1 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:03,600 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 2: What do we do when we are going through seasons 3 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:11,840 Speaker 2: of suffering? I'm talking prolonged suffering, and we have real questions, 4 00:00:12,119 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 2: real doubts, and real feelings that we don't really know if. 5 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:16,600 Speaker 1: We're allowed to feel. 6 00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:18,720 Speaker 2: We're gonna talk about all of that and more in 7 00:00:18,760 --> 00:00:27,040 Speaker 2: today's episode. Hello, Hello, Hello, ladies and gents, and welcome 8 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 2: to this week's episode of The Botton Beloved Podcast. As always, 9 00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 2: it's your girl, Kirby Kelly. I'm so glad that you 10 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:36,560 Speaker 2: are tuning in, and I am excited for my guest 11 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 2: that I have joining me today. I'm excited for the 12 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:42,200 Speaker 2: conversation that we are going to have surrounding her book, 13 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:46,520 Speaker 2: which is out now. It's called Fearfully and Wonderfully Broken. 14 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:47,680 Speaker 1: What a title. 15 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 2: Fearfully and Wonderfully Broken. Fighting for faith when you're falling apart. 16 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 2: How many of us can like raise our hand and 17 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 2: be like that is me or that has been me. 18 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:01,120 Speaker 2: Maybe that's the season that you are in today. My friend, 19 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 2: she's joining me, Sydney and Bennett. She's joining me, and 20 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 2: we are going to dive into her story, and we're 21 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 2: going to dive into the resilience really of her story 22 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:14,600 Speaker 2: of being able to look at suffering as a place 23 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 2: for faith to grow and not for us to be 24 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,480 Speaker 2: left defeated. But before we get into that, Sidney, welcome 25 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 2: to the podcast. Can you introduce yourself and let everybody 26 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:25,840 Speaker 2: know a little bit about who you are, what you do, 27 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:27,039 Speaker 2: and what you're passionate about. 28 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 3: Absolutely, and thank you so much for having me on, Kirby. So, 29 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 3: I'm Sydney Ann Bennett and I am twenty seven years old. 30 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:37,840 Speaker 3: I live in the Idaho Panhandle with my husband and 31 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 3: we have two little girls aged two and six months. 32 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:44,560 Speaker 3: So it's a very busy season of motherhood right now. 33 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:47,160 Speaker 3: I also am a disabled parent, so I do a 34 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 3: lot of my parenting from a wheelchair, and I've just 35 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 3: been I mean, I think all of parenting is learning 36 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:54,760 Speaker 3: on the job, but that's kind of definitely where I 37 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 3: am right now is learning on the job and figuring 38 00:01:58,160 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 3: each step out as it comes. 39 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:03,960 Speaker 2: So, well, tell us a little bit about your story, 40 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 2: because for those who don't know who you are, can 41 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 2: you just share you know, the what changed your life physically, spiritually, 42 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:16,160 Speaker 2: and ultimately what led you to write this book? 43 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: Yeah? 44 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 3: Absolutely, So. I experienced unexplained chronic pain for about a 45 00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:24,840 Speaker 3: year before I got married. No one could figure out 46 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:26,799 Speaker 3: what it was been caused by. But it was getting 47 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 3: worse and worse. I was losing weight, having a hard 48 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:34,000 Speaker 3: time breathing, and there was just no diagnosis. So we 49 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:38,239 Speaker 3: ended up getting married in March Urundiversries on Friday actually, 50 00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 3: and then two weeks after a honeymoon, I my hands 51 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:46,600 Speaker 3: became paralyzed suddenly, just driving back home from the date night, 52 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:51,239 Speaker 3: and that was the first symptom that we recognized as neurological. 53 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,959 Speaker 3: So we went to the er. They did a bunch 54 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 3: of tests, but we're in rural Kansas. There was nothing 55 00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 3: that they could really figure out there. So they sent 56 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 3: me by. I come with my hands still paralyzed and 57 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 3: no answers, And for the next two weeks it was 58 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 3: just basically one thing after the other. I lost the 59 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:11,919 Speaker 3: ability to walk, to speak, I lost my sense of 60 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:16,919 Speaker 3: taste and touch. I started having hallucinations and seizures. And 61 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:19,560 Speaker 3: about a month after that is when I received the 62 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:24,480 Speaker 3: diagnosis of functional neurological disorder. And so not many people 63 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 3: have heard of that. I did not know that was 64 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:29,639 Speaker 3: a thing before I became diagnosed, and so it basically 65 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 3: means that my brain doesn't communicate correctly with my central 66 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 3: nervous system, so it can cause a lot of different 67 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 3: neurological symptoms. And four months after that, my husband was 68 00:03:40,640 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 3: actually deployed overseas for almost a year. So that first 69 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 3: year being disabled, I was living on my own and 70 00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:51,440 Speaker 3: really struggling to work through what was happening to my body, 71 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:55,119 Speaker 3: and not just the physical aspects of it, but the 72 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 3: emotional and spiritual aspects as well, And so I started 73 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:02,520 Speaker 3: writing because that was the only way I had really 74 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 3: to process what I was going through. And those early notes, 75 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 3: all the way back from before I had the diagnosis, 76 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 3: through my husband's deployment, those early notes are what became 77 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:16,479 Speaker 3: this book, but they were shaped. Now it's been I 78 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:20,520 Speaker 3: think about five years since that happened, so those notes 79 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:23,160 Speaker 3: have been shaped through the way that God has formed 80 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 3: my story since that time, and since becoming a mother 81 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:29,840 Speaker 3: and getting mobility aids and learning how to navigate all 82 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 3: of this, and still facing that spiritual and emotional struggle, 83 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 3: but with the clarity of the hindsight that is able 84 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 3: to come back from looking on your suffering and seeing 85 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,400 Speaker 3: how God has been faithful throughout it. So that's what's 86 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:46,039 Speaker 3: led to this book. I've and been part of an 87 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 3: amazing online community and there are so many people that 88 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,479 Speaker 3: have been able to resonate with my story. And my 89 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:54,359 Speaker 3: goal is really just to sit beside someone else in 90 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 3: their suffering and say, yes, I feel you. I have 91 00:04:57,279 --> 00:05:00,240 Speaker 3: been there too, and this is what god Ishoed shown 92 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 3: himself to be in this So let's look to Jesus together. 93 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:08,280 Speaker 2: Wow, Now did you grow up like in the faith 94 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 2: or what did that look like for you? Like, did 95 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:14,520 Speaker 2: you have a strong foundation going into this diagnosis or 96 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:17,360 Speaker 2: was this something where it was like, you know, I've 97 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,280 Speaker 2: kind of wrestled with my faith before this, I'm wrestling 98 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 2: especially now what did that look like for you? Because 99 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:27,280 Speaker 2: I think different people when they go through suffering navigate 100 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 2: it differently based on the foundation of faith that they 101 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 2: either have or don't have, or the relationship with God 102 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 2: they have or don't have. So knowing that it wasn't 103 00:05:37,120 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 2: just this crazy diagnosis, but even having to navigate this 104 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 2: alone with your husband away, I know that there are 105 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 2: a lot of people who if that was the cards 106 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:50,640 Speaker 2: of life that were handed to them, they would just fold. 107 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:52,240 Speaker 1: They would fold and be like, I don't even want 108 00:05:52,279 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: to play this game anymore. 109 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 2: So tell us a little bit about that, about your 110 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:58,279 Speaker 2: perspective going into the suffering, and where you were with 111 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 2: your faith, what it looked like in the midst of it, 112 00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 2: and maybe where you've concluded or or I don't even 113 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 2: want to say arrived, but where you're at today when 114 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:07,039 Speaker 2: it comes to that. 115 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely, that's I think you're so right there in that. 116 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,839 Speaker 3: How like the foundation that we have for our faith 117 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 3: really comes into our suffering. And I think that all 118 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 3: of us are going to experience major suffering at some 119 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:22,520 Speaker 3: point in our life. I think that's part of living 120 00:06:22,560 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 3: in this world. And so it's not exactly if you'll suffer, 121 00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:29,160 Speaker 3: it's when and how and how you're going to respond 122 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:32,719 Speaker 3: to that suffering. And so I grew up in a 123 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 3: Christian family. I had a strong intellectual foundation to my faith, 124 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 3: where I knew all of the right theological answers to suffering. 125 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:44,160 Speaker 3: But it wasn't until I was in my late teens 126 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:48,279 Speaker 3: that I started really experiencing suffering myself. My younger brother 127 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,279 Speaker 3: died in a horseback riding accident, and I think that 128 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 3: was my first real grappling with loss, and so I 129 00:06:56,040 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 3: went through a lot of like soul suffering and grief 130 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:05,040 Speaker 3: in the couple years before my physical diagnosis, and I 131 00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 3: remember working through that, and I wasn't feeling so much 132 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 3: anger at God, but a lot of loss and feeling 133 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 3: like I don't know where to go with these feelings. 134 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 3: And I also don't know how Christians are allowed to 135 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 3: have these kinds of feelings because I was struggling so 136 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:26,000 Speaker 3: much there was no hope. It felt like like I 137 00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 3: knew intellectually there is hope and that God was going 138 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 3: to bring good through this, but emotionally I felt only despair. 139 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 3: And so I was still working through a lot of 140 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 3: that grief when I became physically disabled. So now there 141 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 3: is a new angle of grief, a new angle of 142 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 3: looking at what God was going to do and what 143 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 3: his faithfulness was going to look like. And yeah, a 144 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:50,120 Speaker 3: lot of that has I think a lot of that 145 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 3: faith has been forged through the fire. And you're kind 146 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:57,040 Speaker 3: of faced with a choice when you have great suffering. 147 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 3: You can turn to God with that suffering, you can 148 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 3: give that suffering to Him to carrying, or you can 149 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 3: turn into yourself and then you have to carry that 150 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 3: suffering alone. And so I think all of us are 151 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 3: going to be faced with that choice. And if you 152 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 3: are not giving your suffering to the Lord, even when 153 00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 3: it feels like you know there's nowhere else to go, 154 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 3: you don't understand what He's going to do with it. 155 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 3: If you're not giving it to him, then you're going 156 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,760 Speaker 3: to need to carry your suffering on your own, and 157 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 3: that is way too hard for any human. 158 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 1: Being to carry. 159 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 3: So even if you can't understand what God is doing 160 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 3: through this, I would say that we should still be 161 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 3: offering our suffering to him because that's the only way 162 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 3: we have to survive what this life is going to 163 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 3: bring to us. 164 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 2: Absolutely, and I love that you even touched on when 165 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 2: it came to like your own emotions in that season 166 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:54,320 Speaker 2: and even just in other seasons. The grief that you 167 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:56,920 Speaker 2: talked about, which I'm so sorry for the loss of 168 00:08:56,960 --> 00:08:57,320 Speaker 2: your brother. 169 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:02,120 Speaker 1: That's horrible. So that's horrible. I haven't lost a sibling, 170 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 1: but I've lost parents, and just it sucks. 171 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:11,320 Speaker 2: It is hard to grapple with even God, You're so good, 172 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 2: yet you allowed this thing to happen, and trying to 173 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:19,080 Speaker 2: reconcile those things. That's hard for any child, any adult, 174 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 2: anybody in any season to navigate even the season. To 175 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:25,960 Speaker 2: Christian that can be a really hard thing to navigate, 176 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 2: not just the situation, but what you talked about the 177 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 2: emotions that can come with it, where it's like, I'm 178 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,160 Speaker 2: a Christian, I'm feeling all these things. You didn't say 179 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 2: it was anger, but for someone listening, it might be anger. 180 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 2: It might be this sense of betrayal. It might be 181 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 2: just I feel confused, I feel abandoned, I feel lost 182 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 2: like fill in the blank. We can all feel some 183 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 2: way when we go through a trial or a season, 184 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 2: a prolonged season even of suffering, where it feels like 185 00:09:57,280 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 2: we don't have an answer, we don't have why, and 186 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 2: we're left with all these heavy and real emotions. But 187 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:06,679 Speaker 2: I think that's where the enemy can get a foothold. 188 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 3: Is well? 189 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 2: Am I even allowed to feel this way? Like I 190 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,200 Speaker 2: feel like a bad Christian? Am I doubting God? Am 191 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 2: I doubting his goodness? 192 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 1: You know? Am I? 193 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 2: Am I forsaking the faith by feeling this way? Shouldn't 194 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:19,680 Speaker 2: I just be happy all the time. I'd love to 195 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:21,960 Speaker 2: hear your thoughts on that of how you were able 196 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 2: to even emotionally begin to unpack those things, because that 197 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 2: it's a process and it could still be an ongoing 198 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:32,679 Speaker 2: process for you. Maybe I'd love to hear kind of 199 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,440 Speaker 2: even what that looked like for you to just feel 200 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:37,680 Speaker 2: those feelings or or get out of a place of 201 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 2: shame even with those feelings, and how you begin to 202 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 2: deal with it and heal with with all of that 203 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:44,720 Speaker 2: with the Lord. 204 00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:47,720 Speaker 3: Yes, for sure, there's I think there's so much shame 205 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 3: that we can carry that we're not supposed to carry 206 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 3: because Christ has already died for everything that we've that 207 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 3: we've ever done, that that's wrong. So the shame that 208 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 3: we're caring is something that putting on ourselves. But I 209 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:04,840 Speaker 3: totally resonate with what you're saying. With that feeling of abandonment, 210 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 3: that's something that I've really struggled with. And Yeah, the 211 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:12,160 Speaker 3: shame of feeling like I shouldn't be feeling this way. 212 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 3: I should be stronger than this, This shouldn't be the 213 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:17,080 Speaker 3: thing that gets me down. And I think that no 214 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,000 Speaker 3: matter what kind of suffering you're going through, whether it's 215 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 3: physical disability or something else, or the sort of grief 216 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,839 Speaker 3: or loss, there's a lot of cultural expectation to just 217 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 3: kind of pull yourself up by your own bootstraps and 218 00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 3: we see you, know, for example, disabled or disability suffering. 219 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:37,800 Speaker 3: We say that as like, oh, it should be inspirational, 220 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:40,840 Speaker 3: like we should see you overcome your illness, we should 221 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:43,560 Speaker 3: see you get out of that wheelchair, we should see 222 00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 3: you move on with your life and accomplish really great 223 00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:48,800 Speaker 3: and exciting things. And that can happen with any kind 224 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 3: of suffering. But there's certain kinds of suffering that I 225 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:54,320 Speaker 3: think hold more stigma and shame around them when we 226 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 3: don't fit that picture of what we think we should 227 00:11:57,200 --> 00:12:01,920 Speaker 3: be experiencing through that trial. And Christians especially can do 228 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 3: that because we think, oh, we should always be joyful 229 00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:07,679 Speaker 3: in the Lord and always be happy and hopeful, and 230 00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 3: that's just not the reality. And I see that in 231 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:16,079 Speaker 3: scripture constantly, like our idea of the happy, joyful Christian. 232 00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 3: If you actually take that back to the words of scripture, 233 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:24,200 Speaker 3: you have psalm after psalm of Christians that are crying 234 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 3: out to the Lord in lament and are saying things 235 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:31,439 Speaker 3: like I don't remember what happiness feels like, my pillow 236 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:35,600 Speaker 3: is swimming with tears, my bones are wasting away with sorrow. 237 00:12:36,040 --> 00:12:38,600 Speaker 3: Those are not the kinds of words that we use 238 00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 3: around suffering today. Those are the kinds of words that 239 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 3: we are afraid to say out loud, but they're in 240 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:47,560 Speaker 3: the Bible in prayers to God. And so I would 241 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 3: say that the first thing that you should do if 242 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 3: you are feeling like I don't know if I should 243 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:54,840 Speaker 3: be feeling this way, I feel confused, I feel abandoned, 244 00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,880 Speaker 3: take those feelings to the Lord. Like you are actually 245 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:01,320 Speaker 3: allowed to pray those feelings to the Lord. And that's 246 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:03,920 Speaker 3: not a lack of faith. That is an expression of 247 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 3: faith that we find in the Word. So say something like, Lord, 248 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:11,560 Speaker 3: I do not know what you're doing here. I feel abandoned, 249 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,200 Speaker 3: I feel like I'm despairing, I feel like I'm crushed. 250 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:18,040 Speaker 3: I feel like there's no way out. I feel angry 251 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:20,160 Speaker 3: at you, and I do not know what to do 252 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 3: with these feelings. Lord, please help me. Help me bring 253 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 3: these feelings to you and just lay all of those out. 254 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 3: Those feelings are not hidden from God. God knows that 255 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:32,839 Speaker 3: you're feeling that way. But the only way that you 256 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:35,200 Speaker 3: will be able to be helped by God's strength is 257 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:38,080 Speaker 3: if he bring those feelings to him. And so if 258 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 3: you don't know where to start, I would say start 259 00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 3: there and just keep doing it over and over. It's 260 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 3: not something that you can just surrender once and all 261 00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:50,160 Speaker 3: of a sudden, now you're trusting. It's something that you 262 00:13:50,280 --> 00:13:53,559 Speaker 3: need to do over and over in your life. And 263 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 3: God is going to meet that prayer. He is, and 264 00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:59,120 Speaker 3: it might not be the first time or the second time, 265 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,520 Speaker 3: but He is going to meet it. And one day 266 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,680 Speaker 3: you will look back and see that through all of 267 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 3: these prayers you thought were unanswered, God was actually doing 268 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:09,760 Speaker 3: a beautiful and wonderful thing. 269 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 1: Amen. 270 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 2: Amen, I love that with what you said of even 271 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 2: you having felt that abandonment, like that kind of like 272 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 2: being a feeling and maybe even a root for you, 273 00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 2: the fact that what you were saying, even about lament 274 00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 2: is that it is this holy thing because at the 275 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:32,760 Speaker 2: end of the day, what lament does is it shifts 276 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 2: us to look at God and to address God, the 277 00:14:36,720 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 2: very one that we might feel abandoned by. It pushes 278 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 2: us to pursue Him and come to this realization, really, 279 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:46,960 Speaker 2: of way, you never have abandoned me, Like I'm gonna 280 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:52,080 Speaker 2: lay it all out here, every feeling, every thought, every tear, 281 00:14:52,680 --> 00:14:56,440 Speaker 2: every cry, like lay those things out before the Lord 282 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 2: to the person who just feels completely abandoned in a 283 00:14:59,880 --> 00:15:03,600 Speaker 2: li bring it to him. It's so tempting to just 284 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 2: want to keep it to yourself or to take it 285 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 2: somewhere else. But but and I feel like I'm a 286 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 2: broken record here because this is something I say a 287 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 2: lot here on the podcast and have at least in 288 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 2: this season of life, even as I've wrestled with like 289 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 2: my own suffering and my own grief very publicly on 290 00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 2: here has been this idea of you know, praise. We 291 00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:23,880 Speaker 2: think praise is the only song that we can sing 292 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 2: to the Lord that brings us into relationship with him 293 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 2: and develop intimacy with him. But lament is another song 294 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 2: that is still sung to the Lord and brings about 295 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 2: intimacy with him. 296 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 1: And the coolest thing. 297 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:39,520 Speaker 2: About the laments that we read throughout Scripture is that 298 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 2: time and having time and time again. It ends with 299 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:45,400 Speaker 2: it with hope, and it ends with declaration, and it 300 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:51,040 Speaker 2: ends with remembrance of who God is in our circumstance, 301 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 2: in our suffering, not just beyond it, like when we 302 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 2: get to the finished line when we overcome, kind of 303 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,560 Speaker 2: like what you were saying, but it's like right here now, 304 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 2: in the mundane, in the middle of things, like as 305 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,560 Speaker 2: I'm figuring it out navigating it. God can show up, 306 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 2: but we also need to bring him those things, the 307 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,560 Speaker 2: suffering that we've been shouldering alone, if we have been 308 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 2: shouldering it alone. And someone I should say that you 309 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 2: talk about in your book is your husband and how 310 00:16:21,600 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 2: even just going through suffering it, he showed up for 311 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 2: you and was one of those people who was consistent 312 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 2: in your life. And so I'd love to just hear 313 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:34,120 Speaker 2: a bit about that, maybe like what that looked like 314 00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:37,240 Speaker 2: for you, what you learned through that season of your 315 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 2: husband coming alongside you, and maybe even just advice for 316 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 2: people who are on the outside of suffering but their 317 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 2: loved one is It's like, how do we show up 318 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 2: for people in the middle of what they're going through, 319 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:53,240 Speaker 2: especially when it's like I can't provide you the answer 320 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 2: or I can't provide. 321 00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:57,120 Speaker 1: You the healing, but I still want to show up 322 00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:57,440 Speaker 1: for you. 323 00:16:57,720 --> 00:16:59,360 Speaker 2: What would you say to those people and what did 324 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 2: it look like navigating that with your husband? 325 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a great question. So I think a lot 326 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 3: of the struggle was something that I brought into the 327 00:17:08,160 --> 00:17:11,560 Speaker 3: relationship myself because I did not want to receive help. 328 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,920 Speaker 3: And I think that's something that a lot of us 329 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:18,440 Speaker 3: will probably experience in that position, is that we want 330 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 3: to do it all ourselves. We don't want to be 331 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:24,280 Speaker 3: a burden. However, we think that looks we don't want 332 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:28,960 Speaker 3: to receive help, and so we end up actually undermining 333 00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:32,440 Speaker 3: the expression of love that people are trying to give 334 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,480 Speaker 3: to us. And it took so many people, in so 335 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:40,119 Speaker 3: many different conversations to kind of learned that. But I 336 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 3: definitely the most expression of it was certainly in the 337 00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:47,240 Speaker 3: love that my husband showed to me. 338 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:48,560 Speaker 1: And when we. 339 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:50,840 Speaker 3: First got married, you know, all of this was just 340 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:54,360 Speaker 3: completely knew. Neither of us knew what was happening. I 341 00:17:54,400 --> 00:17:57,119 Speaker 3: was told that I was probably dying, and it was 342 00:17:57,200 --> 00:17:59,720 Speaker 3: almost like am I going to die? In the first 343 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 3: year of our marriage, Like we didn't know what was 344 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 3: going to happen, And you have to physically carry me 345 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 3: and physically wash me and physically answer my questions when 346 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 3: I became confused or incoherent. And if you want to, 347 00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 3: like I think, our temptation is to want to solve 348 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 3: people suffering, but the best way that you can help 349 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 3: them is to just be along with them for the ride, 350 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 3: because a lot of the suffering be long term suffering 351 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:32,639 Speaker 3: is not something that you can solve or that will 352 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 3: be solved in this life on this earth. And people 353 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 3: will often keep coming and say, oh, I'm going to 354 00:18:39,359 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 3: pray for you to get better or I'm going to 355 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 3: pray for your healing, and after a while, sometimes even those, 356 00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:49,440 Speaker 3: even though those are you know, all well meaning comments, 357 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 3: sometimes it can fall flat to the person you're trying 358 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:55,359 Speaker 3: to talk to because in their mind they're thinking, Okay, 359 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 3: that's really nice, but I know that I'm not going 360 00:18:57,640 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 3: to get better or that I'm probably not going to 361 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:04,240 Speaker 3: be and so what then what else can prayer offer? 362 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:07,199 Speaker 3: And so being with them for the ride, being like, 363 00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 3: you know, no matter what happens, if you're gonna get better, 364 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 3: if you're going to get worse, I'm gonna be here 365 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:14,359 Speaker 3: with you, and I'll cry with you, and I'll laugh 366 00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:17,359 Speaker 3: with you and read the room and meet them where 367 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:20,440 Speaker 3: they are and then point them to Jesus. Not in 368 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,000 Speaker 3: like a here's a few Bible verses and a couple 369 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:27,080 Speaker 3: platitude sort of way, but in like the way that 370 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 3: you know, I've been in this weak spot. I've been 371 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:34,280 Speaker 3: suffering too, And this is how the Lord is given 372 00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:36,240 Speaker 3: his presence to me. This is what he's shown me 373 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 3: in his word, this is how he sustained me. And 374 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 3: knowing that there is so much room in faith for 375 00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 3: real depth of sorrow and suffering and not trying to 376 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 3: placate that is an absolutely huge gift that you can 377 00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:53,960 Speaker 3: give someone. And if you don't know what to say, 378 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 3: then there's no there's nothing that you can do that's 379 00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:02,880 Speaker 3: too small to be helpful. I was my toddler. She's 380 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:04,800 Speaker 3: very into Winnie the Pooh right now, and so I 381 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:07,400 Speaker 3: was reading to her the other day and there's this 382 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:11,720 Speaker 3: one story where Ere loses his tale and Pooh says that, 383 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:14,119 Speaker 3: you know, he tried to think really hard as something 384 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,639 Speaker 3: useful to say, but he couldn't think of anything. So 385 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:19,920 Speaker 3: he decided to do something useful instead. And I think 386 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:21,920 Speaker 3: we could all take a lesson from Winnie the Pooh. 387 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 3: There where a lot of times we want to find 388 00:20:24,359 --> 00:20:28,040 Speaker 3: like the perfect words, but there's really no perfect words 389 00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:31,439 Speaker 3: to hold some kinds of sorrow and some kinds of grief. 390 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 3: And so if you're able to do something, you know, 391 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,640 Speaker 3: I had a friend that drove me around the neighborhood 392 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 3: one day after I've been sick and bed ridden for 393 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 3: a week, so that I could look at fall leaves, 394 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:45,880 Speaker 3: like that's a very simple thing that you could do, 395 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 3: but it meant so much to me, Like it's something 396 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 3: that I still think about, or bringing someone dinner, sending 397 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:54,679 Speaker 3: a text, Hey, I'm praying for you. Hey, I'm going 398 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:56,919 Speaker 3: to pick up your kids from school this day. What 399 00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 3: can I bring you? Can I bring you a coffee? 400 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:00,760 Speaker 3: Like something like that, just to show that you are 401 00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:03,040 Speaker 3: thinking of someone, you're praying for them, and to be 402 00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,240 Speaker 3: with them in the ride instead of letting their suffering 403 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 3: scare you away, leaning into that suffering with them is 404 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:12,160 Speaker 3: the biggest gift that you forget someone. 405 00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:14,680 Speaker 1: It's so beautifully said. 406 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:17,399 Speaker 2: It just makes me think of the picture of like 407 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:21,800 Speaker 2: being the hands and feet of Christ, like actually showing 408 00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 2: up and doing what needs to be done, going to 409 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 2: the people in the body who need that care, who 410 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:32,880 Speaker 2: are in a season of suffering or struggle or sorrow. 411 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 2: I mean, there's so many unique seasons and situations that 412 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 2: we can probably think of that we've been in where 413 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 2: it's like I wish somebody showed up for me in 414 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:43,840 Speaker 2: this way, and it's like maybe we need to like 415 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:47,520 Speaker 2: look outward and actually look at the people around us 416 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:50,480 Speaker 2: and recognize hey, Like, how can I be the hands 417 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 2: and feet of Jesus, not just the mouthpiece of Jesus, 418 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:55,159 Speaker 2: Because there is a time and place for that. Like 419 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,679 Speaker 2: when I think of the story of Lazarus when he 420 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:03,000 Speaker 2: died and four days goes by, right, like Jesus shows up, 421 00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:05,320 Speaker 2: They send word for him because they're like, our brother 422 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 2: is sick. He kind of delays shows up four days later, 423 00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:12,680 Speaker 2: and with Martha and Mary, he has two different responses 424 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:16,320 Speaker 2: to them. With Martha, he meets her with like this 425 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:20,199 Speaker 2: this theological statement of like I am the Resurrection and 426 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:22,400 Speaker 2: the life, like you believe this, yes? 427 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:23,679 Speaker 1: And she's like, yes, I believe this. 428 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:25,600 Speaker 2: And it's like there's a time and place where it's 429 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,040 Speaker 2: like we need truth, we need that encouragement, we need 430 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:31,800 Speaker 2: to be reminded of of who Jesus is. But then 431 00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 2: I think about Mary and it's like when Jesus and 432 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 2: Mary have this interaction, they just weep together, like it's 433 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,920 Speaker 2: the famous Bible verse that everyone has memorized, right, Jesus 434 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 2: wept right, And it's like that's that is a ministry too, 435 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:46,080 Speaker 2: a ministry of presence for people who are in that 436 00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:49,000 Speaker 2: place where it's like this really sucks, and it's like 437 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 2: Jesus showed up and he got on her level and 438 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:55,479 Speaker 2: wept with her and then went on to go and 439 00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:57,399 Speaker 2: do something that only he could do. 440 00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: Might I add like he is the Savior? Right, he 441 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:00,119 Speaker 1: is God God. 442 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 2: Not all of us can really command a dead man 443 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,080 Speaker 2: to come walking out of a grave and see it happen. Right. 444 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:08,159 Speaker 2: Jesus has that authority to be able to do it 445 00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,280 Speaker 2: and make it happen in alignment with his will. 446 00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:10,640 Speaker 1: Right. 447 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 2: But the whole point of that that I'm saying is 448 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,720 Speaker 2: that Jesus showed up for people in the way that 449 00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:19,640 Speaker 2: they needed him to show up, and he knew how 450 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:22,040 Speaker 2: to show up for those people. So that's something that 451 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 2: I think we can all even be prayerful, is who 452 00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:26,200 Speaker 2: are the people in my life that are going through 453 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 2: something right now? And God, what is the best way 454 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:31,240 Speaker 2: that I can show up for them and love them 455 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:33,960 Speaker 2: and meet a need in their life in this season? 456 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 2: If I can, but to begin to wrap up the podcast, 457 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 2: this went by so quick, but as we begin to 458 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 2: wrap up, I would love to know how did you 459 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 2: continue and how do you continue to choose faith on 460 00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:53,440 Speaker 2: days when it's like nothing's improving. I'm in a prolonged season, 461 00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 2: it feels like, you know, will my healing come? Will 462 00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,280 Speaker 2: will this diagnosis be a forever thing? How do you 463 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,600 Speaker 2: continue to hold on to faith when it just feels 464 00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:04,240 Speaker 2: like nothing has improved. 465 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 1: Yeah. 466 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 3: I think a lot of us struggle with this because 467 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:13,359 Speaker 3: we picture that one day we're going to be quote 468 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,919 Speaker 3: unquote faithful enough where we won't struggle with doubt or 469 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 3: we won't struggle with sadness. And I don't think that 470 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:22,800 Speaker 3: happens in this life because just like in the story 471 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 3: that you just related with Jesus, Jesus knew he is 472 00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:30,080 Speaker 3: the resurrection, and yet he's still wet beside the grave 473 00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,199 Speaker 3: of his friend. And so even though we know what 474 00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 3: is coming, we know redemption is coming and that this 475 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:39,119 Speaker 3: story is going to be made into something good, and 476 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:42,000 Speaker 3: we know that one day our sorrow will end. That 477 00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:46,200 Speaker 3: grief that we hold right now is actually proof of 478 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:51,879 Speaker 3: the fact that we know something better is supposed to be. Christians, 479 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 3: I think, are the only ones that actually understand that 480 00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 3: the fullness of what sorrow can look like, because we 481 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,639 Speaker 3: know it's not supposed to be this. So, if you 482 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 3: have a view of the world where everything is just 483 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,399 Speaker 3: you know, materialistic. Everything is matter. 484 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:07,359 Speaker 1: There is no God. 485 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 3: There's actually no proper response to sorrow that makes sense 486 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:16,400 Speaker 3: with what we feel inside our souls, because Christians understand 487 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,080 Speaker 3: the framework of the world is broken right now because 488 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:21,920 Speaker 3: of sin, and so we never get to a point 489 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:26,000 Speaker 3: where we can actually graduate past that until we're in glory. 490 00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 3: And so when you're faced with those doubts, you need 491 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:33,000 Speaker 3: to go back to what you know of God. And 492 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:35,760 Speaker 3: I think this circles back to your question earlier about 493 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 3: having that foundation. If you aren't seeking the Lord and 494 00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:42,439 Speaker 3: learning about Him and growing in him and being in 495 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:46,000 Speaker 3: His word in the easy seasons of life, then you're 496 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 3: going to feel like you have no foundation when that 497 00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 3: struggle and that suffering comes. And so really like, even 498 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:55,359 Speaker 3: if you're not in a period of suffering right now, 499 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 3: lean into the Lord, grow in him, grow into his community, 500 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:04,920 Speaker 3: be reading your Bible, the understanding a perspective of who 501 00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 3: God is that is big enough for the suffering of 502 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,360 Speaker 3: this world and not just the easy times. And if 503 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 3: you are in a period of suffering and you're feeling 504 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:17,280 Speaker 3: all of the feelings that we think, you know Christians 505 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:21,200 Speaker 3: shouldn't feel, know that there's language for that in the Bible, 506 00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:24,159 Speaker 3: that God has actually given us language for that because 507 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,800 Speaker 3: he knows it is real and he knows it can 508 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:30,000 Speaker 3: break us, and that we are to bring that brokenness 509 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 3: to God and the redemption that we look forward to 510 00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:37,440 Speaker 3: is actually strong enough to work backwards through time and 511 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:41,600 Speaker 3: make what we're experiencing right now something beautiful and wonderful. 512 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 3: But you're never going to experience that unless you've been 513 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:48,719 Speaker 3: brought to your own point of breaking and then you 514 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 3: bring that brokenness to the Lord. Wow. 515 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 2: Wise wise words, wise words like the Biblical framework worldview. 516 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,719 Speaker 2: It completely changes everything, not just who we are and 517 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 2: how we live and how we love other people. 518 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:06,359 Speaker 1: And worship God. 519 00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:09,640 Speaker 2: All of that is true, but especially when it comes 520 00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:13,320 Speaker 2: to suffering like something that can that can so be 521 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,760 Speaker 2: like a an Achilles heel for so many people in 522 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 2: their faith walk where it's like oof, like I really 523 00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:22,560 Speaker 2: got hit here, and I feel like I'm either stuck 524 00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:27,320 Speaker 2: or I'm just gonna completely abandon this journey as a whole. 525 00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,959 Speaker 2: But it's like when you really understand the Gospel, the 526 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:38,920 Speaker 2: whole meta narrative of the Bible and how it's it's creation, fall, redemption, restoration, 527 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,399 Speaker 2: it's this beautiful cycle that we can look into our 528 00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:45,320 Speaker 2: own season and hold on to that hope that it 529 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:49,480 Speaker 2: might not turn out how we expect, Like, not every 530 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:51,760 Speaker 2: story that we read in scripture is going to be 531 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:54,960 Speaker 2: completely applicable to our life and our situation. And this 532 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:57,879 Speaker 2: is exactly how Jesus is gonna work it out for us. No, 533 00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 2: but the tenets of who God is. 534 00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:02,640 Speaker 1: His character, we can hope for. 535 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:06,000 Speaker 2: That, we can hope for that faithfulness and that consistency 536 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:07,800 Speaker 2: with whatever we're going through. 537 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:09,720 Speaker 1: I mean, what you've gone through. 538 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,200 Speaker 2: I've never gone through that, but I've gone through suffering 539 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,520 Speaker 2: and I've gone through sorrow, and we both hold on 540 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,399 Speaker 2: to the same hope of knowing who our God is. 541 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:18,080 Speaker 1: And those are the. 542 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:21,160 Speaker 2: Things that we can hold on to in any season 543 00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:25,800 Speaker 2: of sorrow, suffering, doubt, disappointment, you name it. Are there 544 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:28,119 Speaker 2: any final things? Because you write about so much in 545 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:30,320 Speaker 2: your book, but are there any final things if you 546 00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:32,840 Speaker 2: just had like one final word to say, maybe it's 547 00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:35,639 Speaker 2: something we didn't get to today, or just another point 548 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 2: or passionate thing that's burning on your heart that you're like, 549 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:40,880 Speaker 2: I just want people to know this one thing. 550 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 1: What would that be? 551 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:47,280 Speaker 3: Thank you? I think that oh, putting me on the 552 00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:52,160 Speaker 3: spot here. I think the biggest thing that I would 553 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 3: want people to know is that our faith is big 554 00:28:56,600 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 3: enough to hold every feeling that you could possibly feel, 555 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,480 Speaker 3: and all of the brokenness that you think is impossible 556 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 3: to align with God. And I love the title of 557 00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:10,560 Speaker 3: your podcast, bot and Beloved, And as soon as I 558 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 3: heard it, it immediately made me think of a story 559 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 3: that I read. I think it was from Beneath a 560 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 3: Joy Risner who's also gone through a lot of physical 561 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 3: and emotional suffering in her life. But she was leading 562 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,440 Speaker 3: a group of women who were walking through very hard 563 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 3: seasons and they were trying to pick their word for 564 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:31,160 Speaker 3: the year, and one person said, I feel like my 565 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:35,080 Speaker 3: word is broken, Like that's just that's the name that 566 00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,360 Speaker 3: comes to mind when I think of myself right now. 567 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:39,920 Speaker 3: And then a few months later she came back and 568 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:43,200 Speaker 3: she said, even though I feel broken, I know that 569 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 3: God calls me beloved. And I think that that's the 570 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 3: place where we need to ultimately come to, is that 571 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,600 Speaker 3: even when our feelings are telling us we are broken, 572 00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:57,080 Speaker 3: this suffering is meaningless. This cannot turn into anything good. 573 00:29:57,160 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 3: I do not like this story God has placed me in. 574 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 3: God actually sees our brokenness, and he calls us beloved. 575 00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 3: And that's what we need to come back to, is 576 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:09,840 Speaker 3: that even when we feel broken, we are beloved by God. 577 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,400 Speaker 3: And it's not so much that we can trace God's 578 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:15,560 Speaker 3: hand in exactly what he's doing with this, but we 579 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 3: can trust his heart and that his presence and his 580 00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 3: character are good and that he's going to be faithful 581 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:24,040 Speaker 3: and redeem the suffering that we're in. 582 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:29,360 Speaker 2: Amen, when you can't see his hand, trust his heart. 583 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 1: That is so good. Write that down, y'all. Write that down. 584 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 1: Speaking of write that down? 585 00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:38,400 Speaker 2: Where can people type and write down and plug in 586 00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 2: and figure out and grab your book because by the 587 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 2: time this episode is out, your book is available for 588 00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:46,120 Speaker 2: everybody to get. 589 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 1: So where can they get it? 590 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,640 Speaker 3: Yes, so pretty much any major bookstore, Amazon, Barnes, and Noble. 591 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 3: It'll be there. And you can also look at my 592 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:58,240 Speaker 3: website or my Instagram page. I'm the an Girl and 593 00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 3: so I have a link to the book there as well, 594 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 3: and on my personal website Sidneyandbennett dot com or Fearfully 595 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 3: and Wonderfully Broken dot com. You can also get the 596 00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 3: books through there directly. 597 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:11,720 Speaker 1: Awesome, Well, I'll link that down below. 598 00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 2: So y'all can just if you want to type in 599 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:15,400 Speaker 2: you want to go get it wherever you like to 600 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:17,480 Speaker 2: get your books, you can do that, but I'll put 601 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 2: the Amazon link down below. I'll put other links down 602 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:22,200 Speaker 2: below that you guys can check out. Remember, the title 603 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:26,040 Speaker 2: of her book is called Fearfully and Wonderfully Broken, Fighting 604 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 2: for Faith when You're falling apart. Sidney, thank you so 605 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 2: much for not only being faithful to writing this book 606 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,960 Speaker 2: and just honoring God with the story that he has 607 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,120 Speaker 2: allowed you to go through, but thank you for taking 608 00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:40,840 Speaker 2: time to be here on the podcast and just pour 609 00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:43,720 Speaker 2: into everybody who was able to listen today. 610 00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me, Kirvy. This was 611 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 3: such blessing. 612 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:50,680 Speaker 2: Yay absolutely, and to everyone who tuned in, whether you're 613 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,400 Speaker 2: watching on YouTube to the video portion, whether you are 614 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:57,720 Speaker 2: listening on Spotify or Spotify or Apple Podcasts, or wherever 615 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,040 Speaker 2: you tune into your podcast, thank you. I really hope 616 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 2: that this episode blessed you today and gave you some perspective, 617 00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:08,520 Speaker 2: some encouragement, and maybe even the words or the actions 618 00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:09,400 Speaker 2: to do. 619 00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:11,920 Speaker 1: For someone who might be going through something today. 620 00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,440 Speaker 2: But until next week, I love you, guys, and I'll 621 00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:17,000 Speaker 2: see you here next time on the Bottom Beloved Podcast. 622 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: Bye. 623 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 2: For more life giving, faith based podcast just like this one, 624 00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 2: check out lifeaudio dot com, a proud partner of the 625 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 2: Bottom Beloved Podcast.