1
00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:08,200
Speaker 1: Is the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians. The revival

2
00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:10,799
Speaker 1: of an ancient conflict recorded in the Bible.

3
00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:13,720
Speaker 2: The nation of Israel is a resurrected nation.

4
00:00:14,080 --> 00:00:16,520
Speaker 1: What if there was going to be a resurrection of

5
00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:22,480
Speaker 1: another people, an enemy people of Israel? The Dragon's Prophecy.

6
00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:27,440
Speaker 1: Watch it now or by the DVD at the Dragonsprophecyfilm

7
00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:30,160
Speaker 1: dot Com.

8
00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:31,040
Speaker 3: Coming up.

9
00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:34,320
Speaker 2: A huge case just went before the Supreme Court. I'm

10
00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:36,559
Speaker 2: going to show why the Supreme Court is likely to

11
00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:40,559
Speaker 2: affirm President Trump's authority to fire a democratic member of

12
00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:43,240
Speaker 2: the Federal Trade Commission. This is a very important case

13
00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:46,320
Speaker 2: about the reach of executive authority.

14
00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:48,320
Speaker 3: And human rights. Attorney Brooke Goldstein joins me.

15
00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:51,760
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about the problem of anti Semitism

16
00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,319
Speaker 2: on the left and on the right. Hey, if you're

17
00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:57,280
Speaker 2: watching on YouTube x or Rumble, listening on Apple or Spotify,

18
00:00:57,560 --> 00:00:59,080
Speaker 2: please subscribe to my channel.

19
00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:01,200
Speaker 3: This is the Dition SUSA podcast.

20
00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,520
Speaker 1: America needs this voice. The times are crazy and a

21
00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:19,040
Speaker 1: time of confusion, division and lies. We need a brave

22
00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:23,560
Speaker 1: voice of reason, understanding and truth. This is the Dines

23
00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:25,160
Speaker 1: DESUSA Podcast.

24
00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:33,200
Speaker 2: Before I jump into it, a quick reminder here are

25
00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:37,640
Speaker 2: the DVDs for The Dragon's Prophecy. They're going fast, and

26
00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:40,400
Speaker 2: it's really good to order now because you're going to

27
00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:45,119
Speaker 2: get them in time for Christmas, in time for stocking stufferers,

28
00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:46,320
Speaker 2: in time for gifts.

29
00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:49,840
Speaker 3: So go to the Dragons.

30
00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:55,000
Speaker 2: Prophecyfilm dot com and sign up for sign up for DVDs.

31
00:01:55,080 --> 00:02:00,000
Speaker 2: All right, I want to talk about the hearing before

32
00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:05,400
Speaker 2: the Supreme Court yesterday on a very important issue, which

33
00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:10,440
Speaker 2: is what is the authority of the president to fire

34
00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:17,240
Speaker 2: members of the so called independent agencies. Now you know

35
00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:22,399
Speaker 2: what these independent agencies are. Typically they are called alphabet agencies,

36
00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:30,800
Speaker 2: things like the FCC, the Federal Communications Commission, or the.

37
00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:32,400
Speaker 3: FTC, which is the Federal Trade.

38
00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:37,239
Speaker 2: Commission, And there's a whole bunch of these. And many

39
00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:42,600
Speaker 2: of these agencies were created by Congress and they were

40
00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:47,200
Speaker 2: given a certain authority to do certain things having to

41
00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:51,240
Speaker 2: do with food, or with drugs, or with the communication system.

42
00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:54,840
Speaker 2: And these agencies were at one time quite small, but

43
00:02:54,919 --> 00:02:59,000
Speaker 2: they have now become huge, and so huge that they

44
00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:04,680
Speaker 2: even make deals with foreign governments. They regulate multi billion

45
00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:09,480
Speaker 2: dollar industries. They make decisions that have a massive impact

46
00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:14,120
Speaker 2: on our economy but also a massive impact on people's lives,

47
00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:15,840
Speaker 2: people's freedom, people's rights.

48
00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:18,440
Speaker 3: And here's an interesting question.

49
00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:23,120
Speaker 2: Although these agencies are set up by Congress, once they're

50
00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:29,040
Speaker 2: set up, they are typically administered by experts, bureaucrats, armies

51
00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:33,360
Speaker 2: of PhDs. And these are people who supposedly have some

52
00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:38,160
Speaker 2: regulatory expertise. They're usually plucked out of sometimes out of

53
00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:41,720
Speaker 2: the business sector, but more normally out of academia. And

54
00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:45,640
Speaker 2: they have all this power. So who are they accountable to.

55
00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:51,320
Speaker 2: Certainly Congress doesn't exercise any direct oversight over these agencies.

56
00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:51,800
Speaker 3: And why not.

57
00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:55,400
Speaker 2: Well, because Congress is the legislative body, they make laws.

58
00:03:56,120 --> 00:04:00,960
Speaker 2: The executive branch is charged with well executing or carrying

59
00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,320
Speaker 2: out the laws. And so here we get to the

60
00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:06,960
Speaker 2: logic of Trump's position. Trump's position is, well, if the

61
00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:10,880
Speaker 2: executive branch has the authority to carry out these laws,

62
00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,520
Speaker 2: the executive branch has to have authority over these agencies.

63
00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:18,200
Speaker 3: And this is the issue before the Supreme Court.

64
00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:23,120
Speaker 2: Now, all of this came about because Trump decided to

65
00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,880
Speaker 2: fire a member of the FDC, the Federal Trade Commission.

66
00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:27,720
Speaker 3: Her name is.

67
00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:33,000
Speaker 2: Rebecca Slaughter, and Rebecca Slaughter argued that not only is

68
00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:38,280
Speaker 2: her position independent of the executive but the agency has

69
00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:42,240
Speaker 2: its own authority. That authority was given by Congress. Not

70
00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:46,719
Speaker 2: only that Congress place some restrictions on the ability of

71
00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:52,360
Speaker 2: the president to fire members of the FDC, and therefore

72
00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:57,000
Speaker 2: she is immune from presidential removal.

73
00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:00,359
Speaker 3: And this was the issue before the Court.

74
00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:03,640
Speaker 2: Now, there is a governing case that goes all the

75
00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:06,160
Speaker 2: way back to FDR, all the way back to nineteen

76
00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:10,360
Speaker 2: thirty five. It's called Humphreys Executor versus United States. This

77
00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:13,640
Speaker 2: was a law passed by the Supreme Court, not a law,

78
00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:18,520
Speaker 2: but a ruling by the Supreme Court when these agencies

79
00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:22,320
Speaker 2: were just being established and they had very little power,

80
00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:25,480
Speaker 2: and by and larger Supreme Court said, you know, when

81
00:05:25,520 --> 00:05:28,560
Speaker 2: Congress sets up these agencies, there's a limit to what

82
00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:32,880
Speaker 2: the president can do to interfere with them. But interestingly,

83
00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:37,279
Speaker 2: over the years, this Supreme Court decision, going back now

84
00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:43,000
Speaker 2: some ninety years, has been hollowed out, has been pulled back,

85
00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:46,320
Speaker 2: has been scaled back. And so when the issue came

86
00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:49,800
Speaker 2: before the Supreme Court, you basically had a sharp divide

87
00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:55,320
Speaker 2: between the six Conservatives and the three liberals. And what

88
00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:57,520
Speaker 2: I'm saying here is that it looks like we are

89
00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:01,400
Speaker 2: heading to a six to three rules in which the

90
00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:06,880
Speaker 2: Supreme Court is likely to strike down this ninety year

91
00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:12,359
Speaker 2: old decision, which is Humphrey's executor, and the Supreme Court

92
00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:16,359
Speaker 2: is likely to give Trump the authority to fire this woman,

93
00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:21,040
Speaker 2: slaughter to slaughter her if you will. Now, the Court

94
00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:25,200
Speaker 2: could take a slightly narrower approach and not overturn the

95
00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:28,600
Speaker 2: ninety year old decision, but just basically say that the

96
00:06:28,600 --> 00:06:32,360
Speaker 2: circumstances have changed, and so although the decision sort of

97
00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:36,080
Speaker 2: remains in place, we're not overruling it. We are merely

98
00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:40,400
Speaker 2: applying it to completely different circumstances. When these agencies have

99
00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:44,600
Speaker 2: become mammoth and giant, and they now have huge tentacles

100
00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:48,640
Speaker 2: of power, and they do require some sort of oversight,

101
00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:52,640
Speaker 2: and that oversight appropriately comes from the executive branch and

102
00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:56,359
Speaker 2: not the legislature, and therefore Trump has every right to

103
00:06:56,440 --> 00:07:02,000
Speaker 2: give this woman the boot. Liberal justices were basically saying

104
00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:06,200
Speaker 2: that a rule by experts is a good thing, and

105
00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:11,240
Speaker 2: rule by experts is particularly good in areas that require expertise.

106
00:07:11,800 --> 00:07:14,360
Speaker 2: So what does the president know about what foods people

107
00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:16,920
Speaker 2: should eat? What does the president know about what vaccines

108
00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:19,200
Speaker 2: people should take? What does the president know about certain

109
00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:22,000
Speaker 2: types of trade deals. Remember here we're talking about the

110
00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:26,080
Speaker 2: Federal Trade Association, and so Trump needs to butt out.

111
00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:27,600
Speaker 3: This is basically where the.

112
00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:32,400
Speaker 2: Liberal justices were coming out, but none of the conservatives

113
00:07:32,440 --> 00:07:34,120
Speaker 2: are buying it at all.

114
00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:40,000
Speaker 3: And notably here we have Justice Kavanaugh.

115
00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,600
Speaker 2: No, actually it's Justice Neil gor Sach I think putting

116
00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:48,200
Speaker 2: the matter in perfect perspective, he says, this whole notion

117
00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:51,880
Speaker 2: of quote, independent agencies is a little problematic. Who are

118
00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:56,440
Speaker 2: they independent of? Are they independent of the legislature? Having

119
00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:59,320
Speaker 2: been set up, they're now independent? Are the independent of

120
00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:04,040
Speaker 2: the the executive? Are they also independent of the judiciary?

121
00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:06,640
Speaker 2: In a sense, what you're saying is that they're independent

122
00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:11,160
Speaker 2: of the American people, because where are the reigns of accountability?

123
00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:18,520
Speaker 2: And moreover, this is how Justice Gorsuch put it. He goes, quote,

124
00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:22,680
Speaker 2: there's no such thing in our constitutional order as a

125
00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:30,880
Speaker 2: fourth branch of government that is somehow quasi judicial, quasi legislative. So,

126
00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:35,680
Speaker 2: in other words, a constitutional scheme is tripartite. It's in

127
00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,520
Speaker 2: three parts. We have a legislature they make laws. We

128
00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,520
Speaker 2: have an executive they carried out. We have a judiciary.

129
00:08:41,559 --> 00:08:44,880
Speaker 2: They determine the legality or constitutionality of the laws. We

130
00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:48,240
Speaker 2: don't have anything else. Everything that we create has to

131
00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:52,319
Speaker 2: fit into this tripartite scheme, and so I think this

132
00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:57,720
Speaker 2: is the viewpoint that is likely to prevail. Now, all

133
00:08:57,760 --> 00:09:00,520
Speaker 2: of us in watching these hearings are, to some agree,

134
00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:07,240
Speaker 2: engaging in tea leaf reading, and sometimes it's hard to say.

135
00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:11,600
Speaker 2: The justices will ask probing questions, but you don't have

136
00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:14,520
Speaker 2: a clear reading as to where this is coming out.

137
00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,120
Speaker 2: But this is not one of those cases. If you

138
00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:22,000
Speaker 2: listen to the hearings, you become pretty convinced. Hah. It

139
00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:25,160
Speaker 2: looks like the conservatives all understand you cannot have these

140
00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:29,120
Speaker 2: rogue agencies that have all this power that is unchecked,

141
00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:35,600
Speaker 2: that has no oversight, and the oversight appropriately comes from

142
00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:39,079
Speaker 2: the branch of government that is entrusted with the carrying

143
00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:42,160
Speaker 2: out of the laws. And so I'm not sure when

144
00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:45,680
Speaker 2: this opinion is due, but I think it's going to

145
00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:49,560
Speaker 2: be a big win for the Conservatives, a big win

146
00:09:49,640 --> 00:09:52,120
Speaker 2: for Trump. If I was this woman's slaughter, I'd be

147
00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:56,600
Speaker 2: making other job and career plans. And the ramifications of

148
00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,560
Speaker 2: the decision are big. Why because even though it seems

149
00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:03,199
Speaker 2: to be a one person at one agency, the Federal

150
00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:07,560
Speaker 2: Trade Commission. In reality, we're talking about Trump's ability to

151
00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:12,240
Speaker 2: fire people in all these independent agencies. The only agency

152
00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:16,520
Speaker 2: that Congress expressed some reluctance about was the Federal Reserve,

153
00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:21,040
Speaker 2: where you have these governors, Federal Reserve governors that are

154
00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:24,679
Speaker 2: pointed through a complex system. And there has been for

155
00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:28,920
Speaker 2: some time talk about a independent I think it's only

156
00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:31,240
Speaker 2: a quasi independent FED.

157
00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:33,880
Speaker 3: But that's really not an issue here. This case does

158
00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:35,439
Speaker 3: not involved the Federal Reserve.

159
00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:38,720
Speaker 2: And so even though that came up as an interesting hypothetical,

160
00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:41,840
Speaker 2: and maybe in that case the Supreme Court would be

161
00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:44,920
Speaker 2: more reluctant to give the president a kind of carte

162
00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:48,960
Speaker 2: blanche in firing authority. We're talking about the agencies like

163
00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:53,480
Speaker 2: the Consumer Products Safety Commission, the Surface Transportation Board, the

164
00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:58,240
Speaker 2: so called EEOC, the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. By the way,

165
00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:03,160
Speaker 2: these agencies are dense populated with left wing bureaucrats, and

166
00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,960
Speaker 2: giving the government, in this case, a Republican president, the

167
00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:10,120
Speaker 2: chance to put these people out in the street is

168
00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:13,680
Speaker 2: overdue is something that we've been waiting for for a

169
00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:17,600
Speaker 2: long time. Interestingly, previous Republican presidents have not even gone

170
00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:20,280
Speaker 2: to the court and said give us this authority. We

171
00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,040
Speaker 2: do want to boot these people out. This really shows

172
00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:26,240
Speaker 2: the uniqueness of Trump. He goes where other Republicans have

173
00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,320
Speaker 2: feared to tread. I'm really glad he's doing it, and

174
00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:32,200
Speaker 2: it looks like in this case it's going to pay off.

175
00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:37,600
Speaker 2: Incorporating a wide variety of whole food ingredients into my

176
00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:40,840
Speaker 2: daily routine is key for me, and I do it

177
00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:43,839
Speaker 2: with this right here. This is fruits and veggies and

178
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:47,360
Speaker 2: a capsule. This is balance of nature. These are fruit

179
00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:49,560
Speaker 2: and veggie supplements that make it simple. They give me

180
00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:51,840
Speaker 2: the fruits and veggies I need and that I simply

181
00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:55,240
Speaker 2: don't have the time or the energy to eat. These

182
00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:59,200
Speaker 2: harvested ingredients have freeze dried into a fine powder using

183
00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:03,319
Speaker 2: an advanced vacuum cold process to better preserve nutritional value.

184
00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:05,600
Speaker 2: I can say with total confidence, I'm getting thirty one

185
00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:08,520
Speaker 2: ingredients from fruits and veggies. And hey, if you don't

186
00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:11,360
Speaker 2: like taking pills, no problem. Consider opening the fruit and

187
00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,560
Speaker 2: veggie supplements, Mix the powder into a smoothie or sprinkle

188
00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:16,199
Speaker 2: it over food, and you're good to go.

189
00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:18,920
Speaker 3: Join me in taking balance of nature. Every day you

190
00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:20,400
Speaker 3: get fifty.

191
00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:23,600
Speaker 2: Percent off the whole health system for life with this

192
00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:28,160
Speaker 2: limited time offer. Go to Balance of Nature dot com

193
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:30,880
Speaker 2: to claim the offer. New and existing customers can lock

194
00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:34,439
Speaker 2: in the whole health system at seventy nine dollars and

195
00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:37,280
Speaker 2: ninety nine cents per order for life. Hey, if you

196
00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:39,640
Speaker 2: canceled in the future, you lose this price, but the

197
00:12:39,679 --> 00:12:42,120
Speaker 2: way to get it go to balance.

198
00:12:41,679 --> 00:12:43,280
Speaker 3: Of nature dot com.

199
00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:48,320
Speaker 2: You know how the holidays can get long, car rides, flights,

200
00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:50,960
Speaker 2: big meals too much going on. Well, for Debbie, that

201
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:54,040
Speaker 2: often means nausea and it's the worst when you're supposed

202
00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:57,480
Speaker 2: to be enjoying family time. Our next sponsor has been

203
00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:00,480
Speaker 2: a total game changer for Debbie the last twenty years,

204
00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:04,440
Speaker 2: and especially during the holiday season. She gets nauseous a lot.

205
00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,040
Speaker 2: Between all the travel parties and end of the year

206
00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:11,760
Speaker 2: chaos Relief Ban has truly saved our family time. It's

207
00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:15,360
Speaker 2: one hundred percent drug free, it's non drowsy, works quickly

208
00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:19,480
Speaker 2: before or after symptoms start, and has zero side effects.

209
00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:24,640
Speaker 2: Plus Relief Ban's new Premiere Plus model provides advanced nausea relief,

210
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:29,640
Speaker 2: includes a digital clock and utilizes smart skin sensing technology

211
00:13:29,679 --> 00:13:31,480
Speaker 2: to preserve battery life.

212
00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:33,320
Speaker 3: If you want to head into the holidays and the

213
00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:33,640
Speaker 3: new year.

214
00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:36,760
Speaker 2: Feeling your best, join the hundreds of thousands of people

215
00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:39,800
Speaker 2: who are nausea free with relief Ban. Right now, we

216
00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:43,000
Speaker 2: have an exclusive offer just for my listeners and viewers.

217
00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:46,360
Speaker 2: Go to relief ban dot com. Use promo Codeinesh. You

218
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,760
Speaker 2: get twenty percent off plus free shipping. And remember, relief

219
00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,280
Speaker 2: Ban has extended their return window for holiday purchases through

220
00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:57,040
Speaker 2: January one, so you can shop and gift with confidence.

221
00:13:57,120 --> 00:14:02,160
Speaker 2: Head to Reliefman dot com, rl I e fband dot com.

222
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:05,360
Speaker 2: Use our promo code Denesh you get twenty percent off

223
00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:06,560
Speaker 2: lust free shipping.

224
00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:09,240
Speaker 3: Guys.

225
00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:12,559
Speaker 2: I'm delighted to welcome back to the podcast Brooke Goldstein.

226
00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:15,720
Speaker 2: She is a Miami based human rights lawyer. She is

227
00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:21,080
Speaker 2: an author, an award winning filmmaker. She's recognized really internationally

228
00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:25,000
Speaker 2: as an advocate on behalf of the Jewish community. She's

229
00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:28,880
Speaker 2: founder and executive director of the Lawfair Project, and she

230
00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:32,320
Speaker 2: is the author of Lawfair The War against Free Speech

231
00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:36,080
Speaker 2: and also a forthcoming book which is End jew Hatred,

232
00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:39,080
Speaker 2: a Manual for mobilization.

233
00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:40,880
Speaker 3: Brook, thanks for joining me.

234
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:43,800
Speaker 2: I really appreciate it, and by the way, I also

235
00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,200
Speaker 2: appreciate your helping me get the word out about the

236
00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:49,200
Speaker 2: Dragon's prophecy. I'm glad you enjoyed it, and thank you

237
00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:51,600
Speaker 2: for sharing the message.

238
00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:55,000
Speaker 4: An incredibly important film. Thank you for making.

239
00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:58,960
Speaker 2: It well, we were delighted to do it. You mentioned

240
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:01,000
Speaker 2: to me a moment ago, I want you to give

241
00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:05,520
Speaker 2: more details that you just want a big lawsuit against CARE,

242
00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:08,800
Speaker 2: which is the Council of What Arab Islamic Relations. I

243
00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:11,720
Speaker 2: guess it is a group that purports to be a

244
00:15:11,720 --> 00:15:13,920
Speaker 2: civil rights group, but I think is a long way

245
00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:16,760
Speaker 2: from that. Talk about the lawsuit, what was it about?

246
00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:17,240
Speaker 1: Right?

247
00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,080
Speaker 5: Well, thank you, thank you again for having me on.

248
00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:22,760
Speaker 5: It's always an honor and privilege to talk with you. CARE,

249
00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:26,800
Speaker 5: the Council on American Islamic Relations, as we know, is

250
00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:31,160
Speaker 5: a Muslim brotherhood front group. It was an unindicted co

251
00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:37,040
Speaker 5: conspirator in a terror financing trial and just recently was designated.

252
00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:39,280
Speaker 4: As a terrorist group by both the state of.

253
00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:43,640
Speaker 5: Texas and also Florida, which I think is a positive step. Now,

254
00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:46,200
Speaker 5: my book, my first book that you mentioned, law Fair,

255
00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:50,760
Speaker 5: The War against Free Speech, details how Islamist groups like

256
00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:56,920
Speaker 5: CARE have been weaponizing our legal system, filing frivolous lawsuits

257
00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:00,600
Speaker 5: in an attempt to silence and punish and imitate and

258
00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:04,840
Speaker 5: really shut up anybody who's speaking publicly about issues of

259
00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:09,640
Speaker 5: radical Islam, calling attention to Care's connections. And now they

260
00:16:09,680 --> 00:16:14,400
Speaker 5: are targeting Jewish people for reporting on anti Semitism, and

261
00:16:14,440 --> 00:16:17,600
Speaker 5: that is exactly what happened here. We are delighted to

262
00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:22,160
Speaker 5: report that the judge dismissed the lawsuit that CARE filed.

263
00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:26,520
Speaker 5: The Care was the attorneys in the case, Karashi v.

264
00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:26,920
Speaker 4: Beer.

265
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:30,800
Speaker 5: We represent the Beers, and what happened here is very simple.

266
00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:34,080
Speaker 4: The Beers commented on social media jew.

267
00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:41,200
Speaker 5: Hate Database posted a image exposing the plaintiff for her

268
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:45,760
Speaker 5: anti Semitic and vile anti Jewish rhetoric. And the only

269
00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:49,160
Speaker 5: things our clients did was posed to link to where

270
00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:55,359
Speaker 5: she works, which was a publicly available information, and Tartwell

271
00:16:55,480 --> 00:17:00,440
Speaker 5: Law subsequently then fired her, and rightfully so and so

272
00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:04,760
Speaker 5: Karashi then sued the Beers and the judge through the

273
00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:09,840
Speaker 5: case out, and it was an absolutely correct decision because

274
00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:12,919
Speaker 5: they recognized there was no cause of action here. It

275
00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:17,560
Speaker 5: is not illegal to post publicly available information, and that

276
00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:20,960
Speaker 5: certainly didn't lead to her firing. What led to her

277
00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:24,880
Speaker 5: firing was her anti Semitic, vile.

278
00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:27,280
Speaker 4: Jew hatred and her posts about that.

279
00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:30,000
Speaker 5: So, I think what this case shows is that the

280
00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:33,440
Speaker 5: law can no longer be weaponized, that we have an

281
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,239
Speaker 5: impartial and objective judicial system, and that this type of

282
00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:41,600
Speaker 5: lawfair will be met with justice. And the Lawfair Project

283
00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:44,320
Speaker 5: is committed and always has been, and always will be

284
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:49,399
Speaker 5: committed to defending the First Amendment rights of all Americans,

285
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:53,240
Speaker 5: not just Jewish Americans, as they speak publicly about issues

286
00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,480
Speaker 5: of concerns such as the rise in anti Semitism.

287
00:17:58,320 --> 00:17:59,800
Speaker 3: Is the strategy.

288
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:07,080
Speaker 2: That is employed by care One of using the accusation

289
00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:12,040
Speaker 2: of Islamophobia and hate speech? What is the vehicle that

290
00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:15,600
Speaker 2: they used to try to shut people down and intimidate them.

291
00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:19,479
Speaker 2: You said that they've got like a systematic campaign of

292
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:24,760
Speaker 2: doing that and actually preventing public exposure of themselves. What

293
00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,920
Speaker 2: is their technique for intimidating people into silence?

294
00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:33,159
Speaker 5: Well, in general, there's three ways to intimidate people into silence.

295
00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:37,480
Speaker 5: We've seen violence carried out by radical groups.

296
00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:40,159
Speaker 4: We saw what happened to the offices of Charlie hem Do.

297
00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,879
Speaker 5: In France when they dare to publish a cartoon with

298
00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:48,399
Speaker 5: Mohammed and a bomb in his turbane to satirize the

299
00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:51,639
Speaker 5: whole issue of Islamist terrorism. We saw what happened to

300
00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:54,040
Speaker 5: Theo Van Goh who was stabbed in the back on

301
00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:57,520
Speaker 5: the streets of Amsterdam after he co produced a movie

302
00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:00,639
Speaker 5: with an Ian Hersili, who now I believe remains in

303
00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:04,919
Speaker 5: hiding because they wanted to expose the treatment of women

304
00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:08,960
Speaker 5: under radical Islam. So there's the violent attacks and threats,

305
00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:11,639
Speaker 5: and we see violent rhetoric online all the time.

306
00:19:12,440 --> 00:19:14,240
Speaker 4: Then there's the tactics used by.

307
00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:18,840
Speaker 5: Groups like the Council on American Islamic Relations of slandering

308
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:23,919
Speaker 5: people as Islamophobic or anti Muslim. This started mostly after

309
00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:27,720
Speaker 5: nine to eleven, which I call the first great awakening,

310
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:30,800
Speaker 5: you know, in modern American history to the threat of

311
00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,520
Speaker 5: radical Islam. And we should have understood and realized what

312
00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,520
Speaker 5: we were dealing with. But right, you know, almost immediately

313
00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:41,480
Speaker 5: following the tax we had this huge, very well funded

314
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:46,359
Speaker 5: campaign to slander people who were talking about radical Islam

315
00:19:46,359 --> 00:19:48,399
Speaker 5: as a threat to our democracy and as a threat

316
00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:51,960
Speaker 5: to world peace. And it became politically incorrect to talk

317
00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:52,440
Speaker 5: about it.

318
00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:53,359
Speaker 4: And then of.

319
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:55,879
Speaker 5: Course there are these law fair lawsuits, which is what

320
00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,160
Speaker 5: I wrote my first book about Lawfair, The War against

321
00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 5: free speech, the filing of.

322
00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:07,359
Speaker 4: A frivolous and malicious and baseless lawsuits against counter terrorism officials.

323
00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,960
Speaker 5: Against members of the media, as you can see with

324
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:13,720
Speaker 5: my clients, just against anyone, you know, regular citizens who

325
00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,520
Speaker 5: are posting online and talking about these issues.

326
00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:20,240
Speaker 4: And so this has basically led to a chilling effect

327
00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:22,960
Speaker 4: in our society. Now we woke up again.

328
00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:28,840
Speaker 5: After October the seventh to this threat of Islamist terrorism

329
00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:32,840
Speaker 5: and violence, and we saw them globalizing into Fada and

330
00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:37,600
Speaker 5: bring this you know, hummus ideology to our campuses, to

331
00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:41,159
Speaker 5: our streets in the United States, and we, you know,

332
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:43,800
Speaker 5: need to talk about this stuff because if you can't

333
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:45,879
Speaker 5: talk about it, if you can't joke about it, if

334
00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,159
Speaker 5: you can't write about it, we're not going to be

335
00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,719
Speaker 5: able to understand it and defeat it. And there is

336
00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:57,280
Speaker 5: a very very shrewd strategy that is being implemented by

337
00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:00,600
Speaker 5: the month from Brotherhood. It's twenty plus years already that

338
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:06,879
Speaker 5: they've been infiltrating our systems, our campuses through charitable front organizations.

339
00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:09,800
Speaker 5: Qatar is doing the same thing with their sovereign wealth fund.

340
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,760
Speaker 5: They're funding our schools. Guitar is the Muslim brother, the

341
00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:16,280
Speaker 5: Muslim brotherhood is guitar is halmus. It's all the same

342
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,719
Speaker 5: radical ideology. They're all supportive of each other, and their

343
00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,239
Speaker 5: number one goal is to re establish the caliphate and

344
00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 5: to destroy America from within.

345
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:28,600
Speaker 4: And so the most important thing.

346
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:31,840
Speaker 5: That we must do is safeguard our rights, our First

347
00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:35,000
Speaker 5: Amendment right to free speech, because the more we talk

348
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,960
Speaker 5: about it, the more we can understand the threat and

349
00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:42,040
Speaker 5: then understand how to combat it and eventually to defeat it.

350
00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:47,840
Speaker 2: What seems very strange to me, Brooke, is that if

351
00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:54,040
Speaker 2: the goal is an Islamic caliphate with its accompaniment of

352
00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:57,679
Speaker 2: Sharia law, it seems quite clear that this is something

353
00:21:57,760 --> 00:21:59,880
Speaker 2: that really no one.

354
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:03,080
Speaker 3: In the West would want.

355
00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:05,439
Speaker 2: And by that I mean you wouldn't think that the

356
00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:07,880
Speaker 2: left would want it. You wouldn't think that the right

357
00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:11,280
Speaker 2: would want it. Who wants to live under Shariah? Now

358
00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:16,840
Speaker 2: maybe some Muslim immigrants do, but you would think the

359
00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 2: vast majority of people on both sides of the spectrum

360
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:25,320
Speaker 2: would emphatically reject this goal. And yet you have seen

361
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,760
Speaker 2: not only the rise of a strong anti Jewish, anti

362
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:33,439
Speaker 2: Israel sentiment on the left and on the right, but

363
00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:39,439
Speaker 2: it's often kind of accompanied by efforts to kind of

364
00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:45,560
Speaker 2: minimize or promote or ally with some of these Islamist elements,

365
00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 2: particularly not so much I would say al Qaeda or Isis,

366
00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:53,320
Speaker 2: but certainly with the Muslim Brotherhood agenda, just as you

367
00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 2: have described it. How do you account for this bizarre

368
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 2: sympathy to ward of goal that we would seem to

369
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:04,399
Speaker 2: be nobody really wants.

370
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,199
Speaker 5: Well, see, I think it's a combination of ignorance, but

371
00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:12,560
Speaker 5: it's also cognitive dissonance, and there's also a strategy there,

372
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,800
Speaker 5: so you know, on the street level, it's incredible ignorance.

373
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:19,919
Speaker 5: You have gays for Palestine for example, you know, women

374
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:21,560
Speaker 5: marching in tank tops and.

375
00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:22,920
Speaker 4: Shorts that are pro Hamas.

376
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 5: When the second day step foot in Gaza, they would

377
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,320
Speaker 5: be killed. You know, Gays are thrown from rooftops and

378
00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:34,000
Speaker 5: hung and murdered. So you know, you have this extreme

379
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 5: woke alliance with a radical Islamist ideology because they share

380
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:42,880
Speaker 5: the same purpose, and that is to defeat Israel. And

381
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:45,639
Speaker 5: you know that's why I also always say Jew hatred,

382
00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:47,600
Speaker 5: anti Semitism is not rational.

383
00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:51,960
Speaker 4: It makes people crazy. And what is really.

384
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:56,720
Speaker 5: Interesting is how the Islamists are very open about you know,

385
00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,680
Speaker 5: first the Saturday people, then the Sunday people, We're coming

386
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:00,239
Speaker 5: for you too.

387
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:01,879
Speaker 4: We were marching against Israel.

388
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:05,040
Speaker 5: And now you know that October the seventh and the

389
00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 5: war apparently is over, but it really isn't. Let's just

390
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,160
Speaker 5: call it a ceasefire right now. You know they're now

391
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 5: marching in Christmas markets in France and Belgium and attacking

392
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,960
Speaker 5: Christian religious bookstores, and throughout Nigeria and Sudan engaging in

393
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:25,640
Speaker 5: mass slaughter of black Christians.

394
00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:28,200
Speaker 4: It's not about Israel. And this is the.

395
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:33,680
Speaker 5: Greatest diversion tactic is getting people to well, first of all,

396
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 5: starting a war, which is what Hamas did, getting people

397
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:42,360
Speaker 5: to believe that Islamism is only a threat to the Jews.

398
00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 5: And if only we created another Palestinian Islamic state in

399
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,879
Speaker 5: a sea of failed Islamic dictatorships, all of a sudden,

400
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,679
Speaker 5: there would be peace and diverting everyone's attention to the

401
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 5: so called Israeli Palestinian conflict as though that is the

402
00:24:56,800 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 5: cause of the problem, when it's really not. It's the

403
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 5: Muslims in mosques, the radical emoms preaching throughout Europe, throughout

404
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 5: the United States and Canada. Death to the Infidels, death

405
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,560
Speaker 5: to the Americans, death to the Jews, death to Gaze,

406
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:17,639
Speaker 5: subjugation of women. The issue is radical Islam, and what

407
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:23,960
Speaker 5: really we should be forming are alliances between minority communities

408
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,639
Speaker 5: and all communities, frankly that believe in the upholding of

409
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 5: Judeo Christian values against the infiltration of radical Islam. But

410
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:35,960
Speaker 5: going back to your earlier question, this should have been

411
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 5: done twenty years ago.

412
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 4: But because of the.

413
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:43,920
Speaker 5: Islam of fov Mania campaign, the coordinated and very well

414
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 5: funded effort to silence us, to sue us, to defame us,

415
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 5: we couldn't organize or talk about this. But now is

416
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,000
Speaker 5: the time. Now is the time to wake up and understand.

417
00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,960
Speaker 5: You know, I always say that we're wasting our time

418
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 5: with pro Israel AD. The goal should not be to

419
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,919
Speaker 5: get people to love Israel. The goal should be to

420
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 5: form alliances against the creep of radical Islam into our

421
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 5: Western Judeo.

422
00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:14,560
Speaker 4: Christian societies, because that is the real threat.

423
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 5: You know, there's no reason why a mother in Ohio

424
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 5: should care about Israeli politics. But when you show that

425
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 5: mother a video of a young girl who dresses perhaps

426
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 5: like her daughter, walking down a street in Belgium and

427
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:31,920
Speaker 5: being surrounded by fifteen Muslims who are shouting and threatening

428
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,560
Speaker 5: to rape her and attack her because she's not dressed

429
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 5: in a Sharia compliant way.

430
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:39,240
Speaker 4: That is what you should be worried about.

431
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 5: And when they say globalizing into Fada, that is what

432
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:47,320
Speaker 5: they mean, bring Sharia law and radical Islamist principles into

433
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,119
Speaker 5: the West. And we see this all over Europe. You know,

434
00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:53,479
Speaker 5: it used to be faux pas to talk about the

435
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 5: Sharia nogo zones throughout France. It's happening.

436
00:26:57,880 --> 00:26:58,400
Speaker 4: It's real.

437
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,199
Speaker 5: There are places in France the police can even go

438
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,440
Speaker 5: to without you know, full armor and automatic weaponry, and

439
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 5: they go in and they out, and it's real compliant neighborhoods.

440
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,400
Speaker 4: That's what's happening, you know, in Michigan.

441
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,959
Speaker 5: That's what you know, they want to happen throughout the

442
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:16,399
Speaker 5: Western world. And we cannot allow this to happen. We

443
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 5: cannot have a subset of Sharia compliant neighborhoods within our

444
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,160
Speaker 5: Western democracy because it is just not compatible with our

445
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,840
Speaker 5: constitutional rights.

446
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:31,240
Speaker 3: In some ways, broke.

447
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 2: It seems to me that if if this is really

448
00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 2: a fight about Judaeo Christian values, I can sort of

449
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:40,760
Speaker 2: understand why some people on the left, particularly people.

450
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 3: Who are products of our media or education system.

451
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,280
Speaker 2: They can say, well, we don't like we don't like

452
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 2: Judeo Christian civilization, so naturally we're going to be somewhat

453
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,359
Speaker 2: pro Islamic because we agree with them that it'd be

454
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:54,679
Speaker 2: really good for the civilization to be taken down. It

455
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:58,760
Speaker 2: seems to me, though, much more surprising to encounter the

456
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,199
Speaker 2: same kinds of sentiment coming from the right, because the

457
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:07,160
Speaker 2: people on the right profess to be dedicated Christians, avidly

458
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:10,920
Speaker 2: in support of Western values, and yet you see an

459
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 2: echo of some of those sentiments kind of right of center,

460
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 2: and some of us who are on the right are like,

461
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 2: where is this coming from? You have any thoughts about

462
00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:22,399
Speaker 2: where it's coming from and why?

463
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 5: Well, I'm happy you brought it up, because this, to

464
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 5: me is the greatest concern.

465
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:33,239
Speaker 4: We've lost the Democratic Party. It's been completely.

466
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:36,159
Speaker 5: Captured by the radical left, the woke, the progressives, and

467
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:37,480
Speaker 5: their alliance with Islamists.

468
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 4: We see that, and now the goal is to capture

469
00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 4: the right.

470
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:44,080
Speaker 5: And you know, a lot of people are accusing Katar

471
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 5: of being behind it. I know that Tucker Carlson came

472
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 5: out recently and said he hasn't taken any money from Katar.

473
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 5: But Laura Lumer just broke that, in fact, he did

474
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 5: at least take a couple hundred thousand dollars allegedly from

475
00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 5: Qatar when he was doing one interview. So if he's

476
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,920
Speaker 5: lying about that, perhaps he's lying about other things. And

477
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 5: you see now this resurgence of a perverted version of

478
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 5: an originally perverted ideology of replacement theology coming back and

479
00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:19,800
Speaker 5: a targeted attack to the Christian evangelical youth to pervert

480
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 5: really the words of Jesus, to accuse Israel wrongfully of

481
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,480
Speaker 5: bringing us into the so called Forever Wars, when really

482
00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 5: we should be thanking Israel for being on the front

483
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 5: lines of the war against radicalization and turning American youth

484
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 5: towards radical ideologies. And I'm very concerned that the next

485
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 5: presidential election we're going to see on stage both from

486
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:51,800
Speaker 5: the Democrats and potentially, god forbid, the Republicans, radical candidates.

487
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:55,960
Speaker 4: And so we have to look deep with it.

488
00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:59,920
Speaker 5: How is this happening, And really it's happening through social media,

489
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 5: it's happening through TikTok, it's happening through the infiltration of

490
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 5: our educational systems.

491
00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 4: You know, Katar has spent.

492
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 5: Over one billion dollars a year at least that we

493
00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 5: know of, infiltrating academia through DEI through the so called

494
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:14,800
Speaker 5: critical race theory.

495
00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:16,240
Speaker 4: But we've seen this in the past.

496
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 5: We saw, for example, the Mufty of Jerusalem meet with

497
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 5: Hitler back during World War Two, when the Nazis, you know,

498
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 5: they they hate the Semitic people. They were anti Semitic

499
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 5: in every sense of.

500
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 4: The word, right. They had no love.

501
00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:35,320
Speaker 5: For the brown Arabs that live in the Middle East.

502
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 5: And yet they saw an alliance, and that alliance was

503
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:41,040
Speaker 5: based solely on one thing, jew hatred. And that's why

504
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:44,960
Speaker 5: jew hatred is a disease, it's a virus that drive society.

505
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 5: Is crazy, it is not rational. It is partially responsible

506
00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 5: for these, you know, convenient alliances between people whose values otherwise,

507
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 5: you know, don't align. Because the enemy of my enemy

508
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:03,640
Speaker 5: is my friend. And that's how they see it.

509
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 4: But I'm telling you.

510
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 5: Again, first the Saturday people, then the Sunday people. And

511
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 5: this is not something I'm making up. This is something

512
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 5: that is openly admitted. If you watch, you know, any

513
00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 5: of the translations of the media coming out of the

514
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 5: Arab world, they are very open about what their strategy

515
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 5: is and they frankly see Israel as a little America,

516
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 5: not vice versa. They see Israel as the outpost of

517
00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 5: Western democracy in the Middle East. So that is why

518
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 5: it is so important that we uphold our values. It's

519
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 5: important we get the foreign funding outside of our educational system.

520
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:42,840
Speaker 5: I think we should get foreign funding, especially from countries

521
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 5: that fund terrorism. Guitar is the number one largest state

522
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 5: sponsor of terror right now. It's the main backer of Hummas.

523
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 5: I don't know why their sovereign wealth fund is able

524
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 5: to operate freely. I've heard this statement over and over again,

525
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:01,480
Speaker 5: especially when it comes to the reinvigoration of the Abraham Accords,

526
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 5: that economic partnership leads to peace. And I don't know

527
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 5: why that is taken as a given, because you know

528
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 5: what I call it is economic entanglement. When we allow

529
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 5: Qatar to own our schools, to own our hospitals, to

530
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 5: fund media, that has not led to peace, That has

531
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 5: led to destabilization of our country and the.

532
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 4: Spread of radical values.

533
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:28,120
Speaker 5: In anti American ideology. And so I just ask people

534
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 5: to question, even with the Abraham Accords, these Islamist countries,

535
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,080
Speaker 5: and they're Muslim countries, they will always be Muslim countries.

536
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:38,520
Speaker 5: They can dial up the radicalism and they can dial

537
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 5: it down. Saudi Arabia don't forget nine to eleven, but

538
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 5: all of a sudden they want to be part of

539
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 5: the Abraham Accords, so they're taking the jew aged and

540
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 5: the anti Americanism out of their curriculum. We can invest

541
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 5: with them. We're not becoming rich. Saudi Arabia becomes rich,

542
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 5: qatark becomes rich, and maybe certain investment funds in the

543
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 5: United States get wealthier, but the American people are not

544
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:02,680
Speaker 5: getting wealthier from these partnerships were enriching these countries. In

545
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:04,719
Speaker 5: ten fifteen years down the line, we're going to be

546
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 5: so economically intertwined with them and reliant on them that

547
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 5: when they turn up the Islamism again and they start

548
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:14,040
Speaker 5: funding terrorism, there's going to be nothing that.

549
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,960
Speaker 4: We could do about it. So these are the things

550
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 4: that concern me the most right now.

551
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 3: I mean, this is very interesting. Brook.

552
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,719
Speaker 2: What you're really saying is in some ways Qatar and

553
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 2: even Saudi Arabia are more dangerous than even Iran, because

554
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 2: when somebody has got their guns and nuclear weapons or

555
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 2: potential nuclear weapons pointed at you, well, it's not difficult

556
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:38,680
Speaker 2: to see that.

557
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,680
Speaker 3: They don't wish, they don't mean any good, right.

558
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 2: But I think what you're saying is when people come

559
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,200
Speaker 2: in and buy your land and buy your businesses and

560
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 2: claim to cooperate on AI, you think, well, wow, we

561
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,479
Speaker 2: you know we've got to we've we're making trade deals

562
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 2: with these people, and you're saying their agenda may still

563
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 2: remain exactly the same and all of this is part

564
00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 2: of a of a long term strate. How did you?

565
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 3: Guys?

566
00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:03,360
Speaker 2: Have been talking to Brooke Goldstein, executive director of The

567
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 2: Lawfair Project, the forthcoming book and jew Hatred, a manual

568
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:08,560
Speaker 2: for mobilization.

569
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 3: Check it out.

570
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 2: By the way, you can follow Brook on x at

571
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 2: Goldstein brook Brook and the website The Lawfair Project dot org.

572
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 3: Brook thank you very much for joining me.

573
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me today.

574
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 3: It's still going on, guys.

575
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 2: It's my Pillows, big three in one sale with a

576
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:31,719
Speaker 2: limited edition product, a back in stock special, and a

577
00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 2: closeout deal you won't find anywhere else. My pillow bedsheets

578
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 2: just twenty nine ninety eight, any color, any style, any size,

579
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,920
Speaker 2: even kings regular price one hundred nineteen ninety eight now

580
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 2: only twenty nine eighty eight. But move quickly, because once

581
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,359
Speaker 2: they're gone, they're gone for good. My towels are back

582
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 2: in stock. Get a six piece my towel set regular

583
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 2: price sixty nine ninety eight, now only thirty nine ninety eight,

584
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 2: And for the first and only time, get their limited

585
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:00,799
Speaker 2: edition Premium my Pillows made with He's a Cotton and

586
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:04,400
Speaker 2: a Designer Gussett Queen's Size seventeen.

587
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:06,399
Speaker 3: Ninety eight kings only nineteen ninety eight.

588
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:08,759
Speaker 2: Also for a limited time, when you order over one

589
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:11,760
Speaker 2: hundred dollars, you get free shipping plus one hundred dollars

590
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:15,759
Speaker 2: in free digital gifts called eight hundred eight seven six

591
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 2: zero two two seven. That's eight hundred eight seven six

592
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:21,799
Speaker 2: zero two two seven. Or go to my pillow dot

593
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 2: com use promo code denesh for the best offers. Ever,

594
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,560
Speaker 2: quantities are low, so order now again. It's MyPillow dot

595
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 2: com and the promo code is din e SHDNESH. You know,

596
00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:38,279
Speaker 2: in the conversation I just had with Brooke Goldstein, she

597
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 2: made a reference to replacement theology, a topic I've alluded

598
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:46,960
Speaker 2: to off and on on this program, but I haven't

599
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 2: really gotten into it. And many of the people who

600
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:57,920
Speaker 2: advocate this replacement theology, they sometimes do it as a

601
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 2: in distinction to or in contrast to, the idea of

602
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 2: dispensational theology. Now, dispensational theology is a kind of Protestant

603
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 2: understanding of the way in which the end times will

604
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 2: unfold the various eras or dispensations. And some of the people,

605
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 2: not all, but many who advocate the replacement theology think

606
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,080
Speaker 2: that they're coming out of like a Catholic understanding that

607
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 2: is older, more venerable, more reliable than this sort of

608
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 2: newfangled Protestant view. And so I thought to myself, as

609
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 2: someone who's actually studied the Catholic intellectual tradition for a

610
00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:42,799
Speaker 2: long time. In fact, I went through Catholic Catechism many

611
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:44,480
Speaker 2: many years ago when I was a child.

612
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 3: I thought to myself, let me look.

613
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 2: Up what the greatest thinker in the Catholic Church, the

614
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:52,520
Speaker 2: philosopher Thomas Aquinas.

615
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 3: In a sense, this is a guy who's considered.

616
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:59,719
Speaker 2: The official Catholic philosopher, and apart from say Augustine in

617
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 2: the four century, it's hard to think of a thinker

618
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:06,880
Speaker 2: of comparable eminence. What did he think about replacement theology?

619
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:10,839
Speaker 2: So I've done a little bit of digging into it,

620
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:14,279
Speaker 2: And I want to summarize Aquinas's conclusions because I think

621
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:22,040
Speaker 2: they throw a lot of light on this very muddled debate. Basically,

622
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 2: what a Quinas says is that the replacement is true

623
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 2: in a particular sense, in a theological sense, in a

624
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 2: salvational sense, but not in any other sense. So let's

625
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 2: speak clear about what he means. What he is saying

626
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 2: is that in the Old Testament, or prior to the

627
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 2: coming of Christ, let us say, salvation was based upon

628
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:55,840
Speaker 2: trust in God and good deeds. You didn't have Christ

629
00:37:55,960 --> 00:38:00,319
Speaker 2: having paid the ultimate sacrifice for sin. And so what

630
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 2: are you supposed to do if you are Abraham or

631
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:08,480
Speaker 2: Isaac or Jacob or Joshua. You can't exactly place your

632
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 2: faith in Christ because Christ hasn't come yet. And so

633
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:15,400
Speaker 2: for the Jews of the Old Testament, God had rules,

634
00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 2: he had laws, He had rights and commandments, and the

635
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:25,720
Speaker 2: Jews were asked to keep those. And if you keep those,

636
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,919
Speaker 2: then and if you have, as Abraham did, trust in God.

637
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,680
Speaker 2: Let's remember when God told Abraham to take Isaac to

638
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:35,920
Speaker 2: the top of the mountain and sacrifice him. What does

639
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,319
Speaker 2: it reflect if not trust for Abraham to go, I

640
00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:43,479
Speaker 2: will do as you say, and he almost went through

641
00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:47,400
Speaker 2: with it until God himself said stop. And so that's trust,

642
00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:55,359
Speaker 2: that is obedience, that is ultimately letting God have his way. Now,

643
00:38:55,520 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 2: says a Quitinnas, once Jesus comes, once Jesus die and

644
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 2: is resurrected, there is a.

645
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:07,280
Speaker 3: New spiritual era. Salvation now is through Jesus.

646
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 2: Jesus is in fact the way, and Jesus is in

647
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 2: fact the only way. So in this sense there is

648
00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:17,680
Speaker 2: a replacement. The replacement is that the kind of old

649
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:21,400
Speaker 2: way of climbing the spiritual ladder and getting to the

650
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 2: pearly gates, if I can put it crudely, is now

651
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:28,200
Speaker 2: replaced with a new way, which is accepting the free

652
00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:31,920
Speaker 2: gift of salvation that comes from the sacrifice that is

653
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:35,040
Speaker 2: done by Christ. And so says Aquinas, if you have

654
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:39,560
Speaker 2: Jews now who reject Christ, who know about him and

655
00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 2: go no thank you, then they are cutting themselves off

656
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:46,319
Speaker 2: from that way. They are cutting themselves off from that

657
00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 2: road to salvation, which happens to be the only road.

658
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:52,360
Speaker 3: So replacement theology.

659
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:57,280
Speaker 2: Is true in that sense, but in that sense alone.

660
00:39:57,440 --> 00:39:59,960
Speaker 2: A Quinas goes on to say that what is no

661
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:04,839
Speaker 2: not being replaced is in fact, the entirety of the

662
00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 2: Biblical story. The Biblical story is a narrative with a beginning,

663
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 2: a middle, and an end. It begins with creation. It

664
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 2: begins for the Jews and for the relationship with God.

665
00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:21,880
Speaker 2: The Original Covenant begins with Abraham, it continues through Moses.

666
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 2: Jesus is, by the way, not the end of the story,

667
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 2: but the middle of the story, because the end of

668
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 2: the story is the return of the Messiah, and it

669
00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:35,239
Speaker 2: says a Quinas, all kinds of events are foretold in

670
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 2: the Bible, including conversions of the Jews, maybe not all

671
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:40,280
Speaker 2: the Jews, but many Jews.

672
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:42,600
Speaker 3: And all of this these are all.

673
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 2: Earthly promises that are going to happen on this earth.

674
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 2: And they involve not necessarily the next world.

675
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 3: Per se.

676
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:53,799
Speaker 2: They have to do with things that are predicted and

677
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 2: forecast to happen in this world. And what of all

678
00:40:57,640 --> 00:41:03,360
Speaker 2: that is repudiated, goes none of it. So you still

679
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 2: have the relevance of the Creation story. You have the

680
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:09,960
Speaker 2: relevance of the Exodus. You have the relevance of the

681
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:14,839
Speaker 2: Ten Commandments that certainly hasn't been displaced or replaced. You

682
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,960
Speaker 2: have the Psalms, you have the prophets, you have the

683
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:22,440
Speaker 2: unfolding of the prophecies, you have the early Church, and

684
00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:24,840
Speaker 2: you have of course the times to come. So that

685
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:28,720
Speaker 2: story which the Bible kind of lays out from beginning

686
00:41:28,719 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 2: to end, is in no way replaced. The New Testament

687
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 2: does not kick out the Old. The replacement does occur,

688
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,000
Speaker 2: but in the narrow sense I just described. It's very

689
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:43,040
Speaker 2: important because it has to do with what Augustine would

690
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:47,040
Speaker 2: actually have called earlier, many centuries earlier, the city of God.

691
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:51,920
Speaker 2: But God also makes many promises in the City of Man,

692
00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:55,560
Speaker 2: and those promises including by the way the land promises

693
00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:59,359
Speaker 2: to Abraham, the land promises to Abraham's descendants.

694
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:01,000
Speaker 3: The land to the Jews.

695
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:07,960
Speaker 2: That is not repudiated, that is not replaced at all.

696
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:13,919
Speaker 2: I'm hoping today to complete the chapter on biology, which

697
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:18,200
Speaker 2: is called Undeniable Teleology. This is from my book Life

698
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:23,200
Speaker 2: After Death. The evidence and the question we're exploring here

699
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:28,880
Speaker 2: is does biology reveal some kind of a pattern in

700
00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:36,320
Speaker 2: nature that points to a movement from the material to

701
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 2: the spiritual, or from the material to the immaterial, or

702
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:48,440
Speaker 2: from plain physical objects to something as abstract and immaterial

703
00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:53,880
Speaker 2: as consciousness. We're looking for this in nature itself now

704
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 2: many people will say the design of nature points to

705
00:42:57,040 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 2: a designer, and that is a separate argument to be

706
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 2: made on another day. I agree with that argument, but

707
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 2: I'm not really jumping from design to a designer. I'm

708
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:12,759
Speaker 2: merely asking what is the design? Where is the design

709
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:17,439
Speaker 2: such as it is pointing to? And that's what we're

710
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:20,320
Speaker 2: going to be looking at now. I want to suggest

711
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:25,000
Speaker 2: that the pattern of biology and of nature is right

712
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 2: before our eyes.

713
00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:27,279
Speaker 3: It's kind of.

714
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:31,160
Speaker 2: Amazing that biologists by and large don't see it. They

715
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:35,960
Speaker 2: missed the forest for the trees, and we can see

716
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,759
Speaker 2: this design. We can see this pattern not only in

717
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:46,760
Speaker 2: evolution itself, but also in the preconditions that produce evolution. Now,

718
00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 2: what I'm about to say has nothing to do with theology.

719
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 2: It has everything to do with scientific description, and it

720
00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:58,920
Speaker 2: is a refutation of a common argument made by some

721
00:43:59,080 --> 00:44:02,839
Speaker 2: biologists today, but it used to be very common a.

722
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 3: Few decades ago. Stephen J.

723
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:08,120
Speaker 2: Gould is probably the most common, the most prominent advocate

724
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 2: of this view, but others like John NAYNERD. Smith also

725
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:13,200
Speaker 2: made it. The idea is that evolution is based on

726
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:17,319
Speaker 2: like random accidents, and there's no pattern in evolution and

727
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:19,520
Speaker 2: therefore there's no pattern in nature.

728
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:21,120
Speaker 3: Now, Stephen J.

729
00:44:21,239 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 2: Gould, in his book Full House, basically makes the argument

730
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:27,720
Speaker 2: the following way. He goes, where's the pattern in nature? Sure,

731
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:30,640
Speaker 2: one thing evolves into another, but he goes, the thing

732
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 2: that is the basis of this evolution. Let's just say

733
00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:39,359
Speaker 2: A evolves into B, and B evolves into C, and

734
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:40,440
Speaker 2: C evolves into D.

735
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:43,680
Speaker 3: But A, B, and C are still around. They haven't

736
00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:44,759
Speaker 3: been eliminated.

737
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:48,720
Speaker 2: They might have produced new forms, but the old forms

738
00:44:48,719 --> 00:44:51,040
Speaker 2: still coexist alongside the new forms.

739
00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:52,080
Speaker 3: And Stephen J.

740
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:56,040
Speaker 2: Gould gives the example of bacteria. He goes, bacteria maybe

741
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 2: quote the lowest of all the life forms. Maybe they

742
00:44:58,520 --> 00:45:01,959
Speaker 2: were there at the very beginning, along before man. But hey,

743
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 2: we still have bacteria.

744
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:04,000
Speaker 3: They're still around.

745
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 2: Here's Gould, fishes didn't die out or stop evolving because

746
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:13,000
Speaker 2: one lineage of creatures out of the ocean managed to

747
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,480
Speaker 2: colonize the land. So this is the gold argument that

748
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 2: evolution is a mish mash. It's there is no detectable movement,

749
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 2: a direction, or pattern. But this view has been challenged

750
00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:32,319
Speaker 2: in recent years by two mammoth figures. Christian Dadou, who

751
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:34,879
Speaker 2: won the Nobel Prize for the study of cells, and

752
00:45:34,920 --> 00:45:38,280
Speaker 2: Simon Conway Morris, who's the world's leading expert on the

753
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 2: so called Burgess shale. And these guys argue, and I

754
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:46,080
Speaker 2: think you can see the intuitive sense of it that

755
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:52,440
Speaker 2: for all the babble about randomness, evolution follows predictable pathways.

756
00:45:53,120 --> 00:45:56,920
Speaker 2: They give one a clear example, and that is the eye. Now,

757
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 2: evidently the eye has evolved separately and independently many different

758
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:05,880
Speaker 2: times under evolution. So it's not like the eye evolved

759
00:46:05,880 --> 00:46:08,279
Speaker 2: and then one eye led to another eye. It's that

760
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:12,719
Speaker 2: eyes developed in separate creatures and even species, independently of

761
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:13,120
Speaker 2: each other.

762
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 3: So what does that show you? Quote?

763
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:17,240
Speaker 2: It shows that even though you have these different groups

764
00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 2: of creatures quote, each group has independently navigated to the

765
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:27,040
Speaker 2: same evolutionary solution. Wow, pretty fascinating. Not only this, but

766
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:32,560
Speaker 2: there's a phenomenon that these scientific giants call evolutionary convergence.

767
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 2: And what do we mean by evolutionary convergence. It's that

768
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:38,240
Speaker 2: even though there is an element of randomness, so obviously

769
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:40,839
Speaker 2: the conditions under which you survive are different from here

770
00:46:40,840 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 2: to there. But what they're getting at is, nevertheless, certain

771
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:48,919
Speaker 2: patterns are clearly detectable let's give a couple of analogies

772
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:50,399
Speaker 2: of what they're getting at.

773
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 3: It's very random.

774
00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:54,040
Speaker 2: If I toss a coin, it's random whether I get

775
00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 2: ahead or a tail. But on the other hand, I

776
00:46:56,600 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 2: can predict that if I toss a coin one hundred times,

777
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:03,399
Speaker 2: I can predict roughly how many heads and tails I'm

778
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:03,839
Speaker 2: gonna get.

779
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:04,799
Speaker 3: Now, how can I do that?

780
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:09,439
Speaker 2: Because even though each toss is random, the process as

781
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:11,759
Speaker 2: a whole is not random. I'm gonna get close to

782
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 2: fifty heads and close to fifty tails. It'd be really

783
00:47:14,719 --> 00:47:17,359
Speaker 2: surprising to toss a coin one hundred times and get

784
00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:20,360
Speaker 2: one hundred heads or ninety nine heads in one tail.

785
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 2: That could happen, but it's extremely unlikely. So the point

786
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:28,320
Speaker 2: is that even though there's a randomization in the process,

787
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:30,839
Speaker 2: the results are fairly predictable.

788
00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 3: Or think of water that is at the top of

789
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:34,560
Speaker 3: a mountain that's coming down.

790
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:39,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's not an absolute established path for the water.

791
00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:41,399
Speaker 2: It could cut this way, it could cut that way.

792
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:43,520
Speaker 2: Here's a tree, the water goes around the tree. There's

793
00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:46,000
Speaker 2: a rock, the water goes around the rock. But the

794
00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:49,279
Speaker 2: point is, even though the water is coming down many

795
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 2: different ways, it's going in the same direction, isn't it.

796
00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:55,279
Speaker 2: It's not going up, it's not going sideways, it is

797
00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:57,919
Speaker 2: in fact going down. And very often the water will

798
00:47:58,000 --> 00:48:00,960
Speaker 2: end in the same pool, it'll end in the same place.

799
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:03,680
Speaker 2: And this is what the scientists are saying about evolution,

800
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 2: that if you could rerun the tape of evolution, no,

801
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 2: you wouldn't end up in some timbuk two. You'd pretty

802
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:12,400
Speaker 2: much find similar patterns that come out again and again

803
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 2: and reach somewhat the same or similar results. So Christian

804
00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 2: Dadou has a phrase which I think is very resonant here.

805
00:48:21,560 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 2: He speaks about the arrow of evolution. And the point

806
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:28,279
Speaker 2: about an arrow is an arrow flies kind of predictably

807
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:32,080
Speaker 2: toward a target. And de Duke says, Okay, when we

808
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:36,040
Speaker 2: look at evolution, we go through these stages or ages.

809
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:41,879
Speaker 2: There is the age of chemistry, and then there's the

810
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:46,520
Speaker 2: age of information. So we move from the first age

811
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 2: to the second. We have chemistry now too, but information

812
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:52,920
Speaker 2: is in a way the summit. Similarly, you can speak

813
00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 2: of the movement from the age of the single cell

814
00:48:55,800 --> 00:49:00,080
Speaker 2: to the age of multi cellular organisms to now the

815
00:49:00,120 --> 00:49:03,040
Speaker 2: age of the mind. And let's spend a moment on

816
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 2: what we mean by the age of the mind. This

817
00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:08,880
Speaker 2: is a very kind of arresting and interesting concept because

818
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:09,320
Speaker 2: it has.

819
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 3: Produced a new order of being in the world.

820
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 2: If you go from a unicellular creature one cell to

821
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:20,640
Speaker 2: a multicellular creature, you're still dealing by and large with creatures.

822
00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:26,840
Speaker 2: But if you move from unconsciousness, or you move even

823
00:49:26,880 --> 00:49:35,359
Speaker 2: from consciousness but not mental understanding, to mental understanding. Let's

824
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:39,279
Speaker 2: just say, for example, the consciousness of a deer or

825
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 2: the consciousness of a rabbit to human consciousness, those are

826
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:48,560
Speaker 2: very different. Because human consciousness, for example, is capable of

827
00:49:48,600 --> 00:49:53,080
Speaker 2: contemplating itself. It is also capable of contemplating the process

828
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:56,400
Speaker 2: of evolution, which is not accessible to like a deer

829
00:49:56,960 --> 00:49:59,319
Speaker 2: or to a rabbit. And so we now have a

830
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:03,640
Speaker 2: special mid of being in the world. And the point is,

831
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:07,000
Speaker 2: the pattern is really clear. The universe has in a

832
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:11,840
Speaker 2: way enabled its own comprehension. I'm quoting now from the

833
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:15,680
Speaker 2: book Nature has Unfolded, a plan for nature itself to

834
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:20,120
Speaker 2: become known. The progression of evolution on Earth shows an

835
00:50:20,239 --> 00:50:26,920
Speaker 2: unmistakable trajectory movement from matter to mind. Now, mind, as

836
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:30,600
Speaker 2: I've said many times, is not material. It is immaterial,

837
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:34,759
Speaker 2: and material things like bodies are breakable, they're perishable, but

838
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:36,080
Speaker 2: immaterial things.

839
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:38,640
Speaker 3: Like ideas are not. And so here we have a.

840
00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:42,480
Speaker 2: Really important clue to life after death. Why because in

841
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:47,920
Speaker 2: showing that perishable matter has within itself the capacity to

842
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:51,960
Speaker 2: generate imperishable ideas, we see in nature a clue to

843
00:50:52,880 --> 00:50:57,760
Speaker 2: unique creatures like us who can read Nature's laws and patterns.

844
00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:01,520
Speaker 2: And just as nature is part material and perishable and

845
00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:05,480
Speaker 2: also part immaterial and imperishable, hey.

846
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 3: So are we.

847
00:51:07,680 --> 00:51:11,400
Speaker 2: So it's possible that our individual destiny may follow Nature's

848
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:16,279
Speaker 2: destiny in moving from one type of existence material to

849
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:18,040
Speaker 2: another immaterial.

850
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:19,799
Speaker 3: So the time will come when.

851
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:24,200
Speaker 2: Our bodies will irretrievably break down, we know, but it

852
00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:29,000
Speaker 2: is possible, and I write indeed suggested within the script

853
00:51:29,120 --> 00:51:34,280
Speaker 2: of nature that a part of us might outlast these

854
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 2: mortal coils.

855
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:40,080
Speaker 1: Subscribe to the Dinesh DeSUS a podcast on Apple, Google,

856
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:44,560
Speaker 1: and Spotify, or watch on Rumble YouTube and Salem now

857
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:51,160
Speaker 1: dot com.