1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,240 Speaker 1: I was an art class, and the teacher didn't think 2 00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:03,840 Speaker 1: I was going to become Picasso. So we're sitting there 3 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,480 Speaker 1: and there's drawings all over in pottery or whatever, and 4 00:00:06,559 --> 00:00:09,760 Speaker 1: this teacher goes, hey, viittert in front of the whole class, Hey, viterart. 5 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:12,720 Speaker 1: If my dog was as ugly as you, I would 6 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 1: shave its ass and make it walk backwards. 7 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 2: Stop it. 8 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, so that was the art teacher. 9 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: So I mean, if the teachers are doing that, the 10 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 1: kids now have license to do whatever. 11 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:24,959 Speaker 2: New York Times bestseller this is a brand new book 12 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 2: out called Born Lucky. A dedicated father, a grateful son 13 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 2: in my Journey with Autism. I gotta tell you, brother, 14 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 2: you and I have been talking on television for a while, 15 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 2: and you're right. You normally interview me. I had no 16 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 2: idea that there was any journey with autism. So whatever 17 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 2: it is that your dad did and your family did 18 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:45,160 Speaker 2: and you did through this process has worked very well. 19 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 2: Let's go back to when you found out there was 20 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,360 Speaker 2: this diagnosis. You're a little younger than I am, but 21 00:00:50,520 --> 00:00:53,640 Speaker 2: growing up I don't remember hearing about autism at all. 22 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 2: So what did you think was going on? 23 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:01,600 Speaker 3: Right? So Joe, thank you. When I was eight years old, 24 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 3: my parents were told. 25 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:06,559 Speaker 1: They needed to have me evaluated, which is the worst 26 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:07,720 Speaker 1: thing any parent can hear. 27 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:11,400 Speaker 3: So they take me to one of those medical office buildings. 28 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 3: We've all been there. 29 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: You can imagine any parent can how upset that parent 30 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:20,280 Speaker 1: would be. And we have the linoleum floors and the 31 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:23,399 Speaker 1: stale coffee and the old magazines. This is before cell 32 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 1: phones or anything like that. So my parents just sat 33 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: there for a couple of hours, terrified and nervous. The 34 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:29,800 Speaker 1: woman brought me back and she said, look, your son 35 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 1: has a lot of problems, behavioral problems. It had been 36 00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: years since I'd ever been invited to a playdate or 37 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:37,839 Speaker 1: a birthday party because I couldn't get along with kids 38 00:01:37,880 --> 00:01:41,400 Speaker 1: my own age. But she said, you know, this is 39 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: a kid who if he's touched in class or in 40 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:47,320 Speaker 1: a lunch line or at recess, he'll turn around and 41 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 1: slug a kid. So big behavior problems, big sensory problems. 42 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:53,320 Speaker 1: If I had socks that I didn't like on, or 43 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 1: a jacket I didn't like, I'd melt down in the 44 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:57,960 Speaker 1: day would be over. And then she gave me an 45 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 1: IQ test, And an IQ test is the average of 46 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 1: two scores. My scores spread between the two scores with 47 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:10,000 Speaker 1: seventy points. A learning disability is twenty points. So the 48 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 1: parlance of the day, I was between mentally retarded and 49 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 1: genius in different ways. And she said it's very difficult 50 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 1: to understand what's going on inside his head, meaning my head. Now, 51 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:22,320 Speaker 1: my wife would say, it's still very hard to understand 52 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:24,200 Speaker 1: what's going on inside my head. 53 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:26,680 Speaker 2: That's a different thing, though, Yeah, that's a different problem. 54 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:30,920 Speaker 1: But my dad, as any father would, goes, what do 55 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,359 Speaker 1: we do? And the woman says, well, there's not much 56 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: you can do, and my dad goes, really, because you know, 57 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:38,359 Speaker 1: if we meet him where he's at, he's a disaster. 58 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 1: And she goes, well, you kind of need to meet 59 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: him where he's at. And my dad said, well, is 60 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:45,080 Speaker 1: there anything we can do? And she said generally not. 61 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:48,440 Speaker 1: And my dad then went about to adapting me to 62 00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 1: the world rather than the world to me and born lucky. Yes, 63 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:55,600 Speaker 1: it is, it is my story, but this book really 64 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: isn't about me. This is about giving hope to every 65 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 1: parent of a king. Having a hard time, doesn't matter 66 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:06,240 Speaker 1: if it's autism or ADHD or anxiety, bullying, difficulties, growing up. 67 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 3: Whatever it is. 68 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:11,080 Speaker 1: Born Lucky is proof that the power of parents to 69 00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:13,720 Speaker 1: help their kid be more. 70 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 2: It is Leland vinteror go and get the book. Go 71 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 2: to Born Lucky dot com. Christy is a great host 72 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 2: of our News Nation. You've seen him on television a 73 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 2: long time. Let me go through some of what you 74 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,520 Speaker 2: just said. Because we in our own brains see the 75 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 2: world the way that we see it, and we think 76 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:31,600 Speaker 2: everybody sees it the same way. Clearly that's not true. 77 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,079 Speaker 2: As we get older, we learned that people have different perspectives. 78 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 2: But when you talk about autism and reacting like you said, 79 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 2: if somebody you had the wrong color on, you would 80 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 2: melt down, or somebody touched you in the lunch line, 81 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:44,560 Speaker 2: you might punch him. I didn't have that worldview. I 82 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 2: didn't see it the way that you saw it. So 83 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 2: I'm guessing your dad, Mark, I'm guessing your dad had 84 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 2: to figure out what it was that you were seeing. 85 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 2: What was the prism through which you saw? I mean, 86 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 2: did he have to do that or did he say, 87 00:03:57,720 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 2: let me bring you to where you should be? How 88 00:03:59,360 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 2: did it work? 89 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 3: But it was much more about bringing me to where 90 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:03,160 Speaker 3: I should be? 91 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 1: Right, you know, I think he realized how I saw 92 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 1: the world because I acted out in that way he 93 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 1: was trying to say to me, and it required an 94 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 1: enormous amount of trust that he built up with me 95 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:18,960 Speaker 1: to say how you're seeing the world is wrong, right, okay? 96 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 1: And I had to trust him to that extent. You know, 97 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:25,880 Speaker 1: Born Lucky is that story of adapting me. So it's 98 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:28,000 Speaker 1: you know, it started because my dad realized I wasn't 99 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 1: gonna have any friends, so he said, maybe I could 100 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 1: be your friend. And then it started with two hundred 101 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,719 Speaker 1: push ups a day, five days a week for months, 102 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 1: and then I would get some kind of reward. And 103 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:41,480 Speaker 1: the idea was to teach me that self esteem is earned, 104 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:44,040 Speaker 1: it's not given. And Dad realized I wouldn't get self 105 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:46,599 Speaker 1: esteem from the way most kids do growing up. You know, 106 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:49,159 Speaker 1: most kids, it's either being good at school wasn't going 107 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 1: to be me, being good at athletics wasn't going to 108 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: be be and being popular wasn't going to be me. 109 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: So Dad was trying to figure out, how do I 110 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:00,360 Speaker 1: give this kid self esteem? 111 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 3: That was that. 112 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:05,080 Speaker 1: Then it was the social interaction part, and one thing 113 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: that's really resonated with folks. As we've talked about born 114 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:11,159 Speaker 1: Lucky is how my dad would take me to lunches. 115 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: And I would have loved to go to lunches with 116 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:15,120 Speaker 1: say Joe Paggs, because I was a mini me to 117 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:15,479 Speaker 1: my dad. 118 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:16,440 Speaker 3: I could talk about. 119 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 1: Politics, business and news and he would have brought me 120 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: to lunch. We would have sat down at a diner 121 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:22,920 Speaker 1: and before you could look at the menu, I would 122 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: have been peppering you with questions, how do you choose topics? 123 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 1: How do you book your guests? How do you figure 124 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 1: out if you're going to get invited? On TV shows? 125 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,479 Speaker 1: On and on on r And Dad would tap his 126 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 1: watch and that was my signal to be quiet without 127 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:41,280 Speaker 1: embarrassing me, and then to bookmark that moment and later 128 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 1: in the cars we were driving home and say, okay, 129 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 1: when mister Peggs was talking about the time he was 130 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:54,360 Speaker 1: swatted or about his weekend plans, you interrupted and either 131 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:56,239 Speaker 1: talked about your push ups or about this or whatever. 132 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 3: Why'd you do that? 133 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:58,719 Speaker 1: I said, well, I don't know, Dad, it seemed interesting 134 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 1: to me, and he'd go, okay, what could you have 135 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 1: asked mister Paggs about that? He would have been interested 136 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: in And then I would role play that conversation with 137 00:06:06,839 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 1: my dad. So it was, you know, from the very beginning, 138 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: teaching me the social and emotional fabric that most people 139 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:16,599 Speaker 1: see as normal or feel as normal. 140 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 2: You know, Leland, it's funny you mentioned self esteem a 141 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 2: few times. Get this book, by the way, Born Lucky 142 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:23,160 Speaker 2: dot com. The name of the book is Born Lucky. 143 00:06:23,200 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 2: It is Leland Victord. You said self esteem a couple 144 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:29,600 Speaker 2: of times. So in your youth before dad said let's 145 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 2: devise a plan to help bring him to where he 146 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 2: needs to be. Was there a self esteem issue? Did 147 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 2: you not like what you saw, what you felt where 148 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 2: you were, or did you was there an issue that 149 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 2: you didn't know existed. That's why he had to bring 150 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,239 Speaker 2: bring you to a place where you understood self esteem. 151 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 2: How does that work? 152 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:47,839 Speaker 1: It's a great question from a little kid. You know, 153 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:50,880 Speaker 1: I understood that I was completely ostracized. I knew I 154 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:53,480 Speaker 1: had no friends. I knew I wasn't very good at school. 155 00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: I knew the teachers picked on me. You know, did 156 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 1: in Born Lucky Star I have. 157 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 2: To interrupt the teachers that I was going to tell you. 158 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 1: And when I was in eighth grade, and this is 159 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 1: just one example, but when I was In eighth grade, 160 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: I was an art class, and the teacher didn't think 161 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 1: I was going to become Picasso. So we're sitting there 162 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:15,080 Speaker 1: and there's drawings all over in pottery or whatever, and 163 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 1: this teacher goes, hey, BITTERT in front of the whole class, Hey, BITTERT. 164 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 1: If my dog was as ugly as you, I would 165 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 1: shave its ass and make it walk backwards. 166 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 2: Stop it. 167 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, So that was the art teacher. 168 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 1: So I mean, if the teachers are doing that, the 169 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 1: kids now have license to do whatever. Seventh grade, my 170 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: parents were called in second week of school. I'd been 171 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:36,880 Speaker 1: through four or five schools and at this point my 172 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:38,680 Speaker 1: parents were just hoping seventh grade was going to be 173 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 1: a restart. And the principal says to my parents, you know, 174 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 1: everybody at this school thinks lucky, meaning me is really weird. 175 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 3: Arrow number one through my parents' heart. 176 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 1: They're sitting there in the principal's office with you know, 177 00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:53,960 Speaker 1: the desks and whatever else. And then the principal says, uh, 178 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 1: and frankly, I do too. And remember I, to be fair, 179 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 1: I was weird. I was a very weird kid. But 180 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 1: part of my dad's mission was to not tell anyone, 181 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 1: you know. He didn't tell any of his friends, no teachers, 182 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 1: no counselors, no accommodations, no extra time on tests, because 183 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 1: he felt like the world wouldn't accommodate me later. 184 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 3: On in life. 185 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: And he said, if I'm going to raise my son 186 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:22,280 Speaker 1: to be able to function in the real world, I'm 187 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:25,720 Speaker 1: going to have to do it without people knowing he 188 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 1: has a diagnosis. He never wanted me to be defined 189 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 1: by a diagnosis, and he never wanted me to to 190 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:33,319 Speaker 1: find myself by one. 191 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 2: What's crazy to me is you must have gone to 192 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:38,079 Speaker 2: the worst, the worst school on the planet, where the 193 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 2: art teacher's saying that the principles saying that it's just 194 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:43,440 Speaker 2: unbelievable because it was their job to literally help you 195 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:46,120 Speaker 2: through whatever the struggle was, and they didn't do that. 196 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:47,960 Speaker 2: I'm so glad that you had your parents that you had, 197 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 2: and that your dad, you know, gave you this structure. 198 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 2: You know when when you were talking about it earlier 199 00:08:52,720 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 2: with the pushups and tapping the watch, that structure did you? 200 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 2: Were you structure less before your dad devised this plan? 201 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 3: I don't really know, Joe. 202 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:04,440 Speaker 1: I mean, the push up started when I was I 203 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:06,960 Speaker 1: think six years old, seven years old, so I don't 204 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:07,959 Speaker 1: really remember before that. 205 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:10,560 Speaker 3: I think as soon as my dad realized and inn 206 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 3: Born Lucky. 207 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: There's this moment where we're at this family vacation, one 208 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:17,800 Speaker 1: of those week long family vacations. Everybody shows up on 209 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:20,560 Speaker 1: a Saturday, and I think we're at this like dude ranch. 210 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:22,960 Speaker 1: So there was like a big lodge and a sort 211 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 1: of big field or lawn out front, and kids were 212 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: playing soccer and getting to know each other, and I 213 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 1: was bumping into people and pushing them down and yelling 214 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,360 Speaker 1: and you know, trying to make friends but I didn't 215 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 1: know how. And my dad looks at my mom and goes, 216 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, we got a real problem here. And I 217 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:41,079 Speaker 1: think I was five or six years old at that point. 218 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 1: So from the very beginning, I think it was very 219 00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 1: clear to my dad, especially that this was a real issue. 220 00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: And Born Lucky, I think, is the story of Dad 221 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:55,440 Speaker 1: realizing what that was and to your point, providing structure 222 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: and saying, you know, I know where my son is, 223 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 1: and I know what my son needs, and I'm going 224 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 1: to help him be more. You know, it's not Born 225 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 1: Lucky's not a how to cure autism book. It's a 226 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 1: story of love by a parent to help their child 227 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:16,719 Speaker 1: embrace adversity and hold their hand through adversity rather than 228 00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:18,440 Speaker 1: trying to take the adversity away. 229 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 2: Born Lucky, you dedicated father, a grateful son. In my 230 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,679 Speaker 2: journey with autism, Leland, when did you find out that 231 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 2: it was something called autism? Because again, early on you 232 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:28,960 Speaker 2: probably that word was being used. 233 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:31,600 Speaker 3: No, so it's a great question. 234 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:34,080 Speaker 1: It wasn't until I was in my twenties that my 235 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 1: parents told me about this, you know, this diagnosis and 236 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:42,680 Speaker 1: these these you know, sort of the names for the 237 00:10:42,679 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 1: difficulties I was having. I was diagnosed at first both 238 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: I think called pervasive developmental disorder. 239 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 3: It's in the book sort of how this went on. 240 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:53,840 Speaker 1: It's all things that we now know to be autism, 241 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: is what I was diagnosed with. So it wasn't until 242 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 1: I was in my twenties, and then in my thirties 243 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:01,840 Speaker 1: I sort of started, i think, probably realizing more about it. 244 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:05,720 Speaker 1: And I still struggle with issues today, you know, eye 245 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:08,920 Speaker 1: contact and becoming way too task focused. And I could 246 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 1: go through a list, but what Dad always taught me 247 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 1: was you can never make an excuse of oh, by 248 00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 1: the way, you know, that's my autism. 249 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 3: It is. 250 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: What the standard is and how you should act. You 251 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 1: got to learn how to adapt, adapt to that. 252 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,200 Speaker 2: Leland Vinter go and get his book called Born Lucky. 253 00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 2: I got to ask you. I was a television news 254 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 2: anchor for a long time. I've been in broadcasting thirty 255 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 2: six years. It's not about me, but I say that 256 00:11:34,679 --> 00:11:37,199 Speaker 2: because it's not easy, Leland. What we do is an 257 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 2: easy looking at a camera, saying words, remembering things, interviewing people, 258 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 2: asking interesting questions. I find you to be very, very 259 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,200 Speaker 2: good at it. So how did you how did how 260 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:50,760 Speaker 2: did you become this? I mean again, what you could 261 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 2: easily have said, Ah, you know, I'm born in this 262 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:55,959 Speaker 2: different way, and I'm not going to apply myself. I'm 263 00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 2: going to go do a job that doesn't require so 264 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 2: much intellectual work. What we do means we have to 265 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:03,960 Speaker 2: use our brain in our words. What made you think 266 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:04,600 Speaker 2: you could do this? 267 00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:06,440 Speaker 3: Well? 268 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:09,880 Speaker 1: Partly right, because I didn't know I had some kind 269 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 1: of diagnosis. 270 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:13,199 Speaker 3: Okay, you know the fact I think one of the. 271 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: Great things that my dad gave me is that is 272 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:20,800 Speaker 1: the knowledge that I could do anything and I could 273 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:25,680 Speaker 1: be anything. Now it's different, right than saying look, kid, 274 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:29,200 Speaker 1: you can go be a great tennis player. And one 275 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 1: of the great moments in the book right is when 276 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,960 Speaker 1: I'm playing trying to play tennis to impress this girl 277 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 1: with seventh grade I wanted to learn how to play tennis, 278 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 1: and I and my dad, who is a great amateur athlete, 279 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: great hand eye coordination, he saw me. I mean I 280 00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:45,360 Speaker 1: would miss balls and I was. I still am very uncoordinated, 281 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 1: awkward whatever any time of ball moves. 282 00:12:48,160 --> 00:12:50,199 Speaker 3: I can't really sense it because I have no depth perception. 283 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:52,839 Speaker 1: And my dad looks at me one after third or 284 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 1: three or four tennis lessons, he goes, look lucky, he goes, 285 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:56,679 Speaker 1: I will pay for all your tennis lessons. I will 286 00:12:56,720 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: come to all of your tennis matches. You'll never be 287 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 1: able to play tennis. Right now, The flip side is 288 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:08,800 Speaker 1: is that that brutal honesty meant that when he told 289 00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 1: me I could do something, or when I was good 290 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 1: at something. 291 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 3: I believed him right. 292 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:15,719 Speaker 1: And I think that one of the things about journalism 293 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:19,560 Speaker 1: and Joe you can relate to this is hard work 294 00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: does a lot in journalism. I wasn't going to be 295 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 1: a doctor because I couldn't do chemistry and biology and 296 00:13:25,160 --> 00:13:26,599 Speaker 1: all that kind of stuff. I wasn't going to be 297 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 1: a lawyer because my writing still is very lacking in 298 00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: terms of sort of how we typically think about writing. 299 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:36,240 Speaker 1: So there was something when I sort of started and 300 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 1: fell into journalism really kind of randomly in high school. 301 00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: It was one of those things that hard work yielded results, 302 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:47,320 Speaker 1: and hard work just knocked down a lot of barriers 303 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 1: in journalism, and that's why I took to it. 304 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:54,960 Speaker 2: So you outworked everybody out. Again, if you're out there 305 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 2: on a beat, or if you're out there on a story, 306 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 2: and if you stick to it, you will end up 307 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 2: with that story. I think that that's a perfect it's 308 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 2: actually the perfect realm for you to be in. But 309 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 2: what made you think of journalism? Because you played tennis 310 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 2: to impress the girl? You know what I mean, You 311 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 2: did the pushups. 312 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:14,720 Speaker 1: Said so, yeah, I needed an internship one summer and 313 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:17,559 Speaker 1: a guy named Charlie Brennan, a great radio guy, had 314 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: one time said to me, hey, kid, if you ever 315 00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 1: need an internship. 316 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 3: Give me a call. 317 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 1: And I gave him a call and I got a 318 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: lot of coffee after my junior year in high school. 319 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 1: But I could see how if you just outworked everybody, 320 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 1: you could get to do more. You know, it's very 321 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:37,760 Speaker 1: journalism in many ways as a meritocracy, right yeah, And 322 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 1: that appealed to me, so I I just started working 323 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 1: hard and one thing led to another. Obviously in born lucky, 324 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: you know, the bullies continued out of high school. The 325 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:52,400 Speaker 1: one thing my dad didn't tell me in eighth grade 326 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 1: when I was going through everything, was middle school is 327 00:14:56,120 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 1: really great training for a Washington newsroom. Okay, is it 328 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 1: took you a second to laugh at that, but it's true. 329 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 3: You know. 330 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:07,280 Speaker 1: The one thing also that my dad did when I 331 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 1: was in eighth grade, you know, he would he would 332 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: sit there and listen to me every night, and I 333 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 1: would take out the emotional torture that I had been 334 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 1: through and oftentimes the physical you know, beating that I 335 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: had taken during the day. He would let me take 336 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: it out on him. I'd yell at him, i'd cry, 337 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 1: do all these things, but he put send me back 338 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:26,080 Speaker 1: to school the next day, right yeah. And it was 339 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 1: him and I walking through adversity together. And I didn't 340 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:31,200 Speaker 1: know this, Joe, until I interviewed my mom for the 341 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:35,680 Speaker 1: book that a lot of times after those sessions almost 342 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:38,760 Speaker 1: nightly sessions with him. You know, he would walk down 343 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 1: to the living room late at night, was all dark, 344 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:45,640 Speaker 1: and he'd just sit there and cry by himself. And 345 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:48,800 Speaker 1: I think the reason Born Lucky has resonated with so 346 00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: many people, and not just parents of kids with autism, 347 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: but ADHD and anxiety and physical disabilities and difficulties fitting 348 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 1: in and on and on, is because it proves to 349 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 1: parents that they're not alone in this struggle. 350 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 2: Yeah. 351 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 1: And I can't stress enough that idea of you know, 352 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: so many parents and it's so much easier for the 353 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 1: schools right to hey, we're just gonna take the adversity away, 354 00:16:14,920 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: no problem, that's fine, And we're seeing now the deleterious 355 00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 1: effects of that. Columbia University just came out with a 356 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 1: huge study that giving kids with anxiety accommodations for anxiety 357 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 1: just makes them more anxious. Forty percent of Stanford's popular 358 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:36,040 Speaker 1: of student population now gets accommodations for being disabled. That 359 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:40,160 Speaker 1: doesn't help kids, right, And that I think was why 360 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 1: Born Lucky is resonating in the way that it is. 361 00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 2: It's it's kind of incredible because, again not about me, 362 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:48,760 Speaker 2: but I had a very interesting relationship with my father 363 00:16:49,280 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 2: and it was such that he thought I should dig 364 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 2: ditches and drive trucks, both great jobs, by the way, 365 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 2: and I did both of those things, but I knew 366 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 2: that I had something else in mind, and it would 367 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,200 Speaker 2: be what I ended up doing. And because he kept 368 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:04,399 Speaker 2: telling me that I couldn't do it, man, I was 369 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 2: going to show him that I could do it. And 370 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:07,399 Speaker 2: I think you're right. I think you go through that 371 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 2: adversity and either you come out of it, you rise 372 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 2: from that, or you're mired in people telling patting you 373 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:15,879 Speaker 2: on the head saying oh, you're autistic, so you probably 374 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,000 Speaker 2: can't do no. No. What you said was I'm gonna 375 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 2: find what I can do, and I'm gonna do it 376 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:21,119 Speaker 2: the best I can. And again, you're one of the 377 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:23,640 Speaker 2: best that we have doing that. Was there any of that, 378 00:17:23,920 --> 00:17:27,879 Speaker 2: because it sounds like your dad was extremely supportive but 379 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:30,199 Speaker 2: at the same time not easy on you, and I 380 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 2: think it worked. 381 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:31,640 Speaker 3: Yeah. 382 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: I think that that is a really great balance to 383 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:38,600 Speaker 1: pick up on Joe, that he was extraordinarily supportive and 384 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:44,240 Speaker 1: held my hand through every moment of adversity but pushed 385 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:47,399 Speaker 1: me to be more every day. And it's important that 386 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: you know he didn't push me to get great grades, 387 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:51,119 Speaker 1: because he knew that wasn't possible. But he said, you know, 388 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:53,400 Speaker 1: when you put your mind to something, you know, when 389 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:55,199 Speaker 1: you do whatever you choose to do. And like, you know, 390 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:58,159 Speaker 1: I got involved in rowing in eighth grade and it 391 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: became a push every night of okay, how how can 392 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 1: you get better? 393 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:02,080 Speaker 3: How can you do more? 394 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 1: Same same with journalism, you know, once I picked journalism, 395 00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:08,920 Speaker 1: it became okay, what's the goals? 396 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:10,000 Speaker 3: And in a big part of. 397 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,439 Speaker 1: This book, obviously, it's about setting goals, whether it be 398 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 1: push ups when I was a little boy, or rowing 399 00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:18,399 Speaker 1: when I was in high school, or then journalism when 400 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:21,000 Speaker 1: I got into my professional career, and that was a 401 00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:23,199 Speaker 1: that's a really big thing. And I think that that 402 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:26,880 Speaker 1: it was not setting goals that he thought were important, 403 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:29,320 Speaker 1: or not setting goals that he wanted me to achieve 404 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:31,720 Speaker 1: or was going to make, you know, give him things 405 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,480 Speaker 1: to talk to his friends about. It was about things 406 00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:36,360 Speaker 1: that I wanted and that were going to be good 407 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: for me. And there's a difference there. It's interesting, Joe. 408 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,159 Speaker 1: You know, I give speeches now about this book, and 409 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:45,520 Speaker 1: I'll ask parents, you know the room, Hey, you know, 410 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:47,119 Speaker 1: if your parent put up your hands So I was 411 00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 1: at a church yesterday and ninety percent of the room 412 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:51,879 Speaker 1: their hands went up, and I said, okay, put your 413 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:56,120 Speaker 1: hands down now. If your kid is president of his class, 414 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 1: on the honor roll, captain of the sports team, never 415 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:04,680 Speaker 1: had any problems with bullying, no ADHD or anxiety, never 416 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:07,399 Speaker 1: gave you any problems. Has so many birthday party invites 417 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 1: you need a Google calendar. Put your hand up, and 418 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:12,639 Speaker 1: in the room of two hundred people, one hand went up, 419 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:13,920 Speaker 1: and I looked at the guys that you must have 420 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 1: a great wife. But I think it shows how difficult 421 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,560 Speaker 1: of a time every kid is having right now. Yeah, 422 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:29,040 Speaker 1: and therefore how much parents are able to do. And 423 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 1: that story really resonates. 424 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 2: I think a lot of parents throw their hands up, 425 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 2: and I'm glad that you're remotivating them. Whether it was 426 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:39,119 Speaker 2: the intention or not, this book will motivate them that 427 00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:40,879 Speaker 2: you can make a difference in your kid's life. And 428 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 2: it's not about letting society label the child and saying 429 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:45,760 Speaker 2: this is what the person is, this is what they 430 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 2: can do. Don't even try to help him or her 431 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:49,960 Speaker 2: out of that. I'm glad that you wrote the book 432 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 2: and people can actually get that inspiration it's born Lucky 433 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:54,960 Speaker 2: dot com. Get the book called Born Lucky. It's Leland Vendor. 434 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 2: Let me ask you this. In what you do, you're 435 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:01,159 Speaker 2: the authority, and what you you do, you have to 436 00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 2: be completely in charge of the information or else I 437 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 2: will trust you. Why put this book out there? Any hesitation? 438 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 1: It's a fantastic question. And yeah, there was a lot 439 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:14,439 Speaker 1: of hesitation by both me and my dad. You know, 440 00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:17,320 Speaker 1: going to therapy on national television is like sitting in 441 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:20,320 Speaker 1: a bathtub full of scissors. It won't kill you, but 442 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,439 Speaker 1: it's not exactly fun. I never went to therapy as 443 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:26,320 Speaker 1: a kid. So as we started writing the book, I 444 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,160 Speaker 1: was interviewing my dad and every time i'd interview him, 445 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:31,359 Speaker 1: he goes, do we really want to tell this story? 446 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:33,680 Speaker 1: Is this a little too personal? On and on and on, 447 00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:36,119 Speaker 1: and I said, Dad, this isn't going to work. I said, 448 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 1: you got to just level with me on everything, and 449 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:40,399 Speaker 1: I'll write the manuscript. If you don't like it, we 450 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 1: won't turn it into HarperCollins. So to be fair, I 451 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:46,600 Speaker 1: didn't have a plan if he said no, because I 452 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:48,720 Speaker 1: had a book contract. And it was a huge day 453 00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 1: when I gave him the manuscript and the book was 454 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:54,119 Speaker 1: due on Friday, and on Thursday he calls me and 455 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:56,200 Speaker 1: he goes, I don't know about this. He goes, Born 456 00:20:56,280 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: Lucky is this? This is everything about our family. You 457 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,000 Speaker 1: know how I felt. You know the letter that he 458 00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:05,919 Speaker 1: got from his father when he was sixteen and his 459 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:08,679 Speaker 1: dad died, and letters that my dad wrote me when 460 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:09,600 Speaker 1: I went to the Middle East. 461 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:10,919 Speaker 3: He says, I don't know about this. 462 00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:15,439 Speaker 1: And I said, okay, I've got a book deal. I've 463 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:17,119 Speaker 1: got a book contract tomorrow and I'm not gonna have 464 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:18,199 Speaker 1: chat gpt do this. 465 00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:22,200 Speaker 3: So I said, Dad, let me turn this around. 466 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:25,600 Speaker 1: I said, you remember when that woman diagnosed me and 467 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:27,840 Speaker 1: he goes uh huh. And I said you remember how 468 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 1: hopeless you felt? 469 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:30,240 Speaker 3: And he goes uh huh. 470 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:32,040 Speaker 1: And I said you remember how helpless you felt? And 471 00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:35,960 Speaker 1: he goes uh huh. I said, what if that woman 472 00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 1: had given you Born Lucky, right, she'd given you the 473 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 1: book and said, here you go. 474 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:43,600 Speaker 3: This isn't a prescription, it's not a cure, but it's 475 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:44,760 Speaker 3: the story. 476 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 1: Of what a really involved and really loving father can do. 477 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:51,840 Speaker 1: And he said I would have read it every week. 478 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 3: Okay. 479 00:21:54,560 --> 00:21:57,199 Speaker 1: I said, I think if we can do that, we 480 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:01,120 Speaker 1: can give families hope, then it's worth it. 481 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:02,919 Speaker 3: He said, okay. 482 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 1: And since then, Joe, you know, I have gotten hundreds 483 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:12,199 Speaker 1: of emails and social media comments everything else from families 484 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:13,480 Speaker 1: saying you've given us. 485 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:17,360 Speaker 3: Hope and it's been so inspiring. 486 00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:18,639 Speaker 1: And you know, I really thought there was going to 487 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 1: be some negative backlash and people are going to come 488 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: at me over and everything else. 489 00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,440 Speaker 3: Nothing, And I'll leave your you know, just this one 490 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 3: story if you have the time. 491 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:30,679 Speaker 1: You know, there are so many families that obviously have 492 00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:32,480 Speaker 1: it much worse than I did, right, you know, kids 493 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:36,600 Speaker 1: are in all sorts of different places. But I shared 494 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:39,640 Speaker 1: the born Lucky story with this father of a kid 495 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 1: who was profoundly autistic, and he said, you know what, 496 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:45,200 Speaker 1: You're so right. I'm so glad I heard this. He said, 497 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 1: my son was about twenty years old, twenty two years old, 498 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: living in a group home. Kid has some real issues, 499 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:55,120 Speaker 1: and he was angry and had all sorts of personality issues. 500 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 3: And the one thing he liked doing was splashing in 501 00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:58,080 Speaker 3: the pool. 502 00:22:58,119 --> 00:22:59,640 Speaker 1: And I would see on the reports from the group 503 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: home that he was happy splashing in the pool. So 504 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 1: I said, we need to teach my son how to 505 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,359 Speaker 1: swim and they said, you can't teach a twenty two 506 00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: year old autistic kid how to swim, and he's gonna 507 00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:09,520 Speaker 1: maybe drown and it's dangerous and everything else. And then 508 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 1: Dad guse no, no, I think we should do this. He's 509 00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 1: happiest in the pool. We're gonna get her in the pool. 510 00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:15,879 Speaker 1: The kid now swims a mile and a half every morning. 511 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,359 Speaker 1: Oh wow, he's totally different, physically, totally different, happy, his 512 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 1: personalities changed. He's up every morning with a swimsuit on, 513 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 1: ready to go. Like that is the story of what 514 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:29,800 Speaker 1: involved in dedicated parents can be. And I think that 515 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,360 Speaker 1: Born Lucky is sort of is telling and showing parents 516 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:35,359 Speaker 1: that power that they have. 517 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:38,439 Speaker 2: It's Leland Vinner. Go and get his book. It's called 518 00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:40,440 Speaker 2: Born Lucky. Go to born Lucky dot com. Born Lucky, 519 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:44,320 Speaker 2: A dedicated father, a grateful son, and my journey with autism. 520 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:46,960 Speaker 2: You said something a few times in the interview, and 521 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:48,720 Speaker 2: don't I don't think you were being humble. I think 522 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:53,080 Speaker 2: you meant it. This isn't a manual for those who 523 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,359 Speaker 2: have autistic kids. You didn't intend to be that, but Leland, 524 00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:57,920 Speaker 2: it sounds like it's starting to become that. Are you 525 00:23:57,960 --> 00:23:58,480 Speaker 2: okay with that. 526 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 3: I'm not in the advice business. When we started. 527 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,520 Speaker 1: Sending out the book, or you know, proposals for the book, 528 00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:13,560 Speaker 1: the publishers came back and said, you know, we need 529 00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: we need how tos, we need checklists, we need action items. 530 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:20,680 Speaker 1: And I said no, I said, this isn't a how 531 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 1: to manual. This is a love story of a father 532 00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,520 Speaker 1: and a son. And the only reason it came about 533 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:27,760 Speaker 1: is because Joe, to your point, when I got my 534 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,359 Speaker 1: show at NewsNation, I was working with this talent coach 535 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,159 Speaker 1: and she talked to me as I was making the 536 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 1: transition for being a reporter to being an anchor, about 537 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: trying to connect with the audience emotionally, and how do 538 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: you connect in the two box right, which is what 539 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: you and I would call this box that you're there, 540 00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,960 Speaker 1: I'm there. He says, how do you match the audience's 541 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 1: emotion and the person you're interviewing's emotion? And I said, well, 542 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: working on that, and she goes, but it seems really 543 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:56,160 Speaker 1: hard for you, and I said, well, yeah, because I'm 544 00:24:56,160 --> 00:25:00,639 Speaker 1: autistic and it's about the hardest thing I could possibly do. 545 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:04,320 Speaker 1: And she goes silent for thirty seconds. She goes, did 546 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: you say you were autistic, and I said, uh huh. 547 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,240 Speaker 1: And she says, did you tell anybody that, like the 548 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 1: bosses or I said no. I said, I've never told 549 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,479 Speaker 1: anybody that for thirty five years. It's what my dad always, 550 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 1: you know, sort of wanted me to just do things 551 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: on my own. And she goes, I don't understand. Have 552 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:23,320 Speaker 1: you ever told anybody ever written about this? And I'd 553 00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:25,720 Speaker 1: written about seven hundred words one time that I thought 554 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 1: would be an op ed as a thank you to 555 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:31,720 Speaker 1: my father and maybe put out, and she I said, 556 00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 1: well the little thing. I said, I'll send it to you. 557 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,960 Speaker 1: So I sent it to her and didn't hear anything else. 558 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:40,680 Speaker 1: And about four or five months later, my phone rang 559 00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: and it was the fellow who I worked with on 560 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: the book, a guy named Don Yaeger, and he said, 561 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:46,360 Speaker 1: you know who I am. I said, yeah, of course, 562 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:48,720 Speaker 1: you know. You've got twelve New York Times bestsellers and 563 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:52,000 Speaker 1: wrote a bunch of big time books and was worked 564 00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,240 Speaker 1: with Walter Payton Sports illustrated all this kind of stuff. 565 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 1: And he said, I really want to turn your story 566 00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,359 Speaker 1: into a book. And I said, I'm not writing a 567 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,359 Speaker 1: book and I'm not telling anybody about this like that's 568 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:03,160 Speaker 1: the whole point. He said no, he said you need 569 00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:05,359 Speaker 1: to and I said why. He said, well, I'm the 570 00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:08,480 Speaker 1: father of an autistic child and if I had had 571 00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:12,080 Speaker 1: this book it would have changed my life, and we 572 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: need to do this. So we met with dad and 573 00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,400 Speaker 1: sort of got to do this. But to your point, 574 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: I don't think this isn't. 575 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 3: A how to manual. 576 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,160 Speaker 1: The most important part of the book is the four 577 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 1: page afterward by my father, and he has a couple 578 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,400 Speaker 1: pieces of advice for parents. But he's the one who 579 00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:33,159 Speaker 1: did all this right. I just really was along for 580 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,200 Speaker 1: the ride. But I think now telling this story, even 581 00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: though my dad doesn't want to be called a hero, 582 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,880 Speaker 1: I think so many people are seeing that he has 583 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 1: shown them that there is still a lot of hope 584 00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:46,000 Speaker 1: and that they're not alone. 585 00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:48,440 Speaker 2: It's not Leland Venner. Go and get this book called 586 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:51,840 Speaker 2: Born Lucky. Born Lucky dot com is the website. Just 587 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,199 Speaker 2: my thoughts as I'm listening to you speak. It doesn't 588 00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:56,960 Speaker 2: have to be a how too manual to be a 589 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 2: really good guide. I'm really fast with the Rubik's cub 590 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:04,160 Speaker 2: I can solve it in fifteen seconds. I didn't learn 591 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 2: that by by writing down how to, or reading somebody's 592 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:09,680 Speaker 2: how to. I watch people do it. I heard their stories. 593 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 2: I figured out why they wanted to do it, and 594 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 2: then I saw their finger moves and what would be 595 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:17,639 Speaker 2: faster and whatever. They didn't intend to teach me, but 596 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:19,520 Speaker 2: I learned a lot. And I think you're doing that here, 597 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:22,119 Speaker 2: because as you're speaking, there are people in my life 598 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,280 Speaker 2: that I now know need to read the book. And again, 599 00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:27,200 Speaker 2: it might not have been in your intention for them 600 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 2: to read it and go oh wow, that worked that way. Well, 601 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,080 Speaker 2: maybe I'll apply that as well. It's a beautiful story. 602 00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:34,040 Speaker 2: I haven't read the whole book. I've read the forward, 603 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 2: but it's a beautiful story between father and son, and 604 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:40,400 Speaker 2: it's a beautiful story of struggle to triumph. I get 605 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:42,879 Speaker 2: that it might be a great movie one day. But 606 00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:45,240 Speaker 2: I'm telling you the big cell, the big sell of 607 00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:47,920 Speaker 2: this book, and you're not pushing it this way I am, 608 00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,840 Speaker 2: is that people one in thirty six are diagnosed as 609 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,640 Speaker 2: autistic in some form or fashion. In this day and age, 610 00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 2: people need this leland, So I hope that you'll embrace it. 611 00:27:57,800 --> 00:27:59,280 Speaker 2: I don't think that you're not embracing it. I know 612 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:01,520 Speaker 2: that it was in the intent but I hope that 613 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:03,359 Speaker 2: you'll embrace it because a lot more stories are going 614 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,320 Speaker 2: to be flooding your inbox, I promise you, because what 615 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 2: you've just told me in about a half an hour 616 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:09,120 Speaker 2: is unbelievable. I'll give you the last word on this. 617 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:14,120 Speaker 1: No look to me, this book is a father son 618 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:16,399 Speaker 1: love story. I wanted to show my dad that I 619 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 1: understood how much I appreciated what he did. And I 620 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:25,639 Speaker 1: wanted my dad to understand how grateful I was for 621 00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 1: all the time and all the hours and all the 622 00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: heartache that he put in to turning me into the 623 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 1: man I am. And that's why I think it is 624 00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:40,560 Speaker 1: resonated so far beyond just autism right right that it is. 625 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:44,000 Speaker 1: It is a father son love story, and that is 626 00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 1: really the important part to me. If it helps people, 627 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 1: which clearly it has started to, that's wonderful and I'm 628 00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 1: so happy and so touched, and it's interesting. I send 629 00:28:56,360 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 1: my dad all the emails of people who write in 630 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,440 Speaker 1: about this this experience and about what they've got in 631 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,080 Speaker 1: the book, and it's just meant so much to him, 632 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:12,560 Speaker 1: and that that, to me, is really the very the 633 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 1: very best part of having done this. 634 00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 3: So if if baring my soul. If it was. 635 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:23,200 Speaker 1: In reliving some of these really dark and awful moments 636 00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:27,920 Speaker 1: of my life gives others hope, then then it's worth it. 637 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:29,000 Speaker 2: I love it. 638 00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 3: Oh. 639 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:30,600 Speaker 2: I think he sounds like a great guy. Hope to 640 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:32,320 Speaker 2: meet him one day, and you're certainly a great son. 641 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:34,840 Speaker 2: Go and get this book called Born Lucky, Dedicated Father, 642 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,320 Speaker 2: a Grateful Son, and My Journey with Autism. It's Leland Vinnert. 643 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 2: Go and get it now, show it full screen. Boom, 644 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,719 Speaker 2: there it is and at the end to look at that. 645 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:43,280 Speaker 3: There you go. 646 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 2: We adjusted the camera to make sure we got it 647 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,640 Speaker 2: in there. It looks beautiful, Leland. Thanks Ci Milion for 648 00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 2: making it happen. Thank you for having me on your show. 649 00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 2: When you do and do me fair, come back on 650 00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 2: here anytime. 651 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 1: Okay, anytime, Joe. I'm at your service. 652 00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:58,880 Speaker 2: I appreciate you and hope you sell two billion books. 653 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:00,880 Speaker 2: That's going to do it for this edition of Unshaken 654 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 2: and Unafraid with Joe Pegs. Another one dropping very soon.