1 00:00:03,410 --> 00:00:07,820 Speaker 1: You're listening to AC N A podcast. Hello, it's Theresa Tang. 2 00:00:07,829 --> 00:00:10,550 Speaker 1: The CN A correspondent team will be taking a break 3 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:12,670 Speaker 1: for a few weeks in December, but we will be 4 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:16,628 Speaker 1: back in January 2025. We're also putting together a special 5 00:00:16,639 --> 00:00:20,309 Speaker 1: Asian tsunami anniversary episode which will be coming out soon. 6 00:00:20,319 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 1: You don't want to miss that. In the meantime, we're 7 00:00:22,250 --> 00:00:25,149 Speaker 1: bringing back some of the more memorable episodes from this 8 00:00:25,159 --> 00:00:27,659 Speaker 1: year just in case you've missed them. Have a listen 9 00:00:27,670 --> 00:00:28,270 Speaker 1: and enjoy. 10 00:00:30,829 --> 00:00:33,290 Speaker 1: What would you risk for a chance at a better 11 00:00:33,299 --> 00:00:44,220 Speaker 1: life for some? The answer is everything and I'm Teresa Tang. 12 00:00:44,279 --> 00:00:46,560 Speaker 1: And in this episode, you might hear things you've never 13 00:00:46,569 --> 00:00:49,869 Speaker 1: heard before about what it's like being a migrant. It 14 00:00:49,950 --> 00:00:52,810 Speaker 1: need to be a T shirt, a shirt, 15 00:00:53,555 --> 00:00:59,834 Speaker 1: no jackets, no hoodies, sweatshirts, cardigans, nothing. Last year, 2.5 16 00:00:59,845 --> 00:01:03,474 Speaker 1: million migrants entered the United States illegally via its southern 17 00:01:03,485 --> 00:01:13,393 Speaker 1: border with Mexico. Nearly 40,000 of them from China. Why 18 00:01:13,404 --> 00:01:16,175 Speaker 1: are these people so desperate for the American dream? 19 00:01:16,510 --> 00:01:20,000 Speaker 1: Weu joins me today in her new documentary, walk the line. 20 00:01:20,029 --> 00:01:23,449 Speaker 1: She traces the same path thousands of Chinese citizens take 21 00:01:23,459 --> 00:01:26,289 Speaker 1: to get to America. You want to listen to this? 22 00:01:28,889 --> 00:01:32,039 Speaker 1: We, hi. Hi, good morning to you, Teresa. You know, 23 00:01:32,050 --> 00:01:34,989 Speaker 1: I honestly don't know where to begin with this. This 24 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:37,819 Speaker 1: dog took you on the road for seven weeks and 25 00:01:37,830 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 1: you covered a topic that strikes at the core of 26 00:01:40,169 --> 00:01:42,699 Speaker 1: who we all are. Even if you haven't migrated yourself, 27 00:01:42,709 --> 00:01:46,629 Speaker 1: we really all share the universal desire for opportunities for 28 00:01:46,639 --> 00:01:50,410 Speaker 1: ourselves and for our Children. What inspired this exploration? Can 29 00:01:50,419 --> 00:01:52,660 Speaker 1: you tell me what makes it different from other stories 30 00:01:52,669 --> 00:01:53,230 Speaker 1: of migration? 31 00:01:53,307 --> 00:01:55,867 Speaker 1: I think you just hit the nail on the head there. 32 00:01:55,877 --> 00:01:59,428 Speaker 1: It's really about the universal desire that we see in 33 00:01:59,438 --> 00:02:02,697 Speaker 1: all of us. Often documentaries that are made about people 34 00:02:02,708 --> 00:02:07,847 Speaker 1: in relatively extreme conditions, situations as these migrants who were 35 00:02:07,858 --> 00:02:10,056 Speaker 1: when they were trying to get to America. And as 36 00:02:10,067 --> 00:02:12,977 Speaker 1: you said, there's several documentaries and news reports that have 37 00:02:12,988 --> 00:02:16,286 Speaker 1: been made about these Chinese migrants. They often wait for 38 00:02:16,298 --> 00:02:17,638 Speaker 1: them on the US border. 39 00:02:17,725 --> 00:02:21,386 Speaker 1: They shout questions at them when they come across often. 40 00:02:21,395 --> 00:02:23,535 Speaker 1: What you see is when asked about why are you 41 00:02:23,546 --> 00:02:26,766 Speaker 1: coming to America? They would say freedom and democracy. There's 42 00:02:26,776 --> 00:02:29,106 Speaker 1: nothing wrong with that. And there's a lot of truth 43 00:02:29,115 --> 00:02:34,065 Speaker 1: to that. But in our experience of making documentaries about migrants, 44 00:02:34,076 --> 00:02:37,166 Speaker 1: it's a lot more complex than that. People just don't 45 00:02:37,175 --> 00:02:40,585 Speaker 1: do this for a single reason. It really helps that 46 00:02:40,595 --> 00:02:42,065 Speaker 1: you see these people 47 00:02:42,143 --> 00:02:44,953 Speaker 1: as a people, as your friends, as your family. As people, 48 00:02:44,964 --> 00:02:48,843 Speaker 1: you could relate to, you understand their motivations. And in 49 00:02:48,854 --> 00:02:51,524 Speaker 1: this case, as you were saying, you understand why they 50 00:02:51,532 --> 00:02:55,964 Speaker 1: want better opportunities for themselves and for their Children, that's 51 00:02:55,973 --> 00:02:59,002 Speaker 1: really what set us apart. We made a documentary that's 52 00:02:59,014 --> 00:03:03,483 Speaker 1: about the intimate experience of being a migrant on the road, 53 00:03:03,494 --> 00:03:06,373 Speaker 1: being subject to a lot of violence and danger. 54 00:03:06,561 --> 00:03:09,542 Speaker 1: Hope that in the end, people see them as people 55 00:03:09,552 --> 00:03:12,621 Speaker 1: they could relate to, they could see in their real lives. 56 00:03:12,632 --> 00:03:14,442 Speaker 1: And I want to give you an example. So you 57 00:03:14,451 --> 00:03:18,401 Speaker 1: must have seen this scene of these Chinese migrants in 58 00:03:18,412 --> 00:03:20,462 Speaker 1: the desert and they've been there for a few days. 59 00:03:20,472 --> 00:03:23,821 Speaker 1: And eventually when us border patrol came to arrest them, 60 00:03:24,121 --> 00:03:26,792 Speaker 1: they were taken into detention and in detention, there are 61 00:03:26,802 --> 00:03:29,431 Speaker 1: certain rules that you cannot have shoelaces, you can only 62 00:03:29,442 --> 00:03:30,900 Speaker 1: have one layer of clothing 63 00:03:31,130 --> 00:03:33,720 Speaker 1: and you cannot have anything that you could potentially use 64 00:03:33,729 --> 00:03:36,759 Speaker 1: to harm yourself or other people. So the border patrol 65 00:03:36,770 --> 00:03:39,770 Speaker 1: officers will have to give them a pat down. And 66 00:03:39,779 --> 00:03:42,509 Speaker 1: then because of the workload, you put sense that they 67 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,270 Speaker 1: were doing it quite roughly. And I just remember when 68 00:03:45,279 --> 00:03:47,470 Speaker 1: I was on a scene, I was watching that I 69 00:03:47,479 --> 00:03:50,050 Speaker 1: saw this man, he must have been about my dad's 70 00:03:50,059 --> 00:03:50,589 Speaker 1: age 71 00:03:51,039 --> 00:03:53,470 Speaker 1: and he was totally calm. They took off all his 72 00:03:53,479 --> 00:03:57,460 Speaker 1: clothes then put on a jacket. And as that was happening, 73 00:03:57,470 --> 00:04:00,380 Speaker 1: I I actually started crying, it suddenly occurred to me 74 00:04:00,389 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 1: that they would have families too. What would have to 75 00:04:03,889 --> 00:04:08,130 Speaker 1: happen for someone to go through that experience and enduring 76 00:04:08,139 --> 00:04:11,949 Speaker 1: gladly was something that got me very emotional. And that's 77 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:15,429 Speaker 1: certainly the type of the emotions we were trying to 78 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:18,750 Speaker 1: evoke in our viewers too. Yeah, I got teary so 79 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:20,619 Speaker 1: many times during your doc and 80 00:04:20,850 --> 00:04:22,808 Speaker 1: I want to talk about the emotional side of it 81 00:04:22,820 --> 00:04:25,529 Speaker 1: and its toll on you later on. But I was 82 00:04:25,540 --> 00:04:28,609 Speaker 1: looking at your Instagram, you posted snippets of your doc 83 00:04:28,769 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 1: and I was reading the comments, there was one guy 84 00:04:31,329 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 1: Gerald he posted and he said, look, I don't understand 85 00:04:35,649 --> 00:04:37,570 Speaker 1: China is not a bad place to be, you know, 86 00:04:37,579 --> 00:04:40,579 Speaker 1: is life really so terrible there that people would just 87 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:43,250 Speaker 1: put their lives at risk to go to America. How 88 00:04:43,260 --> 00:04:45,799 Speaker 1: would you answer him? Yeah, that's a very good question. 89 00:04:45,809 --> 00:04:46,950 Speaker 1: And that's the question 90 00:04:47,045 --> 00:04:49,936 Speaker 1: and people ask, and that actually really is the question 91 00:04:49,946 --> 00:04:53,506 Speaker 1: that prompted us to do this documentary. I grew up 92 00:04:53,515 --> 00:04:56,065 Speaker 1: in China. So this is a country and a people 93 00:04:56,075 --> 00:04:59,575 Speaker 1: I'm very familiar with. And I just remember growing up, 94 00:04:59,585 --> 00:05:03,566 Speaker 1: it is such an aspirational country that's doing better all 95 00:05:03,575 --> 00:05:05,765 Speaker 1: the time in a sense that you could really couldn't 96 00:05:05,776 --> 00:05:09,365 Speaker 1: foresee how good your life will be in 10 years time. 97 00:05:09,376 --> 00:05:11,925 Speaker 1: So that's the China I'm used to. It is an 98 00:05:11,936 --> 00:05:13,096 Speaker 1: immensely proud 99 00:05:13,242 --> 00:05:17,851 Speaker 1: the population as well. What really, to me marked a 100 00:05:17,861 --> 00:05:22,690 Speaker 1: turning point was the pandemic and the zero COVID policy. 101 00:05:22,701 --> 00:05:25,541 Speaker 1: What happened in the process is that it destroyed a 102 00:05:25,552 --> 00:05:29,101 Speaker 1: lot of small business people. They've lost everything they built 103 00:05:29,111 --> 00:05:32,752 Speaker 1: over the past 1020 years and they just do not 104 00:05:32,761 --> 00:05:36,111 Speaker 1: have the confidence to start over. And the majority of 105 00:05:36,122 --> 00:05:38,721 Speaker 1: the people we encounter on the road are this type 106 00:05:38,731 --> 00:05:39,302 Speaker 1: of people. 107 00:05:39,589 --> 00:05:43,209 Speaker 1: But also on top of that, what zero COVID changed 108 00:05:43,220 --> 00:05:48,369 Speaker 1: about China was the fact that there's no more visibility 109 00:05:48,428 --> 00:05:50,940 Speaker 1: that the future will be better. In the past, the 110 00:05:50,950 --> 00:05:54,308 Speaker 1: Chinese people could very confidently say of course, in 510 111 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:56,309 Speaker 1: years time, my life will be better. Of course, my 112 00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:58,209 Speaker 1: children's life will be much better 113 00:05:58,428 --> 00:06:01,209 Speaker 1: than I am. But because of that set back, there 114 00:06:01,220 --> 00:06:04,910 Speaker 1: is a severe loss of confidence and that is really 115 00:06:04,928 --> 00:06:07,649 Speaker 1: the marginal change here, right? That's prompting a lot of 116 00:06:07,660 --> 00:06:10,980 Speaker 1: people to do this. Listen to what the Chinese migrants 117 00:06:10,988 --> 00:06:12,409 Speaker 1: actually said to us. 118 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,679 Speaker 1: Three years of the pandemic lockdown ruined everything for us. 119 00:06:17,690 --> 00:06:21,539 Speaker 1: I used to have my own business but lost $28,000. 120 00:06:21,549 --> 00:06:24,250 Speaker 1: In two years. I had to sell my apartment. I 121 00:06:24,260 --> 00:06:26,510 Speaker 1: didn't even get to live in it. I have two 122 00:06:26,519 --> 00:06:34,500 Speaker 1: kids to raise. I had a small leather factory. In 123 00:06:34,540 --> 00:06:34,989 Speaker 1: the last 124 00:06:35,274 --> 00:06:40,993 Speaker 1: years, we lost $125,000. There is no future. Before I 125 00:06:41,005 --> 00:06:44,303 Speaker 1: lose all my money, I must get out of China 126 00:06:46,984 --> 00:06:49,755 Speaker 1: in China. It's almost impossible to find a job at 127 00:06:49,765 --> 00:06:54,024 Speaker 1: my age. I'm 56 in the US age doesn't matter 128 00:06:54,035 --> 00:06:55,665 Speaker 1: as long as you are willing to work. 129 00:06:57,890 --> 00:07:01,260 Speaker 1: Ecuador is a key location on this journey to America 130 00:07:01,269 --> 00:07:03,570 Speaker 1: way and it's not really a country. Many Chinese know 131 00:07:03,579 --> 00:07:05,919 Speaker 1: about one of the many things I learned from your 132 00:07:05,928 --> 00:07:09,660 Speaker 1: doc is Ecuador is actually the closest country to the 133 00:07:09,670 --> 00:07:13,950 Speaker 1: US that allows Chinese passport holders entry without a visa. 134 00:07:14,250 --> 00:07:17,579 Speaker 1: So these migrants land there, what happens to them next, 135 00:07:17,589 --> 00:07:21,230 Speaker 1: Ecuador strangely seems to have a visa free policy for 136 00:07:21,239 --> 00:07:24,059 Speaker 1: the entire world. That's why it is actually the first 137 00:07:24,070 --> 00:07:26,709 Speaker 1: stop for a lot of the migrants, not just the 138 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,549 Speaker 1: Chinese ones, the Indian migrants, African migrants often their journey 139 00:07:30,559 --> 00:07:33,709 Speaker 1: starts in Ecuador as well. And from Ecuador, what they 140 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:37,510 Speaker 1: need to do is to get into Colombia illegally. And 141 00:07:37,519 --> 00:07:38,670 Speaker 1: then from Colombia, 142 00:07:38,945 --> 00:07:41,225 Speaker 1: that's the last country they will be in in South 143 00:07:41,234 --> 00:07:45,815 Speaker 1: America to try to get into what's geographically considered in 144 00:07:45,825 --> 00:07:49,075 Speaker 1: North America. So the first country will be Panama. And 145 00:07:49,084 --> 00:07:52,315 Speaker 1: then after Panama, they were the Central American states, I 146 00:07:52,325 --> 00:07:54,255 Speaker 1: might not be able to recall all of them, but 147 00:07:54,265 --> 00:07:58,545 Speaker 1: I think it's Costa Rica, Nicaragua, Honduras, Guatemala. Uh yes, 148 00:07:58,554 --> 00:08:01,804 Speaker 1: I'm still one short and then from there, they get 149 00:08:01,815 --> 00:08:03,174 Speaker 1: into Mexico and from 150 00:08:03,260 --> 00:08:06,839 Speaker 1: Mexico, they sort of step by step have pushed towards 151 00:08:06,850 --> 00:08:09,850 Speaker 1: the US border. Now the US has a very long 152 00:08:09,859 --> 00:08:14,130 Speaker 1: border with Mexico. It's more than 3000 kilometers. There are 153 00:08:14,140 --> 00:08:17,350 Speaker 1: different states and people enter in the past there has 154 00:08:17,359 --> 00:08:21,429 Speaker 1: been Arizona, Texas, but these states have been red states 155 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:25,268 Speaker 1: that they've started cracking down on illegal migration. So as 156 00:08:25,279 --> 00:08:27,359 Speaker 1: we were on a trip, most of the migrants that 157 00:08:27,369 --> 00:08:27,679 Speaker 1: have 158 00:08:28,045 --> 00:08:32,424 Speaker 1: to enter through California and the Darien Gap, it is 159 00:08:32,434 --> 00:08:35,294 Speaker 1: the most dangerous portion of this migrant journey on paper. 160 00:08:35,304 --> 00:08:38,494 Speaker 1: At least it lies on the border between Panama and Colombia. 161 00:08:38,505 --> 00:08:43,344 Speaker 1: It's remote, it's roadless. There's dense jungle, very difficult terrain, 162 00:08:43,354 --> 00:08:46,265 Speaker 1: wild animals and violent criminal gangs. It doesn't sound like 163 00:08:46,275 --> 00:08:50,744 Speaker 1: a very nice place. How challenging is this stretch for 164 00:08:50,755 --> 00:08:52,145 Speaker 1: the migrants that you followed? 165 00:08:52,489 --> 00:08:55,789 Speaker 1: The Dairy and Gap is really an interesting. It's something 166 00:08:55,799 --> 00:08:58,909 Speaker 1: I didn't know about before I started looking into this. 167 00:08:58,919 --> 00:09:01,978 Speaker 1: And the only reason you cannot drive from North America 168 00:09:01,989 --> 00:09:04,440 Speaker 1: into South America is because of the Dairy and Gap. 169 00:09:04,450 --> 00:09:06,809 Speaker 1: The jungle is so dense that till this day they 170 00:09:06,820 --> 00:09:10,718 Speaker 1: didn't build any roads. So in the past when the 171 00:09:10,729 --> 00:09:12,429 Speaker 1: route was mostly travel by 172 00:09:12,572 --> 00:09:14,963 Speaker 1: South American migrants, they have to walk on foot for 173 00:09:14,973 --> 00:09:18,872 Speaker 1: up to seven days. There are several documentaries about that 174 00:09:18,881 --> 00:09:21,862 Speaker 1: because it has no roads, you have no supplies, you 175 00:09:21,872 --> 00:09:25,283 Speaker 1: have to carry everything on your back, your Children, your backpack, 176 00:09:25,293 --> 00:09:28,833 Speaker 1: all the water you need to drink along the journey. Naturally. 177 00:09:28,843 --> 00:09:32,473 Speaker 1: It is a huge barrier because this area has been 178 00:09:32,655 --> 00:09:36,486 Speaker 1: relatively lawless, is controlled by one of the world's largest 179 00:09:36,495 --> 00:09:40,255 Speaker 1: drug cartels. There are a lot of other dangers as well. 180 00:09:40,265 --> 00:09:42,765 Speaker 1: I had a source in this documentary who doesn't want 181 00:09:42,776 --> 00:09:45,055 Speaker 1: people to know who he is, but he's a very 182 00:09:45,065 --> 00:09:48,555 Speaker 1: senior politician in South America. He was have a listen 183 00:09:48,565 --> 00:09:49,796 Speaker 1: to what he had to say. 184 00:09:50,035 --> 00:09:52,625 Speaker 2: There is not much person of the 185 00:09:52,979 --> 00:09:59,700 Speaker 2: Colombian or Panamanian police or any type of governmental presence 186 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:04,789 Speaker 2: because it's an area that has always been deserted. And 187 00:10:04,799 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 2: there are several different groups of criminal gangs that operate 188 00:10:09,890 --> 00:10:13,679 Speaker 2: a profit out of the problem of the people that 189 00:10:13,690 --> 00:10:15,820 Speaker 2: needs to travel and migrate. 190 00:10:16,119 --> 00:10:19,320 Speaker 1: Now in Tapachula, Mexico, you managed to interview a man 191 00:10:19,330 --> 00:10:23,719 Speaker 1: you call Mario. He's actually a smuggler. And the conversation 192 00:10:23,729 --> 00:10:26,429 Speaker 1: you have with him is just so riveting. How did 193 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:30,090 Speaker 1: you find him? Yeah, Mario obviously isn't someone I would 194 00:10:30,099 --> 00:10:35,419 Speaker 1: naturally know, but I'm a very, very good fixer in Tapachula, 195 00:10:35,900 --> 00:10:41,349 Speaker 1: Southern Mexico. His name is Benjamin just to contextualize Tapachula 196 00:10:41,359 --> 00:10:41,700 Speaker 1: a bit. 197 00:10:41,900 --> 00:10:44,020 Speaker 1: So usually when we go to a country, we look 198 00:10:44,030 --> 00:10:46,700 Speaker 1: for a fixer in a capital. But when we reached 199 00:10:46,710 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 1: out to people in Mexico City, they all said we're 200 00:10:49,770 --> 00:10:53,659 Speaker 1: not going there. Good luck. Go find someone locally. That's 201 00:10:53,669 --> 00:10:59,619 Speaker 1: the kind of town it is through Benjamin. We found Mario. 202 00:10:59,900 --> 00:11:04,460 Speaker 1: I never really quite understood what his incentives were. Why 203 00:11:04,469 --> 00:11:07,380 Speaker 1: would he come forward to reveal these secrets? 204 00:11:07,609 --> 00:11:11,020 Speaker 1: Part of it is because I think Chinese migrants are 205 00:11:11,030 --> 00:11:13,839 Speaker 1: still a minority of his business. So he's very keen 206 00:11:13,849 --> 00:11:17,218 Speaker 1: to move into that market that might explain why. But 207 00:11:17,229 --> 00:11:21,340 Speaker 1: he was also very anxious because remember these smugglers answer 208 00:11:21,349 --> 00:11:25,020 Speaker 1: to the drug cartels, even though they're running their own business. 209 00:11:25,030 --> 00:11:26,979 Speaker 1: And there are a lot of people, they need to 210 00:11:26,989 --> 00:11:29,140 Speaker 1: stay on the good side of so that he was 211 00:11:29,150 --> 00:11:32,239 Speaker 1: reasonably anxious. He didn't really want people to know we're 212 00:11:32,250 --> 00:11:33,010 Speaker 1: meeting them. 213 00:11:33,159 --> 00:11:37,340 Speaker 1: His initial plan was to smuggle us into Guatemala which 214 00:11:37,349 --> 00:11:41,140 Speaker 1: we said no, can you imagine? But eventually we found 215 00:11:41,150 --> 00:11:44,098 Speaker 1: in neutral territory, he was happy with it. He turned up, 216 00:11:44,109 --> 00:11:47,409 Speaker 1: we did the interview and the interview was interrupted several 217 00:11:47,419 --> 00:11:50,659 Speaker 1: times because he was so busy. People were just calling 218 00:11:50,669 --> 00:11:55,099 Speaker 1: him up negotiating price checking where the families were trying 219 00:11:55,109 --> 00:11:57,340 Speaker 1: to figure out where to send money and all that 220 00:11:57,659 --> 00:11:58,789 Speaker 1: in an odd way. It was a 221 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:00,739 Speaker 1: think that happened because it gave us a bit more 222 00:12:00,750 --> 00:12:04,059 Speaker 1: confidence that this guy really is a smuggler. But I 223 00:12:04,070 --> 00:12:06,699 Speaker 1: think it was a long conversation. A lot of that 224 00:12:06,710 --> 00:12:09,549 Speaker 1: content did not make into the final cut. You get 225 00:12:09,559 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: the sense that he really appears to be quite proud 226 00:12:11,969 --> 00:12:15,098 Speaker 1: of what he does. So I asked him, look, Mario, 227 00:12:15,109 --> 00:12:18,959 Speaker 1: how are you justifying what you do for a living? 228 00:12:18,969 --> 00:12:21,289 Speaker 1: Do you think you're doing God's work? And he just 229 00:12:21,299 --> 00:12:24,380 Speaker 1: sort of laughed and said, oh God's work is 230 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,059 Speaker 1: saying a lot, I don't think I'm doing God's work, 231 00:12:27,190 --> 00:12:30,809 Speaker 1: but I'm doing an essential job and sometimes I have 232 00:12:30,820 --> 00:12:33,380 Speaker 1: to discipline people. I'm like, what do you mean? He said, 233 00:12:33,390 --> 00:12:37,579 Speaker 1: sometimes the migrants get drunk act disorderly. I beat them up. 234 00:12:37,590 --> 00:12:39,978 Speaker 1: I keep them in line or for the benefit of 235 00:12:39,989 --> 00:12:42,960 Speaker 1: the greater community. So they don't bother other people, they 236 00:12:42,969 --> 00:12:47,190 Speaker 1: don't bother other migrants. And then he said, you must 237 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:49,849 Speaker 1: have heard that we rape women. 238 00:12:50,349 --> 00:12:54,549 Speaker 1: We don't rate women. Women came to us to offer sex. 239 00:12:54,989 --> 00:12:57,039 Speaker 1: I'm like, what, what do you mean? And he says 240 00:12:57,049 --> 00:12:59,719 Speaker 1: a lot of times these women travel with a group 241 00:12:59,729 --> 00:13:03,429 Speaker 1: of men that are not entirely friendly to them. Sometimes 242 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:07,090 Speaker 1: they want protection from their own people and they come 243 00:13:07,099 --> 00:13:08,840 Speaker 1: to us, they offer sex, we 244 00:13:08,945 --> 00:13:11,385 Speaker 1: give them a separate room, we give them a little 245 00:13:11,395 --> 00:13:14,724 Speaker 1: bit of protection. That's what we do. There's no way 246 00:13:14,734 --> 00:13:17,955 Speaker 1: for me to verify the validity of that claim. But 247 00:13:17,965 --> 00:13:21,604 Speaker 1: I just thought that left me with what was a 248 00:13:21,614 --> 00:13:25,613 Speaker 1: combination of disbelief and grief that already this journey is 249 00:13:25,625 --> 00:13:27,405 Speaker 1: so hard on everyone. 250 00:13:28,210 --> 00:13:33,169 Speaker 1: The disproportionate effect that it has on women. Migrants is 251 00:13:33,179 --> 00:13:36,830 Speaker 1: really unthinkable for us to be talking about this from 252 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:42,710 Speaker 1: the safety of our homes. Chinese customers are very complicated. Firstly, 253 00:13:42,719 --> 00:13:46,369 Speaker 1: because of the language. Secondly, the food we definitely can't 254 00:13:46,380 --> 00:13:46,669 Speaker 1: speak 255 00:13:47,184 --> 00:13:50,775 Speaker 1: and they need to get used to eating beans, tacos, 256 00:13:50,844 --> 00:13:55,335 Speaker 1: quesadillas and whatever is native here to Mexico. If you 257 00:13:55,344 --> 00:13:58,255 Speaker 1: hire me along the way, they won't attack you, they 258 00:13:58,265 --> 00:14:01,375 Speaker 1: are not going to kidnap you for women, they won't 259 00:14:01,385 --> 00:14:04,424 Speaker 1: rape or beat them. If a man defends a woman, 260 00:14:04,434 --> 00:14:07,885 Speaker 1: he may die. Our job is basically to help you 261 00:14:07,895 --> 00:14:12,554 Speaker 1: reach your destination safe and sound in the shortest time possible. 262 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:17,809 Speaker 1: A big chunk of your documentary follows a family, a mother, 263 00:14:17,820 --> 00:14:20,580 Speaker 1: a father, their teen daughter, Lucy. They left such an 264 00:14:20,590 --> 00:14:23,250 Speaker 1: impression on me. They were put through the ringer, their 265 00:14:23,260 --> 00:14:26,390 Speaker 1: boat cap sizes, then their strip search, they're robbed once 266 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:29,380 Speaker 1: they get to Mexico and every time I saw you 267 00:14:29,390 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 1: on camera meet with them, I could really feel how 268 00:14:32,090 --> 00:14:34,169 Speaker 1: much you wanted to help. How did you keep your 269 00:14:34,179 --> 00:14:36,099 Speaker 1: emotions separate from your job way? 270 00:14:36,369 --> 00:14:38,729 Speaker 1: Yeah, it was such a lovely family. I still tear 271 00:14:38,739 --> 00:14:41,179 Speaker 1: up whenever I think about them. The good news is 272 00:14:41,190 --> 00:14:44,549 Speaker 1: they're in California. They're, they're doing well. That's reassuring for 273 00:14:44,559 --> 00:14:49,539 Speaker 1: us to know. But the help part that's difficult because 274 00:14:49,549 --> 00:14:52,640 Speaker 1: partly you want to be human with people, right? You 275 00:14:52,650 --> 00:14:54,690 Speaker 1: want to be true to your feelings and that's how 276 00:14:54,700 --> 00:15:00,739 Speaker 1: you connect with the profiles. But ethically we should not 277 00:15:00,750 --> 00:15:03,820 Speaker 1: be changing the course of the story. 278 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:06,450 Speaker 1: If something happens to them, they don't make it to 279 00:15:06,460 --> 00:15:10,369 Speaker 1: the US. That is not something we should try to intervene. 280 00:15:10,469 --> 00:15:14,049 Speaker 1: But on top of that, the US and Mexico and Panama, 281 00:15:14,059 --> 00:15:16,940 Speaker 1: I believe, and several other countries on this route makes 282 00:15:16,950 --> 00:15:19,989 Speaker 1: it a criminal offense for people to help the migrants. 283 00:15:20,330 --> 00:15:20,700 Speaker 1: So 284 00:15:20,784 --> 00:15:24,205 Speaker 1: it is also very clear to us for our safety 285 00:15:24,215 --> 00:15:27,284 Speaker 1: being law abiding citizens that we were in a situation. 286 00:15:27,294 --> 00:15:30,424 Speaker 1: We couldn't do that. And we had the benefit of 287 00:15:30,434 --> 00:15:33,515 Speaker 1: that foresight. When we approached people, we made it very 288 00:15:33,525 --> 00:15:36,315 Speaker 1: clear to them that there are several things we cannot 289 00:15:36,325 --> 00:15:37,005 Speaker 1: do for you. 290 00:15:37,369 --> 00:15:39,789 Speaker 1: We cannot give you a ride in our vehicle. We 291 00:15:39,799 --> 00:15:41,960 Speaker 1: cannot give you any money to get you out of 292 00:15:41,969 --> 00:15:44,599 Speaker 1: a bind. Um Actually, I've even said to them because 293 00:15:44,609 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 1: they have Chinese yuan and they often want a US dollar. 294 00:15:46,890 --> 00:15:50,229 Speaker 1: I said I couldn't even do that because in some 295 00:15:50,239 --> 00:15:56,710 Speaker 1: instances that would be considered financing migration or money laundering. Surprisingly, 296 00:15:56,719 --> 00:16:00,359 Speaker 1: most people were very OK with it. There are 297 00:16:00,525 --> 00:16:03,544 Speaker 1: several migrants that were not our main profile at which 298 00:16:03,554 --> 00:16:05,344 Speaker 1: point said if you don't help me, I don't want 299 00:16:05,354 --> 00:16:08,255 Speaker 1: to be filmed. And then that was that. But for 300 00:16:08,265 --> 00:16:11,164 Speaker 1: the main group of migrants, they were actually pretty good 301 00:16:11,544 --> 00:16:15,625 Speaker 1: with having this agreement and really sticking to it. There 302 00:16:15,635 --> 00:16:18,525 Speaker 1: was once after we left Mexico and the family kept 303 00:16:18,534 --> 00:16:21,094 Speaker 1: on getting bounced back to the south of Mexico and 304 00:16:21,104 --> 00:16:23,094 Speaker 1: that took them several tries and they wasted a lot 305 00:16:23,104 --> 00:16:23,585 Speaker 1: of money 306 00:16:23,919 --> 00:16:27,260 Speaker 1: and dad did call me and say, you know, I'm 307 00:16:27,270 --> 00:16:29,830 Speaker 1: out of options. I've wasted all of my money. My 308 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 1: family is still in Mexico. Is there anything you could 309 00:16:32,409 --> 00:16:35,849 Speaker 1: do for me at all? And that was difficult. But 310 00:16:35,859 --> 00:16:38,460 Speaker 1: I still had to tell them we had this conversation 311 00:16:38,469 --> 00:16:42,260 Speaker 1: early on precisely with this day in mind. And I 312 00:16:42,270 --> 00:16:46,309 Speaker 1: can because that means I break the law. Um, they 313 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:48,890 Speaker 1: have so many good qualities and this being one of 314 00:16:48,900 --> 00:16:51,140 Speaker 1: them is that they made an agreement and they 315 00:16:51,369 --> 00:16:54,429 Speaker 1: stuck to it and they were ok when I told 316 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:56,469 Speaker 1: them that there was nothing we could do to help them. 317 00:16:56,750 --> 00:16:58,650 Speaker 1: But I suppose a lot of the people watching this 318 00:16:58,659 --> 00:17:01,809 Speaker 1: would have the question is, well, then why would they 319 00:17:01,820 --> 00:17:04,170 Speaker 1: want to be future? Why would they want a camera 320 00:17:04,180 --> 00:17:07,670 Speaker 1: crew following them around? Why would they do this for us? 321 00:17:08,540 --> 00:17:12,290 Speaker 1: That's a question almost for every documentary that's ever made 322 00:17:12,300 --> 00:17:15,140 Speaker 1: about people with the intimate private lives. Right? And I 323 00:17:15,150 --> 00:17:17,569 Speaker 1: believe the answer is that we live to tell stories. 324 00:17:17,579 --> 00:17:20,589 Speaker 1: We all have an innate desire to tell people what 325 00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 1: we're doing. Just imagine your best friend is probably the 326 00:17:23,530 --> 00:17:23,810 Speaker 1: person 327 00:17:23,911 --> 00:17:28,702 Speaker 1: is willing to listen to you. And these migrants are 328 00:17:28,712 --> 00:17:31,381 Speaker 1: on a journey of their life and often they couldn't 329 00:17:31,391 --> 00:17:33,851 Speaker 1: tell their family because they were worried that the family 330 00:17:33,862 --> 00:17:35,571 Speaker 1: would get scared. Then they try to get them to 331 00:17:35,582 --> 00:17:39,362 Speaker 1: go back so often, they didn't tell anyone else. And 332 00:17:39,371 --> 00:17:42,592 Speaker 1: we were the only people there who could listen to 333 00:17:42,602 --> 00:17:47,722 Speaker 1: them without posing any threats to them. That's very, very powerful. 334 00:17:47,732 --> 00:17:50,371 Speaker 1: People want to tell their stories 335 00:17:51,076 --> 00:17:54,225 Speaker 1: and things we don't judge them and they felt safe 336 00:17:54,234 --> 00:17:57,176 Speaker 1: have been listened to. And I'm very glad how that 337 00:17:57,186 --> 00:18:00,514 Speaker 1: worked out for migrants who managed to survive and they 338 00:18:00,526 --> 00:18:03,795 Speaker 1: make their way through South America. Up to Mexico, then 339 00:18:03,806 --> 00:18:06,095 Speaker 1: finally to the border with the United States. It doesn't 340 00:18:06,105 --> 00:18:08,666 Speaker 1: end there in your, do we meet a man named 341 00:18:08,676 --> 00:18:11,436 Speaker 1: Sam Schultz? And I really like this guy. You know, 342 00:18:11,446 --> 00:18:14,186 Speaker 1: he leads a team that hands out free meals to 343 00:18:14,196 --> 00:18:18,095 Speaker 1: migrants waiting for border control processing in Oba, California. 344 00:18:18,469 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 1: I'm going to play an excerpt now of what he 345 00:18:20,530 --> 00:18:22,930 Speaker 1: told you while you guys were riding in a car 346 00:18:22,939 --> 00:18:26,819 Speaker 1: heading to a migrant encampment. Take a listen. Yesterday, we spent, 347 00:18:27,079 --> 00:18:30,869 Speaker 1: we fed about 750 people. Most of the people who 348 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,189 Speaker 1: are coming from China are not really familiar with 349 00:18:34,199 --> 00:18:37,409 Speaker 1: camping out, staying out in the country, dealing with the 350 00:18:37,420 --> 00:18:39,688 Speaker 1: kind of harsh situation that we have here because they 351 00:18:39,699 --> 00:18:42,560 Speaker 1: seem to be mostly urban people directly. They come from 352 00:18:42,569 --> 00:18:45,948 Speaker 1: a very orderly society. And as you will see in 353 00:18:45,959 --> 00:18:49,810 Speaker 1: the moment, sir, this is not a particularly orderly situation. 354 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:53,739 Speaker 1: Ok. So what did you see Wei the encampment we 355 00:18:53,750 --> 00:18:57,599 Speaker 1: encounter more than 50 migrants and I think more than 50% 356 00:18:57,609 --> 00:19:01,899 Speaker 1: of them were Chinese. We went at a fortunate or 357 00:19:01,910 --> 00:19:05,060 Speaker 1: unfortunate time for the migrants is we went to Wakamba 358 00:19:05,069 --> 00:19:06,979 Speaker 1: right after Thanksgiving. 359 00:19:07,380 --> 00:19:09,869 Speaker 1: And because it's a long holiday, a lot of border 360 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:13,810 Speaker 1: patrol officers were rostered for their leave. So they really 361 00:19:13,819 --> 00:19:15,959 Speaker 1: waited a long time. Some people were in the desert 362 00:19:15,969 --> 00:19:19,310 Speaker 1: for five days before they could be taken out. So 363 00:19:19,319 --> 00:19:22,380 Speaker 1: what immediately greeted us? Was there a whole group of 364 00:19:22,390 --> 00:19:25,198 Speaker 1: Chinese migrants, they all approached the vehicle because they know 365 00:19:25,209 --> 00:19:27,790 Speaker 1: the vehicles were coming to feed them. I think a 366 00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 1: lot of them were particularly excited and when they saw us, 367 00:19:30,770 --> 00:19:33,949 Speaker 1: they were talking about themselves. Is that person Chinese is 368 00:19:33,959 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: this person who 369 00:19:34,619 --> 00:19:38,560 Speaker 1: could understand this? That was quite a funny experience. Yes. 370 00:19:38,569 --> 00:19:40,979 Speaker 1: So he's an interesting guy. I did ask him, you know, 371 00:19:40,989 --> 00:19:45,010 Speaker 1: why do you do something like this? And his explanation 372 00:19:45,020 --> 00:19:48,739 Speaker 1: is he, he's a Quaker. He, he sees the entire 373 00:19:48,750 --> 00:19:51,630 Speaker 1: universe as his friends and you must help a friend 374 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:55,198 Speaker 1: in need. So another issue in the US to contend 375 00:19:55,209 --> 00:19:57,890 Speaker 1: with is public sentiment. A lot of Americans would say 376 00:19:58,010 --> 00:20:01,010 Speaker 1: opening our doors to others is part of the DNA 377 00:20:01,020 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 1: of our country. 378 00:20:02,079 --> 00:20:04,300 Speaker 1: But at the same time, more and more are expressing 379 00:20:04,310 --> 00:20:08,140 Speaker 1: concern about too much immigration and they're calling for reform. 380 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:11,919 Speaker 1: It's a hugely polarizing topic right now, isn't it? Yeah, exactly. 381 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:15,160 Speaker 1: You're absolutely right. I did my masters in the U 382 00:20:15,170 --> 00:20:18,010 Speaker 1: SI worked for a bit in the US as well 383 00:20:18,020 --> 00:20:20,659 Speaker 1: and this was in late two thousands and you could 384 00:20:20,670 --> 00:20:24,680 Speaker 1: already sense how that conversation was heating up, but also 385 00:20:24,729 --> 00:20:26,739 Speaker 1: how fundamentally the United States, 386 00:20:26,834 --> 00:20:31,024 Speaker 1: it's as a country has a different founding principle than 387 00:20:31,035 --> 00:20:33,804 Speaker 1: most countries, especially in Asia that a lot of the 388 00:20:33,814 --> 00:20:38,864 Speaker 1: countries are organized essentially around a single ethnicity. There was 389 00:20:38,875 --> 00:20:41,024 Speaker 1: a quote from Ronald Reagan that we ran at the 390 00:20:41,035 --> 00:20:44,125 Speaker 1: beginning of the documentary that anyone can come to America 391 00:20:44,135 --> 00:20:45,214 Speaker 1: and become American. 392 00:20:45,449 --> 00:20:50,729 Speaker 1: That philosophy has really been challenged in today's climate, in 393 00:20:50,739 --> 00:20:54,790 Speaker 1: a very globalized world and also unstable world that in 394 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:57,188 Speaker 1: a lot of countries, people want a better life and 395 00:20:57,199 --> 00:21:00,020 Speaker 1: they decide to pack up and leave. Is it a 396 00:21:00,030 --> 00:21:03,379 Speaker 1: polarizing issue? I think that's a harder question to answer 397 00:21:03,390 --> 00:21:06,729 Speaker 1: because now there's quite a bit of consensus that something 398 00:21:06,739 --> 00:21:08,189 Speaker 1: is wrong. Something has 399 00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:12,479 Speaker 1: to change a country is simply not a made for 400 00:21:12,489 --> 00:21:15,829 Speaker 1: taking in 2.5 million strangers a year that they know 401 00:21:15,839 --> 00:21:18,819 Speaker 1: nothing about. People tend to think of it as a 402 00:21:18,829 --> 00:21:21,680 Speaker 1: polarizing issue. But I thought what we saw that was 403 00:21:21,689 --> 00:21:26,359 Speaker 1: beautiful on the ground was how much solidarity the the 404 00:21:26,369 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 1: town of Wakamba have, even if people you would assume 405 00:21:31,150 --> 00:21:34,429 Speaker 1: to be on opposite side of the issue. So for example, 406 00:21:34,439 --> 00:21:37,589 Speaker 1: the landowner who's land on which the the migrants in 407 00:21:37,599 --> 00:21:41,270 Speaker 1: camp out, he's the most vocal critic of the current 408 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:43,810 Speaker 1: US government and he really wants something to change. He 409 00:21:43,819 --> 00:21:46,329 Speaker 1: wants to reelect Donald Trump so he could chuck all 410 00:21:46,339 --> 00:21:50,329 Speaker 1: these migrants out. But at the same time, he's actually 411 00:21:50,339 --> 00:21:53,890 Speaker 1: friendly with Sam. He allows Sam because his 412 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:57,089 Speaker 1: private property to go on his private property to feed 413 00:21:57,099 --> 00:22:00,698 Speaker 1: these migrants to take care of them. Because he says 414 00:22:00,709 --> 00:22:04,669 Speaker 1: somebody's got to help these people when we went around 415 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:06,760 Speaker 1: to do an interview and it started to rain and 416 00:22:06,770 --> 00:22:10,780 Speaker 1: it's actually miserably cold in the desert. Him and his 417 00:22:10,790 --> 00:22:13,459 Speaker 1: wife sat down, had a cup of tea and just said, 418 00:22:13,469 --> 00:22:15,459 Speaker 1: I wonder how the little ones are doing in the desert. 419 00:22:15,469 --> 00:22:16,739 Speaker 1: This is unfair to them. 420 00:22:17,069 --> 00:22:20,849 Speaker 1: It is a polarizing issue politically. But on a human level, 421 00:22:20,859 --> 00:22:25,300 Speaker 1: people are kind, this is not an issue of kindness, 422 00:22:25,310 --> 00:22:27,968 Speaker 1: of cruelty. And I think that everybody realizes that something 423 00:22:27,979 --> 00:22:31,050 Speaker 1: is broken here and something needs to be fixed. Then 424 00:22:31,060 --> 00:22:33,619 Speaker 1: what about those folks that you followed? Say they made 425 00:22:33,630 --> 00:22:36,369 Speaker 1: it to the US? What are their prospects for? Actually 426 00:22:36,380 --> 00:22:38,849 Speaker 1: realizing the American dream? Are they just going to be 427 00:22:38,859 --> 00:22:41,619 Speaker 1: sent back to China? Well as of right now, actually, 428 00:22:41,630 --> 00:22:44,530 Speaker 1: they cannot be sent back to China because 429 00:22:44,609 --> 00:22:49,310 Speaker 1: repatriation, it requires co-operation from the other country. And we 430 00:22:49,319 --> 00:22:52,949 Speaker 1: do know that right now, China does not cooperated with 431 00:22:52,959 --> 00:22:56,359 Speaker 1: the US to take back these migrants. It's one of 432 00:22:56,369 --> 00:22:59,140 Speaker 1: the issues in their high level meetings that Washington and 433 00:22:59,150 --> 00:23:03,030 Speaker 1: Beijing are talking about. We don't know if and when 434 00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:06,479 Speaker 1: there will be any result, essentially what's going to happen 435 00:23:06,489 --> 00:23:09,270 Speaker 1: for these Chinese migrants after they arrived in the US 436 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:12,069 Speaker 1: is most of them will choose to file asylum claim. 437 00:23:12,349 --> 00:23:15,689 Speaker 1: But even if that asylum claim does not succeed, they 438 00:23:15,699 --> 00:23:18,489 Speaker 1: will remain in the US after the while the US 439 00:23:18,500 --> 00:23:21,510 Speaker 1: government cannot just have them stay in the country and 440 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:24,129 Speaker 1: be unemployed and they will be given a work permit 441 00:23:24,140 --> 00:23:28,649 Speaker 1: to work anyway. So for the most part, unless and 442 00:23:28,660 --> 00:23:32,089 Speaker 1: until they choose to voluntarily leave the United States that 443 00:23:32,099 --> 00:23:35,410 Speaker 1: they will simply remain there. But that's quite different from 444 00:23:35,420 --> 00:23:38,169 Speaker 1: realizing the American dream, right? What's the definition of the 445 00:23:38,180 --> 00:23:38,810 Speaker 1: American dream 446 00:23:38,901 --> 00:23:42,552 Speaker 1: house, a car, three kids and a dog picket fence, 447 00:23:43,442 --> 00:23:46,952 Speaker 1: picket fence, all of that. That is probably something a 448 00:23:46,962 --> 00:23:51,640 Speaker 1: lot of Americans cannot achieve these days. But the reality 449 00:23:51,651 --> 00:23:53,452 Speaker 1: for a lot of these migrants is a lot of 450 00:23:53,462 --> 00:23:56,442 Speaker 1: them do encounter quite a bit of disappointment. As you 451 00:23:56,452 --> 00:23:59,232 Speaker 1: will see, there are segments that we shot in this 452 00:23:59,241 --> 00:24:03,722 Speaker 1: particular what really is just a parking lot in Los Angeles. 453 00:24:03,732 --> 00:24:05,241 Speaker 1: But it's known as a fat 454 00:24:05,453 --> 00:24:08,404 Speaker 1: Dane Square among the Chinese migrants, a lot of them 455 00:24:08,413 --> 00:24:11,693 Speaker 1: arrived there. They couldn't find anywhere to live, they couldn't 456 00:24:11,703 --> 00:24:16,463 Speaker 1: find reasonably stable well paying jobs. They hang around the 457 00:24:16,473 --> 00:24:20,113 Speaker 1: square all day chat with other migrants. What we gather 458 00:24:20,124 --> 00:24:23,273 Speaker 1: from their conversation is that some migrants do leave and 459 00:24:23,284 --> 00:24:27,144 Speaker 1: they leave voluntarily to go back to China after realizing 460 00:24:27,154 --> 00:24:29,713 Speaker 1: that it's one big mistake, I guess for me, the 461 00:24:29,723 --> 00:24:31,322 Speaker 1: question at the end of all of this, at the 462 00:24:31,333 --> 00:24:31,904 Speaker 1: end of the day, 463 00:24:32,005 --> 00:24:35,186 Speaker 1: danger, the humiliation as you put it in your dock. 464 00:24:35,196 --> 00:24:38,745 Speaker 1: All the fear, the sacrifice, was it worth it to 465 00:24:38,755 --> 00:24:40,754 Speaker 1: these people? You know, if there was someone in China 466 00:24:40,765 --> 00:24:44,206 Speaker 1: considering taking this path to America, what do you want 467 00:24:44,215 --> 00:24:48,056 Speaker 1: them to take away from this story? It's difficult to 468 00:24:48,066 --> 00:24:51,306 Speaker 1: give people advice, right? Because bear in mind this is 469 00:24:51,316 --> 00:24:56,484 Speaker 1: illicit activity that we shouldn't encourage people to do on 470 00:24:56,494 --> 00:24:58,305 Speaker 1: a different level. I also realize 471 00:24:58,750 --> 00:25:03,040 Speaker 1: people are in situations that we might not understand and 472 00:25:03,050 --> 00:25:06,510 Speaker 1: there will always be people choosing to risk their lives 473 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,839 Speaker 1: to do this at the very least, what we try 474 00:25:09,849 --> 00:25:13,229 Speaker 1: to do. And I hope on some level we succeeded 475 00:25:13,239 --> 00:25:16,290 Speaker 1: in doing is that we show them the reality of it. 476 00:25:16,300 --> 00:25:18,729 Speaker 1: We show them the reality of the journey. We show 477 00:25:18,739 --> 00:25:21,569 Speaker 1: them the reality of what's waiting on the other side. 478 00:25:21,770 --> 00:25:25,849 Speaker 1: So they walk into this with their eyes wide open, 479 00:25:26,180 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 1: which is not the case with most of the migrants 480 00:25:29,010 --> 00:25:32,900 Speaker 1: I encounter on the road, people had unrealistic expectations for 481 00:25:32,910 --> 00:25:37,739 Speaker 1: the US and unrealistic expectations of what the journey will be. 482 00:25:37,939 --> 00:25:41,290 Speaker 1: So the question of whether it's worth it really is 483 00:25:41,300 --> 00:25:43,540 Speaker 1: up to the individual, what they had in mind, what 484 00:25:43,550 --> 00:25:46,159 Speaker 1: they were trying to achieve and how they adapted 485 00:25:46,234 --> 00:25:49,576 Speaker 1: after they got to the U SI was so captivated 486 00:25:49,586 --> 00:25:51,696 Speaker 1: with this story from beginning to end. And I admit 487 00:25:51,705 --> 00:25:55,166 Speaker 1: I got emotional quite a few times. I really encourage 488 00:25:55,176 --> 00:25:59,076 Speaker 1: our listeners to watch your incredible three part documentary as well. 489 00:25:59,086 --> 00:26:01,965 Speaker 1: Where can they see it way? It's already on youtube. 490 00:26:01,975 --> 00:26:05,105 Speaker 1: We actually dumped all three episodes on youtube from Saturday. 491 00:26:05,115 --> 00:26:06,215 Speaker 1: So you can find that at the 492 00:26:06,291 --> 00:26:10,312 Speaker 1: CN A insider youtube channel as well, there will be repeats, 493 00:26:10,321 --> 00:26:13,621 Speaker 1: but you can also find it on channel news, asia.com 494 00:26:13,722 --> 00:26:16,592 Speaker 1: and Vod you heard her go and watch this dog. 495 00:26:16,602 --> 00:26:18,671 Speaker 1: You will not regret it. Thank you so much, Wei. 496 00:26:18,921 --> 00:26:22,031 Speaker 1: Thank you Teresa. And a reminder that the TV episodes 497 00:26:22,041 --> 00:26:24,910 Speaker 1: of CN A correspondent air every Wednesday at 9:30 p.m. 498 00:26:24,921 --> 00:26:28,171 Speaker 1: Singapore Hong Kong time the team behind this week's episode 499 00:26:28,182 --> 00:26:32,421 Speaker 1: is Rossley Pute Clara Ong Christina Robert Craig Dale and myself, 500 00:26:32,432 --> 00:26:33,911 Speaker 1: Teresa Tang. Thanks for listening.