1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,110 Speaker 1: Hi hazel zero. And I'm jermaine and welcome back to 2 00:00:03,110 --> 00:00:08,730 Speaker 1: another episode of calamities podcast. Today we have the beautiful 3 00:00:08,730 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: guest in the house. Welcome Justin Sokka uh 4 00:00:13,940 --> 00:00:17,599 Speaker 1: look at us. We're all dressed in black. Come on adjustment. 5 00:00:17,610 --> 00:00:20,060 Speaker 1: The crew is dressed in black as well and I 6 00:00:20,060 --> 00:00:20,650 Speaker 1: brought this. 7 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:29,420 Speaker 1: No, you keep it on the whole show. Okay 8 00:00:29,430 --> 00:00:32,980 Speaker 2: damn. You 9 00:00:32,979 --> 00:00:35,100 Speaker 1: know, we're so thankful to jasmine for taking time out 10 00:00:35,100 --> 00:00:38,659 Speaker 1: of a busy schedule to come here. So, you know, 11 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 1: gentlemen, how has everything been for you recently? 12 00:00:41,409 --> 00:00:45,540 Speaker 2: Mm Everything has been moving but it's a lot slower 13 00:00:45,540 --> 00:00:48,320 Speaker 2: than before. But at the same time I think like 14 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:51,500 Speaker 2: I'm slowly finding my own rhythm in my own place. 15 00:00:51,510 --> 00:00:53,230 Speaker 2: That's nice to hear. So 16 00:00:53,229 --> 00:00:55,050 Speaker 1: I don't know about you girls, but I haven't seen 17 00:00:55,060 --> 00:01:00,750 Speaker 1: jasmine without her visor or her mask all at one time. Actually, right. Yeah. 18 00:01:00,940 --> 00:01:03,010 Speaker 1: Actually right. I don't think she knows this, but I 19 00:01:03,010 --> 00:01:10,860 Speaker 1: have breaking news. Are you sure? It's right. I'm very sure. 20 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:15,580 Speaker 1: Okay. Because I think a couple of years ago, um 21 00:01:15,590 --> 00:01:17,899 Speaker 1: within uh, calm down, 22 00:01:17,910 --> 00:01:19,060 Speaker 2: calm down and 23 00:01:19,060 --> 00:01:21,220 Speaker 1: it just so happened that I'm always the nicest room. 24 00:01:21,230 --> 00:01:24,430 Speaker 1: So she was in my room. I can't remember. So 25 00:01:24,440 --> 00:01:26,380 Speaker 1: she had come in and I remember I should go 26 00:01:26,390 --> 00:01:29,210 Speaker 1: a let me see your face. I was right there. 27 00:01:29,220 --> 00:01:32,860 Speaker 1: I 28 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:36,230 Speaker 1: I do, yes, I did. Oh my gosh, okay. So 29 00:01:36,230 --> 00:01:38,810 Speaker 1: for all of you, who has never seen jasmine. So 30 00:01:38,810 --> 00:01:41,300 Speaker 1: go before. I'm sure there will be like netizens out there, 31 00:01:41,310 --> 00:01:44,380 Speaker 1: you know, take a screenshot of you in your mask 32 00:01:44,390 --> 00:01:47,630 Speaker 1: and you and your visor and trying to piece them together. 33 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:52,580 Speaker 1: So I have, is this how you look like? Just mean? 34 00:01:52,590 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 1: Is this how you look like? 35 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,990 Speaker 1: I 36 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:03,419 Speaker 2: know you don't you don't even like use photo shop, 37 00:02:03,430 --> 00:02:04,290 Speaker 1: you just 38 00:02:04,290 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 2: crop and you put down your 39 00:02:05,730 --> 00:02:08,230 Speaker 1: photo greed in my phone. Okay, I think this is 40 00:02:08,230 --> 00:02:10,700 Speaker 1: the best like this, this is the best I can do. 41 00:02:10,710 --> 00:02:14,180 Speaker 1: You know how how to find it and good. I 42 00:02:14,190 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: think we can establish that gentleman is beautiful with or 43 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:19,950 Speaker 1: without Hamas. Exactly. I 44 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:21,700 Speaker 2: describe this expression 45 00:02:21,710 --> 00:02:26,660 Speaker 1: like yo yo man, yo Yeah, I love that. The 46 00:02:26,660 --> 00:02:30,850 Speaker 1: effort that he's put into it. My goodness. But so 47 00:02:30,860 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: Jasmine is here today to talk about something that I 48 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,790 Speaker 1: think is really relevant to her and we are going 49 00:02:35,790 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: to be discussing the policing of women's clothes. That is 50 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:41,660 Speaker 1: the topic for today, and I feel like you are 51 00:02:41,660 --> 00:02:44,190 Speaker 1: someone that does not conform to, you know, a certain 52 00:02:44,190 --> 00:02:46,230 Speaker 1: gender identity and you try to break out of that. So, 53 00:02:46,230 --> 00:02:47,359 Speaker 1: tell us a bit more about it. 54 00:02:47,540 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think for myself since young, I I've always 55 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:55,309 Speaker 2: loved wearing baggy clothes. I've been very tomboys growing up. 56 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,660 Speaker 2: I always get clothes from my brother's wardrobe or I 57 00:02:57,660 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 2: would shop in like male section and then I tend 58 00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:03,010 Speaker 2: to wear things that are like oversized and I found 59 00:03:03,010 --> 00:03:04,359 Speaker 2: it super comfortable 60 00:03:04,540 --> 00:03:08,350 Speaker 2: and empowering so that when I started just minutes ago, 61 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:11,150 Speaker 2: like the key idea was to wear a lot more 62 00:03:11,150 --> 00:03:14,660 Speaker 2: androgynous outfits, but of course like that change right with 63 00:03:14,669 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 2: each and every M. V. I get like style this 64 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:20,380 Speaker 2: on board, and then every time like stylist would put 65 00:03:20,380 --> 00:03:22,450 Speaker 2: me in different outfits and that's what we like grew 66 00:03:22,450 --> 00:03:24,550 Speaker 2: out of this like biggie 67 00:03:24,940 --> 00:03:27,570 Speaker 2: clothes that I always wear and I tried different things 68 00:03:27,570 --> 00:03:33,210 Speaker 2: like heels, moss skirts, dresses. So ever since then it's 69 00:03:33,210 --> 00:03:36,510 Speaker 2: been quite a journey, but I'm also just wearing black 70 00:03:36,510 --> 00:03:39,590 Speaker 2: color and I realized that even though you're confined to 71 00:03:39,590 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 2: just one color, there's so much innovation that can still happen. 72 00:03:43,490 --> 00:03:44,260 Speaker 2: Uh 73 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:44,660 Speaker 2: So 74 00:03:44,660 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: question has any like netizens flamed you for putting your 75 00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:52,550 Speaker 1: mask on advisors on saying nasty remarks like what you 76 00:03:52,550 --> 00:03:53,510 Speaker 1: have to do this 77 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:57,850 Speaker 2: and stuff like that. Maybe once in a while sometimes 78 00:03:57,860 --> 00:04:01,980 Speaker 2: when I joined certain shows, right? Like when I was 79 00:04:01,980 --> 00:04:04,580 Speaker 2: in china and then I have hate us, and then 80 00:04:04,580 --> 00:04:08,110 Speaker 2: people just find every reason and come to you and 81 00:04:08,110 --> 00:04:11,490 Speaker 2: then it doesn't get to me honestly, because I feel 82 00:04:11,490 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 2: like I know the reason of why I even choose 83 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:20,010 Speaker 2: to wear a mask, so it shouldn't be about other 84 00:04:20,010 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 2: people finding an issue with it. 85 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:23,260 Speaker 2: So I can 86 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:26,470 Speaker 2: very unbothered by it. I would say that's great. 87 00:04:26,470 --> 00:04:30,270 Speaker 1: That's nice to hear. Yeah, correct me if I'm wrong, 88 00:04:30,270 --> 00:04:34,580 Speaker 1: but it's the reason for this that you wanted people 89 00:04:34,580 --> 00:04:38,510 Speaker 1: to see you for your music and not for how 90 00:04:38,510 --> 00:04:38,690 Speaker 1: you 91 00:04:38,690 --> 00:04:39,150 Speaker 2: look. 92 00:04:39,740 --> 00:04:42,429 Speaker 2: So in the beginning, right? It was so much more 93 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:46,460 Speaker 2: of having an object that I can hide behind so 94 00:04:46,460 --> 00:04:50,650 Speaker 2: that people would deflect attention away from me to my music. 95 00:04:50,660 --> 00:04:54,859 Speaker 2: But then as time passes by with every different envy, 96 00:04:55,339 --> 00:04:58,349 Speaker 2: the mass keeps changing. And then I started like resilient 97 00:04:58,350 --> 00:05:01,980 Speaker 2: different parts of my face and it's become more of 98 00:05:01,980 --> 00:05:05,089 Speaker 2: an extension of my identity, more so than an object 99 00:05:05,089 --> 00:05:06,440 Speaker 2: for media hype behind. 100 00:05:06,450 --> 00:05:09,030 Speaker 1: That's nice, awesome. So I think you know it really 101 00:05:09,029 --> 00:05:11,870 Speaker 1: represents what we want to talk about today because as women, right, 102 00:05:11,880 --> 00:05:14,450 Speaker 1: we can never win when it comes to clothes you dress. 103 00:05:14,460 --> 00:05:16,580 Speaker 1: You know you cover up too much. People say you 104 00:05:16,580 --> 00:05:19,250 Speaker 1: you with the little people also say you what is 105 00:05:19,250 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: this obsession with what women wear? And it's so crazy 106 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 1: if you think about it, A bikini and a burqa 107 00:05:25,250 --> 00:05:29,100 Speaker 1: are both icons of objectification. How can that be? It's 108 00:05:29,100 --> 00:05:32,159 Speaker 1: so ironic. Right? Um and so we want to discuss 109 00:05:32,170 --> 00:05:34,770 Speaker 1: how much skin is too much skin based on our 110 00:05:34,770 --> 00:05:38,880 Speaker 1: personal experiences and should we really even care about these things. 111 00:05:38,890 --> 00:05:40,159 Speaker 1: Do you think this is too much skin? 112 00:05:41,339 --> 00:05:45,870 Speaker 1: You know, are you cold a little? You go with 113 00:05:45,870 --> 00:05:52,659 Speaker 1: the deputy head? Okay, not bad. Huh? Okay. So let 114 00:05:52,660 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: me pose a question to the floor right now. Have 115 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:58,589 Speaker 1: you all ever experienced a situation where someone perhaps a 116 00:05:58,589 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: man has told you that you are too covered up 117 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:05,859 Speaker 1: or too sexy? Too covered up or to sexier. 118 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:09,029 Speaker 1: My father in law. Uh my father was a media 119 00:06:09,870 --> 00:06:14,080 Speaker 1: uh that means that you're wearing too little is not 120 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:14,550 Speaker 1: good 121 00:06:15,140 --> 00:06:16,160 Speaker 1: Other than that? 122 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:18,480 Speaker 1: I honestly don't think so. What would you tell your 123 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:20,860 Speaker 1: father then? Yeah. Well they always trying to get, 124 00:06:21,339 --> 00:06:21,659 Speaker 1: yeah, 125 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:24,460 Speaker 1: I will wear a jacket later, but I never doula. 126 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:27,480 Speaker 1: Okay, so jasmine, has that ever happened to you 127 00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:31,370 Speaker 2: before? Strange enough, I get more of people telling me 128 00:06:31,370 --> 00:06:35,360 Speaker 2: that I'm very covered up more so than revealing. I 129 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:38,150 Speaker 2: think to give a more extreme example would be like 130 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:41,380 Speaker 2: we're all around the same age right up to date. 131 00:06:41,390 --> 00:06:45,690 Speaker 2: I don't own a beginning. So I guess for me 132 00:06:45,690 --> 00:06:48,770 Speaker 2: it's not that I have anything against like showing more skin, 133 00:06:48,779 --> 00:06:52,410 Speaker 2: but I just think that I either don't have enough 134 00:06:52,410 --> 00:06:56,659 Speaker 2: friends who asked me to the beach. Uh like uh 135 00:06:56,839 --> 00:06:59,180 Speaker 2: basically I don't I don't go to a beach often 136 00:06:59,180 --> 00:07:02,529 Speaker 2: enough to to meet one right black beginning. And even 137 00:07:02,529 --> 00:07:04,589 Speaker 2: if even if I do go to a beach, I 138 00:07:04,589 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 2: feel like I would have won something different, something 139 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:12,380 Speaker 2: Yeah, just something comfortable. And and to that, like I 140 00:07:12,380 --> 00:07:16,170 Speaker 2: also think that maybe to some women, it's empowering right 141 00:07:16,170 --> 00:07:18,870 Speaker 2: to just to just like show their skin and be 142 00:07:18,870 --> 00:07:22,040 Speaker 2: comfortable in it for me. I also feel that kind 143 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:25,860 Speaker 2: of empowerment in just covering up and then just dressing 144 00:07:25,940 --> 00:07:28,850 Speaker 2: like baggy clothes and feeling like comfortable and just 145 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:32,750 Speaker 2: sitting in whatever position I like, you know, sorry. When 146 00:07:32,750 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 1: you say that people have mentioned that you're 147 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:38,990 Speaker 1: more covered up than you are showing skin. Do they 148 00:07:38,990 --> 00:07:42,620 Speaker 1: say that with the underlying tone that maybe you should 149 00:07:42,620 --> 00:07:43,090 Speaker 1: show more 150 00:07:43,090 --> 00:07:47,920 Speaker 2: skin? No, they don't, they don't. It's just a casual remark. Yeah. 151 00:07:47,930 --> 00:07:50,110 Speaker 2: It's just a casual remark like guys were telling me 152 00:07:50,110 --> 00:07:52,060 Speaker 2: things like, oh, you're just very quiet. 153 00:07:52,140 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 2: Yeah. And then it never registered my hate much like, oh, 154 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:59,460 Speaker 2: is it a compliment or is it an inside? I 155 00:07:59,460 --> 00:08:02,370 Speaker 2: just take it like neutrally and I'm like, knowledge. I 156 00:08:02,370 --> 00:08:05,130 Speaker 2: love to wear winter clothes in a place like Singapore. 157 00:08:05,140 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 2: I mean, look, 158 00:08:06,340 --> 00:08:07,989 Speaker 1: you 159 00:08:07,990 --> 00:08:12,170 Speaker 2: hold on. Uh, I think about the Thangka, so it's 160 00:08:12,170 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 2: a bit too much. I 161 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:17,680 Speaker 1: think. What about userra? I'm sure being in like, you know, 162 00:08:17,690 --> 00:08:22,750 Speaker 1: your community, uh, there may be more restrictions than usual 163 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:24,500 Speaker 1: when it comes to clothes. 164 00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:30,890 Speaker 1: Had the singer where the starter, I think for me 165 00:08:30,890 --> 00:08:34,140 Speaker 1: because I don't really care what people think or what 166 00:08:34,140 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 1: people say. I'm a bit, I've always lived my life. 167 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: I'll do it about what do you know? Yes. Yeah. 168 00:08:39,650 --> 00:08:42,870 Speaker 1: And I will not hide things, which means that if 169 00:08:42,870 --> 00:08:45,760 Speaker 1: I'm gonna wear something a bit more exposed, 170 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:47,949 Speaker 1: I will not wear a jacket just to get out 171 00:08:47,950 --> 00:08:50,060 Speaker 1: of the house. I will 172 00:08:50,140 --> 00:08:52,319 Speaker 1: where it is, it is, my mother makes noise means 173 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 1: my mother make nice. It's okay. I would rather than 174 00:08:56,440 --> 00:09:00,500 Speaker 1: I rather than than do sort of like pretend it 175 00:09:00,500 --> 00:09:05,710 Speaker 1: just makes me uncomfortable. Yeah, but I think working where 176 00:09:05,710 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: I do, um I do get comments more often from 177 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 1: people I don't know As compared to people I do. 178 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:19,579 Speaker 1: Um that includes people I work with as well. Um 179 00:09:19,580 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 1: who sometimes give me remind us that especially if it's 180 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:29,470 Speaker 1: going to be content for the brand, um they cannot 181 00:09:29,470 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 1: have this and that. 182 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, so that frustrates me sometimes. I've also um seen 183 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:39,250 Speaker 1: strangers comments like there was once I was in a 184 00:09:39,260 --> 00:09:41,250 Speaker 1: ripped pair of jeans 185 00:09:41,740 --> 00:09:44,850 Speaker 1: and it's like here here, it's not like on my 186 00:09:44,850 --> 00:09:48,569 Speaker 1: ass and things, right? And then this person commented, if 187 00:09:48,570 --> 00:09:51,300 Speaker 1: you're gonna wear pence with holes like that, you might 188 00:09:51,300 --> 00:09:54,350 Speaker 1: as well just don't wear any pence. How does that 189 00:09:54,350 --> 00:09:57,060 Speaker 1: make sense? And the person proceeded to say like 190 00:09:57,340 --> 00:10:03,439 Speaker 1: no brainer. Where does this is what women go through 191 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:05,839 Speaker 1: on the daily and I think it's just, it's crazy. 192 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:07,600 Speaker 1: I mean, I've had a guy come up to me 193 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:08,650 Speaker 1: before and see that 194 00:10:08,740 --> 00:10:10,449 Speaker 1: actually you're not very sexy. 195 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 1: You know why you're as sexy as a hot chilli. Okay, 196 00:10:14,740 --> 00:10:18,230 Speaker 1: I'm alright. No, someone, someone commented on my Tiktok that 197 00:10:18,230 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: day and said, your body shape is weird. Then I 198 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:23,870 Speaker 1: shot a seven. I was laughing about it. I was like, no, 199 00:10:23,870 --> 00:10:29,290 Speaker 1: your body shape is sexy. I know, I know, but 200 00:10:29,290 --> 00:10:31,270 Speaker 1: the ironic thing is that because, you know, I don't 201 00:10:31,270 --> 00:10:33,860 Speaker 1: have much to show up here. I'm president of the 202 00:10:33,860 --> 00:10:38,260 Speaker 1: itty bitty titty committee trying to get a VIP membership. 203 00:10:38,540 --> 00:10:41,709 Speaker 1: So I don't show the cleavage, right? And that's probably 204 00:10:41,710 --> 00:10:45,890 Speaker 1: why they associate that they associate cleavage with sexiness. In fact, 205 00:10:45,890 --> 00:10:49,429 Speaker 1: I think in recent days, right? Not having too much 206 00:10:49,429 --> 00:10:52,570 Speaker 1: of a cleavages sexually sexier. Oh is it? I feel 207 00:10:52,580 --> 00:10:57,320 Speaker 1: I feel like the flat chest kind of like black, 208 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:58,650 Speaker 2: you know, comforting 209 00:10:58,660 --> 00:11:03,610 Speaker 1: you. Do you you do you? Yeah, okay, here's something 210 00:11:03,610 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 1: that I think is really ironic with regards to cleavage. 211 00:11:06,410 --> 00:11:09,459 Speaker 1: You know, some people say you showed so much cleavage, 212 00:11:09,460 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: you got no self respect mint. 213 00:11:11,140 --> 00:11:13,340 Speaker 1: Then some people say you cover up so much. Actually 214 00:11:13,340 --> 00:11:15,189 Speaker 1: you look better if you show a bit more know 215 00:11:15,190 --> 00:11:17,319 Speaker 1: that some people say you show so much, but I 216 00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:19,060 Speaker 1: think it shows your heart? Ah 217 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: Exactly, right? I've heard this in the industry before where 218 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:25,540 Speaker 1: someone's worn a blazer and then it's really low cut 219 00:11:25,550 --> 00:11:28,020 Speaker 1: and then some guys made some comments. Why is she 220 00:11:28,020 --> 00:11:30,110 Speaker 1: when you're like that? She got nothing. Sure this is 221 00:11:30,110 --> 00:11:32,080 Speaker 1: what we go through. If there are any men listening, 222 00:11:32,090 --> 00:11:34,650 Speaker 1: please shame on you. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. 223 00:11:34,660 --> 00:11:37,949 Speaker 1: We want to communicate. And under small mindful of what 224 00:11:37,950 --> 00:11:39,650 Speaker 1: you say, that's right. Yeah. 225 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:42,990 Speaker 1: So what do you think jasmine being in this industry? 226 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:45,050 Speaker 1: Being in the media, right? I'm sure you've seen a 227 00:11:45,050 --> 00:11:48,400 Speaker 1: lot of people in different countries, how do you protect 228 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:48,929 Speaker 1: your sense 229 00:11:48,929 --> 00:11:52,620 Speaker 2: of identity? I would say like maybe always start off 230 00:11:52,620 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 2: like knowing who you are, who you stand for and 231 00:11:56,290 --> 00:12:02,109 Speaker 2: always prioritize your own comfort. No threshold. Sometimes you need 232 00:12:02,110 --> 00:12:06,010 Speaker 2: to kind of like adapt into like the context and 233 00:12:06,010 --> 00:12:09,459 Speaker 2: be respectful. But also at the same times, like don't 234 00:12:09,460 --> 00:12:12,870 Speaker 2: compromise who you are or surrounding yourself with people that 235 00:12:12,870 --> 00:12:14,839 Speaker 2: you trust always helps. You know, if you have a 236 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,530 Speaker 2: team of people that you trust, let's say that you're 237 00:12:17,530 --> 00:12:19,160 Speaker 2: wearing something very revealing 238 00:12:19,340 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 2: and then you have your inner shoot. But then if 239 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,650 Speaker 2: you're working with people that you trust, like you just 240 00:12:24,650 --> 00:12:26,400 Speaker 2: know that they will have your back and they were 241 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:28,390 Speaker 2: then there were no the limit and they wouldn't go 242 00:12:28,390 --> 00:12:30,470 Speaker 2: over the line, that's 243 00:12:30,470 --> 00:12:33,220 Speaker 1: it. Have you ever encountered any stylist who tried to 244 00:12:33,220 --> 00:12:36,550 Speaker 1: put you in something a bit more revealing? Oh, 245 00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:40,160 Speaker 2: I would say like it's always a communication. Okay, so 246 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:40,459 Speaker 2: you won't 247 00:12:40,460 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: be afraid to say like no, I don't want this. 248 00:12:42,410 --> 00:12:46,460 Speaker 2: Yeah, I would just outrightly like specifically like state everything. 249 00:12:46,460 --> 00:12:49,830 Speaker 2: Like very specifically like this is what I can accept 250 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:54,000 Speaker 2: this is what I can. But then sometimes when I see, 251 00:12:54,010 --> 00:12:56,710 Speaker 2: I mean, okay for me, maybe I separate just like 252 00:12:56,710 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 2: Mark clearly, right? Like when I do my artist project, 253 00:12:59,970 --> 00:13:02,860 Speaker 2: then I see it as more of an art form. 254 00:13:02,870 --> 00:13:05,300 Speaker 2: So sometimes when I do shoot and I do, like 255 00:13:05,300 --> 00:13:06,460 Speaker 2: I said an outfit a lot, 256 00:13:06,540 --> 00:13:09,200 Speaker 2: I don't want to compromise the aesthetic of the outfit 257 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:11,250 Speaker 2: by wearing something that could 258 00:13:11,340 --> 00:13:14,260 Speaker 2: change how the outfit looks. So I would like have 259 00:13:14,260 --> 00:13:17,480 Speaker 2: a discussion, we say like the photographer or videographer style 260 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 2: is about how we can each do our pet to 261 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 2: make sure that I'm comfortable and at the same time, 262 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 2: like the outfit can still be showing the way that 263 00:13:26,250 --> 00:13:27,579 Speaker 2: it should. So 264 00:13:27,580 --> 00:13:30,460 Speaker 1: I've seen one of your photographs, right? You would in 265 00:13:30,460 --> 00:13:30,860 Speaker 1: this like 266 00:13:30,940 --> 00:13:35,550 Speaker 1: black outfit. Yeah, it cuts like quite low down the back. 267 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:38,170 Speaker 2: I know what you're talking about. 268 00:13:38,179 --> 00:13:40,070 Speaker 1: Was that the one that made it up on the 269 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:40,310 Speaker 1: bill 270 00:13:40,309 --> 00:13:43,580 Speaker 2: Book? There's one Right? Times Square. My God, that was 271 00:13:43,590 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 1: amazing. You got a nice bag by 272 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 2: the way, sexyback. Yeah. 273 00:13:49,170 --> 00:13:49,960 Speaker 1: So we okay. That 274 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:53,160 Speaker 2: yeah, I didn't think too much about it. Neither did 275 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:55,309 Speaker 2: I have a talk with my parents. So 276 00:13:55,309 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 1: they're more open up with like the kind of clothes 277 00:13:57,880 --> 00:13:58,300 Speaker 1: you wear 278 00:13:58,300 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 2: and it's situational if my mom attends like my rehearsal 279 00:14:02,490 --> 00:14:06,949 Speaker 2: or like my performance when I'm in the dressing room, 280 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:10,880 Speaker 2: then she'll get super productive or my manager too. So 281 00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 2: I think it's the moms in my life, like super 282 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:17,430 Speaker 1: productive. That's nice and I think it's very important that 283 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,300 Speaker 1: just mean herself knows what she wants to be put in, 284 00:14:21,310 --> 00:14:23,180 Speaker 1: you know, and she's not afraid to stand up for 285 00:14:23,180 --> 00:14:26,020 Speaker 1: herself correct. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. I think 286 00:14:26,020 --> 00:14:28,700 Speaker 1: that's really amazing for all the young women that look 287 00:14:28,700 --> 00:14:32,780 Speaker 1: up to you. They find that sense of empowerment as well. Yeah, 288 00:14:32,790 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: that's awesome. Okay, so we want to talk a bit 289 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 1: more about 290 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:38,700 Speaker 1: the sexualization of women in sports. I know this is 291 00:14:38,700 --> 00:14:40,890 Speaker 1: a different industry from us, but I think this is 292 00:14:40,900 --> 00:14:43,490 Speaker 1: really huge news that came out this year. Right? So 293 00:14:43,490 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: there is a paralympic world champion. Um she was actually 294 00:14:47,250 --> 00:14:51,070 Speaker 1: left speechless when an official in the championships told her 295 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,990 Speaker 1: your briefs are two shot and inappropriate and in the 296 00:14:54,990 --> 00:14:58,220 Speaker 1: rules itself, right? Even states you can't wear anything that's 297 00:14:58,220 --> 00:15:03,820 Speaker 1: translucent because if you do, you could impede the judge's view. Okay, 298 00:15:03,820 --> 00:15:06,810 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, is that the woman's problem or the judges problem? 299 00:15:06,820 --> 00:15:08,500 Speaker 1: But well if I'm not wrong, the rules of the 300 00:15:08,500 --> 00:15:12,560 Speaker 1: competition didn't state the length of the shots, the briefs, right? 301 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:16,830 Speaker 1: So technically she can't be faulted for what she was wearing. Yeah. 302 00:15:16,830 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 1: And I think this made the headlines. This went up 303 00:15:19,330 --> 00:15:21,050 Speaker 1: like blood on twitter and stuff like that. And many 304 00:15:21,050 --> 00:15:25,150 Speaker 1: people really stood up for this world champion called Olivia Breen. 305 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: What do you think? I 306 00:15:26,290 --> 00:15:29,030 Speaker 2: mean, I think that when it comes to something like 307 00:15:29,030 --> 00:15:32,870 Speaker 2: a profession like first of all the piratey would be 308 00:15:32,870 --> 00:15:37,369 Speaker 2: to wear something that would make you excel in the spots. Right? 309 00:15:37,380 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 2: That's the most important part, but the same time I 310 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:43,110 Speaker 2: also feel that is a bit inevitable in a sense 311 00:15:43,110 --> 00:15:44,460 Speaker 2: that um 312 00:15:44,540 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 2: when it comes to women and standards, it differs around 313 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:48,350 Speaker 2: the world 314 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:51,410 Speaker 2: and then when it comes to an event like the olympics, 315 00:15:51,420 --> 00:15:56,460 Speaker 2: it's like broadcasted globally. So different people from different places 316 00:15:56,460 --> 00:15:59,670 Speaker 2: would have different ideas of women and some of them 317 00:15:59,670 --> 00:16:03,160 Speaker 2: were deemed this to be like unacceptable. So I think 318 00:16:03,170 --> 00:16:05,750 Speaker 2: maybe there needs to be a broader understanding 319 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:07,770 Speaker 2: in general. It's interesting 320 00:16:07,770 --> 00:16:10,180 Speaker 1: that you bring up, you know, it's different and everywhere. 321 00:16:10,190 --> 00:16:12,690 Speaker 1: I mean firstly we can establish that would a male 322 00:16:12,690 --> 00:16:13,550 Speaker 1: athlete b 323 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:16,840 Speaker 1: treated this week if the male athlete was in like 324 00:16:16,850 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: a very sharp pair of briefs, I don't think he 325 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:21,610 Speaker 1: could have escaped this as well. I mean, that would 326 00:16:21,610 --> 00:16:22,850 Speaker 1: look even more, 327 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,550 Speaker 1: wow, they're like a female in the same sharp pair 328 00:16:26,550 --> 00:16:29,860 Speaker 1: of briefs. Right? Perhaps, perhaps. Yeah, but the ironic thing 329 00:16:29,870 --> 00:16:33,130 Speaker 1: is that in another sport this is beach handball. Right? 330 00:16:33,130 --> 00:16:38,780 Speaker 1: The whole team was actually find 1000 $700 for not 331 00:16:38,790 --> 00:16:41,990 Speaker 1: wearing bikini bottoms. So what were they wearing? They were 332 00:16:41,990 --> 00:16:45,420 Speaker 1: basically wearing like shots and all that. Right. But the 333 00:16:45,420 --> 00:16:46,660 Speaker 1: rules stipulated 334 00:16:46,740 --> 00:16:50,220 Speaker 1: that they must wear bikini bottoms. It's actually in the 335 00:16:50,220 --> 00:16:53,990 Speaker 1: rule book of the sport. Yes. Why? Okay, so here's 336 00:16:53,990 --> 00:16:57,060 Speaker 1: what they say athletes, uniforms and accessories contribute to helping 337 00:16:57,060 --> 00:17:00,990 Speaker 1: athletes increase the performance as well as remain coherent with 338 00:17:00,990 --> 00:17:04,930 Speaker 1: the sportive and attractive image of the spot. Also must 339 00:17:04,930 --> 00:17:09,810 Speaker 1: look attractive. Why it's a spot. What modeling contest? No, 340 00:17:09,810 --> 00:17:14,860 Speaker 1: I'm very angry. Very ironic. These two situations. One you get, 341 00:17:14,869 --> 00:17:17,580 Speaker 1: you know, flame for wearing too much when you get 342 00:17:17,580 --> 00:17:20,930 Speaker 1: flamed for wearing too little. Exactly, but well, good news 343 00:17:20,930 --> 00:17:24,980 Speaker 1: is for years, female athletes, they have been fighting back, right? 344 00:17:24,980 --> 00:17:28,400 Speaker 1: So there's these few german gymnast, they made a stand 345 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:30,270 Speaker 1: by completing the Tokyo olympics 346 00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:34,929 Speaker 1: in full body leotards to protest against the sexual sexualization 347 00:17:34,930 --> 00:17:37,860 Speaker 1: of spot. Usually they were the one that cuts upright, 348 00:17:37,869 --> 00:17:41,010 Speaker 1: cuts up your thighs, but in this case they went 349 00:17:41,010 --> 00:17:44,280 Speaker 1: for the full body one and I think it's okay, 350 00:17:44,290 --> 00:17:46,209 Speaker 1: it's okay. And they really made like a name for 351 00:17:46,210 --> 00:17:48,550 Speaker 1: themselves just by this. Yeah, I think it makes a 352 00:17:48,550 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: statement and people can appreciate your craft more than the 353 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:54,630 Speaker 1: way that you look, right? So let's bring it home 354 00:17:54,630 --> 00:17:57,169 Speaker 1: a little bit to us and our personal experience, 355 00:17:57,240 --> 00:17:59,580 Speaker 1: policing of women's clothes is not a new thing. And 356 00:17:59,580 --> 00:18:01,830 Speaker 1: we all grew up in schools where I'm sure we 357 00:18:01,830 --> 00:18:03,990 Speaker 1: all can escorting for one thing or another, I just 358 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:08,450 Speaker 1: shot a kind of thing. Tell us more. Like when 359 00:18:08,450 --> 00:18:10,260 Speaker 1: you were in school, did you ever 360 00:18:10,740 --> 00:18:11,689 Speaker 1: gonna get 361 00:18:12,230 --> 00:18:16,490 Speaker 2: okay? There was one trouble that I can sue. I 362 00:18:16,490 --> 00:18:21,590 Speaker 2: cannot get over in secondary school ankle socks were Ben, 363 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 2: did you get 364 00:18:22,890 --> 00:18:24,900 Speaker 1: this scenario? 365 00:18:24,910 --> 00:18:25,750 Speaker 2: And then like we did with 366 00:18:27,140 --> 00:18:28,950 Speaker 1: the Oh 367 00:18:29,540 --> 00:18:33,629 Speaker 2: yeah, so ankle socks were banned and I could never 368 00:18:33,630 --> 00:18:36,669 Speaker 2: understand why, because the height of my socks should not 369 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:41,920 Speaker 2: correlate to my results on me being a bad student, right? So, 370 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:45,969 Speaker 2: I would purposefully well, like, ankle socks around to be 371 00:18:45,970 --> 00:18:48,890 Speaker 2: caught by teachers, so that I can ask them like 372 00:18:48,890 --> 00:18:51,740 Speaker 2: why why is this band? Because I can understand what 373 00:18:51,740 --> 00:18:54,669 Speaker 2: it's like shot dinner force got right or like 374 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,450 Speaker 2: tape up pens. That's why guys, right? 375 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:00,820 Speaker 2: Yeah, but I could never get over the ankle. So 376 00:19:01,609 --> 00:19:04,900 Speaker 1: rational is a secondary school girl. But you challenge your 377 00:19:04,900 --> 00:19:06,670 Speaker 1: teacher right? What were your teachers say? 378 00:19:07,140 --> 00:19:10,270 Speaker 2: I didn't get any good answer. 379 00:19:10,740 --> 00:19:13,050 Speaker 2: And then that time I was so I think it 380 00:19:13,050 --> 00:19:16,000 Speaker 2: was set for something. So so it was the whole 381 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:20,050 Speaker 2: like old level period. Yeah. And gradually like that just 382 00:19:20,050 --> 00:19:24,140 Speaker 2: faded away. But I could never get a good and 383 00:19:24,140 --> 00:19:26,310 Speaker 2: stuff like it because there's no one. Yeah, 384 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:30,320 Speaker 1: exactly. I think the teachers themselves, they must have struggled 385 00:19:30,330 --> 00:19:32,780 Speaker 1: also to keep up with the rules. Maybe they themselves 386 00:19:32,780 --> 00:19:35,130 Speaker 1: feel like this is bullshit. What kind of rules is, 387 00:19:35,130 --> 00:19:37,619 Speaker 1: but they have to go by the book. Right? Exactly. 388 00:19:37,630 --> 00:19:39,740 Speaker 1: So it's a tough call for them as well. Yeah, 389 00:19:39,750 --> 00:19:41,740 Speaker 1: dress codes in school. I think one of the big 390 00:19:41,740 --> 00:19:46,620 Speaker 1: things are that I never understood. No colored brass because 391 00:19:46,619 --> 00:19:49,140 Speaker 1: my uniform was white, right? So because of that after 392 00:19:49,140 --> 00:19:51,360 Speaker 1: you wash a while it becomes a bit translucent 393 00:19:51,540 --> 00:19:53,060 Speaker 1: the last time like 394 00:19:53,140 --> 00:19:57,610 Speaker 1: secondary school we were by hopping bras. Yeah, but then 395 00:19:57,609 --> 00:19:59,740 Speaker 1: we were gonna scolding and say that you cannot wear 396 00:19:59,740 --> 00:20:02,090 Speaker 1: this and in fact, there was actually a student from 397 00:20:02,090 --> 00:20:06,140 Speaker 1: Nanyang girls high school, a female teacher actually went around 398 00:20:06,140 --> 00:20:09,070 Speaker 1: to all the site for students um button their shirt 399 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:09,970 Speaker 1: and check what colors their 400 00:20:09,970 --> 00:20:12,960 Speaker 2: bra this invasive, right? Yeah 401 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:14,360 Speaker 1: correct. She had to apologize to her 402 00:20:14,540 --> 00:20:16,659 Speaker 1: of course but only. Yeah 403 00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:18,660 Speaker 1: but if you cannot see the color of the brought 404 00:20:18,660 --> 00:20:21,750 Speaker 1: from the outside okay. Why why why why hey about 405 00:20:21,750 --> 00:20:25,360 Speaker 1: that shit? Right okay. But you know what I do 406 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:29,290 Speaker 1: think there's a reason for for them saying that you 407 00:20:29,290 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 1: know secondary school girls were not allowed to wear light 408 00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:34,119 Speaker 1: colored breast because they don't want to attract the wrong 409 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:37,570 Speaker 1: kind of attention that may potentially bring danger to these 410 00:20:37,570 --> 00:20:40,780 Speaker 1: girls out of school. Perhaps this is a solid reason 411 00:20:40,780 --> 00:20:43,230 Speaker 1: in my opinion. Yeah I can understand that but I 412 00:20:43,230 --> 00:20:45,859 Speaker 1: think we've discussed many many times as well you know 413 00:20:45,859 --> 00:20:51,520 Speaker 1: like how about aside from telling us to avoid these 414 00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: situations 415 00:20:52,740 --> 00:20:55,900 Speaker 1: that you educate the other party as well that she 416 00:20:55,900 --> 00:20:57,919 Speaker 1: will wear whatever the hell she wants to and that 417 00:20:57,920 --> 00:20:59,540 Speaker 1: doesn't mean that you can do whatever the hell you 418 00:20:59,540 --> 00:21:03,660 Speaker 1: want to. Yeah it's about that whole victim blaming kind 419 00:21:03,660 --> 00:21:06,910 Speaker 1: of Angola. I think it's just such a difficult situation 420 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,660 Speaker 1: even not just at schools but at work as well. 421 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 1: There's so many different dress codes like in Japan women 422 00:21:13,850 --> 00:21:17,550 Speaker 1: are actually mostly required to wear heels at work so 423 00:21:17,550 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: I can't imagine that pain man he do you hate wearing. 424 00:21:21,010 --> 00:21:22,380 Speaker 1: Yeah I 425 00:21:22,390 --> 00:21:24,850 Speaker 2: mean I don't I don't hate it all the time 426 00:21:24,859 --> 00:21:27,210 Speaker 2: sometimes when it's for performances. I can see the point 427 00:21:27,210 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 2: of wearing, but 428 00:21:28,140 --> 00:21:30,170 Speaker 2: for me it's more of like, it's a 429 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:33,109 Speaker 2: package, like there's a character I'm trying to build right 430 00:21:33,109 --> 00:21:35,970 Speaker 2: from a stage performance, but when it comes to going 431 00:21:35,970 --> 00:21:39,610 Speaker 2: to your work, especially if it's a bad end kind 432 00:21:39,609 --> 00:21:43,010 Speaker 2: of work, right? Where it's not sales, how does wearing 433 00:21:43,010 --> 00:21:46,859 Speaker 2: heels linked to higher performance? You know? 434 00:21:46,940 --> 00:21:49,550 Speaker 1: So in Japan, this is a very interesting movement is 435 00:21:49,550 --> 00:21:52,000 Speaker 1: called the cool to movement. So correct me if I'm 436 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,690 Speaker 1: wrong in Japanese, K U T s you could sue 437 00:21:55,700 --> 00:21:59,770 Speaker 1: means shoes and K U T S U U 438 00:22:00,140 --> 00:22:03,320 Speaker 1: with an extra you means pain. So this is how 439 00:22:03,330 --> 00:22:07,020 Speaker 1: cool to came about. So this Japanese women, they launched 440 00:22:07,020 --> 00:22:10,740 Speaker 1: this movement to fight against having to wear heels at 441 00:22:10,740 --> 00:22:12,369 Speaker 1: work because of what the hell you do work with 442 00:22:12,369 --> 00:22:14,790 Speaker 1: your hands, your fingers or your eyes right now with 443 00:22:14,790 --> 00:22:18,460 Speaker 1: your feet. And I think this is very, very incredible 444 00:22:18,460 --> 00:22:20,830 Speaker 1: for a place like Japan where you know, maybe rules 445 00:22:20,830 --> 00:22:24,250 Speaker 1: are tighter and stricter. Exactly, but okay, we have to 446 00:22:24,250 --> 00:22:26,880 Speaker 1: acknowledge on the flip side, like for men, right? They 447 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:29,510 Speaker 1: do get discriminated against as well when it comes to 448 00:22:29,510 --> 00:22:32,960 Speaker 1: dress code, for example, they cannot keep long hair if 449 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:35,330 Speaker 1: you work in a corporate sort of, you know industry. 450 00:22:35,340 --> 00:22:39,350 Speaker 1: Um like in terms of open toed sandals, you know, 451 00:22:39,350 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: we can wear right? Like open toed sandals and all that, 452 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:43,530 Speaker 1: but if a man were to wear that and go 453 00:22:43,530 --> 00:22:44,359 Speaker 1: into the workplace, 454 00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:47,449 Speaker 1: they will also be discriminated against. So we have to 455 00:22:47,450 --> 00:22:50,679 Speaker 1: acknowledge that for the men listening as well. So now 456 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:52,389 Speaker 1: that we are in covid times, right? There's a lot 457 00:22:52,390 --> 00:22:54,860 Speaker 1: of zoom calls going on. I have a friend who 458 00:22:54,869 --> 00:22:58,050 Speaker 1: doesn't shave and he goes on like this zoom meetings 459 00:22:58,050 --> 00:22:59,770 Speaker 1: and he's had his boss tell him, 460 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:04,790 Speaker 1: can you please shave? You look very sluggish, you know, problem. 461 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:08,330 Speaker 1: But maybe the boss feels like this is not putting 462 00:23:08,330 --> 00:23:11,030 Speaker 1: up like a good image for the brand or the company. 463 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:12,969 Speaker 1: So what do you think about this? Do you think 464 00:23:12,980 --> 00:23:16,060 Speaker 1: this is acceptable? Shit, My friend shave. 465 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:24,919 Speaker 1: We shoot my friend shave. Yes or no, maybe a groom. Yeah. 466 00:23:24,930 --> 00:23:29,439 Speaker 1: Make a certain shape. Start compromise that compromising. I think 467 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:32,659 Speaker 1: it's a bit tricky when it comes to like maybe 468 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,730 Speaker 1: dress quote for work and things like that because I 469 00:23:35,730 --> 00:23:40,010 Speaker 1: do believe maybe from the company's standpoint, it's an image 470 00:23:40,010 --> 00:23:42,840 Speaker 1: that they're going for or a certain brand look that 471 00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,879 Speaker 1: they're going for as well. But at the same time, 472 00:23:45,890 --> 00:23:48,679 Speaker 1: if you think about it right? Sometimes we feel like 473 00:23:48,690 --> 00:23:51,740 Speaker 1: if I dress up today and I look good and 474 00:23:51,740 --> 00:23:53,980 Speaker 1: I feel good. I feel like I'm going to take 475 00:23:53,980 --> 00:23:56,859 Speaker 1: on the wall and I can do 476 00:23:56,940 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 1: like one does. I'm going to produce great work to do. 477 00:24:00,570 --> 00:24:02,730 Speaker 1: So it has to do with your mood as well. 478 00:24:02,740 --> 00:24:05,379 Speaker 1: So do you think maybe that's what companies think as well, 479 00:24:05,380 --> 00:24:07,890 Speaker 1: but if people come in and whatever they want to 480 00:24:07,900 --> 00:24:11,820 Speaker 1: do that they might just feel too comfortable or you know, 481 00:24:11,820 --> 00:24:15,070 Speaker 1: it makes them feel like you're not setting a hit 482 00:24:15,070 --> 00:24:18,530 Speaker 1: straight to get what done. Do you think 483 00:24:18,530 --> 00:24:21,750 Speaker 2: so? I think that's a super interesting point of view. 484 00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,429 Speaker 2: I've never thought of it that way. But I think 485 00:24:24,430 --> 00:24:28,490 Speaker 2: like also just listening right to to the different like 486 00:24:28,500 --> 00:24:31,990 Speaker 2: regulations that set in place. It almost sounds as if 487 00:24:31,990 --> 00:24:36,410 Speaker 2: like that a lot of gender rules, it's like female 488 00:24:36,420 --> 00:24:38,160 Speaker 2: kills makeup 489 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:39,350 Speaker 2: and then mills 490 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:44,630 Speaker 2: um no shoes with total but open to Yeah. And 491 00:24:44,630 --> 00:24:49,150 Speaker 2: I think like what, what is like these companies actually 492 00:24:49,150 --> 00:24:53,429 Speaker 2: rephrase it and make it less gender, something that's like 493 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 2: a pure neat and 494 00:24:58,140 --> 00:25:00,680 Speaker 2: fresh looking. I don't know like 495 00:25:00,690 --> 00:25:01,560 Speaker 1: the language is 496 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:07,580 Speaker 2: important, like make it more empathetic, like not specific to 497 00:25:07,590 --> 00:25:10,950 Speaker 2: a particular agenda and maybe that could even 498 00:25:11,940 --> 00:25:14,510 Speaker 2: the fairness. Yeah, exactly. 499 00:25:14,510 --> 00:25:16,530 Speaker 1: And I agree with what you mentioned just now because 500 00:25:16,540 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 1: I've once turned up to work in pajamas and I 501 00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:21,500 Speaker 1: got the same and we always do yeah, Kobe times 502 00:25:21,500 --> 00:25:24,220 Speaker 1: a second time to go to go to war in 503 00:25:24,220 --> 00:25:26,340 Speaker 1: my pajamas. No, I really think that there's a difference 504 00:25:26,340 --> 00:25:29,350 Speaker 1: in mindset as compared to if I was all dolled 505 00:25:29,350 --> 00:25:32,179 Speaker 1: up makeup that I go to work prepared to do 506 00:25:32,180 --> 00:25:34,420 Speaker 1: a good show good livestream. There really is a difference 507 00:25:34,420 --> 00:25:37,469 Speaker 1: in mindset. I think it goes one step too far 508 00:25:37,470 --> 00:25:40,810 Speaker 1: when employers refused to hire women because of the attire. 509 00:25:40,810 --> 00:25:43,810 Speaker 1: Let me tell you what happened last year, A department 510 00:25:43,810 --> 00:25:47,970 Speaker 1: store actually made the news because temp stuff she showed 511 00:25:47,970 --> 00:25:50,270 Speaker 1: up on the job, she was wearing a hijab, 512 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:52,530 Speaker 1: they told her that she would have to take off 513 00:25:52,530 --> 00:25:53,890 Speaker 1: her hijab, she can't wear it, 514 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,710 Speaker 1: This is religious hit, This is really just what correct. 515 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,030 Speaker 1: And they actually, you know, wanted to foster to take 516 00:26:00,030 --> 00:26:03,500 Speaker 1: it off. Um now they have changed the rules of 517 00:26:03,510 --> 00:26:06,220 Speaker 1: their company policy, thank goodness after you know, lots of 518 00:26:06,220 --> 00:26:09,310 Speaker 1: backlash and funeral from everyone, but why does it take 519 00:26:09,310 --> 00:26:12,260 Speaker 1: backlash to acknowledge that this is an issue? 520 00:26:12,340 --> 00:26:14,669 Speaker 1: Can I touch on something? It might be a bit sensitive, 521 00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:17,820 Speaker 1: but I'm gonna mention it anyway. So as we know 522 00:26:17,820 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: in the latest National Day rally, it's just been announced 523 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:26,010 Speaker 1: that nurses can now wear the hijab at work and 524 00:26:26,010 --> 00:26:30,220 Speaker 1: this I think is very much anticipated by many. They've 525 00:26:30,220 --> 00:26:32,640 Speaker 1: been waiting for this for a very long time because 526 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:33,939 Speaker 1: I think for a lot of them, some of them 527 00:26:33,940 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 1: are not comfortable with taking it off, but they do 528 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,310 Speaker 1: it anyway because of the job and things like that 529 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,270 Speaker 1: and then I don't know if you've seen, but there's 530 00:26:40,270 --> 00:26:43,700 Speaker 1: been this slew of comments online and you know what, 531 00:26:43,700 --> 00:26:46,270 Speaker 1: a lot of people from different cultures have been saying like, 532 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 1: oh you know what, like I'm happy for my muslim 533 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:50,770 Speaker 1: friends who are wearing the hijab, we cannot wear it 534 00:26:50,770 --> 00:26:54,270 Speaker 1: at work. There was this bunch of comments um that 535 00:26:54,270 --> 00:26:58,300 Speaker 1: I saw that made me go like really is this Singapore? 536 00:26:58,300 --> 00:27:02,409 Speaker 1: Because people were saying things like wow, we took so 537 00:27:02,410 --> 00:27:05,260 Speaker 1: many years to progress for what? Only to be regressing, 538 00:27:05,940 --> 00:27:09,800 Speaker 1: who would say this kind of thing and I'm like sorry, 539 00:27:09,810 --> 00:27:13,250 Speaker 1: oh and there was a lot of it, I wouldn't 540 00:27:13,250 --> 00:27:16,090 Speaker 1: want to do, it actually was a whole compilation of 541 00:27:16,090 --> 00:27:20,030 Speaker 1: those and just people going like um sorry, I would 542 00:27:20,030 --> 00:27:22,010 Speaker 1: be so uncomfortable if I was a patient and my 543 00:27:22,010 --> 00:27:24,660 Speaker 1: nurse was wearing the hijab, why, why 544 00:27:24,740 --> 00:27:27,070 Speaker 1: it's not going to affect the injections they give you 545 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:28,060 Speaker 1: all right, 546 00:27:28,140 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 1: wow. Oh this shocking With with their names from their 547 00:27:33,290 --> 00:27:38,050 Speaker 1: own accounts, shamelessly putting those comments out there, like it 548 00:27:38,050 --> 00:27:39,859 Speaker 1: is nothing wrong. And I'm just like 549 00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:44,300 Speaker 1: what really? I think this is where what Jasmine says, 550 00:27:44,310 --> 00:27:47,330 Speaker 1: you need to be you need to have empathy for everyone, 551 00:27:47,340 --> 00:27:48,359 Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Like 552 00:27:48,740 --> 00:27:51,400 Speaker 1: you need to understand that this is a religious hit 553 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:55,250 Speaker 1: here and why are you dictating what they can or 554 00:27:55,250 --> 00:27:58,250 Speaker 1: cannot wear? You are not showing any compassion or understanding 555 00:27:58,250 --> 00:27:58,850 Speaker 1: towards them. 556 00:27:59,240 --> 00:27:59,900 Speaker 1: What do you think? Just 557 00:27:59,900 --> 00:28:03,570 Speaker 2: mean? I mean this is quite insane. I think yeah, 558 00:28:03,580 --> 00:28:06,949 Speaker 2: just because like we do live in our secular country 559 00:28:06,950 --> 00:28:10,940 Speaker 2: and then we're supposed to respect like different stars and 560 00:28:10,950 --> 00:28:15,300 Speaker 2: understand so to have people like have that kind of comment. 561 00:28:15,300 --> 00:28:18,170 Speaker 2: It took me a while to register like, like 562 00:28:18,340 --> 00:28:20,170 Speaker 2: how we listen 563 00:28:20,340 --> 00:28:24,250 Speaker 2: this this generation right now like why do we still 564 00:28:24,250 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 2: have to explain differences? 565 00:28:26,290 --> 00:28:29,250 Speaker 1: Okay, so it's undeniable that there will be times when 566 00:28:29,250 --> 00:28:31,360 Speaker 1: there's a need to dress a certain way and there 567 00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:33,400 Speaker 1: are rules in place of course that we should break. 568 00:28:33,410 --> 00:28:35,730 Speaker 1: But here's a question for all, have you girls ever 569 00:28:35,730 --> 00:28:38,850 Speaker 1: broken a dress code rule and got into trouble for it? 570 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 1: Little 571 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,050 Speaker 2: confession. 572 00:28:41,140 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 1: So I would love Douglas salva uh, there's a reason 573 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 1: for this. You want to show the camera. 574 00:28:45,690 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 2: No sexy back. 575 00:28:47,810 --> 00:28:49,860 Speaker 1: That's the reason for this because 576 00:28:50,540 --> 00:28:53,200 Speaker 1: I am expected to dress a certain way a lot 577 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:55,870 Speaker 1: of times, not by people who actually matter by people 578 00:28:55,870 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 1: who don't really matter actually. Um, so do sort of 579 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,160 Speaker 1: playing safe and it's sort of like 580 00:29:04,540 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 1: still gotta do at one. I pick up a lot 581 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,540 Speaker 1: of these goats. So if you just see me from 582 00:29:09,540 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: the front business in the front, let me tell you 583 00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:18,220 Speaker 1: something funny just maybe a month ago or something. But no, um, yeah, 584 00:29:18,230 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 1: maybe a month or two ago I was in the building, 585 00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: I work and I did not expect to see my 586 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:26,550 Speaker 1: boss in that day. Oh, I was right on, but 587 00:29:26,550 --> 00:29:30,130 Speaker 1: let's not, I think okay. And then um, she had 588 00:29:30,130 --> 00:29:31,710 Speaker 1: said if you're here, can you come out and see 589 00:29:31,710 --> 00:29:36,720 Speaker 1: me okay because she will say things like she was, 590 00:29:37,030 --> 00:29:40,950 Speaker 1: she was, she has her best interests at heart. I understand. 591 00:29:41,140 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 1: So I went up and the whole time I was 592 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:49,630 Speaker 1: with her. I walked this way I entered the room. 593 00:29:49,660 --> 00:29:55,150 Speaker 1: I came by. So did you find out in the end? 594 00:29:55,220 --> 00:29:57,730 Speaker 1: I don't think so. I don't know where she saw 595 00:29:57,740 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 1: but after this episode she will, I felt them silly. 596 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:04,510 Speaker 1: They're like actually was that necessary? You know, and I 597 00:30:04,510 --> 00:30:05,770 Speaker 1: was a bit like, 598 00:30:06,340 --> 00:30:10,510 Speaker 1: oh but well we got to do what we gotta do. 599 00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:14,210 Speaker 1: We gotta keep our jobs right? Yeah. I mean as 600 00:30:14,210 --> 00:30:16,780 Speaker 1: much as we want to protect our sense of style, 601 00:30:16,780 --> 00:30:18,670 Speaker 1: sense of fashion, right? There are certain 602 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:22,290 Speaker 1: places, you know in certain situations that you have to respect. 603 00:30:22,300 --> 00:30:25,220 Speaker 1: But let's talk about really your style and how it 604 00:30:25,220 --> 00:30:29,050 Speaker 1: empowers you what you wear. So for everyone, how would 605 00:30:29,050 --> 00:30:32,710 Speaker 1: you say your own style reflects your identity, who you 606 00:30:32,710 --> 00:30:33,350 Speaker 1: are inside. 607 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,460 Speaker 1: I love my stall. Okay. I love 608 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:43,290 Speaker 1: I especially love tops that don't require me to wear 609 00:30:43,290 --> 00:30:45,920 Speaker 1: bra like this one for example. I really love it. 610 00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:48,640 Speaker 1: I feel so free and I feel I feel good 611 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:51,310 Speaker 1: about myself. I feel confident and I think it increases 612 00:30:51,310 --> 00:30:55,010 Speaker 1: my work capacity increases efficiency. So I think for me 613 00:30:55,010 --> 00:30:57,780 Speaker 1: the answer is a sure I love my style. So 614 00:30:57,790 --> 00:31:00,250 Speaker 1: I'm sure I can say the same for you to judgment. Yeah. 615 00:31:00,260 --> 00:31:02,470 Speaker 1: Not the brothers parlor, but the part where you love 616 00:31:02,470 --> 00:31:05,820 Speaker 2: yourself. I can kind of relate. Sometimes you 617 00:31:05,820 --> 00:31:07,030 Speaker 1: got me girl 618 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:09,630 Speaker 2: for me. I've always stuck to the color of black 619 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,190 Speaker 2: at least for the past five years and it's been 620 00:31:12,190 --> 00:31:18,020 Speaker 2: very efficient. It's been very, um, I would say everything 621 00:31:18,020 --> 00:31:20,170 Speaker 2: has been very comfortable for me, right? 622 00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:22,890 Speaker 2: And then I also get to innovate within that same 623 00:31:22,890 --> 00:31:23,500 Speaker 2: space 624 00:31:23,740 --> 00:31:26,500 Speaker 2: and I ever saw this quote from one of my 625 00:31:26,500 --> 00:31:30,870 Speaker 2: favorite designer, Yohji Yamamoto. Okay, I'm just taking fragment of 626 00:31:30,870 --> 00:31:34,290 Speaker 2: his court because I don't remember what it is, but 627 00:31:34,300 --> 00:31:37,430 Speaker 2: he mentioned how black is a color which is everywhere, 628 00:31:37,430 --> 00:31:39,940 Speaker 2: but yet it's in the background. And then I really 629 00:31:39,940 --> 00:31:43,010 Speaker 2: resonated with that, right? So I'm like, yeah, I found 630 00:31:43,010 --> 00:31:46,390 Speaker 2: my power in this black outfit and then I still 631 00:31:46,390 --> 00:31:48,270 Speaker 2: like wearing like baggy clothes. 632 00:31:48,340 --> 00:31:53,580 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're like super comfy and it's just me being 633 00:31:53,580 --> 00:31:55,060 Speaker 2: able to be me. 634 00:31:55,090 --> 00:31:57,310 Speaker 1: That's true. Yeah. 635 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:01,940 Speaker 1: Yes. She cannot say that she want to wear like 636 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:07,420 Speaker 1: a necklace, but she only gave me uh, no, no, 637 00:32:07,420 --> 00:32:11,420 Speaker 1: I think my style is quite a spectrum because I, 638 00:32:11,420 --> 00:32:14,860 Speaker 1: I go through phases and um, 639 00:32:15,340 --> 00:32:17,360 Speaker 1: I sort of just like to 640 00:32:17,740 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 1: dress however I feel on that day. So I think 641 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 1: I own a spectrum of styles. It's not necessarily one 642 00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:29,030 Speaker 1: thing and whatever I feel like doing, I just pull 643 00:32:29,030 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 1: it up. I think that reflects her personality because she 644 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:34,920 Speaker 1: goes with the flow, right? Like you're just like whatever 645 00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:38,460 Speaker 1: I feel today I wear. So you're true to yourself with. Yeah, 646 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:41,790 Speaker 1: that's good. That's good. I think for me my my 647 00:32:41,790 --> 00:32:44,170 Speaker 1: style has changed a lot over the years as well. 648 00:32:44,170 --> 00:32:46,940 Speaker 1: I think my my identity when it comes to style 649 00:32:46,950 --> 00:32:49,000 Speaker 1: um and I look up to a lot of role 650 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 1: models you know in the industry to see like what 651 00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:54,350 Speaker 1: is trending right now, I really look at the trends 652 00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:57,270 Speaker 1: and then also whatever is cheaper like the uh 653 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,840 Speaker 1: okay, but you know Billie Eilish right? You know she 654 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:03,010 Speaker 1: used to wear lots of baggy clothes like that was 655 00:33:03,010 --> 00:33:04,550 Speaker 1: her thing and I love that about her and she 656 00:33:04,550 --> 00:33:06,570 Speaker 1: said that she didn't want to be sexualized which I 657 00:33:06,570 --> 00:33:08,219 Speaker 1: understand because she came on the scene when she was 658 00:33:08,220 --> 00:33:11,070 Speaker 1: very young with her new album, she actually is showing 659 00:33:11,070 --> 00:33:13,320 Speaker 1: a different side of her and you know she is 660 00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:16,470 Speaker 1: a very curvy girl and she is finding that empowerment 661 00:33:16,470 --> 00:33:17,770 Speaker 1: in her own sexuality. 662 00:33:17,940 --> 00:33:20,780 Speaker 1: So you can change it doesn't mean that one day 663 00:33:20,790 --> 00:33:23,540 Speaker 1: you love wearing baggy clothes, you can't change that in 664 00:33:23,540 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: the future. We are not static human beings, you know 665 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:28,880 Speaker 1: what I mean? And for Jasmine wise, I think being 666 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:32,120 Speaker 1: in the music industry you know taylor Swift said that 667 00:33:32,130 --> 00:33:35,610 Speaker 1: women are expected to reinvent themselves more than men. What 668 00:33:35,610 --> 00:33:36,260 Speaker 1: do you think about 669 00:33:36,270 --> 00:33:40,740 Speaker 2: this? Yeah, I super agree. I constantly feel the pressure 670 00:33:40,740 --> 00:33:42,770 Speaker 2: of like you know being a woman 671 00:33:42,940 --> 00:33:46,100 Speaker 2: uh when it comes to a lot of female idols 672 00:33:46,100 --> 00:33:50,560 Speaker 2: that I follow every year or once every few years, 673 00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,500 Speaker 2: you will see them like changing radically in terms of 674 00:33:53,500 --> 00:33:57,910 Speaker 2: like the way they dress. Um the hairstyle is the makeup, 675 00:33:57,910 --> 00:34:02,560 Speaker 2: there's so many different different parts that needs to be reinvented. 676 00:34:02,700 --> 00:34:04,260 Speaker 2: It seems like almost 677 00:34:04,340 --> 00:34:06,310 Speaker 2: and then when it comes to mail, okay, let's take 678 00:34:06,310 --> 00:34:09,700 Speaker 2: like maybe just one example not to represent everyone right 679 00:34:09,710 --> 00:34:15,170 Speaker 2: at Sharon. Yeah, he's been him like always like besides 680 00:34:15,170 --> 00:34:19,170 Speaker 2: his music, which is amazing, right? Like did he have 681 00:34:19,170 --> 00:34:21,050 Speaker 2: to go through a lot of 682 00:34:21,140 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 2: makeup changes or outfit changes? We have an image of 683 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:26,060 Speaker 2: him right in our head and 684 00:34:26,340 --> 00:34:29,820 Speaker 2: take that and compared to like other female artists, has 685 00:34:29,820 --> 00:34:33,600 Speaker 2: there been any female artists that has been that static 686 00:34:33,610 --> 00:34:35,759 Speaker 2: in terms of their aesthetic, wow, 687 00:34:36,239 --> 00:34:39,370 Speaker 1: that's true, that's true because insurance looked the same for 688 00:34:39,380 --> 00:34:45,150 Speaker 1: 20 years. Probably correct, correct. Actually wanna give one last story. 689 00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,560 Speaker 1: So I used to have a friend, she is a walker, 690 00:34:48,570 --> 00:34:53,060 Speaker 1: uh DJ um and she's not someone that you know 691 00:34:53,060 --> 00:34:56,310 Speaker 1: shows a lot of skin, she's well of revealing clothes, 692 00:34:56,310 --> 00:34:58,350 Speaker 1: but the other DJs on the scene 693 00:34:58,940 --> 00:35:01,509 Speaker 1: would actually stop this. You I know I have a 694 00:35:01,510 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: personal friend who starts a lot of the shoot and 695 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,420 Speaker 1: she got up and spin that kind of thing. Um 696 00:35:05,430 --> 00:35:08,980 Speaker 1: just so they would see more appealing and more, they 697 00:35:08,980 --> 00:35:11,820 Speaker 1: would have more jobs come their way. So my friend 698 00:35:11,820 --> 00:35:14,370 Speaker 1: at the time, she, she felt like, am I losing out, 699 00:35:14,380 --> 00:35:16,490 Speaker 1: Am I going to lose if I protect my sense 700 00:35:16,489 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 1: of identity and I don't show so much and 701 00:35:18,940 --> 00:35:21,320 Speaker 1: I think that's very sad that that's a reality of 702 00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,300 Speaker 1: the situation. I don't get the, I just don't get 703 00:35:24,300 --> 00:35:25,060 Speaker 1: the boob thing 704 00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:30,890 Speaker 1: call the associate like club DJs, we've got big boobs. Okay. Honestly, 705 00:35:30,900 --> 00:35:33,170 Speaker 1: I feel like when you do have it, 706 00:35:33,739 --> 00:35:35,979 Speaker 1: I don't want it there. Yeah, I mean I don't 707 00:35:35,980 --> 00:35:41,750 Speaker 1: want no really possible. I feel like everything you wear 708 00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:48,930 Speaker 1: becomes more offensive. Oh, okay. Even if it's nothing right? 709 00:35:48,930 --> 00:35:51,779 Speaker 1: Let's say it's a fitted top, like what domains wearing, 710 00:35:51,780 --> 00:35:54,939 Speaker 1: it's nothing is covered. But it just looks that bit 711 00:35:54,940 --> 00:36:04,980 Speaker 1: more sexualized instantly because it's obvious because it's big, good problem. Well, honestly, 712 00:36:04,980 --> 00:36:06,910 Speaker 1: I think, you know, the grass is always greener on 713 00:36:06,910 --> 00:36:09,560 Speaker 1: the other side, but Jasmine, do you have any final 714 00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,380 Speaker 1: words maybe about your friends in the industry who feel 715 00:36:12,380 --> 00:36:14,649 Speaker 1: this pressure as well and they might have succumbed 716 00:36:14,650 --> 00:36:14,960 Speaker 2: to it. 717 00:36:15,030 --> 00:36:17,590 Speaker 2: I would say when I started out, right, I was 718 00:36:17,590 --> 00:36:21,130 Speaker 2: in the electronic music scene and back then I was 719 00:36:21,130 --> 00:36:24,830 Speaker 2: in DJ club in school. Yeah. So, so I totally 720 00:36:24,830 --> 00:36:28,310 Speaker 2: get what, like what you're saying and I think if anyone, 721 00:36:28,310 --> 00:36:31,500 Speaker 2: it would be me like first feeling that pressure to 722 00:36:31,500 --> 00:36:34,860 Speaker 2: confirm to a certain standard of how a female DJ 723 00:36:34,860 --> 00:36:38,460 Speaker 2: should be. Yeah. And then I have no asset. 724 00:36:38,830 --> 00:36:39,660 Speaker 2: So 725 00:36:40,130 --> 00:36:44,330 Speaker 2: I mean, you have so much, so many issues. So 726 00:36:44,330 --> 00:36:46,350 Speaker 2: I felt like if I, if I were to try 727 00:36:46,350 --> 00:36:48,760 Speaker 2: to conform to it, it wouldn't even work and it's 728 00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:51,750 Speaker 2: also also feel like with the whole living up to 729 00:36:51,750 --> 00:36:56,450 Speaker 2: that idea of a very hard woman DJ, you kind 730 00:36:56,450 --> 00:36:58,660 Speaker 2: of make people miss the point that women is so 731 00:36:58,660 --> 00:37:01,340 Speaker 2: much more than just how they look. 732 00:37:01,430 --> 00:37:06,110 Speaker 2: You know, I have friends that attend events or DJ events, right? 733 00:37:06,110 --> 00:37:08,930 Speaker 2: And they just go there because of how the DJ 734 00:37:08,930 --> 00:37:12,550 Speaker 2: looks and I feel like that's missing the point of 735 00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:17,390 Speaker 2: of like going there to enjoy music. So I didn't 736 00:37:17,390 --> 00:37:20,180 Speaker 2: invite with that whole idea and I didn't want to 737 00:37:20,180 --> 00:37:20,660 Speaker 2: like 738 00:37:20,930 --> 00:37:23,330 Speaker 2: be a part of it. So I just focused small 739 00:37:23,330 --> 00:37:24,460 Speaker 2: into music pipe, 740 00:37:24,630 --> 00:37:25,770 Speaker 2: wow, really 741 00:37:25,770 --> 00:37:29,049 Speaker 1: respect that even after the years. I mean it's so 742 00:37:29,050 --> 00:37:32,310 Speaker 1: true that I've never thought about walking into zoo because 743 00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:33,830 Speaker 1: DJ ghetto is handsome or something like 744 00:37:33,830 --> 00:37:35,700 Speaker 2: that. Yeah, that's true. 745 00:37:35,710 --> 00:37:37,850 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. 746 00:37:38,330 --> 00:37:40,740 Speaker 1: So there really is a double standard. So I think 747 00:37:40,750 --> 00:37:43,799 Speaker 1: we can just talk about what we've unpacked here today. 748 00:37:43,810 --> 00:37:48,500 Speaker 1: Um firstly we should recognize people for what's inside, you know, 749 00:37:48,500 --> 00:37:51,780 Speaker 1: the talent and not what they look like on the outside. 750 00:37:51,790 --> 00:37:52,440 Speaker 1: I think that's really 751 00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:53,810 Speaker 2: important. 752 00:37:53,820 --> 00:37:56,910 Speaker 1: And secondly, breaking dress coats really pays off. I mean, 753 00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,770 Speaker 1: not when rules are in place, of course, but especially 754 00:37:59,770 --> 00:38:03,279 Speaker 1: when fighting dress codes, their bias or discriminatory. I think 755 00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,070 Speaker 1: it's really, really important. Can I just stay away that 756 00:38:06,070 --> 00:38:08,450 Speaker 1: I'm really impressed. Like just at a young age at 757 00:38:08,450 --> 00:38:11,060 Speaker 1: that time, especially at such a young age. Like you 758 00:38:11,060 --> 00:38:15,140 Speaker 1: could recognize that this might be what was expected of you. 759 00:38:15,219 --> 00:38:17,419 Speaker 1: But you know what? That's not what I'm comfortable with. 760 00:38:17,430 --> 00:38:19,360 Speaker 1: I'm going to stick with it even if you know 761 00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:21,750 Speaker 1: it's going to be putting me a disadvantage right now 762 00:38:21,750 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 1: because people think I should be this way I'm going 763 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:26,070 Speaker 1: to stick to that. Yeah, I think that's really 764 00:38:26,070 --> 00:38:30,259 Speaker 2: cool. Thank you. I feel the same admiration for you 765 00:38:30,260 --> 00:38:33,040 Speaker 2: as well. Like the whole, you know, I don't want 766 00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:36,490 Speaker 2: to be confined by what people expect me everywhere. I 767 00:38:36,489 --> 00:38:39,390 Speaker 2: just want to wear whatever I feel like. And I 768 00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:42,450 Speaker 2: want today. And if you have an issue 769 00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:45,030 Speaker 2: that's yours, I like that. 770 00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:46,340 Speaker 2: Mm hmm. 771 00:38:46,350 --> 00:38:47,950 Speaker 1: There we go. There we go. So 772 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,839 Speaker 1: ending this policing of women's clothes, it's up to you, 773 00:38:51,850 --> 00:38:54,250 Speaker 1: up to me as women and up to us to 774 00:38:54,250 --> 00:38:56,960 Speaker 1: teach the next generation as well. So let's do what 775 00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,760 Speaker 1: we can and yeah, don't be afraid to live your 776 00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:03,530 Speaker 1: true self as Jasmine has told us today. All right 777 00:39:03,530 --> 00:39:05,380 Speaker 1: with that. Thank you so much for joining us on 778 00:39:05,380 --> 00:39:07,940 Speaker 1: this episode of calamities. How 779 00:39:08,420 --> 00:39:12,160 Speaker 1: once again, I'm hazel I'm Missouri I'm Jermaine and thank 780 00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:16,390 Speaker 1: you so much. Just before we end off any upcoming 781 00:39:16,390 --> 00:39:17,540 Speaker 1: works that we can look forward to. 782 00:39:17,550 --> 00:39:20,319 Speaker 2: I am really saying my E. P. This 783 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:22,450 Speaker 1: man. 784 00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:23,419 Speaker 2: Yeah. Any 785 00:39:23,420 --> 00:39:25,930 Speaker 1: teases you can get it going to be an english 786 00:39:25,930 --> 00:39:29,190 Speaker 2: and mandarin or like it's going to be english. but 787 00:39:29,190 --> 00:39:31,750 Speaker 2: it's also a very important piece of work to me. 788 00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:35,959 Speaker 2: It's a whole idea of being 25 in the middle 789 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:39,290 Speaker 2: of this pandemic, like what it means. Like to be 790 00:39:39,290 --> 00:39:41,560 Speaker 2: in the middle of your twenties, like you are not 791 00:39:41,570 --> 00:39:44,580 Speaker 2: that young anymore, but at the same time, like you 792 00:39:44,580 --> 00:39:45,989 Speaker 2: are still young, 793 00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:50,210 Speaker 1: you can do it. I 794 00:39:50,219 --> 00:39:50,489 Speaker 2: feel 795 00:39:50,489 --> 00:39:53,160 Speaker 1: you. Yes. So is there any song a part of 796 00:39:53,170 --> 00:39:56,100 Speaker 1: any song that you like the most in this upcoming ep? 797 00:39:56,110 --> 00:39:59,110 Speaker 2: There's just one song. It cannot be more blatant than 798 00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:02,900 Speaker 2: it is. So it's called 25 25. Okay, could 799 00:40:02,900 --> 00:40:04,580 Speaker 1: you share part of the lyrics are like, sing a 800 00:40:04,580 --> 00:40:05,030 Speaker 1: bit for 801 00:40:05,030 --> 00:40:07,150 Speaker 2: us. Damn. I don't know how it sounds like if 802 00:40:07,150 --> 00:40:09,470 Speaker 2: I sing it a cappella, I'll do it. 803 00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:12,219 Speaker 1: I'm very excited. Yeah, 804 00:40:12,810 --> 00:40:13,310 Speaker 2: yeah. 805 00:40:16,110 --> 00:40:18,069 Speaker 2: Whoa, Chef practice. 806 00:40:19,510 --> 00:40:24,160 Speaker 2: I'm 25. I am way too low for you and 807 00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:26,850 Speaker 2: I'm staying home instead of partying. 808 00:40:27,710 --> 00:40:31,210 Speaker 2: I don't want to die. I'm still way too young 809 00:40:31,210 --> 00:40:35,240 Speaker 2: to be missing. Oh, don't alive. I'll never know. 810 00:40:35,610 --> 00:40:40,310 Speaker 2: At least I'm not as foolish thinking people won't be leaving. 811 00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:45,170 Speaker 2: So I learned to put myself put myself first and 812 00:40:45,170 --> 00:40:49,540 Speaker 2: I realized that it's okay to not know where I'm going, 813 00:40:49,550 --> 00:40:52,940 Speaker 2: but I'm sure like I won, 814 00:40:53,310 --> 00:40:55,500 Speaker 2: I don't want to wait. I don't hesitate. I don't 815 00:40:55,500 --> 00:40:55,830 Speaker 2: want to 816 00:40:56,410 --> 00:40:58,620 Speaker 2: fucking where is my time? 817 00:40:58,780 --> 00:41:12,690 Speaker 1: Okay. Lyric lyric quite a little bit a ways away 818 00:41:12,700 --> 00:41:13,140 Speaker 1: correct 819 00:41:13,210 --> 00:41:14,620 Speaker 1: two years down the road only 820 00:41:14,630 --> 00:41:16,490 Speaker 2: incredible, incredible. 821 00:41:16,489 --> 00:41:18,790 Speaker 1: We absolutely cannot wait. It sounds like, you know, it's 822 00:41:18,790 --> 00:41:21,250 Speaker 1: really personal to you and I think it's gonna touch 823 00:41:21,250 --> 00:41:23,020 Speaker 1: so many people that hear it. 824 00:41:23,110 --> 00:41:26,280 Speaker 2: Thank you. Thank you for being a safe space for 825 00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,299 Speaker 2: me to let do it from underneath my mask as 826 00:41:29,300 --> 00:41:33,350 Speaker 1: well. Absolutely, absolutely. And I think when you put something 827 00:41:33,350 --> 00:41:36,750 Speaker 1: so personal out like that, you know, it becomes something 828 00:41:36,750 --> 00:41:39,060 Speaker 1: else for somebody who's listening as well, you know, it's 829 00:41:39,060 --> 00:41:40,140 Speaker 1: going to be someone's like 830 00:41:40,210 --> 00:41:42,080 Speaker 1: this song or that song or they're just going to 831 00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:44,939 Speaker 1: relate to it in different ways and that's what's so special, 832 00:41:45,010 --> 00:41:47,260 Speaker 1: right? And I just want to shout out that the jasmine, 833 00:41:47,270 --> 00:41:50,009 Speaker 1: she told me personally that she is a fan of 834 00:41:50,010 --> 00:41:53,100 Speaker 1: harsh podcast. This is how our conversation came about. And 835 00:41:53,100 --> 00:41:54,320 Speaker 1: I was like, you know, what do you want to 836 00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:56,720 Speaker 1: come on our podcast? And she was like, yeah, so 837 00:41:56,719 --> 00:41:57,730 Speaker 1: this happened. 838 00:41:57,910 --> 00:42:01,170 Speaker 1: So thank you for listening to us. Just thank you 839 00:42:01,170 --> 00:42:03,500 Speaker 1: and make sure to follow us at its clarity dot 840 00:42:03,500 --> 00:42:06,250 Speaker 1: co for more updates on the next episode. And yeah, 841 00:42:06,260 --> 00:42:10,260 Speaker 1: wherever podcasts are exactly what we're on Youtube 25. Me 842 00:42:10,260 --> 00:42:13,379 Speaker 1: listen Apple podcast, That's right. And we'll see you next 843 00:42:13,380 --> 00:42:16,140 Speaker 1: time on hash by and 844 00:42:16,310 --> 00:42:24,640 Speaker 1: less this man actually cutting it so anxious