1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:03,520 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:09,480 Speaker 2: Hi there, and welcome to the Praying Christian Women podcast. 3 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 2: I'm Jamie Hampton and today I'm so excited to welcome 4 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 2: special guest Jennifer Slattery, who is also part of the 5 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:20,840 Speaker 2: Life Audio podcast network along with her co host of 6 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 2: the Faith Overfear podcast, Carol McCracken. So, thank you, Jennifer. 7 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,080 Speaker 2: There are lots of other introductions. You're a speaker, you're 8 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 2: an author, you're a podcaster, you're so many things. Thank 9 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:33,479 Speaker 2: you for joining us on the podcast today. 10 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:35,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm excited. It's a great topic. 11 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, So for our listeners, our topic today is going 12 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 2: to be about prayer as a two way conversation, and 13 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 2: Jennifer's going to talk about her interactive prayer journaling that 14 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 2: she's been doing and making a practice of for a 15 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:51,760 Speaker 2: long time now. Before we get into that, though, we 16 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 2: love to ask all of our podcast guests, what is 17 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:57,279 Speaker 2: your favorite prayer closet? Where do you like to go 18 00:00:57,320 --> 00:00:58,120 Speaker 2: to meet with God? 19 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:03,480 Speaker 3: Yeah? So there is, there's not one place. So I've 20 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 3: started a new practice where first thing in the morning 21 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 3: where I'm trying to just pause before I open my 22 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,399 Speaker 3: eyes before I move for like five minutes where I 23 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 3: just thank God, and that really it feels like it 24 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 3: connects me. It feels like it connects me with his heart, 25 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 3: and it kind of sets the tone for the day. 26 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:25,319 Speaker 3: And then I just love on my bed with my puppy. 27 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:27,920 Speaker 3: Well she's no longer a puppy, but and I get 28 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:31,039 Speaker 3: all my research material out and so that's kind of 29 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:34,480 Speaker 3: when I feel like I'm really wrestling with God over 30 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 3: truth and hearing from him and really digging deep in scripture. 31 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:41,720 Speaker 3: And then I have another special that feels really special 32 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:43,920 Speaker 3: to me, and I guess what I'm community. Each of 33 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:46,680 Speaker 3: those are a little different in how I'm connecting with God, 34 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 3: if that makes sense. And then when in the morning, 35 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:53,559 Speaker 3: I walk my puppy and I listen to praise music, 36 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 3: and so that's a time where it's it's more free flowing, 37 00:01:57,320 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 3: where I'm more just kind of resting in God's presence, 38 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 3: I learn if he wants to speak, and communicating with 39 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 3: him when I want to speak, but also just enjoying 40 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:09,399 Speaker 3: sensing his presence. 41 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I love that you bring that up, Jennifer, 42 00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:15,640 Speaker 2: just about how prayer isn't always just going to be 43 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 2: one thing, like the way that we connect with God, 44 00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 2: just like any relationship. We're going to have these different 45 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 2: ways throughout the day that we're going to connect with him, 46 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:25,040 Speaker 2: and there's a lot of freedom in that. I think 47 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 2: sometimes we box ourselves into prayer has to look like this, 48 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 2: But I love that picture. 49 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:31,799 Speaker 1: Can you tell us about your puppy what kind of 50 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 1: act deals? 51 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:35,120 Speaker 3: I would love too? So she is a mini Golden 52 00:02:35,200 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 3: Doodle And I got to tell you that this does 53 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,560 Speaker 3: sound really sad. I learned so much about God's heart 54 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:43,640 Speaker 3: through that puppy and just like my heart towards her. 55 00:02:43,800 --> 00:02:46,680 Speaker 3: But yeah, So she turned a year in July and 56 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 3: she's about twenty five pounds. She's white, curly, fluffy, silly, snugly. Yeah, 57 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 3: she's a lot of fun. Do you have any pets? 58 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 2: Yes, we have a black lab an English lab. 59 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 3: Oh. 60 00:02:56,880 --> 00:03:03,239 Speaker 2: He's huge and goofy and fun and loving and just hilarious. 61 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:05,639 Speaker 2: We always wonder because we've had dogs along the way, 62 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 2: but we had a gap where we didn't have dogs, 63 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:10,400 Speaker 2: and we always ask like what did we do before 64 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:11,280 Speaker 2: we had a dog? 65 00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:13,360 Speaker 1: Like where did we fill our gaps of time? 66 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 2: But just you know, laughing, and you know, they so 67 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:18,960 Speaker 2: much joy. 68 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:21,799 Speaker 3: So yeah, and they slow you down like that that 69 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:25,919 Speaker 3: prayer walk, praise walk. I used to do it sporadically, 70 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 3: but now it's like I have to take time in 71 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 3: my day and it's such a great reset and kind 72 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 3: of like just stilling my soul for the day ahead 73 00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 3: or whenever, like if I do it in the afternoon 74 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 3: or whatever. It's been a huge gift to me. 75 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: Yes. Absolutely. 76 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:46,119 Speaker 3: What's your dog's name, bean, B B E A N. Yes, 77 00:03:46,240 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 3: we love that's good. 78 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 1: Well, so, Jennifer. 79 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:53,720 Speaker 2: A lot of times, I think, especially for me, when 80 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 2: I was younger in my faith, when I was a 81 00:03:55,560 --> 00:04:01,119 Speaker 2: kid and even into maybe almost into call, I kind 82 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 2: of thought of prayer as asking God for things. That 83 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 2: was just what I pictured. I mean, I knew there 84 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 2: was praise. I pictured praise and worship kind of being 85 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 2: one thing, you know, as something separate. But I just 86 00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 2: thought of prayer as like a one way ask kind 87 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:19,839 Speaker 2: of and the two way was God doing something in return. 88 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 2: But I love that you brought up this topic when 89 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:27,600 Speaker 2: we were talking about two way conversation with God, and 90 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 2: so do you remember the first time that it occurred 91 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:33,599 Speaker 2: to you that prayer was like God could talk back 92 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,599 Speaker 2: or that he could communicate. What was that like for you? 93 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, so my story might be a little different. I 94 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:42,160 Speaker 3: wasn't raised in a Christian home, and I really didn't 95 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:44,839 Speaker 3: have a lot of church experience. And when I began 96 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:49,440 Speaker 3: walking with God, I didn't know not to expect him 97 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 3: to speak. I didn't know that it wasn't so I 98 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 3: felt like it was a lot more natural, naturally occurring. 99 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 3: And then as I began getting in church culture in 100 00:05:01,160 --> 00:05:05,480 Speaker 3: some more I want to say, maybe beering on legalistic 101 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 3: and I began to it became harder to hear him 102 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 3: because I started justifying away or explaining, well, am I 103 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:16,960 Speaker 3: really sure that's his voice? And I got so caught 104 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 3: up in my head, and then prayer began to turn. 105 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 3: In fact, there was a time I look back over 106 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:25,520 Speaker 3: my journals from a period of time. It was about 107 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 3: a ten year period where if you had asked me 108 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 3: back then, I would have told you I was really 109 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 3: close with God. But I'm looking over my prayer journals 110 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 3: and it's all me, and it's the same often, like Lord, 111 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 3: help me with this, and Lord, you know I want 112 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:40,039 Speaker 3: to do this better and all of the things for 113 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:44,239 Speaker 3: ten years and that kind of saddened me, but also 114 00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:48,239 Speaker 3: it just showed me that, Okay, it's so easy, I think, 115 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:54,039 Speaker 3: to fall into an intellectualized faith, and absolutely, yes, yeah, 116 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 3: and I love I mean, I love looking at you know, 117 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 3: I love digging deep into scripture in the historical context 118 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:01,200 Speaker 3: and all of those things. So I'm and that's the 119 00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:04,480 Speaker 3: way I connect with God. But that can't be the 120 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 3: only way, right, Like, there has to be that relational 121 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 3: emotional connection, And so I'm relearning to but also in 122 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 3: that to let him speak on his terms, because sometimes 123 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:24,000 Speaker 3: I think we also get caught up in every time 124 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 3: I sit and I'm silent with God, I should hear 125 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 3: him right and and frankly I don't. And so I've 126 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 3: started and I used to get really anxious about that, 127 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:34,039 Speaker 3: and like what's going on in my soul? Am I 128 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 3: in sin? Am? I? You know? What have I done? 129 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:39,040 Speaker 3: Am I too busy? Have I disconnected from him? And 130 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:42,280 Speaker 3: that just ruins my relational bond with him? Like my 131 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:46,160 Speaker 3: time of building that bond. And I read something in 132 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 3: a book I don't remember which book, but basically said 133 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:51,680 Speaker 3: the she was a mental health professional, but she's don't 134 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 3: come in without expectation. And that reduced the anxiety that 135 00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:00,599 Speaker 3: ironically hinders me from hearing him. I get caught up 136 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 3: in my head like that. It's a lot more challenging 137 00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:06,480 Speaker 3: to hear him. So I think just by saying, okay, Lord, 138 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 3: if you choose to speak right now, I'm listening. If 139 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 3: you don't, I'm here, Your God Almighty, you get to choose. 140 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 1: That is so important. 141 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:18,840 Speaker 2: And I don't know if I've heard anyone address that 142 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,040 Speaker 2: specific thing. And I think it is so important because 143 00:07:22,760 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 2: I do think that so many of us. 144 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 1: And I'll do it. I'll open the Bible and I'll. 145 00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 2: Say, God, I want a word from you, and I 146 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 2: open to Leviticus and it's talking about, you know, all 147 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 2: of these ceremonial washings or whatever, and I'm sure you 148 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 2: glean something from that, or it's something about, you know, 149 00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 2: your enemies being dragged down to the bottom of the 150 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 2: sea with the millstone. 151 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: But I don't know. 152 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:46,680 Speaker 2: I and I just I kind of laugh, and I'm 153 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 2: just like, of course, you know, like you said, we 154 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:54,760 Speaker 2: can't force God's voice, and if we live in openness 155 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 2: to hearing from him, we're going to have those times. 156 00:07:57,600 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 2: But I have been there so many times, and I 157 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:03,280 Speaker 2: even still do it sometimes. Yeah, I try to force 158 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 2: his hand and his voice, and I get frustrated when, 159 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:10,120 Speaker 2: especially when I'm looking for discernment about a decision. 160 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:13,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Can I tell a little story that's kind 161 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:17,160 Speaker 3: of humorous. So I went to a conference for women 162 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 3: Christian communicators and on the opening night, the lady, the 163 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:24,920 Speaker 3: director had this activity that she wanted us to do. Well. 164 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 3: She paired us with people and said, Okay, you're going 165 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 3: to pray for your neighbor, the person you're paired with, 166 00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:32,160 Speaker 3: and you're going to get a word from God for them, 167 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 3: and you're going to tell that to them. And so 168 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 3: she went first, like to talk to me, and so 169 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,679 Speaker 3: she's praying and then she gives me this beautiful word 170 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 3: from God and it's pretty elaborate. And I'm listening in 171 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:46,280 Speaker 3: the room. I can hear everybody's having these conversations and 172 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 3: they are so touched and they're having such profound encounters. 173 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 3: And then it gets my turn and I got nothing. 174 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 3: I mean, I send God's presence, So don't get me wrong, 175 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 3: I sensed the Holy Spirit and I'm like, Lord, what, 176 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 3: I'm sitting there and I'm like, she needs some guys. 177 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 3: You want something? And I didn't, And I had to 178 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 3: just tell I said, I'm sorry, I've I've got nothing, 179 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 3: and I think one thing, and I kind of wrestled 180 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 3: with that and thought about it later. I think there's 181 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 3: a tendency in those moments when we feel like we 182 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:21,520 Speaker 3: should receive that special word. It is very easy for 183 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 3: us to then create a special word and justify in 184 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 3: our brains that well, yeah, this probably is and that's dangerous. 185 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:33,680 Speaker 2: I'm so glad you brought that up, because I was 186 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 2: just about to commend you for being honest and not 187 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 2: just trying to conjure something up, because that is a 188 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 2: lot of pressure to be in and for you to 189 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 2: be just absolutely honest. So can you talk about that 190 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:49,160 Speaker 2: a little bit? A how do you know when you're 191 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:52,400 Speaker 2: not hearing something? How do you know if you think 192 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 2: you might have heard something that it is from God, 193 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 2: that it's not just you talk about that? 194 00:09:57,520 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, so well, I tend to operate from a I'm 195 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:04,320 Speaker 3: trying to operate I should say, from a place of trust, 196 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:08,320 Speaker 3: meaning Jesus said, if my sheep will hear my voice, 197 00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:11,320 Speaker 3: and so I tell him, I'm like, Lord, teach me, 198 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 3: help me. Like I tend to see, it is his 199 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:16,920 Speaker 3: responsibility to speak to me in a way that I 200 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:20,160 Speaker 3: can understand now that I do think we have to 201 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 3: do our heart work first. So Romans twelve one and 202 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 3: two says, in view of God's mercy, present your body 203 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 3: as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God. This 204 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:32,560 Speaker 3: is your spiritual act of worship. Then you will know 205 00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:36,200 Speaker 3: and test and approve what God's will is his good, pleasing, 206 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:39,800 Speaker 3: perfect will. And I found I actually will pray that often. 207 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:42,960 Speaker 3: And I found if I follow those steps, and it's 208 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 3: this opening my soul to Him and saying, Lord, I 209 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 3: am giving you my agenda, I'm giving you my desires. 210 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 3: I'm relinquishing my pride, and so I will normally I 211 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 3: do have to say, I like to start with confession 212 00:10:57,120 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 3: and where I just take time and I'm like, Lord, 213 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:04,240 Speaker 3: what in my soul is hindering our relationship and my 214 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 3: ability to hear you? And that's an ongoing conversation, because 215 00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:10,320 Speaker 3: whether we want to admit it or not, we all 216 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:14,240 Speaker 3: have areas of deception. And so I'm just again, I'm 217 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:17,839 Speaker 3: trusting him, Lord, protect me from deception, give me a 218 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,560 Speaker 3: hunger for you, give me a hunger for truth. I 219 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:23,679 Speaker 3: can't create those things on my own. And then I 220 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 3: trust him to do that to lead me to speak 221 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:31,800 Speaker 3: to me in ways I understand, to correct me when 222 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 3: I'm veering off path. To reiterate, a lot of times 223 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 3: he will, He'll give off sense a message in scripture, 224 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:43,760 Speaker 3: and then I'll kind of sense the same message in 225 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:46,680 Speaker 3: as I'm praying, and then you know, I'll talk to 226 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 3: somebody and they'll kind of have the same message. So 227 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 3: he's so he's so gracious that he wants us in 228 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 3: his will even more than we want to be in 229 00:11:57,120 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 3: his will, and he wants to connect with us even 230 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:02,440 Speaker 3: where than we want to connect with him. And so 231 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 3: I think, just again trusting him, going back to well, 232 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:10,960 Speaker 3: if I don't hear him, then it's okay. If I 233 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:14,280 Speaker 3: hear him wrong, I really trust that if I'm honestly 234 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,520 Speaker 3: trying to seek him, he'll nudge me in the right direction. 235 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,640 Speaker 3: And He's been really faithful in that, and more often 236 00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:25,480 Speaker 3: than not, it's been when I am veering the wrong way. 237 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,439 Speaker 3: In fact, every time that I can think of, I've known, 238 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 3: I've had a prick in my spirit, I've had a conviction, 239 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 3: I've had like a sense of anxiety or something that 240 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 3: my spirit knew, Okay, this isn't where God's leading. And 241 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:43,560 Speaker 3: I chose to either justify it away, excuse it away, 242 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:46,679 Speaker 3: or you know, like, oh no, that's probably not God. 243 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 3: So I don't know if that answers your question, But 244 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,800 Speaker 3: I ultimately I think if we keep our heart right 245 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 3: with God and our desire is to align with him, 246 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:00,280 Speaker 3: he takes care of everything else. Yeah. 247 00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:01,080 Speaker 1: I appreciate that. 248 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 2: And you know, also you talking about that confirmation process 249 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 2: if you're not totally sure to confirm with scripture, to 250 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 2: confirm with what you're hearing and seeing other people receiving 251 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:17,400 Speaker 2: from God, if it involves a decision, which sometimes having 252 00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:20,959 Speaker 2: other people involved makes it better because you can see 253 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 2: are we all hearing the same thing? 254 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:25,000 Speaker 1: Are we kind of moving in the direction? 255 00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:27,600 Speaker 2: What would you say to someone who came back, because 256 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:29,439 Speaker 2: I know that there are some people who will say, 257 00:13:30,040 --> 00:13:33,040 Speaker 2: if you think you're hearing from God just in general, 258 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: you're wrong. The only way you can hear is just 259 00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:38,040 Speaker 2: by reading God's word. That's the only way you can 260 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:40,319 Speaker 2: hear from him. Do you have a response to them, 261 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,839 Speaker 2: and do you feel like there are any kernels of 262 00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 2: truth in people who are nervous about receiving anything that 263 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:48,720 Speaker 2: isn't in the Bible. 264 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:03,439 Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, first of all, I could I have compassion 265 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 3: for that I can understand, and especially like I I 266 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 3: enter church culture in the whole what I would call 267 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 3: the Satanic panic where everybody was never heard of that. 268 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 3: But yeah, yeah, and so if you have roots in that, 269 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 3: it can be frightening. And so I understand that, and 270 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 3: I do think sometimes too, that is a response to 271 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 3: people kind of veering too far the other way where 272 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 3: they put it. They make scripture mean whatever they want 273 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 3: it to mean because God told this, and they're out 274 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 3: telling their prophesies, you know, when God told me this 275 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 3: for you, and God's going to do this, and they're 276 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 3: really following their emotions. So I think there's a fear component, 277 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 3: but I also think there is. Scripture absolutely is the 278 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:50,960 Speaker 3: only objective way that we truly will know God and 279 00:14:51,000 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 3: his character and his heart and his ways. And if 280 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 3: we don't have that peace, then yeah, it's a very 281 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 3: dangerous place to be because we are creating our own world, 282 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 3: you and our own theology. So scripture absolutely has to 283 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 3: be our foundation and our anchor. And also the more 284 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 3: we know it, the more it becomes a part of us. 285 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 3: And so we begin to think like Jesus, right, like, 286 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 3: the more we read his thoughts the more we think 287 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 3: his thoughts, and yet I would challenge them, how is 288 00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 3: that a relationship. It's a great life behavior modification, and 289 00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 3: you can still be saved, be secure in Jesus Christ right, 290 00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 3: and be following head knowledge. And again, like I said, 291 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 3: behavior modification. But Jesus said, my sheep will know my voice. 292 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 3: And God's our father, right. I mean, there's so many 293 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 3: deep relational words and phrases and psalms and names of 294 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 3: God that convey to me that he wants to connect 295 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 3: with us on a soul to soul level. And I 296 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 3: would say again, you have to trust the Father if 297 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 3: he is a good and loving father and you are 298 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 3: actively God said, if you seek me and you seek 299 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 3: me with all your heart, I will be found by you. 300 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:15,880 Speaker 3: So trust him on that that as long as you 301 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 3: are seeking him and you're in Christian community that's important, 302 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 3: You're in scripture, that's important, you're actively trying to live 303 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:28,440 Speaker 3: a holy life like you're not pursuing sin, you're not 304 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 3: feeding your sin nature. Then trust God to gently grow 305 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 3: you and speak to you and let you know when 306 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:39,320 Speaker 3: you're being deceived or getting off path. 307 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's really good. 308 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 2: And you brought up something important too, that there are 309 00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 2: people who will adhere to the Bible only and still 310 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 2: use it wrong, you know, still tak it out of 311 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:53,360 Speaker 2: context and use it as a weapon in the wrong 312 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 2: way because they're not open and humble. Like what you're 313 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 2: saying is like having a spear of humility about the 314 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 2: whole thing. 315 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 1: Like I'm a human, I'm flawed. 316 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 2: Please God, you know, ask please speak to me, rather 317 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:13,200 Speaker 2: than you know, viewing yourself as this powerful prophet that's 318 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 2: going to speak truth to everyone. 319 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:19,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, and yeah, Well can. 320 00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:22,879 Speaker 2: You talk a little bit about your process. You've talked 321 00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:25,920 Speaker 2: about how you have this interactive journaling that. 322 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:26,320 Speaker 1: You go through. 323 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 2: I would love to hear what your process is, how 324 00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:30,199 Speaker 2: you came up with that. 325 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 3: So I'm in therapy. I've been in therapy for about 326 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 3: three years and I've learned this actually from my therapist, 327 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 3: and it's been a huge part of my healing journey, 328 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:44,439 Speaker 3: my growth journey, my transformational journey. And there's a lot 329 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 3: of different ways you can do it, but what works 330 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:50,560 Speaker 3: for me is I like to start with gratitude, where 331 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:53,880 Speaker 3: I'm thanking God and writing it down. I'm thanking Him 332 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 3: for certain things, and that does a couple things. It 333 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:01,239 Speaker 3: turns on what's called our relational circuits, which makes it 334 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 3: easier to hear from him and kind of gets us 335 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:08,960 Speaker 3: out of our head right, Like we're stepping into peaceful, grateful, 336 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:13,399 Speaker 3: joyful relational mode, which makes us more receptive to his voice. 337 00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:15,640 Speaker 3: And then I just I pause. A lot of times 338 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,480 Speaker 3: I'll just say, Lord, is there something you want to 339 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,360 Speaker 3: say to me? Sometimes I'll just pause and I'll send 340 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:25,440 Speaker 3: him responding to what I wrote, And then it creates 341 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:30,479 Speaker 3: this ongoing conversation where I'll just write something and I pause, 342 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 3: and it kind of goes back to the like are 343 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,280 Speaker 3: these my thoughts? Are these from the devil? Are these 344 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 3: from the world? Are these from God? Well? They suggest 345 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 3: in that process when you're journaling, when you're sitting with God, 346 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:46,640 Speaker 3: you don't analyze it all, right, then, So I write 347 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 3: it down and I'll do like a dash when I 348 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,760 Speaker 3: sense God talking, and I write it in his voice, 349 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:55,400 Speaker 3: and then I go back later because I don't want 350 00:18:55,400 --> 00:18:57,880 Speaker 3: to disrupt the flow. It's like if you're having coffee 351 00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 3: with a friend and she's telling you about your house 352 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:02,000 Speaker 3: and you're like, did I really just hear about the house, 353 00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:05,199 Speaker 3: and like what color was like? And it disrupts the conversation, right, 354 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,920 Speaker 3: disrupts the connection, And so I think you're prioritizing connection 355 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,840 Speaker 3: in that space. And then you can go back later 356 00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 3: and say, was this really God? Does this sound like 357 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 3: something he would say? Does this produce in me? What scripture? 358 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 1: You know? 359 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:24,400 Speaker 3: Love? Joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, that sort of thing, 360 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 3: And so far, for me, it's been confirmed in other ways, 361 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 3: and it's been healing and helpful. And again, I don't 362 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 3: always hear from him, and I do have to say 363 00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:40,040 Speaker 3: one thing. For initially, for a long time, I kept 364 00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 3: hearing the same thing, you know, as I will never 365 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 3: leave you, I love you, I won't forsake you, and 366 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:49,680 Speaker 3: I got frustrated. I'm like, Okay, I know my therapist 367 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:53,440 Speaker 3: has these really long, beautiful conversations with you, and you're 368 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 3: giving me the same thing over and over and over again. 369 00:19:56,840 --> 00:19:58,439 Speaker 3: And I sensed him saying to me, that's what you 370 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,640 Speaker 3: need to hear, and I'm like, Okay, Okay, I guess 371 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 3: this isn't penetrating as deeply as it needs to penetrate 372 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 3: before we can move on to whatever you want to 373 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:09,679 Speaker 3: say next. 374 00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, well that and that is evidence that you were 375 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,600 Speaker 2: really seeking God, because if it was just you and 376 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 2: you really wanted to hear all of these elaborate conversations, 377 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 2: you would have manifested those in your book by writing 378 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 2: them down. So yeah, I love that. Has your process 379 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:31,680 Speaker 2: evolved over time? Has it changed since you first started 380 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:32,160 Speaker 2: doing it? 381 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:36,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's simplified. And there's actually one book 382 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 3: too that's very helpful and I'm going to see if 383 00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 3: I can find it. It's When the Soul Listens. It's 384 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:45,160 Speaker 3: called When the Soul Listens, and she has an interactive 385 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:49,159 Speaker 3: where you read a section of scripture and you pause 386 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:53,359 Speaker 3: and you picture yourself in there, and then something beautiful 387 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:55,800 Speaker 3: happens when you're doing it in connection with the Holy Spirit, 388 00:20:55,840 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 3: where God actually meets you in that space. Maybe not always, 389 00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:03,880 Speaker 3: like again, we don't want to put expectations on how 390 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 3: God is going to respond, but so that is, you know, 391 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:10,919 Speaker 3: kind of being a little more creative sometimes with some 392 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:15,600 Speaker 3: of like using imagery or allowing God to use imagery. 393 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:21,720 Speaker 3: And I probably am more. Initially there were like outlines 394 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,280 Speaker 3: I followed, kind of guidelines I followed, and now I'm 395 00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:27,399 Speaker 3: a little more organic with it. But yeah, initially it 396 00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:30,159 Speaker 3: was following it kind of had some prompts that you 397 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,320 Speaker 3: could follow through that that were helpful to just get 398 00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:37,639 Speaker 3: me started. Sometimes it's for me, it's very helpful to 399 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 3: have music, and it's also a lot of times helpful 400 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,480 Speaker 3: for me to move. So like when I'm walking for 401 00:21:43,560 --> 00:21:46,240 Speaker 3: some reason, when I'm walking out in nature, well, nature 402 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:48,960 Speaker 3: for me is a really big connection with God. And 403 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 3: so I think finding your own when you can think 404 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 3: back over threads in your life of like when have 405 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 3: you most felt connected with God? That potentially could be 406 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,159 Speaker 3: a space where you're going to be most receptive to hear. 407 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 3: And but I want to also for those who are listening. 408 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:07,880 Speaker 3: So my daughter is an engineer and she does not 409 00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:10,280 Speaker 3: connect with God in the same way. She does not 410 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 3: connect with him through music. She's more intellectual, and she 411 00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:15,560 Speaker 3: told me when she was in high school, She's like, Mom, 412 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 3: I don't see God in music. I see him in math. 413 00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:22,359 Speaker 3: And for her are in math very visual. We often 414 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:24,280 Speaker 3: think God is going to speak to us. We think, okay, 415 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:27,200 Speaker 3: it has to be verbal, it has to be language, 416 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:30,719 Speaker 3: and for some people it might be visual. For like 417 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 3: my daughter, it might be more like mathematical, like she 418 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 3: sees profound things about his character through calculus. Which is 419 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:43,359 Speaker 3: insane to me. So I think just giving ourselves recognizing 420 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 3: the Lord who created us uniquely will speak to us uniquely, 421 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 3: and our experience with him will not be exactly like 422 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,159 Speaker 3: our mothers or our brothers, or our best friend or 423 00:22:56,200 --> 00:23:00,640 Speaker 3: our sisters. And so I think allowing it to develop 424 00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:04,640 Speaker 3: over time as an organic relationship, just as we would 425 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:08,400 Speaker 3: with any other relationship with the caveat that he is almighty, 426 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 3: all powerful, holy creator God. So but also it's a relationship. 427 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:16,920 Speaker 2: Yes, I'm so glad you said that, because I love 428 00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 2: your That's such a tangible example of your daughter seeing 429 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:25,000 Speaker 2: God in calculus and not in praise and worship music 430 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 2: or in whatever. I think that's so important for people listening, 431 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,840 Speaker 2: because you know, just like you kind of were comparing 432 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:36,119 Speaker 2: your hearing from God to the person that taught it 433 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,480 Speaker 2: to you and thinking, well, what's wrong with me? 434 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker 1: Why aren't you? 435 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 2: Do you not love me as much as you love 436 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:42,760 Speaker 2: this person because you're not communicating. 437 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's. 438 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:46,160 Speaker 2: Where I would go in my mind, like well why 439 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,240 Speaker 2: did you give this to this person? And looking at 440 00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:52,440 Speaker 2: other people's communication with God or their relationship with God 441 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:55,560 Speaker 2: and feeling less then because yours doesn't look like that 442 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 2: at this point and forever. And I think it's so 443 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,320 Speaker 2: important to kind of know yourself and maybe kind of 444 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:04,080 Speaker 2: evolve your way of talking with God. If one thing 445 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:08,440 Speaker 2: isn't working or feeling like you're connecting with God, maybe 446 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:10,600 Speaker 2: shift the way you're doing it. And I think that's 447 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 2: such a powerful reminder. I see God in science. I 448 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:19,720 Speaker 2: studied science, and you know everything. I mean, it's like, 449 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 2: you know, the heavens declare the glory of God all 450 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 2: of creation, and through science and discovering scientific truths, it 451 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 2: just becomes more and more evident that there's this amazing 452 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 2: creator and so everyone experiences him differently. 453 00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: And I'm just so glad you want that. 454 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 2: I'm just wandering through your process of interactive journaling. Have 455 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:57,960 Speaker 2: you been surprised by something God has told you? Just 456 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:02,040 Speaker 2: something where you're just like, wow, Okay, that didn't come 457 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:02,359 Speaker 2: from me. 458 00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:07,640 Speaker 3: Yes, Well, I mean I think one of the things 459 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 3: is what I told you is where it was just 460 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:13,360 Speaker 3: him reiterating and I want to say, Jamie, that went on. 461 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:16,439 Speaker 3: It was more than a month. I'm talking daily for 462 00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 3: a month, and yeah, and so just really reiterating to me, 463 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 3: which I think is that we never get beyond that 464 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 3: profound truth that we are loved by God. 465 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, we never get We never dig deep enough to 466 00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:31,440 Speaker 2: really uncover what it means, do we. 467 00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:35,199 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But there was another time where it 468 00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:37,960 Speaker 3: was in my healing journey, and so I was actually 469 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 3: homeless in my late teens, and I was struggling just 470 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,399 Speaker 3: with shame from things I did in my teen years, 471 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:49,920 Speaker 3: things that I experienced, and really carrying a heavy weight 472 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:55,159 Speaker 3: of condemnation and wanting honestly, I was wanting God to 473 00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:57,800 Speaker 3: convict me and to like, you know, yes you did 474 00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:01,560 Speaker 3: this x y Z. And it was confusing to me 475 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:03,920 Speaker 3: that he was not responding to me in that way. 476 00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 3: He was responding to me with such gentleness and grace. 477 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 3: So for me, he will often when I hear from him, 478 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,159 Speaker 3: it's like a continued conversation where he might say a 479 00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 3: little bit one day, and then maybe I'm out in 480 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:17,879 Speaker 3: a walk and he'll kind of expand on it. I 481 00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 3: think it takes my brain time to catch up, I'm 482 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:22,720 Speaker 3: not sure, but and then like a couple days later 483 00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,200 Speaker 3: he'll give a little more information. And so in this 484 00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,520 Speaker 3: one I happened to be reading and it's in Psalm 485 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:31,640 Speaker 3: thirty seven some thirty seven five, where it says those 486 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:34,400 Speaker 3: who look to the Lord are radiant, their faces are 487 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:37,920 Speaker 3: never covered in shame. And so that spoke really clearly, 488 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 3: but I didn't fully grasp what God was trying to 489 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:43,000 Speaker 3: say to me, and so then I went and looked 490 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,720 Speaker 3: at the historical context. And that was when David wrote 491 00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:51,919 Speaker 3: that after he had pretended to be insane to flee 492 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 3: to find safety from Saul, the reigning king, who was 493 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,280 Speaker 3: trying to kill him, and then he was in Philistine 494 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,560 Speaker 3: territory and he was afraid in danger there, and so 495 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:05,840 Speaker 3: he behaved in a shameful way for survival. And I 496 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:07,440 Speaker 3: sensed God saying that to you, but I was still 497 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,480 Speaker 3: pushing back. I'm like, no, I still need you to 498 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:14,800 Speaker 3: like convict me right, like I need to be disciplined 499 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,760 Speaker 3: or at least chastised for this. And there was a 500 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,919 Speaker 3: series of events where I sensed him saying to me 501 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:26,199 Speaker 3: that during that season I was basically dead inside, like 502 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 3: to survive, I guess. And it was about, I want 503 00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:33,119 Speaker 3: to say, a week or two later where I was 504 00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,280 Speaker 3: talking to a friend who knew me from back then, 505 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:38,119 Speaker 3: and I just said, Hey, do you mind if I 506 00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 3: ask you because I was still trying to like in 507 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,119 Speaker 3: those INSS, I didn't want to. I think why this 508 00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:45,879 Speaker 3: was so hard. I didn't want to absolve myself of 509 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:48,360 Speaker 3: something that God still wanted to deal with. I think 510 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 3: was what was really going on. And it's really easy 511 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:52,960 Speaker 3: to be like, I'm forgiven, I'm in grace right Like, 512 00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,320 Speaker 3: I didn't want to self deceive. And I said, how 513 00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:56,880 Speaker 3: did you view. 514 00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:57,440 Speaker 1: Me back then? 515 00:27:57,720 --> 00:27:59,199 Speaker 3: And she said, I don't know. You just seem kind 516 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:02,879 Speaker 3: of dead and it just and so I was able 517 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:04,760 Speaker 3: to receive that, And I think that goes back to 518 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 3: what you said too, Like it was a message in scripture, 519 00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:11,239 Speaker 3: it was a message during my interactive journal time, and 520 00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,080 Speaker 3: it was the same message when I was talking to 521 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 3: my friend. So it was a continued message. It wasn't 522 00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 3: just like this zip of a thought. And so I 523 00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 3: think that goes back to how do we know if 524 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 3: it's from God is persistent for me in my life. 525 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 3: He's when he wants me just like the I love you, 526 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 3: I love you, I love you, I love you, I 527 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,159 Speaker 3: love you, I love you. When he is wanting me 528 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,320 Speaker 3: to know something or he's wanting me to do something. 529 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:38,200 Speaker 3: If I don't catch it the first time, he will 530 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:41,720 Speaker 3: keep repeating it in a gentle, loving way. He doesn't 531 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 3: get frustrated, but he's like, Okay, he didn't hear me 532 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 3: that way. Let me try this. 533 00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:47,480 Speaker 1: Yeah. 534 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:49,840 Speaker 2: And that's such a relief because it takes the I 535 00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:52,080 Speaker 2: think a lot of times. My problem is it's not 536 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:54,240 Speaker 2: that I don't trust God to be able to communicate 537 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:56,960 Speaker 2: with me. I trust my ability to hear from him. 538 00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 2: But you know, I've heard I heard someone resent say 539 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:06,040 Speaker 2: something about how we can attune our ears to the 540 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 2: frequency of God's voice. And I love that analogy because 541 00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:12,480 Speaker 2: there's so much coming at us. We've got all different voices, 542 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,640 Speaker 2: including our own, including the enemy, including the world. And 543 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:19,840 Speaker 2: I just feel like the way that we can attune 544 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:23,520 Speaker 2: our voices, we can, like you said, like by knowing scripture, 545 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:28,960 Speaker 2: by reading scripture, by making Bible study and reading God's 546 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 2: word part of our lives. I mean, that's one way 547 00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 2: to attune our ears. But this other way is this 548 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 2: trust of shifting your focus from I have to be 549 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:44,360 Speaker 2: trusted to hear him right too. I can trust him 550 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 2: to tell me what I need to know, and just 551 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:52,240 Speaker 2: having an open handedness and not a fear of hearing right. 552 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 2: I love the way that has kind of happened for you. 553 00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,680 Speaker 2: What would you say for someone that's interested in starting 554 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,960 Speaker 2: to actively journal, what would be a good first step 555 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 2: that you would recommend. 556 00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, so I believe a Deeper Walk International actually has 557 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,720 Speaker 3: some guidance online. And then also the book When the 558 00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:16,959 Speaker 3: Soul Listens is a really good resource as well. Following that, 559 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:19,760 Speaker 3: or even if you're like, I'm not a reader and 560 00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 3: that's too much, I would suggest something that my therapist 561 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:25,800 Speaker 3: had suggested that I try to make a practice of 562 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 3: is before you read scripture, just be silent for two minutes, 563 00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,040 Speaker 3: and it'll feel two minutes will feel super long in 564 00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 3: the beginning, and just kind of with the attitude of like, Lord, 565 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 3: help me to hear you. Teach me to hear you. 566 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:43,720 Speaker 3: If you choose to speak right now, wonderful. If not, 567 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:47,480 Speaker 3: just know I am turning my heart towards you, and 568 00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:49,480 Speaker 3: I think as long as we just keep saying Lord, 569 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,719 Speaker 3: teach me. And I like what you said, try things 570 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:56,640 Speaker 3: like I do journaling, because that's really helpful to me. 571 00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:59,960 Speaker 3: If you don't do journaling, maybe speak out loud, maybe 572 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:02,920 Speaker 3: we write poetry, Maybe go for a walk, Like there's 573 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:06,440 Speaker 3: so many other ways we can experience God, but just 574 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:10,800 Speaker 3: pay attention to like this is when He most resonated 575 00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 3: in my soul, and then do more of that. But 576 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:18,880 Speaker 3: then also be open if somebody presents a new practice 577 00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 3: that you haven't maybe tried. 578 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:23,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, that is great advice. Well, thank you so much 579 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:25,800 Speaker 2: for sharing about this, Jennifer. Can you tell us a 580 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,800 Speaker 2: little bit more about your podcast Faith over Sure that 581 00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 2: you can post with Carol. 582 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 3: Yeah. So we believe that God does want us to 583 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 3: live in freedom. We take Jesus's words. We don't believe 584 00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 3: it was a hyperbole when he said I came that 585 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 3: you might have life and have it to the full. 586 00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:42,680 Speaker 3: We believe he wants us to have vibrant life. But 587 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:46,960 Speaker 3: unfortunately we do live in a world where we've been wounded, 588 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:50,040 Speaker 3: where there's a lot of chaos going on, where things 589 00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,680 Speaker 3: can feel pretty unsettling, and so we will fear and 590 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,800 Speaker 3: experience anxiety. But we don't have to sit there. I 591 00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 3: believe that God gives us tools, and so what we 592 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 3: do is we provide scripture and practices, brain science, mental 593 00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:10,920 Speaker 3: health components, all of these things to give some maybe 594 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,560 Speaker 3: ideas or steps people can take if they want to 595 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 3: experience increased freedom. And again we do it all through. 596 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 3: It really comes down to where is God leading you 597 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,800 Speaker 3: in your particular journey. Here are some things that work 598 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:27,160 Speaker 3: for this person, but it's a processing through all of that. 599 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 3: With christ is a big component of our because we 600 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:33,720 Speaker 3: say faith over fear. It's not that we don't have fear, 601 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 3: it's we're choosing faith, so the fear's there, but we're 602 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,000 Speaker 3: saying I'm going to choose to walk in faith to 603 00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:43,200 Speaker 3: the best of my ability, and we want to walk 604 00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:45,200 Speaker 3: beside people as they make that choice. 605 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:47,120 Speaker 1: I love it well. 606 00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 2: And so for those listening, we are all brain Christian 607 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:52,960 Speaker 2: women and Faith over Fear all part of the Life 608 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:57,680 Speaker 2: Audio podcast network. So you can find your podcast over 609 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 2: on lifeaudio dot com or anywhere you find podcasts. 610 00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:03,800 Speaker 3: And you're going to be on my podcast, so that's right. 611 00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, we'll be sharing about that so you can 612 00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:08,760 Speaker 2: be looking forward to that too. 613 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: That's exciting. 614 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:14,080 Speaker 2: Yes, all right, Well, where can our listeners find you? 615 00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,880 Speaker 2: Because you've got all kinds of things, You've got Bible studies, 616 00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:19,880 Speaker 2: you write all kinds of things, so yeah, where can 617 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 2: they find you and your books and connect with you 618 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 2: on social media all of those things? 619 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:26,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, So I do want to say, I just have 620 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 3: a new Bible reading plan that released on the You 621 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 3: Version Bible app on October six, embracing your true self 622 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:37,640 Speaker 3: living and your Christ centered identity. So I would encourage 623 00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,520 Speaker 3: people can just search for that. But also if you 624 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 3: just my website, Jennifer Slattery Lives out Loud pretty much 625 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:45,440 Speaker 3: will direct you wherever you want to go, whether you 626 00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 3: want to find me on social media and connect there, 627 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:51,760 Speaker 3: or on YouTube or my articles or wherever else. 628 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 1: All right, so go to the website. 629 00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:56,520 Speaker 2: Well, we will link to all of that in our 630 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 2: show notes. And Jennifer, it's been so good getting to 631 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,240 Speaker 2: connect with you and talk with you. 632 00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:02,960 Speaker 1: Thanks for being part of the podcast. 633 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:04,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, this was awesome. 634 00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:05,440 Speaker 1: Yeah. 635 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 2: So I'd like to close in prayer. How can we 636 00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:08,320 Speaker 2: pray for you today? 637 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:10,839 Speaker 3: Yeah? I think, well, maybe just for all of us, 638 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 3: But I really am feeling just such a burden to 639 00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:18,719 Speaker 3: be an active peacemaker in our culture. I think it's 640 00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:22,160 Speaker 3: such an opportunity for the Gospel and to build bridges 641 00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 3: with people who are desperately hungry for Christ, even if 642 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 3: they don't recognize it, living in fear and anxiety because 643 00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:32,719 Speaker 3: they don't have Jesus, and so me personally. I want 644 00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,360 Speaker 3: to be a peacemaker and I'm just praying that God's 645 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:39,600 Speaker 3: spirit will rise up in his children to build bridges 646 00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:40,480 Speaker 3: and not barriers. 647 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 1: Oh that's beautiful, all right, Well let's pray. 648 00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:45,200 Speaker 3: Yeah. 649 00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:47,359 Speaker 2: God, we just thank you for this time today. Thank 650 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,960 Speaker 2: you for connecting praying Christian women, faith over fear. Thank 651 00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:54,840 Speaker 2: you for Life Audio for being just this amazing steward 652 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:58,320 Speaker 2: of Christian podcasts. We just thank you for all of 653 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:02,080 Speaker 2: their support, and just pray for your blessing on Jennifer 654 00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:07,919 Speaker 2: and Carol and their podcast, for Jennifer's ministry, we pray 655 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:10,319 Speaker 2: for her puppy. Just thank you for the joy that 656 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:13,880 Speaker 2: our dogs bring us and our pets. God, we lift 657 00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 2: up the body of Christ to you today. We just 658 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:22,360 Speaker 2: pray that you would just descend with a spirit of peace, 659 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:27,200 Speaker 2: a spirit of harmony, and that you would just allow 660 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:33,000 Speaker 2: us as believers to look inside of ourselves for anything 661 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:36,720 Speaker 2: that's causing division among either brothers and sisters in Christ 662 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:40,000 Speaker 2: or the world at large. Show us how we can 663 00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:44,800 Speaker 2: build bridges, show us just how we can bring peace, 664 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:48,400 Speaker 2: and how we can point people to Jesus in a 665 00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:52,640 Speaker 2: way that is attractive, that is authentic and that above 666 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,759 Speaker 2: and beyond anything else, displays the love of Christ that 667 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 2: is just revolutionary. It is so contrary to the love 668 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,200 Speaker 2: that the world knows, and we just pray that they'll 669 00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:04,120 Speaker 2: know us by our love. 670 00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:07,720 Speaker 1: Thank you, man and Jesus Man. Amen. Amen. 671 00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:16,120 Speaker 2: Do you love true crime but feel like it's a 672 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 2: guilty pleasure because of the swearing and explicit content. 673 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:23,080 Speaker 1: If so, I can't wait to tell you the good news. 674 00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:26,920 Speaker 2: Alana and I just launched our brand new podcast, Christian 675 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,960 Speaker 2: True Crime Junkies, a squeaky clean crime show for believers. 676 00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 1: Each week we. 677 00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 2: Bring you unforgettable testimonies of survival, stories of justice, and 678 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 2: tales of redemption. And yes, sometimes plain old murder, always clean, 679 00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:47,279 Speaker 2: always from a Christian perspective. Listen to Christian True Crime 680 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:51,200 Speaker 2: Junkies today wherever you listen to podcasts, and don't forget 681 00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:54,120 Speaker 2: to follow us. New episodes come out every week and 682 00:36:54,160 --> 00:37:01,399 Speaker 2: you don't want to miss out. We'd like to take 683 00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:03,399 Speaker 2: just a quick second to thank the team at Life 684 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,600 Speaker 2: Audio for their partnership with us on the podcast. If 685 00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:09,440 Speaker 2: you go to lifeaudio dot com, you will find dozens 686 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 2: of other faith centered podcasts in their network. They've got 687 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:15,919 Speaker 2: shows about prayer, Bible study, parenting, and so much more. 688 00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:21,520 Speaker 2: That's life audio dot com.