1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,310 Speaker 1: This is a C. N. A. Podcast 2 00:00:13,790 --> 00:00:16,669 Speaker 1: that's the sound of about half a million cubic meters 3 00:00:16,670 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: of earth collapsing soil and rock on the move and unstoppable. 4 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:26,140 Speaker 1: It's the sound that in the early hours 16 December 5 00:00:26,140 --> 00:00:30,260 Speaker 1: 2022 buried 31 campers on a hillside near Malaysia's genting 6 00:00:30,260 --> 00:00:30,850 Speaker 1: highlands 7 00:00:32,780 --> 00:00:36,150 Speaker 1: At around 2-3 like that. I'm not very sure, but 8 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: it's at night when we're sleeping. That's the first time 9 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:42,220 Speaker 1: we heard a loud noise very loud and our family 10 00:00:42,220 --> 00:00:46,710 Speaker 1: is awakened by data. But hearing the sound, understanding what 11 00:00:46,710 --> 00:00:49,629 Speaker 1: it means and being able to do anything about it 12 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,380 Speaker 1: are all different things. As long Qiming discovered 13 00:00:53,870 --> 00:00:56,330 Speaker 1: once we are awake we want to find out what's 14 00:00:56,330 --> 00:01:00,360 Speaker 1: what's wrong. But before we can do anything I heard 15 00:01:00,370 --> 00:01:04,970 Speaker 1: then I felt the my tent shaking the loud noise. 16 00:01:04,980 --> 00:01:08,490 Speaker 1: Then I tried to get up before I can. My 17 00:01:08,490 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: leg is trapped by the mud Qiming. Was lucky a 18 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:14,260 Speaker 1: friend helped to free his leg and they both escaped 19 00:01:14,260 --> 00:01:16,670 Speaker 1: to safety. As the landslide rumbled on 20 00:01:17,700 --> 00:01:21,660 Speaker 1: Lindsay Shen also survived but needed more help. 21 00:01:22,220 --> 00:01:28,030 Speaker 1: I saw my lower body was buried by the soil. 22 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,729 Speaker 1: I tried to dig the soil with my hands but 23 00:01:30,730 --> 00:01:33,400 Speaker 1: because only my left hand was easy to move, I 24 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:37,450 Speaker 1: couldn't dig much. After a long time the rescue team arrived. 25 00:01:37,459 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: They used a shovel to dig out the soil I 26 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,560 Speaker 1: was carried out but I was slipping in and out 27 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:43,640 Speaker 1: of consciousness. 28 00:01:49,170 --> 00:01:51,970 Speaker 1: I'm Steve Lie and on this episode of CNN correspondent, 29 00:01:51,970 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 1: you'll hear how this landslide tragedy unfolded for 92 campus 30 00:01:56,210 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 1: on the grounds of an organic farm, a farm that 31 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:02,280 Speaker 1: didn't have a license to operate as a campsite. 32 00:02:02,930 --> 00:02:05,610 Speaker 1: And joining me with all the details and insight on 33 00:02:05,610 --> 00:02:08,610 Speaker 1: my colleagues to Ariffin and Pamela lim who mobilized to 34 00:02:08,610 --> 00:02:11,150 Speaker 1: the scene along with their cameraman. Welcome to you both. 35 00:02:11,260 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: Good morning. Morning steve. Thanks. 36 00:02:14,830 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 1: The team was scheduled to cover the signing of an 37 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 1: agreement by the coalitions and parties in Prime Minister Anwar 38 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:23,870 Speaker 1: Ibrahim's Unity Government that day, but had to quickly switch 39 00:02:23,870 --> 00:02:27,100 Speaker 1: gears to deploy to Batang Kali for this breaking news 40 00:02:27,100 --> 00:02:29,829 Speaker 1: assignment to talk us through that. Well, steve, that was 41 00:02:29,830 --> 00:02:31,410 Speaker 1: the plan for that friday. 42 00:02:31,435 --> 00:02:33,485 Speaker 1: We were supposed to be at the Prime Minister's office 43 00:02:33,485 --> 00:02:36,125 Speaker 1: at around three PM in the afternoon because that was 44 00:02:36,125 --> 00:02:40,055 Speaker 1: when the signing of the memorandum of understanding between all 45 00:02:40,055 --> 00:02:43,425 Speaker 1: political parties were going to take place. So in my 46 00:02:43,425 --> 00:02:46,275 Speaker 1: head on that friday morning I would have the morning 47 00:02:46,275 --> 00:02:48,530 Speaker 1: free and then I only start work in the afternoon. 48 00:02:48,750 --> 00:02:52,940 Speaker 1: But news of the landslide broke about early as three a.m. 49 00:02:52,950 --> 00:02:56,540 Speaker 1: On friday morning and the local media reports started pushing 50 00:02:56,540 --> 00:02:59,609 Speaker 1: out articles as early as 67 a. M. So by 51 00:02:59,610 --> 00:03:02,709 Speaker 1: morning I woke up to the flurry of messages and 52 00:03:02,710 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: calls from my editors from pam. Everyone was trying to 53 00:03:06,010 --> 00:03:08,530 Speaker 1: reach me and then when I woke up I had 54 00:03:08,530 --> 00:03:11,489 Speaker 1: to go through all the developments and all the breaking 55 00:03:11,490 --> 00:03:14,610 Speaker 1: news that was happening. And that's when we swung into action. 56 00:03:14,610 --> 00:03:17,770 Speaker 1: So we immediately did a life cross at about 11 a.m. 57 00:03:17,770 --> 00:03:18,060 Speaker 1: From 58 00:03:18,205 --> 00:03:21,605 Speaker 1: just to give our viewers an update about what exactly 59 00:03:21,605 --> 00:03:24,935 Speaker 1: was happening at Batang Kali, a bit more context into landslides. 60 00:03:24,935 --> 00:03:27,745 Speaker 1: You know, usually happening in the area during this time, 61 00:03:27,845 --> 00:03:30,875 Speaker 1: the death toll and the people who were involved in 62 00:03:30,875 --> 00:03:33,845 Speaker 1: immediately after that pam picked me up with my crew 63 00:03:33,845 --> 00:03:37,645 Speaker 1: and we went straight to the landslide area. It was 64 00:03:37,645 --> 00:03:39,695 Speaker 1: a mad rush to get there as well so we 65 00:03:39,695 --> 00:03:42,445 Speaker 1: could get information from the ground. Pam. Tell us what 66 00:03:42,445 --> 00:03:44,485 Speaker 1: happened when you arrived at the site. I understand that 67 00:03:44,495 --> 00:03:47,315 Speaker 1: access to the landslide location was actually quite limited. 68 00:03:47,990 --> 00:03:50,860 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. So even before we made a way 69 00:03:50,860 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 1: that I had to plan out the logistics. We heard 70 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 1: there were already road closures and security was pretty tight 71 00:03:58,450 --> 00:04:01,960 Speaker 1: leading up to the campsite. The good thing is the 72 00:04:01,970 --> 00:04:03,020 Speaker 1: fire and rescue depart 73 00:04:03,035 --> 00:04:06,155 Speaker 1: and had already set up the ops center just outside 74 00:04:06,165 --> 00:04:10,335 Speaker 1: the site. We reached the site by noon and at 75 00:04:10,335 --> 00:04:14,215 Speaker 1: the base we couldn't really see the landslide itself, but 76 00:04:14,225 --> 00:04:17,415 Speaker 1: we could already see that search and rescue was at 77 00:04:17,415 --> 00:04:21,245 Speaker 1: its height and we heard that survivors were being brought out. 78 00:04:21,245 --> 00:04:23,914 Speaker 1: So it was more trying to wrap our head around 79 00:04:23,925 --> 00:04:26,555 Speaker 1: what actually happened and the reason why you had to 80 00:04:26,555 --> 00:04:28,935 Speaker 1: keep such a distance. I presume you could fill me in. 81 00:04:28,935 --> 00:04:31,915 Speaker 1: But the site itself was still an unstable situation as 82 00:04:31,915 --> 00:04:32,850 Speaker 1: it was still unfolding. 83 00:04:33,100 --> 00:04:37,039 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. They did not rule out more landslides 84 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:40,540 Speaker 1: actually because they were still checking on soil movement and 85 00:04:40,540 --> 00:04:43,550 Speaker 1: stability of the ground and give us some background on 86 00:04:43,550 --> 00:04:47,570 Speaker 1: this situation. Who were these campers and why were they there? Well, 87 00:04:47,570 --> 00:04:50,930 Speaker 1: it's the end holidays as a school holiday period. So 88 00:04:50,930 --> 00:04:53,830 Speaker 1: this is a time when families would bring the Children 89 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:58,210 Speaker 1: out to enjoy some outdoor activity at Father's Organic Farm. 90 00:04:58,210 --> 00:04:59,320 Speaker 1: There are lots of active 91 00:04:59,333 --> 00:05:02,943 Speaker 1: activities for for not just campus but people who wanted 92 00:05:02,943 --> 00:05:05,433 Speaker 1: to enjoy a bit of nature in that area. There 93 00:05:05,433 --> 00:05:08,293 Speaker 1: are a lot of eco tourism spots in Batang Kali 94 00:05:08,293 --> 00:05:11,352 Speaker 1: which is near genting highlands on that night. There were 95 00:05:11,353 --> 00:05:14,543 Speaker 1: about 92 people who were there and there were various 96 00:05:14,543 --> 00:05:17,653 Speaker 1: groups of people including a group of teachers and students 97 00:05:17,653 --> 00:05:21,763 Speaker 1: from primary school in Kuala Lumpur. They made up the 98 00:05:21,763 --> 00:05:22,643 Speaker 1: bulk of the 99 00:05:22,966 --> 00:05:26,275 Speaker 1: Who had died from this tragedy of the 31 victims, 100 00:05:26,276 --> 00:05:28,476 Speaker 1: 11 of them were from the school I think in 101 00:05:28,476 --> 00:05:31,945 Speaker 1: total there about over 20 of them just from that group, 102 00:05:31,956 --> 00:05:34,886 Speaker 1: there are also other groups of people, friends and family 103 00:05:34,886 --> 00:05:38,596 Speaker 1: members who were celebrating a story I've heard is one 104 00:05:38,596 --> 00:05:40,706 Speaker 1: of the victims seven year old boy, it was his 105 00:05:40,706 --> 00:05:44,006 Speaker 1: birthday and he wanted his entire family to be there 106 00:05:44,005 --> 00:05:46,256 Speaker 1: to celebrate by going camping. So 107 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:49,570 Speaker 1: just a mix of people who are just there to 108 00:05:49,570 --> 00:05:51,880 Speaker 1: have a good time and be on holiday. It seems 109 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:54,640 Speaker 1: quite heartbreaking to have your whole family there with you 110 00:05:54,640 --> 00:05:57,090 Speaker 1: for such a tragic event to happen just quickly. What's 111 00:05:57,089 --> 00:05:58,800 Speaker 1: the age range of the people that were involved in 112 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,950 Speaker 1: this as young as seven? I think the youngest victim 113 00:06:01,950 --> 00:06:04,650 Speaker 1: was a baby. I think it was one years old 114 00:06:04,650 --> 00:06:06,840 Speaker 1: was the youngest victim 115 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:10,010 Speaker 1: but we also know there were babies who were a 116 00:06:10,010 --> 00:06:14,040 Speaker 1: few months old. The oldest was about maybe 50 in 117 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,740 Speaker 1: the late fifties, early sixties. From young to old. It's 118 00:06:17,740 --> 00:06:21,770 Speaker 1: really generations of family members together and it really paints 119 00:06:21,770 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: a picture that it was thought to be a safe 120 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:27,210 Speaker 1: family outing to go on during the school holiday pam 121 00:06:27,210 --> 00:06:30,229 Speaker 1: From the accounts of the survivors that you spoke to 122 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:32,350 Speaker 1: tell us a bit about how it unfolded for them 123 00:06:32,350 --> 00:06:34,810 Speaker 1: given that this happened at two a.m. In the morning. 124 00:06:34,810 --> 00:06:35,820 Speaker 1: Were they all asleep? 125 00:06:36,130 --> 00:06:38,669 Speaker 1: Yeah. Most of the survivors we spoke to they were 126 00:06:38,670 --> 00:06:41,940 Speaker 1: all asleep and as you heard earlier from the sound 127 00:06:41,940 --> 00:06:44,500 Speaker 1: by they woke up to a loud sound what they 128 00:06:44,500 --> 00:06:46,570 Speaker 1: described as an explosion 129 00:06:46,940 --> 00:06:48,810 Speaker 1: because it was the middle of the night it was 130 00:06:48,810 --> 00:06:52,980 Speaker 1: also very dark, visibility was poor. They could not see 131 00:06:52,990 --> 00:06:55,610 Speaker 1: they don't know what happened but the survivors who woke 132 00:06:55,610 --> 00:06:57,690 Speaker 1: up woke up in a shock and when they came 133 00:06:57,690 --> 00:07:00,510 Speaker 1: out of the tent all they saw was just soil, 134 00:07:00,510 --> 00:07:03,590 Speaker 1: mud all around and those who could escape decided to 135 00:07:03,589 --> 00:07:06,420 Speaker 1: run for their lives must have been absolutely frightening to 136 00:07:06,420 --> 00:07:08,680 Speaker 1: do that in the dark, not knowing which way was 137 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:09,500 Speaker 1: the safe way 138 00:07:09,650 --> 00:07:12,180 Speaker 1: to escape to FIFA. Tell us about some of the 139 00:07:12,180 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 1: accounts that you heard. Well like what pam said, a 140 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,340 Speaker 1: lot of them were sleeping. But one thing that really 141 00:07:17,340 --> 00:07:20,090 Speaker 1: struck me from what the survivors were telling us is 142 00:07:20,090 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 1: that 143 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 1: It was really fast. There were two waves of landslide 144 00:07:24,330 --> 00:07:27,470 Speaker 1: and the duration between the 1st and 2nd landslide was 145 00:07:27,470 --> 00:07:30,170 Speaker 1: about 10 minutes. But they did say that when the 146 00:07:30,170 --> 00:07:33,750 Speaker 1: first landslide struck it was just a matter of 10-15 147 00:07:33,750 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 1: seconds before the soil the ground reach them. And you 148 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:40,250 Speaker 1: have to understand that the entire campsite is about more 149 00:07:40,250 --> 00:07:43,980 Speaker 1: than almost two km long from the top of the 150 00:07:43,980 --> 00:07:44,070 Speaker 1: law 151 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:47,260 Speaker 1: landslide right to the end of when the landslide stopped. 152 00:07:47,270 --> 00:07:51,570 Speaker 1: So you could just calculate how fast the ground was 153 00:07:51,570 --> 00:07:54,330 Speaker 1: moving if it could move a distance of two kilometers 154 00:07:54,330 --> 00:07:56,860 Speaker 1: in a matter of 10 15 seconds there was barely 155 00:07:56,860 --> 00:07:59,660 Speaker 1: any time for the campus to be at at that 156 00:07:59,660 --> 00:08:02,490 Speaker 1: point in time. And even when they thought it was 157 00:08:02,500 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 1: over after the first wave was done and they were 158 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:07,510 Speaker 1: trying to free themselves out from the mud a second. 159 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:09,970 Speaker 1: And I think that's when a lot of them who 160 00:08:09,970 --> 00:08:13,550 Speaker 1: were trying to save other people decided that they couldn't, 161 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:16,380 Speaker 1: they had to run to safety first. That seems like 162 00:08:16,380 --> 00:08:18,970 Speaker 1: quite a difficult choice to have to make when you 163 00:08:18,970 --> 00:08:20,800 Speaker 1: know that there are people in danger, but as well, 164 00:08:20,800 --> 00:08:23,370 Speaker 1: there is danger from the second landslide coming at you 165 00:08:23,370 --> 00:08:26,350 Speaker 1: as well. Give us some context. And how common are 166 00:08:26,350 --> 00:08:29,370 Speaker 1: landslides like this in Malaysia? Is it rare for there 167 00:08:29,370 --> 00:08:30,860 Speaker 1: to be a loss of life from these events? 168 00:08:31,460 --> 00:08:35,130 Speaker 1: Yes, so landslides are pretty common in Malaysia, given a 169 00:08:35,130 --> 00:08:38,980 Speaker 1: weather that sometimes sees heavy rainfall for days, which affects 170 00:08:38,980 --> 00:08:42,059 Speaker 1: the hilly terrain, beat along roads like this at Batang 171 00:08:42,059 --> 00:08:45,579 Speaker 1: Kali that lead up to hilltop resorts or even residential 172 00:08:45,580 --> 00:08:50,640 Speaker 1: areas for context. In 2022 alone, apart from Batang Kali landslide, 173 00:08:50,650 --> 00:08:52,030 Speaker 1: there were more than 20 174 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:56,740 Speaker 1: Other landslides reported, but only 3-4 of these involved fatalities 175 00:08:56,750 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 1: or even injuries. So in terms of landslide casualties, the 176 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:03,850 Speaker 1: number is usually relatively low because either it happened at 177 00:09:03,860 --> 00:09:08,810 Speaker 1: an unoccupied area or the residents or people were evacuated 178 00:09:08,820 --> 00:09:12,020 Speaker 1: in time when authorities detected soil movement or cracks on 179 00:09:12,020 --> 00:09:12,620 Speaker 1: the ground. 180 00:09:12,890 --> 00:09:16,150 Speaker 1: There of course have been major ones over the decades, 181 00:09:16,170 --> 00:09:20,570 Speaker 1: but this Batang Kali landslide with its 31 fatalities is 182 00:09:20,570 --> 00:09:23,540 Speaker 1: the worst Malaysia is seen in almost 30 years. The 183 00:09:23,540 --> 00:09:27,030 Speaker 1: only landslide deadlier than this one was the highland towers 184 00:09:27,030 --> 00:09:31,250 Speaker 1: in 1993 where a residential block collapsed. 41 people lost 185 00:09:31,250 --> 00:09:34,380 Speaker 1: their lives. Then Next on CNN correspondent of FIFA and 186 00:09:34,380 --> 00:09:37,890 Speaker 1: Pamela will talk you through the challenges. Rescuers faced as 187 00:09:37,890 --> 00:09:40,819 Speaker 1: the tumbling rock and earth turned to sticky mud 188 00:09:41,059 --> 00:09:44,170 Speaker 1: and the implications for the organic farm that operated the 189 00:09:44,170 --> 00:09:45,829 Speaker 1: campsite without a license. 190 00:09:49,150 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 1: Hi, my name is julie you and I'm the host 191 00:09:52,010 --> 00:09:55,680 Speaker 1: of the climate conversations. Each week I speak to guests 192 00:09:55,690 --> 00:09:58,310 Speaker 1: who give us tips on how we can protect the 193 00:09:58,309 --> 00:10:01,570 Speaker 1: earth every once in a while. We also have interesting 194 00:10:01,570 --> 00:10:06,100 Speaker 1: stories like how Singapore's first Tesla owner prompted billionaire 195 00:10:06,125 --> 00:10:08,944 Speaker 1: Elon musk to reach out to Prime Minister Lee hsien 196 00:10:08,945 --> 00:10:13,145 Speaker 1: loong or chef who makes the juiciest burgers from only 197 00:10:13,145 --> 00:10:17,175 Speaker 1: plant based ingredients for more stories like these. Look for 198 00:10:17,175 --> 00:10:20,375 Speaker 1: the climate conversations under C. N. A. And me listen 199 00:10:20,385 --> 00:10:22,965 Speaker 1: apps or wherever you get your podcasts, 200 00:10:26,130 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 1: you're back with me steve lie along with RCN a 201 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:31,230 Speaker 1: team in Malaysia FIFA Ariffin and Pamela limb as we 202 00:10:31,230 --> 00:10:34,030 Speaker 1: turn your attention to the recovery efforts at the site 203 00:10:34,030 --> 00:10:36,910 Speaker 1: of the Batang Kali landslide. Here's the account of one 204 00:10:36,910 --> 00:10:40,059 Speaker 1: of the first responders who was on the scene about 205 00:10:40,059 --> 00:10:41,630 Speaker 1: an hour after it occurred. 206 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:49,610 Speaker 2: When we arrived, we saw the entire campsite covered in soil. 207 00:10:49,620 --> 00:10:53,030 Speaker 2: Only a few sites were safe when it was still dark, 208 00:10:53,030 --> 00:10:56,670 Speaker 2: the ground was still hard, it hadn't softened so rescuers 209 00:10:56,670 --> 00:11:00,100 Speaker 2: were able to enter deeper into the campsite to save victims, 210 00:11:00,110 --> 00:11:03,910 Speaker 2: but by morning water had begun seeping into the ground 211 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:06,980 Speaker 2: which made it wet and muddy and shifted a lot 212 00:11:06,990 --> 00:11:09,530 Speaker 2: of the soil. It was very hard for us to 213 00:11:09,530 --> 00:11:10,310 Speaker 2: move and 214 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 2: to identify where the victims could be buried. 215 00:11:14,110 --> 00:11:16,990 Speaker 1: That paints a vivid picture of what rescuers were up 216 00:11:16,990 --> 00:11:20,290 Speaker 1: against searching in the dark for survivors with conditions 217 00:11:20,570 --> 00:11:24,050 Speaker 1: that just got worse. Right? So when we spoke to 218 00:11:24,059 --> 00:11:27,460 Speaker 1: some of the rescuers about what happened on that night, 219 00:11:27,470 --> 00:11:28,959 Speaker 1: a lot of them told us that when they first 220 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:32,580 Speaker 1: received the emergency call saying that there was a landslide 221 00:11:32,580 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 1: involving about 100 people at Batang Kali. Many of them 222 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:39,580 Speaker 1: were shocked. They couldn't believe that there were 100 people 223 00:11:39,580 --> 00:11:41,970 Speaker 1: involved in that area because they said there were no 224 00:11:41,970 --> 00:11:45,230 Speaker 1: buildings in that area and they didn't expect that 225 00:11:45,245 --> 00:11:48,335 Speaker 1: the number of people affected would be that large. When 226 00:11:48,335 --> 00:11:51,145 Speaker 1: they got there, of course it was completely dark. There 227 00:11:51,145 --> 00:11:54,084 Speaker 1: were only maybe a couple of street lights and a 228 00:11:54,085 --> 00:11:57,025 Speaker 1: couple of torch lights that were being used by the 229 00:11:57,025 --> 00:11:59,945 Speaker 1: survivors who managed to dig their way out to safety. 230 00:11:59,955 --> 00:12:02,995 Speaker 1: But they said it was really a race against time. 231 00:12:03,005 --> 00:12:06,574 Speaker 1: When they got there it was completely dark. It was chaotic. 232 00:12:06,585 --> 00:12:09,215 Speaker 1: All they could hear were people shouting for their help 233 00:12:09,225 --> 00:12:09,905 Speaker 1: too 234 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 1: bring them to safety. But then they were also dealing 235 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,390 Speaker 1: with other issues like the uncertainty of whether there was 236 00:12:16,390 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 1: going to be another landslide that could happen at that 237 00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:22,380 Speaker 1: time and because it was dark, they had to move 238 00:12:22,380 --> 00:12:24,970 Speaker 1: really fast. They told me it was only when the 239 00:12:24,970 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 1: sun rose that they could see the site and then 240 00:12:28,530 --> 00:12:31,319 Speaker 1: it only dawned on them just how large an area 241 00:12:31,330 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 1: it was and how much soil they would have to 242 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:34,579 Speaker 1: deal with. 243 00:12:34,595 --> 00:12:38,295 Speaker 1: So their priority when they got there was to get 244 00:12:38,304 --> 00:12:41,395 Speaker 1: the people who were alive out of the site as 245 00:12:41,395 --> 00:12:44,425 Speaker 1: soon as possible and once everyone was brought out to 246 00:12:44,425 --> 00:12:48,064 Speaker 1: safety then they focused on searching for the remaining victims 247 00:12:48,065 --> 00:12:50,955 Speaker 1: who could be buried under the soil and that process 248 00:12:50,955 --> 00:12:54,425 Speaker 1: of rescuing those that were stuck and looking for those 249 00:12:54,425 --> 00:12:57,975 Speaker 1: that hadn't been found then dragged out for several days. 250 00:12:57,975 --> 00:12:59,255 Speaker 1: This rescue operation 251 00:12:59,550 --> 00:13:02,460 Speaker 1: pam at what point did it become clear that it 252 00:13:02,460 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: was moving from becoming a search for survivors to perhaps 253 00:13:07,500 --> 00:13:08,490 Speaker 1: a search for bodies 254 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:12,430 Speaker 1: to be honest, Eve, throughout the nine days at no 255 00:13:12,429 --> 00:13:15,219 Speaker 1: point was it mentioned that rescuers had given up on 256 00:13:15,220 --> 00:13:18,620 Speaker 1: finding survivors, but on high inside, according to experts, we 257 00:13:18,620 --> 00:13:22,630 Speaker 1: spoke to later chances of survival past the 1st 24 258 00:13:22,630 --> 00:13:25,679 Speaker 1: hours were little to none. This was because given the 259 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:28,710 Speaker 1: impact of the soil, the amount of soil that directly 260 00:13:28,710 --> 00:13:32,270 Speaker 1: hit tents and also the magnitude of it where soil 261 00:13:32,270 --> 00:13:36,030 Speaker 1: had piled up more than 10 m high. So rescuers 262 00:13:36,030 --> 00:13:38,160 Speaker 1: and experts say that for landslide, that it 263 00:13:38,235 --> 00:13:41,665 Speaker 1: involved solid structures that could have been pockets. There would 264 00:13:41,665 --> 00:13:45,125 Speaker 1: have been chance for survival, but it's just soil and 265 00:13:45,125 --> 00:13:47,545 Speaker 1: wet soil at that. It was a matter of hoping 266 00:13:47,545 --> 00:13:50,405 Speaker 1: for a miracle. I think the Rescuers knew of the 267 00:13:50,415 --> 00:13:54,885 Speaker 1: very slim to no chance of survival past the 1st 268 00:13:54,885 --> 00:13:57,255 Speaker 1: 24 hours, like what pam said, but a lot of 269 00:13:57,255 --> 00:14:00,735 Speaker 1: them still kept hope. They kept looking for the victim's 270 00:14:00,735 --> 00:14:03,225 Speaker 1: looking for the bodies and just sort of praying that 271 00:14:03,235 --> 00:14:05,635 Speaker 1: there would be a miracle that would happen, that they 272 00:14:05,635 --> 00:14:07,390 Speaker 1: would be able to find someone 273 00:14:07,570 --> 00:14:10,750 Speaker 1: buried but still alive, sadly though that was not to 274 00:14:10,750 --> 00:14:13,020 Speaker 1: be the case. What did it feel like when the 275 00:14:13,020 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: last body that was missing was found from the Rescuers perspective, 276 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:18,580 Speaker 1: When we spoke to them, a lot of them felt 277 00:14:18,580 --> 00:14:22,890 Speaker 1: this sense of relief that they managed to complete their 278 00:14:22,890 --> 00:14:26,290 Speaker 1: mission successfully and that they were able to sort of 279 00:14:26,290 --> 00:14:29,530 Speaker 1: find all of the bodies of the victims and bring 280 00:14:29,530 --> 00:14:30,670 Speaker 1: it back to their family 281 00:14:30,685 --> 00:14:32,855 Speaker 1: so that their families and those who survived would have 282 00:14:32,855 --> 00:14:36,255 Speaker 1: a sense of closure. I think for everyone involved in 283 00:14:36,255 --> 00:14:40,865 Speaker 1: this mission, whether it's the rescuers or whether it's the 284 00:14:40,875 --> 00:14:44,095 Speaker 1: survivors and their families or even as members of the media, 285 00:14:44,105 --> 00:14:47,085 Speaker 1: it was just this huge sense of relief that the 286 00:14:47,085 --> 00:14:49,115 Speaker 1: last victim has been found and things have come to 287 00:14:49,115 --> 00:14:52,485 Speaker 1: a close and the FIFA the organic farm where this happened, 288 00:14:52,495 --> 00:14:53,785 Speaker 1: didn't have a license, 289 00:14:54,060 --> 00:14:55,800 Speaker 1: what's going to happen to them and what are the 290 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:59,900 Speaker 1: wider implications. I think there were a lot of uncertainty 291 00:14:59,900 --> 00:15:03,770 Speaker 1: surrounding what sort of permits and licenses were needed for 292 00:15:03,770 --> 00:15:06,390 Speaker 1: a campsite to operate. There's still a lot of confusion 293 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,610 Speaker 1: speaking to other campsite owners, some of them told me 294 00:15:09,610 --> 00:15:14,300 Speaker 1: that they're not sure exactly what to apply for, whether 295 00:15:14,300 --> 00:15:17,620 Speaker 1: there is a specific camping permit or whether it is 296 00:15:17,620 --> 00:15:18,980 Speaker 1: an accommodation permit. 297 00:15:18,996 --> 00:15:21,226 Speaker 1: So there's still a lot of confusion around there. But 298 00:15:21,226 --> 00:15:23,766 Speaker 1: of course, you know, these campsite operators and a couple 299 00:15:23,766 --> 00:15:25,846 Speaker 1: of avid campus that I spoke to say that there 300 00:15:25,846 --> 00:15:30,706 Speaker 1: should be better guidelines or more firm regulations to allow 301 00:15:30,716 --> 00:15:33,906 Speaker 1: this industry to be better regulated so that people who 302 00:15:33,916 --> 00:15:36,546 Speaker 1: go for camping will know what to do an event 303 00:15:36,546 --> 00:15:39,556 Speaker 1: like this. So we know that the Selangor state government 304 00:15:39,556 --> 00:15:42,106 Speaker 1: has been quick to reach out to stakeholders and have 305 00:15:42,106 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 1: discussions to come up with some sort 306 00:15:43,932 --> 00:15:47,802 Speaker 1: regulations for the industry. An investigation of course is still 307 00:15:47,802 --> 00:15:51,422 Speaker 1: going on about what actually caused this landslide at Batang Kali. 308 00:15:51,432 --> 00:15:55,112 Speaker 1: The authorities have not released the results of the investigation 309 00:15:55,112 --> 00:15:58,182 Speaker 1: just yet. So we cannot speculate anything at this point. 310 00:15:58,192 --> 00:16:02,012 Speaker 1: But we also know that the government is continuing discussions 311 00:16:02,012 --> 00:16:06,072 Speaker 1: with the campsites with the survivors as well. And we're 312 00:16:06,072 --> 00:16:09,132 Speaker 1: expecting something to come out sometime after chinese New year 313 00:16:09,142 --> 00:16:13,450 Speaker 1: and pam some time has passed since this landslide took place. 314 00:16:13,590 --> 00:16:16,430 Speaker 1: What's your sense of how this story has played out 315 00:16:16,430 --> 00:16:18,990 Speaker 1: in Malaysia and how people have reacted to it? I 316 00:16:18,990 --> 00:16:23,060 Speaker 1: think it's really hit close to a lot of Malaysians. 317 00:16:23,070 --> 00:16:27,220 Speaker 1: The stories itself, seeing how many families were involved, how 318 00:16:27,220 --> 00:16:30,950 Speaker 1: many Children were involved. There's also a sense of being 319 00:16:30,950 --> 00:16:31,350 Speaker 1: cautious 320 00:16:31,365 --> 00:16:36,615 Speaker 1: Camping and Eco tourism is quite popular in Malaysia and 321 00:16:36,625 --> 00:16:40,330 Speaker 1: this site that area, Batang Kali being just about 10, 322 00:16:40,330 --> 00:16:43,980 Speaker 1: 15 km from genting highlands. You know, it's sort of 323 00:16:43,990 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 1: make people more cautious too, especially venture in these areas 324 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 1: during the rainy season. 325 00:16:49,310 --> 00:16:52,210 Speaker 1: But at the same time, everyone is also waiting for 326 00:16:52,210 --> 00:16:55,470 Speaker 1: this investigation report to know what exactly caused this because 327 00:16:55,470 --> 00:16:58,020 Speaker 1: we know that the night where the landslide happened, it 328 00:16:58,020 --> 00:17:02,270 Speaker 1: wasn't a rainy night. Previously, people thought landslides happened during 329 00:17:02,270 --> 00:17:05,700 Speaker 1: heavy rainfall after several days of rainfall. So there's a 330 00:17:05,700 --> 00:17:09,270 Speaker 1: lot of uncertainty and people just want to know the 331 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:13,159 Speaker 1: results of the investigation and what's what precautions should they 332 00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:14,780 Speaker 1: take if they were to go cam 333 00:17:15,180 --> 00:17:18,310 Speaker 1: go outdoors and hopefully we'll get those answers in due 334 00:17:18,310 --> 00:17:20,670 Speaker 1: course and we will for sure be covering it on 335 00:17:20,670 --> 00:17:23,030 Speaker 1: Sienna across our different platforms. So our listeners will be 336 00:17:23,030 --> 00:17:25,150 Speaker 1: able to keep an eye out for that one. Just 337 00:17:25,150 --> 00:17:28,410 Speaker 1: one last quick question for both of you actually, perhaps 338 00:17:28,420 --> 00:17:30,810 Speaker 1: you can go first, what's your biggest takeaway from covering 339 00:17:30,810 --> 00:17:33,470 Speaker 1: this story that our listeners may not have picked up? 340 00:17:33,650 --> 00:17:36,510 Speaker 1: I think it's a sense of when the tragedy struck, 341 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:40,230 Speaker 1: just how the entire nation came together to give us 342 00:17:40,230 --> 00:17:40,270 Speaker 1: a 343 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,369 Speaker 1: support and to grieve with the families. We know that 344 00:17:43,380 --> 00:17:46,930 Speaker 1: the rescue efforts involved, all the agencies, whether it's the 345 00:17:46,930 --> 00:17:51,820 Speaker 1: Health Ministry, the Roadworks Department, the Environment Ministry, all the 346 00:17:51,820 --> 00:17:55,619 Speaker 1: rescue agencies, your Fire and Rescue Department, Civil Defense, your police, 347 00:17:55,630 --> 00:17:58,590 Speaker 1: everyone just came together and when we spoke to the 348 00:17:58,590 --> 00:18:01,630 Speaker 1: Rescuers you get a sense that people didn't care which 349 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,090 Speaker 1: agency they came from. Their task was to just save 350 00:18:04,090 --> 00:18:05,750 Speaker 1: as many lives as possible. So they 351 00:18:05,770 --> 00:18:09,090 Speaker 1: all told me that they worked very cohesively as one 352 00:18:09,090 --> 00:18:11,929 Speaker 1: search and rescue unit. We also saw a lot of 353 00:18:11,930 --> 00:18:15,300 Speaker 1: people trying to give as much and contribute as much 354 00:18:15,300 --> 00:18:17,820 Speaker 1: to the search and rescue efforts as possible. We had 355 00:18:17,820 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 1: a lot of ngos coming to give donations to give 356 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,790 Speaker 1: food to the people at the site. Some of them, 357 00:18:24,800 --> 00:18:27,270 Speaker 1: even when there was too much food, they even decided 358 00:18:27,270 --> 00:18:29,940 Speaker 1: to give dog food for the canines who were involved 359 00:18:29,940 --> 00:18:31,230 Speaker 1: in the rescue mission. 360 00:18:31,420 --> 00:18:34,540 Speaker 1: And the outpouring of grief is the whole country that 361 00:18:34,540 --> 00:18:37,699 Speaker 1: was giving together when I was outside primary school. You 362 00:18:37,700 --> 00:18:40,000 Speaker 1: know people had left flowers as a tribute to some 363 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:42,470 Speaker 1: of the teachers who had died in the incident. But 364 00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:45,030 Speaker 1: a lot of the other people who came to put flowers, 365 00:18:45,030 --> 00:18:48,449 Speaker 1: there weren't even people from the school, they told me 366 00:18:48,450 --> 00:18:50,449 Speaker 1: that they had just heard of the story in the 367 00:18:50,450 --> 00:18:53,540 Speaker 1: news and decided to come and pay their respects and tributes. 368 00:18:53,540 --> 00:18:57,109 Speaker 1: So that was very heartwarming to see just really how 369 00:18:57,109 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 1: everyone 370 00:18:57,540 --> 00:19:01,020 Speaker 1: came together to support one another in this tragedy. But 371 00:19:01,020 --> 00:19:03,770 Speaker 1: another thing I think that our viewers didn't get to 372 00:19:03,770 --> 00:19:05,869 Speaker 1: see as much as as we did being on the 373 00:19:05,869 --> 00:19:10,010 Speaker 1: ground was the sheer scale of the landslide when we 374 00:19:10,010 --> 00:19:12,109 Speaker 1: first got to the base that was set up by 375 00:19:12,109 --> 00:19:14,350 Speaker 1: the Fire and Rescue Department, it was outside, so we 376 00:19:14,350 --> 00:19:16,650 Speaker 1: didn't quite have a view of the ground. Zero of 377 00:19:16,660 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 1: the area of the landslide struck. But when we hiked 378 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:22,879 Speaker 1: up about two kilometers right to the top of the hill, 379 00:19:22,890 --> 00:19:23,640 Speaker 1: that was when we 380 00:19:23,650 --> 00:19:26,240 Speaker 1: You could see just how vast it was, just how 381 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:30,679 Speaker 1: much soil had moved from an elevation of about 100 m. 382 00:19:30,690 --> 00:19:34,239 Speaker 1: When we stood there, we realized that this was massive. 383 00:19:34,250 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 1: It was just not a normal landslide. It was really, 384 00:19:37,010 --> 00:19:40,100 Speaker 1: really big from those on the side. Like you said, 385 00:19:40,109 --> 00:19:43,560 Speaker 1: whether it was rescuers or journalists often assumed that we 386 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:46,560 Speaker 1: have to detach from our emotions went on duty. But 387 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:48,730 Speaker 1: in times like this, it's just not possible when we 388 00:19:48,730 --> 00:19:49,750 Speaker 1: spoke to the rescuers 389 00:19:49,770 --> 00:19:52,929 Speaker 1: Because almost every one of them said how heartbreaking it 390 00:19:52,930 --> 00:19:55,869 Speaker 1: was for them to be seeing hearing the news of 391 00:19:55,869 --> 00:19:59,430 Speaker 1: families involved, for them to be bringing out Children, an 392 00:19:59,430 --> 00:20:02,480 Speaker 1: entire family that was who lost their lives while they 393 00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:05,609 Speaker 1: had to manage their emotions, thinking of their loved ones 394 00:20:05,609 --> 00:20:09,679 Speaker 1: back home. It was also motivation for them to soldier 395 00:20:09,680 --> 00:20:12,770 Speaker 1: on despite the fatigue, some of them worked throughout the 396 00:20:12,770 --> 00:20:15,890 Speaker 1: nine days with 2-3 hours of rest in between. 397 00:20:16,030 --> 00:20:19,020 Speaker 1: Their motivation was to at least be able to give 398 00:20:19,020 --> 00:20:22,830 Speaker 1: the family some closure and for us while we reported 399 00:20:22,830 --> 00:20:26,020 Speaker 1: the hard facts and the death toll is just a number. 400 00:20:26,030 --> 00:20:28,770 Speaker 1: But each and every victim has a story has a 401 00:20:28,770 --> 00:20:32,540 Speaker 1: family and these survivors and these families shared their pain 402 00:20:32,550 --> 00:20:34,940 Speaker 1: and grief with us and I think that's something that 403 00:20:34,940 --> 00:20:37,140 Speaker 1: will that will stick with us for a long time. 404 00:20:37,380 --> 00:20:39,700 Speaker 1: And I understand as well that you're putting together a 405 00:20:39,710 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 1: program a special program all about this as well. Yes. 406 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:46,480 Speaker 1: So we're doing a whole episode for CNN correspondent on 407 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,010 Speaker 1: the bottom Cali landslide. So this is where we will 408 00:20:49,010 --> 00:20:52,950 Speaker 1: get to listen from the victims from the rescuers about 409 00:20:52,950 --> 00:20:56,110 Speaker 1: what happened and what unfolded on that fateful night. And 410 00:20:56,109 --> 00:20:59,340 Speaker 1: we'll also look at the regulations surrounding camping. What's going 411 00:20:59,340 --> 00:21:02,300 Speaker 1: to happen? How can the authorities assure people that this 412 00:21:02,300 --> 00:21:05,159 Speaker 1: is a safe activity for everyone to enjoy. 413 00:21:05,530 --> 00:21:07,950 Speaker 1: Keep an eye out for that one on the C. N. A. T. V. 414 00:21:07,950 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 1: That CNN correspondent tv version in the meantime A FIFA 415 00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:13,640 Speaker 1: and Pamela. The presence of you and your cameraman on 416 00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:16,649 Speaker 1: the ground was crucial to our coverage of this tragic 417 00:21:16,650 --> 00:21:19,639 Speaker 1: story as we covered it across all our platforms. Thank 418 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:21,640 Speaker 1: you for that and for speaking to me today. Thanks 419 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:23,510 Speaker 1: for having us. Yeah thanks for having us. 420 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:27,850 Speaker 1: Natural disasters are often accompanied by tragedy and are always 421 00:21:27,850 --> 00:21:31,270 Speaker 1: difficult to cover unpredictable in nature and with stakes at 422 00:21:31,270 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: the highest level of life and death time is of 423 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,430 Speaker 1: the essence quick thinking and the right resources are needed 424 00:21:37,619 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 1: in an often unknown and unpredictable environment. You hope for 425 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:41,810 Speaker 1: the best 426 00:21:42,510 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: but must be ready for the worst. 427 00:21:44,650 --> 00:21:48,150 Speaker 1: The Tv version CNN correspondent airs on sienna every Wednesday 428 00:21:48,150 --> 00:21:51,010 Speaker 1: at 9:30 p.m. You can also watch it whenever and 429 00:21:51,010 --> 00:21:53,750 Speaker 1: wherever you like on CNN dot asia do you like 430 00:21:53,750 --> 00:21:56,109 Speaker 1: and subscribe to this podcast version that takes you behind 431 00:21:56,109 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: the scenes with our correspondents so you don't miss a 432 00:21:58,240 --> 00:21:59,139 Speaker 1: single episode. 433 00:21:59,790 --> 00:22:02,060 Speaker 1: Our podcast team is made up of Clara on Christina 434 00:22:02,060 --> 00:22:04,710 Speaker 1: robert and me steve. Thank you for listening.