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Speaker 1: Life audio. At this hour, American and coalition forces are

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Speaker 1: in the early stages of military operations to disarmed rat

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Speaker 1: that free it's people. You could defend the world from

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Speaker 1: grave danger.

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Speaker 2: I will never forget the image during the ambush at

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Speaker 2: the bridge. We're on top of the bridge, We're trying

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Speaker 2: to deal with the craziness. The bombs are falling. But

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Speaker 2: I looked over my shoulder and you were laying on

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Speaker 2: the top of a home, the engaging targets off in

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Speaker 2: the distance. Wild times right, Well.

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Speaker 1: It really was. And sometimes i've you know, in previous

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Speaker 1: conversations and but what was it for the kind of

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Speaker 1: the scars and the pictures and not sound dramatic, like

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Speaker 1: it almost seems like a dream. My counselor asked me

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Speaker 1: a question. He said, Hey, if you were to die tomorrow,

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Speaker 1: what would it say on your tombstone? And it set

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Speaker 1: me back. He goes, well, sniper recon all the kind

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Speaker 1: of t shirts, right, all the things that we kind

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Speaker 1: of hang you know, Marine corps, you know, hang our

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Speaker 1: hat on. And I was like, yeah, I would say

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Speaker 1: all those things. And he goes, okay, well what else

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Speaker 1: could it say? You know, like you're not even halfway done.

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Speaker 1: Yet those are things that you did. Those were jobs

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Speaker 1: that you, you know, performed at, but they're not who you are.

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Speaker 1: And it just hit me like a bolt of lightning.

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Speaker 1: You know, like this, this machine is never going to

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Speaker 1: love means a way I loved.

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Speaker 2: He lot. Welcome to the March or Die Show. Glad

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Speaker 2: to have you joining us today. This is the show

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Speaker 2: where we do our best. Sometimes I hit the mark

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Speaker 2: and sometimes I don't, but we do our best to

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Speaker 2: give you both the principles and perspectives you need to

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Speaker 2: march when it would be easier to stay where you

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Speaker 2: are and die. And I appreciate you joining us today.

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Speaker 2: If you're not yet subscribed, please do that now wherever

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Speaker 2: you're listening from. If you're not on the YouTube channel,

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Speaker 2: go over to YouTube when this is over. If you're listening,

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Speaker 2: go to YouTube subscribe. There a lot of great content there,

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Speaker 2: and I encourage you to join us. There a lot

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Speaker 2: of other things happening, and I don't want to get

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Speaker 2: into any of those today because I want to jump

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Speaker 2: right into our conversation. Today is a really for me,

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Speaker 2: very special podcast episode. I like all of our episodes,

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Speaker 2: but this one is special to me. I've got a man,

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Speaker 2: a friend and a brother from years ago, and it's

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Speaker 2: one of those relationships I'll talk about a little bit.

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Speaker 2: One of those relationships. We haven't stayed close over the years.

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Speaker 2: We've connected here and there and communicated a little bit.

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Speaker 2: But I mean, I have a small circle of people

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Speaker 2: that I look to and go when the world was

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Speaker 2: burning down around me, they were there. And my guest

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Speaker 2: today is one of those. Dagan van Houston is with me. Man,

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Speaker 2: how you doing. It's great to have you on.

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Speaker 1: Brother, Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: So a little at your background marine sniper, that's how

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Speaker 2: we met, and I'll talk about that here in just

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Speaker 2: a second. But then you know, we came back from Iraq,

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Speaker 2: I got out of the Marine Corps and you went

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Speaker 2: on and did great things. You've done just about everything

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Speaker 2: you can with a rifle. I think you contracted instructor

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Speaker 2: work for the CIA for a while. You've done all

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Speaker 2: kinds of stuff, and let's you talk about that if

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Speaker 2: you'd like to. But in the process of that built

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Speaker 2: a family, raising kids, doing all the things, and it's

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Speaker 2: just not easy to do that. And man, I've watched

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Speaker 2: you from kind of a distance over the years and

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Speaker 2: just super proud to know you and proud of what

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Speaker 2: you built. And then co founder of a company that's

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Speaker 2: producing a great product, nomadic research, producing gear for people

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Speaker 2: like you, right, for guys that have been places and

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Speaker 2: neither gear to matter when it matters, and just continue

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Speaker 2: to build, man, And it's awesome to be able to

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Speaker 2: talk to you. It's funny. So I've told the story

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Speaker 2: like a zillion times. It's the March or Dies story.

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Speaker 2: It's that day April first on the bridge and we

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Speaker 2: got into a major firefighter, major engagement. And I tell

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Speaker 2: this story all the time and people are kind, but

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Speaker 2: I don't know if they always believe me. But it

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Speaker 2: was wild man, and so a little of our background, right,

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Speaker 2: So we deployed to Iraq in I guess Kuwait in

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Speaker 2: January two thousand and three, eventually went in to Iraq

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Speaker 2: as part of the push. At the time, you were

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Speaker 2: the sniper platoon sergeant, right, that's your role.

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Speaker 1: Chief scout chefot Edwards, Yep, Chief scout staff Sergeant Edwards.

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Speaker 1: Apota was the platoon sergeant.

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Speaker 2: Yeah sorry yeah yeah, who had been my platoon sergeant

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Speaker 2: when I was a rifle platoon platoon commander. So we

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Speaker 2: all deployed together uh at the time Staff starns Apata,

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Speaker 2: who retired as Sartain Major Zapata, who had a huge

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Speaker 2: influence on my life. When I checked into one five

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Speaker 2: as a second lieutenant, he was my platoon sergeant and

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Speaker 2: I've credited him over the years with really helping me

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Speaker 2: to understand how to be a marine and how to

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Speaker 2: lead marines. And then he went over to scout snipers.

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Speaker 2: You were there. So when we all deployed to Iraq,

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Speaker 2: you guys were kind of like the misfit group right,

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Speaker 2: like it had nowhere to fit. And I just happened

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Speaker 2: to lead a platoon of misfits, and so Staff Starns

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Speaker 2: of Potas that I've got my team, I want to

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Speaker 2: attach them to you because I know you'll take care

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Speaker 2: of them, and they just fit right. And so you

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Speaker 2: guys jumped into our vehicles, we pushed, and so many

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Speaker 2: things happened. We got to know each other, you and

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Speaker 2: I did during that time. But I will never forget

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Speaker 2: the image during the ambush at the bridge, We're on

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Speaker 2: top of the bridge. We're trying to deal with the craziness.

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Speaker 2: The bombs are falling that's where the marcher dye thing

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Speaker 2: comes from. People have heard me talk about this a

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Speaker 2: million times. But I looked over my shoulder and you

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Speaker 2: were laying on the top of a home be engaging

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Speaker 2: targets off in the distance, and like, that's a that's

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Speaker 2: an image I will never forget. And it wasn't the

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Speaker 2: last time I saw that either, but wild times, right.

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Speaker 1: It really was. And sometimes i've you know, in previous conversations,

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Speaker 1: but what was it for the kind of the scars

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Speaker 1: and the pictures not sound dramatic, like it almost seems

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Speaker 1: like a dream. Yeah, right, Like so much of it is, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, and kind of the human memory, and we

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Speaker 1: all kind of know the kind of the pitfalls with

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Speaker 1: the human memory. It's like I need these conversations to continually,

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Speaker 1: you know, hold on to you, you know, those kind

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Speaker 1: of fleeting images, you know, and then some that you'll

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Speaker 1: never forget, right, Yeah.

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Speaker 2: No, that's right. It's funny just knowing that we were

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Speaker 2: going to talk. I've spent a lot of time thinking

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Speaker 2: about kind of those days and the push and I

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Speaker 2: have these because I speak a lot on this and

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Speaker 2: I've written on this a lot in our time in Iraq,

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Speaker 2: and that I have these these moments and the way

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Speaker 2: I tell these stories. But you know, just thinking of

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Speaker 2: moments where you know, we're in a security position, you're

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Speaker 2: hanging out at our vehicle and we're just talking about

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Speaker 2: life and talking about stuff. These are memories I haven't

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Speaker 2: dusted off in twenty plus years, right. But that's why

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Speaker 2: I think the bond between those who've served in a

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Speaker 2: combat environment is so tight, because in those moments where

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Speaker 2: all we had was each other to depend on. Man,

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Speaker 2: how many other times in your life are you in

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Speaker 2: environments like that right where you look around and you

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Speaker 2: go if things go bad, and they probably will, and

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Speaker 2: they have these are the guys I have to lean on.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and one of and I'm not saying this because

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Speaker 1: you're sitting here a fantastic When you look back, what

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Speaker 1: a fantastic group of individuals. Yeah, incredible, you know, just

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Speaker 1: from the top down, you know, first time fifth Marines

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Speaker 1: during that time frame. Uh, it was just an incredible

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Speaker 1: group of individuals, you know, and even at the time,

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Speaker 1: I think we we kind of knew that, you know,

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Speaker 1: and and definitely in retrospect looking back, uh, once again,

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Speaker 1: just great, great dudes across the board.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a time that is very special. I

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Speaker 2: had the opportunity to have coffee with General Padia. He's retired.

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Speaker 2: He was our battalion commander at the time, Lieutenant Colonel

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Speaker 2: Padea at the time. He lives near me, so we

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Speaker 2: get together once in a while and it's great. We

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Speaker 2: sit down and talk. And we were talking about this

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Speaker 2: a few weeks ago that that was a moment and

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Speaker 2: I just I didn't understand it. Then I thought that

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Speaker 2: this is just what it looks like. And we had

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Speaker 2: you know, General Mattis was our division commander. Joe Dunferd,

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Speaker 2: who became the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, was regimental

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Speaker 2: commander and then arbittalion commander. I mean I would still

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Speaker 2: do anything he wanted me to do today, right, I

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Speaker 2: mean a leader's leader, compassionate, strong, all the things you

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Speaker 2: would look to for a leader. And Fred Padilla retired

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Speaker 2: as a two star, did amazing things first or a

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Speaker 2: third Marine division CEO at one point, amazing things and

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Speaker 2: then just on down. I mean like at every level

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Speaker 2: it was. It was special and it's funny you have

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Speaker 2: to look back to realize that because I I didn't

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Speaker 2: I knew it was special. But I thought that this

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Speaker 2: is how it's supposed to be, and then you get

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Speaker 2: a little ways out and you're like, this isn't how

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Speaker 2: it is all the time.

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Speaker 1: It's not how it is all the time. He was

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Speaker 1: super strong, in my opinion, super strong n CEOs, very

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Speaker 1: strong staff n CEOs, you know, uh, and the officer

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Speaker 1: corps as well, you know what I mean, And there's

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Speaker 1: going to be Personally. I had my fair share of

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Speaker 1: personal personality conflicts, you know, and things of that nature.

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Speaker 1: But it seemed to when it was time to do work,

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Speaker 1: it was you know, it kind of ran like a

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Speaker 1: Swiss wad sure as good as it was going to go.

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Speaker 2: Another sniper story I've told over the years is we

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Speaker 2: finally made it into bagged Out on April tenth, and

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Speaker 2: that was another, I mean, absolutely incredible engagement. Whether it

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Speaker 2: took seven hours or you know, twenty five hours, I've

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Speaker 2: heard all these different lengths of time. I have no idea.

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Speaker 2: It took a long time. It was dark when we

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Speaker 2: started and it was late afternoon when we finished. I

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Speaker 2: know that for sure. But one of the memories I

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Speaker 2: have we got up onto a rooftop and I was

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Speaker 2: so with what I did. We're setting up machine gun

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Speaker 2: positions in different places, and one of the places we

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Speaker 2: had to set up a machine gun position was on

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Speaker 2: that rooftop, and so I went up there to be

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Speaker 2: with my machine gun team, and you were there with

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Speaker 2: your spotter. And it was a wild time, man, Like

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Speaker 2: I mean, right out in front of the building where

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Speaker 2: we were, there was a counter attack and there was

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Speaker 2: a lot of things happening and standing next to you

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Speaker 2: guys while you're clearing targets out in the street. Just again,

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Speaker 2: these are the things you think about. You try to

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Speaker 2: explain it to people, and they just they don't understand,

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Speaker 2: like what a unique environment that is.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it happened. It seemed to happen so fast, right

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Speaker 1: and even though it was, like you said, like was

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Speaker 1: it nine hours?

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Speaker 2: Was it six?

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Speaker 1: What a blur? You know, what what a blur that

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Speaker 1: kind of that entry that fight in was. I remember

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Speaker 1: obviously bits and pieces, but yeah, the rooftop got active

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Speaker 1: real quick, you know, and uh, yeah, it was I

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Speaker 1: would call it a target rich environment. You know. The

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Speaker 1: guys were obviously ready and eager to to you know,

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Speaker 1: prosecute targets and protect the Marines on the ground. That

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Speaker 1: rooftop was was prime real estate for a lot of

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Speaker 1: different reasons that it was a good spot.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, wild stuff, man. And then you know, we came back.

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Speaker 2: We were in the city for a couple of weeks

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Speaker 2: and then retrograded back and came home and I got

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Speaker 2: out and moved on, and you you stayed at it.

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Speaker 2: Talk about your your career a little bit kind of

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Speaker 2: beyond that.

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Speaker 1: So I had yeah, and I appreciate the question. I

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Speaker 1: had orders to uh Quantico Snipers School right after the invasion,

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Speaker 1: and kind of the only sticking point there was, you

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Speaker 1: know one five obviously was going to turn right right

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Speaker 1: around and do Fallujah, and uh that was a real

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Speaker 1: kind of fork in the road for me, right, I

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Speaker 1: didn't have you know, from my perspective, I was kind

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Speaker 1: of getting conflicting word, right, I had career in see

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Speaker 1: Stefan C. I was saying, hey, take your orders, you know,

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Speaker 1: don't don't quote unquote chase something that's not guaranteed. Because

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Speaker 1: who who wasn't itching to go back right? You know,

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Speaker 1: most people were, you know, and it was a quick turnaround,

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Speaker 1: if I remember.

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Speaker 2: Right seven and they were back in country.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so pretty sure. And uh so I made the

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Speaker 1: choice to uh take you know, take the orders to Quantico,

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Speaker 1: which ended up being one of the pinnacle or high

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Speaker 1: water marks of my time in the Marine Corps and

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Speaker 1: teaching there for the better part of three or four years,

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Speaker 1: and uh it was a fantastic spot for not only

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Speaker 1: personal growth as an individual operator and as a sniper,

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Speaker 1: but a lot of exposure to kind of opening up

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Speaker 1: my aperture as far as what's possible, you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: in the in the in the federal government, outside of

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Speaker 1: the biggering machine as we call it. So I attribute

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Speaker 1: my time there to you know, it was a good choice.

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Speaker 1: You know, as much as I would like to have

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Speaker 1: been with the guys in Fallujah, you know, you make

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Speaker 1: your choices and you live with it, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, that's right. And then from there you did

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Speaker 2: a lot of different things, contracting, a lot of instructing,

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Speaker 2: you know, teaching at a very high level, and through

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Speaker 2: all of that, I mean you can call out any

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Speaker 2: highlights of that time. Certainly is a long time, but

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Speaker 2: through through that time, you're married, you've got kids, you're

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Speaker 2: you're doing something that most people don't do while also

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Speaker 2: maintaining a family and a personal life. And you did

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Speaker 2: Can you talk about that a little bit, because I

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Speaker 2: think so often we talk about the pitfalls and the

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Speaker 2: dangers and it's very very hard, very hard, but there

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Speaker 2: is a way to navigate it. And it's not without

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Speaker 2: its difficulties. It's not without its challenges, but it's possible.

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Speaker 2: Can you talk about that a little bit?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I can start up by saying I didn't

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Speaker 1: do it well, you know, And I think that's an

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Speaker 1: important message to the listeners or the guys out there

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Speaker 1: that are going through it right now. Man, if I

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Speaker 1: could do it over again, right, I fell into the

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Speaker 1: pitfall that it's common that everything else kind of got

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Speaker 1: put on the back burner. And I have, you know,

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Speaker 1: shout out to my wife. Jim and I have been married,

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Speaker 1: she's also a Marina, fourteen years. We've been married for

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Speaker 1: going on twenty five, I think, yeah, twenty five. We

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Speaker 1: just celebrated our twenty fifth anniversary. And thank you. All

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Speaker 1: the kudos go to her because I was putting almost

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Speaker 1: no effort into it. Everything I was trying to achieve

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Speaker 1: very selfish, very self centered, and because you're kind of

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Speaker 1: you know, the mindset in those environments is, you know,

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Speaker 1: it comes first, you know, a mission job, and that's

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Speaker 1: a necessity, but there is a way to find balance

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Speaker 1: and do it well. I almost think you know me personally,

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Speaker 1: obviously I had to do it the wrong way so

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Speaker 1: I could figure out how to do it the right way.

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Speaker 1: You know, and have spent the last I would say,

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Speaker 1: five or six years, you know, trying to do it

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Speaker 1: the right way because I did it the wrong way

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Speaker 1: for so long. You know, you have two families, right,

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Speaker 1: and you spend more time with your Marine Corps family,

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Speaker 1: your team, whether it's you know, you know when I

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Speaker 1: was overseas contracting, it was three months on, one month off,

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Speaker 1: and so it's easy to see how you know, even

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Speaker 1: that thirty day time period for the better course of

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Speaker 1: four or five years, you know, a lot of balls

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Speaker 1: get dropped. You know, I made a ton of mistakes,

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Speaker 1: and you know it's it just you know, it takes

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Speaker 1: a recentering and a refocus thing to realize you know

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Speaker 1: what's you know, your your priorities right. And once you

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Speaker 1: figure out what those priorities are, which is you know, family,

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Speaker 1: loved ones, friends, you know, you just got to rezero

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Speaker 1: yourself and and and kind of reprioritize those targets those priorities.

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Speaker 2: So the moral of the story is very well and

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Speaker 2: you'll be okay, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I find the right one, right, I lucked out. I

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Speaker 1: struck gold right off the bat, you know. Yeah, she's

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Speaker 1: fantastic and having her vidual service obviously aided a lot.

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Speaker 1: I think had we not been dual service, we might

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Speaker 1: be having a different conversation. But she's uh yeah, all

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Speaker 1: the kudos kind of go to her. I made every

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Speaker 1: mistake you could.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I made a lot of mistakes coming home too,

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Speaker 2: and I wasn't in for a long time, but even

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Speaker 2: just trying to figure out who am I on the

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Speaker 2: other side of this, and it's so clear when you're

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Speaker 2: doing the work that you know how to do in

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Speaker 2: the military, right, it makes sense. Then you come home

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Speaker 2: you're trying to figure things out. But one of the

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Speaker 2: things I've said often is your family gets it if

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Speaker 2: you have to be away. They understand that that that

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Speaker 2: comes with the territory. What they don't get is when

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Speaker 2: you're home and you're away. Right, if you're home, be home,

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Speaker 2: because you can operate at a high level when you're away,

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Speaker 2: but you need to operate at that same high level

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Speaker 2: when you're home and that's man, that's a hard balance

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Speaker 2: to strike. You just have a heart time turning it

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Speaker 2: off and somehow going to you know, soccer games and

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Speaker 2: school stuff and whatever. It just doesn't seem that important

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Speaker 2: because of what you've been doing. But it's super important

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Speaker 2: your family correct.

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Speaker 1: Correct. Yeah, It's very, very difficult, and that's why conversations

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Speaker 1: like these are so important because I think the more

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Speaker 1: that you know, guys and gals hear it that have

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Speaker 1: either you know, are our age and have experienced it

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Speaker 1: and are still trying to, you know, find that balance

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Speaker 1: and find that correct calibration. But more importantly, you know

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Speaker 1: the the people that you know, the younger generation that

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Speaker 1: are that are inevitably going to go through the same

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Speaker 1: things you know. Unfortunately, it's the balance is paramount because

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Speaker 1: if you hit that skinny pedal on the right, like

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Speaker 1: I feel like I did for as long as I did,

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Speaker 1: eventually you're going to run on a gas or hit

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Speaker 1: a brick wall. Right. It's just it's inevitable, you know.

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Speaker 1: So let's let's learn how to throttle back a little bit,

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Speaker 1: you know, and apply proper pressure when when needed in

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Speaker 1: the appropriate places.

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Speaker 2: Soun's good. The one of the things that helps, you know,

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Speaker 2: service members or transitioning service members where you find yourself

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Speaker 2: on that kind of continuum, are or is having the

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Speaker 2: right people around, having people that that get you, that

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Speaker 2: understand and knowing a little bit of your your family story.

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Speaker 2: I know you have a brother right that was a marine.

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Speaker 1: Brother and sister both marines.

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Speaker 2: Okay, and and a wife who who you know, is

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Speaker 2: as well and understands that. How important has it been

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Speaker 2: to you to have an extended family that gets it,

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Speaker 2: like you can just say stupid stuff and and talk

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Speaker 2: about what you're dealing with. Whether you do or not,

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Speaker 2: I don't know if you do with them, but just

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Speaker 2: to have people around you that you can be yourself

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Speaker 2: and not have to, you know, pretend that things are

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Speaker 2: okay all the time.

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Speaker 1: Sure, it's a it's a yeah. With with the extended family,

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Speaker 1: with the you know, my dad, all the uncles, you know,

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Speaker 1: tons of you know, predominantly marines. It's a constant conversation.

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Speaker 1: And my brother and sister both did two tours after

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Speaker 1: you and I our time frame, and uh, you know

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Speaker 1: my wife or brother, we had a ka and the

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Speaker 1: family unfortunately you know, and uh, he was a marine

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Speaker 1: in Afghanistan so yeah, it's a common conversation, it's and

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Speaker 1: it's uh, we have that kind of baked in support

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Speaker 1: structure to where at any given time and place, you know,

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Speaker 1: you've got somebody that you can talk it out if

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Speaker 1: he if you need to write, and we our family,

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Speaker 1: we do a good job of having kind of a

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Speaker 1: positive reflection, yeah, you know, and focusing on you know,

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Speaker 1: focusing on the positive. Like I look at our time

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Speaker 1: and I think my family shares it, like, yes, there

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Speaker 1: were some obviously some bad times, but the experience was

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Speaker 1: one of growth, right. The experience was one that you know,

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Speaker 1: I look back with in a positive that I'm thankful

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Speaker 1: for the time that I spent, right, and I'm thankful

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Speaker 1: for the bad times too, because you can't appreciate the

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Speaker 1: good times without you know, kind of the suffering, right,

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Speaker 1: And so it's paramount, right, it's paramount to have that

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Speaker 1: and surrounding us, being surrounded a very tight knit family.

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Speaker 1: It's h it's been very beneficial.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think for you know, a lot of

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Speaker 2: people like like you and me are people that serve

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Speaker 2: for a long time. Particularly they leave that environment and

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Speaker 2: they don't have anyone and you just get tired of

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Speaker 2: trying to explain yourself to people. And you know, there's

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Speaker 2: a certain sense of shame that comes with how you

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Speaker 2: feel that there shouldn't be but there is, and and

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Speaker 2: how do I articulate to that that to people around

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Speaker 2: If you don't have the right community around you, then man,

399
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Speaker 2: you can't transition from one thing to the next. You

400
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Speaker 2: hit a wall and you just kind of get stuck there.

401
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Speaker 2: And you know, one thing watching kind of your trajectory

402
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Speaker 2: is that you've been able to move from one thing

403
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Speaker 2: to the next and kind of transition through these different

404
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Speaker 2: things to now leading a company. And that doesn't happen alone.

405
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Speaker 2: You have to have the right people in your life

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Speaker 2: to help you get there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not take a note for an answer. And basically,

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Speaker 1: you know, I try and tell guys right like, it's

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Speaker 1: you want to get hit in the mouth on a

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Speaker 1: daily basis, step outside of your conference zone and try

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Speaker 1: something new. Right, So, if anything, it's going to teach

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Speaker 1: your resilience. But what I think, you know, uh, and

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Speaker 1: I was having extensive conversations with the teammate last night

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Speaker 1: about this is you have these these individuals that have

415
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Speaker 1: been put through kind of the test of all tests, right,

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Speaker 1: they've they've been through and been six accessful. Not without failure,

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Speaker 1: but the majority of people have been successful. They wouldn't

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Speaker 1: be Marines, they wouldn't be where they are today. There

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Speaker 1: is zero reason why those You're not going to be

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Speaker 1: successful in anything that you apply yourself, and to just

421
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Speaker 1: keep that on the forefront of your kind of brain

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Speaker 1: housing group, Like, it's not you're going to be without failure.

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Speaker 1: It's that if you don't stop, you will be successful.

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Speaker 1: You just have to keep pushing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's good. Yeah, don't take no for an answer.

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Speaker 2: That's great. Talk about trying to figure out a transition here,

427
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Speaker 2: talk about nomadic research, and then i'd love to hear

428
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Speaker 2: you just talk about that, how you got into that

429
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Speaker 2: and why that's important to you. But then through that

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00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,080
Speaker 2: you've continued to serve and and you know, watching some

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Speaker 2: of your videos and listening to your podcast. Your company

432
00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:58,240
Speaker 2: exists obviously for the reason every company exists to make

433
00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:00,399
Speaker 2: money and to you know, provide for your families and

434
00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:02,920
Speaker 2: do those things. But you guys are both committed. You're

435
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:05,520
Speaker 2: committed as a team to like this is a thing

436
00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:08,120
Speaker 2: we hold loosely and we're going to support the communities

437
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:08,720
Speaker 2: that we came.

438
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:12,320
Speaker 1: From without a doubt. Yeah, the kind of the impetus

439
00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:15,160
Speaker 1: of nomadic research. With my teammate and I Matt Horton,

440
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:19,960
Speaker 1: sitting around the campfire, if you will. In Afghanistan, in

441
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:24,240
Speaker 1: the contracting space, there's there's always your exit strategy or

442
00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:26,760
Speaker 1: you know, kind of your plan B and C, right,

443
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:31,840
Speaker 1: because it's such a fickle and unstable environment. When I

444
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 1: when I showed up to the team room after selection

445
00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:37,640
Speaker 1: in Afghanistan, it was like, welcome to the team room. Hey,

446
00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 1: by the way, start looking for another job, you know.

447
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,960
Speaker 1: And in my brain I was like, whoa, this was

448
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:46,280
Speaker 1: supposed to be kind of my forever. I was gonna

449
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:49,399
Speaker 1: ride this end of the sunset and and ended up

450
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:52,840
Speaker 1: you know, doing it for fourteen years. But always, you know,

451
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:55,199
Speaker 1: from day one, kind of working on a plan B

452
00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,399
Speaker 1: and C. What's chapter three? What's chapter four.

453
00:22:58,320 --> 00:22:59,480
Speaker 2: To look like? Right?

454
00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:03,240
Speaker 1: And Uh, Matt, my business partner who's a former Navy

455
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,840
Speaker 1: seal hit me up and said, hey, I've got this

456
00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:10,160
Speaker 1: idea for this company. Uh, outdoor venture apparel and travel accessories.

457
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:14,160
Speaker 1: Uh for you know, people that live on the road basically,

458
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 1: you know, have that kind of nomadic lifestyle, and uh,

459
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:18,880
Speaker 1: I said, what do you need for me? He said,

460
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,479
Speaker 1: I'm just your loyalty. I was like, I'm in you

461
00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:24,199
Speaker 1: know that. Yeah, I can do that. That sounds that

462
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:27,800
Speaker 1: sounds cheap, you know. So yeah, we established a company

463
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:32,240
Speaker 1: and uh, always you know, always trying to you know,

464
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,920
Speaker 1: reach back and aid the communities from which we came

465
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,080
Speaker 1: in any way, shape or form. I definitely try and

466
00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 1: do that with the podcast, you know, educational, informative and

467
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 1: and entertaining and just once again kind of be that

468
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:50,560
Speaker 1: voice of positivity. Like we spent so long being a

469
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:54,879
Speaker 1: destructive force, which was necessary at the time, and and

470
00:23:54,880 --> 00:24:00,280
Speaker 1: and being a willing participant, but there is I can

471
00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:04,119
Speaker 1: be just as effective on the positive side, right And

472
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:07,119
Speaker 1: so from from that day forth, uh, you know, it

473
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 1: was like, hey, we're we're just gonna try and be

474
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:14,080
Speaker 1: force a positivity, you know, not you know, try and

475
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:16,439
Speaker 1: set the example. You know what I'm saying, by no

476
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 1: means wrote the book on do it like me. In fact,

477
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:21,680
Speaker 1: it's more like, hey, check out all the ways I've

478
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:24,400
Speaker 1: you know, I've I've messed up and learned from it,

479
00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:29,920
Speaker 1: but spread a positive message in a community that unfortunately

480
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:33,440
Speaker 1: it's there's a lot of heavy weight, right, there's a

481
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:36,560
Speaker 1: lot of we've all been through quite a bit, but

482
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,280
Speaker 1: it can be positive, right, and so we we attempt

483
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,000
Speaker 1: to be as positive as positive.

484
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 2: How important is is service to you know, the person

485
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 2: who has served, they've experienced the things in their life

486
00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:53,439
Speaker 2: and now they're kind of transition moment. How important is

487
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,560
Speaker 2: looking outside and serving others to making that transition work

488
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 2: and helping you as an individual? For it's not always

489
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,200
Speaker 2: all about the people you're helping, right, there is there

490
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:04,840
Speaker 2: is a residual impact.

491
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:08,600
Speaker 1: I think it's paramount to find that new purpose. I

492
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:10,679
Speaker 1: think you you have to have a high degree of

493
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,560
Speaker 1: selflessness to enlist in the first place, right, whether it's

494
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 1: you know, we're trying to serve the country, we're trying

495
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 1: to serve our families, and so finding that new purpose

496
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:27,480
Speaker 1: or that new way to be selfless, right, and the

497
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:29,119
Speaker 1: only if the only way I can be you know,

498
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 1: if the only way I can be selfless is to

499
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 1: be very very candid about the mistakes I've made and

500
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 1: how you know, basically the things that I've done wrong,

501
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, offered that as you know, a

502
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 1: guidebook or a rule book to you know, avoid those pitfalls.

503
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 1: Then that's kind of my new purpose, right, and kind

504
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 1: of works and all right, you know it's uh, it's

505
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:59,399
Speaker 1: paramount to find that new sense of duty. And I

506
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:06,600
Speaker 1: think worse in your everyday activities, right, helping people is

507
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: uh is rewarding. And you know, I was, I kind

508
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,639
Speaker 1: of close out almost every conversation, Hey man, hit me

509
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,400
Speaker 1: up if I can help, I will, you know, and

510
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 1: and then try and kind of live by that, you know,

511
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: it's the least I can do. And uh, yeah, so

512
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,960
Speaker 1: I so you know, there's a very long, wooded, winded

513
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 1: way of saying. I think it's very important to uh

514
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:29,600
Speaker 1: to find purpose in helping others.

515
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 2: It's good a lot of men and women, I always

516
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 2: say guys, but a lot of men and women who've served,

517
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 2: they get real caught up and how they feel during

518
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 2: the transition or how they feel reflecting on what happened

519
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 2: in the military or whatever. And that's all real, it's

520
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 2: all valid. But they become so so introspective and so

521
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 2: kind of internally focused that it crushes them. And and

522
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 2: it seems like just the just the ability to lift

523
00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:59,080
Speaker 2: your eyes up look outside of your situation, as bad

524
00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:00,359
Speaker 2: as it may be, you don't have have it all

525
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 2: figured out, but find someone else that you can help,

526
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 2: and find someone else that you can serve. It just

527
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,080
Speaker 2: changes everything. It changes even the conversation that's happening in

528
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 2: your heart and in your head because you realize, like, oh,

529
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 2: I do still, like you said, have a purpose. I

530
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 2: can still accomplish something important here.

531
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 1: It's terrifying, right, It's absolutely terrifying the thought of leaving

532
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: that environment. Right, whether it's been four years or twenty

533
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,440
Speaker 1: four years, you know, the thought of leaving that environment

534
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:34,159
Speaker 1: is crippling. You know, the fear is crippling. And and

535
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:37,199
Speaker 1: I'm not ashamed to say that. You know, it's a

536
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:40,440
Speaker 1: fear unto itself. You know, it's not like getting shot

537
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:42,960
Speaker 1: at or being in an active combat zone. It's the

538
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:46,280
Speaker 1: fear of the unknown, and what am I going to

539
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:47,200
Speaker 1: do with myself?

540
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 2: You know?

541
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 1: And come to find out that same fear that I

542
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:55,359
Speaker 1: had leaving the Marine Corps and going into the contracting realm,

543
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,880
Speaker 1: I figured it out, right, going back to that that

544
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 1: you know, nine times out of ten, you're you know,

545
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:06,119
Speaker 1: you're successful individuals. You know you have the tools, you

546
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: know how to be successful. And oh, by the way,

547
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 1: fourteen years later when I decided to leave the organization,

548
00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:15,159
Speaker 1: same fear, right, same fear all over again, Like what

549
00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:16,920
Speaker 1: am I going to do with myself?

550
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:17,240
Speaker 2: Right?

551
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,960
Speaker 1: And then you figure it out, right, whether it's through faith,

552
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,119
Speaker 1: or through family, or through your network or your resilience

553
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 1: for all of the above. Right, we we we figure

554
00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 1: it out. You know what I'm saying. There's gonna be

555
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,840
Speaker 1: hiccups here and there. But if you you know, if

556
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 1: you keep your head up and stay positive, you're going

557
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 1: to be successful. You've been successful up to this point.

558
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:40,240
Speaker 1: What would change?

559
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 2: And that speaks a little bit to that that issue

560
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 2: of where do you find your identity? And if you

561
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,160
Speaker 2: find your identity in the uniform or in the job,

562
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 2: then then when that changes, because it will change, you

563
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 2: don't know who you are anymore. But if it's if

564
00:28:57,520 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 2: it's that I've always been capable, I've worked hard, I

565
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,800
Speaker 2: know I can do that, That's who I am, then

566
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 2: it doesn't matter where you find yourself. You're going to

567
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 2: be able to transition from whatever thing you were doing

568
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 2: to something new because you're not a different person. That's

569
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 2: just a job that you did and now you're in

570
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 2: a new job.

571
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent and I tell this story all

572
00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 1: the time, anytime I get the chance. I was going

573
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 1: through some treatment and my counselor asked me a question.

574
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: He said, you know, during one of our counseling sessions

575
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 1: over the phone, he said, Hey, if you were to

576
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:28,680
Speaker 1: die tomorrow, what would it say on your tombstone?

577
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 2: Yeah?

578
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 1: And it set me back, set me back in my chair.

579
00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 1: And I was like, I've never thought of that, you know.

580
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 1: And he goes, well, what would it say? And he

581
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 1: kind of listed off the accolades, you know, sniper recon,

582
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 1: all the kind of T shirts, right, all the things

583
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 1: that we kind of hang you know, Marine Corps, you know,

584
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:48,720
Speaker 1: hang our hat on. And I was like, yeah, I

585
00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 1: would say all those things and he goes, okay, well

586
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 1: what else could it say? You know, like, you're not

587
00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 1: even halfway done yet. You know, those are once you know,

588
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 1: to your point, those are things that you did. Those

589
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: were jobs that you you know, performed that, but they're

590
00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:08,880
Speaker 1: not who you are, right, It's it's it's they're not

591
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: your identity. It's something that you did, right and anymore.

592
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 1: And I've chewed on that. This was years ago. I've

593
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:17,800
Speaker 1: chewed on that ever since. And you know what, would

594
00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 1: I wanted to say now, and I think it would

595
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 1: say husband, father, friend. The end, it doesn't need to

596
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 1: say anything else. Once again, recalibrating to those things that matter, right,

597
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 1: you know, it's uh, it's that sense of identity. That's

598
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:38,320
Speaker 1: a hard jacket to take off. You know, it's armor.

599
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 1: We spend so much time kind of creating this avatar.

600
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: You know, that's impervious and uh, that's mission driven and

601
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,120
Speaker 1: so on and so forth. But there, there, there is.

602
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:49,960
Speaker 1: There's going to be a chapter two, there's going to

603
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 1: be a chapter three, and it's completely up to you

604
00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:55,720
Speaker 1: how those chapters read. You have the tools.

605
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:58,680
Speaker 2: That's so good man. And that's when I talk about

606
00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 2: legacy and teach on it and speak on it. He's

607
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,600
Speaker 2: exactly those words. Really, you may be in a chapter

608
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 2: you don't like, and that's fine, But as long as

609
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:10,520
Speaker 2: you're breathing, the story's still being written. So let's turn

610
00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 2: the page and start over. And when you start thinking

611
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 2: about your life in those terms, what would it say

612
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 2: on my tombstone? That's that's a legacy question. What will

613
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 2: I leave behind? Because we're all going to leave something behind,

614
00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 2: So what am I going to leave behind? Well? Is

615
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 2: it something that people can look at and say that

616
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 2: was neat, But then at home, it's like, you know,

617
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 2: my dad did that stuff. I heard about it, but

618
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 2: he didn't show up for my thing, and he never

619
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 2: really demonstrated that he cared about me or whatever. Or

620
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 2: he was around, but he was you know, aloof or

621
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 2: emotionally disconnected or whatever. When you start thinking about your legacy,

622
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:46,719
Speaker 2: it really does. It clarifies a lot of things. It

623
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:49,440
Speaker 2: starts it's like a microscope is put on your life

624
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 2: and you go, okay, like, well that matters, that doesn't matter,

625
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,160
Speaker 2: that's important, that's not important. And as cool as our

626
00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 2: jobs may have been, at the end of the day,

627
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,480
Speaker 2: they need to serve a purpose and hopefully they serve

628
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 2: a big person. I mean, we could go, you know,

629
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 2: completely sideways on this. I don't even understand always when

630
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 2: I think back on things I was a part of

631
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 2: in the military, how important that was like in terms

632
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:15,320
Speaker 2: of like like globally and nationally and those kind of things. Right,

633
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 2: you struggle with that, But I think personally I learned

634
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 2: so much, I grew so much. I've developed, you know, relationships.

635
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, it was a

636
00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:26,120
Speaker 2: way to take care of my family. It was a

637
00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:30,479
Speaker 2: way to chart a course and provide a vision to

638
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 2: my kids of what they could do in their lives.

639
00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 2: And so, yeah, asking that legacy question, what's going to

640
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 2: be left when you're gone? It clarifies so many things.

641
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:45,720
Speaker 1: Sure, Sure, and when you when you're able to turn

642
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: the noise down, so to speak, and and kind of

643
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 1: realize that there are there are so few things when

644
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:56,120
Speaker 1: it really boils down to it, that actually matter, you know, obviously,

645
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 1: the relationship that you have with your family, with your

646
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:02,320
Speaker 1: close friends, you know, people in general. You know, I

647
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,080
Speaker 1: used to, you know, kind of have this thought process

648
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: where I was trying to project you know, uh, fear,

649
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: you know, intimidation, you know what I'm saying, you know,

650
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:15,960
Speaker 1: not to be trifled with, so to speak. And it's

651
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 1: all the things that come with that, that ego that

652
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 1: that we build up, you know, and then you realize, like,

653
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:27,600
Speaker 1: h maybe maybe I should focus on my interactions with

654
00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:32,479
Speaker 1: individuals being positive. You know, when when I when I

655
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,160
Speaker 1: break contact with this individual, was I a good part

656
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 1: of their day or a bad part of their day?

657
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 2: Right?

658
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 1: And uh you know, so once again, it's, yeah, the

659
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:45,800
Speaker 1: legacy that you leave behind, like try and set as

660
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 1: positive and as good as an example as you can

661
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:51,560
Speaker 1: in every way that you can, right, knowing that people

662
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: are inherently flawed. I have my fair share and then some, right,

663
00:33:56,440 --> 00:34:00,960
Speaker 1: but uh, you know, being kind, being compassionate, it the

664
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,240
Speaker 1: teeth can come out, right when the teeth need to

665
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,480
Speaker 1: come out. And I think that's a hard thing for

666
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 1: guys and gals when they transitioned, Like the teeth are

667
00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 1: never going to go away, you know, but there's a

668
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:17,400
Speaker 1: time and place that's right. It doesn't have to be

669
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:20,719
Speaker 1: all the time, right, you know, we're just not in

670
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:24,719
Speaker 1: that environment anymore. And that's a tough transition. Again, that's

671
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 1: just part of that reintegration back into you know, civilian society.

672
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:34,919
Speaker 1: You know, period end of story, and once again conversations

673
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:35,920
Speaker 1: like this, I think, hell.

674
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:40,640
Speaker 2: I remember you mentioned Fallujah. So we came back from

675
00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:44,080
Speaker 2: Iraq and I transitioned out, I mean within thirty days

676
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 2: I was off active duty, and you know, all that

677
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 2: stuff then happened. So when we when we came home,

678
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 2: people don't really maybe remember this, but when we came home,

679
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 2: it was like mission accomplished. Right, the war's over, it's

680
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 2: all done, And so that was kind of the mindset

681
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 2: a lot of us had coming back as we went.

682
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:02,040
Speaker 2: We did the thing, and now it's over, and so

683
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:04,840
Speaker 2: let's move on. Well, they didn't take very long before

684
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 2: clearly that wasn't true, and we end up in twenty

685
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 2: years of war. But I transitioned out of the Marine

686
00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 2: Corps and I was working a job that was a

687
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:16,600
Speaker 2: wonderful job. And then those guys went back to Fallujah,

688
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 2: and I remember just being absolutely crushed with a couple

689
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 2: of things. One was I promised them. I told them

690
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:24,799
Speaker 2: that I would be there for them, I would take

691
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:27,600
Speaker 2: care of them, and I'm not. I started to hear

692
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:33,480
Speaker 2: about you know, ka's and guys who were wounded. My

693
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,839
Speaker 2: platoon sergeant when I was in Iraq, Gunny Keister, was

694
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 2: deployed back to Fallujah, and he would email me like

695
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:44,400
Speaker 2: every week. He'd give me like an update because I

696
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 2: knew a bunch of those guys, and he'd send me

697
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:47,600
Speaker 2: a message and he was like, Hey, this is what's happening.

698
00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 2: And so man, I remember hearing about that and thinking,

699
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:53,920
Speaker 2: first of all, I abandoned these guys. That was one

700
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 2: thought I had, But the other one was just like

701
00:35:56,080 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 2: this overwhelming the big green machine rolls without me, Like

702
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:03,120
Speaker 2: when you're there, you feel like this doesn't happen if

703
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:06,040
Speaker 2: I'm not here, which is it's a stupid thought, right,

704
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:08,400
Speaker 2: Like I mean I always talk about our deployment to

705
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:10,439
Speaker 2: Iraq and all that, and I mean there were thirty

706
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:13,799
Speaker 2: thousand Marines that deployed to Iron, So you know, you're

707
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 2: one very small cog, right, but you feel like this

708
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:18,960
Speaker 2: doesn't happen without me. And then when they went back

709
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 2: to Fallujah, I just had this overwhelming like I don't

710
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 2: even know how to describe it other than just like

711
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 2: like a period of morning, like they don't need they

712
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:30,880
Speaker 2: don't need me anymore. And that led to a long

713
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:34,160
Speaker 2: process for me of trying to figure out like, Okay,

714
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 2: well who am I now? Like what does what does

715
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,359
Speaker 2: any of it mean? Yeah?

716
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 1: One thousand percent I can relate to all of it.

717
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:44,839
Speaker 1: I had that epifocal and I shared all the same

718
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,880
Speaker 1: feelings the guys. The guys were calling me, you know

719
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:53,440
Speaker 1: at Quantico like during high activities, which I was should

720
00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 1: you be on the right right, you know, come on guys, uh,

721
00:36:56,920 --> 00:36:58,959
Speaker 1: you know, hey, wish you were here type of deal.

722
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: And I had that same epifocal moment. I think and

723
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:07,800
Speaker 1: I'll speak for myself, like I loved the Marine Corps

724
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:12,920
Speaker 1: so much. It was my entire identity, it was my

725
00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 1: entire being, and I loved it so much. And I

726
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:19,200
Speaker 1: had this one epifocal moment one day where there was

727
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 1: a sargeant major retirement and which is you know, on

728
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 1: a Friday, and you know, here's the flowers and everything,

729
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 1: right and the whole ceremony. And on Monday, the following Monday,

730
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,239
Speaker 1: you know, you've got a PFC that's checking into that

731
00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:42,320
Speaker 1: particular unit, has no idea that that dude ever existed.

732
00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:45,760
Speaker 1: And it just hit me like a bolt of lightning,

733
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 1: you know, like this, this this machine is never going

734
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:52,400
Speaker 1: to love me the way I love it, right, And

735
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 1: so that kind of opened up the bandwidth, so to speak,

736
00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:02,840
Speaker 1: to for me to start kind of looking at, Okay,

737
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 1: what other avenues or what other things, what other capabilities

738
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:10,839
Speaker 1: or opportunities, because there's going to be life after this, right,

739
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,760
Speaker 1: and for a time, you can't conceptualize it. You cannot

740
00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:16,279
Speaker 1: conceptualize not right, whether you're in for four years or

741
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 1: twenty four it's it's your it's your reality, you know,

742
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 1: and nothing else outside is real. And uh, that's it's

743
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 1: it's tough. It's a tough transition. It's a tough mental

744
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:30,239
Speaker 1: shift in gears to be like, Okay, there's I'm going

745
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:32,279
Speaker 1: to have to start making some moves and making some

746
00:38:32,400 --> 00:38:37,000
Speaker 1: plans here, and that inevitably is goes back to self improvement. Okay,

747
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:38,880
Speaker 1: I need to go to college. I need to go

748
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, like, I need to start

749
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:44,600
Speaker 1: preparing myself. Right, it's mission planning. It's you know, life

750
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:46,840
Speaker 1: is met tea, right, you know what I'm saying, like,

751
00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:49,560
Speaker 1: you you know, you can you can literally apply it

752
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,920
Speaker 1: to the mission planning process, to anything. And uh so

753
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 1: that's kind of what I started doing all through my

754
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 1: time in Quantico, throughout my time in Recon. You know,

755
00:38:58,719 --> 00:39:01,880
Speaker 1: it was always kind of having that, Yeah, you've got

756
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:04,560
Speaker 1: your three and five meter targets, but once two and

757
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:06,400
Speaker 1: three years down the road going to look like and

758
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,080
Speaker 1: let's start laying the groundwork to make sure that those

759
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 1: are successful times.

760
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's good man, that's really good. It's it's interesting

761
00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:19,160
Speaker 2: to watch. So the military transition one hundred percent everything

762
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,319
Speaker 2: that you just said. Another community that really struggles with

763
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 2: this is is the law enforcement community. And I know

764
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:28,560
Speaker 2: you've worked with law enforcement as well, and it's it's

765
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:31,000
Speaker 2: very much the same. It's like, you know, I'm the protector,

766
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 2: the defender, the you know whatever here in this community.

767
00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 2: And then it ends and those guys look around and

768
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:45,279
Speaker 2: go what happens next? Without having prepared for eventually this

769
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:47,200
Speaker 2: comes to an end? Who are you when this is over?

770
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:52,080
Speaker 1: And I think another thing that my counselor said to

771
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:54,640
Speaker 1: me that was once again kind of hit me hard

772
00:39:54,719 --> 00:39:57,400
Speaker 1: the ten ring, was you know, no one's ever going

773
00:39:57,480 --> 00:39:58,839
Speaker 1: to take any of that away from you.

774
00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 2: That's right, yeah, yeah, right, right right.

775
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 1: It's you can't. You know, like you served and that

776
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 1: new purpose or that new time should now be directed

777
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:13,719
Speaker 1: towards yourself, right and your family and your loved ones

778
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:18,759
Speaker 1: who inevitably have sacrificed along the way. You know, it's

779
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,879
Speaker 1: it is okay, it's comintuitive to for people like us,

780
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:28,719
Speaker 1: it is okay to be selfish at times, right when

781
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,920
Speaker 1: you've spent your entire life in existence being self less,

782
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:36,319
Speaker 1: you know, and using that time in that chapter two

783
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,799
Speaker 1: or three or whatever it is, you'll always be you know,

784
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:42,319
Speaker 1: you might not be an active cop, but no one's

785
00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 1: ever going to take away that ten twenty fifteen years,

786
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:47,680
Speaker 1: however long you did it for through you done of story,

787
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:50,400
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's yours to hold on two forever.

788
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 1: But the chapter two, what's next? You know what I mean?

789
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:59,840
Speaker 1: You just crushed that. That's a difficult thing to crush,

790
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:01,560
Speaker 1: and a police officers not easy.

791
00:41:01,840 --> 00:41:02,040
Speaker 2: Right.

792
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:05,879
Speaker 1: If you were strong enough, resilient enough, and successful enough

793
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,480
Speaker 1: to crush that, what else can you go right and

794
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 1: just and crush? Right?

795
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 2: That's good? Yeah, you should always be proud of your service.

796
00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 2: And I you know, again, I say this all the time,

797
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:19,360
Speaker 2: I'm very, very thankful for what I had the privilege

798
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 2: of being a part of. And that's that's how I

799
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:23,920
Speaker 2: view it now, right, is I had just this incredible

800
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 2: blessing of being a part of something really big and meaningful.

801
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 2: But I just can't find my whole world in that.

802
00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 2: And so, yeah, if you spend a long time in

803
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 2: the military, you spend a long time in law enforcement

804
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:38,239
Speaker 2: whatever it is you need to prepare for the next

805
00:41:38,360 --> 00:41:41,839
Speaker 2: next phase or the next stage. I mentioned my son's

806
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 2: in law enforcement, and so I'm spending time having these

807
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 2: conversations not just with him, but with other young police officers, right,

808
00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:53,360
Speaker 2: And they're just I appreciate it because I see in

809
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,080
Speaker 2: them like how I felt when I was twenty four

810
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:58,560
Speaker 2: years old, right, like, get after it all the time,

811
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:03,759
Speaker 2: and that's amazing. But trust me, someday you're going to

812
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 2: be looking at the back of this thing and going,

813
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:08,160
Speaker 2: what do I do now? So start preparing for that now.

814
00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:11,440
Speaker 2: Don't get so wrapped up in what you're doing. It's important,

815
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 2: but it's not the end of the world, and that

816
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:15,160
Speaker 2: organization is going to go on without you too, whether

817
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:17,239
Speaker 2: you believe it or not. So it's important to note.

818
00:42:17,239 --> 00:42:20,000
Speaker 1: Without a doubt, without a doubt, And I think there's

819
00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 1: that once again, there's that transitional you know, it's very

820
00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:25,640
Speaker 1: very heartbreaking, it's very very heavy when you come to

821
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:32,759
Speaker 1: that realization. But through positive actions, healthy habits, you know,

822
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,680
Speaker 1: whether like I said, whether it's faith or hobbies, or

823
00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:38,040
Speaker 1: your support network and your friends, if you're hanging out

824
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:41,120
Speaker 1: with the right people, kind of showing you that once

825
00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 1: again that chapter two and chapter three is literally whatever

826
00:42:47,640 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 1: it is that you want it to be. You know,

827
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:52,920
Speaker 1: I honestly believe that you know what I'm saying. And

828
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 1: if that's sitting back on the rock and chair, you know,

829
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:57,759
Speaker 1: for the rest of your days then you earned that, right,

830
00:42:57,760 --> 00:42:59,279
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. But if you're happy in

831
00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:03,640
Speaker 1: your content, then we're not having this conversation, right. It's

832
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 1: that how do I fill that hole?

833
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:05,840
Speaker 2: You know?

834
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 1: How do I find that new you know, cloak to

835
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:13,240
Speaker 1: where so to speak, that new identity? And that's uh,

836
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 1: it's it's just something that you have to go through,

837
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:20,000
Speaker 1: right and not get you know, stuck in that negative

838
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:25,000
Speaker 1: loop of yesterday. You know, tomorrow is looking pretty bright

839
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:27,760
Speaker 1: if you if you want to have that perspective.

840
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:29,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, you have that opportunity in front of you. And again,

841
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,000
Speaker 2: I've talked about this a lot, particularly in this podcast

842
00:43:32,040 --> 00:43:34,640
Speaker 2: in other places, but this is why faith is so

843
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:37,280
Speaker 2: important to me and so important in this process because

844
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:40,799
Speaker 2: it it you know, I don't mean like like just

845
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:42,480
Speaker 2: have faith in whatever you want, because I had faith

846
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,319
Speaker 2: in the Marine Corps, right, I had faith in other things.

847
00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:48,160
Speaker 2: But having faith in a God who creates you means

848
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:52,319
Speaker 2: whatever else happens in my life, there is that which

849
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:54,680
Speaker 2: does not change, that which does not move, and that

850
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 2: allows me to then go, Okay, how was I created?

851
00:43:57,080 --> 00:43:58,600
Speaker 2: What was I created to accomplish? And I could do

852
00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:00,920
Speaker 2: that anywhere? I could do that any where and it's

853
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:03,880
Speaker 2: a new environment. But I know who I am and

854
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 2: it has nothing to do with an organization or even a.

855
00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:10,920
Speaker 1: Job, right, yep, absolutely, yes.

856
00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:16,839
Speaker 2: So Memorial Day is coming up as we record. It's

857
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:20,040
Speaker 2: a few weeks away, but the month of May, and

858
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 2: this is a really important time, I think for those

859
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:26,200
Speaker 2: who have served. And I know that you think of

860
00:44:26,239 --> 00:44:29,800
Speaker 2: specific people when Memorial Day rolls around. I would imagine,

861
00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:33,759
Speaker 2: I know, I do you know I talk about a

862
00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 2: couple of people and these these were people during my time.

863
00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:39,239
Speaker 2: I always talk about Shane Shoulders, first ka of the

864
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:42,719
Speaker 2: war in Iraq. You know, we were there when that

865
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:47,880
Speaker 2: happened te Haita stats are in Teita Man. I was

866
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:51,440
Speaker 2: thinking about him the other day. It kind of happened

867
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 2: later during our time there, when we finally got into

868
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:56,960
Speaker 2: bag Dad. But what a man, What an incredible marine,

869
00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:59,760
Speaker 2: what a what an interesting human being? Right, an interesting person.

870
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 2: But I think of him as well. And then the

871
00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 2: other day I was talking about Gunny Boar and Man,

872
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:09,640
Speaker 2: a guy who was like the consummate professional, right and

873
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 2: was killed in Baghdad, I mean, doing what marines do,

874
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 2: and and I think about these guys and so many

875
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:20,400
Speaker 2: other people, so many other people. That was the beginning

876
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:22,800
Speaker 2: of this thing, but so many other folks, and the

877
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:26,120
Speaker 2: Moral Day is really important. This season is really important,

878
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,839
Speaker 2: not just so that we can pause and remember think

879
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:32,799
Speaker 2: about honor people that we cared about, but I think

880
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 2: it's important for those of us who have served to

881
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 2: help those who haven't served understand the cost of you know,

882
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:47,440
Speaker 2: this thing we call freedom. Can you talk about not

883
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:49,959
Speaker 2: just Memorial Day as in the holiday, but talk about

884
00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:52,760
Speaker 2: the season and the importance of it to you and

885
00:45:52,760 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 2: and maybe some of those folks that have made an

886
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:55,399
Speaker 2: impact on your life.

887
00:45:56,880 --> 00:45:59,920
Speaker 1: Definitely, Yeah, it's definitely a family event obviously in what

888
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 1: we do. Polo, Illinois is the town that my wife

889
00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:06,600
Speaker 1: and I grew up in and kind of a tradition.

890
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:10,799
Speaker 1: There's obviously the military parade, all the veterans show up

891
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,239
Speaker 1: and we you know, we march out to the cemetery,

892
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:16,320
Speaker 1: do the do the ceremony there, and then there's a

893
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:20,880
Speaker 1: large family gathering that goes to the gravesite of Justice Bartelt,

894
00:46:21,239 --> 00:46:25,439
Speaker 1: who was killed in action. You know, my wife's maiden

895
00:46:25,520 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 1: name is Bartelt, and uh it's uh we treated as

896
00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:33,520
Speaker 1: a celebration, you know, there is that sense of mourning right,

897
00:46:34,120 --> 00:46:37,120
Speaker 1: what you're in your mourning the loss. You missed that individual,

898
00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:42,200
Speaker 1: you missed their presence, right, But we celebrate, you know,

899
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:46,200
Speaker 1: we celebrate in the sense of, you know, really trying

900
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 1: to keep in the forefront of our minds that that

901
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:53,480
Speaker 1: individual and those individuals are at peace. Right where they're

902
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:58,400
Speaker 1: at is eternal bliss, happiness, contentment, and they would not

903
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:03,359
Speaker 1: want us to, you know, kick rocks, you know, kind

904
00:47:03,360 --> 00:47:07,160
Speaker 1: of treat it in a negative, uh negative, negative light.

905
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:10,279
Speaker 1: And so we we celebrate the time that we had

906
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 1: with those individuals, and we honor the sacrifices that they made,

907
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:17,280
Speaker 1: and especially in my family, we we kind of count

908
00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:21,000
Speaker 1: our blessings that with the amount of us that spent

909
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:25,400
Speaker 1: time in the g WoT that uh, you know, the

910
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 1: relatively unscathed, you know what I'm saying. It obviously could

911
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 1: have been a lot you know, Vegas odds probably should

912
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: have been a lot worse. You know, so we we

913
00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:41,080
Speaker 1: try and celebrate it. It's it's a heavy but joyous occasion,

914
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,960
Speaker 1: and uh we we just once again, you know, think

915
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:48,280
Speaker 1: back to the positive aspects and what those individuals did,

916
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: the you know, the fearlessness, the bravery and and ultimately

917
00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:56,399
Speaker 1: obviously the sacrifice, you know, and uh, I think that's

918
00:47:56,440 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 1: something to be held up high on a pedestal and not,

919
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:02,680
Speaker 1: uh not mourned. If that makes sense.

920
00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:05,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, it makes perfect sense. I think that's right. It's

921
00:48:05,760 --> 00:48:07,680
Speaker 2: that question of if they could come back and tell

922
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 2: us how they wanted us to behave right, they probably

923
00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:12,960
Speaker 2: say celebrate like this is I gave my life for this.

924
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:14,719
Speaker 2: I gave my life for the opportunity you have to

925
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:17,960
Speaker 2: do that. We kind of look down on people get

926
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,520
Speaker 2: together and have family barbecues and stuff in memorial days,

927
00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:22,319
Speaker 2: Like I think that's probably what they would have been doing,

928
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:24,880
Speaker 2: first of all, and second what they would want us

929
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:28,800
Speaker 2: to do. Do you think we have a responsibility as

930
00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:33,400
Speaker 2: veterans to I don't know for word educator is right,

931
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,600
Speaker 2: but to educate people who haven't served about why this

932
00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:38,280
Speaker 2: is important.

933
00:48:39,520 --> 00:48:42,719
Speaker 1: Yes I do, Yes, I do. And not in the

934
00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:46,680
Speaker 1: sense of, see if I can articulate this correctly, you know,

935
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:49,200
Speaker 1: not in the sense of, hey, I deserve a pat

936
00:48:49,239 --> 00:48:52,759
Speaker 1: on the back. That's the farest thing from it. And

937
00:48:52,960 --> 00:48:54,839
Speaker 1: you know that goes back to I think the best

938
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 1: answer I've ever heard, because that that quintessential Hey, thank

939
00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:59,600
Speaker 1: you for your service, and how do you respond to that?

940
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 1: And one of the one of the one of the

941
00:49:03,080 --> 00:49:05,840
Speaker 1: best answers I've ever heard was and somebody did it

942
00:49:05,880 --> 00:49:08,080
Speaker 1: to me. I was like, hey, thank you for your service.

943
00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:09,839
Speaker 1: I appreciate it, and he goes, you were worth it,

944
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 1: you know, and it kind of set me back on

945
00:49:12,719 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 1: my And so I do think it's important to you know, uh,

946
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:21,719
Speaker 1: to educate just and not in the sense of, hey,

947
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:24,279
Speaker 1: you should be paying attention to this or this is

948
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 1: the correct course of action. It's uh, you know, people

949
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:32,800
Speaker 1: that have raised their hands for whatever reason they raised it,

950
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:36,840
Speaker 1: it's irrelevant they raised it. And uh, if they're not

951
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:42,480
Speaker 1: here and they made that ultimate sacrifice, the least we

952
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,959
Speaker 1: can do is recognize that if just for a second,

953
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:52,439
Speaker 1: you know, just for a second, you know. And so, yeah,

954
00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 1: it's and it's a dulky subject, right, It's an uncomfortable topic.

955
00:49:56,560 --> 00:50:00,160
Speaker 1: You know, they're uncomfortable with the fact that maybe they

956
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 1: didn't serve or whatever. And that's okay, right this. I

957
00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:07,720
Speaker 1: don't think anyone should never feel guilt of not serving.

958
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:12,480
Speaker 1: But the way if you do feel that in any way,

959
00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:16,319
Speaker 1: shape or form, it's an easy fix. Memorial Day is

960
00:50:16,440 --> 00:50:20,799
Speaker 1: in that celebration and that kind of you know, recognition

961
00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:25,319
Speaker 1: of that that that day is the least anyone can

962
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:28,839
Speaker 1: do right to kind of show that respect and that thankfulness.

963
00:50:29,160 --> 00:50:33,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's good. It's amazing how many people will come

964
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:35,520
Speaker 2: up to you and say, oh, you served, that's awesome.

965
00:50:35,560 --> 00:50:38,319
Speaker 2: I was going to but right, it's like, and you

966
00:50:38,360 --> 00:50:40,319
Speaker 2: know that behind that is like almost a sense of

967
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 2: like guilt, like I didn't I didn't do that or whatever.

968
00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:45,440
Speaker 2: The number of people that were going to be Marines

969
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:47,360
Speaker 2: is crazy because I know a lot of Marines, and

970
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:49,360
Speaker 2: it's it's a pretty low bar. I mean, let's be honest,

971
00:50:49,400 --> 00:50:51,080
Speaker 2: you could have done it probably if you wanted to.

972
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:53,280
Speaker 2: It's not like that.

973
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:58,440
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, it's and I feel the same way, believe

974
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:00,520
Speaker 1: it or not, Like when I'm in the presence of

975
00:51:00,520 --> 00:51:04,160
Speaker 1: firefighters or police officers. Yeah, you know, I'm like, hey man,

976
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,720
Speaker 1: that's something I always kind of toyed around with doing.

977
00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 1: I'm so thankful that there are people like you that

978
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 1: are doing it because I came to the realization that

979
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:16,239
Speaker 1: I could not. Yeah, you know what I mean. So

980
00:51:16,520 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 1: it's so I'm kind of like, you know, a big

981
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 1: dose of humility, right, It's yeah, it's not a high bar.

982
00:51:25,960 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 1: It's just potentially high consequence for sure. Yeah, my youngest.

983
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 2: My youngest wants to be a Navy corman, which you know,

984
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:37,879
Speaker 2: I always joked that every family has a black sheep, right,

985
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 2: and he wants to be a Navy corman. So we

986
00:51:39,960 --> 00:51:42,359
Speaker 2: were actually talking about the ASVAB yesterday and I'm like, yeah,

987
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:45,360
Speaker 2: it's again, not not a high bar, right, like, just

988
00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:51,080
Speaker 2: you'll be fine. But my point with that is people

989
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:53,839
Speaker 2: don't need to apologize for not serving for whatever reason

990
00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:57,040
Speaker 2: they didn't. Whatever it doesn't that was their reason, and

991
00:51:57,080 --> 00:52:03,520
Speaker 2: it's fine. But live your life in such a way

992
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:06,759
Speaker 2: that you respect those who did. And I think for

993
00:52:06,840 --> 00:52:10,080
Speaker 2: me that's that's kind of what it boils down to, is, Look,

994
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:13,319
Speaker 2: you did your thing, whatever your thing was, contribute to

995
00:52:13,360 --> 00:52:16,759
Speaker 2: the world that hopefully we had a hand in building.

996
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:21,560
Speaker 1: Exactly something. And I told my oldest daughter this that

997
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 1: she was, you know, getting close to the graduation agent,

998
00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 1: obviously being surrounded by it. I'm sure she felt a

999
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 1: lot of pressure, even though there was zero pressure on

1000
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:33,680
Speaker 1: her mom and I side. I said, hey, you don't

1001
00:52:33,800 --> 00:52:39,440
Speaker 1: have to serve, but you do have to contribute something

1002
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:43,040
Speaker 1: positive to society. You know what I'm saying you can't

1003
00:52:43,080 --> 00:52:46,800
Speaker 1: be you can't just take. I don't care if you

1004
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:48,640
Speaker 1: volunteer at the soup kitchen. I don't care. If you

1005
00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:50,960
Speaker 1: pick up trash on the side of the highway, I

1006
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:54,799
Speaker 1: don't care. But you're going to give back somehow, some way,

1007
00:52:54,880 --> 00:52:58,120
Speaker 1: because none of this is free, you know, just period,

1008
00:52:58,200 --> 00:52:58,760
Speaker 1: end of story.

1009
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:03,480
Speaker 2: It's good. Yeah, right, yeah, It's about service, not necessarily

1010
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 2: what uniform you wore in service or how you did it.

1011
00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 2: And again, I'm a firm believer that all of us

1012
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:12,120
Speaker 2: are created with different skills and opportunities and perspectives and backgrounds,

1013
00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:15,920
Speaker 2: and so use that, steward over that and find a

1014
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:17,279
Speaker 2: place to use that, and there are a lot of

1015
00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 2: ways to do that. That's good. If you were sitting

1016
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:30,080
Speaker 2: across from someone who, let's say their mid career, maybe

1017
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:32,400
Speaker 2: they have a family, maybe they don't. They're you know,

1018
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:35,719
Speaker 2: they're they're far enough along that they're pretty settled. They

1019
00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:37,200
Speaker 2: know how to do the job they're doing, and they're

1020
00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:38,960
Speaker 2: proud of it or whatever. But maybe they're also far

1021
00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:41,440
Speaker 2: enough along they're starting to look down to someday I'm

1022
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:45,160
Speaker 2: gonna have to to transition out of this thing. You've

1023
00:53:45,200 --> 00:53:47,480
Speaker 2: kind of seen this from every every every place. I

1024
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:49,840
Speaker 2: think you know, from wearing the uniform to doing the

1025
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:53,640
Speaker 2: job but not necessarily wearing the uniform, training high performers.

1026
00:53:55,080 --> 00:53:58,040
Speaker 2: I know you work with the FIS Hostage Rescue Team

1027
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:00,000
Speaker 2: for a while and those guys you talk about high performers.

1028
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:03,680
Speaker 2: I have the privilege of going to their compound and

1029
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:07,040
Speaker 2: meeting with some of those guys and watching him train. Unbelievable.

1030
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:10,040
Speaker 2: I mean, it's just like anyone. This is a complete aside.

1031
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:12,279
Speaker 2: But anyone that says there aren't levels of human we're

1032
00:54:12,280 --> 00:54:14,600
Speaker 2: all the same, they haven't been in that environment. Are

1033
00:54:15,080 --> 00:54:17,840
Speaker 2: Those are not normal people? Right? And you've been around

1034
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:19,759
Speaker 2: a lot of those that level of people. So you've

1035
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:23,440
Speaker 2: seen this in all kind of everywhere, right from like

1036
00:54:23,560 --> 00:54:25,360
Speaker 2: the PFC who just had nowhere else to go, so

1037
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:27,240
Speaker 2: we went in the military to a guy who probably

1038
00:54:27,239 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 2: could have done anything that he wanted, to special Operations

1039
00:54:30,440 --> 00:54:34,120
Speaker 2: community as guys who are super high IQ could have

1040
00:54:34,160 --> 00:54:36,960
Speaker 2: been professional athletes, but they chose to carry a gun instead. Right,

1041
00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:40,480
Speaker 2: So you've seen this from every perspective. You're sitting down

1042
00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:42,640
Speaker 2: with a guy and you've got to give him some advice.

1043
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:43,680
Speaker 2: What would your advice be?

1044
00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:49,879
Speaker 1: To him, that's a great question question.

1045
00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:51,840
Speaker 2: I know it's a big question. It's a very individual

1046
00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:55,120
Speaker 2: question too, but just generally, like, Bro, you've got to

1047
00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 2: understand this thing.

1048
00:54:57,719 --> 00:54:59,320
Speaker 1: I think what you have to I think what I

1049
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:04,000
Speaker 1: would tell them is, once again, it's not to sound

1050
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:09,000
Speaker 1: like a broken record. Whatever it is that you're doing.

1051
00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:14,640
Speaker 1: If it's if it doesn't fulfill you right, if it

1052
00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:20,400
Speaker 1: doesn't fulfill you, if it doesn't give you purpose, enjoy

1053
00:55:20,560 --> 00:55:25,840
Speaker 1: and contentment, then it's time to start looking for something

1054
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:31,440
Speaker 1: that does right. If if you're completely if if your

1055
00:55:31,480 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 1: general disposition is of contentment, joy and and and happiness,

1056
00:55:36,719 --> 00:55:38,680
Speaker 1: then you're obviously right where you need to be, and

1057
00:55:38,719 --> 00:55:42,920
Speaker 1: you need to continue to march right. If there's and

1058
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:44,960
Speaker 1: I'll use myself as an example, like I was at

1059
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:47,399
Speaker 1: the twelve year mark in the Marine Corps, which by

1060
00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:50,000
Speaker 1: any argument is over the hump, you know, and kind

1061
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:52,760
Speaker 1: of closer to the end than it is anything else.

1062
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:53,920
Speaker 2: But I was.

1063
00:55:55,640 --> 00:56:01,319
Speaker 1: In such a bad place mentally, physically, spiritually that I

1064
00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:04,719
Speaker 1: don't I was not operating at one hundred percent, so

1065
00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:09,200
Speaker 1: therefore not I'm doing myself, and that the marines around

1066
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:13,200
Speaker 1: me zero favors by kind of sticking around and gutting

1067
00:56:13,200 --> 00:56:18,759
Speaker 1: it out right, and I found that contentment, that joy

1068
00:56:18,760 --> 00:56:23,160
Speaker 1: and that purpose in kind of the next adventure and

1069
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:26,320
Speaker 1: whatever that was, you know, just simply the act of

1070
00:56:27,080 --> 00:56:30,600
Speaker 1: cutting the ties and kind of fresh start and let's

1071
00:56:30,680 --> 00:56:34,719
Speaker 1: just see what happens. And I found my purpose, my

1072
00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 1: join my contentment going down that path. And fourteen years

1073
00:56:39,080 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 1: later the well had run dry, and then I had

1074
00:56:42,960 --> 00:56:46,000
Speaker 1: to find purpose, joy and contentment in something else, you know,

1075
00:56:46,120 --> 00:56:49,960
Speaker 1: kind of that new pursuit. And that new pursuit once

1076
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:53,239
Speaker 1: again was trying to be a voice in an example

1077
00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:59,719
Speaker 1: of positivity of resilience of Hey, you know it's you're

1078
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:02,680
Speaker 1: going to your going to This is just a new selection.

1079
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:06,399
Speaker 1: Like how many selections have you know, have you been through? Right,

1080
00:57:07,200 --> 00:57:10,360
Speaker 1: this is just a new selection process. And guess what

1081
00:57:10,600 --> 00:57:13,320
Speaker 1: if you fail, you can go again, right, you know

1082
00:57:13,960 --> 00:57:17,280
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like, it's just keep going, you know,

1083
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:20,200
Speaker 1: just keep going. Don't take no for an answer, you know,

1084
00:57:20,320 --> 00:57:25,400
Speaker 1: bet on yourself, you know, and you know, positive habits,

1085
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:29,880
Speaker 1: you know, healthy positive and healthy habits obviously help. And

1086
00:57:30,760 --> 00:57:34,760
Speaker 1: you know, you know, seeking that that new past that

1087
00:57:35,320 --> 00:57:36,720
Speaker 1: brings you join contentment.

1088
00:57:38,360 --> 00:57:40,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's good. Some people just grind it out because

1089
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:43,560
Speaker 2: this is where I am. Right, well, I'm here, Yeah,

1090
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:45,680
Speaker 2: I'm at the twelve year mark. It's for those who

1091
00:57:45,760 --> 00:57:48,320
Speaker 2: haven't been in the military, that is the mark where

1092
00:57:48,360 --> 00:57:55,120
Speaker 2: these conversations often happen. Is like, okay, three enlistments, I'm

1093
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 2: basically eight years away from retirement. So even if I

1094
00:57:57,800 --> 00:57:59,600
Speaker 2: hate my job and I'm going to go become a

1095
00:57:59,600 --> 00:58:04,200
Speaker 2: recruiter somewhere, it's eight years, dude. That's it's eight years.

1096
00:58:04,920 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 2: There's a lot in eight years, and you have a

1097
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:09,960
Speaker 2: family to take care of and a future to plan for,

1098
00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:13,720
Speaker 2: and so sometimes it's wise to stick it out. But

1099
00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:16,080
Speaker 2: but often it's the best thing you can do to say,

1100
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:18,080
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go find the next thing, and that's right.

1101
00:58:18,320 --> 00:58:22,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, and these you know, be be brutally self aware,

1102
00:58:22,720 --> 00:58:26,400
Speaker 1: you know, have those hard, you know, internal conversations with yourself,

1103
00:58:26,520 --> 00:58:29,720
Speaker 1: like and I did, and you know, and obviously seeking

1104
00:58:29,920 --> 00:58:32,760
Speaker 1: advice from anybody and everybody to give it to me,

1105
00:58:32,960 --> 00:58:36,240
Speaker 1: of course, you know. And you know, the ultimate conversation

1106
00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:38,400
Speaker 1: was was with my wife where I was like, hey,

1107
00:58:39,160 --> 00:58:42,000
Speaker 1: it's we can either do the next nine years eight

1108
00:58:42,080 --> 00:58:45,040
Speaker 1: or nine years on their terms, and we kind of

1109
00:58:45,040 --> 00:58:48,000
Speaker 1: know how that's going to go. We know how I'm

1110
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 1: going to handle it, which is going to be not well,

1111
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:53,880
Speaker 1: you know, because I went from moderately belligerent to off

1112
00:58:53,920 --> 00:58:57,520
Speaker 1: the charts, you know, belligerent by that time. And uh,

1113
00:58:57,640 --> 00:59:00,880
Speaker 1: or we can take a chance on our sol and

1114
00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:03,560
Speaker 1: kind of see what this new paths, you know, where

1115
00:59:03,560 --> 00:59:07,440
Speaker 1: this new paths will lead. And ultimately it was just

1116
00:59:07,560 --> 00:59:10,600
Speaker 1: better for my interest, for her interests, the family's interest,

1117
00:59:11,240 --> 00:59:14,480
Speaker 1: that I not be in that constant state of of

1118
00:59:14,720 --> 00:59:17,480
Speaker 1: of discontentment, right, you know, because it breeds so much

1119
00:59:17,560 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 1: other negative emotions. And uh so, yeah, we cut ties

1120
00:59:21,360 --> 00:59:24,680
Speaker 1: and uh we cut ties and like I said, it's

1121
00:59:24,760 --> 00:59:27,280
Speaker 1: been uh, it's been good.

1122
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:30,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, it's good man. It's good to talk

1123
00:59:30,280 --> 00:59:31,440
Speaker 2: to you. I feel like we could sit here and

1124
00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:34,840
Speaker 2: talk for a lot longer than this. We need to

1125
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:37,800
Speaker 2: make it not twenty three years between the next this

1126
00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:39,840
Speaker 2: time and the next time. We've communicated a little bit.

1127
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:42,040
Speaker 2: We've talked a little bit, but I need to make

1128
00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:46,040
Speaker 2: my way to to Illinois and you can hang out, yeah.

1129
00:59:45,600 --> 00:59:49,080
Speaker 1: Anytime, Yes, absolutely, yeah, absolutely.

1130
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:52,760
Speaker 2: How can people follow you? Obviously, the socials, where can

1131
00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:54,680
Speaker 2: they learn more about nomadic research and the work you

1132
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:55,520
Speaker 2: guys are doing. There.

1133
00:59:56,440 --> 01:00:00,440
Speaker 1: So Nomadicresearch dot com is where you know the retail

1134
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:04,080
Speaker 1: shop is that. We also have the Nomadic Research podcast YouTube,

1135
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:06,960
Speaker 1: Spotify and uh yeah, and then I'm a true named

1136
01:00:07,040 --> 01:00:11,000
Speaker 1: Dagan van Houston on all the socials. So yeah, please

1137
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:12,880
Speaker 1: check us out. We got a lot of good gear

1138
01:00:13,280 --> 01:00:16,040
Speaker 1: and uh you won't be disappointed. And I really appreciate

1139
01:00:16,040 --> 01:00:16,680
Speaker 1: the opportunity.

1140
01:00:16,720 --> 01:00:19,600
Speaker 2: Brother. Yeah, thank you man, Dagan van Houston, appreciate you.