1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,760 Speaker 1: Did you know the sheriff leading the Nancy Guthrie investigation 2 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:05,840 Speaker 1: is in serious trouble. I'm talking about in his own department, 3 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:09,039 Speaker 1: ninety eight point two percent no confidence vote from his 4 00:00:09,039 --> 00:00:12,880 Speaker 1: own deputies, and reports of an FBI investigation into his department. 5 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: The tenant Rady Sutton is here to break down what 6 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 1: the cast means for the Guthrie case. You cannot have 7 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,239 Speaker 1: a department in revolt while a woman is missing. You 8 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:22,799 Speaker 1: need these facts. Well, can you tell me about the 9 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:26,120 Speaker 1: investigative prowess or lack thereof of Sheriff Chris Nanos. 10 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:32,880 Speaker 2: Well, okay, so you're talking about a law enforcement leader 11 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 2: who does not have the confidence of his police department. 12 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:43,840 Speaker 3: Let me start on that. He actually had a ninety eight. 13 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:47,480 Speaker 2: Point two percent of the department voted a no confidence 14 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:48,520 Speaker 2: vote against him. 15 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:50,959 Speaker 1: Let's break his news. I had no idea. For those 16 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,320 Speaker 1: who don't know, you can do that. We had a 17 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: question here at San Antonio about the police chief not 18 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: too long ago that no confidence vote can't go through. 19 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 1: Ninety eight percent said no confidence in the sheriff. I 20 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 1: didn't know that. Why didn't we know that? 21 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you probably didn't know that he was under 22 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 2: FBI investigation a few years ago. Either didn't no clue 23 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 2: himself himself that that agency has had troubled leadership for 24 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 2: a while under him and one of his deputy chiefs 25 00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 2: was there was an FBI investigation, Arinco investigation, a bunch 26 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:33,120 Speaker 2: of money turned up missing, and during the investigation, his 27 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:35,959 Speaker 2: deputy chief committed suicide. 28 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, and no idea. 29 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:42,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, so there's been a lot of issues involving him. 30 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 2: But let's talk about this case. Because I've been down Tuson. 31 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 2: I was there for nine days covering this for other channels, 32 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:56,800 Speaker 2: right right, And of course I've been a cop for 33 00:01:56,840 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 2: thirty four years. 34 00:01:58,240 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 3: I know what leadership is supposed to be. 35 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 2: And watching nanos doing the initial. 36 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:08,520 Speaker 3: Press conferences were was just uh, I was, I was. 37 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 3: I was dumbfounded. He was, he was. 38 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:17,519 Speaker 2: His performance was dismal, for he walked, he told, he 39 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 2: said things he shouldn't have said. Then later on he 40 00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:25,520 Speaker 2: walked some of those things. Back then they cleared the scene. 41 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:27,880 Speaker 2: This is first of all, they treated it like a 42 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 2: like a search and rescue case at the beginning, when 43 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:35,280 Speaker 2: there was clearly evidence of a crime scene, which they 44 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:39,200 Speaker 2: later said, this is a crime scene. Well, why would 45 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 2: you release a crime scene of of a of a kidnapping, 46 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:48,760 Speaker 2: which is how it was first viewed. Why would you 47 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 2: It's it's leadership is everything. Now, they have very talented 48 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:58,679 Speaker 2: police officers there who are hard working with deputies. Now 49 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:02,919 Speaker 2: let's but let's let's set the senior So, Pima County 50 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:07,200 Speaker 2: is a massive county. It's huge, and Tucson lies within 51 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:12,080 Speaker 2: Pima County. But Tucson has its own police department, and 52 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,600 Speaker 2: Tucson it's a rough town. They last year they invested 53 00:03:15,639 --> 00:03:20,960 Speaker 2: negated about fifty murders. Oh, now Pima County, Pima County 54 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:24,240 Speaker 2: is not They had about five. Now why is that 55 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:26,480 Speaker 2: significant to what I'm what I'm going to be bringing 56 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:31,000 Speaker 2: up to you. Well, in addition to his poor leadership, 57 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 2: uh and the reasons for it, this sheriff got in 58 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:41,280 Speaker 2: some type of pisson contest with the with the investigators, 59 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 2: with his detectives in the homicide bureau. 60 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 3: This this goes back a few months, and. 61 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 2: So he basically reassigned all the experienced investigators to punishment 62 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 2: details like patrol or wherever he sent him thereby leading 63 00:03:56,280 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 2: leaving very putting, very inexperienced attacks actives into the homicide Bureau. Now, 64 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 2: of all things where you want your best, most experienced people, 65 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:14,320 Speaker 2: it's in homicide because, especially in an agency that only 66 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:21,039 Speaker 2: investigates five homicides year, it takes experience in order to 67 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:25,919 Speaker 2: become a competent homicide investigator. It takes world experience to 68 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:28,840 Speaker 2: do it. One of the detectives, that's my understanding, has 69 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 2: never investigated a homicide. So you have inexperienced homicide guys. 70 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 2: Thank goodness that the FBI stepped up in such a 71 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:42,919 Speaker 2: such a big way that it did. But once again, 72 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 2: it's a dismal it's a dismal showing of leadership which 73 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 2: affects the investigative process and the prowess of these of 74 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 2: these detectives. You can't blame them, they don't have the experience. 75 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: Well, let me ask you this question, Lieutenant Randy Sutton 76 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,279 Speaker 1: retired going to follow his great organization, the Wounded Blue 77 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: Dot Org. Because of how it was handled early on. Again, 78 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:08,039 Speaker 1: you you've already mentioned this. It was clearly a crime scene. 79 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:10,200 Speaker 1: You've got blood drops at the front door, yet the 80 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 1: front door camera was destroyed or taken, and then you 81 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:17,520 Speaker 1: find somebody who's a stranger's DNA inside the house. Why 82 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 1: would you ever think that was a search and rescue? 83 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:21,080 Speaker 1: Why would you why would you not look at this 84 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 1: as a crime scene from moment one. I don't have 85 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:26,120 Speaker 1: blood drops on my front doorway neither do you. 86 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:26,920 Speaker 3: Isn't that? 87 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:29,160 Speaker 1: I mean, any cop like Cop one on one is, Hey, 88 00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 1: there's blood on the front door. Maybe we should tape 89 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 1: this off and not untape it till we find out 90 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:34,159 Speaker 1: where the blood came from. 91 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:39,720 Speaker 2: You would think so, you would think so, And that 92 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 2: isn't That isn't the way that this went down. Now, 93 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:49,280 Speaker 2: remember that in one of his dismal press conferences, Natos 94 00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 2: said that there was no there was no. 95 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,240 Speaker 3: Camera footage available and he fully believed that. 96 00:05:56,600 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 2: Well, if it weren't for the FBI coming in, Yeah, 97 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:04,799 Speaker 2: who who has incredible forensic abilities and digital capabilities. Working 98 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:09,280 Speaker 2: with Google, they recovered the most key piece of evidence 99 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 2: in this entire investigation, and that, of course, is the 100 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:15,279 Speaker 2: video of that monster, you know, on the front on 101 00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 2: the front. 102 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 3: Area of the home. 103 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 2: So once again the sheriff looked like an idiot because 104 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 2: because he made that statement. And now but now he 105 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:30,159 Speaker 2: won't even do a press conference because hey, he's. 106 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 1: Doing these he's doing these individual sitdowns. Randy, this is 107 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: very strange to me. He's taking individual reporters and he's 108 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:38,440 Speaker 1: spending his entire day talking about the same thing to 109 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 1: individual reporters, and it comes off like he's trying to 110 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 1: save his own reputation. 111 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 3: I'm with you. 112 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:44,880 Speaker 1: Go and stand behind the podium, go and stand on 113 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:47,720 Speaker 1: a microphone, take questions from the media. Do one session 114 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 1: every day at noon or three o'clock or whatever it is, 115 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 1: get us an update, and then go do the work. 116 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:53,920 Speaker 1: It doesn't look like he's even doing the work. He's 117 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: he's playing damage control. 118 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 2: And well, you know, this goes right along with his 119 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:05,479 Speaker 2: type of leadership, right. I think he was punishing the 120 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 2: media for uh, you know, for the for the dismal 121 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 2: showing that he did, and he was so roundly criticized 122 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 2: so many times in so many ways. He just said, 123 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 2: in fact, he went radio silent for like four days. 124 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 2: You didn't hear anything from nothing. 125 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:24,400 Speaker 1: So you went to a I went to a basketball 126 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 1: game in there too at some point, so I mean, listen, Yeah, 127 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 1: but obviously he screwed up from the beginning. So how 128 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:31,120 Speaker 1: did it work about the connection with the FBI, Because 129 00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: I'm geting all sorts of mixed reaction. Did Nanos end 130 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:35,960 Speaker 1: up calling them in? Did the FBI say, hey, we 131 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:38,760 Speaker 1: heard about this because it's Savannah Guthrie's mother, can we 132 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,640 Speaker 1: help you? How did that connection happen? And it sounds 133 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 1: like you've got some your ears to the ground there 134 00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: from the from the front line troops in the sheriff's office. 135 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:50,040 Speaker 1: Is it true that that Nanos it was not cooperating 136 00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 1: with the FBI early on. 137 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, he hesitated in calling them in. He should They 138 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 2: should have been called in. This was clearly a kidnapping. Yeah, 139 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 2: And of when you when you have kidnapping, you can 140 00:08:03,320 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 2: just say that's FBI all over it. 141 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:07,560 Speaker 3: Right. 142 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 2: They have the forensic capabilities, they have the they they 143 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 2: have the resources, uh to to deal with this. But 144 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 2: he he clearly didn't want to. In fact, several days later, 145 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 2: remember remember the glove, the faces glove that was found 146 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 2: two miles away. 147 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 3: He didn't even send it to the FBI lab. 148 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 2: He sent it to his own private lab that that 149 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 2: their department has used. 150 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:38,119 Speaker 3: Which is mind boggling. When you're working hand in hand. 151 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:42,480 Speaker 2: Allegedly with the FBI, why wouldn't you send it directly 152 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:43,199 Speaker 2: to their lab? 153 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 3: Why cause a delay? 154 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 2: In getting the information to codis to the combined you 155 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 2: know DNA index system, which had to be had eventually 156 00:08:55,800 --> 00:08:56,719 Speaker 2: had to be sent to them. 157 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:00,800 Speaker 3: Anyway, why it doesn't make any sense. It's just it 158 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 3: just doesn't make any sense. 159 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:07,559 Speaker 2: But and the FBI actually came out and said he's 160 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 2: not cooperating with us. For them to even do that 161 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 2: is startling. But and you'll notice this, Joe, you haven't 162 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:17,679 Speaker 2: heard a peep out of the FBI. 163 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 3: Not peep. Yeah. 164 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:23,800 Speaker 2: Usually usually the special Agent charge will come out and 165 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 2: do a joint press conference or something. They have been 166 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 2: completely radio silent, even though they have a massive team there. 167 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:36,679 Speaker 2: They have a command post, they have the hostage rescue 168 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 2: team there, they have four hundred agents that they've sent there. 169 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:44,040 Speaker 2: So but they don't want I don't think they want 170 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:46,680 Speaker 2: to be associated publicly with this guy. 171 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:48,200 Speaker 1: Well I was going to ask you why is that? 172 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 1: Because the FBI should be taking the lead. It sounds 173 00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: like they're not. It sounds like p MA County still 174 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:54,719 Speaker 1: is in the lead for some reason. And it kind 175 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 1: of makes sense what you just said. Why get in 176 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:59,040 Speaker 1: the middle of this mud when they're busy investigating the 177 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: case and they want to solve the So I guess 178 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 1: I understand why they're not out in front, but I 179 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:05,560 Speaker 1: almost expect cash to come out at some point and go, listen, 180 00:10:05,800 --> 00:10:07,439 Speaker 1: here's what we're facing out there, and this could have 181 00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: gone a lot smoother. Maybe they're waiting for the actual 182 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:11,920 Speaker 1: conclusion of the case. So let me ask you something 183 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:15,520 Speaker 1: very directly, as an investigator, would this case, in your opinion, 184 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 1: have been closer to being solved by now had we 185 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 1: not had the missteps by this one guy. 186 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:23,079 Speaker 3: I don't know the answer to that question. 187 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:29,679 Speaker 2: There's that's there's too many variables there, Probably not, I 188 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 2: would say, probably not. 189 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 3: Why is this one so hard to hear to solve? 190 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:36,720 Speaker 3: What is it? Well? 191 00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:41,079 Speaker 2: They are they are literally and this is kind of 192 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 2: shocking to me that that they haven't been able to 193 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 2: at least they haven't publicly said that they've found cell 194 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 2: phone data from the towers there. You know, they this 195 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 2: is this is you know, a richly mined area for 196 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 2: instances like this, And unless these people were so professional, 197 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 2: they didn't bring any cell phones. And that's a possibility too. 198 00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:13,120 Speaker 2: This was this was planned. So here's here's another thing. 199 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 2: Let let I want to I want to talk about 200 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:19,400 Speaker 2: this place there's all kinds of conjecture out there, you know, 201 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 2: was this a burglary gone wrong. I've heard some quote 202 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 2: experts unquote put that theory forward. Now, I don't believe 203 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 2: that to be the case, and I'll tell you why. 204 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:33,319 Speaker 2: For if you look at the crime statistics in Pma 205 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 2: County for a nighttime residential burglaries, they call them hot 206 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:44,359 Speaker 2: prowls because for a burglar to go into a residence 207 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:47,520 Speaker 2: knowing that there's someone there, that's why they do all 208 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 2: the burglaries during the daytime, because there's nobody there. 209 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 3: It's it. 210 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 2: It is so rare in that in Pema County that 211 00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:57,320 Speaker 2: I think they had the last one, you know, five 212 00:11:57,400 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 2: years ago or something. That is not what a burglar does. 213 00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 2: And a burglar doesn't dress up like that monstrosity that 214 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:09,880 Speaker 2: we saw on that video camera. Right, That's that this 215 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 2: was targeted. There's no doubt in my mind, and I 216 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 2: have my own theories about that that I really, you know, 217 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 2: don't talk about it in the other media because my 218 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 2: theories are just that my theories. 219 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:26,320 Speaker 1: Well, right, Rady, let me ask you this, lieutenor Raandy Sutton, 220 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 1: go ahead, but I. 221 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:30,840 Speaker 3: Don't believe that this was anything random. 222 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:35,000 Speaker 2: Okay, I fully believe that this was a targeted crime, 223 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:38,720 Speaker 2: and I fully don't believe that this was a kidnap 224 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 2: for ransom either. 225 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 1: Let's talk about the actual crime scene. It's Lieutenant Randy 226 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 1: Sutton go to the Wounded Blue Dot Org. The Wounded 227 00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: Blue Dot Org. If he looks familiar, He's been in movies. 228 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 1: He was also on cops for a long time and 229 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: a great police officer investigator for thirty plus years. Let's 230 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 1: talk about the actual crime scene, because I don't know 231 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 1: anything from anything about whether somebody's professional or not professional. 232 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 1: Like you said, he dressed up in this constrosity. He 233 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:04,080 Speaker 1: had to have known there was a camera in the front, otherwise, 234 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 1: why hide himself so well. He had to have known 235 00:13:06,520 --> 00:13:08,439 Speaker 1: there was something going on. But when he walks up, 236 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 1: he sort of walks to the left, sort of puts 237 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:11,959 Speaker 1: his hand over the camera. I'm not sure what he's 238 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 1: trying to do, and he grabs some brush, which looks 239 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 1: very unprofessional to me, and then he goes inside. There's 240 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:20,400 Speaker 1: DNA left in side. We're not sure what form of 241 00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 1: DNA it is. And then when they leave, either she's 242 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:26,040 Speaker 1: walking and bleeding or they're carrying her out, her blood 243 00:13:26,080 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 1: is in the front door. He doesn't try to clean 244 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,960 Speaker 1: it up or not leave this mess behind. So how 245 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 1: professional and how planned could this have been to not 246 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:35,439 Speaker 1: have gone back and at least covered your tracks, and 247 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:38,320 Speaker 1: then he throws the glove out allegedly two miles later. 248 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:40,800 Speaker 1: I'm confused by it because you're right, it looks like 249 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 1: it was a targeted attack in my very unprofessional opinion, 250 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 1: and he looks like he's setting it up to not 251 00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: get caught. But then you leave all this evidence but behind, 252 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 1: Why why would you do all that? 253 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 3: He didn't leave all this evidence behind? 254 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,560 Speaker 2: First of all, I don't know that that glove that 255 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 2: they recovered two miles away has anything to do with anything. 256 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 3: Wow, you're the first person saying yeah, I'm not. 257 00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 2: I am not convinced that that has any any credence 258 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:11,760 Speaker 2: at all to this investigation. Now, the DNA found inside 259 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:15,440 Speaker 2: the home, that's a totally different story. And since we 260 00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 2: do here's what we don't know. We don't know in 261 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:22,760 Speaker 2: what context that DNA was found. Was that DNA semen? 262 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 2: Was it blood? 263 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:28,560 Speaker 3: Was it? Where did it? How did it get there? 264 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 2: And that's critical information because we don't know what the 265 00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 2: crime scene was like, was there was there signs of 266 00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 2: the struggle? 267 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 3: Was he take was she taken from her bed? You know? 268 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:41,960 Speaker 3: Was she sexually assaulted? 269 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,600 Speaker 2: These are things we don't know, but if we had, 270 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 2: if we and this is the type of thing that 271 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 2: they will that they should not tell us. They should 272 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,680 Speaker 2: not tell the public this because this is stuff that 273 00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 2: that only the bad guy and I think there were 274 00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 2: more than one bad guys about. 275 00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:02,680 Speaker 1: Well, why not clean it the blood of the front doorstep. 276 00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: They had another shoes bleeding and it's her, it's her 277 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 1: dna from that blood. 278 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 3: They couldn't have cleaned it up. Couldn't cleaned it up. 279 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 2: I mean you can it would still be there, I 280 00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 2: mean there were still they would they would, you know, 281 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 2: luminol would find it. They don't care. They don't care. 282 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:23,760 Speaker 2: Now you'll notice that he was in no hurry. He wasn't. 283 00:15:23,840 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 2: You're right, he was there a long time. It was 284 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 2: there a long time he was. Now that it is incongruous. 285 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 2: If he knew that that camera was there, why wouldn't 286 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 2: he just bring some spray paint or some or a 287 00:15:36,720 --> 00:15:38,440 Speaker 2: piece of black tape to cover it up? 288 00:15:38,720 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 3: Right? And so that that's that's a little incongruous. I don't. 289 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 3: I'm not sure about that piece. 290 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 2: But he destroyed it, you know, And I believe that 291 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:52,480 Speaker 2: they did that from inside the home. I think that 292 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 2: that whoever was in the back of the house was 293 00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 2: not concerned. 294 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 3: You know, think of this. What is the purpose of. 295 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,840 Speaker 2: Having one of those ring doorbells or nest doorbells? So 296 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 2: you told me right away there, Yeah, right, they weren't 297 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:12,600 Speaker 2: worried about it. Wow, they weren't worried about it. That's interesting. 298 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:14,240 Speaker 2: Why weren't they worried about it? 299 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:17,200 Speaker 1: Did they know there wasn't a subscription? Is that where 300 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 1: we're leading toward? 301 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 2: No, No, I'm not leaning towards that. I'm leaning toward. 302 00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:34,720 Speaker 2: Did they were they able to somehow incapacitate or prior 303 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:40,280 Speaker 2: to entering the home? Wow, that's an interesting angle. I 304 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:41,880 Speaker 2: would not have thought of it. By the way, Lieutenan 305 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:43,400 Speaker 2: Randy Sutton, there's a little bit of a delay on. 306 00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:44,640 Speaker 2: I mean to talk over you if I am, I 307 00:16:44,640 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 2: apologize about that law enforcement for thirty plus years in 308 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 2: Las Vegas and New Jersey. You've seen him on cops, 309 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 2: you've seen him in movies. So you said something a 310 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 2: little while ago that I want to. I want you 311 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 2: to expand upon if you don't mind. Why are you 312 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:57,960 Speaker 2: convinced there's more than one person? Do you think there's 313 00:16:58,000 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 2: somebody in the back door trying to let this guy in? 314 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 2: Do you think there's somebody wedding in the car? Why 315 00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 2: more than one person? I think that there was more 316 00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 2: than one person, because I do believe that there was 317 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 2: somebody in the back of the house, and I also 318 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 2: believe that to transport her required a driver. Now did 319 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:22,119 Speaker 2: did is the driver? Where there are two people or 320 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 2: where there are three? That's my that is my question. 321 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:28,560 Speaker 2: And if there were three, that means that they had 322 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 2: to have a plan for the getaway driver to roll 323 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:35,639 Speaker 2: up at a certain period of time. And that's why 324 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,800 Speaker 2: if if they were if they did not bring cell 325 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:44,080 Speaker 2: phones because they knew that they could be tracked, then 326 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 2: they had to have a real timeline here to know 327 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 2: when the driver was going to come collect you know, 328 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:57,880 Speaker 2: the missus Guthrie and them for their getaway. 329 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:02,399 Speaker 1: Wow, there's so much there. Let me go back to 330 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 1: the camera a second, because I might have misunderstood you. 331 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 1: Did you say that you thought that they had the 332 00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:10,199 Speaker 1: ability possibly to incapacitate the camera or they thought that 333 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:12,359 Speaker 1: she was incapacitated when they got there, so they weren't 334 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:14,639 Speaker 1: worried about it. Do you think that they could have 335 00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:20,360 Speaker 1: I meant incapacitate per okay, because now if they could 336 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:23,359 Speaker 1: have had the ability to incapacitate and incapacitate the camera, 337 00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:25,480 Speaker 1: that would be a technological thing. Or maybe they were 338 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 1: in the circle somehow. What do you make of the 339 00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 1: whole The family is ruled out. But they didn't say 340 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,120 Speaker 1: friends and neighbors and others who knew her are ruled out. 341 00:18:33,280 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 1: They just said the family was ruled out. What do 342 00:18:35,040 --> 00:18:35,439 Speaker 1: you make of that? 343 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 2: Well, the first thing in make of it is that 344 00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:42,360 Speaker 2: the sheriff can't rule out anybody. 345 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:44,240 Speaker 1: I don't care what he says. Oh, he said he 346 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 1: rolled them out like day two. He literally said he 347 00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:49,600 Speaker 1: rolled out everybody day too. Again Randy in some weird 348 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:52,399 Speaker 1: move to cover his ass. Why even say that? Do 349 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:53,399 Speaker 1: you know why he would say that? 350 00:18:55,480 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 2: It is absolutely mind boggling to me, mind boggling. Family. 351 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:07,439 Speaker 2: There has to be a relationship basis in this, in 352 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:10,320 Speaker 2: this attack right there, there is some relationship. It may 353 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 2: be as tenuous as somebody who knew the house or 354 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:16,919 Speaker 2: you know, had worked on the house, or delivered a 355 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:19,719 Speaker 2: package of the house or whatever. But there is some 356 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:25,480 Speaker 2: relationship that that when this is solved, we're going to 357 00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 2: get We're going to get knowledge of that there was 358 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:32,159 Speaker 2: some some relationship. Then now let's look at motives here. 359 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 2: What are the motives for crime like this? Money is 360 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:43,679 Speaker 2: probably number one. Yeah, Revenge is a possibility, lust is 361 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:47,920 Speaker 2: a possibility, Hatred is a possibility. 362 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:49,919 Speaker 3: But it's got to be one of those. There's no 363 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:53,120 Speaker 3: there's there's no other motives. 364 00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 2: I mean, this wasn't hey, you know what, let's go 365 00:19:56,119 --> 00:20:00,520 Speaker 2: kidnap an old lady today that this was done, this 366 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 2: was done for a reason. Well, and this is why 367 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:11,239 Speaker 2: this is such a difficult investigation, because the investigators have 368 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 2: to figure out what the motive is. That's critical to 369 00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:18,120 Speaker 2: discovering who did it. 370 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:21,239 Speaker 1: Randy, can we can we at this point say this 371 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: isn't about money. And here's why I say this again, 372 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 1: I'm a novice. You can correct me anything that I 373 00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:25,600 Speaker 1: say wrong. 374 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 3: Here. 375 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:28,760 Speaker 1: If you got her and want her for ransom, you 376 00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:30,239 Speaker 1: got to show me a sign of life. You got 377 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:31,879 Speaker 1: to show me something. You got to show me that 378 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:34,399 Speaker 1: the commodity is still available. Otherwise why would I send you, 379 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:37,439 Speaker 1: I think they're asking for six million dollars allegedly. Do 380 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 1: you think this is for money? If so, why haven't 381 00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 1: they done something to get the money. 382 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:44,920 Speaker 3: I do not think that this is for money, No, okay, 383 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 3: I don't. 384 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:51,680 Speaker 2: I think the ransom demands were either grown up as 385 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:53,439 Speaker 2: a distraction. 386 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:54,960 Speaker 3: Or you have other people. 387 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:57,679 Speaker 2: Well we know we have other people that are involved 388 00:20:58,080 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 2: in trying to extort money from this family. That one 389 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:05,879 Speaker 2: was arrested, and I really do hope that the investigators 390 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 2: are following every lead when it comes down to the 391 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:15,159 Speaker 2: people that you know contacted TMZ with these a ransom 392 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:17,880 Speaker 2: demand and b the one that says I know who 393 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 2: did it and if you want to know, you better 394 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:20,639 Speaker 2: pay me. 395 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 3: When it's the same amount of money. 396 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 2: That the FBI is offering, you know, it's if this 397 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,040 Speaker 2: is If this was serious, we would have a proof 398 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,359 Speaker 2: of life. There would have been a ransom demand that 399 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:36,120 Speaker 2: was legitimate, and I don't believe that that was ever 400 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:36,639 Speaker 2: the case. 401 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: Nobody is in custody, nobody's being detained right now, but 402 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:42,359 Speaker 1: they have talked to four different people so far, starting 403 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:44,520 Speaker 1: with the delivery driver who decided to do a media 404 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:46,879 Speaker 1: tour afterwards, which is very strange, and he wasn't sure 405 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,440 Speaker 1: if he'd ever delivered to that house. And then you've 406 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:51,399 Speaker 1: got three more people. They've got a range rover that 407 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,159 Speaker 1: they held a tarp over to get something out of 408 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:56,360 Speaker 1: the range rover. Really, in your experience, do you think 409 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: they've already spoken to who they assume might be involved 410 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:00,920 Speaker 1: in this all the they don't have enough to hold 411 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 1: him or her. 412 00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:09,560 Speaker 2: It's possible. It's possible now considering the land rover. Glad 413 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,719 Speaker 2: you brought that up. So they were able to obtain 414 00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 2: search warrants on two different occasions, now right. The first 415 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 2: one was the delivery driver that was apparently not connected 416 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:25,720 Speaker 2: in any way. The second we we don't really know 417 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,600 Speaker 2: what that relationship was or is, but we do know 418 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,919 Speaker 2: that they did the They did a search warrant at 419 00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 2: the house and also on this vehicle, and they seized 420 00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,960 Speaker 2: the vehicle. Now that's telling to me because that means 421 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 2: they found something in there that they wanted to either 422 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:48,439 Speaker 2: process or they wanted to do a search in a 423 00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:49,760 Speaker 2: controlled environment. 424 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 3: That's not the usual way this is done. 425 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 2: If they had cleared that individual of anything at the scene, 426 00:22:57,640 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 2: they wouldn't have done that. 427 00:22:58,640 --> 00:22:59,920 Speaker 3: They seized the vehicle. 428 00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:03,040 Speaker 1: Well, they would, they would, They would be probable cause 429 00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 1: on a warrant to seize the vehicle. 430 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:11,280 Speaker 2: Right, correct, correct, And you Now here's the other here's 431 00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,600 Speaker 2: the This could be part of the issue. They might 432 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:18,640 Speaker 2: have found something in the vehicle that is totally unrelated 433 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:21,480 Speaker 2: but was illegal. They could have found drug while there, 434 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:23,800 Speaker 2: they could have found stolen property, you. 435 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:27,120 Speaker 3: Know how you think about that. Yeah, there's there's so. 436 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 2: Many avenues here Joe that that we we we just 437 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:32,640 Speaker 2: don't know the answers to her. 438 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,159 Speaker 3: And so you know, this is like, this is like 439 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,800 Speaker 3: that what was that game clue? Yes? Right? Was this? Like? Yeah, 440 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:42,800 Speaker 3: that's what this is like. It's like real life clue. 441 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: At showing our age that we know we know the 442 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:46,359 Speaker 1: game clue. A lot of people watching are going, I 443 00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 1: don't know what clue is? What are they talking about? 444 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:49,920 Speaker 1: It could have been Colonel Mustard in the in the 445 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:53,119 Speaker 1: den with the with the candlestick. All right, it's our 446 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:56,159 Speaker 1: Rady Sutton, a former lieutenant he's retired now founder the 447 00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:58,199 Speaker 1: Wounded Blue but the Wunded Blue dot org. Let me ask 448 00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 1: you about the Walmart connection. When you go into Walmart, 449 00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: a some dude greet you or at some lady B. 450 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 1: You're on video constantly, you walk in, you're on video. 451 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: They know who went there, they know who shopped. I 452 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:11,360 Speaker 1: would assume that this part, again maybe a bad assumption, 453 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: but I would assume you go to Walmart and you 454 00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:15,840 Speaker 1: get the backpack that's available there, you get the jacket 455 00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: that's available there, you get the gloves that are available there, 456 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 1: you get the ski mask that's available there, and you 457 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:22,520 Speaker 1: probably buy them all at once and then leave unless 458 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: they're so you know, nefarious that they decided let me 459 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 1: go to several different Walmarts and get all these items. 460 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:28,080 Speaker 3: Do you think that. 461 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:32,159 Speaker 1: There's a huge investigatory action being taken with Walmart that 462 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:32,920 Speaker 1: we aren't privy to. 463 00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,520 Speaker 3: There has to be right, absolutely not. 464 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,800 Speaker 2: This is a huge This is a huge clue, but 465 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:47,640 Speaker 2: it also requires an incredible amount of manpower to investigate this. Right, 466 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:51,960 Speaker 2: every store in the Tucson area is going it has 467 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 2: been There's no doubt in my mind, it's already it's 468 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 2: already been done, has been contacted. They're getting the footage 469 00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 2: of their cameras, looking at receipts, they're looking at their 470 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:08,359 Speaker 2: their questioning, they're questioning. You know, the clerks that that 471 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 2: and and at the same time, you'll I saw an 472 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,200 Speaker 2: interview with a gunshot owner a couple of days ago, 473 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:19,840 Speaker 2: and he said that the FBI was in showing them 474 00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:23,400 Speaker 2: pictures of asking about these individuals. 475 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 3: So they they're they're they're following every lead. 476 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,280 Speaker 2: But you know, they have I think they got something 477 00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:34,600 Speaker 2: like twenty five thousand emails, phone calls, et cetera. And 478 00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 2: even if you have four hundred agents there, it requires 479 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,960 Speaker 2: a massive amount of crime. And this once again, you know, 480 00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:47,480 Speaker 2: we're we're a society that that that expects instantaneous gratification. 481 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 2: We're so used to seeing you know, the the the 482 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 2: episodes on TV and in the movies where they solve 483 00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 2: the crimes in forty eight hours or you know, a 484 00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:03,040 Speaker 2: two hour time period, and that isn't reality. That's not 485 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:06,160 Speaker 2: It's great when it does happen, you know, but this 486 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:09,080 Speaker 2: is a this is a planned event. This isn't a 487 00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:12,440 Speaker 2: crime of passion. Most of the most of the murders 488 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 2: that take place, most of the crimes of violence that 489 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:19,679 Speaker 2: take place, they happen at at because of rage. It 490 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 2: happens because of a relationship, and so they're much easier 491 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 2: to solve like that. 492 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 3: This isn't that case. This is right, This is a 493 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:31,080 Speaker 3: true who done it and. 494 00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: Have ready a law order. We solve it in an hour. 495 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 1: In one hour, you can solve the case on the 496 00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:37,880 Speaker 1: law and order before you went out of time. 497 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:38,040 Speaker 3: Gun. 498 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,400 Speaker 1: Let me let me ask you about the gun. I'm 499 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 1: a gun carrier. I've got five guns not far from 500 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 1: where I'm sitting right now. I would never, ever, ever, 501 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,000 Speaker 1: never carry a gun like that guy was carrying it 502 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:49,000 Speaker 1: that day. That whole store is available at Walmart. To 503 00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 1: imagine that, I don't know if the gun that he 504 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:52,960 Speaker 1: had is available at Walmart or not know that some 505 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,280 Speaker 1: Walmarts do sell firearms. But having said that, the way 506 00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:58,760 Speaker 1: he's he's carrying the gun, does that tell you anything 507 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:00,679 Speaker 1: about who this guy is. I mean, nobody who's like 508 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,439 Speaker 1: a Second Amendment guy or gal is going to. 509 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:04,040 Speaker 3: Carry like that. 510 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 1: It's dangerous, it's stupid, it doesn't make any sense. 511 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:09,560 Speaker 3: Okay. 512 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 2: So I spoke with some sources down in that area, 513 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:18,760 Speaker 2: sources familiar with the Cartels, and believe it or not, 514 00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:22,680 Speaker 2: there is a term for that type of carrying a 515 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,040 Speaker 2: reality with the Cartels, they called a Mexican carry. 516 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 1: I had no idea. So you think this guy's a 517 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,159 Speaker 1: cartel guy. Wouldn't they be more sophisticated than this and 518 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:32,240 Speaker 1: try to get the ransom? 519 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:40,000 Speaker 2: Then consider this possibility. Okay, consider that this was hired out, 520 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:44,600 Speaker 2: This wasn't done by the person who planned it. Okay, 521 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:49,200 Speaker 2: this is considered that this Where would you find someone 522 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:53,480 Speaker 2: who has done kidnappings in the past and has no conscience? 523 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:55,879 Speaker 1: I would guess at the cartel levels. 524 00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:01,880 Speaker 2: You would guess at the cartel level experienced kidnappers. They've 525 00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,560 Speaker 2: done this, they do they're doing There's a number of 526 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:07,200 Speaker 2: these that have taken place in Phoenix, by the way, 527 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 2: that you don't hear about, but there their their ransom 528 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 2: demands for for illegal aliens that that that they get 529 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 2: from their families in Mexico. 530 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:20,400 Speaker 3: So they have experienced doing this. 531 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,080 Speaker 2: And if you look at it, if you look at 532 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 2: the way this individual mood, if you looked at his legs, 533 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:34,120 Speaker 2: he was bow legging, yes, and or he had right 534 00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 2: and uh I I fully I fully keep in in 535 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 2: the context of this situation that that he might have 536 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:49,000 Speaker 2: come from south of the border, which would would be 537 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,080 Speaker 2: a big plus for not having his d n A 538 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 2: in codis uh and he was high. 539 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,160 Speaker 3: This was hired out. I I fully believe this is 540 00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:00,720 Speaker 3: hired out. 541 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: If he shot the gun well inside, because you know, 542 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 1: we we know that she was injured. If he shot 543 00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: the gun well inside, would they have released that to 544 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: the public. Would we know that if he if he 545 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: shot the gun, so they wouldn't he wouldn't. 546 00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 2: No, But there's no reason to shoot her. There's no 547 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:21,920 Speaker 2: reason to shoot her. She's wanting four years old. Well, 548 00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 2: but why do you have the gun controllable? Well, then 549 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 2: why do you have the gun? You know what I mean? 550 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 3: Fear fear intimidation. Okay, makes sense. And and remember. 551 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:40,400 Speaker 2: You can have all the planning in the world, there 552 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:44,520 Speaker 2: could always be that occurrence where Hm, a sheriff's vehicle 553 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,280 Speaker 2: just happened to drive by and notice something and make 554 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 2: a vehicle stop, right, So you have to plan for 555 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 2: any eventuality when you're committing a major felony crime like this, 556 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:01,520 Speaker 2: and and and uh, you know this is at the 557 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 2: end of the day, we still have an eighty four 558 00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:07,760 Speaker 2: year old woman, the mother of of these of these people, 559 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 2: who is who has been taken and we have we 560 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:17,160 Speaker 2: have to you know, think of the humanity here, the 561 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:20,840 Speaker 2: terror that this poor woman went through. I mean, think 562 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:24,520 Speaker 2: about that, that that creature walking in on you in 563 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 2: the middle of the night, and I just it sends 564 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,760 Speaker 2: shutters down my my heart. 565 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 3: That what she. 566 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,880 Speaker 2: What she went through that night, and I pray that 567 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:38,719 Speaker 2: she is alive. 568 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:41,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, me too. I don't believe that's the case. But 569 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:48,880 Speaker 3: you know, Hope springs eternal. I'm with you. Yeah. Yeah. 570 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,959 Speaker 2: And it was, you know, seeing the seeing the the 571 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 2: Guthrie family and the pain on their faces and they're 572 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 2: you know, the the pleas if you have any any 573 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 2: you madity in you at all, you know, you have 574 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,480 Speaker 2: to feel sorry for these people and what they're going through. 575 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:10,520 Speaker 2: I've seen, you know, Joe, I've seen so many crime 576 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 2: victims over my years. I've seen the desperation. I've seen 577 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:18,440 Speaker 2: the heartache. And you know, this is one of the 578 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:20,880 Speaker 2: reasons that I do what I do with the with 579 00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:24,960 Speaker 2: the Wounded Blue because officers are feeling it too. You know, 580 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:27,360 Speaker 2: there's there's gonna be a lot of a lot of 581 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 2: post traumatic stress that revolves around this case. 582 00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 3: And is the is the website by the way, go ahead? 583 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:39,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, So anyway, we're I'll be down back in Tucson 584 00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:43,520 Speaker 2: this weekend covering it once again and let's hope that 585 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 2: that they get the major break in the case and 586 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 2: they are able to bring someone to justice for this. 587 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 1: We're all hoping for absolutely, And I couldn't agree with 588 00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:55,240 Speaker 1: you more. My viewers, my listeners, they all agree with 589 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:56,640 Speaker 1: you as well. Let me ask you one last question. 590 00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:58,760 Speaker 1: I'll let you go and thank you for coming back 591 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:02,160 Speaker 1: on your knowledge. Is is so amazing the DNA stuff, 592 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:04,520 Speaker 1: because again, we're in a DNA you know, way of life. 593 00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 1: We think, hey, you got the DNA, you got the guy. 594 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,480 Speaker 1: It turns out, as you said, not in codis he's 595 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 1: not in the in the the the crime index that 596 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:13,600 Speaker 1: we keep here in the United States, that that that 597 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,320 Speaker 1: the FBI has. Could be a cartel connection, could be 598 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,480 Speaker 1: a foreign guy, that could be somebody who's never done 599 00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 1: anything before. But I think you and I would agree 600 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 1: that's probably not the case. Having said all of that, 601 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:24,960 Speaker 1: what can they glean from the DNA, because they're talking 602 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,440 Speaker 1: about genealogy, so they could tell where the guy's from, 603 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 1: what his ethnicity is, what his nationality might be, you know, 604 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:32,840 Speaker 1: what his ancestry is, certainly, but do we do we 605 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:34,720 Speaker 1: have any other way that I'm not aware of to 606 00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:38,200 Speaker 1: find out a closer proximity of who this guy might 607 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:39,440 Speaker 1: be just from the DNA. 608 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,840 Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, absolutely, and that way is through familial DNA 609 00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:48,720 Speaker 2: and they're they're actively searching for this. 610 00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 3: Now. 611 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 2: You know, there's all those sites out there where people 612 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:57,160 Speaker 2: want to know about their their origins, their uh, their ancestry, 613 00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 2: et cetera. Yeah, so there's a budget of data bases 614 00:33:00,520 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 2: out there. 615 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 3: Now. 616 00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:05,880 Speaker 2: Some of them will cooperate with law enforcement, some of 617 00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 2: them won't. You know, it's a they they're walking an 618 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,920 Speaker 2: interesting tight rope there, yes, but you know it's the 619 00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 2: way they solve the Coldberger case, right or you know 620 00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 2: the way they arrested Coldburger. 621 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:20,040 Speaker 3: So yeah, there there are avenues. 622 00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,520 Speaker 2: I'm absolutely one hundred percent sure that that is being 623 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,920 Speaker 2: pursued right now as we speak. That's a longer process, 624 00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:33,080 Speaker 2: of course, but it is. It's a valid process. So 625 00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:35,840 Speaker 2: the answer to that question is yes. 626 00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:38,680 Speaker 1: Ready to listen again. The knowledge is key and it's 627 00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:41,080 Speaker 1: amazing every time. Go and support this great organization. He 628 00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:43,960 Speaker 1: runs the Wounded Blue Dot organ is Lieutenant Randy Sutton retired. 629 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 1: Just just great to have the knowledge. Keep up the 630 00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,200 Speaker 1: great work. We're watching you on the big network television 631 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:50,480 Speaker 1: as well. And thank you for your friendship. I appreciate you. 632 00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:54,800 Speaker 2: And if you would tune into my podcast it's called 633 00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:58,440 Speaker 2: The Cops Life and that is everywhere too. And my 634 00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:01,520 Speaker 2: new my new book just came out, Rescuing nine to 635 00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:03,720 Speaker 2: one one, The Fight for America's Safety. 636 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,480 Speaker 3: I love it. I booked that. I wish every every 637 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:08,920 Speaker 3: American would read. Say the name of the the name 638 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:13,000 Speaker 3: of the book again, rescuing nine one one, The Fight 639 00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,279 Speaker 3: for America's Safety, Go and get it. 640 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,279 Speaker 1: We'll spend more time on that next time we speak 641 00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:19,040 Speaker 1: as well. Randy, thanks for the time of the access. 642 00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:22,959 Speaker 3: My pleasure. Jokes always great to do your show. 643 00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:24,759 Speaker 1: All right, brother, we'll talk very soon. That's it for 644 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:27,239 Speaker 1: this one. I'm shaken and unafraid with Joe Pegs. Make 645 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:29,359 Speaker 1: sure you subscribe. We'll drop another one very soon.