1 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:03,520 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:12,040 Speaker 2: Welcome to the Entangling Prayer Podcast. I'm Rachel Wojo, and 3 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:17,200 Speaker 2: each week we unravel life's notts through prayer. Here you'll 4 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 2: find practical wisdom and prayer encouragement to guide you through 5 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:26,439 Speaker 2: life's hardest seasons. Join me as we untangle life's messes together, 6 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:34,680 Speaker 2: one prayer at a time. Well, hey there, I'm Rachel, 7 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:37,279 Speaker 2: and I'm so glad you have joined us today. I 8 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:39,639 Speaker 2: have to tell you I've been looking forward to this 9 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 2: conversation all week. With Mother's Day around the corner, I 10 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:48,720 Speaker 2: wanted to sit down with someone who understands that life 11 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:53,560 Speaker 2: is not always easy as a mama, and who would 12 00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 2: be willing to share what it's like to miss a 13 00:00:56,440 --> 00:01:01,040 Speaker 2: child and to even as a Christian, struggle in your 14 00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:05,360 Speaker 2: prayer life when life has gotten hard. And so I'm 15 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 2: just so honored. My guest today is Jenny LESCo and 16 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:13,319 Speaker 2: she's an author, a pastor's wife, and a mama with 17 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:17,279 Speaker 2: a house full of kiddos and one in heaven. So, Jenny, 18 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 2: thank you so much for being here today. I'm really 19 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:23,520 Speaker 2: honored that you would come and share on a Tangling Prayer. 20 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:26,320 Speaker 1: Yes, Rachel, thank you so much for having me it's 21 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 1: really it's my honor to get to be here and 22 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 1: have a conversation and just see where God leads us today. 23 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 1: I'm so grateful. 24 00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:39,839 Speaker 2: Yeah, before we talk about too much, because I'm sure 25 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 2: that we will talk about a lot, I wondered if 26 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 2: you would be willing to share a little bit about 27 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 2: your precious daughter. 28 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: I know that for me when people ask me. 29 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 2: About Taylor, I get kind of excited because as time passes, 30 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 2: as at marches on past the loss of a child 31 00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:05,800 Speaker 2: sometimes so you don't get asked as often, and it 32 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 2: kind of stirs up a joy in me because I 33 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:13,520 Speaker 2: remember those pigtails, or I remember that little giggle, and 34 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 2: it's precious. So would you share a little bit about 35 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 2: And I want to make sure I'm saying the name right. 36 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:23,520 Speaker 2: It's it's Lenya. Yes, yes, Lenya, Yes. 37 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 1: You're so right. I think. Well, it's been thirteen years 38 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 1: now since she went to heaven. She was five years old, 39 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:35,280 Speaker 1: and it is it's like there are the people in 40 00:02:35,320 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 1: your life who know and who will just say something like, 41 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 1: oh my gosh, I remember when Lenny did this, like 42 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 1: and though that's always such a sweet thing, but then 43 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:48,600 Speaker 1: there's people who don't, who don't never met her, and 44 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 1: as time goes on, it's like, oh, I don't get 45 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: to describe her as as much as I would want to, 46 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: but thank you for asking. 47 00:02:57,919 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 2: Uh. 48 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:02,000 Speaker 1: Elenya Avery LESCo. So she was five years old when 49 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:06,640 Speaker 1: she went to heaven and she died of an asthma 50 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: attack five days before Christmas in twenty twelve. And she 51 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:17,160 Speaker 1: was the spunkiest of our family in the sense that 52 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:22,080 Speaker 1: she was probably the most naughty and the most stubborn, 53 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 1: but also just so much personality and funny and just 54 00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 1: a sweetheart and loved ballet and loved our church. My 55 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:41,839 Speaker 1: husband and I planted a church almost twenty years ago, 56 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 1: and she was very much just loved being part of 57 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 1: the church and inviting people to church. And it's sweet 58 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 1: because the week that she went to heaven was the 59 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: week before Christmas, and she had her cute little gray 60 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 1: purse that had her Bible in it and invites to 61 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 1: Fresh Life Christmas, our Christmas gathering, and she was always like, Mom, 62 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:10,160 Speaker 1: you got to invite that person. Mom, you forgot to 63 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: invite that person. And it's just one of the things 64 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 1: that I always think about and is a good reminder 65 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:17,159 Speaker 1: for me when I kind of get in my zone 66 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 1: and I'm just trying to run around doing all the 67 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 1: things to just stop and be present and to say 68 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: hi to someone and to invite someone to church or 69 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 1: see how someone's doing. And so yeah, Lenya Avery. 70 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:39,040 Speaker 2: Sweet, I read your husband's book years ago where he 71 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:42,480 Speaker 2: talks about much of her life and describes so much 72 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 2: of what happened in your lives. But I know, as 73 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:50,679 Speaker 2: a mom our perspective, of course, as parents is different. 74 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:56,279 Speaker 2: Father's perspective and mother's perspective is different. And then individually 75 00:04:56,360 --> 00:05:01,039 Speaker 2: we all experience grief in different way ways. And so 76 00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 2: when it comes to grief and your prayer life, how 77 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 2: was that during that time? I don't want to put 78 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:16,080 Speaker 2: words in your mouth, but could you even find words 79 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 2: to pray after your daughter went to happen? 80 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:26,760 Speaker 1: Yes? Yes, and no. And I think the journey of 81 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:30,039 Speaker 1: that even now, like learning, what does it look like 82 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:33,440 Speaker 1: to pray? I think I'm hopefully we'll always be learning, 83 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 1: but hopefully we'll also always be growing in it. But 84 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 1: I think that immediately after, well within the timeframe of 85 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: her being unconscious and Levy doing CPR and all of that, 86 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I was just like, I don't even know 87 00:05:57,240 --> 00:05:59,240 Speaker 1: the words I was saying. I was just crying out 88 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 1: and crying out to God for help and God heal 89 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:08,080 Speaker 1: her and Lord, and I didn't, ah, I don't even know. 90 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:14,920 Speaker 1: And then when when she did go to heaven, Levi 91 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 1: and I both were standing there next to her in 92 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:29,279 Speaker 1: the hospital room, and our response was, Lord, you gave 93 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 1: us Lenya, and we dedicated her to you, and we 94 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: give her back to you, and you give and you 95 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,400 Speaker 1: take away, and we bless your name. And that was 96 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 1: kind of like a like an instinctive like, Okay, I 97 00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: don't We're in shock, We're we hate this, what is 98 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 1: going what is even going on? We're praying that God 99 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 1: would raise her from the dead also, and that was 100 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 1: kind of like our our guttural cry. And then from 101 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:10,800 Speaker 1: there forward it was very much like confused prayers and 102 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: not knowing, like you said, not knowing what to say, 103 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 1: not knowing what to pray, not hating it, and learning. 104 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 1: And I think all throughout the process Levi and I 105 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 1: both and we weren't perfectly on the same grief wavelength 106 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 1: the whole time. Like there would be times that he 107 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:36,440 Speaker 1: would be like good and I would be down and 108 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 1: he would be down and I would be up and 109 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 1: and we would fight, and it would was hard, and 110 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: you know, but I think just the whole doing it together, 111 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:51,559 Speaker 1: even if we weren't on the same wavelength, was life 112 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 1: saving and we needed each other. So I think even 113 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: just going back and forth between each other and our 114 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 1: responses and where we were at, as well as leading 115 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 1: a church which was complex in its own right, but 116 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:17,600 Speaker 1: also we were learning, and Levi was preaching through and 117 00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:21,800 Speaker 1: we were learning about heaven and what happens to our 118 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 1: spirit when our bodies are alive any you know, it's 119 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: like so with our church, and I'm so grateful that 120 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 1: our church was with us for the ride as well, 121 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:38,960 Speaker 1: and the highs and the lows and the good and 122 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:42,320 Speaker 1: the hard and just learning together and being planted together 123 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:46,319 Speaker 1: and not knowing what to pray, not knowing what to say, 124 00:08:46,360 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 1: but then people texting randomly and the church coming in 125 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: and praying on our behalf like and I think that's 126 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:56,880 Speaker 1: part of the beauty of the Body of Christ and 127 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:59,240 Speaker 1: why we need each other, is like we're not always 128 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 1: going to know what to pray, and we're not always 129 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:03,080 Speaker 1: going to feel like praying, and we're not going to 130 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,200 Speaker 1: always feel like even a Christian because it's like, what 131 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 1: is all the doubts, all the questions, all the things, 132 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 1: and yet then there are people who are planted alongside us, 133 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 1: who are near us, who are praying for us, who 134 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 1: are strong for us, who are helping us find our 135 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: bearings in the deepest, darkest, most horrible waters. And so 136 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 1: I feel like, yes, there there. For me personally, there 137 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 1: were definitely times where it just felt silent. I was silent, 138 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 1: and I felt like God was silent, And so I 139 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: think navigating that like Okay, what do you do? And 140 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 1: you feel like God's not speaking to you or there, 141 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 1: or you don't know what to say to him, and 142 00:09:55,160 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 1: it kind of feels like an awkward silence. Yeah, I 143 00:10:00,559 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: know that. 144 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 2: For me, I went through a lot of anger, maybe 145 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: not initially, when I lost my daughter Taylor. I think 146 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:13,640 Speaker 2: our situations mine and yours are very different from one 147 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 2: another in that you almost had no warning. Even though 148 00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:23,120 Speaker 2: she had the aisthmatic condition, you did not know that 149 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:27,920 Speaker 2: that would be the day. And in my situation, my 150 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:32,559 Speaker 2: daughter had a neurologically degenerative disease and was diagnosed at 151 00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 2: the age of four, with a lifespan of ten to 152 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 2: fifteen years, so to live with her for twenty two 153 00:10:38,640 --> 00:10:43,199 Speaker 2: years was a very special blessing and opportunity. But at 154 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 2: the same time, to watch her go from being able 155 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:51,199 Speaker 2: to call me mommy and sing songs and feed herself 156 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:58,679 Speaker 2: to being completely bedridden and unable to talk is you know, 157 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 2: that was a long journey. And so when I look 158 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:04,959 Speaker 2: at your journey and then my journey, two very different 159 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 2: paths to losing a child, I think I had a 160 00:11:10,679 --> 00:11:16,320 Speaker 2: lot of anger that didn't surface until a little while 161 00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:20,760 Speaker 2: after I began to process that Taylor was in heaven, 162 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:25,360 Speaker 2: and some of that anger I think resulted in some 163 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 2: pretty hefty conversations between the Lord and I. But I 164 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:36,720 Speaker 2: look back now, you know, almost seven years later, and say, wow, 165 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:41,640 Speaker 2: those were probably some of the most honest conversations that 166 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:44,600 Speaker 2: God and I had together. And then I think there's 167 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 2: the opposite side of that where you just feel like 168 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 2: what you just described, where neither you feel like you 169 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:55,960 Speaker 2: wonder if God is near and you wonder what words 170 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 2: you have to say to him whether he's near or not. 171 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:05,400 Speaker 2: Be so challenging. As we look at a shift, do 172 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:10,560 Speaker 2: you remember something happening that sort of changed that did 173 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 2: it go from feeling like something really impossible to have 174 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 2: conversations with God to just you know, changing on a dime, 175 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:22,200 Speaker 2: or do you think it was more gradual and God 176 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:25,199 Speaker 2: just continually working in your heart? 177 00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:30,079 Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like that second one, just the gradual. 178 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:36,960 Speaker 1: It's so interesting because when you're so near death like 179 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:41,000 Speaker 1: that and so near grief and so just like I 180 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:45,079 Speaker 1: know it's been said, like the veil between this life 181 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:47,319 Speaker 1: and the next life is so thin, and you can 182 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:51,880 Speaker 1: just it's almost like you can feel God's presence in 183 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:57,440 Speaker 1: such a deeper way and nearer way, and like the 184 00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 1: Bible says that He's near to the broken hearted, and 185 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 1: we experienced that, like you you experience his presence, you 186 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:09,840 Speaker 1: experience his kindness, and in the midst of such tragedy, 187 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: like you can you know that He loves you and 188 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: you you whether it's excuse me, whether it's someone coming 189 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: and speaking life over you and saying like hey, God 190 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:28,080 Speaker 1: wants me to tell you that you're not alone, or 191 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:33,560 Speaker 1: a text, a simple text or whatever. Like I just 192 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:39,080 Speaker 1: I felt God's nearness so tangibly, and even looking back 193 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:43,200 Speaker 1: at pictures like that week, I mean, we had family 194 00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:49,199 Speaker 1: coming in town for the funeral, and her funeral was 195 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 1: in celebration of life. Was the day after Christmas, and 196 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:54,720 Speaker 1: that was the day that we were supposed to be 197 00:13:54,840 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 1: going on our family Christmas trip to Disneyland, and and 198 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 1: so like, there was just so much happening, and like, 199 00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 1: I know, you understand, like you just feel like you're 200 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,560 Speaker 1: in a cloud like and I feel like, for a 201 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 1: few years, I just felt the way I felt foggy. 202 00:14:17,160 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 1: I felt cloudy. I felt like I'm just trying to 203 00:14:21,680 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: live in each moment and I'm trying to do my 204 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 1: best to love my family. I still had Olivia, who 205 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 1: was seven at the time Lenny went to have an 206 00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:37,320 Speaker 1: ant h five Livy, our oldest was seven, Daisy was 207 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 1: two and a half, and Clover was almost one. And 208 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 1: so when you have other kids that you have to 209 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:48,000 Speaker 1: still show up for, I have my husband. I still 210 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:52,960 Speaker 1: need to love and be there for it. Like it 211 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 1: was so helpful to still need to show up, because 212 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:00,520 Speaker 1: I feel like if it was just me, it would 213 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:04,320 Speaker 1: have been so easy to to just kind of slink 214 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:08,800 Speaker 1: down and slink back and fade out. I feel like, 215 00:15:09,040 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 1: but I had to feed Clover, I had to feed Daisy, 216 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 1: I had to hug and love Olivia. I had to 217 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 1: like I had to do these things, and whether I 218 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: felt like doing those things or not, I still had 219 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 1: to do them. But I felt like within the cloud 220 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,400 Speaker 1: of grief, I was act. I was acting and reacting 221 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 1: and living and moving, but it just felt like almost 222 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 1: slow motion. Yeah, and I I'm so grateful that in 223 00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 1: the in the heartbreak and the heartache of those initial 224 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 1: weeks and initial days, like God was so faithful. But 225 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: like what I was trying to say, I was looking 226 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 1: back at pictures of like me with Levi and the 227 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: kids and us like smiling and laughing or videos, and 228 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: it's like, how on earth where we like that when 229 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:03,000 Speaker 1: and our daughter just died? Like I don't even understand. 230 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 1: And I think the Bible so perfectly describes that when 231 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:10,160 Speaker 1: it says that He gives us peace that passes understanding, 232 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:14,240 Speaker 1: Like we didn't understand it then we still don't understand 233 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 1: it now that He is so near and so close 234 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:20,600 Speaker 1: and so loves us and is so tender in our 235 00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:28,320 Speaker 1: in our trauma that he can he can make that 236 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 1: ache and that pain possible, but it's not understandable, and 237 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 1: so it's just it's I feel like there is such 238 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 1: a confusion but also peace in the middle of it all, 239 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 1: like I feel like, no matter what I feel like, 240 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 1: I describe grief as just weird, because there's no way 241 00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:55,760 Speaker 1: to fully describe it, fully understand it, and there's highs 242 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: and lows and ups and downs and backs, back and 243 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 1: forth and all the thing, and there's just it's just indescribable. 244 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:08,280 Speaker 1: But to answer your question, I feel like it was 245 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:11,879 Speaker 1: a gradual kind of like coming out of that fog. 246 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:15,879 Speaker 1: And I do remember, and I think I wrote it 247 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,600 Speaker 1: in my journal. I do remember describing like I feel 248 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 1: like the fog has lifted, or like I'm coming out 249 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:26,880 Speaker 1: of the fog, and I feel like I can see 250 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:30,360 Speaker 1: a little bit more clearly. I still don't fully understand, 251 00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: which I don't think we ever will until we're in 252 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 1: heaven and we see Jesus face to face And even then, 253 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:39,639 Speaker 1: the more I think about it and consider it, I 254 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:43,160 Speaker 1: feel like, even then I think all of that grief 255 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 1: will melt away because we'll be in his presence and 256 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: it'll seem like such a tiny part of our life 257 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:56,879 Speaker 1: and then we're just with Him, and so I don't know. 258 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 1: I just see even now Star build him, healing and 259 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:12,639 Speaker 1: restoring and beautifying and making sense of things that didn't 260 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:16,920 Speaker 1: always make sense, and also helping me be okay with 261 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 1: not knowing, and helping me be okay with trusting him 262 00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:29,040 Speaker 1: and loving him and glorifying him when I don't understand. 263 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:31,160 Speaker 1: And I think that has been one of the dearest 264 00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:36,399 Speaker 1: things has been. Okay, God, I don't understand, and I won't, 265 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:40,360 Speaker 1: but I trust you, and I trust that you are 266 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:44,199 Speaker 1: good and that you are God, and that in the 267 00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 1: pain and in the heartache and in the grief and 268 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: in the horrible dark things, that you have a plan 269 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,200 Speaker 1: and you are good, and you love me and you're 270 00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 1: my shepherd. And so I feel like it has all 271 00:18:58,600 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 1: been so gradual. 272 00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:06,119 Speaker 2: I would agree one hundred percent. I'm thinking about some 273 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 2: of the moms who will be listening to this and 274 00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 2: agreeing with you about the fog and how it just 275 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:17,320 Speaker 2: doesn't all fit in a neat, tidy little box, and 276 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:23,320 Speaker 2: that there is a mystery to trusting God, that mystery 277 00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:27,919 Speaker 2: of accepting that you won't understand everything, probably not on 278 00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:33,200 Speaker 2: this side of heaven, and that in that mystery you're 279 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 2: trusting that the next life has to be more than 280 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 2: what we can even imagine. I was thinking about that 281 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:47,199 Speaker 2: mama who is listening to this discussion, this conversation, and 282 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 2: she's saying, I'm still in the middle of that fog. 283 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 2: I haven't gotten to the place where I can feel 284 00:19:55,320 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 2: more than just a day at a time. What advice 285 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,959 Speaker 2: would you have for that woman, Because I know that 286 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:05,600 Speaker 2: you've written this amazing book it's called Fight to Flourish, 287 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:12,520 Speaker 2: And I think that it's so easy to settle into 288 00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:18,600 Speaker 2: a survival mode when you're in that season of horrible 289 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:22,480 Speaker 2: grief and sorrow of trying to understand the mystery. And 290 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 2: so what is your advice to that woman who's listening 291 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:29,520 Speaker 2: right now, who says, man, I sure I want to thrive, 292 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,200 Speaker 2: but I feel like I'm barely surviving. 293 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I totally understand, and I've been there, and 294 00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:44,080 Speaker 1: I know that, especially in the beginning days and the 295 00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:50,120 Speaker 1: beginning years, like I would hear people who would say like, oh, 296 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:53,040 Speaker 1: I'm so sorry my son has been in heaven for 297 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:56,960 Speaker 1: twenty five years or even ten years or five years, 298 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:02,640 Speaker 1: like I could not even them or comprehend like that 299 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:06,920 Speaker 1: amount of time going by without Lenya, and I hated it, 300 00:21:07,119 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 1: and I was angry, and and as as Levi and 301 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:15,160 Speaker 1: I were learning and growing, like we we we learned 302 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: that God is also mad at death. And it was 303 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: so helpful to like, when Jesus was at Lazarus's grave 304 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:29,800 Speaker 1: and he was gonna raise him back to life, he 305 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:35,560 Speaker 1: it said that he he like sighed and like kind 306 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 1: of like roared in his spirit, and the the idea 307 00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,359 Speaker 1: of that in that language was that it was like 308 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 1: a horse and angry horse like like uh tapping on 309 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: the ground with his hoofs and just like that idea 310 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 1: like I hate death and this was not the original plan. 311 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:59,639 Speaker 1: And and so that was so helpful for us to 312 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 1: have that frame of reference and to know that, Okay, 313 00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:05,399 Speaker 1: God isn't like, this isn't me, this isn't us against God. 314 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:09,640 Speaker 1: God is with us and mad at this. This wasn't 315 00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 1: his design. But he's not only mad at it. He 316 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:17,199 Speaker 1: is he has the plan and the power to be 317 00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:19,359 Speaker 1: with us and get us through this. And the fact 318 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:24,879 Speaker 1: that Jesus lived and died and rose from the dead 319 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:27,040 Speaker 1: like that this is the kind of power we're talking 320 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: about of being able to face the things that we're 321 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:35,760 Speaker 1: in and speaking specifically to that woman who who is 322 00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:40,920 Speaker 1: still very much grieving and hurting and in the fog 323 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:45,160 Speaker 1: and in the pain, I would just say that God 324 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 1: is with you right here, and yes, I believe that 325 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:52,159 Speaker 1: there is going to come a day where God is 326 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 1: going to have healed you and brought you to a 327 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:59,719 Speaker 1: place of wholeness where you can see and be like, 328 00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:02,240 Speaker 1: look above the It's like when you're on a plane 329 00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 1: and you're flying through the fog, but then all of 330 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 1: a sudden you come up above it and you see 331 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:11,680 Speaker 1: the blue skies and the sunshine and you're above the fog. 332 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 1: Like I believe because I experience this, and I believe 333 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:18,400 Speaker 1: this is what God has for you, is that as 334 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:21,160 Speaker 1: you keep trusting Him, there will come a day where 335 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 1: you will experience that. And it seems impossible now, but 336 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:28,639 Speaker 1: I do love that the Bible says that with God, 337 00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:32,960 Speaker 1: all things are possible. So it's the impossibilities that we're 338 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:38,679 Speaker 1: facing now that you're facing. Now. God has something so 339 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 1: stunning and so beautiful to overcome that impossibility. But I 340 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: will say that right here and right now, while you 341 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,120 Speaker 1: do want to be in a place where you're thriving, 342 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 1: and where you do want to be in a place 343 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:57,840 Speaker 1: where you're helping others or not so much in this yourself, 344 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 1: I will say that there are are some beautiful things 345 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,640 Speaker 1: that God has for you right here and now as 346 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: you're in this fog. And I think that this was 347 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: something that God was showing me and something that I 348 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 1: wrote about in that book, the fight to flourish, And 349 00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:21,760 Speaker 1: when we're when a seed is planted in the soil, 350 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,240 Speaker 1: the seed is planted in darkness, like there's no light, 351 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:31,200 Speaker 1: there's no like seeing what's going on, and the seed 352 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:34,360 Speaker 1: is just in the dark, in the dirt, in the soil, 353 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 1: and there's nothing that that seed can do in and 354 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 1: of itself. But the hope is that as it's being 355 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 1: watered and as it's receiving from the sunshine, even though 356 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 1: it doesn't see it, that there is growth happening. And 357 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 1: I just I don't know if you've seen those videos 358 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:56,480 Speaker 1: where you can see what's happening under the soil, but 359 00:24:56,640 --> 00:25:00,560 Speaker 1: you just start seeing the little roots start coming out bottom, 360 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,000 Speaker 1: and then there's the little sprout that starts coming out 361 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: of the top, and then and then sooner or later 362 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 1: it pokes through the soil, and then you start seeing 363 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 1: the flourishing and greenery and the stems and the leaves, 364 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 1: and then finally there's blooms and there's fruit, and the 365 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 1: things that were happening under the soil were just as 366 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:29,320 Speaker 1: important and just as beautiful as when the bloom comes out. 367 00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:31,160 Speaker 1: And so I think that that was something that God 368 00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 1: was speaking to me and ministering to me, is that 369 00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:39,399 Speaker 1: when we are feeling like we're covered, or we're under 370 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:43,360 Speaker 1: the soil, or we're in this fog and pain, that 371 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,439 Speaker 1: there are beautiful things happening that only God can do 372 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:51,439 Speaker 1: between me and him in that space, and allowing God's 373 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:57,679 Speaker 1: word to flood us and to be our very bread 374 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 1: and to be hungry for it. And that's something else too, 375 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:05,080 Speaker 1: because I remember in those initial days opening God's Word 376 00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 1: and just feeling like it was like words just like 377 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:10,720 Speaker 1: or letters even just kind of like floating around. It 378 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 1: was like I do not even know how to turn 379 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 1: under the Bible. 380 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 2: And I just have to interrupt and say that I literally, 381 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 2: in that season of my life, had to change translations. 382 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:25,879 Speaker 1: That I was reading. 383 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:30,119 Speaker 2: I had always read the ESV for a couple of years, 384 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:34,040 Speaker 2: I grew up reading KJV read ESV. All of a sudden, 385 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 2: my brain would not process that ESV version, and I 386 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 2: moved to the NIV to simplify the wordings so that 387 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:50,240 Speaker 2: I could still actually get something off the page when 388 00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 2: I was reading my Bible. So I so appreciate you 389 00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 2: bringing that up because I think it's a very real 390 00:26:57,680 --> 00:26:58,679 Speaker 2: issue for people. 391 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:02,280 Speaker 1: It was for me, yeah, absolutely. And do you have 392 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:05,840 Speaker 1: other kids as well? I do. Yeah. Are they younger 393 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:08,919 Speaker 1: than Taylor or they were? Ye? Yeah. And that was 394 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,720 Speaker 1: actually something that was helpful for me too, was opening 395 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:16,720 Speaker 1: up the Kids Bible with my kids, because, like you said, 396 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: it's like you just needed the simple truth and to 397 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,639 Speaker 1: hear it in a way that kids can understand, like 398 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 1: that was some of the most rich times. And I 399 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:29,840 Speaker 1: would read it with my kids, but sometimes I would 400 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:31,679 Speaker 1: just read it on my own and weep because it 401 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:38,040 Speaker 1: would just One was the Jesus Story Storybook Bible, and 402 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,159 Speaker 1: the part about Heaven was just like, oh my gosh, 403 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 1: like I needed that. I needed to know, like, Okay, 404 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:47,640 Speaker 1: this is what my soul needed. Or we Also there's 405 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:53,200 Speaker 1: this book called Daily Light by Anne Graham Lots and 406 00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,840 Speaker 1: it's it looks like a little Bible, but basically it's 407 00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: morning and evening, so each page so sorry, there's morning 408 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:05,360 Speaker 1: and evening and it's just Bible, but it like has 409 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:08,720 Speaker 1: a heading, so like a main theme, but then it's 410 00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,439 Speaker 1: like it's just all Bible versus that go along with 411 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,520 Speaker 1: the peace of God or and it was so helpful. 412 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 1: And our friends Pastor Greg and Kathy Lori had just 413 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:24,080 Speaker 1: their son had just died four years before Lennya did, 414 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:27,880 Speaker 1: and so we actually saw them like grieving and in 415 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,680 Speaker 1: the process, and we were with them, and this was 416 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,119 Speaker 1: a book that ministered to them, and so it was 417 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 1: like it was an automatic and we had one, and 418 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 1: so it was an automatic like Okay, yeah, let's open 419 00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 1: this up. And it's God's words. So it's yet I 420 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 1: think devotionals are amazing, but it's also just we need 421 00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: God's word more than we need food. And I think sometimes, 422 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:54,240 Speaker 1: especially in those early days, it's like you can't even eat. 423 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,200 Speaker 1: It's like people are trying to make you have something, 424 00:28:58,040 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 1: to have a smoothie or something, but it's like I 425 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:03,040 Speaker 1: can't eat anything. But Lord, I just I'm just hungry 426 00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:06,720 Speaker 1: for you. I'm hungry for your kingdom. I just want 427 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:11,320 Speaker 1: more than what this world has to give me. And 428 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:16,920 Speaker 1: so all that to say, you're in it. If you're 429 00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,960 Speaker 1: in it right now, it's okay to be in it, 430 00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 1: because first of all, you're not alone in it. God 431 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:30,560 Speaker 1: is with you. Yes, Jesus defeated death in the grave, 432 00:29:30,760 --> 00:29:35,440 Speaker 1: and with the same power that he was raised from 433 00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:38,040 Speaker 1: the dead, we have that we have that power to 434 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,200 Speaker 1: fight forward. And even if we'd feel like we're just 435 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:45,000 Speaker 1: taking a tiny little centimeter of a step each day, 436 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:48,560 Speaker 1: or we feel like we're going backwards, like He's with us, 437 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: and I just and I love, I always take so 438 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 1: much comfort in the fact that God is our shepherd 439 00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,200 Speaker 1: and the fact that he's our good shepherd and he 440 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:03,680 Speaker 1: knows us, he knows his sheep, and he's not going 441 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: to lead us in a place where is dangerous for us, 442 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: like he's gonna lead us. So as if we're just 443 00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:16,440 Speaker 1: totally surrendered to our shepherd and letting him lead us, 444 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,720 Speaker 1: letting him hold us, letting him carry us, letting him 445 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:24,440 Speaker 1: guide us, then we're in the safest place we can be. 446 00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 1: And that was another thing that when I felt like 447 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: I was in the dark, or when I felt like 448 00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: I was in the shadow, I love how Psalm twenty 449 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: three says that even though we walk through the valley 450 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:41,080 Speaker 1: of the shadow of death, we will fear no evil, 451 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:43,480 Speaker 1: and it's just the shadow of death and it's dark, 452 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:49,280 Speaker 1: but when God's with us, we can go through those things, 453 00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,440 Speaker 1: and we can go through the valley of the shadow 454 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,200 Speaker 1: of death. And the fact that we're in a shadow 455 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: isn't always a bad thing, because the Bible also talks 456 00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 1: about God being, of Him being our strength, and of 457 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:07,920 Speaker 1: us finding shelter in the shadow of His wings. And 458 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:11,080 Speaker 1: I think that that has been also so comforting, because 459 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:13,320 Speaker 1: you might feel like you're in the dark, or you 460 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,000 Speaker 1: feel like you're far from God. But if we can 461 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 1: just remember that we're safe in his shadow and safe 462 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:21,640 Speaker 1: in under the shadow of his wing, where there's we're 463 00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 1: near esut to his heart. We may not clearly hear 464 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:27,760 Speaker 1: his voice, but we're nearest to his heart. I think 465 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:30,640 Speaker 1: that that's where we need to stay when we feel 466 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,040 Speaker 1: like we're in the fog and we feel like we're 467 00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,400 Speaker 1: in the confusion. It's to just stay. Don't make any 468 00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: sudden movements, Just stay stay close, stay stay in his shadow. 469 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 2: I say that often, to just get as close to 470 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:51,240 Speaker 2: Jesus as you possibly can and stay there, don't wander away, 471 00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,280 Speaker 2: so that you can experience all that He has to 472 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 2: offer on a very intimate level. Chenny, thank you so 473 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:02,920 Speaker 2: much for sharing this and encouragement, this deep encouragement. I 474 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,280 Speaker 2: know that this is going to bless women, especially as 475 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 2: Mother's Day comes about. 476 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:09,720 Speaker 1: And I wondered if you would. 477 00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 2: Just pray for the moms who are listening in today 478 00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:16,080 Speaker 2: before we close out. Yes, I would be so honored 479 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:24,479 Speaker 2: to thank you, Rachel. Well Father, we just pause, and 480 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,360 Speaker 2: I thank you that even after a conversation like this, 481 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:33,440 Speaker 2: or time spent your word, or time receiving from you 482 00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:37,080 Speaker 2: at church, or time with a friend, Lord, that we 483 00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:44,320 Speaker 2: can pause and pray and just let your presence wash 484 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 2: over us and let your peace overwhelm us. And so, Lord, 485 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 2: we just want to be still before you, and we 486 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:55,400 Speaker 2: want to receive from you. We don't want to rush 487 00:32:55,440 --> 00:33:00,200 Speaker 2: away from a moment. Even if we do have to 488 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 2: actually rush away and do something with our kids or 489 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 2: go to work or whatever. We do want to give 490 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,920 Speaker 2: you the space to move in our hearts and in 491 00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 2: our lives and in our minds and even in our bodies, 492 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:16,560 Speaker 2: just overwhelming us with your peace. And so I just 493 00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 2: pray for the women today. I pray for your peace 494 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:26,440 Speaker 2: to overwhelm and I pray for those who are in 495 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 2: that place of ache and hurt and pain. And I 496 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:36,120 Speaker 2: pray that your love and your grace would wash over them, 497 00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 2: and that they would see that, yes, you have a 498 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 2: plan for them to fight forward and to fight, to 499 00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 2: flourish and to fight and to be diligent to enter 500 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:50,520 Speaker 2: your rest. But also you have given us your rest, 501 00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 2: and you have given us your peace. And so there 502 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:58,640 Speaker 2: are seasons of fighting, and there are seasons of resting. 503 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:01,840 Speaker 2: And so I just pray that you would give the 504 00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:06,280 Speaker 2: listeners the wisdom to know the season that you have 505 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,239 Speaker 2: them in and to lean into you no matter what 506 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:14,080 Speaker 2: season they are in. I pray that they would have 507 00:34:14,120 --> 00:34:19,680 Speaker 2: that picture of you as their good shepherd, comforting, leading, directing, 508 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:28,360 Speaker 2: just with your eyes of love looking at them, telling 509 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:31,759 Speaker 2: them how much you adore them and you love them, 510 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:34,479 Speaker 2: and you have a plan for them, and that even 511 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,239 Speaker 2: in the midst of the deepest darkest pain, in the 512 00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 2: deepest darkest days, that you are with them, that you 513 00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:47,680 Speaker 2: love them, that they can find rest in peace, true peace, 514 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,160 Speaker 2: in the shelter and in the shadow of your wings. 515 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:55,120 Speaker 1: And Lord, I pray that even if they don't see 516 00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:58,160 Speaker 1: it now, that they would that they would know with 517 00:34:58,239 --> 00:35:00,680 Speaker 1: their eyes of faith that there is a day coming 518 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,840 Speaker 1: where you have for them to be healed and whole 519 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:14,440 Speaker 1: and using this pain as a microphone to tell others 520 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,440 Speaker 1: of who you are and to comfort others with the 521 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,520 Speaker 1: comfort that you've given them. And I pray also just 522 00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:24,160 Speaker 1: to continued strength and healing over Rachel and her family. 523 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,239 Speaker 1: And I thank you for this podcast. I thank you 524 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:31,520 Speaker 1: for this moment. I thank you for how you introduce 525 00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:36,000 Speaker 1: us to our brothers and sisters in Christ and how 526 00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 1: you have your way in us. And so we just 527 00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 1: want to surrender to you today anew afresh and we 528 00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 1: love you Lord in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen, Amen. 529 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,040 Speaker 2: Thank you Jenny for sharing with our audience today, and 530 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:53,440 Speaker 2: thank you listeners. I'm signing off as Rachel Wojo. Until 531 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:58,120 Speaker 2: next time. God sees you, he hears you, and he 532 00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:04,759 Speaker 2: knows your needs. Thanks for joining me on the Untangling 533 00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:09,359 Speaker 2: Prayer Podcast. If this episode resonated with you, share it 534 00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:12,120 Speaker 2: with someone who could use a little hope, and be 535 00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 2: sure to subscribe for more. Until next time, keep seeking, 536 00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:21,040 Speaker 2: keep trusting, and keep praying.