1 00:00:08,257 --> 00:00:09,057 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:11,097 --> 00:00:14,457 Speaker 2: Head over to the Jesus Calling YouTube channel for inspirational 3 00:00:14,537 --> 00:00:18,337 Speaker 2: video content that will enhance your spiritual life. Each week, 4 00:00:18,377 --> 00:00:22,177 Speaker 2: you'll find beautiful devotional videos from morning, evening, and sleep, 5 00:00:22,457 --> 00:00:26,416 Speaker 2: as well as stories and readings from celebrities, authors, pastors, 6 00:00:26,616 --> 00:00:28,976 Speaker 2: and everyday people who share how God has worked in 7 00:00:29,017 --> 00:00:32,177 Speaker 2: their lives. You'll also find the Jesus Listen Stories of 8 00:00:32,217 --> 00:00:37,577 Speaker 2: Prayer series hosted by Susie McIntyre, eton Jesus Calling podcast episodes, 9 00:00:37,817 --> 00:00:40,937 Speaker 2: and a scripture based bonus series where experts walk us 10 00:00:40,976 --> 00:00:44,336 Speaker 2: through specific books of the Bible. Subscribe today for new 11 00:00:44,417 --> 00:00:45,457 Speaker 2: videos each week. 12 00:00:48,737 --> 00:00:51,496 Speaker 3: You know, all any of us has any day is 13 00:00:51,777 --> 00:00:56,737 Speaker 3: what we wake up with, that toolkit, those decision making skills, 14 00:00:57,377 --> 00:00:59,137 Speaker 3: and nothing stays static. 15 00:00:59,777 --> 00:01:01,737 Speaker 1: Life is happening to all of us all the time, 16 00:01:01,937 --> 00:01:05,137 Speaker 1: and we have to be gentle with ourselves in general, 17 00:01:05,177 --> 00:01:05,897 Speaker 1: with each other each other. 18 00:01:07,257 --> 00:01:10,417 Speaker 2: Welcome to the Jesus Calling Podcast. This week, we're honored 19 00:01:10,417 --> 00:01:12,297 Speaker 2: to welcome back a dear friend of the show, the 20 00:01:12,497 --> 00:01:16,417 Speaker 2: iconic artist, singer and Grammy Award winner Amy Grant. Amy 21 00:01:16,497 --> 00:01:18,577 Speaker 2: joins us to share her heart about her first album 22 00:01:18,617 --> 00:01:22,097 Speaker 2: of original material in thirteen years. The deeply personal project 23 00:01:22,137 --> 00:01:25,657 Speaker 2: titled The Me That Remains. In this moving interview, Amy 24 00:01:25,737 --> 00:01:28,417 Speaker 2: opens up about the profound life events that inspired her 25 00:01:28,417 --> 00:01:31,497 Speaker 2: new music, navigating the tender journey of aging and caring 26 00:01:31,497 --> 00:01:33,297 Speaker 2: for her parents at the end of their lives, her 27 00:01:33,337 --> 00:01:36,617 Speaker 2: ongoing recovery from a serious bike accident, and the enduring 28 00:01:36,697 --> 00:01:38,857 Speaker 2: joy of creating music that she feels. 29 00:01:38,537 --> 00:01:39,977 Speaker 1: Grateful to share with the world. 30 00:01:40,497 --> 00:01:43,417 Speaker 2: Later in the episode, we'll hear from Andrew Osanga, a 31 00:01:43,537 --> 00:01:47,497 Speaker 2: Nashville based musician, writer, and podcaster. Andrew spent years trapped 32 00:01:47,497 --> 00:01:50,057 Speaker 2: in the tension between his private doubts and the crushing 33 00:01:50,137 --> 00:01:51,697 Speaker 2: expectation of performing. 34 00:01:51,337 --> 00:01:52,337 Speaker 1: As a Christian artist. 35 00:01:52,737 --> 00:01:55,857 Speaker 2: Growing up, image was everything, and he struggled under pressure 36 00:01:55,857 --> 00:01:58,497 Speaker 2: to appear put together even when he felt broken inside. 37 00:01:58,537 --> 00:02:02,937 Speaker 2: It took devastating loss, including his home flooding, displacing his family, 38 00:02:03,177 --> 00:02:06,057 Speaker 2: and his wife's grueling cancer journey for him to finally 39 00:02:06,097 --> 00:02:10,496 Speaker 2: break free from performance driven faith. Let's begin with Amy's story. 40 00:02:12,457 --> 00:02:15,937 Speaker 3: Aging felt like a mystery to me. My parents did 41 00:02:15,977 --> 00:02:19,657 Speaker 3: not really talk about it. My mother, her only brother, 42 00:02:19,737 --> 00:02:22,137 Speaker 3: died his senior year in high school, her younger brother, 43 00:02:22,617 --> 00:02:26,137 Speaker 3: and my father was an only child, and it is 44 00:02:26,297 --> 00:02:32,777 Speaker 3: interesting having both parents be only children. So there was 45 00:02:32,857 --> 00:02:35,297 Speaker 3: no one for them to talk about. Remember when mom 46 00:02:35,337 --> 00:02:38,697 Speaker 3: and dad did this, and so care for my parents. 47 00:02:39,177 --> 00:02:42,777 Speaker 3: Communicating about my parents. We've always had the group we 48 00:02:42,817 --> 00:02:47,017 Speaker 3: call ourselves the original village for each other, but they 49 00:02:47,057 --> 00:02:51,537 Speaker 3: didn't have that. My parents both had a long goodbye. 50 00:02:51,737 --> 00:02:54,977 Speaker 3: They battled with different kinds of dementia back in two 51 00:02:55,017 --> 00:02:57,497 Speaker 3: thousand and nine. I was on the road a lot 52 00:02:57,577 --> 00:02:59,697 Speaker 3: the fall of two thousand and eight, and then I 53 00:02:59,777 --> 00:03:01,737 Speaker 3: came back and I was with my mother, and I 54 00:03:01,817 --> 00:03:05,057 Speaker 3: was like, oh my gosh, what what has happened to Mom? 55 00:03:05,137 --> 00:03:09,257 Speaker 3: She had body dementia. And I just put the skids 56 00:03:09,297 --> 00:03:12,297 Speaker 3: on everything and I said, I have to stop work, 57 00:03:12,937 --> 00:03:15,817 Speaker 3: I have to stop everything. And there were a couple 58 00:03:15,857 --> 00:03:18,977 Speaker 3: of trips on the books that couldn't be changed. But 59 00:03:19,457 --> 00:03:22,857 Speaker 3: that decision on my part affected a lot of other 60 00:03:22,897 --> 00:03:27,417 Speaker 3: people's lives. But all I could think was we're losing mom. 61 00:03:28,257 --> 00:03:32,577 Speaker 3: And then as we were caring for Mom, I was going, 62 00:03:32,977 --> 00:03:36,217 Speaker 3: what's going on with my dad? Like he's losing words 63 00:03:36,417 --> 00:03:40,137 Speaker 3: And finally, and he's so smart and he's a doctor, 64 00:03:40,857 --> 00:03:45,057 Speaker 3: helped start Tennessee oncology years ago. But I remember having 65 00:03:45,097 --> 00:03:47,617 Speaker 3: a conversation with him saying Dad. It's like you're in 66 00:03:47,657 --> 00:03:50,577 Speaker 3: a room with no doors and windows and somebody's got 67 00:03:50,577 --> 00:03:53,257 Speaker 3: a hose running and the water is just coming up. 68 00:03:53,497 --> 00:03:57,777 Speaker 3: And what do you want us to do when you 69 00:03:57,857 --> 00:04:01,177 Speaker 3: don't know something is shifting in your parents? Because they've 70 00:04:01,257 --> 00:04:05,217 Speaker 3: always been dependable, they've been who they are. I remember 71 00:04:05,577 --> 00:04:08,817 Speaker 3: I wish I could take back what I felt as 72 00:04:08,937 --> 00:04:14,337 Speaker 3: irritation being in the car with my dad and him saying, now, 73 00:04:14,817 --> 00:04:17,136 Speaker 3: down here, you're going to turn left. And I remember 74 00:04:17,176 --> 00:04:22,217 Speaker 3: one time saying we've ridden this road a hundred times, 75 00:04:23,137 --> 00:04:26,256 Speaker 3: and so why are you giving me directions? But he 76 00:04:26,616 --> 00:04:31,137 Speaker 3: was saying out loud what he could remember, and now 77 00:04:31,176 --> 00:04:32,017 Speaker 3: I go. 78 00:04:31,777 --> 00:04:35,017 Speaker 1: Oh, good, gosh, Amy. 79 00:04:35,176 --> 00:04:39,817 Speaker 3: And so a lesson for me with my kids is, 80 00:04:41,017 --> 00:04:43,337 Speaker 3: don't ever be afraid to speak the truth of what 81 00:04:43,577 --> 00:04:47,657 Speaker 3: is right now, and let's not talk behind each other's back. 82 00:04:50,097 --> 00:04:53,976 Speaker 3: So my mom passed in twenty eleven, and my father 83 00:04:54,616 --> 00:04:58,256 Speaker 3: stuck around till twenty eighteen, but so compromised because the 84 00:04:58,337 --> 00:05:03,337 Speaker 3: way dementia affected him, it really attacked his language first. 85 00:05:04,176 --> 00:05:05,296 Speaker 1: And you know, all. 86 00:05:05,176 --> 00:05:09,056 Speaker 3: Any of has any day is what we wake up with, 87 00:05:10,137 --> 00:05:16,136 Speaker 3: that toolkit, those decision making skills, and nothing stays static. 88 00:05:17,217 --> 00:05:18,817 Speaker 1: Life is happening to all of us all. 89 00:05:18,736 --> 00:05:22,297 Speaker 3: The time, and we have to be gentle with ourselves 90 00:05:22,337 --> 00:05:29,537 Speaker 3: and gentle with each other and speak with compassion and honesty. 91 00:05:29,577 --> 00:05:33,337 Speaker 3: And I don't know, there's decades when you're younger that 92 00:05:33,416 --> 00:05:39,616 Speaker 3: you just have this misguided understanding that life, just everything 93 00:05:39,736 --> 00:05:42,017 Speaker 3: kind of stays. We're just going to be on this 94 00:05:42,217 --> 00:05:46,457 Speaker 3: road unless you've experienced an accident our illness. And we 95 00:05:46,537 --> 00:05:49,056 Speaker 3: had sort of an early version of that with me 96 00:05:49,257 --> 00:05:52,416 Speaker 3: because I had a bike crack in twenty twenty two 97 00:05:52,616 --> 00:05:54,896 Speaker 3: and didn't know if I was permanently changed, that was 98 00:05:54,936 --> 00:06:00,296 Speaker 3: temporarily changed for several months. But you know, that gave 99 00:06:00,376 --> 00:06:05,897 Speaker 3: us an opportunity with my children to practice what the. 100 00:06:05,736 --> 00:06:06,296 Speaker 1: End might be. 101 00:06:07,976 --> 00:06:09,937 Speaker 3: And I saw my kids come around me. 102 00:06:10,137 --> 00:06:10,497 Speaker 1: I heard. 103 00:06:10,537 --> 00:06:11,976 Speaker 3: I don't remember a lot of it, but I heard 104 00:06:12,017 --> 00:06:22,577 Speaker 3: about it later. I had several very quiet months, no screens. 105 00:06:23,217 --> 00:06:25,777 Speaker 3: I spent a lot of time just in the backyard, 106 00:06:26,657 --> 00:06:29,897 Speaker 3: sitting at a picnic table writing. I called it writing 107 00:06:29,936 --> 00:06:32,736 Speaker 3: to remember. I filled a spiral notebook. I've never gone 108 00:06:32,777 --> 00:06:34,377 Speaker 3: back and read any of it. I don't care to. 109 00:06:35,616 --> 00:06:39,296 Speaker 3: I started reading books that I guess I had purchased 110 00:06:39,296 --> 00:06:41,537 Speaker 3: and had no memory of it. But I thought this 111 00:06:41,697 --> 00:06:45,176 Speaker 3: mattered to me. And one of those books was written 112 00:06:45,176 --> 00:06:48,297 Speaker 3: by Desmond Tutu and his daughter Infotutu. It was called 113 00:06:48,296 --> 00:06:51,336 Speaker 3: the Book of Forgiving. I found it on my desk 114 00:06:51,416 --> 00:06:53,457 Speaker 3: and the bottom half of it looked like I dropped 115 00:06:53,457 --> 00:06:56,976 Speaker 3: it in a puddle, and I went, well, I must 116 00:06:56,976 --> 00:06:59,297 Speaker 3: have been carrying this book around. And so that was 117 00:06:59,337 --> 00:07:04,176 Speaker 3: the first book I read. And so as I'm processing writing, 118 00:07:04,337 --> 00:07:08,656 Speaker 3: trying to remember my life and different seasons of my life, 119 00:07:08,697 --> 00:07:14,576 Speaker 3: I'm also hearing Desmond Tutu's words about forgiveness. And so 120 00:07:15,457 --> 00:07:20,977 Speaker 3: you know, in those months, those very quiet months of August, September, October, 121 00:07:21,457 --> 00:07:24,857 Speaker 3: by mid November, I was going back to rehearsals, but 122 00:07:24,937 --> 00:07:29,097 Speaker 3: I was not ready. And then starting to sing in December, 123 00:07:29,457 --> 00:07:33,937 Speaker 3: and nothing was working right and my balance was bad, 124 00:07:33,977 --> 00:07:36,377 Speaker 3: but I was surrounded by people that I knew had 125 00:07:36,457 --> 00:07:42,017 Speaker 3: my back words were on a teleprompter. And then by January, 126 00:07:42,417 --> 00:07:46,297 Speaker 3: that bike rack had caused spontaneous growth of a pre 127 00:07:46,457 --> 00:07:50,136 Speaker 3: existing cyst that was nestled in my vocal cords. And 128 00:07:50,217 --> 00:07:53,817 Speaker 3: so that surgery happened in January of twenty twenty three, 129 00:07:55,257 --> 00:08:00,456 Speaker 3: and that was such an unexpected gift from that bike accident. 130 00:08:01,057 --> 00:08:04,737 Speaker 3: Everything that seemed like, oh my gosh, this could be catastrophic, 131 00:08:04,777 --> 00:08:08,177 Speaker 3: there was always a gift in it. Like one of 132 00:08:08,217 --> 00:08:12,177 Speaker 3: my daughters, who is very frank, has an incredible sense 133 00:08:12,177 --> 00:08:14,977 Speaker 3: of humor, and she would say, oh my gosh, mother, 134 00:08:15,057 --> 00:08:16,777 Speaker 3: I loved you so much better right after your head 135 00:08:16,777 --> 00:08:22,617 Speaker 3: injury because you just spoke your truth. But it has 136 00:08:22,697 --> 00:08:29,256 Speaker 3: been a long process. I know every human being is unique. 137 00:08:29,697 --> 00:08:35,697 Speaker 3: Our recovery is unique from everything. And last week was 138 00:08:35,737 --> 00:08:39,257 Speaker 3: the first time I've really been working hard to recover 139 00:08:39,977 --> 00:08:40,857 Speaker 3: just my balance. 140 00:08:41,737 --> 00:08:42,777 Speaker 1: And really it's been in. 141 00:08:42,737 --> 00:08:46,457 Speaker 3: The last six months, so that's like three years and 142 00:08:46,617 --> 00:08:50,577 Speaker 3: change after the accident, and I just was compelled to 143 00:08:50,697 --> 00:08:57,937 Speaker 3: try different routines of movements throughout the day. And so 144 00:08:58,057 --> 00:09:00,217 Speaker 3: now I can walk down a hall and I won't 145 00:09:00,257 --> 00:09:02,537 Speaker 3: sort of out of nowhere, list to the left and 146 00:09:02,617 --> 00:09:03,177 Speaker 3: hit the wall. 147 00:09:03,697 --> 00:09:05,217 Speaker 1: But I mean that was three years in I was 148 00:09:05,257 --> 00:09:05,657 Speaker 1: doing that. 149 00:09:06,577 --> 00:09:11,697 Speaker 3: But life for all of us is recovery, practicing. When 150 00:09:11,777 --> 00:09:16,977 Speaker 3: our memory starts to be less dependable, set alarms. I 151 00:09:17,017 --> 00:09:19,617 Speaker 3: set an alarm every time I turn on the bath water. 152 00:09:20,697 --> 00:09:22,737 Speaker 3: You know my calendar, I used to keep it all 153 00:09:22,777 --> 00:09:26,217 Speaker 3: in here. I write everything down. You know, it's just like, 154 00:09:26,737 --> 00:09:31,137 Speaker 3: you know, things shift for all of us, and it's like, well, okay, 155 00:09:31,497 --> 00:09:36,017 Speaker 3: how can I shift my daily practices to help me 156 00:09:36,017 --> 00:09:39,977 Speaker 3: accomplish what I want to do? And then also realize 157 00:09:40,017 --> 00:09:43,737 Speaker 3: that at some point we don't have the capacity to 158 00:09:43,817 --> 00:09:47,537 Speaker 3: do what we once did, so say, well, if time 159 00:09:47,577 --> 00:09:51,777 Speaker 3: and energy resources are precious, I need to figure out 160 00:09:51,817 --> 00:09:54,697 Speaker 3: what matters most and put that at the top of 161 00:09:54,737 --> 00:09:58,497 Speaker 3: the to do list and let go of things that 162 00:09:58,577 --> 00:10:02,057 Speaker 3: I used to say mattered. But if I had to 163 00:10:02,137 --> 00:10:05,817 Speaker 3: choose between this or that, no contest, I'm going to 164 00:10:05,857 --> 00:10:15,097 Speaker 3: put my energy towards my first choice. 165 00:10:15,537 --> 00:10:16,577 Speaker 1: Music is just fun. 166 00:10:17,377 --> 00:10:21,097 Speaker 3: It is fun, and to me, I feel like the 167 00:10:21,297 --> 00:10:27,457 Speaker 3: arts are good medicine for everybody, and so I'm always 168 00:10:27,497 --> 00:10:31,017 Speaker 3: so glad to get to put on evening of songs. 169 00:10:31,057 --> 00:10:35,297 Speaker 3: I'm so glad when people show up. I do look 170 00:10:35,377 --> 00:10:38,897 Speaker 3: round the curtain and go, oh my gosh. Anybody could 171 00:10:38,897 --> 00:10:42,817 Speaker 3: have done all sorts of things with their money, with 172 00:10:42,937 --> 00:10:46,097 Speaker 3: their time, and they've chosen to be here. And if 173 00:10:46,097 --> 00:10:48,497 Speaker 3: it's one person, we're going to go out and work 174 00:10:48,537 --> 00:10:52,457 Speaker 3: hard and give them everything that we've got. And it's fun, 175 00:10:52,617 --> 00:10:55,817 Speaker 3: honestly having you know, I sing songs from all different 176 00:10:55,897 --> 00:11:00,057 Speaker 3: chapters of life. I started recording in the late seventies, 177 00:11:00,937 --> 00:11:03,617 Speaker 3: and so I just try to do something from every decade, 178 00:11:04,337 --> 00:11:09,697 Speaker 3: some familiar songs, maybe some not familiar, sometimes covers. But 179 00:11:09,737 --> 00:11:12,897 Speaker 3: it's been so much fun to have new music. I 180 00:11:12,937 --> 00:11:17,777 Speaker 3: feel like a lot of the record is hopefully telling 181 00:11:17,937 --> 00:11:22,017 Speaker 3: our story, all with different lenses and different details of 182 00:11:22,057 --> 00:11:26,057 Speaker 3: the story. But we are all part of humanity, and 183 00:11:26,137 --> 00:11:32,657 Speaker 3: we all experience good and hard and unresolved unrest, and 184 00:11:32,737 --> 00:11:35,217 Speaker 3: how do we sit in it and find our way forward? 185 00:11:36,257 --> 00:11:39,737 Speaker 3: The sixth of January. It was written by Sandy Lawrence, 186 00:11:40,497 --> 00:11:43,097 Speaker 3: and at some point I said, oh my gosh, I 187 00:11:43,137 --> 00:11:45,617 Speaker 3: can't stop thinking about that song. Would you let me record? 188 00:11:45,657 --> 00:11:48,937 Speaker 3: That reminded me of early Joni Mitchell. I mean she's 189 00:11:49,017 --> 00:11:53,137 Speaker 3: quoting Joni Mitchell in the first verse, and that song 190 00:11:53,617 --> 00:12:00,297 Speaker 3: just it made me think, It's like, this is the 191 00:12:00,337 --> 00:12:06,497 Speaker 3: world we are in. There's no finger pointing, and everybody's 192 00:12:06,537 --> 00:12:09,657 Speaker 3: life experience is different, and how do we come together. 193 00:12:10,817 --> 00:12:20,497 Speaker 1: Even all an what's going on? 194 00:12:23,537 --> 00:12:25,097 Speaker 3: Mom and days? 195 00:12:25,497 --> 00:12:38,977 Speaker 2: If I aft on revelc I loved when realized we lost. 196 00:12:38,777 --> 00:12:44,257 Speaker 3: Ay and I related to themist in my own life, 197 00:12:44,537 --> 00:12:48,777 Speaker 3: in my neighborhood, in my community in my country. You 198 00:12:48,817 --> 00:12:58,577 Speaker 3: know where are we. My mom's first cousin was a 199 00:12:58,657 --> 00:13:03,497 Speaker 3: career school teacher, and she gave me my first copy 200 00:13:03,537 --> 00:13:08,217 Speaker 3: of Jesus Calling, and that must have been I don't know, 201 00:13:08,897 --> 00:13:14,337 Speaker 3: twenty twenty plus years ago, and I remember I so 202 00:13:14,817 --> 00:13:18,537 Speaker 3: loved that book. She was so instrumental in my life. 203 00:13:18,697 --> 00:13:20,697 Speaker 3: My mom's only brother was killed in a car wreck 204 00:13:20,857 --> 00:13:24,017 Speaker 3: in high school, and she was the closest thing I 205 00:13:24,057 --> 00:13:26,057 Speaker 3: had to an aunt. And there were times that she 206 00:13:26,217 --> 00:13:29,937 Speaker 3: lived with us, and when I was a kid, she 207 00:13:29,977 --> 00:13:33,977 Speaker 3: took me to concerts. She gave me my love of poetry. 208 00:13:34,497 --> 00:13:36,297 Speaker 3: You know, I'd crawl into her bed when I was 209 00:13:36,337 --> 00:13:38,657 Speaker 3: a tiny child, and I remember her just turning on 210 00:13:38,737 --> 00:13:42,817 Speaker 3: the light and reading me poetry. And she gave me 211 00:13:42,857 --> 00:13:46,537 Speaker 3: that copy of Jesus Calling, and I read it and 212 00:13:46,657 --> 00:13:49,137 Speaker 3: read it to this day. I mean, I've bought several 213 00:13:49,137 --> 00:13:53,136 Speaker 3: copies of that book, but that original copy, if you 214 00:13:53,217 --> 00:13:56,737 Speaker 3: found it in my house, it's actually covered in black, 215 00:13:57,497 --> 00:14:02,897 Speaker 3: non shiny duct tape. And it's because I wanted to 216 00:14:02,937 --> 00:14:06,057 Speaker 3: carry that book with me everywhere. To me, it's such 217 00:14:06,097 --> 00:14:10,896 Speaker 3: a private experience, because I needed the privacy of that experience. 218 00:14:11,137 --> 00:14:14,377 Speaker 3: Whether I was on an airplane, on a tour bus, 219 00:14:15,017 --> 00:14:19,177 Speaker 3: at a restaurant. I have written journals through different times 220 00:14:19,177 --> 00:14:23,977 Speaker 3: in life, and really sort of a lot of times, 221 00:14:24,057 --> 00:14:27,617 Speaker 3: especially if you're struggling with something or trying to process something. 222 00:14:28,417 --> 00:14:31,137 Speaker 3: For those of us that like to write, you know, 223 00:14:31,217 --> 00:14:33,657 Speaker 3: we'll pick up a pen. There's something especially something about 224 00:14:33,657 --> 00:14:39,457 Speaker 3: writing cursive when it's almost like drawing. It's almost like doodling, 225 00:14:39,497 --> 00:14:41,857 Speaker 3: and I find that my thoughts will get freed up 226 00:14:42,257 --> 00:14:46,857 Speaker 3: if my hand is moving that way. Everybody has those struggles, 227 00:14:46,937 --> 00:14:52,977 Speaker 3: those processing choices gone south, something physical. You know the 228 00:14:52,977 --> 00:14:59,097 Speaker 3: phrase illness or accident. Those things are never anticipated by anybody. 229 00:14:59,977 --> 00:15:02,057 Speaker 3: So you can be on a road and you go, 230 00:15:02,617 --> 00:15:06,177 Speaker 3: barring illness or accident, where we hope to wind up 231 00:15:06,337 --> 00:15:09,937 Speaker 3: is at this destination. But I just think, you know, 232 00:15:10,137 --> 00:15:11,777 Speaker 3: all of us, you get to a certain point of 233 00:15:11,817 --> 00:15:14,577 Speaker 3: time and you feel such gratitude, thank you God for 234 00:15:14,657 --> 00:15:17,657 Speaker 3: this day, Thank you, and you look at the. 235 00:15:17,577 --> 00:15:18,217 Speaker 1: Ones you love. 236 00:15:18,417 --> 00:15:22,617 Speaker 3: Okay, barring illness or accident, we're gonna Lord willing. 237 00:15:23,297 --> 00:15:24,857 Speaker 1: But when those things. 238 00:15:24,617 --> 00:15:27,777 Speaker 3: Come, you need the people in your life even more 239 00:15:28,537 --> 00:15:31,577 Speaker 3: to remind you of what matters, to remind you you're 240 00:15:31,657 --> 00:15:34,457 Speaker 3: right on time for your life. You are loved by God. 241 00:15:35,057 --> 00:15:39,457 Speaker 3: Your life matters if you are still breathing. The adventure continues. 242 00:15:41,497 --> 00:15:44,297 Speaker 2: To learn more about Amy's new record, The Meat That Remains, 243 00:15:44,497 --> 00:15:45,737 Speaker 2: or to find out where you can see You're in 244 00:15:45,817 --> 00:15:48,537 Speaker 2: concert and a city near you. Visit her website at 245 00:15:48,537 --> 00:15:52,377 Speaker 2: Amy Grant dot com. Stay tuned to Androw Singa's story 246 00:15:52,497 --> 00:16:01,097 Speaker 2: after a brief message, These uncertain times bring anxiety and fear, 247 00:16:01,497 --> 00:16:04,577 Speaker 2: but Jesus Listens Prayers for Every Season gives you daily 248 00:16:04,617 --> 00:16:09,377 Speaker 2: prayers of comfort with seasonally inspired illustrations. This beautiful book 249 00:16:09,417 --> 00:16:12,977 Speaker 2: includes prayers that speak to your situation, whether it's a 250 00:16:13,017 --> 00:16:17,057 Speaker 2: time of stress or strength. Look for Jesus Listens Prayers 251 00:16:17,057 --> 00:16:18,977 Speaker 2: for Every Season wherever. 252 00:16:18,617 --> 00:16:19,337 Speaker 1: You buy books. 253 00:16:25,857 --> 00:16:29,537 Speaker 2: Our next guest is Andrew O. Senga, a Nashville based musician, author, 254 00:16:29,577 --> 00:16:32,137 Speaker 2: and mentor who understands the quiet pressure to be a 255 00:16:32,137 --> 00:16:35,577 Speaker 2: perfect Christian. In this conversation, he shares how hard seasons 256 00:16:35,617 --> 00:16:38,817 Speaker 2: struck down that belief and how older, time tested practices 257 00:16:38,897 --> 00:16:41,857 Speaker 2: like prayer, silence, and him writing have helped him live 258 00:16:41,897 --> 00:16:43,457 Speaker 2: with more honesty and grace. 259 00:16:45,217 --> 00:16:48,937 Speaker 4: My name is Andrew O. Singa and I live in Nashville, Tennessee. 260 00:16:49,257 --> 00:16:53,617 Speaker 4: I am a musician and an author, and I do 261 00:16:53,657 --> 00:16:56,497 Speaker 4: a lot of different things in the music world. Some 262 00:16:56,617 --> 00:16:58,777 Speaker 4: of that is performing and writing, and a lot of 263 00:16:58,777 --> 00:17:03,777 Speaker 4: that is mentoring artists and helping care for younger artists 264 00:17:03,817 --> 00:17:06,257 Speaker 4: and develop their voice and what it is that they 265 00:17:06,737 --> 00:17:09,097 Speaker 4: want to say and how they best want to say it. 266 00:17:09,137 --> 00:17:13,057 Speaker 4: And I started this podcast called The Pivot and it 267 00:17:13,097 --> 00:17:16,417 Speaker 4: has been such a joy. We've done like one hundred 268 00:17:16,417 --> 00:17:19,817 Speaker 4: and twenty episodes. Now I've just talking about what happens 269 00:17:19,817 --> 00:17:22,537 Speaker 4: when life changes. I'm also a husband and a dad, 270 00:17:22,897 --> 00:17:25,417 Speaker 4: and my wife Alison, and I have three daughters and 271 00:17:25,497 --> 00:17:31,017 Speaker 4: a puppy named Pippa. I grew up in this fundamentalist 272 00:17:31,137 --> 00:17:34,737 Speaker 4: church in the middle of a cornfield in Illinois. Really 273 00:17:34,817 --> 00:17:37,897 Speaker 4: wonderful kind people, and they taught me a lot about 274 00:17:37,937 --> 00:17:41,377 Speaker 4: Jesus and the Bible, but there was this pressure to 275 00:17:41,617 --> 00:17:45,537 Speaker 4: kind of look the right way, to be the perfect 276 00:17:45,697 --> 00:17:49,377 Speaker 4: Christian kid, and I absorbed that do my marrow of 277 00:17:49,417 --> 00:17:52,897 Speaker 4: my bones, and I think I thought for a long 278 00:17:52,937 --> 00:17:57,017 Speaker 4: time that that was how the Christian life was lived. 279 00:17:57,897 --> 00:18:03,297 Speaker 4: To perform Christianity, that you had to look right, and 280 00:18:03,337 --> 00:18:05,937 Speaker 4: I kind of had this mental image of God being 281 00:18:05,937 --> 00:18:08,936 Speaker 4: a cop kind of driving behind you. Just waiting for 282 00:18:08,977 --> 00:18:11,897 Speaker 4: you to make a wrong turn, you know, waiting for 283 00:18:11,937 --> 00:18:14,377 Speaker 4: you to go one mile over the speed limit. And 284 00:18:15,337 --> 00:18:18,097 Speaker 4: so not only was God waiting to catch me, but 285 00:18:18,137 --> 00:18:21,216 Speaker 4: also everyone around was waiting to look for when there 286 00:18:21,257 --> 00:18:23,617 Speaker 4: was a crack in the armor. And so you just 287 00:18:23,657 --> 00:18:27,657 Speaker 4: always had to be perfect for everyone around you, but 288 00:18:27,777 --> 00:18:31,217 Speaker 4: inside you knew you weren't, and so there was this 289 00:18:31,257 --> 00:18:34,297 Speaker 4: disconnect between what you look like and who you were, 290 00:18:35,737 --> 00:18:43,897 Speaker 4: and that disconnect is a really dangerous thing. For many 291 00:18:43,977 --> 00:18:48,657 Speaker 4: years there I just lived with this disconnect, this feeling 292 00:18:48,697 --> 00:18:52,897 Speaker 4: of unease. And then it was through this ministry called 293 00:18:52,977 --> 00:18:57,017 Speaker 4: Young Life where I started to be introduced to the 294 00:18:57,057 --> 00:19:01,216 Speaker 4: actual person of Jesus, and I was introduced to a 295 00:19:01,217 --> 00:19:04,936 Speaker 4: lot of people who cared about me in a different way, 296 00:19:05,937 --> 00:19:09,417 Speaker 4: who were really just sort of free with affection. Were 297 00:19:09,457 --> 00:19:13,337 Speaker 4: just like, man, we just like you, and you can 298 00:19:13,697 --> 00:19:15,537 Speaker 4: be who you are and we like you. And I 299 00:19:15,577 --> 00:19:19,736 Speaker 4: watched them like other people who were pretty unlikable, and 300 00:19:19,777 --> 00:19:24,457 Speaker 4: that was really disconcerting for me because I wasn't used 301 00:19:24,457 --> 00:19:27,737 Speaker 4: to that. We weren't always the most free with our 302 00:19:28,097 --> 00:19:33,217 Speaker 4: liking or loving sometimes. And the more I saw these 303 00:19:33,257 --> 00:19:38,617 Speaker 4: people through the love of Jesus, caring for people who 304 00:19:38,697 --> 00:19:43,617 Speaker 4: were often seemingly uncarable about any uncare about able, you know, 305 00:19:44,177 --> 00:19:46,696 Speaker 4: if that's a word. The more I realized that that 306 00:19:46,777 --> 00:19:49,337 Speaker 4: maybe Jesus cared about me that way, maybe these people 307 00:19:49,537 --> 00:19:53,177 Speaker 4: care about me that way, and that disconnect between who 308 00:19:53,257 --> 00:19:55,497 Speaker 4: I thought I was supposed to be and who I 309 00:19:55,537 --> 00:19:59,057 Speaker 4: really was on the inside started to fade away, and 310 00:19:59,577 --> 00:20:01,897 Speaker 4: I started to be able to be who I really 311 00:20:01,977 --> 00:20:05,817 Speaker 4: was around these folks, And the less I was pretending, 312 00:20:06,337 --> 00:20:08,976 Speaker 4: the more they actually got to know me, and the 313 00:20:09,017 --> 00:20:12,657 Speaker 4: more they liked me, and the more I got to 314 00:20:12,737 --> 00:20:15,697 Speaker 4: like who I was too. Because Jesus doesn't want us 315 00:20:15,697 --> 00:20:19,937 Speaker 4: to pretend. He wants us to be the people he created. 316 00:20:20,537 --> 00:20:23,417 Speaker 4: He doesn't love a fake image of me. 317 00:20:23,697 --> 00:20:24,297 Speaker 1: He loves me. 318 00:20:25,697 --> 00:20:29,377 Speaker 4: So I went to college to get an English degree 319 00:20:30,177 --> 00:20:36,817 Speaker 4: in Nashville, and somehow doors opened really quickly, and I 320 00:20:36,857 --> 00:20:40,097 Speaker 4: got a record deal my freshman year of college in Nashville. 321 00:20:40,857 --> 00:20:43,696 Speaker 4: We signed the deal the day I turned nineteen, and 322 00:20:44,017 --> 00:20:48,497 Speaker 4: we released an album that summer, and I have never 323 00:20:48,577 --> 00:20:51,497 Speaker 4: gone back to college. I've just been a musician ever 324 00:20:51,577 --> 00:20:53,857 Speaker 4: since and been on the road with a bunch of 325 00:20:53,937 --> 00:20:58,097 Speaker 4: different artists and it's been super fun. So I was 326 00:20:58,097 --> 00:21:00,617 Speaker 4: in a band called the Normals, and then it was in 327 00:21:00,657 --> 00:21:03,817 Speaker 4: a band called Cadman's Call and played with a bunch 328 00:21:03,857 --> 00:21:12,977 Speaker 4: of other folks. Since then, there have been a number 329 00:21:12,977 --> 00:21:16,657 Speaker 4: of experiences in my life that have helped or redirect 330 00:21:16,657 --> 00:21:19,977 Speaker 4: me towards kind of a more quiet and grounded way 331 00:21:20,057 --> 00:21:25,257 Speaker 4: of being with God, moving from performance towards presence. We'd 332 00:21:25,257 --> 00:21:28,216 Speaker 4: been volunteering at this young Life camp, which was the 333 00:21:28,217 --> 00:21:30,897 Speaker 4: thing we love to do. We had a newborn baby, 334 00:21:31,257 --> 00:21:33,977 Speaker 4: who was our third daughter, and we'd been gone for 335 00:21:34,017 --> 00:21:37,177 Speaker 4: about a month, and we came home and had found 336 00:21:37,217 --> 00:21:38,936 Speaker 4: that a pipe had burst in our house and had 337 00:21:38,937 --> 00:21:42,817 Speaker 4: been running for three weeks and just trashed our home. 338 00:21:43,017 --> 00:21:46,216 Speaker 4: It was just ruined, and so we lost everything. We 339 00:21:46,257 --> 00:21:48,177 Speaker 4: had to move out of our house, and we had 340 00:21:48,177 --> 00:21:52,137 Speaker 4: this newborn baby who was collicky and crying all the time, 341 00:21:52,497 --> 00:21:55,297 Speaker 4: couldn't sleep. I was supposed to go on a tour. 342 00:21:55,897 --> 00:21:59,057 Speaker 4: The tour was having a hard time already. I couldn't 343 00:21:59,057 --> 00:22:01,817 Speaker 4: really get it to work, and then I couldn't put 344 00:22:01,857 --> 00:22:03,857 Speaker 4: any energy towards it because I was having to fight 345 00:22:03,857 --> 00:22:07,297 Speaker 4: with insurance companies all day and figure out what we 346 00:22:07,337 --> 00:22:09,696 Speaker 4: could salvage in our house and try to figure out 347 00:22:09,737 --> 00:22:12,857 Speaker 4: how we could rebuild our house and take care of 348 00:22:12,857 --> 00:22:19,417 Speaker 4: these kids, and we were just spiraling. Our family's gone 349 00:22:19,457 --> 00:22:21,857 Speaker 4: through a lot of different kinds of suffering, like a 350 00:22:21,857 --> 00:22:25,016 Speaker 4: lot of people listening to this have. My wife, Alison 351 00:22:25,057 --> 00:22:27,977 Speaker 4: and I have been married for twenty three years now, 352 00:22:28,097 --> 00:22:33,217 Speaker 4: and in September of twenty twenty three, she was diagnosed 353 00:22:33,257 --> 00:22:38,177 Speaker 4: with a super aggressive form of cancer called multiple myeloma, 354 00:22:38,297 --> 00:22:43,177 Speaker 4: which is a it's like a nasty, angry older brother 355 00:22:43,377 --> 00:22:47,337 Speaker 4: to leukemia. It's a blood cancer that lives in your bones, 356 00:22:47,457 --> 00:22:51,177 Speaker 4: and she had one of the most aggressive cases of 357 00:22:51,177 --> 00:22:54,977 Speaker 4: it that they've ever seen at this hospital in Nashville, 358 00:22:55,017 --> 00:22:58,777 Speaker 4: which happens to specialize in multiple myeloma, which one of 359 00:22:58,777 --> 00:23:01,577 Speaker 4: the wonderful things is that it's in Nashville. A lot 360 00:23:01,577 --> 00:23:04,297 Speaker 4: of people have to move to Nashville to be treated 361 00:23:04,377 --> 00:23:07,057 Speaker 4: for this kind of cancer, and for us, it's fifteen 362 00:23:07,097 --> 00:23:10,417 Speaker 4: minutes away, so that's been a gift. She still has 363 00:23:10,497 --> 00:23:13,897 Speaker 4: chemo every week. We're about two and a half years 364 00:23:13,897 --> 00:23:18,097 Speaker 4: into it now. Her parents have moved here to Nashville 365 00:23:18,137 --> 00:23:21,617 Speaker 4: to help take care of her and our family, which 366 00:23:21,617 --> 00:23:26,857 Speaker 4: has been an incredible blessing. Her father is a retired physician. 367 00:23:26,897 --> 00:23:30,257 Speaker 4: He was a doctor for forty years. And I'd like 368 00:23:30,297 --> 00:23:33,337 Speaker 4: to say that I'm a caretaker, and there are times 369 00:23:33,377 --> 00:23:36,257 Speaker 4: when i am, but truthfully, her dad has taken that 370 00:23:36,377 --> 00:23:40,097 Speaker 4: role for her. He goes to almost every doctor's appointment 371 00:23:40,177 --> 00:23:42,657 Speaker 4: with her. He understands what all the medicine does. He's 372 00:23:42,697 --> 00:23:47,817 Speaker 4: able to speak nurse, a doctor, and insurance. It's been incredible, 373 00:23:48,217 --> 00:23:51,297 Speaker 4: not just that he can help her, but to have 374 00:23:51,337 --> 00:23:53,217 Speaker 4: them in our daily life it has been awesome too. 375 00:23:53,217 --> 00:23:55,857 Speaker 4: They live two blocks away. They've joined our church, and 376 00:23:56,337 --> 00:23:58,457 Speaker 4: we love getting to see them just about every day. 377 00:23:59,697 --> 00:24:02,537 Speaker 4: But it's been a really difficult journey. She's in a 378 00:24:02,537 --> 00:24:05,857 Speaker 4: lot of pain. She can't drive, she can't work, can't 379 00:24:05,857 --> 00:24:09,417 Speaker 4: do quite a lot of things, and so it has 380 00:24:09,497 --> 00:24:14,137 Speaker 4: been challenge and it still is every day. But the 381 00:24:14,337 --> 00:24:18,577 Speaker 4: wonderful thing is Jesus doesn't meet us in our perfection. 382 00:24:18,897 --> 00:24:22,057 Speaker 4: He meets us in our suffering. Jesus is introduced to 383 00:24:22,137 --> 00:24:25,777 Speaker 4: us in the Bible as a man of sorrows, and 384 00:24:25,817 --> 00:24:28,137 Speaker 4: so it's not that we have to stay there all 385 00:24:28,217 --> 00:24:31,337 Speaker 4: the time, but knowing that is a part of our 386 00:24:31,417 --> 00:24:34,737 Speaker 4: story and that being able to be honest about that 387 00:24:35,657 --> 00:24:39,697 Speaker 4: allows us this freedom to be people of joy rather 388 00:24:39,777 --> 00:24:41,976 Speaker 4: than having to sort of put on a happy face. 389 00:24:42,817 --> 00:24:46,177 Speaker 4: I think finding a way to be able to be 390 00:24:46,417 --> 00:24:51,257 Speaker 4: authentically yourself. And I don't mean in a self help way, 391 00:24:51,457 --> 00:24:53,936 Speaker 4: in a like you got to be yourself, but I 392 00:24:53,977 --> 00:24:56,817 Speaker 4: mean be the person that God created you to be 393 00:24:57,017 --> 00:24:59,937 Speaker 4: and not create a false image of a fake Christian. 394 00:25:00,097 --> 00:25:04,417 Speaker 4: That's what I mean. We can hold suffering and joy 395 00:25:04,497 --> 00:25:07,297 Speaker 4: in both hands at the same time time, and I 396 00:25:07,297 --> 00:25:09,777 Speaker 4: think those are the people that were drawn to and 397 00:25:09,817 --> 00:25:12,456 Speaker 4: that's when we can start to speak with an authentic voice. 398 00:25:13,177 --> 00:25:15,857 Speaker 4: And that takes time to learn how to do that, 399 00:25:15,977 --> 00:25:18,897 Speaker 4: and that takes honestly walking through seasons of both suffering 400 00:25:18,937 --> 00:25:20,857 Speaker 4: and joy to be able to learn how to do that. 401 00:25:25,297 --> 00:25:27,217 Speaker 4: We have been going to church for a long time 402 00:25:27,257 --> 00:25:30,937 Speaker 4: that met on Sundays, and I usually traveled on the weekends, 403 00:25:30,977 --> 00:25:34,817 Speaker 4: and so I kept missing church all the time. And 404 00:25:34,937 --> 00:25:37,737 Speaker 4: there was this little Anglican church that met a few 405 00:25:37,737 --> 00:25:41,337 Speaker 4: minutes from my house that had a Wednesday Bible study, 406 00:25:42,177 --> 00:25:44,537 Speaker 4: and I thought, well, maybe i'll I had some friends 407 00:25:44,537 --> 00:25:47,696 Speaker 4: that went to that church, and I looked up to 408 00:25:47,697 --> 00:25:49,577 Speaker 4: see if they had any weekday services, and they had 409 00:25:49,577 --> 00:25:51,256 Speaker 4: that Bible study. So I thought, well, I'll go to that. 410 00:25:51,617 --> 00:25:55,177 Speaker 4: So I walked in and it was the priest and 411 00:25:55,217 --> 00:25:59,097 Speaker 4: then nine or ten women in their seventies and eighties 412 00:25:59,537 --> 00:26:03,497 Speaker 4: and then me, and I was like, this is awesome. 413 00:26:04,577 --> 00:26:08,577 Speaker 4: So I went to that Bible steady pretty faithfully during 414 00:26:08,617 --> 00:26:12,457 Speaker 4: that whole season. And he just sat with these old 415 00:26:12,537 --> 00:26:17,297 Speaker 4: ladies and this priest who's kind of a bit of 416 00:26:17,297 --> 00:26:21,257 Speaker 4: a personality, and they would just kind of bicker sometimes 417 00:26:21,297 --> 00:26:24,216 Speaker 4: and they just have to have the funniest relationship, and 418 00:26:24,337 --> 00:26:27,337 Speaker 4: he would be teaching and they would be teaching him, 419 00:26:27,457 --> 00:26:29,737 Speaker 4: and because some of them knew the scripture better needed, 420 00:26:29,777 --> 00:26:33,297 Speaker 4: and they would also be reciting these prayers that had 421 00:26:33,297 --> 00:26:36,337 Speaker 4: been written, you know, a thousand years ago, five hundred 422 00:26:36,417 --> 00:26:37,577 Speaker 4: years ago, and I. 423 00:26:37,537 --> 00:26:40,097 Speaker 1: Was like, what is this. This is so beautiful. 424 00:26:40,537 --> 00:26:44,137 Speaker 4: They would just sit in silence for a minute. And 425 00:26:44,537 --> 00:26:47,976 Speaker 4: I couldn't need anything more in that moment than to 426 00:26:48,017 --> 00:26:52,257 Speaker 4: sit in silence with some old ladies. It was such 427 00:26:52,457 --> 00:26:57,457 Speaker 4: an incredible gift. So I started bringing my family there 428 00:26:57,497 --> 00:27:00,137 Speaker 4: when I was in town on Sundays, and we've now 429 00:27:00,177 --> 00:27:02,736 Speaker 4: been a part of that church for thirteen years, and 430 00:27:02,777 --> 00:27:05,897 Speaker 4: that has kind of fundamentally shaped me now to be 431 00:27:06,697 --> 00:27:11,697 Speaker 4: sitting under these rhythms of quiet, and these rhythms of 432 00:27:12,217 --> 00:27:15,297 Speaker 4: these older prayers, to be in a place where we 433 00:27:15,337 --> 00:27:19,537 Speaker 4: are saying scripture aloud week after week after week after week, 434 00:27:20,137 --> 00:27:23,216 Speaker 4: and some of these little sayings to say over and 435 00:27:23,257 --> 00:27:25,936 Speaker 4: over every week, Christ has died, Christ has risen, Christ 436 00:27:25,937 --> 00:27:29,337 Speaker 4: will come again, to the point where then you say 437 00:27:29,377 --> 00:27:32,017 Speaker 4: it and you stop thinking it, and then one day 438 00:27:32,057 --> 00:27:35,297 Speaker 4: you're walking on a Tuesday afternoon and it just comes 439 00:27:35,337 --> 00:27:37,297 Speaker 4: alive to you because it's become a part of you. 440 00:27:37,617 --> 00:27:40,097 Speaker 4: It's been one of the most beautiful things of my life. 441 00:27:41,017 --> 00:27:44,897 Speaker 4: We live in a culture that prizes things like novelty, speed, 442 00:27:45,017 --> 00:27:50,617 Speaker 4: and constant reinvention, and I think these practices like lament, confession, 443 00:27:51,177 --> 00:27:54,177 Speaker 4: shared prayer, and silence, they can be kind of a 444 00:27:54,217 --> 00:27:59,257 Speaker 4: form of resistance, pushing back against this speed, the hectic life, 445 00:27:59,657 --> 00:28:03,696 Speaker 4: against the doom scroll. They're a way of reclaiming the 446 00:28:03,777 --> 00:28:06,417 Speaker 4: life that we're meant to live, a life in rhythm 447 00:28:06,417 --> 00:28:09,537 Speaker 4: with God, a life in rhythm of community with one another. 448 00:28:10,097 --> 00:28:11,976 Speaker 4: I've found that to be true in my own life. 449 00:28:12,657 --> 00:28:16,377 Speaker 4: The more that I adopt these practices, the more I'm 450 00:28:16,417 --> 00:28:19,337 Speaker 4: aware of the presence of God, and the more I 451 00:28:19,377 --> 00:28:28,337 Speaker 4: feel invested in the community of those around me. I 452 00:28:28,417 --> 00:28:31,657 Speaker 4: used to be a runner, and running is all about achieving, 453 00:28:31,857 --> 00:28:34,097 Speaker 4: kind of get a better time, kind of go further, 454 00:28:34,497 --> 00:28:39,737 Speaker 4: kind of go faster. Walking is different. Walking is about 455 00:28:40,017 --> 00:28:42,897 Speaker 4: keeping a steady pace, and you can walk with people 456 00:28:43,737 --> 00:28:46,097 Speaker 4: and you can talk, or you can walk by yourself 457 00:28:46,217 --> 00:28:49,617 Speaker 4: and you can think. There's a beautiful lake that's about 458 00:28:49,617 --> 00:28:51,777 Speaker 4: a mile and a half from my house, and I 459 00:28:51,817 --> 00:28:54,657 Speaker 4: start just about every day now walking around this lake. 460 00:28:55,537 --> 00:28:59,417 Speaker 4: The memories I have of prayers that have happened around 461 00:28:59,617 --> 00:29:02,377 Speaker 4: that lake, and conversations that have happened around that lake, 462 00:29:02,817 --> 00:29:06,617 Speaker 4: the holy moments that have happened there, the anguish that's 463 00:29:06,617 --> 00:29:09,057 Speaker 4: happened out there. They're like, God, where are you? The 464 00:29:09,097 --> 00:29:11,897 Speaker 4: Psalm says, you leave me besides still waters. And sometimes 465 00:29:12,057 --> 00:29:13,737 Speaker 4: I have to go down there and be like, Okay, 466 00:29:13,977 --> 00:29:16,737 Speaker 4: here's some still water. God, where are you? I'm here, 467 00:29:18,177 --> 00:29:22,097 Speaker 4: And sometimes he meets me there. Sometimes I go there 468 00:29:22,817 --> 00:29:28,137 Speaker 4: and I see a deer just sort of gracefully scamper. 469 00:29:27,817 --> 00:29:28,257 Speaker 1: Up the hill. 470 00:29:28,297 --> 00:29:33,337 Speaker 4: And that's what I see that day, and that's the 471 00:29:33,337 --> 00:29:36,937 Speaker 4: gift I get. Sometimes what I get is a deep 472 00:29:36,977 --> 00:29:42,737 Speaker 4: conversation with a friend, and all those are precious, but 473 00:29:42,777 --> 00:29:47,297 Speaker 4: that rhythm has been really really special to me. Going 474 00:29:47,337 --> 00:29:51,097 Speaker 4: through that flood thirteen years ago where everything fell apart 475 00:29:51,137 --> 00:29:54,537 Speaker 4: and we lost so much. That first introduced me to 476 00:29:54,617 --> 00:30:00,257 Speaker 4: these rhythms of liturgical prayer, of slowing down, and that 477 00:30:00,297 --> 00:30:04,257 Speaker 4: has been such a fundamental shift in my life. And 478 00:30:04,337 --> 00:30:07,657 Speaker 4: so now there are still obviously times when I get 479 00:30:07,697 --> 00:30:10,457 Speaker 4: anxious and stressed and I don't know what's going on 480 00:30:10,537 --> 00:30:13,097 Speaker 4: in life. But to be able to have things to 481 00:30:13,137 --> 00:30:17,577 Speaker 4: turn to that are time tested, that are older than 482 00:30:17,657 --> 00:30:20,737 Speaker 4: a self help book that's not going to chat GPT 483 00:30:20,817 --> 00:30:24,497 Speaker 4: and saying what should I do? That is just incredible. 484 00:30:24,577 --> 00:30:27,737 Speaker 4: To know that there are these rhythms that have existed 485 00:30:27,777 --> 00:30:30,857 Speaker 4: for hundreds and hundreds of years, that Christians have practiced 486 00:30:30,897 --> 00:30:35,577 Speaker 4: and have honed that help us attune to the Spirit 487 00:30:35,617 --> 00:30:39,817 Speaker 4: of God and to walk daily in rhythm with him. 488 00:30:40,297 --> 00:30:45,097 Speaker 4: It's just fundamentally transformational. I was raised that we're supposed 489 00:30:45,137 --> 00:30:47,977 Speaker 4: to have our quiet time and read the Bible every day, 490 00:30:48,057 --> 00:30:52,697 Speaker 4: and honestly, I struggle with that sometimes because my days 491 00:30:52,737 --> 00:30:57,417 Speaker 4: never look the same. I tour and I've had kids, 492 00:30:57,457 --> 00:31:00,337 Speaker 4: and I don't have the kind of life where I 493 00:31:00,377 --> 00:31:02,657 Speaker 4: can just wake up and sit in the same chair 494 00:31:02,697 --> 00:31:06,257 Speaker 4: and drink the same cup of coffee, but learned that 495 00:31:06,377 --> 00:31:10,617 Speaker 4: having these kinds of rhythms, it's different than that. There 496 00:31:10,617 --> 00:31:15,097 Speaker 4: are ways to bring scripture into my daily life, ways 497 00:31:15,137 --> 00:31:18,737 Speaker 4: to bring quiet into my daily life. And now that 498 00:31:18,817 --> 00:31:22,937 Speaker 4: I've started to adopt these practices for years, I just 499 00:31:23,377 --> 00:31:27,017 Speaker 4: can't imagine going a long time without them. This is 500 00:31:27,057 --> 00:31:29,457 Speaker 4: one of the things that I really love about Jesus calling. 501 00:31:29,577 --> 00:31:33,217 Speaker 4: What Sarah Young has done is so similar to the 502 00:31:33,257 --> 00:31:36,337 Speaker 4: work that I try to do, which is take these 503 00:31:36,337 --> 00:31:40,177 Speaker 4: older practices and make them fresh and modern for people, 504 00:31:40,657 --> 00:31:44,057 Speaker 4: and bring the Word of God and bring old prayers 505 00:31:44,857 --> 00:31:47,937 Speaker 4: into something that's really tangible and usable for people. I 506 00:31:47,977 --> 00:31:50,937 Speaker 4: think it's so beautiful, and I'm so thankful and grateful 507 00:31:50,977 --> 00:31:53,097 Speaker 4: for the work that she's done, and that this work 508 00:31:53,177 --> 00:31:59,897 Speaker 4: is to keep happening. It's beautiful. Jesus listens. July third, 509 00:32:00,417 --> 00:32:04,217 Speaker 4: Precious Jesus, help me to look for you and find 510 00:32:04,257 --> 00:32:07,897 Speaker 4: you in the hard place of my life. It's easy 511 00:32:07,937 --> 00:32:10,697 Speaker 4: for me to find you in an answered prayer, in 512 00:32:10,737 --> 00:32:14,457 Speaker 4: beauty and heartfelt joy, but I know you are also 513 00:32:14,537 --> 00:32:18,337 Speaker 4: tenderly present in my difficulties. Teach me to view my 514 00:32:18,417 --> 00:32:22,177 Speaker 4: problems as opportunities to grow and grace, experiencing your loving 515 00:32:22,217 --> 00:32:25,857 Speaker 4: presence in greater depth and breadth. I must search for 516 00:32:25,897 --> 00:32:30,377 Speaker 4: you in my dark times, both past and present. When 517 00:32:30,377 --> 00:32:33,377 Speaker 4: I'm troubled by thoughts of hurtful experiences in my past. 518 00:32:34,137 --> 00:32:37,337 Speaker 4: I'll look for you in those painful memories. You know 519 00:32:37,457 --> 00:32:39,937 Speaker 4: all about them, and you are ready to meet me there. 520 00:32:40,897 --> 00:32:44,177 Speaker 4: I can invite you into those broken places and collaborate 521 00:32:44,217 --> 00:32:47,857 Speaker 4: with you and putting the fragments back together in new ways. 522 00:32:48,857 --> 00:32:51,657 Speaker 4: As I seek to walk close to you, Please draw 523 00:32:51,697 --> 00:32:55,617 Speaker 4: me into deeper, richer intimacy with you in your compassionate 524 00:32:55,697 --> 00:32:56,737 Speaker 4: name Amen. 525 00:32:59,537 --> 00:33:03,457 Speaker 2: To learn more about Androsinga, visit androsinga dot com, and 526 00:33:03,537 --> 00:33:05,977 Speaker 2: be sure to check out his new book, to Remember 527 00:33:06,217 --> 00:33:10,777 Speaker 2: Forgotten Pathways to Unauthentic Faith at your favorite retailer. If 528 00:33:10,817 --> 00:33:13,417 Speaker 2: you'd like to hear more stories about caretaking, check out 529 00:33:13,417 --> 00:33:19,697 Speaker 2: our interview with Diane Chue. Next time on the Jesus 530 00:33:19,697 --> 00:33:23,497 Speaker 2: Calling podcast, we'll hear from country singer songwriter Annie Bosco, 531 00:33:23,737 --> 00:33:26,017 Speaker 2: whose career was newly brought to an end by a 532 00:33:26,057 --> 00:33:27,057 Speaker 2: vocal cort surgery. 533 00:33:28,257 --> 00:33:31,417 Speaker 5: After a month, I was singing things that I couldn't 534 00:33:31,417 --> 00:33:33,977 Speaker 5: sing before my vocal cord surgery so it was crazy 535 00:33:34,057 --> 00:33:37,297 Speaker 5: because I was seeing this come back through just like 536 00:33:37,337 --> 00:33:39,337 Speaker 5: hard work, dedication, rehab, and faith. 537 00:33:39,417 --> 00:33:40,297 Speaker 4: And that's the scariest. 538 00:33:40,617 --> 00:33:43,497 Speaker 5: Your faith is tested the most when you don't see 539 00:33:43,537 --> 00:33:45,137 Speaker 5: the light at the end of the tunnel, but you 540 00:33:45,217 --> 00:33:46,337 Speaker 5: still have to believe. 541 00:33:46,097 --> 00:33:46,537 Speaker 1: That it's there. 542 00:33:50,457 --> 00:33:53,017 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Jesus Calling Stories of Faith 543 00:33:53,057 --> 00:33:56,937 Speaker 2: podcast on the Life Audio Network. Every week, we'll bring 544 00:33:56,937 --> 00:33:59,537 Speaker 2: you stories from people who share their journeys of faith 545 00:33:59,857 --> 00:34:03,577 Speaker 2: and have prayer and a relationship with God transformed their lives. 546 00:34:04,337 --> 00:34:07,697 Speaker 2: Be sure to follow us on Apple, Spotify, iHeart, or 547 00:34:07,777 --> 00:34:11,057 Speaker 2: wherever you listen to podcasts, and leave us a review 548 00:34:11,136 --> 00:34:15,337 Speaker 2: so others can be inspired weekly by these stories of faith. Finally, 549 00:34:15,616 --> 00:34:19,136 Speaker 2: you can find encouragement resources and more on the Jesus 550 00:34:19,176 --> 00:34:22,417 Speaker 2: Calling website at Jesuscalling dot com.