 I'm always exploring, like to me now, I'm just like 0:40:09.140 --> 0:40:10.930 trying to see what kind of future so called angles 0:40:10.930 --> 0:40:13.779 where to put this and that account photo, whatever. Then 0:40:13.930 --> 0:40:16.770 it's so tiring sometimes if I spend too much time 0:40:16.770 --> 0:40:17.259 on it 0:40:17.270 --> 0:40:20.160 before you wait, six hours went by 0:40:20.170 --> 0:40:22.549 and I was like, yeah, I see some other like 0:40:22.560 --> 0:40:25.460 influencers and stuff. My friends and stuff, they're very casual 0:40:25.460 --> 0:40:26.279 about it. Don't 0:40:26.280 --> 0:40:27.440 think too much, just 0:40:27.680 --> 0:40:31.410 like you're eating a buffet and you're filming yourself the 0:40:31.410 --> 0:40:35.279 next moment. It's like content is up shout out to 0:40:35.280 --> 0:40:36.450 Royce lee 0:40:37.230 --> 0:40:39.850 who doesn't take things too seriously, totally, 0:40:39.850 --> 0:40:43.620 totally. Yeah. And I think he just, by his actions, 0:40:43.620 --> 0:40:44.770 you teaches me all this. 0:40:44.800 --> 0:40:45.820 Okay, that's good. 0:40:45.820 --> 0:40:47.690 So I thought really quite cool, you know, a lot 0:40:47.690 --> 0:40:50.180 of people around me that they share and I understand 0:40:50.180 --> 0:40:52.860 that you select as a personality that's always 0:40:52.880 --> 0:40:57.040 pressure every day you're wasting about content, you know, everyone else. 0:40:57.080 --> 0:40:59.190 So you always want to, you know, do something you 0:40:59.190 --> 0:41:00.920 mean a friend first thing and let's do a Tiktok 0:41:00.920 --> 0:41:02.400 first sketches trend, 0:41:02.410 --> 0:41:05.730 but we have never said that by the way. Friends 0:41:05.730 --> 0:41:07.120 and my friends would kill me if I ever said 0:41:07.120 --> 0:41:08.500 that because not all of them are in 0:41:08.670 --> 0:41:11.100 the industry, we just want to chill out and catch 0:41:11.100 --> 0:41:14.029 up said that they'd be like, get out of here, 0:41:14.040 --> 0:41:14.470 that's the most 0:41:14.469 --> 0:41:17.960 important right to chill to like meet up bond and 0:41:17.960 --> 0:41:19.469 have like real conversations. 0:41:19.480 --> 0:41:23.190 So to conclude in just a short while would you 0:41:23.190 --> 0:41:25.219 say that the people around you 0:41:25.230 --> 0:41:28.720 really also shaped you and helped you develop like a 0:41:28.719 --> 0:41:33.040 more for example, healthier response to failure. Two goals to 0:41:33.040 --> 0:41:33.580 how you see. 0:41:33.910 --> 0:41:34.580 I think 0:41:34.580 --> 0:41:35.200 accesses your 0:41:35.200 --> 0:41:39.489 milestones. I like to really like surround myself with like 0:41:39.489 --> 0:41:44.640 minded people, positive people, you know, who understands you and 0:41:44.650 --> 0:41:47.490 who are not afraid to give you harsh feedback. Also 0:41:47.489 --> 0:41:49.710 if you need Yeah, I think these are people who 0:41:49.710 --> 0:41:51.210 really keep you grounded no matter 0:41:51.489 --> 0:41:54.350 you know how successful or how famous you get, you know, 0:41:54.350 --> 0:41:57.180 I think we all need this bunch of people. Yeah. 0:41:57.190 --> 0:42:01.260 And you know the day just focus on ourselves, right? 0:42:01.270 --> 0:42:05.920 Give our best and that everything else take place? No, 0:42:05.920 --> 0:42:07.969 no, I completely agree with you. I think that we 0:42:07.969 --> 0:42:11.420 are truly, you know, a reflection of the closest five 0:42:11.420 --> 0:42:14.810 or 10 people that we are with constantly and that 0:42:14.810 --> 0:42:17.509 also reflects on how we deal with things, be it 0:42:17.520 --> 0:42:20.950 success is how we celebrate them, be it, how we, 0:42:20.960 --> 0:42:23.000 you know, mark out our goals and how we handle 0:42:23.000 --> 0:42:26.799 failures or how we also deal with milestones in life. 0:42:26.810 --> 0:42:29.480 I think that is so important that we surround ourselves 0:42:29.580 --> 0:42:32.850 and don't be afraid to speak to people, you know, 0:42:32.860 --> 0:42:36.830 for support for help, anything. I think everyone's willing to learn. 0:42:36.830 --> 0:42:40.330 Everyone wants to help, right? Yeah. And everyone also wants 0:42:40.330 --> 0:42:42.370 to see each other be successful, right? 0:42:42.910 --> 0:42:43.779 Not 0:42:43.790 --> 0:42:46.550 everyone wants to see everyone successful, 0:42:46.560 --> 0:42:48.080 but that's one 0:42:48.080 --> 0:42:50.280 or two haters out there will probably be like, 0:42:50.360 --> 0:42:52.710 it's important to support 0:42:52.719 --> 0:42:54.370 those that matter to you. 0:42:54.500 --> 0:43:00.070 I completely agree. So to everyone, you know, like new year. 0:43:00.080 --> 0:43:03.960 Yeah. Yeah. But also like I would say, 0:43:03.960 --> 0:43:06.450 I would say New year improved me, 0:43:06.650 --> 0:43:11.469 improved me really? Like continuing what has from last year, 0:43:11.469 --> 0:43:14.479 you know, take the lessons that we learned, right? Yeah. 0:43:14.489 --> 0:43:17.240 And just absorb it really resonate inside, 0:43:17.550 --> 0:43:22.070 internalize it. Then take time slowly, you know, strive towards 0:43:22.070 --> 0:43:23.950 the next milestone. Yeah. I 0:43:23.950 --> 0:43:26.089 figured the trick is I don't actually set a New 0:43:26.090 --> 0:43:27.250 year's resolution 0:43:27.260 --> 0:43:28.190 actually. I don't, I 0:43:28.190 --> 0:43:30.399 don't, I don't, I don't know why I stopped doing 0:43:30.400 --> 0:43:31.440 it a long time ago 0:43:31.920 --> 0:43:34.330 because I realized I never achieve anything on that list. 0:43:34.340 --> 0:43:37.210 Like if I just go into the year with like 0:43:37.210 --> 0:43:40.710 a fresh, good, positive perspective and I look back and 0:43:40.710 --> 0:43:42.830 I'm like, wow, achieve so much. You look back and 0:43:42.830 --> 0:43:44.540 you're like, wow, like, right? You know, 0:43:44.540 --> 0:43:47.350 sometimes people ask me that I'm like, hmm, I'll try 0:43:47.350 --> 0:43:49.650 to say something, right? Yeah, I'll try to think about it, 0:43:49.650 --> 0:43:52.230 then I'll come with an answer. But this year's my 0:43:52.230 --> 0:43:54.880 answer is next year, maybe two more babies 0:43:54.890 --> 0:43:57.230 really is your wife watching this right now? 0:43:57.239 --> 0:43:58.290 She should watch this 0:43:58.320 --> 0:44:02.860 because I heard that one more baby. One more gym maybe. Yeah, 0:44:02.880 --> 0:44:05.219 so we try, we try so like this, but it's 0:44:05.219 --> 0:44:08.080 not something that you definitely want to make it happen 0:44:08.080 --> 0:44:09.049 and stuff. It's just like, 0:44:09.060 --> 0:44:11.060 it's like in your peripheral vision. But if it happens, 0:44:11.070 --> 0:44:11.420 you 0:44:11.430 --> 0:44:15.460 just go with the flow and for me that's that. 0:44:15.469 --> 0:44:15.810 All 0:44:15.810 --> 0:44:17.580 right, thank you so much for joining us on this 0:44:17.750 --> 0:44:18.580 for having me, everyone. 0:44:18.590 --> 0:44:21.250 You know, I'm so glad. We also saw a different 0:44:21.250 --> 0:44:23.450 side of you because on instagram, all I see is 0:44:23.450 --> 0:44:24.719 like 0:44:25.120 --> 0:44:25.370 two 0:44:25.370 --> 0:44:29.490 more reps and some of our mutual friends, you know, 0:44:29.489 --> 0:44:31.840 saying like, oh, I got totally like killed by Lucas 0:44:31.840 --> 0:44:34.339 today at the gym that like, oh man, this guy 0:44:34.340 --> 0:44:35.030 is savage. 0:44:35.140 --> 0:44:38.569 People will see that side of me. But then, you know, 0:44:38.580 --> 0:44:41.259 we spend one hour together, you know, we're only posting 0:44:41.260 --> 0:44:44.460 that moment up. But there's a lot more conversations, which 0:44:44.460 --> 0:44:45.740 I hold close to my heart. That's what I would 0:44:45.739 --> 0:44:47.860 like to be a trainer because I like I enjoy 0:44:47.860 --> 0:44:49.450 the conversations, the lesson I learned from 0:44:49.450 --> 0:44:50.169 connections, 0:44:50.180 --> 0:44:52.900 my clients teach me so many things, you know, they 0:44:52.900 --> 0:44:55.080 support me in this entire journey a deck 0:44:55.090 --> 0:44:55.670 as a trainer. 0:44:55.680 --> 0:44:58.580 Honestly, likewise, I feel the same way about our podcast. 0:44:58.580 --> 0:45:00.770 Like I learned so much from, well men obviously I 0:45:00.770 --> 0:45:02.250 always say they have a lot of explaining to do, 0:45:02.250 --> 0:45:04.670 but we learned so much from each other. Thank you 0:45:04.670 --> 0:45:07.210 so much for joining us here today and for not 0:45:07.219 --> 0:45:10.250 pressurizing me to go to the gym. Thank you so 0:45:10.250 --> 0:45:12.700 much for listening to this episode of Men explain if 0:45:12.700 --> 0:45:15.060 you enjoyed it, please hit the follow button. We are 0:45:15.060 --> 0:45:17.150 on Spotify and Apple podcast 0:45:17.160 --> 0:45:21.010 also follow its clarity dot code on instagram and Tiktok 0:45:21.010 --> 0:45:25.060 For more content like this, See you next episode. Bye!