Speaker 1: You're listening to AC N A podcast.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Climate Conversations. I'm your host, Julie Yu.
Speaker 1: For many of us, coffee is essential. It jumpstarts our
Speaker 1: mornings and keeps us going throughout the day. In fact,
Speaker 1: more than 60% of Singaporeans begin their day with coffee.
Speaker 1: But have you ever stopped to think about the future
Speaker 1: of this beloved beverage as climate change accelerates, global warming
Speaker 1: is making rainfall patterns erratic and intensifying droughts. Growing coffee
Speaker 1: beans is becoming more and more challenging. Even the former
Speaker 1: CEO of Starbucks, Howard Schultz has acknowledged that climate change
Speaker 1: is going to play a bigger role in affecting the
Speaker 1: quality and integrity of coffee.
Speaker 1: In the first part of our sustainability chiefs episode, we'll
Speaker 1: explore how Starbucks is adapting to this new normal, working
Speaker 1: to reduce its environmental footprint and responding to the growing
Speaker 1: demands of conscious consumers. Joining us today is the Chief
Speaker 1: Sustainability Officer of Starbucks, Michael Kori.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the climate conversations, Michael. Just curious before we start,
Speaker 1: what Starbucks drink did you have this morning to kick
Speaker 1: start your day? You know, this morning, I just had
Speaker 1: a brewed coffee. That's what I usually drink. French Press
Speaker 1: I think I had uh Costa Rica. Excellent choice. All right.
Speaker 1: So let's take you back to 2020. When you started
Speaker 1: your journey with Starbucks, you made a significant career move
Speaker 1: from levi's where you have been the head of sustainability
Speaker 1: for over two decades.
Speaker 1: So what inspired you to take up this role? Well,
Speaker 1: I would say Julie that I'm actually inspired by things
Speaker 1: that happened to me when I was young when I
Speaker 1: was in high school, I was very inspired by a
Speaker 1: biology teacher who helped found our high school recycling club
Speaker 1: called Student Action for the Environment. So I was involved
Speaker 1: in recycling way back when I was a kid and
Speaker 1: I actually went to Asia when I was younger as
Speaker 1: well and spent a number of years at a place
Speaker 1: called the Asia Foundation doing International Development
Speaker 1: work, lived in Bangladesh, lived in Thailand for a number
Speaker 1: of years. And then after graduate school, I joined Levi
Speaker 1: Strauss and company. That was about the time when there
Speaker 1: were a lot of concerns around working conditions in factories
Speaker 1: in Asia, in the apparel sector. And they got involved
Speaker 1: in labor standards in the factories. And then after a
Speaker 1: few years, the company asked me to take on environmental
Speaker 1: work and it was back to what I had experienced
Speaker 1: when I was younger
Speaker 1: and I had a passion for it and got very
Speaker 1: involved in some of the environmental programs at Levi's. And
Speaker 1: it's really about making the world a better place. We
Speaker 1: have big challenges around the environment and climate and we
Speaker 1: need to do something. This generation needs to do something. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I took a look at your open letter that you
Speaker 1: sent out to your staff that year that you joined
Speaker 1: Starbucks, you set firm goals to cut the company's carbon,
Speaker 1: water and waste footprints in half by 2030. I mean,
Speaker 1: these are ambitious initiatives. So Michael, what gave you the
Speaker 1: confidence to set this sustainability vision for the company? Well,
Speaker 1: I will say when I joined Starbucks, the then CEO
Speaker 1: made these announcements saying
Speaker 1: it's very important for us as a company to be
Speaker 1: resource positive to give back more than we take from
Speaker 1: the planet's resources. And that's really our animating vision for
Speaker 1: the work that we're doing. And then
Speaker 1: we said, look, it's great to have a vision. We
Speaker 1: also need to have targets. And so that's when we
Speaker 1: set those carbon water and waste targets to reduce our
Speaker 1: footprint in each of those areas by 50% by 2030.
Speaker 1: And it's been three years since the announcement. How is
Speaker 1: the progress coming along? One of the things that we
Speaker 1: have been doing is really focusing on coffee,
Speaker 1: sustainable cups, reusable cups and our greener stores. So I'll
Speaker 1: start in reverse order by saying that we've now reached
Speaker 1: 3500 of our greener stores certified all around the world.
Speaker 1: Our goal is 10,000 by 2025. So we're making very
Speaker 1: good progress towards that. In terms of our cups, we
Speaker 1: have literally done 21 market tests all around the world
Speaker 1: in different markets including markets in Asia,
Speaker 1: South Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore. Looking at what are the
Speaker 1: best incentives to get more reusable cup usage, including testing
Speaker 1: with other companies. We've been doing existing cups, we've been
Speaker 1: doing light weighting and more
Speaker 1: cycle content in the hot cups that we're currently offering.
Speaker 1: And in coffee, we have now gotten up to 70
Speaker 1: million coffee trees that we have donated to coffee farmers
Speaker 1: all around the world. Towards our goal of 100 million
Speaker 1: coffee trees.
Speaker 1: There are climate resistant coffee trees I should add. And
Speaker 1: we've also introduced 3500 wet mills that use up to 80%
Speaker 1: less water in our coffee producing countries around the world
Speaker 1: and achieving these goals in less than what 10 years
Speaker 1: come with. I'm sure its share of challenges. What were
Speaker 1: some of the key risks you and
Speaker 1: anticipate it? Well, I think one of the biggest things
Speaker 1: that we needed to do with the company is change
Speaker 1: people's mindset. Like most companies, we tend to think in
Speaker 1: three year, four year terms, that's generally company's strategic planning horizon.
Speaker 1: As I think you're well aware and to get our leaders,
Speaker 1: our partners, our employees
Speaker 1: to think in a 10 year vision of what might
Speaker 1: be possible is really one of the biggest opportunities that
Speaker 1: we had and so spent the first couple of years
Speaker 1: talking to people showing them the data, showing them what
Speaker 1: others were doing and really trying to inspire people that
Speaker 1: these visions are
Speaker 1: achievable and we must achieve them in order for us
Speaker 1: to do our part to address these big issues like
Speaker 1: the climate crisis that the world is facing. What was
Speaker 1: the initial reaction within the company then? And has it
Speaker 1: changed much? Now, Starbucks has always been throughout our 51
Speaker 1: year history,
Speaker 1: we've always had a focus on sustainability and in the
Speaker 1: early days, it was a focus on sustainable coffee because
Speaker 1: obviously that is our core product. And so we developed
Speaker 1: something called our coffee and farmer Equity program to make
Speaker 1: sure that the coffee that we were serving was sustainable.
Speaker 1: And we worked with a big environmental organization, Conservation International
Speaker 1: to set up this program
Speaker 1: to support not only farmers income and social conditions of
Speaker 1: the communities where we're sourcing coffee, but also the environmental
Speaker 1: standards of how they were growing the coffee in more
Speaker 1: sustainable ways and also the quality of the coffee. So
Speaker 1: we've been working with farmers, literally, it's 400,000 smallholder farmers
Speaker 1: all around the world. Many countries in Asia like
Speaker 1: Indonesia, China, Vietnam to support them and really train them.
Speaker 1: We've set up what we call farmer support centers, 10
Speaker 1: of them all around the world to support farmers figure
Speaker 1: out how to grow coffee more sustainably for those of
Speaker 1: us who are not familiar with coffee production itself? What
Speaker 1: are the major contributors to carbon emissions? And how is
Speaker 1: Starbucks working towards decarbonizing a cup of coffee?
Speaker 1: So when we work with farmers, we support the farmers
Speaker 1: by not only teaching them more sustainable agricultural techniques like
Speaker 1: what is known as regenerative agriculture. So to plow your
Speaker 1: fields less to use more composting natural fertilizers. But the
Speaker 1: other thing that I'm not sure most people realize that
Speaker 1: when they're drinking their morning cup of coffee because of
Speaker 1: the climate
Speaker 1: crisis, the land area that is available to grow coffee
Speaker 1: all around the world will be reduced 50% by 2050.
Speaker 1: So coffee grows in the tropics in a narrow band
Speaker 1: up on the mountain, it requires those conditions and because
Speaker 1: of climate change, because of the temperature of the earth
Speaker 1: going up, the area available to grow coffee will decline
Speaker 1: by half. And so one of the things that we
Speaker 1: are doing in our farmer support centers
Speaker 1: and in our coffee farm that we actually own in
Speaker 1: Costa Rica is we're developing new varieties of coffee that
Speaker 1: are resistant to the impacts of climate change. It usually
Speaker 1: takes four years for a coffee plant to mature and
Speaker 1: bear fruit. These plants, these trees that we're developing can
Speaker 1: mature in about half the time.
Speaker 1: So not only are we developing these more, what you
Speaker 1: could call climate resistant coffee trees for our farmers, we
Speaker 1: are actually giving them to the farmers. Our commitment is
Speaker 1: to donate 100 million of these more sustainable coffee trees
Speaker 1: to farmers all around the world. And as of this year,
Speaker 1: we've hit 70 million more climate resistant trees that we're
Speaker 1: actually providing to coffee. Farmers.
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Speaker 1: So let's delve into starbucks' iconic disposable cups. Your aim
Speaker 1: is to eliminate them by 2030. Tell us more about that.
Speaker 1: Overhaul cups is the vessel with which we serve the
Speaker 1: coffee in. And so we've said we need to eliminate
Speaker 1: that waste the single use cup. And there are three
Speaker 1: different approaches that we're taking to do this one is
Speaker 1: that when you go to a Starbucks store and you're
Speaker 1: gonna order your cup of coffee and stay there in
Speaker 1: the cafe to
Speaker 1: drink it, we are offering it in ceramic cup. So
Speaker 1: that's becoming our default. We used to it a long time.
Speaker 1: But now we're coming back to it to be more sustainable.
Speaker 1: The second option is we were encouraging customers throughout Asia
Speaker 1: to bring their own what we call personal cup. So
Speaker 1: here's mine. I take this everywhere I go, it's one
Speaker 1: they got in Pike Place Market, which was our first
Speaker 1: Starbucks store for Pike Place Market in Seattle. So I
Speaker 1: take this and we will fill
Speaker 1: this so that eliminates the use of the disposable cup.
Speaker 1: And the last option is what we're calling our borrow
Speaker 1: a cup system. So if a customer comes in to
Speaker 1: a cafe and that they're gonna take their coffee away
Speaker 1: or take it to go, then we've developed this test
Speaker 1: reusable cup that they can take their beverage away and
Speaker 1: then we have return kiosk in our stores where they
Speaker 1: can come scan it, then return it and then we'll wash,
Speaker 1: sterilize it and
Speaker 1: use it again. And so throughout Asia, we are doing
Speaker 1: pilots in a number of countries, about 600 stores. We're
Speaker 1: also testing these programs in Singapore, South Korea, Hong Kong.
Speaker 1: Really trying to figure out how do we support our
Speaker 1: customers to be more?
Speaker 1: Has it gained traction? It is gaining traction. You know,
Speaker 1: one of the things we're seeing is customers love the
Speaker 1: reusable cup, the borrow a cup and they are collecting
Speaker 1: them and then returning them to the kiosk like they'll
Speaker 1: collect them all over the week and then Monday morning
Speaker 1: they'll come in and they're scanning the cup and putting
Speaker 1: it back in.
Speaker 1: We're seeing that the customers as well as our store partners,
Speaker 1: the baristas, they like it because we're making a difference.
Speaker 1: That's great to know. But I also wonder, do these
Speaker 1: initiatives come with an added cost for Starbucks? I mean,
Speaker 1: we've been testing all types of different incentives to get
Speaker 1: our customers to bring their reusable cups or testing all
Speaker 1: kinds of incentives to
Speaker 1: bring back, return the borrow a cup. So right now,
Speaker 1: we're experimenting with what is the best incentive to get
Speaker 1: customers because we're trying to change people's behavior. It isn't
Speaker 1: always easy to do that. So we're testing a lot
Speaker 1: of different things. In fact, over the past 18 months,
Speaker 1: we have conducted 21 tests in markets all around the world.
Speaker 1: And what we're seeing is, of course, every market is different.
Speaker 1: And so we have to have a different combination of
Speaker 1: incentives or disincentives or other programs. And I also understand
Speaker 1: that beyond the cups, Starbucks is building more green stores worldwide.
Speaker 1: Could you describe how these differ from others and what
Speaker 1: impact are they expected to have? Our greener stores is
Speaker 1: a terrific concept and a program that we started roughly
Speaker 1: about 10 years ago. We were one of the world's
Speaker 1: largest region
Speaker 1: tailor of what we call lead. Certified stores, stands for
Speaker 1: leadership and environmental design and these are stores that are
Speaker 1: certified to be built more sustainably. We also want to
Speaker 1: make sure we operate it more sustainably and use less
Speaker 1: water and do recycling in the store. And so we
Speaker 1: came up, we developed this greener stores program with World
Speaker 1: Wildlife Fund and we have
Speaker 1: now globally certified 3500 of our stores to be greener stores.
Speaker 1: We have just begun the program this year in a
Speaker 1: number of markets in Asia, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam, India, Malaysia, Philippines.
Speaker 1: Our target is 10,000 of our stores worldwide by 2025.
Speaker 1: And ultimately, the vision here just like with the cups
Speaker 1: is to go all in on sustainability so that every
Speaker 1: new store we build is built to our greener store specifications. Ok,
Speaker 1: Michael Starbucks has met obviously some goals in the past
Speaker 1: but also has a history of
Speaker 1: or even scrapping its sustainability goals. What are you doing
Speaker 1: to ensure that all those goals are met by 2030? Well,
Speaker 1: one of the things that we do every year is
Speaker 1: we report on our progress, year to year. So that's
Speaker 1: one thing that's happening that we are doing and we've
Speaker 1: been very transparent about that and the progress that we're making.
Speaker 1: And the other thing that we are doing is I
Speaker 1: would encourage you to look at our report and look
Speaker 1: at
Speaker 1: the progress that we are making because I am very
Speaker 1: confident that with the partners that we have now and
Speaker 1: the leadership that we have now and the focus that
Speaker 1: the world has on sustainability,
Speaker 1: we are going to meet these commitments for those who
Speaker 1: remain skeptical about the possibility of coffee sustainability in an
Speaker 1: industry that largely reliant on plastic cups and a paper
Speaker 1: filters and deforestation. What would you say to them? Well,
Speaker 1: I would say number one, our vision long term is
Speaker 1: to go to reusable cups. Ok. That's our long term vision.
Speaker 1: And again, we're testing all different ways
Speaker 1: to get there in the near term. What we're doing
Speaker 1: is taking our existing cups and making them more sustainable.
Speaker 1: So this past year, we are converting all of our
Speaker 1: paper cups. Our existing paper cups are now 30% post
Speaker 1: consumer recycled content and their forest stewardship council certified as
Speaker 1: not coming from old growth forests. So more sustainable timber
Speaker 1: and we're lightweight them, which means we're using fewer materials
Speaker 1: to make the cup. So we're consuming fewer trees in
Speaker 1: the end. So we're taking steps right now to make
Speaker 1: the existing cup more sustainable as the CSO one of
Speaker 1: the world's largest companies. Do you ever feel pressured to
Speaker 1: lead a sustainable lifestyle yourself? Absolutely. And one has to
Speaker 1: walk the talk. Of course,
Speaker 1: in our home, we've done all our insulation. So we
Speaker 1: use less energy and just personally, lifestyle wise, I have
Speaker 1: taken to public transportation using my vehicle a lot less.
Speaker 1: And in my eating habits, I have pretty much cut
Speaker 1: out meat. I try to choose more plant based alternatives
Speaker 1: and what I'm putting in my body.
Speaker 1: So just a few things there to try and be
Speaker 1: more sustainable. Ok, Michael, thank you very much for joining
Speaker 1: me in discussing sustainability both on a corporate and personal level.
Speaker 1: And we look forward to seeing the positive impact your
Speaker 1: leadership will have not only within Starbucks but also in
Speaker 1: the broader sustainability movement. Thank you again for your time, Julia.
Speaker 1: Thank you. It's been a pleasure to speak with you.
Speaker 1: Well, thanks to my guests and thanks to everyone for
Speaker 1: tuning in. I hope you enjoyed this episode and do
Speaker 1: remember to like and subscribe to this podcast. So, you know,
Speaker 1: when the new episode drops, leave us a message on
Speaker 1: Spotify or Apple podcast to let us know what you
Speaker 1: think the team behind this podcast is Cy and Nguyen,
Speaker 1: Jacqueline Chen, Joanne Chen Tiffany Yang, Cristina Robert and Nam
Speaker 1: Julie Yu signing off.