1 00:00:08,257 --> 00:00:14,217 Speaker 1: Life audio. This episode discusses trauma and maybe triggering for 2 00:00:14,257 --> 00:00:14,977 Speaker 1: some listeners. 3 00:00:17,097 --> 00:00:20,337 Speaker 2: Join us in celebrating an incredible milestone as the beloved 4 00:00:20,417 --> 00:00:24,417 Speaker 2: Jesus Calling brand reaches fifty million lives impacted. As we 5 00:00:24,457 --> 00:00:27,537 Speaker 2: honor the legacy of author Sarah Young, we reflect on 6 00:00:27,577 --> 00:00:32,777 Speaker 2: the stories from celebrities, pastors, authors, actors, singers, athletes, scholars, 7 00:00:32,817 --> 00:00:35,817 Speaker 2: and everyday people who have been inspired by her devotional 8 00:00:35,857 --> 00:00:38,696 Speaker 2: writings to join in the celebration and to hear some 9 00:00:38,737 --> 00:00:40,816 Speaker 2: of the stories of people whose faith journeys have been 10 00:00:40,817 --> 00:00:43,577 Speaker 2: impacted by all the writings of Sarah Young. Head over 11 00:00:43,656 --> 00:00:50,696 Speaker 2: to Jesus Calling dot Com. 12 00:00:48,217 --> 00:00:50,696 Speaker 3: And all of a sudden, I just heard screaming and 13 00:00:50,777 --> 00:00:53,497 Speaker 3: it was like a screen that you've never heard before. 14 00:00:54,537 --> 00:00:57,897 Speaker 4: I can't think of a shark attack that is even 15 00:00:58,297 --> 00:01:01,977 Speaker 4: really close to the carnage that I saw that day. 16 00:01:02,257 --> 00:01:04,377 Speaker 1: He's got to die any moment, is what I'm thinking. 17 00:01:04,857 --> 00:01:08,657 Speaker 4: The reality of being nine miles offshore, expecting that any 18 00:01:08,697 --> 00:01:10,257 Speaker 4: moment he's going to breathe his last. 19 00:01:10,257 --> 00:01:14,697 Speaker 2: Brad, Welcome to the Jesus Calling Podcast. This week we 20 00:01:14,777 --> 00:01:17,937 Speaker 2: hear from Jameson and Mary Reader, authors of Rescue at 21 00:01:17,977 --> 00:01:20,817 Speaker 2: the Reef. They shared the miraculous story of their ten 22 00:01:20,897 --> 00:01:24,777 Speaker 2: year old son, Jameson Junior, who narrowly survived a devastating 23 00:01:24,817 --> 00:01:28,177 Speaker 2: bull shark attack in the Florida Keys. Despite a life 24 00:01:28,257 --> 00:01:32,497 Speaker 2: altering injury, Jameson Junior's faith remained unshaken, and just four 25 00:01:32,577 --> 00:01:35,617 Speaker 2: days later, he asked to return to the reef. Later 26 00:01:35,657 --> 00:01:38,817 Speaker 2: in the episode, we hear from Greta Eskridge, author and 27 00:01:38,857 --> 00:01:41,977 Speaker 2: homeschool Lama four, who shares our story of healing after 28 00:01:42,057 --> 00:01:44,977 Speaker 2: her husband Aaron, confessed to an affair and a year's 29 00:01:45,017 --> 00:01:47,977 Speaker 2: long pornography addiction. While working to heal the damage to 30 00:01:48,017 --> 00:01:51,497 Speaker 2: their marriage, Greta became convinced that parents must break the 31 00:01:51,537 --> 00:01:55,257 Speaker 2: silence around this issue and initiate difficult conversations with their 32 00:01:55,377 --> 00:01:59,617 Speaker 2: kids about pornography. Let's begin with Jameson and Mary's story. 33 00:02:02,537 --> 00:02:05,737 Speaker 1: I'm Jamison Reader and this is my wife Mary. 34 00:02:06,257 --> 00:02:09,617 Speaker 4: We are the authors of Rescue at the Reef, the 35 00:02:09,657 --> 00:02:12,697 Speaker 4: miraculous true story of a little boy with Big Faith. 36 00:02:13,257 --> 00:02:16,657 Speaker 1: We're both from South Florida, Fort Lauderdale, Floridas. We love 37 00:02:16,697 --> 00:02:17,217 Speaker 1: the ocean. 38 00:02:17,657 --> 00:02:20,377 Speaker 4: Three of our five kids were born and raised in 39 00:02:20,497 --> 00:02:27,777 Speaker 4: South Florida, and we just love all ocean things, swimming, diving, fishing, surfing. 40 00:02:30,857 --> 00:02:33,897 Speaker 4: I grew up going to the Florida Keys, so these 41 00:02:33,897 --> 00:02:36,657 Speaker 4: are waters that we're very familiar with that we love. 42 00:02:37,057 --> 00:02:41,857 Speaker 4: And it was an incredibly beautiful day when we were 43 00:02:41,897 --> 00:02:45,977 Speaker 4: able to find just that perfect weather window to be 44 00:02:46,017 --> 00:02:49,737 Speaker 4: able to head offshore nine miles to lu Key Reef. 45 00:02:50,137 --> 00:02:53,777 Speaker 4: This is a Saturday, August thirteenth, twenty twenty two. We 46 00:02:53,897 --> 00:02:58,017 Speaker 4: gave our safety talk and began to just as a 47 00:02:58,057 --> 00:03:04,417 Speaker 4: family get so excited about what we were diving into. All 48 00:03:04,497 --> 00:03:07,097 Speaker 4: of our kids swim like fish, except at the time 49 00:03:07,137 --> 00:03:10,457 Speaker 4: our youngest was three and so he was still learning 50 00:03:10,657 --> 00:03:13,537 Speaker 4: how to swim, so he was in a proper floatation device. 51 00:03:13,657 --> 00:03:17,257 Speaker 1: The rest of us were using pool noodles to just kind. 52 00:03:17,137 --> 00:03:20,377 Speaker 4: Of lay on across our torso so that as we 53 00:03:20,377 --> 00:03:23,617 Speaker 4: were face down in the water snorkeling, once we saw 54 00:03:23,657 --> 00:03:25,617 Speaker 4: something worth exploring, we could let go of. 55 00:03:25,577 --> 00:03:30,337 Speaker 1: That pull noodle, dive down. Just enjoy eight feet underwater. 56 00:03:30,577 --> 00:03:33,137 Speaker 1: That's as deep as it was where we were, as 57 00:03:33,177 --> 00:03:33,977 Speaker 1: clear as a pool. 58 00:03:34,017 --> 00:03:36,777 Speaker 4: It's as shallow as a pool, and as soon as 59 00:03:36,777 --> 00:03:40,857 Speaker 4: we jump in we just see hundreds of species of 60 00:03:40,897 --> 00:03:45,297 Speaker 4: marine life. It is just a glorious moment and so 61 00:03:45,297 --> 00:03:47,537 Speaker 4: we're always looking for sharks because they kind of sneak 62 00:03:47,617 --> 00:03:50,497 Speaker 4: up behind and they're just curious, and so we keep 63 00:03:50,537 --> 00:03:52,537 Speaker 4: looking doing our three sixties see nothing. 64 00:03:52,977 --> 00:03:56,017 Speaker 3: And then when we were cleaning up from lunch, Jamison 65 00:03:56,057 --> 00:03:58,537 Speaker 3: Junior saw turtle surface right by the side of the 66 00:03:58,537 --> 00:04:01,337 Speaker 3: boat and ask Dad if he could take the GoPro 67 00:04:01,457 --> 00:04:02,537 Speaker 3: and go follow the turtle. 68 00:04:03,017 --> 00:04:04,977 Speaker 5: Of course, Dad said, yeah, let's do it. 69 00:04:05,057 --> 00:04:08,497 Speaker 3: Let's go, So he jumped in the water with Jamison 70 00:04:08,537 --> 00:04:11,977 Speaker 3: Junior and our three year old at the time, Neemaiyah. 71 00:04:11,537 --> 00:04:14,417 Speaker 1: And Jamison Junior's ten at this time, yep. 72 00:04:14,497 --> 00:04:18,417 Speaker 3: So they jumped in the water and Jamison Jr. Starts 73 00:04:18,457 --> 00:04:21,736 Speaker 3: filming this turtle and it's just absolutely amazing that the 74 00:04:21,736 --> 00:04:24,137 Speaker 3: turtle is not getting spooped off. He's not swimming off, 75 00:04:24,176 --> 00:04:26,657 Speaker 3: he's letting Jameson just kind of hang out and chill 76 00:04:26,736 --> 00:04:29,137 Speaker 3: right next to him. So he's getting this great footage. 77 00:04:29,217 --> 00:04:33,416 Speaker 3: And Jamison Senior doesn't want to spook the turtle or 78 00:04:33,416 --> 00:04:35,217 Speaker 3: the three year old spook the turtle off, so he 79 00:04:35,296 --> 00:04:37,416 Speaker 3: kind of hangs out by the back of the boat 80 00:04:37,736 --> 00:04:40,217 Speaker 3: with Nehemiah as Jamison Junior is kind of off to 81 00:04:40,217 --> 00:04:42,416 Speaker 3: the side of the boat and then all of a sudden, 82 00:04:42,457 --> 00:04:46,136 Speaker 3: I just heard screaming, and it was like a scream 83 00:04:46,176 --> 00:04:49,297 Speaker 3: that you've never heard before, and you don't ever want 84 00:04:49,337 --> 00:04:52,136 Speaker 3: to hear this terrifying scream. I don't see a shark. 85 00:04:52,976 --> 00:04:56,496 Speaker 3: I just see Jamison Junior screaming, waving his arms in 86 00:04:56,936 --> 00:05:01,856 Speaker 3: desperate need for help. So I immediately started screaming at Jamison Senior, 87 00:05:01,856 --> 00:05:03,736 Speaker 3: who's right here off the back of the boat, and 88 00:05:03,856 --> 00:05:06,496 Speaker 3: tell him go swim to James or he's screaming. 89 00:05:07,176 --> 00:05:09,897 Speaker 1: And I'm like, he looks okay, And we don't see shark. 90 00:05:10,296 --> 00:05:13,497 Speaker 4: We don't think shark because we're looking for shark and 91 00:05:13,537 --> 00:05:16,976 Speaker 4: we know if something's going on with that, we're dialed in. 92 00:05:17,496 --> 00:05:20,376 Speaker 4: And so my first thought is just closed that small 93 00:05:20,416 --> 00:05:21,616 Speaker 4: gap between me and my son. 94 00:05:22,496 --> 00:05:26,256 Speaker 3: So as we approached Jamison, he was white as a sheep, 95 00:05:26,936 --> 00:05:30,136 Speaker 3: and he also looked like he was sitting on an 96 00:05:30,176 --> 00:05:33,296 Speaker 3: invisible chair. I remember thinking, why is he so far up? 97 00:05:33,936 --> 00:05:37,296 Speaker 3: Not levitating out of the water, but just up high. 98 00:05:37,816 --> 00:05:41,176 Speaker 4: The top were more buoyant than what that cool noodle 99 00:05:42,176 --> 00:05:44,097 Speaker 4: would have or should have been able to hold his 100 00:05:44,176 --> 00:05:46,017 Speaker 4: little seventy pound body. 101 00:05:46,577 --> 00:05:50,216 Speaker 3: In that moment, I saw his arm was reaching out help, 102 00:05:50,736 --> 00:05:52,456 Speaker 3: and his eyes were so open. I just dove in 103 00:05:52,496 --> 00:05:55,296 Speaker 3: the water as fast as I could. I got to him. 104 00:05:55,337 --> 00:05:57,937 Speaker 3: I put my arms underneath his underarms, and I kind 105 00:05:57,936 --> 00:06:00,577 Speaker 3: of brought him over to the boat as Genis and 106 00:06:00,697 --> 00:06:02,496 Speaker 3: Senior pulled him out of the boat. Was when I 107 00:06:02,537 --> 00:06:05,856 Speaker 3: saw his tibia bone just come across my face, from 108 00:06:05,856 --> 00:06:08,496 Speaker 3: his knee to his ankle. His achilles tenant. 109 00:06:08,257 --> 00:06:09,296 Speaker 4: Was his bone. 110 00:06:09,337 --> 00:06:12,777 Speaker 3: His foot was untouched, but his bone was just in 111 00:06:12,816 --> 00:06:15,337 Speaker 3: the middle there holding it on. And that's when we 112 00:06:15,376 --> 00:06:18,256 Speaker 3: knew what had happened. And that's when it kind of 113 00:06:18,257 --> 00:06:22,856 Speaker 3: all just came crashing down on both of us. 114 00:06:22,697 --> 00:06:27,017 Speaker 4: The reality of being nine miles off shore, seeing your 115 00:06:27,056 --> 00:06:30,296 Speaker 4: son bleed out. I'm holding him now in my arms, 116 00:06:31,217 --> 00:06:34,176 Speaker 4: expecting that any moment he's going to breathe his last breath, 117 00:06:34,376 --> 00:06:38,057 Speaker 4: just feeling like it's impossible, there is no way looking 118 00:06:38,097 --> 00:06:41,817 Speaker 4: at the damage and so it's just so horrific. You're 119 00:06:41,897 --> 00:06:45,376 Speaker 4: in shock, and so I screamed no, in utter denial 120 00:06:45,897 --> 00:06:48,697 Speaker 4: of the reality that we're that far away from help 121 00:06:49,816 --> 00:06:53,416 Speaker 4: and he's going to die any moment, is what I'm thinking. 122 00:06:54,296 --> 00:06:56,496 Speaker 4: It goes from the greatest day of our life. 123 00:06:56,257 --> 00:06:57,817 Speaker 1: To the worst day. Just like that. 124 00:06:58,736 --> 00:07:02,096 Speaker 4: So he hears me scream no, and the first words 125 00:07:02,097 --> 00:07:06,296 Speaker 4: out of his mouth daddy, it's okay, Jesus is going 126 00:07:06,376 --> 00:07:06,817 Speaker 4: to save me. 127 00:07:13,657 --> 00:07:16,617 Speaker 1: It was like in that moment the hope of heaven 128 00:07:16,777 --> 00:07:21,177 Speaker 1: just broke in what we believe the reason Jamison was 129 00:07:21,217 --> 00:07:24,097 Speaker 1: so buoyant. We believe he was sitting in the hand. 130 00:07:23,857 --> 00:07:27,696 Speaker 4: Of God not just to keep him away from that 131 00:07:27,777 --> 00:07:30,777 Speaker 4: bull shark, but so that he would not fall off 132 00:07:30,816 --> 00:07:33,177 Speaker 4: of his pull needle into the water, and just as 133 00:07:33,217 --> 00:07:35,256 Speaker 4: he's in shock to try to breathe, and then therefore 134 00:07:35,257 --> 00:07:40,576 Speaker 4: inhal water and within seconds drowned. He knew, let me 135 00:07:40,617 --> 00:07:44,097 Speaker 4: comfort my dad with these words, Daddy, it's okay, Jesus 136 00:07:44,217 --> 00:07:47,497 Speaker 4: is going to save me. But simultaneously, let me call 137 00:07:47,617 --> 00:07:49,337 Speaker 4: upon the name of the Lord so that I will 138 00:07:49,337 --> 00:07:49,857 Speaker 4: be saved. 139 00:07:50,337 --> 00:07:52,297 Speaker 1: And that's exactly what he was doing. 140 00:07:56,257 --> 00:08:00,737 Speaker 3: The morning he woke up after his long life saving 141 00:08:00,777 --> 00:08:06,377 Speaker 3: surgery and amputation, he said to me, I can't fill 142 00:08:06,417 --> 00:08:09,777 Speaker 3: my toes, but maybe i'll feel them tomorrow. And my 143 00:08:09,857 --> 00:08:13,257 Speaker 3: heart sunk because he didn't know we didn't tell him. 144 00:08:13,297 --> 00:08:14,297 Speaker 5: Right there that minute. 145 00:08:14,537 --> 00:08:16,737 Speaker 3: My husband was still down in the lower keys with 146 00:08:16,737 --> 00:08:20,097 Speaker 3: their other children and would not have made it up 147 00:08:20,217 --> 00:08:21,977 Speaker 3: to the hospital till that evening, but we knew we 148 00:08:21,977 --> 00:08:24,337 Speaker 3: needed to tell Jamison, and he had been in and 149 00:08:24,377 --> 00:08:27,057 Speaker 3: out sleeping, resting, But at some point that morning we 150 00:08:27,097 --> 00:08:30,177 Speaker 3: got everyone together, the doctor's nurses, the family that was there. 151 00:08:30,457 --> 00:08:32,617 Speaker 3: We were able to tell him that his leg was 152 00:08:32,657 --> 00:08:36,257 Speaker 3: no longer there. We used Bethany Hamilton's story because that's 153 00:08:36,337 --> 00:08:39,217 Speaker 3: a movie, Soul Surer, We've watched several times. He had 154 00:08:39,257 --> 00:08:41,897 Speaker 3: just watched it that week before the shark attack, and 155 00:08:41,977 --> 00:08:44,937 Speaker 3: I said to him, Hey, Bud, remember what happened to 156 00:08:44,977 --> 00:08:48,337 Speaker 3: Bethany And he said, yeah. I said, that's that's what happened, Bud. 157 00:08:49,457 --> 00:08:54,337 Speaker 3: He just looked, took a deep breath, his eyes kind 158 00:08:54,377 --> 00:08:56,937 Speaker 3: of got a little wattery, but he looked over at 159 00:08:56,937 --> 00:09:00,977 Speaker 3: his Saba, which is his grandfather, my husband's father, and 160 00:09:01,017 --> 00:09:04,377 Speaker 3: he started crying. And Jamison Junior looked over and said, Saba, 161 00:09:04,457 --> 00:09:08,737 Speaker 3: it's gonna be okay, to be okay. So we tell 162 00:09:08,777 --> 00:09:11,137 Speaker 3: him his leg is no longer there. You're gonna get 163 00:09:11,137 --> 00:09:14,937 Speaker 3: a cool prosthetic. He's excited. Later on he meets a 164 00:09:14,977 --> 00:09:18,057 Speaker 3: prosthetist in the hospital, and then a couple of days 165 00:09:18,057 --> 00:09:21,377 Speaker 3: after the shark attack is when he decides to call 166 00:09:21,497 --> 00:09:25,137 Speaker 3: Dad on the phone under the sheets because Dad had 167 00:09:25,177 --> 00:09:27,617 Speaker 3: just gone out for a toothbrush and he's whispering under 168 00:09:27,657 --> 00:09:30,337 Speaker 3: the sheets and he says, Dad, I want you to 169 00:09:30,377 --> 00:09:31,337 Speaker 3: take me back to the reef. 170 00:09:32,217 --> 00:09:35,777 Speaker 4: I'm like wow, And in that moment, I'm just like, 171 00:09:37,257 --> 00:09:40,497 Speaker 4: this is four days after the shark attack, and I 172 00:09:40,537 --> 00:09:44,537 Speaker 4: get emotional even thinking about it, because he's a shining 173 00:09:44,657 --> 00:09:49,497 Speaker 4: example in these dark, difficult days that we live of 174 00:09:50,177 --> 00:09:54,417 Speaker 4: I will not be defined by fear, but I'm going 175 00:09:54,457 --> 00:09:57,817 Speaker 4: to rise by faith. I'm going to face my fear, 176 00:09:58,417 --> 00:10:01,417 Speaker 4: and I'm going to find the freedom that I know 177 00:10:01,537 --> 00:10:05,337 Speaker 4: I've always had in doing what I love. And I'm 178 00:10:05,337 --> 00:10:07,217 Speaker 4: not going to be deterred. I'm not going to be 179 00:10:07,217 --> 00:10:11,337 Speaker 4: held back. And I'm just so proud of him in 180 00:10:11,337 --> 00:10:15,337 Speaker 4: that moment. I'm just yes. And I'm also so afraid 181 00:10:15,377 --> 00:10:19,457 Speaker 4: in that moment, how do I properly protect and lead 182 00:10:19,817 --> 00:10:24,297 Speaker 4: and guide my son through this overwhelming moment when in 183 00:10:24,337 --> 00:10:27,937 Speaker 4: reality he was leading and guiding me and all of us. 184 00:10:28,417 --> 00:10:31,697 Speaker 4: So I committed to him because he said, dat, I 185 00:10:31,737 --> 00:10:33,617 Speaker 4: want to go back, because I want to face my fear. 186 00:10:33,697 --> 00:10:36,297 Speaker 1: I just said, man, let's go. 187 00:10:37,097 --> 00:10:40,256 Speaker 4: So it took ten weeks for the doctors to give 188 00:10:40,337 --> 00:10:43,697 Speaker 4: us ultimate clearance, and so we went back nine miles 189 00:10:43,737 --> 00:10:46,057 Speaker 4: off shore to the same re reaf, in the same 190 00:10:46,137 --> 00:10:47,097 Speaker 4: waters where his. 191 00:10:47,137 --> 00:10:48,657 Speaker 1: Life was almost ended. 192 00:10:48,697 --> 00:10:51,897 Speaker 4: And it wasn't the absence of fear that allowed him 193 00:10:51,897 --> 00:10:52,857 Speaker 4: to jump in that day. 194 00:10:53,017 --> 00:10:56,297 Speaker 1: By the way, there's no fences in the ocean, so. 195 00:10:56,257 --> 00:11:00,417 Speaker 4: They can't herd all the sharks into a pen so 196 00:11:00,537 --> 00:11:02,297 Speaker 4: that Jamison can have this moment. 197 00:11:02,457 --> 00:11:06,857 Speaker 1: Doesn't work that way. There was the very real presence, the. 198 00:11:06,777 --> 00:11:12,257 Speaker 4: Very real reality that not only sharks, but the very 199 00:11:12,337 --> 00:11:15,617 Speaker 4: shark that took his life, because they're very territorial. 200 00:11:16,417 --> 00:11:19,337 Speaker 1: So we get out there and I say, Sun, we 201 00:11:19,417 --> 00:11:21,297 Speaker 1: faced our fear. We're here. 202 00:11:21,857 --> 00:11:23,937 Speaker 4: We don't have to jump in, and he goes, no, no, no, 203 00:11:23,977 --> 00:11:26,136 Speaker 4: we have to jump in. I said, well, how do 204 00:11:26,217 --> 00:11:29,617 Speaker 4: you feel. He goes, I'm afraid. I said I'm too. 205 00:11:29,777 --> 00:11:32,737 Speaker 4: I'm with you. That's a real thing. We don't have 206 00:11:32,737 --> 00:11:35,737 Speaker 4: to ignore that. I said, but why do you want 207 00:11:35,737 --> 00:11:39,057 Speaker 4: to jump in? He goes, because we've come this far, 208 00:11:39,417 --> 00:11:40,417 Speaker 4: We got to go all the way. 209 00:11:40,937 --> 00:11:43,257 Speaker 1: We haven't come this far to turn back. 210 00:11:43,337 --> 00:11:47,377 Speaker 4: And I was like, wow, we dive in and it 211 00:11:47,457 --> 00:11:50,017 Speaker 4: all flashes back to him the day of the shark attack, 212 00:11:50,457 --> 00:11:52,617 Speaker 4: you know, looking at the ocean floor, the feeling. 213 00:11:52,297 --> 00:11:54,977 Speaker 1: Of water on his body and all of that. 214 00:11:55,097 --> 00:12:00,057 Speaker 4: But it was just minutes later that just melted away 215 00:12:00,177 --> 00:12:03,737 Speaker 4: and the joy of what we had always loved to 216 00:12:03,777 --> 00:12:07,777 Speaker 4: do just came rushing back. And we just tell people 217 00:12:08,057 --> 00:12:11,857 Speaker 4: that when you face your fear, the fear doesn't go away, 218 00:12:12,617 --> 00:12:15,897 Speaker 4: but what you focus on is what rises. 219 00:12:16,017 --> 00:12:19,617 Speaker 1: Do you focus on the fear or do you focus. 220 00:12:19,377 --> 00:12:23,457 Speaker 4: On your heavenly Father who is with you in those 221 00:12:23,497 --> 00:12:24,657 Speaker 4: fearful moments. 222 00:12:24,457 --> 00:12:26,577 Speaker 1: He's not abandoned, He's with you. 223 00:12:27,097 --> 00:12:29,577 Speaker 4: And when you focus on your Father over the fear, 224 00:12:29,697 --> 00:12:31,377 Speaker 4: then freedom rises. 225 00:12:35,777 --> 00:12:38,777 Speaker 1: Mary has the book Jesus Calling. 226 00:12:39,417 --> 00:12:42,897 Speaker 4: We're so grateful that so many people have found such 227 00:12:42,937 --> 00:12:47,817 Speaker 4: a powerful and concise volume to be able to read 228 00:12:47,897 --> 00:12:51,497 Speaker 4: on a regular basis to guide them. It is just 229 00:12:52,697 --> 00:12:56,737 Speaker 4: a beautiful reality that God is with us. God is 230 00:12:56,817 --> 00:13:01,257 Speaker 4: involved in our lives, in our stories, and often we 231 00:13:01,377 --> 00:13:04,657 Speaker 4: miss that. But that's the greatness of this story is 232 00:13:04,697 --> 00:13:09,817 Speaker 4: that everybody can be awakened to that reality. I'll be 233 00:13:09,897 --> 00:13:16,137 Speaker 4: reading from Jesus Listens January twenty third, My Living Savior, 234 00:13:16,737 --> 00:13:20,857 Speaker 4: your word shows me that it's possible for your followers 235 00:13:20,897 --> 00:13:25,457 Speaker 4: to be joyful and afraid at the same time. When 236 00:13:25,457 --> 00:13:28,137 Speaker 4: an angel told the women who came to your tomb 237 00:13:28,177 --> 00:13:31,737 Speaker 4: that you had risen from the dead, they were afraid 238 00:13:31,897 --> 00:13:35,337 Speaker 4: yet filled with joy. So I don't have to let 239 00:13:35,377 --> 00:13:38,937 Speaker 4: fear keep me from experiencing the joy of your presence. 240 00:13:40,137 --> 00:13:43,137 Speaker 1: This pleasure is not a luxury reserved. 241 00:13:42,657 --> 00:13:46,857 Speaker 4: For times when my problems and the crisises in the 242 00:13:46,857 --> 00:13:51,577 Speaker 4: world seem under control. Your loving presence is mine to 243 00:13:51,817 --> 00:13:57,097 Speaker 4: enjoy today, tomorrow, and forever. I'm thankful that I can 244 00:13:57,137 --> 00:14:01,177 Speaker 4: talk freely with you about my fears, expressing my thoughts 245 00:14:01,217 --> 00:14:05,817 Speaker 4: and feelings candidly. As I relax in your presence and 246 00:14:06,017 --> 00:14:09,897 Speaker 4: entrust all my concerns to you, Please bless me with 247 00:14:10,017 --> 00:14:13,297 Speaker 4: your joy, which no one can take away from me. 248 00:14:14,217 --> 00:14:17,137 Speaker 4: In your delightful name, Jesus came. 249 00:14:19,337 --> 00:14:22,497 Speaker 2: To learn more about jameson a merry reader, visit Brave 250 00:14:22,657 --> 00:14:24,937 Speaker 2: Like jameson dot com and be sure to check out 251 00:14:24,977 --> 00:14:28,017 Speaker 2: their new book, Rescue at the Reef, the miraculous true 252 00:14:28,057 --> 00:14:30,577 Speaker 2: story of a little boy with big faith at your 253 00:14:30,577 --> 00:14:34,777 Speaker 2: favorite retailer. Stay tuned to Greta Eskridge's story. After a 254 00:14:34,777 --> 00:14:41,857 Speaker 2: brief message with more than fifty million copies, sold. The 255 00:14:41,937 --> 00:14:45,297 Speaker 2: original classic edition of Jesus Calling is your daily guide 256 00:14:45,337 --> 00:14:49,097 Speaker 2: to living a more peaceful life. Experience a deeper relationship 257 00:14:49,097 --> 00:14:51,537 Speaker 2: with Jesus as you savor the presence of the one 258 00:14:51,537 --> 00:14:55,377 Speaker 2: who understands you perfectly and loves you forever. With scripture 259 00:14:55,417 --> 00:14:58,657 Speaker 2: and personal reflections, Jesus Calling is your year long guide 260 00:14:58,697 --> 00:15:01,697 Speaker 2: to living a more peaceful life. Its price and size 261 00:15:01,777 --> 00:15:05,057 Speaker 2: also make it the perfect gift for anyone who needs encouragement. 262 00:15:05,577 --> 00:15:13,897 Speaker 2: Find Jesus Calling wherever you buy books. Greta Eskridge is 263 00:15:13,897 --> 00:15:16,577 Speaker 2: an author and homeschool mom before who helps families build 264 00:15:16,657 --> 00:15:20,857 Speaker 2: lasting connections through intentional everyday moments. After navigating a painful 265 00:15:20,857 --> 00:15:24,017 Speaker 2: season in her marriage involving her husband's pornography addiction, she 266 00:15:24,137 --> 00:15:26,977 Speaker 2: now empowers parents with tools to openly talk with their 267 00:15:27,057 --> 00:15:29,937 Speaker 2: kids about the issue and break the cycle of silence. 268 00:15:31,257 --> 00:15:31,457 Speaker 1: Hi. 269 00:15:31,537 --> 00:15:32,777 Speaker 5: I'm Greta Escridge. 270 00:15:32,937 --> 00:15:38,817 Speaker 6: I am a mom to four kids, and I am 271 00:15:39,017 --> 00:15:42,017 Speaker 6: happily married to my husband for almost thirty years. We 272 00:15:42,657 --> 00:15:46,897 Speaker 6: have homeschooled our kids from the beginning. Prior to that, 273 00:15:47,017 --> 00:15:49,977 Speaker 6: I was a high school English teacher, which I really loved, 274 00:15:50,537 --> 00:15:52,937 Speaker 6: and then I've loved my years of getting to homeschool 275 00:15:52,977 --> 00:15:56,617 Speaker 6: my kids. In between those things, I'm also an author, 276 00:15:57,097 --> 00:15:59,177 Speaker 6: a speaker, and a podcaster. 277 00:16:00,097 --> 00:16:05,097 Speaker 5: Those things all keep me really busy and pretty happy too. 278 00:16:11,977 --> 00:16:15,537 Speaker 6: When I think back to being a little kid growing 279 00:16:15,657 --> 00:16:20,217 Speaker 6: up with a busy family. My dad was a self 280 00:16:20,217 --> 00:16:23,817 Speaker 6: employed artist and then a pastor. My mom was a 281 00:16:23,857 --> 00:16:26,777 Speaker 6: stay at home mom, homeschooling us, my brother and I 282 00:16:27,537 --> 00:16:32,817 Speaker 6: and I think about really beginning to understand or experience 283 00:16:33,057 --> 00:16:39,857 Speaker 6: what connection meant, and I can pinpoint relationships, especially with 284 00:16:39,897 --> 00:16:45,617 Speaker 6: my parents, that were deeply rooted in connection and cultivating 285 00:16:45,857 --> 00:16:51,377 Speaker 6: relationship and that did not come from doing like incredible vacations. 286 00:16:51,697 --> 00:16:54,737 Speaker 6: We never went to Disney World as a family. I 287 00:16:54,737 --> 00:16:58,297 Speaker 6: can recall spending hours on the couch with my mom 288 00:16:58,417 --> 00:17:02,377 Speaker 6: reading aloud to us. That was a way she cultivated connection. 289 00:17:02,897 --> 00:17:06,936 Speaker 6: She spent time, she was in intentional about it, and 290 00:17:07,017 --> 00:17:10,257 Speaker 6: we just enjoyed that time together. My dad did things 291 00:17:10,337 --> 00:17:13,017 Speaker 6: like take us on bike rides, and we would go 292 00:17:13,337 --> 00:17:18,017 Speaker 6: to the beach often Sunday after church, pile into the van, 293 00:17:18,777 --> 00:17:22,857 Speaker 6: take a little like hibachi grill and grill hot dogs 294 00:17:22,857 --> 00:17:25,577 Speaker 6: after we spend hours playing in the waves. And so 295 00:17:26,297 --> 00:17:30,216 Speaker 6: what I experienced, which then as I've grown up have 296 00:17:30,337 --> 00:17:34,697 Speaker 6: come to realize and to recognize that cultivating connection isn't 297 00:17:34,817 --> 00:17:40,017 Speaker 6: about these singular once a year, twice a year big moments. 298 00:17:40,057 --> 00:17:46,497 Speaker 6: It's everyday, intentional time spent with one another saying, really, 299 00:17:46,577 --> 00:17:48,857 Speaker 6: I want to be with you, I want to spend 300 00:17:48,897 --> 00:17:49,377 Speaker 6: time with you. 301 00:17:49,497 --> 00:17:51,537 Speaker 5: I like you. You matter to me. 302 00:17:52,137 --> 00:17:57,617 Speaker 6: Connection is incredibly important to me personally and also to 303 00:17:57,857 --> 00:17:58,977 Speaker 6: the work that I do. 304 00:17:59,937 --> 00:18:01,977 Speaker 5: And I can. 305 00:18:01,857 --> 00:18:08,217 Speaker 6: Pinpoint a specific time when I experienced deep disconnection, and 306 00:18:08,377 --> 00:18:11,617 Speaker 6: that moment was when there was a break in connection 307 00:18:11,737 --> 00:18:15,017 Speaker 6: between my husband and I in our marriage, and it 308 00:18:15,257 --> 00:18:20,497 Speaker 6: was the darkest moment of my life and ann Aaron's life. 309 00:18:21,017 --> 00:18:23,137 Speaker 6: He came to me and confessed that he had had 310 00:18:23,217 --> 00:18:27,256 Speaker 6: an affair, he had an addiction to pornography, and of 311 00:18:27,337 --> 00:18:31,976 Speaker 6: course those are deep breaks in connection. My husband was 312 00:18:32,057 --> 00:18:36,097 Speaker 6: exposed to porn as a kid and never really had 313 00:18:36,137 --> 00:18:39,937 Speaker 6: the tools to be able to talk about it with anyone, 314 00:18:40,017 --> 00:18:43,817 Speaker 6: because when we were growing up in Christian homes, no 315 00:18:43,817 --> 00:18:47,737 Speaker 6: one was talking about pornography and he had no tools. 316 00:18:48,697 --> 00:18:53,297 Speaker 6: And out of that pain and brokenness, there was a 317 00:18:53,497 --> 00:18:56,857 Speaker 6: deep longing and a willingness on both of our parts 318 00:18:57,457 --> 00:19:04,497 Speaker 6: to repair, to pursue healing, and to rebuild connection. Out 319 00:19:04,537 --> 00:19:08,897 Speaker 6: of that broken has come a desire for both of 320 00:19:08,977 --> 00:19:16,457 Speaker 6: us to not only cultivate meaningful, intentional, lasting connection as 321 00:19:16,497 --> 00:19:22,377 Speaker 6: a couple, but also with our children with friends, because 322 00:19:23,177 --> 00:19:27,657 Speaker 6: not only have we experienced the disconnection ourselves, but we 323 00:19:28,017 --> 00:19:32,777 Speaker 6: have recognized that our world is becoming increasingly more disconnected 324 00:19:33,217 --> 00:19:38,177 Speaker 6: and pornography is one of the greatest disconnectors that our society, 325 00:19:38,217 --> 00:19:47,497 Speaker 6: our entire world is facing today. So I've had plenty 326 00:19:47,497 --> 00:19:52,177 Speaker 6: of people ask me if this is my story. I 327 00:19:52,257 --> 00:19:56,216 Speaker 6: find out my husband or my wife, my partner is 328 00:19:56,337 --> 00:20:00,057 Speaker 6: using pornography, is addicted to pornography and all the things 329 00:20:00,057 --> 00:20:02,457 Speaker 6: that come with it, how do I respond? 330 00:20:02,497 --> 00:20:03,137 Speaker 1: What do I do? 331 00:20:03,857 --> 00:20:09,137 Speaker 6: And I can't tell you what will be the formula 332 00:20:09,217 --> 00:20:11,097 Speaker 6: for your healing, but I will tell you some of 333 00:20:11,097 --> 00:20:15,017 Speaker 6: the things that have been powerful and have been transformative 334 00:20:15,217 --> 00:20:18,736 Speaker 6: for me personally, for my husband, Aaron, and for our marriage. 335 00:20:18,737 --> 00:20:22,937 Speaker 6: And I would say for me personally, there was two 336 00:20:23,057 --> 00:20:27,377 Speaker 6: things that were incredibly important, and one was to recognize 337 00:20:27,417 --> 00:20:31,977 Speaker 6: I needed to pursue my own healing. So often in 338 00:20:32,017 --> 00:20:37,817 Speaker 6: these situations, the focus is on the healing for the betrayer, 339 00:20:37,977 --> 00:20:42,736 Speaker 6: right the person who has committed the offense, and that 340 00:20:42,897 --> 00:20:46,936 Speaker 6: is understandable. We want them to find healing, right, but 341 00:20:47,097 --> 00:20:51,057 Speaker 6: then the person who has been betrayed, and that could 342 00:20:51,057 --> 00:20:53,337 Speaker 6: be the husband, the wife, or like I said, the partner. 343 00:20:53,977 --> 00:20:57,337 Speaker 6: We're sort of left to cheer on the person who 344 00:20:57,977 --> 00:21:01,936 Speaker 6: in their healing, but there's less focus on our own healing. 345 00:21:02,777 --> 00:21:04,457 Speaker 5: And so that has. 346 00:21:04,297 --> 00:21:08,777 Speaker 6: Been an important part of my story. But also the 347 00:21:08,857 --> 00:21:12,897 Speaker 6: other part of that for me, which was incredibly transformative 348 00:21:13,017 --> 00:21:17,016 Speaker 6: in developing compassion and understanding for my husband, was to 349 00:21:17,497 --> 00:21:22,097 Speaker 6: begin to learn about the addiction itself. I knew nothing 350 00:21:22,217 --> 00:21:26,577 Speaker 6: about pornography. I mean really, I knew very loosely what 351 00:21:26,657 --> 00:21:30,497 Speaker 6: it was, very loosely that people used it. 352 00:21:30,577 --> 00:21:31,577 Speaker 5: But I can never. 353 00:21:31,457 --> 00:21:34,017 Speaker 6: Imagine a man like my husband, who was a good dad, 354 00:21:34,377 --> 00:21:38,017 Speaker 6: a good husband, a provider, he cared for us, he 355 00:21:38,057 --> 00:21:41,976 Speaker 6: went to church like I couldn't fathom him being a 356 00:21:42,017 --> 00:21:45,657 Speaker 6: person who used pornography, and so I felt I needed 357 00:21:45,657 --> 00:21:49,297 Speaker 6: to understand how it had sucked him in, how it 358 00:21:49,337 --> 00:21:53,297 Speaker 6: had changed him, the why. And so I began to 359 00:21:53,377 --> 00:21:58,137 Speaker 6: educate myself and I began to learn, and that understanding 360 00:21:58,337 --> 00:22:02,857 Speaker 6: was transformative because I began to understand it wasn't about 361 00:22:02,977 --> 00:22:07,617 Speaker 6: him hating me or about him looking for something that 362 00:22:07,737 --> 00:22:10,857 Speaker 6: I couldn't give him or wasn't giving him as much 363 00:22:10,897 --> 00:22:14,417 Speaker 6: as he wanted to escape the nature of addiction is 364 00:22:14,857 --> 00:22:17,057 Speaker 6: that it is very hard to do that on your own, 365 00:22:17,217 --> 00:22:20,777 Speaker 6: and he needed support, but shame kept him hiding right 366 00:22:20,857 --> 00:22:23,977 Speaker 6: and kept him saying, well, I can't get help because 367 00:22:24,017 --> 00:22:26,337 Speaker 6: I don't want anyone to know because then everyone will 368 00:22:26,377 --> 00:22:31,337 Speaker 6: hate me. And so beginning to understand what he was 369 00:22:31,417 --> 00:22:36,497 Speaker 6: dealing with was impactful for me to have compassion and 370 00:22:36,657 --> 00:22:41,617 Speaker 6: understanding for him. This is years of healing, years of learning, 371 00:22:41,697 --> 00:22:45,657 Speaker 6: years of work, but being willing to do that and 372 00:22:45,977 --> 00:22:48,897 Speaker 6: pursue my own healing as a betrayed spouse at the 373 00:22:48,937 --> 00:22:54,177 Speaker 6: same time. Those two things were transformative and really, honestly 374 00:22:54,577 --> 00:23:01,257 Speaker 6: what changed everything for both of us. We need to 375 00:23:01,297 --> 00:23:06,177 Speaker 6: have conversations about pornography and the disconnection that it causes. 376 00:23:06,617 --> 00:23:09,456 Speaker 6: But if you've never done it before, if you're dealing 377 00:23:09,497 --> 00:23:13,537 Speaker 6: with your own hurt from pornography, whether because you have 378 00:23:13,737 --> 00:23:16,297 Speaker 6: used it in your own life or someone you know 379 00:23:16,377 --> 00:23:19,257 Speaker 6: has used it, it's caused you pain and you're like, well, 380 00:23:19,297 --> 00:23:22,497 Speaker 6: how can I enter them that conversation or you're just 381 00:23:22,577 --> 00:23:25,017 Speaker 6: simply like, how do I talk to kids about porn. 382 00:23:25,097 --> 00:23:28,696 Speaker 6: I have no idea, I had no tools, and so 383 00:23:29,577 --> 00:23:34,417 Speaker 6: when we entered into our place of repair and restoration 384 00:23:34,697 --> 00:23:38,177 Speaker 6: and healing, our first thought was how can we do 385 00:23:38,257 --> 00:23:42,297 Speaker 6: better for our kids? And then that grew into well, 386 00:23:42,337 --> 00:23:44,456 Speaker 6: how can we do better for kids around the world 387 00:23:44,857 --> 00:23:49,657 Speaker 6: Because parents are struggling. They need help with these conversations. 388 00:23:49,657 --> 00:23:51,936 Speaker 6: It's so much more than just saying I'll put a 389 00:23:51,937 --> 00:23:53,777 Speaker 6: filter on their phone and trust. 390 00:23:53,497 --> 00:23:57,057 Speaker 5: That they'll be safe. No, we actually need to talk 391 00:23:57,097 --> 00:23:57,657 Speaker 5: to our kids. 392 00:23:57,777 --> 00:24:01,457 Speaker 6: I want parents to have the tools that I didn't have, 393 00:24:01,537 --> 00:24:03,097 Speaker 6: that Aaron didn't have. 394 00:24:03,457 --> 00:24:06,137 Speaker 5: We want to do better for our kids, for yours. 395 00:24:07,097 --> 00:24:08,097 Speaker 5: The huge part of. 396 00:24:08,017 --> 00:24:11,256 Speaker 6: My husband Aaron's story is the shame that he carried, 397 00:24:11,377 --> 00:24:14,257 Speaker 6: first from you know, being exposed. 398 00:24:13,897 --> 00:24:14,377 Speaker 5: As a kid. 399 00:24:14,777 --> 00:24:18,496 Speaker 6: Nobody talked to him about it, and then even after 400 00:24:19,337 --> 00:24:21,897 Speaker 6: he found freedom from addiction in his own life, he 401 00:24:21,977 --> 00:24:25,417 Speaker 6: still carried the shame because he still didn't have the 402 00:24:25,457 --> 00:24:29,737 Speaker 6: tools to talk about it. Someone said once that shame 403 00:24:29,817 --> 00:24:34,257 Speaker 6: is an invitation to create language around a topic, and 404 00:24:34,577 --> 00:24:38,977 Speaker 6: I think that this is absolutely true, especially for something 405 00:24:39,177 --> 00:24:45,097 Speaker 6: like pornography, because in Christian circles, of course, there is 406 00:24:45,337 --> 00:24:49,017 Speaker 6: so much shame laced with any sexual topic. But even 407 00:24:49,217 --> 00:24:54,377 Speaker 6: in secular circles, the topic of pornography just has so 408 00:24:54,537 --> 00:24:58,417 Speaker 6: much shame attached to it. When we allow ourselves to 409 00:24:58,457 --> 00:25:01,097 Speaker 6: have that conversation with our kids or with one another, 410 00:25:01,857 --> 00:25:06,857 Speaker 6: it takes away the power of the thing, and it 411 00:25:06,937 --> 00:25:09,936 Speaker 6: reduces the shame. Hoarn doesn't have to be the end 412 00:25:09,977 --> 00:25:13,017 Speaker 6: of their story. And that's what shamee tells us, right. 413 00:25:13,057 --> 00:25:16,297 Speaker 6: Shame tells us this is the end. No one will 414 00:25:16,497 --> 00:25:19,456 Speaker 6: love you anymore, no one will trust you anymore, no 415 00:25:19,497 --> 00:25:22,257 Speaker 6: one will look at you in a positive way. 416 00:25:22,417 --> 00:25:23,777 Speaker 5: That's what shame tells us. 417 00:25:24,217 --> 00:25:26,417 Speaker 6: But when we bring it into the light, it loses 418 00:25:26,457 --> 00:25:30,537 Speaker 6: its power, and instead we can say, hey, there is 419 00:25:30,577 --> 00:25:34,777 Speaker 6: a new story for you. I want to encourage parents 420 00:25:35,137 --> 00:25:41,617 Speaker 6: to give power to conversation and shame free conversation and 421 00:25:41,697 --> 00:25:45,736 Speaker 6: to say, kids, we can talk about this thing and 422 00:25:46,057 --> 00:25:48,097 Speaker 6: you don't have to be afraid to ask me questions. 423 00:25:48,097 --> 00:25:51,537 Speaker 6: You don't have to be afraid or embarrassed if you 424 00:25:51,617 --> 00:25:52,897 Speaker 6: have seen a pornography. 425 00:25:53,057 --> 00:25:54,897 Speaker 5: I am here to help you. I care about you. 426 00:25:55,457 --> 00:25:58,256 Speaker 6: If it happens to you, I want to invite you 427 00:25:58,337 --> 00:26:01,976 Speaker 6: to a safe conversation with me because I love you 428 00:26:02,097 --> 00:26:04,657 Speaker 6: and I care about you. It's not about what you did. 429 00:26:04,737 --> 00:26:08,537 Speaker 6: It's not about what you saw. It's about who you always. 430 00:26:08,057 --> 00:26:10,537 Speaker 5: Are in my eyes because I love you. 431 00:26:10,857 --> 00:26:13,857 Speaker 6: And when we can talk openly like that with our kids, 432 00:26:14,217 --> 00:26:17,457 Speaker 6: with our spouses, with our friends, with a random stranger 433 00:26:17,497 --> 00:26:18,977 Speaker 6: on a plane, which is what I get to do, 434 00:26:19,697 --> 00:26:25,057 Speaker 6: it's incredible how the fear and the shame dissipates and 435 00:26:25,177 --> 00:26:33,057 Speaker 6: instead it's replaced with emotional connection, love, relief. Fear just 436 00:26:33,377 --> 00:26:38,696 Speaker 6: falls away, And it's incredible how much can change just 437 00:26:38,777 --> 00:26:42,337 Speaker 6: by simply opening the door to honest, heartfelt conversation. 438 00:26:44,817 --> 00:26:48,337 Speaker 2: To learn more about Greta Escritch, visit Gretaeskridge dot com 439 00:26:48,377 --> 00:26:50,137 Speaker 2: and be sure to check out her new book, It's 440 00:26:50,137 --> 00:26:52,297 Speaker 2: Time to Talk to Your Kids about Porn as your 441 00:26:52,297 --> 00:26:55,137 Speaker 2: favorite retailer. If you'd like to hear more stories about 442 00:26:55,177 --> 00:26:57,976 Speaker 2: healing and honesty and marriage and family, check out our 443 00:26:57,977 --> 00:27:05,817 Speaker 2: interview with Chelsea Damon. Next time on the Jesus Calling podcast, 444 00:27:05,897 --> 00:27:08,857 Speaker 2: we'll hear from Tom Harden, a formal Wall Street analyst 445 00:27:08,937 --> 00:27:11,217 Speaker 2: who made a series of illegal trades at twenty nine 446 00:27:11,257 --> 00:27:15,177 Speaker 2: years old, becoming a secret FBI informant known as Tipper X, 447 00:27:15,697 --> 00:27:20,097 Speaker 2: and what became the largest insider training investigation in US history. 448 00:27:21,937 --> 00:27:23,777 Speaker 4: God didn't meet me at the top of my career, 449 00:27:23,897 --> 00:27:25,817 Speaker 4: but he met me at the bottom of my character. 450 00:27:29,737 --> 00:27:32,257 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Jesus Calling Stories of Faith 451 00:27:32,337 --> 00:27:36,177 Speaker 2: podcast on the Live Audio Network. Every week, we'll bring 452 00:27:36,217 --> 00:27:38,777 Speaker 2: you stories from people who share their journeys of faith 453 00:27:39,137 --> 00:27:42,857 Speaker 2: and how prayer and a relationship with God transformed their lives. 454 00:27:43,617 --> 00:27:46,977 Speaker 2: Be sure to follow us on Apple, Spotify, iHeart, or 455 00:27:47,017 --> 00:27:50,297 Speaker 2: wherever you listen to podcasts, and leave us a review 456 00:27:50,377 --> 00:27:54,577 Speaker 2: so others can be inspired weekly by these stories of faith. Finally, 457 00:27:54,897 --> 00:27:58,417 Speaker 2: you can find encouragement resources and more on the Jesus 458 00:27:58,417 --> 00:28:01,217 Speaker 2: Calling website at Jesus Calling dot com.