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Speaker 1: Life audio.

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Speaker 2: What confidence can we have that Jesus is really coming

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Speaker 2: back in the future.

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Speaker 3: I avoided the subject for four decades. I didn't want

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Speaker 3: to say anything about it without a doubt. Jesus makes

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Speaker 3: the statement in Matthew chapter twenty four. He said, assuredly,

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Speaker 3: I say to you, this generation will not pass until

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Speaker 3: all these things come to pass. The thing that we

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Speaker 3: know for sure is that no one, not even the

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Speaker 3: angels of God or Jesus himself, know the day. In

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Speaker 3: the out however, he said, we would know the generation,

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Speaker 3: and we would know the season.

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Speaker 2: But the bottom line, I think our confidence in the

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Speaker 2: words of Jesus is that they've been translated accurately. Jesus

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Speaker 2: is God, He's fulfilled prophecy, and he tells us he's

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Speaker 2: coming back, So we better take that seriously. Can we

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Speaker 2: know that Jesus is really coming back? Some would say

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Speaker 2: this is just a matter of blind faith. Is there

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Speaker 2: actually evidence or good reason we have to believe that

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Speaker 2: Jesus will return? And if so, how should we live

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Speaker 2: in light of that? Our guest today is an expert

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Speaker 2: on this topic. He's got a super popular YouTube channel,

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Speaker 2: but it has a book that just came out called

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Speaker 2: The King is Coming, and it's been literally blowing sales up.

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Speaker 2: And I say that because number one, it's a great book,

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Speaker 2: but number two, I think this is a topic that

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Speaker 2: people are particularly interested right now.

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Speaker 1: John, Thanks for coming on, Sean.

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Speaker 3: It's a pleasure to be on with you, and thank

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Speaker 3: you so much for what you're doing for the body

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Speaker 3: of Christ.

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Speaker 2: Well, this is a topic I've been leaning into a

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Speaker 2: little bit. I used to tell people for a while,

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Speaker 2: you know, and times is not really my thing. But

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Speaker 2: I've interviewed John Lennox. I saw your book that came

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Speaker 2: up and I thought, the King is Coming. I have

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Speaker 2: a question for you, and my audience is going to

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Speaker 2: want to know what confidence can we have that Jesus

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Speaker 2: is really coming back in the future. Can we know

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Speaker 2: this or is it something we just believe by quote

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Speaker 2: blind faith.

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Speaker 3: Well, let me tell you this right up front. I

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Speaker 3: avoided the subject for four decades. I didn't want to

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Speaker 3: say anything about it. And it's probably because of this

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Speaker 3: question you just asked. And I can get back to

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Speaker 3: that later of why I avoided it. But without a doubt,

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Speaker 3: Jesus makes the statement in Matthew chapter twenty four. He said,

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Speaker 3: assuredly I say to you, this generation will not pass

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Speaker 3: until all these things come to pass. And he's speaking

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Speaker 3: about three things in Matthew twenty four. First of all,

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Speaker 3: when is all the stones going to be torn down

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Speaker 3: on the temple that happened in seventy a d With

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Speaker 3: Titus of Rome, What will be the signs of your

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Speaker 3: second coming? And thirdly, what will be the signs of

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Speaker 3: the end of the world. In speaking not about the

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Speaker 3: stones being torn down, and what Titus did in speaking

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Speaker 3: specifically about second coming appearing in the clouds in great glory,

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Speaker 3: he said, this generation won't pass until all these things

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Speaker 3: come to pass. Now, the thing that we know for

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Speaker 3: sure is that no one, not even the angels of

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Speaker 3: God or Jesus himself, know the day and the hour. However,

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Speaker 3: he said, we would know the generation, and we would

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Speaker 3: know the season. And if you look at his response

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Speaker 3: to Jerusalem's ignorance of his first coming, he said, you're

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Speaker 3: going to be trampled down by gentiles because you did

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Speaker 3: not know the time the season of your visitation. With

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Speaker 3: his first coming, you have the escenes, the scenes were

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Speaker 3: people that broke away from the man stream. Jerusalem leadership,

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Speaker 3: not Jerusalem. Excuse me, Israel leadership because there was so

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Speaker 3: much corruption. So they went out in the desert and

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Speaker 3: they formed a community called Cumran. Most of your students

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Speaker 3: should understand Kumran from the caves of Cumron. That's where

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Speaker 3: we discovered the Dead Sea scrolls. These people took the

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Speaker 3: word of God seriously. One hundred and fifty years before

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Speaker 3: Jesus was born, they predicted to the exact week that

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Speaker 3: Jesus would ride into Jerusalem on a donkey and he

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Speaker 3: would be executed. How did they know this? They knew

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Speaker 3: this through Daniel's prophecies and Zechariah's prophecies and other early

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Speaker 3: church father or excuse me, Jewish father's writings. Now you

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Speaker 3: look at these guys who were able to recognize right

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Speaker 3: up to the week, and there were certain things about

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Speaker 3: them that gave them the ability to do it. Because

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Speaker 3: if you look at first Peter one, ten and eleven,

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Speaker 3: it says the prophets inquired and searched diligently about what

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Speaker 3: manner and what manner of time Messiah would come in

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Speaker 3: this first coming. Well, these scenes did that too. If

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Speaker 3: you look at a second coming, there's only one slight difference.

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Speaker 3: We can't predict to the week. We can't predict to

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Speaker 3: the day or hour, but we are told that we

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Speaker 3: are expected to know the generation, and we are in

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Speaker 3: that generation because no generation ever before has been able

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Speaker 3: to say that. After eighteen hundred years, God brought the

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Speaker 3: Jews from every nation under heaven, brought them to Israel,

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Speaker 3: and in nineteen sixty seven they repossessed Jerusalem. So Jesus

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Speaker 3: said they would be trampled or ruled by gentile countries

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Speaker 3: until the time of the gentiles is fulfilled. So we're

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Speaker 3: living in a pretty exciting time. Sean, That's what I've

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Speaker 3: That's what I'm saying.

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Speaker 1: I totally agree.

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Speaker 2: So I was curious if you were going to go

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Speaker 2: to the past in terms of what God has fulfilled

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Speaker 2: to show and give us confidence of what He will

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Speaker 2: do in the future, because obviously we can't watch a

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Speaker 2: movie of this happening. Although if the Book of Revelation

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Speaker 2: is true and some of the teachers of Jesus are true,

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Speaker 2: we kind of do have a preview of this. But

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Speaker 2: the bottom line, I think our confidence in the words

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Speaker 2: of Jesus is that they've been translated accurately. Jesus is God,

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Speaker 2: He's fulfilled prophecy and he tells us he's coming back,

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Speaker 2: So we better take that seriously. We're gonna get to

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Speaker 2: this a minute. When you point towards Israel, you argue,

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Speaker 2: even in our lifetime, in the twentieth century, we've seen

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Speaker 2: some of this take place. Now before we get there,

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Speaker 2: I have an apologized channel, So I just have to

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Speaker 2: ask you this. I know skeptics would say, the whole

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Speaker 2: idea of Jesus returning in the clouds is simply unbelievable

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Speaker 2: and our scientific age, how can you expect me to

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Speaker 2: believe that God is going to come down in these

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Speaker 2: clouds in the way it's described in this book, written

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Speaker 2: a couple thousand years ago with a completely different pre

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Speaker 2: scientice worldview.

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Speaker 3: Well, that is an excellent question. If you look at Peter,

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Speaker 3: he says, in the last days, scoffers and mockers are

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Speaker 3: going to rise up and say, where's the promise of

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Speaker 3: his coming? Ever since the fathers fell asleep, everything remains

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Speaker 3: the same as from creation. Well, first of all, atheists

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Speaker 3: and agnostics don't call church fathers fathers. Atheists and agnostics

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Speaker 3: do not call creation creation. They call it evolution. Peter's

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Speaker 3: not talking about people that are outside of the church

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Speaker 3: talking about actually people inside of the church, and you

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Speaker 3: know what their statements are going to be is, come on,

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Speaker 3: this is ridiculous. But what Peter does is he said,

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Speaker 3: they have forgotten. This is God who causes three million

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Speaker 3: people to walk across dry land on the bottom of

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Speaker 3: an ocean floor, and he caused walls of water to

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Speaker 3: stand up as they went through and crushed the most

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Speaker 3: powerful military in the world. This is the same God

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Speaker 3: who scientists have proven with the sixty four page document

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Speaker 3: that sulfur balls an explosion of sulfur destroyed at over

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Speaker 3: six thousand or excuse me, two thousand degrees celsius, the

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Speaker 3: cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. This is the same God

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Speaker 3: who caused a flood to come on the earth, of

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Speaker 3: which we have discovered that very boat. And what these

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Speaker 3: people don't realize is a day with the lords one

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Speaker 3: thousand years and a thousand years is a day. So,

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Speaker 3: in other words, it's only been six days since God

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Speaker 3: has done all these things I just spoke of. It's

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Speaker 3: been in the last six days in Heaven's timeline. If

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Speaker 3: you look at a day, and this is what Peter said,

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Speaker 3: But you, beloved, don't forget a day with the lords

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Speaker 3: a thousand years and a thousand years as a day.

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Speaker 3: Jesus talked about this, about coming in the clouds of Glory.

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Speaker 3: He talked about it so much, and the apostles wrote

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Speaker 3: about it so much. It ends up being the second

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Speaker 3: most talked about subject in the entire Bible, only Salvation.

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Speaker 3: Trump's the second coming of Jesus. There's three hundred prophecies

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Speaker 3: about his first coming, and the people that took it

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Speaker 3: serious got it right. There are over twenty four hundred

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Speaker 3: prophecies about his second coming. Now, I've got an engineering mind.

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Speaker 3: I was trained as an engineer at Purdue University. But

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Speaker 3: I remember a very godly man who worked as an

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Speaker 3: engineer for Dell Helicopter looked at me as a young man, said,

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Speaker 3: young man, you better go from here to here, and

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Speaker 3: I will never forget that as long as I live.

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Speaker 3: Lisa and I were engaged. We were going to him

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Speaker 3: for marriage counseling, and I thought I was so smart.

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Speaker 3: But what was going on is this was leading this

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Speaker 3: instead of this leading this. This is a tool to this.

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Speaker 3: Does that make sense? And so anybodybody who walks closely

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Speaker 3: with Jesus walks closely with God knows we're in the season,

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Speaker 3: but we can see it in the scripture because God's

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Speaker 3: not going to leave us without his firm covenant word

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Speaker 3: to show us. And if this is the second most

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Speaker 3: talked about subject in the Bible, that means we're not

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Speaker 3: supposed to be ignorant of it. Otherwise we're unwise servants

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Speaker 3: that are saying, my Lord is the laying is coming.

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Speaker 3: And when we do that, we lose our ability to

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Speaker 3: purify ourselves even as He is pure. Because the Bible

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Speaker 3: says John made this statement when he saw the whole

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Speaker 3: book of Revelation, that when he appears, and he's talking

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Speaker 3: about appearing in the clouds, we're going to see him

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Speaker 3: as he is. And all who have this eager expectation

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Speaker 3: will purify themselves, even as Jesus Christ is pure. So

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Speaker 3: Jesus said, when the servant, because he talks all about

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Speaker 3: his second coming in Matthew twenty four, and then he

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Speaker 3: tells a parable, and he said, if that servant says

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Speaker 3: in his heart, my master delays is coming, he will

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Speaker 3: begin to eat and drink and get drunk and beat

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Speaker 3: the male, his fellow males and female servants. What is

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Speaker 3: that saying, what is Jesus saying? When we put off

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Speaker 3: his coming, when we put it in the way distant future,

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Speaker 3: what happens is it makes it very easy to succumb

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Speaker 3: to the dictates, to the inclinations, the desires, the passions

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Speaker 3: of our flesh. But when we live with the living

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Speaker 3: hope of him coming any moment, we will purify ourselves.

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Speaker 3: There's a power in it to purify ourselves even as

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Speaker 3: he's pure. So I plan here. I had an organization

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Speaker 3: where we've got fifty employees here in America, We've got

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Speaker 3: one thousand team members globally. I'm preparing to the next generation,

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Speaker 3: in the next generation, but I'm living like he's coming

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Speaker 3: back today.

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Speaker 1: I love that.

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Speaker 2: So you talk a lot about in your book that

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Speaker 2: I had never really pieced together how much talking about

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Speaker 2: Jesus returning is through the scriptures, and how central it is.

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Speaker 2: I had not quite piece that together. And we're going

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Speaker 2: to come back to that. But obviously, as you well know,

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Speaker 2: many generations before us have believed that Jesus was coming

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Speaker 2: back in their lifetime, and that means everybody up to

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Speaker 2: today was minimally wrong. Who claimed that Jesus is coming

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Speaker 2: back I'm curious where you stand on this. Do you

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Speaker 2: believe he will return it in our lifetime? Do you

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Speaker 2: think the time is more right, like we have a

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Speaker 2: better chance in our lifetime. If so, what makes this

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Speaker 2: generation unique?

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Speaker 3: So all these generations, I believe God wanted them to

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Speaker 3: believe He was coming back in their lifetime because of

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Speaker 3: the power to protect themselves from the alluring power of

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Speaker 3: this world. So you know, I, if you look, you'll

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Speaker 3: see many, many times, many times in the New Testament,

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Speaker 3: the Lord is returning soon. Peter writes it, the end

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Speaker 3: of the world is coming soon. Paul writes, the Lord

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Speaker 3: is at the door. This was written in the first century.

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Speaker 3: So I remember when Lisa and I were engaged. She

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Speaker 3: had to go to Indiana and prepare for the wedding,

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Speaker 3: and I was in Dallas for two months. Those are

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Speaker 3: two of the longest months I've ever lived my entire life.

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Speaker 1: I can only imagine.

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Speaker 3: A day seemed like a week, a week seemed like

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Speaker 3: a month, a month seemed like a year. And I

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Speaker 3: remember we got to the end. It was two days

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Speaker 3: before I was flying up to Indianapolis to marry my

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Speaker 3: gorgeous girl, and I was on the phone with her

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Speaker 3: and I said, I'll see you soon, babe. And it

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Speaker 3: was soon. Compared to that two months, two days was

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Speaker 3: so soon. So if you look at a day with

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Speaker 3: the Lord's one thousand years, Pete, this is the thing

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Speaker 3: Peter said, we are not to forget. Now. What every

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Speaker 3: generation is not been able to explain up until ours

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Speaker 3: is the fact that Hoseiah gives us a very specific timeline.

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Speaker 3: Hoseiah is writing to the Jewish people and he tells

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Speaker 3: them in Hoseiah chapter five. The Lord speaks directly through

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Speaker 3: this prophet and says, I'm going to rend you, I'm

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Speaker 3: going to tear you. I'm going to literally come and

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Speaker 3: just I mean rick Havoc. And then I'm going to

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Speaker 3: go back to where i came from. Now, this is interesting.

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Speaker 3: In order to go back to where you came from,

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Speaker 3: you had to leave where you originally were and come

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Speaker 3: somewhere then go back. Well, if you look at Jesus,

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Speaker 3: he left the right hand of the Father and he

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Speaker 3: came to this earth in the first century. But what

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Speaker 3: also happened in that first century, because they didn't realize

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Speaker 3: the time of their visitation, is that they were rendered.

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Speaker 3: If you look at between seventy and thirty one thirty

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Speaker 3: five AD, the Roman army systematically removed every Jew from

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Speaker 3: the nation of from the land of Israel. It was

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Speaker 3: either through brutal murder, it was selling them to slavery,

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Speaker 3: or the smart ones got out before they got they

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Speaker 3: got it captured. And so that was when God said,

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Speaker 3: I will tear you right. There's only two times that

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Speaker 3: we know of that God just says, I'm letting you

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Speaker 3: have at Israel. First one was with the Babylonians and

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Speaker 3: the Assyrians. Second one was with the Romans when between

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Speaker 3: the bar Koba rebellion and one thirty five was the

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Speaker 3: very last stronghold the Jewish people were able to maintain,

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Speaker 3: but the armies of Rome destroyed it. Now Hoseiah in

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Speaker 3: the very next verse, and this is why people miss it.

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Speaker 3: These are the last two verses of Hoseiah chapter five.

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Speaker 3: The very next verse Hoseiah six to one. This is

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Speaker 3: the people of Israel speaking, Come, let us return to

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Speaker 3: the Lord. For he has torn us, but he will

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Speaker 3: heal us. He has stricken us, but he will bind

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Speaker 3: us up. After two days he will revive us. And

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Speaker 3: on the third day he'll raise us up that we

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Speaker 3: may live in his sight that third day is the

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Speaker 3: is the thousand year millennial reign of Christ. So he

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Speaker 3: tells us something Hoseiah that the early Jewish fathers and

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Speaker 3: Church fathers wrote extensively about, is that mankind would have

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Speaker 3: six thousand years three ages, the age of Chaos or

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Speaker 3: creation from the time of Adam to Abraham, and then

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Speaker 3: the Age of Law or Torah from the Abraham to Jesus,

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Speaker 3: and then Jesus to the end of the time of

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Speaker 3: the Gentiles. The Church age would be another two thousand years,

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Speaker 3: and then you would have your seventh day, which would

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Speaker 3: be the seven thousand year millennial reign of Christ. If

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Speaker 3: you look at Jesus was died and resurrected around thirty

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Speaker 3: two AD. The destruction of Jerusalem was seventy a d.

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Speaker 3: If you go two thousand years, because a day with

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Speaker 3: the Lord's one thousand years, just like a Josea says,

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Speaker 3: you end up at around twenty seventy a d. If

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Speaker 3: you go one hundred years from when the Jews got

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Speaker 3: Jerusalem back. If we go to Jesus's words, he said,

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Speaker 3: this generation will not pass. A generation could be forty years,

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Speaker 3: seventy years, or one hundred years. In that word, that

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Speaker 3: word generation, the Greek word. If you go to Nelson's

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Speaker 3: Bible Dictionary, it says it says a group of people

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Speaker 3: living on the earth at the same time period. We

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Speaker 3: still have people alive today that fought in World War II,

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Speaker 3: that was that was eighty five years ago. Now they

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Speaker 3: were probably fifteen years old at least, So generations one

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Speaker 3: hundred years where you can have people on the earth

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Speaker 3: at the same time. My grandson who was just born

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Speaker 3: four years ago is alive at the same time as

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Speaker 3: World War two vets. So what that tells me is,

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Speaker 3: if you take Jesus's words and from the time that

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Speaker 3: the Jews get Jerusalem, and you had one hundred years,

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Speaker 3: you come to twenty sixty seven. You take Hoseiah's words

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Speaker 3: and you add two thousand years, you come to twenty seventy.

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Speaker 3: I think we can safely say, and I know people

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Speaker 3: are going to cut this thing out and they're gonna

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Speaker 3: get all upset at me, but I can safely say,

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Speaker 3: sometime between now and twenty seventy, we are going to

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Speaker 3: see Jesus return just as he said he would, and

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Speaker 3: the scoffers and the namesayers will be very, very disappointed.

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Speaker 3: They didn't listen and pray more careful.

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Speaker 1: That is a bold prediction.

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Speaker 2: I've not had anybody on my channel give a specific

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Speaker 2: prediction within that's what is that now?

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Speaker 1: Like three four decades dan to a certain date.

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Speaker 2: So remind us, like, give us the quick pieces that

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Speaker 2: make this case, Like you laid it out well and

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Speaker 2: you pointed back to the creation of seasons. If I

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Speaker 2: was going to say, sum this up so somebody could understand,

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Speaker 2: what are those key components again that get us right

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Speaker 2: to this date.

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Speaker 3: So first of all, I said nothing about day or hour.

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Speaker 3: I said everything about a season. Okay, So I don't

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Speaker 3: want any of your because Baronis I said this on

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Speaker 3: one other podcast and people are like, nobody knows the

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Speaker 3: day or there, and people were I was, I didn't

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Speaker 3: say a thing because I don't defend myself. I don't

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Speaker 3: believe in.

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Speaker 1: That that's fair.

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Speaker 3: But there were people that are coming back on He

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Speaker 3: never said a day, he never said an hour. He

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Speaker 3: said by this time, because we're expected to know the

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Speaker 3: season of his return. Jesus said that. So when I

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Speaker 3: say this, I'm looking at two different I'm extracting from

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Speaker 3: two different, very specific things that were spoken in Scripture

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Speaker 3: one is Hoseiah giving us the time period of the church,

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Speaker 3: which is two days or two thousand years. Okay, Remember

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Speaker 3: Paul said, all the Israel is going to be saved

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Speaker 3: when the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled. He writes

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Speaker 3: that in Romans chapter nineteen eleven somewhere in there. So

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Speaker 3: the time of the Gentiles is when God's God is

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Speaker 3: dealing with the church age. You've got Jewish people that

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Speaker 3: are getting saved that are in the church, but mostly

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Speaker 3: it's gentile people. Right when that time is up, Paul says,

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Speaker 3: all of Israel's going to be saved. If you look

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Speaker 3: at the prophets of old. Joseiah said, excuse me, Zechariah said,

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Speaker 3: they're going to look upon him whose hands they pierced,

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Speaker 3: and they're going to realize. They're going to realize he's

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Speaker 3: their messiah. And so there's going to be such a

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Speaker 3: great awakening. So that's what Joseiah means when he says,

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Speaker 3: after two days the Lord will revive us. Israel's going

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Speaker 3: to be revived. He's not talking about the Church when

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Speaker 3: he says after two days the Lord will revive us,

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Speaker 3: He's not talking about gentiles. He's talking about the Jewish people,

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Speaker 3: the Lord will revive us. And this is where a

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Speaker 3: lot of people get confused. They mix together the Jewish

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Speaker 3: believers with the Church. They mix together the tribulation saints

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Speaker 3: with the Church. You see the Church in the first three,

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Speaker 3: chapter two and three of Revelation. You don't see her

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Speaker 3: again until chapter twenty one. Why but you see what

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Speaker 3: you see saints, Saints, saints, because there's going to be

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Speaker 3: a massive revival, a massive harvest of souls during the

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Speaker 3: seven year tribulation. You got one hundred and forty four

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Speaker 3: thousand Jewish evangelists. Who are they going to lead to

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Speaker 3: the Lord? I mean, are they evangelists with name only?

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Speaker 3: And they are not going to lead anybody to Christ.

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Speaker 3: There's going to be so many people saved during the

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Speaker 3: seven year tribulation. These are the ones that the Antichrist

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Speaker 3: is going to be given authority over by Heaven. Heaven's

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Speaker 3: going to give him the ability to conquer and destroy

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Speaker 3: those saints. Now, if that meant the Church, then Jesus

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Speaker 3: told us something that wasn't true, because he said the

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Speaker 3: gates of Hell will not prevail against my Church. He

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Speaker 3: didn't say the gates of Hell will not prevail against

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Speaker 3: the tribulation saints. He never said that. He said the church,

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Speaker 3: because what we've got is we've got God dealing with

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Speaker 3: his people. If you look at Daniel, the Angel comes

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Speaker 3: and the Angel says that, Daniel, this is what is

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Speaker 3: determined for your people, not the gentile people. Your people

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Speaker 3: have seventy weeks of years. Sixty nine of those seven

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Speaker 3: year periods have already passed. The end of the sixty

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Speaker 3: ninth is when Messiah was cut off. And in the

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Speaker 3: New Living Tree translation that says, appearing to accomplish nothing,

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Speaker 3: there's one more seven year people, one more year, seven

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Speaker 3: year period. That's when God turns back and really focuses

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Speaker 3: on the Jewish people. We're the wild olive tree. We're

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Speaker 3: the ones that He grafted in because of his great mercy,

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Speaker 3: has promised to Abraham. Hey, it's not just your descendants

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Speaker 3: through you, all nations are going to be blessed. God

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Speaker 3: knew that there would be a church age, and that

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Speaker 3: church age is his bride. The Church is the bride

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Speaker 3: of Christ. So people get so confused, and I did

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Speaker 3: for years when they read the Bible and they lump

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Speaker 3: the Jewish saints, the Jewish saints, the tribulation, Saints, and

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Speaker 3: the Church all into one bucket. There are three different dealings,

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Speaker 3: and it's so excited when you understand it. So you've

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Speaker 3: got Hoseiah giving you a time period. You've got Jesus

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Speaker 3: giving you a time period. No other generation could have

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Speaker 3: gone with either of those. In the sixteen hundreds, what

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Speaker 3: do you say after two days, Well, it's only been

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Speaker 3: one point six days. Right in the twelfth century you

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Speaker 3: would have said, well, it's only been one point two days.

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Speaker 3: We can say today it has been two days two

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Speaker 3: thousand years since the resurrection of the crucifixion, resurrection of Jesus.

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Speaker 3: Of course that's twenty thirty three somewhere in that neighborhood.

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Speaker 3: But we're in that time period.

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Speaker 2: That's a powerful thing, and I would definitely amend you

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Speaker 2: didn't give a date like this is going to be

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Speaker 2: twenty sixty seven February twelfth, but narrowed it down to

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Speaker 2: the season very much. So that means, if you're right

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Speaker 2: about this, people alive today will see the return of Christ.

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Speaker 2: Now you laid out your two pieces of biblical evidence

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Speaker 2: for this may be helpful for me and also for

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Speaker 2: our viewers and listeners. Can you walk us through some

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Speaker 2: of the big things do you see eschatologically taking place?

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Speaker 2: And by this I mean some of the big buckets

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Speaker 2: like the return of Christ, the tribulation period, the millennium,

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Speaker 2: the Great White Throne, judgment as you see it, what's

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Speaker 2: kind of the order of these things take place as

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Speaker 2: a whole. Give us that framework, if you will.

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Speaker 3: Well. The first thing, the first thing that we see

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Speaker 3: happening that's already happened, is the Great Apostasy. I mean,

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Speaker 3: Barnett tells us that over sixty million Americans have walked

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Speaker 3: away from the Face since the year two thousand. At

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Speaker 3: the same time, we're seeing a revival because starting in

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty two, we start seeing young men and women

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Speaker 3: coming to Christ like crazy. So there's a great apostasy,

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Speaker 3: and the Bible says that the man of sin cannot

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Speaker 3: be revealed until what the great falling away first happens.

434
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:57,200
Speaker 3: Second thing we're going to see is we're going to

435
00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:00,960
Speaker 3: see a move of God like well that it will

436
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:05,440
Speaker 3: make the Book of Acts look like child's play. I mean,

437
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 3: the whole region of Asia heard the word of the

438
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:13,480
Speaker 3: Lord in two years without any podcasting, any YouTube, any television.

439
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 3: The whole region of Asia heard it. In two years.

440
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 3: They put sick people on the streets of Jerusalem, and

441
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 3: Peter just walks by and his shadow touches him. They

442
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:31,560
Speaker 3: get appealed. That's like a pastor walking through a hospital

443
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,400
Speaker 3: and emptying it just by walking down the hallways. They

444
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 3: pray in the building shakes. They were accused of being

445
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,920
Speaker 3: the people that turned the world upside down. You see

446
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 3: entire cities coming to the Lord, the city of Samaria,

447
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,159
Speaker 3: lid A, Sharon, Joppa, the entire cities were coming to

448
00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 3: the Lord. Now. The Lord spoke to my heart in prayer, Sean.

449
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:58,760
Speaker 3: It was in the nineteen early nineteen nineties, and he said, son,

450
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,120
Speaker 3: what you'll see in your life time will be even

451
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 3: greater than the Book of Acts. And I said, I

452
00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,640
Speaker 3: can't believe that. I know I have read. I've studied

453
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:12,040
Speaker 3: the Acts so diligently. Lord, that's I mean, people fall

454
00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 3: over dead when they bring up an offering on their

455
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:18,119
Speaker 3: church service. And I said, I won't believe it unless

456
00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:20,840
Speaker 3: you give me scripture. And he said, okay, and I'll

457
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,479
Speaker 3: never forget this. He started rattling scriptures off. The end

458
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,159
Speaker 3: of a thing is better in the beginning the glory

459
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:28,679
Speaker 3: of the former house should be greater than that of

460
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,120
Speaker 3: the latter house. He gave you the former rain moderately

461
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 3: and just started ripping. If you look at Isaiah thirty

462
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,280
Speaker 3: or thirty one, I believe it is. It says the

463
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 3: people of God are going to put away their idols,

464
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 3: and in that day God will give rain, and in

465
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 3: that day the sun will be seven times greater. Wait

466
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:48,240
Speaker 3: a minute, when you get rich raining right here in Nashville,

467
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 3: the sun is not seven times greater. He's talking about

468
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:57,119
Speaker 3: the glory of Jesus among his people. It's going to

469
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 3: be seven times greater. Give the light of seven days.

470
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:05,119
Speaker 3: He said. That's amazing when you think about it. So

471
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 3: we see apostasy, and then we also see the outpouring

472
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 3: of the latter rain. Remember James says, the coming of

473
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 3: the Lord, be patient, because he's the Earth. The fruit

474
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:17,879
Speaker 3: of the Earth's got to receive the former and the

475
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:22,359
Speaker 3: latter rain acts was the former rain. Massive amounts of

476
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:26,679
Speaker 3: souls coming in. We have to see that. That's why

477
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 3: that's why I'm saying I believe he's coming back by

478
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,560
Speaker 3: twenty seventy. But I still think there's a lot that

479
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 3: needs to happen. I actually was in prayer and I said, Lord,

480
00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 3: if you were to come right now, I would actually

481
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 3: be a little disappointed because of the absolute outpouring of

482
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:50,320
Speaker 3: your spirit that I see coming from scripture. Now, I

483
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 3: know I'm not being ere irreverent towards God. I actually

484
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,640
Speaker 3: am saying, Lord, I know you have promised the Latter Rain.

485
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:02,479
Speaker 3: You have promised the outpouring of your spirit in a

486
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 3: profound way. I'm looking for it because it's going to

487
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 3: bring in a harvest soul of souls like we've never seen.

488
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 3: I think we're at the beginning. The Early rain started

489
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 3: with a bang on Pentecost and it faded out. The

490
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 3: Latterine is going to start with a sprinkle, and it's

491
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 3: going to go into a full blown hurricane. And I mean,

492
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 3: we're going to see a move of God all over

493
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 3: the earth. It won't just be in one location, It'll

494
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 3: be all over the earth. And so that's next. Then

495
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 3: what happens, And you're pushing me into the corner and

496
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:38,280
Speaker 3: right here, I'm not I'm not going to argue with

497
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:41,920
Speaker 3: anyone about this. But in the book The King Is Coming,

498
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 3: I give six scriptural reasons of why I believe he

499
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 3: will catch away his bride before the seven year tribulation. Okay,

500
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 3: Now the most convincing to me is Isaiah twenty six,

501
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 3: and first Thessalonious Chapter four. Isaiah says, you're your life

502
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 3: giving light is going to come upon us in the grave.

503
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 3: He's talking about himself and his people, and you're going

504
00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 3: to raise us up, and we're going to enter the chambers,

505
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 3: and then the wrath of God is going to come.

506
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,560
Speaker 3: So in other words, God's going to raise these people

507
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 3: up out of the graves and then he's going to

508
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 3: pour out his wrath on the nations. Go read it

509
00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 3: in Isaiah twenty six, last four verses. All right, so

510
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 3: now first Thessalonians, Paul said, I'm going to tell you

511
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 3: a mystery. I'm going to tell you something Isaiah didn't know,

512
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 3: because Jesus said, there are things that you don't know.

513
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,120
Speaker 3: Nobody is known because the spirit hasn't come. But when

514
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 3: he comes, he'll show you. So Paul and the other apostles,

515
00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 3: I think there's about twelve or thirteen mysteries. What are mysteries.

516
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:44,960
Speaker 3: They're not mysterious. They means they are truths that were

517
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 3: held secret until the Lord of Glory was crucified because

518
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:53,240
Speaker 3: if the principalities would have known these secrets, they would

519
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 3: not have crucified the Lord of Glory. One of those

520
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 3: secrets is, I'm telling you this, We're not all going

521
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 3: to die. What's going to happen. We're going to be

522
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 3: changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye,

523
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 3: for the dead in Christ will rise, and then we

524
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 3: who are alive shall be raised together with them, and

525
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,760
Speaker 3: we shall meet the Lord in the air. And the

526
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 3: word literally means clouds, atmosphere, stratosphere, between the clouds and

527
00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 3: the and the exosphere. We're going to meet him and

528
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,360
Speaker 3: will ever be with the Lord. Now, if Isaiah says

529
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 3: that the dead are going to be raised, are they

530
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 3: going to Are these dead people, these Old Testament saints

531
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 3: and all those people who have died in Christ and

532
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:39,959
Speaker 3: the Church, are they going to hide in Petra? Are

533
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 3: they going to hide in wildernesses and strongholds where people

534
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 3: have been, you know, storing up. No, that's that's ludicrous.

535
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 3: Dead people rising from the great and then hiding on

536
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 3: the earth for seven years. No, when these dead people

537
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 3: are rised, they're going to be with the Lord. Okay,

538
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,400
Speaker 3: So and then then the judgment's going to come on

539
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,200
Speaker 3: the nations. So if we are raised with them who

540
00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,240
Speaker 3: are alive on the earth, that tells me it's happening

541
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 3: before the judgment's poured out. Now you could make an

542
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:12,120
Speaker 3: argument three and a half years into the tribulation because

543
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 3: judgment doesn't come. But to be honest with you, those

544
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 3: seals are broken right at the beginning because the very

545
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 3: first thing that's revealed is the Antichrist on the White Horse.

546
00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 3: So that's just one of six that I give in

547
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 3: the book. Now, I tell this in the book my wife,

548
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 3: doesn't you agree with me? And we joke and we

549
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:38,640
Speaker 3: joke about it. We laugh about it because this is

550
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 3: not something for us to divide on. This is not

551
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,680
Speaker 3: something for us to argue about. And this is what

552
00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:48,160
Speaker 3: kept me away from talking about this for four decades

553
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,160
Speaker 3: of ministry. I've said I don't want anything to do

554
00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 3: with it. But I realized the Holy Spirit was tugging

555
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 3: my heart so strongly I had to. And what I

556
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 3: realized is the big importance of the Second Coming isn't

557
00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:10,000
Speaker 3: dates and timelines, it's being ready. When I was at

558
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,920
Speaker 3: Pretty University, when I took my engineering finals, I had

559
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 3: to find out what classroom, what building, what time? My

560
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 3: final was that took me five minutes, But I had

561
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 3: to spend hours and hours and hours preparing. And the

562
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:25,760
Speaker 3: Bible says that the wedding, the marriage of the lamb,

563
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 3: is common. As a wife has made her self ready.

564
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,959
Speaker 3: Doesn't say God made her ready. She made herself ready.

565
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 3: To her, it was granted to be a raid in

566
00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:38,760
Speaker 3: fineland and clean and bright for the fineland is the

567
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 3: righteous sacks of the saints. The number one priority of

568
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 3: a bride that's in waiting waiting for her groom to

569
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 3: come back and get her. This I'm speaking ancient Jewish wedding,

570
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 3: not modern day Western wedding, is she had to make

571
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:56,360
Speaker 3: that wedding garment. Well, I wonder if in the Western

572
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,520
Speaker 3: church we even got enough material to make a bikini,

573
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:04,240
Speaker 3: let alone a wedding get dress, because so many people

574
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 3: they just go to church, they get their ninety minutes,

575
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:08,759
Speaker 3: and then they basically live for themselves the rest of

576
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 3: the week. I mean, it's her righteous acts, it's her

577
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:18,960
Speaker 3: obedient acts. Our salvation is free, you can never earn it.

578
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 3: But we're the ones that are supposed to construct our

579
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:25,960
Speaker 3: wedding dress by our righteous acts, and so I wrote

580
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 3: this book not to discuss and debate timelines and seasons.

581
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 3: I put those in there because Paul said, encourage one

582
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:38,880
Speaker 3: another with these words, not terrify one another with these words.

583
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 3: I find that a lot of people what they do

584
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 3: is they use eschatology to terrify people. It's the wedding

585
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:49,520
Speaker 3: of the ages. I don't know any bride unless she

586
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:51,960
Speaker 3: didn't want to get married to the groom that's terrified

587
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:54,720
Speaker 3: for a wedding day. My wife and I couldn't wait.

588
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 3: So the church should be excited. We should be in

589
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 3: encouraging one another, saying he's coming, our groove is coming.

590
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,320
Speaker 3: He's waiting for his dad to say, go get your girl.

591
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:10,520
Speaker 3: And we're a love sick bride waiting for our groom

592
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 3: to come and get us. That's the story for the

593
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 3: Church of the Second Coming.

594
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:16,360
Speaker 1: Hey, quick pause.

595
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,359
Speaker 2: I want to tell you about a Bible study tool

596
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:22,080
Speaker 2: that I've used for twenty five years. It is one

597
00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:25,200
Speaker 2: of only two sponsors I have on this channel, along

598
00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:28,480
Speaker 2: with Tablet School Theology. Why because I deeply believe in

599
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 2: it and I deeply benefited from it, and I want

600
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,440
Speaker 2: you to consider using it. It's called Logos and the

601
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,920
Speaker 2: tools that offers at your fingertips will blow you away.

602
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:40,960
Speaker 2: I use it preparing for interviews, I use it in

603
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,520
Speaker 2: my personal Bible study in the morning, and I even

604
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:46,480
Speaker 2: used to when I was writing my dissertation. That means

605
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 2: it's a tool that can be used by scholars who

606
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,359
Speaker 2: want to go deep and lay people who just want

607
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 2: to get into the scriptures for themselves. If you want

608
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:56,359
Speaker 2: to learn how to study the Bible for yourself and

609
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:59,839
Speaker 2: just own and know the scriptures, you will not find

610
00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 2: a better tool than Logos. I'd love for you to

611
00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:05,920
Speaker 2: consider trying it out. Start a free sixty day trial,

612
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:09,279
Speaker 2: which you can find at logos dot com. Slash McDowell

613
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 2: link is in the description. Now back to the show.

614
00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 1: Amen to that.

615
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:15,440
Speaker 2: I'm in the middle of doing a three part series

616
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 2: on this, and I have two interviews with a New

617
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 2: Testament scholar at Talbot, a colleague of mine, Alan Holperg,

618
00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:23,120
Speaker 2: and he agrees with a lot of what you said.

619
00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:24,799
Speaker 2: He would take kind of the it used to be

620
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,720
Speaker 2: called mid trib but now in kind of a scholar

621
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 2: world it's often called.

622
00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:30,400
Speaker 1: Like a pre Wrath position.

623
00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:34,240
Speaker 2: And he talks, he's he talks a little bit about

624
00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:37,080
Speaker 2: like the temple being built as a sign before Jus

625
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,480
Speaker 2: comes back. We don't have to nuance this right now.

626
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 2: People can read your book, you lay out your evidences

627
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 2: for it. You mentioned one reason why you were hesitant

628
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:48,799
Speaker 2: to get into studying this. For me, I was born

629
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:53,360
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy six, so Lindsey I think, was the

630
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:56,560
Speaker 2: author of the decade or one of them, and stuff

631
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:59,480
Speaker 2: about the late great planet Earth that lingered into the eighties.

632
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:01,879
Speaker 2: When I grew up the nineties, there was so much

633
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 2: stuff about Russia is this beast?

634
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 1: And I look back on like there was hysteria. They

635
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 1: got so.

636
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:13,000
Speaker 2: Many things wrong, and it kind of jaded me for

637
00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:17,920
Speaker 2: a while from even talking about end Time's prophecy, and

638
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:22,279
Speaker 2: it discouraged me from studying it. Not to mention so

639
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:26,000
Speaker 2: many people that gave specific dates like this exact date

640
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 2: Jesus is coming back and got it wrong made me

641
00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:33,480
Speaker 2: think a lot of humility about how we read this,

642
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:36,880
Speaker 2: especially because so many people didn't understand Jesus when he

643
00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 2: first came, even though the signs were there.

644
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:42,240
Speaker 1: So what are the other things that changed?

645
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 3: You?

646
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 2: Just pastoring teaching saying I'm not only going to write

647
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:46,959
Speaker 2: on this, but I'm gonna do a ton of YouTube

648
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 2: videos on this. I'm going to write a book on this,

649
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,280
Speaker 2: like this is kind of going to become my lane.

650
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:55,720
Speaker 2: What else motivated you to change? And are you glad

651
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:56,160
Speaker 2: that you did?

652
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:03,719
Speaker 3: Yes, I'm glad that I did. I was very terrified

653
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:06,359
Speaker 3: at first. First of all, I thought I would never

654
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:08,239
Speaker 3: write on this or even preach on it. You know,

655
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:11,480
Speaker 3: I've never preached a message on this until this year.

656
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:15,120
Speaker 3: January was the first time, Oh forgive Me in Mexico.

657
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 3: I spoke to eleven thousand people or eleven thousand member

658
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 3: church in December. That was the very first time I

659
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 3: had ever preached a message on the Second Coming.

660
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:25,840
Speaker 1: How long have you pastored?

661
00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 3: Though? By the way, I've been in ministry forty three years.

662
00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:31,959
Speaker 3: So forty three years, wow, forty two years. I never

663
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 3: spoke on it, Okay never because I didn't want anything

664
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:39,759
Speaker 3: to do with it. I hated the arguments that were

665
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:43,640
Speaker 3: behind it. I hated the laziness, I saw the escape mentality.

666
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 3: I couldn't stand it. And the Holy Spirit I mean

667
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 3: started dealing with me in twenty twenty one and he said, son,

668
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:53,560
Speaker 3: I want you to I want you to look into

669
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:57,440
Speaker 3: this and I mean I felt so draw drawn in

670
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:00,800
Speaker 3: and I didn't put hundreds of hours. I put thousands

671
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,840
Speaker 3: of hours. Now I never thought I would write a book.

672
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 3: Now here's what happened between twenty twenty one and twenty

673
00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:13,320
Speaker 3: twenty six. I started observing things in my own personal life.

674
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:17,040
Speaker 3: First of all, my family said, Dad, you don't get

675
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 3: upset about things like you used to. It's like, okay.

676
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 3: My wife goes, I'm not kidding. She says it all

677
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 3: the time. You're my favorite husband. I'm like, first time

678
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 3: she said, I was like, what does that mean? And

679
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:34,320
Speaker 3: she goes, we've been married for forty four years. She goes,

680
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:37,439
Speaker 3: I like, John two point oh better than one point oh.

681
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:43,040
Speaker 3: I found myself sean weeping to win souls to Jesus.

682
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 3: I mean, I was passionate in twenty fifteen. Don't get

683
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:52,359
Speaker 3: me wrong, but I was so passionate I'm weeping. I

684
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:55,480
Speaker 3: came home one morning because we have tennis courts two

685
00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:57,880
Speaker 3: blocks from my house, and you know, dark thirty. I

686
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 3: go out there and I walk around the tenniscore and

687
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:01,919
Speaker 3: I pray. I pray out loud, and I pray loud

688
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 3: because nobody can hear me. And I came home one

689
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:09,480
Speaker 3: morning with ass. I said, Babe, I've been crying. I'm weeping.

690
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 3: I want to win souls. And I realized, okay, wait

691
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,839
Speaker 3: a minute, this fruit isn't what I thought it would be.

692
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:23,439
Speaker 3: Then I started combining that with the thought why would

693
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 3: I avoid preaching the second most written about subject in

694
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:30,800
Speaker 3: the entire Bible?

695
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:31,720
Speaker 1: Good question?

696
00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:36,439
Speaker 3: And I went, oh, my gosh, and I thought, wait

697
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 3: a minute, okay, why is this the second most And

698
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:43,959
Speaker 3: the Lord showed me in a five K race. Now, Sean,

699
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 3: are you familiar with five k? Right? Have you ever

700
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:47,759
Speaker 3: done a five K race?

701
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 2: Gosh, three miles, not a formal one, but I've I've

702
00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 2: ran that length for sure.

703
00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 3: Kate, A five k race, just for people who don't

704
00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 3: connect the dods, is a five thoul meter race? A

705
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 3: K is a thousand? All right? When does the runner

706
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 3: run the fastest in the five k race?

707
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:13,840
Speaker 1: Well, I would guess the last Oh, keep going, yeah,

708
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 1: the last.

709
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:20,319
Speaker 3: One hundred meters when he sees the finish line. All

710
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 3: of a sudden, I thought, go, no, I'm more passionate

711
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:27,240
Speaker 3: about ministry, about getting soul saved, about discipling the nations

712
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 3: of the world than I've ever been in my entire life.

713
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 3: Yet I've spent thousands of hours studying the Second Coming,

714
00:41:34,920 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 3: So all of a sudden, now I start seeing experientially

715
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,160
Speaker 3: the wisdom of God of making this the second most

716
00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:43,040
Speaker 3: talked about subject in the Bible. Do you know the

717
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 3: early Church had what they call prophecy meals. They would

718
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,000
Speaker 3: get together for a meal and they would talk for

719
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:54,080
Speaker 3: hours and hours about nothing but prophetic scriptures. So what

720
00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,719
Speaker 3: does it do? It keeps us urgent. If you look

721
00:41:56,719 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 3: at the football team, it's down ten points at halftime,

722
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 3: they come out and play the way they did. They're

723
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,760
Speaker 3: down ten points with five minutes left, They're in no huddle,

724
00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:10,360
Speaker 3: they are hurry up offense. And this is what will happen.

725
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:14,160
Speaker 3: I believe with the church, when we have the realization

726
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:17,839
Speaker 3: of His soon return, will become more diligent of getting

727
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:20,840
Speaker 3: soul saved, people discipled and doing the work of Jesus.

728
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:25,520
Speaker 3: That's why this guy has made the decision to obey

729
00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:28,880
Speaker 3: God and preach on this John.

730
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 1: I don't think I did an interview until last year.

731
00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:34,239
Speaker 2: I started this channel twenty ten, sixteen years ago, but

732
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:38,239
Speaker 2: got really serious actually around twenty twenty. During COVID I

733
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:40,800
Speaker 2: was like everything shut down. Am I going to speak again?

734
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:42,800
Speaker 2: Am I going to travel again? I better find a

735
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:45,960
Speaker 2: way to communicate. But I had no intention of covering

736
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 2: this topic. Two summers ago, I was invited by what

737
00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:50,959
Speaker 2: is now my home church maybe is a little longer

738
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 2: than that, to preach on the Revelation. And I preached

739
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:56,520
Speaker 2: on Revelation twenty dealt with the millennium, one of the

740
00:42:56,520 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 2: most controversial topics in the Bible, and then the last

741
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 2: words of Jesus. And I'll tell you, John, it does

742
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:07,319
Speaker 2: make me weep in a way. And I wonder why

743
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:09,960
Speaker 2: had I not studied this before. And I just want

744
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:12,440
Speaker 2: to tell you because you mentioned weeping earlier. I want

745
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:15,320
Speaker 2: to ask what it is that makes you do so.

746
00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:18,960
Speaker 2: So when I'm looking at Revelation twenty two, two things

747
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 2: are powerful to me. One Jesus writes, and this is

748
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 2: verse twelve. He says, look, I'm coming soon, and my

749
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:29,200
Speaker 2: reward is with me to repay each person. According to

750
00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 2: his work, I'm the alpha and the omega, the first

751
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 2: and the last, the beginning in the end. I get

752
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:40,279
Speaker 2: goosebumps reading that. Because the christology is as high as

753
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:45,239
Speaker 2: it could possibly be. Jesus is the one true eternal God,

754
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 2: and he's coming back to judge the world. But then

755
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:52,480
Speaker 2: the last world words A men, you go, says verse twenty.

756
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:56,920
Speaker 2: He who testifies about these things says, yes, I'm coming soon. Amen,

757
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 2: Come Lord Jesus. Those words. When I look at the

758
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:06,560
Speaker 2: brokenness of the world, I find myself saying that now

759
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 2: more than ever, Come Lord soon. Those two things, the

760
00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:14,440
Speaker 2: high christology and that Jesus is going to make all

761
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:17,239
Speaker 2: things new? Is what, if I just stop and think

762
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:19,160
Speaker 2: about it moves me to tears?

763
00:44:19,640 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 1: What is it?

764
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 2: Because you've studied this a lot more than I have.

765
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 2: What is it that moves you to tears when you

766
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:25,640
Speaker 2: study the end times?

767
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 3: The joy of being united with Him and not only me,

768
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:40,400
Speaker 3: but a massive amount of people, and that will be

769
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 3: finally united with our groom. I have a real belief

770
00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 3: that right from the beginning God was looking for a

771
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:54,239
Speaker 3: bride for his son, because he wanted that bride to

772
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:57,160
Speaker 3: be right next to his son and rule the nations,

773
00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:00,439
Speaker 3: the continents, and the galaxies forever and ever and ever.

774
00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:03,799
Speaker 3: And if you look at what Jesus says to the

775
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:07,799
Speaker 3: most carnal Church, the Laodicean Church, to him who overcomes,

776
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:11,480
Speaker 3: I will grant them a throne as my father granted

777
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 3: me a throne, and you will rule the nations. This

778
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:21,160
Speaker 3: life is going to seem like a very quick dream

779
00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:25,279
Speaker 3: once we leave this world, and we're going to enter

780
00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:27,160
Speaker 3: into what we're going to be doing forever and ever,

781
00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:29,319
Speaker 3: and it's going to be a lot more exciting and

782
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 3: full of full of life and what's coming than what

783
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:38,880
Speaker 3: we've experienced here. If what we've experienced here was created

784
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:42,960
Speaker 3: by there, then what is there like? It's going to

785
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:48,360
Speaker 3: be so exhilarating, so much planning and building, and it's

786
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:54,880
Speaker 3: going to be eternally blissful, and I really mean that,

787
00:45:55,680 --> 00:46:00,200
Speaker 3: and so I don't want anybody to miss it. And

788
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:05,440
Speaker 3: this is what you say what caused me to be emotional?

789
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 3: One John two twenty eight says, remain in fellowship with

790
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 3: him so that when he appears, we might be confident

791
00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 3: and not shrink back in shame. Do you know how

792
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:24,880
Speaker 3: he starts that verse, little children, remain in fellowship with

793
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:27,760
Speaker 3: him so that when he appears, we might be confident

794
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:32,560
Speaker 3: and not shrink back in shame. That tells me there's

795
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,600
Speaker 3: two responses of believers. You know, when John doesn't say

796
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 3: little children, he's not talking to atheists, he's not talking

797
00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:45,880
Speaker 3: to agnostics. He's talking to us that when he appears,

798
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:51,880
Speaker 3: there's going to be two responses. One's shame and one's confidence.

799
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:54,840
Speaker 3: Let me give you an example of this. My dad

800
00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 3: never made more than forty five thousand dollars a year,

801
00:46:59,480 --> 00:47:02,520
Speaker 3: yet he saved like crazy, the most frugal man I

802
00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:05,239
Speaker 3: ever knew in my entire life, so his kids could

803
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 3: go to the university of their choice. I went to Purdue.

804
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:10,040
Speaker 3: I happened to walk on the tennis team and start,

805
00:47:12,239 --> 00:47:17,520
Speaker 3: but still my dad, my dad had to pay. And

806
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:22,600
Speaker 3: I remember when I sat in the very first day

807
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:27,239
Speaker 3: in the biggest lecture hall for the engineering school at Purdue's.

808
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 3: There's six thousand students in all produce engineering. There was

809
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:36,239
Speaker 3: about two to twenty to twenty five hundred of us

810
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:40,839
Speaker 3: freshman engineers sitting in that hall. And the professor looks

811
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:42,640
Speaker 3: at us and goes, look at the students you're left.

812
00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:45,319
Speaker 3: Look to the students. You're right, you won't see them.

813
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:47,360
Speaker 3: At the end of the year. We're going to flunk

814
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:50,000
Speaker 3: fifty percent of you out. Wow, And he said, and

815
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:53,200
Speaker 3: then next year we'll flunk out another fifty percent. So

816
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:56,279
Speaker 3: only one out of every three of you will be

817
00:47:56,360 --> 00:48:00,560
Speaker 3: here at the end of your sophomore year. I said that.

818
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:04,960
Speaker 3: A real healthy fear hit me. Sean and I started

819
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:09,680
Speaker 3: studying for finals. That week. I found guys. I found

820
00:48:09,680 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 3: guys who would encourage me to study. I went to

821
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,759
Speaker 3: the library, I got away from the parties, and I

822
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:17,840
Speaker 3: worked like crazy. And Sean, do you know what my

823
00:48:17,880 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 3: first semester, they nailed the report card. It takes about

824
00:48:21,560 --> 00:48:23,760
Speaker 3: ten days. Remember we don't have phones. You're not getting

825
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:30,120
Speaker 3: your report card on your phone. I was confident, and

826
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:33,280
Speaker 3: when that report card came, it was better than I thought.

827
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 3: I made the Purdue University Dean's List. My dad saw

828
00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:40,680
Speaker 3: that report card and his face lit up. He's a

829
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 3: World War two dad doesn't say a lot, but boy,

830
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:45,200
Speaker 3: I'm telling you the joy on his face, I'm sure.

831
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:50,839
Speaker 3: Then I joined a fraternity. Okay, now you know where

832
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 3: I'm going. Okay. Now I'm playing frisbee football all day.

833
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:57,480
Speaker 3: I'm going to four kegers a week. I'm partying like crazy.

834
00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:01,480
Speaker 3: I'm dating girls. I'm not saved yet. Okay. And I

835
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:06,800
Speaker 3: didn't apply myself. And I remember when that final period

836
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:11,840
Speaker 3: was over. I remember not having a lot of confidence.

837
00:49:12,880 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 3: And I was dreading that report card and when it

838
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:21,920
Speaker 3: arrived it was bad. And I opened it up and

839
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:24,640
Speaker 3: my dad said, son, let me see it. And I

840
00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:29,000
Speaker 3: remember his face when he saw that report card. I

841
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 3: was so ashamed. I mean, I never let it happen

842
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:36,279
Speaker 3: again because I never wanted to see the look on

843
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 3: his face again. John actually says, there's going to be believers.

844
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:44,640
Speaker 3: They're going to be ashamed at disappearing first John two

845
00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:48,839
Speaker 3: twenty eight. Go read it, guys. I don't want anybody

846
00:49:49,239 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 3: under our watch to be ashamed when he returns. So

847
00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:58,640
Speaker 3: this message, even though you chose to start out with

848
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:02,280
Speaker 3: thirty percent of the book, the bulk of this book

849
00:50:02,520 --> 00:50:05,360
Speaker 3: is what do we do so that we're not ashamed

850
00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:06,200
Speaker 3: when he appears.

851
00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 1: That's a that's a great response. I love that. I

852
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:11,719
Speaker 1: do want the audience to know that.

853
00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:14,360
Speaker 2: Like I've interviewed John Lennox and he has a I

854
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 2: don't know, four or five six hundred page commentary just

855
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:22,920
Speaker 2: on the Book of Revelation alone, and it's readable but

856
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 2: very academic. You've clearly done your homework, but like you're

857
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:31,799
Speaker 2: articulating here, your concern is less pre trib and mid trib.

858
00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:34,120
Speaker 1: All though you lay out your evidence for that.

859
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:37,719
Speaker 2: You're concerning is less exactly when Jesus is coming out,

860
00:50:37,719 --> 00:50:40,400
Speaker 2: but you're laying out fulfilled prophecy that we have reason

861
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 2: to believe that it's the case your concerned is more

862
00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:47,080
Speaker 2: pastoral for people how they live in light of this,

863
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:49,359
Speaker 2: that's important for people to know.

864
00:50:49,719 --> 00:50:51,960
Speaker 1: Can I act you one? Maybe this is the academic

865
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 1: or apologist to me.

866
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:55,840
Speaker 3: So I've got I can answer it.

867
00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:58,160
Speaker 1: Just do your best. If the answer is simple, then

868
00:50:58,280 --> 00:50:59,200
Speaker 1: give a simple answer.

869
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:02,600
Speaker 2: I'm curious as you think about the end times, if

870
00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 2: artificial intelligence at all plays a role, and you're thinking

871
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:10,640
Speaker 2: about this, And I asked because Silicon Valley billionaire Peter

872
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:14,040
Speaker 2: Thiel draw us on like Biblical proceeds to warn of

873
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:18,839
Speaker 2: a quote Antichrist who will promise safety from existential risk

874
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:21,960
Speaker 2: like nuclear war, climate change, but then it would bring

875
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:25,720
Speaker 2: about something worse, this totalitarian government. Now in some ways

876
00:51:25,719 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 2: he's borrowing Christian language in his kind of eschatology. But

877
00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:32,719
Speaker 2: do you find any reason that that would be a

878
00:51:32,760 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 2: part of it or is that into the realm of

879
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:35,959
Speaker 2: speculation too much?

880
00:51:38,920 --> 00:51:43,640
Speaker 3: Okay, so pure conjuncture conjecture from this point on. Okay,

881
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:45,960
Speaker 3: all right, So can we make that very clear.

882
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:48,880
Speaker 1: Totally fair. That's what I appreciate.

883
00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:52,320
Speaker 3: That if we go past twenty seventy, let's say I'm

884
00:51:52,640 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 3: totally wrong. I think this could possibly be the last

885
00:51:57,080 --> 00:52:00,920
Speaker 3: full generation I'm talking about, from infant to adult, that

886
00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:05,440
Speaker 3: we have fully human beings. I believe that they're going

887
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:09,280
Speaker 3: to figure out how to merge AI with human brains,

888
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:12,480
Speaker 3: and they're going to begin to go down that road.

889
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:17,319
Speaker 3: I believe that AI. One of the greatest risks of

890
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 3: AI is false information. I believe that AI is going

891
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:27,919
Speaker 3: to be It's a tool. I can have a gun,

892
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:30,400
Speaker 3: and that gun can be used to protect or that

893
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:33,640
Speaker 3: gun could be used to destroy. I believe AI is

894
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:35,400
Speaker 3: going to eventually get into the hands of people are

895
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:39,560
Speaker 3: going to use it in very very dark ways. So

896
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:46,040
Speaker 3: the thought has hit me. Could this false prophet could

897
00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 3: he be kind of a hybrid of either I don't

898
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:56,719
Speaker 3: want to go there. That'd be another hour, but it

899
00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:01,120
Speaker 3: could he be a hybrid of AI and human And

900
00:53:01,960 --> 00:53:05,960
Speaker 3: could he be performing these things by the power of

901
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:13,440
Speaker 3: AI and the technologies that we have today to terrify

902
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:18,800
Speaker 3: people into obedience to the Antichrist? I think this could

903
00:53:18,920 --> 00:53:23,759
Speaker 3: very well be something. I think if I could just

904
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:32,080
Speaker 3: be fully transparent here. Sure, AI to me is another

905
00:53:32,239 --> 00:53:35,000
Speaker 3: indicator that I really do believe we're in the final

906
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:40,440
Speaker 3: days because of where it's going and the hybrid that

907
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:41,759
Speaker 3: I'm talking about. I mean, if you look at the

908
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:44,960
Speaker 3: days of Noah, you had angels having sex with women,

909
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:47,160
Speaker 3: and they had Nefhelin on the earth, and it got

910
00:53:47,239 --> 00:53:51,600
Speaker 3: to the point where it was corrupted. Right, So the

911
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:55,240
Speaker 3: corruption on the earth wasn't just them drinking and getting drunk.

912
00:53:55,640 --> 00:54:00,120
Speaker 3: It was the mixing of the seed. So if you

913
00:54:00,120 --> 00:54:05,160
Speaker 3: look at this now, you're not mixing maybe demons with humans,

914
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 3: although I'm not saying that's not a possibility. I'm saying

915
00:54:08,239 --> 00:54:11,960
Speaker 3: what's even more dangerous is mixing AI with human beings.

916
00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:17,080
Speaker 3: And now you end up getting people that are losing

917
00:54:17,719 --> 00:54:22,200
Speaker 3: consciousness as far as a consciousness towards God and are

918
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:27,719
Speaker 3: more driven by the intelligence, the artificial intelligence that has

919
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:31,600
Speaker 3: been merged into their brains. That to me shows me

920
00:54:31,960 --> 00:54:36,439
Speaker 3: because that's where it's going. Do you know that this

921
00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 3: is the reason that Elon Musk pulled away from I

922
00:54:41,239 --> 00:54:44,120
Speaker 3: can't remember the guy's name who's over eighty percent of

923
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:49,960
Speaker 3: the AI, the Google guy. Anyway, they were having a discussion,

924
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:54,319
Speaker 3: and Elon made the statement he said, this could get

925
00:54:54,400 --> 00:54:57,399
Speaker 3: dangerous if we don't put some walls up, and he said,

926
00:54:57,400 --> 00:55:01,239
Speaker 3: don't be a speciist. That was the response of the

927
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:03,840
Speaker 3: CEO of Google. I don't know if it was Google.

928
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:06,319
Speaker 3: I can't remember. I'm doing this one because I've heard

929
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:08,640
Speaker 3: it a couple of times. But in essence, what he

930
00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 3: was saying is, hey, we want the highest order to rule,

931
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:15,759
Speaker 3: and if AI is more intelligent than us, then why

932
00:55:15,800 --> 00:55:18,839
Speaker 3: are you? Why are you? Why are you scared? There

933
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:22,920
Speaker 3: are people that think like that, And so we're living

934
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:25,880
Speaker 3: in the day where once again I think the seed

935
00:55:25,960 --> 00:55:28,400
Speaker 3: is being is it could be corrupted again.

936
00:55:31,120 --> 00:55:33,560
Speaker 2: Well, John, I super appreciate that you said this is

937
00:55:33,640 --> 00:55:36,279
Speaker 2: I don't know if you were like speculation just to

938
00:55:36,400 --> 00:55:40,840
Speaker 2: fine speculation, conjecture in some ways. Oh my goodness, we

939
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:42,799
Speaker 2: get to have a full conversation on this. I have

940
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 2: so many questions for you about the Genesis six passage,

941
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 2: about the possibility philosophically of us merging what that would

942
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:49,640
Speaker 2: look like.

943
00:55:49,960 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 1: We will let this sit with the audience.

944
00:55:52,920 --> 00:55:55,239
Speaker 3: If you're thinking not in the book, okay, yes, it's

945
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:56,319
Speaker 3: nothing in the book.

946
00:55:56,440 --> 00:55:58,360
Speaker 1: No, no, no, you put me there and Sean.

947
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:00,600
Speaker 3: I don't know why, but I've never done this on

948
00:56:00,640 --> 00:56:04,520
Speaker 3: a podcast, never said what I just said. Hopefully you

949
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:08,000
Speaker 3: know people do understand. I'm just I'm just thinking what

950
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 3: wildly could happen. I'm not saying it will happen. I'm

951
00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:15,200
Speaker 3: not prophesying it's going to happen. I am saying it

952
00:56:15,239 --> 00:56:20,360
Speaker 3: could happen. And this is where very powerful human beings

953
00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:23,040
Speaker 3: want it to go, is what I'm trying to say.

954
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:26,919
Speaker 2: It's totally fair, and I think you qualified that very

955
00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:29,960
Speaker 2: fairly in terms of possibilities and thoughts and trends that

956
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:32,480
Speaker 2: we're seeing. So if you're listening, going hold on a minute.

957
00:56:32,520 --> 00:56:35,239
Speaker 2: I want a full conversation about this and what the

958
00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:38,759
Speaker 2: end times and artificial intelligence together would look like. Let

959
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:41,120
Speaker 2: us know comment maybe we'll come back and talk about that.

960
00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:44,120
Speaker 2: But I also want to spend too much time on speculation,

961
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 2: so let me let me just end by asking you this.

962
00:56:47,120 --> 00:56:50,360
Speaker 2: You you stunned me by telling me the first two

963
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 2: months of the release of The King Is Coming is

964
00:56:54,200 --> 00:56:59,680
Speaker 2: about one hundred thousand copies. If over over one hundred

965
00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:02,799
Speaker 2: thousand copies, if a book sells that in its lifetime,

966
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:06,719
Speaker 2: or a quarter of that would be considered a success.

967
00:57:07,160 --> 00:57:09,640
Speaker 2: So why do you think it's sold. It's got a

968
00:57:09,640 --> 00:57:11,920
Speaker 2: great title, you've got a great following.

969
00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:12,960
Speaker 1: But is there.

970
00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:16,880
Speaker 2: Something about the moment right now or something else that

971
00:57:17,080 --> 00:57:18,720
Speaker 2: tells you it's landing differently?

972
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:25,400
Speaker 3: Yes, Sean. Some of the greatest leaders in the Body

973
00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:28,560
Speaker 3: of Christ, most stable, they've been faithful for over four decades,

974
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:32,360
Speaker 3: have come to me and said, John, I didn't touch

975
00:57:32,400 --> 00:57:35,439
Speaker 3: this with a ten foot pole, and now I feel

976
00:57:35,520 --> 00:57:38,280
Speaker 3: like I have to. I'm mandated by the Holy Spirit

977
00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:44,520
Speaker 3: to talk about this. I have so many pastors that

978
00:57:44,600 --> 00:57:49,200
Speaker 3: are in their forties and fifties, who pastor over fifteen

979
00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:52,600
Speaker 3: thousand members in their church, and they're preaching on it,

980
00:57:52,640 --> 00:57:55,360
Speaker 3: and they're telling me, John, I feel so compelled to

981
00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:58,520
Speaker 3: preach on this. I think all of us know it.

982
00:57:59,280 --> 00:58:02,520
Speaker 3: All of us who really love God and walk with God.

983
00:58:03,080 --> 00:58:06,480
Speaker 3: We know we're in the season. And you have to remember,

984
00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:14,360
Speaker 3: John the Baptist came to prepare a people for Jesus's

985
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:18,800
Speaker 3: first coming. Malachi tells us that same annoying's going to

986
00:58:18,880 --> 00:58:21,120
Speaker 3: come to prepare us before the great and dreadful day

987
00:58:21,120 --> 00:58:23,800
Speaker 3: of the Lord, before his second coming. I don't believe

988
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:27,439
Speaker 3: it's one person like John the Baptist. I believe it's

989
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:32,680
Speaker 3: thousands of sons and daughters, men servants and maid servants.

990
00:58:33,480 --> 00:58:35,400
Speaker 3: I believe God is putting us on the hearts of

991
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:39,240
Speaker 3: leaders because we're right at the verge of a second coming.

992
00:58:39,600 --> 00:58:42,040
Speaker 3: And the reason this book is sold the way it has,

993
00:58:42,240 --> 00:58:45,080
Speaker 3: making the New York Times three times, over one hundred

994
00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:47,800
Speaker 3: thousand before it was even two months old, amazing, it's

995
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:51,440
Speaker 3: because and I've never in twenty four books I've written,

996
00:58:51,720 --> 00:58:54,280
Speaker 3: I haven't had any of those books do this, not

997
00:58:54,400 --> 00:59:01,240
Speaker 3: even half of this. The reason is because people know it.

998
00:59:01,800 --> 00:59:04,840
Speaker 3: And when they see a title the King is Coming,

999
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:09,440
Speaker 3: they know and it bears witness. And just like multitudes,

1000
00:59:09,520 --> 00:59:12,440
Speaker 3: Jesus said, what did you go out to the wilderness

1001
00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:16,120
Speaker 3: to see a read blowing in the wind, somebody dressed

1002
00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:20,960
Speaker 3: up in a nice three piece suit. No, because this

1003
00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:25,040
Speaker 3: guy had a word about my coming, and this guy

1004
00:59:25,240 --> 00:59:30,760
Speaker 3: was sent to prepare my coming. Wildly, thousands of us, thousands,

1005
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:35,520
Speaker 3: tens of thousands. God's putting that same thing on us,

1006
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:38,840
Speaker 3: and we're preparing a people and making them ready for

1007
00:59:38,920 --> 00:59:41,320
Speaker 3: the Lord's coming. That's what I believe.

1008
00:59:42,320 --> 00:59:45,720
Speaker 1: I love it, John, I thoroughly enjoyed this interview. This

1009
00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:46,400
Speaker 1: is a lot of fun.

1010
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:48,960
Speaker 2: It went some directions I did not expect it to go,

1011
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:50,320
Speaker 2: which is okay, And.

1012
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:54,040
Speaker 1: You are willing to weigh in and give your two cents.

1013
00:59:54,360 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 2: I've been reading, not as nearly as many as you have,

1014
00:59:56,600 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 2: but been reading a lot of books. The King is

1015
00:59:58,680 --> 01:00:03,520
Speaker 2: Coming is fascinating. There's full of stories and examples. Every chapter.

1016
01:00:03,800 --> 01:00:05,920
Speaker 2: I'm thinking, where's he going? And then you relate it.

1017
01:00:06,360 --> 01:00:09,200
Speaker 2: You lay out your case and how you think eschatology

1018
01:00:09,280 --> 01:00:12,680
Speaker 2: will play out and why the return of Jesus is imminent,

1019
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:16,080
Speaker 2: and you invite people to examine it. So I'd invite

1020
01:00:16,120 --> 01:00:18,360
Speaker 2: people to pick up a copy minimally, even if you

1021
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:22,439
Speaker 2: disagree with John. You'll find it interesting, you'll find it fascinating,

1022
01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:25,600
Speaker 2: You'll find it full of good stories. But really, the

1023
01:00:25,720 --> 01:00:28,560
Speaker 2: big takeaway here is and I appreciate the youse said this, Jean,

1024
01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:31,800
Speaker 2: You've said, Hey, if I'm wrong on my chronology, if

1025
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:34,760
Speaker 2: I'm wrong about post trib or pretrib, I'm not wrong

1026
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:37,400
Speaker 2: that Jesus is coming back. And I'm not wrong that

1027
01:00:37,480 --> 01:00:41,600
Speaker 2: the Bible talks about this over and over again. I'm

1028
01:00:41,640 --> 01:00:44,760
Speaker 2: not wrong that when we have confidence that Jesus is

1029
01:00:44,800 --> 01:00:48,240
Speaker 2: coming back. That must transform the way we live in

1030
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:51,640
Speaker 2: the present. That's a huge takeaway for your book, and

1031
01:00:51,680 --> 01:00:53,040
Speaker 2: so I hope people will pick it up.

1032
01:00:53,320 --> 01:00:54,919
Speaker 1: John, this is fun. Thanks for coming on.

1033
01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:57,640
Speaker 3: Sean, it's been a pleasure. Thank you for having me.

1034
01:00:58,040 --> 01:00:59,360
Speaker 1: Absolutely we'll do it again.

1035
01:00:59,560 --> 01:01:01,880
Speaker 2: Check out the other interview is coming up with doctor

1036
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:04,440
Speaker 2: Alan Holtberg. A lot of similarity, a little bit of

1037
01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:07,480
Speaker 2: different nuance on a few things. If you thought about studying,

1038
01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:09,560
Speaker 2: we'd love to have you at Talbot School Theology. We

1039
01:01:09,640 --> 01:01:12,760
Speaker 2: have full classes on Daniel and Revelation. We discuss and

1040
01:01:12,800 --> 01:01:15,240
Speaker 2: we debate this stuff. We'd love to have you. We

1041
01:01:15,280 --> 01:01:19,320
Speaker 2: also have an apologetics program in particular where we talk

1042
01:01:19,400 --> 01:01:23,400
Speaker 2: about the evidence for Jesus fulfilled prophecy, the scriptures, etc.

1043
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:25,800
Speaker 1: We'd love to have you join us here.

1044
01:01:26,200 --> 01:01:27,720
Speaker 2: John, you got a flight to catch, so this has

1045
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:29,520
Speaker 2: been a joy, but thanks for coming on.

1046
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:30,680
Speaker 3: Thank you.

1047
01:01:31,080 --> 01:01:33,800
Speaker 2: Hey friends, if you enjoyed this show, please hit that

1048
01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:36,800
Speaker 2: fall button on your podcast app. Most of you tuning

1049
01:01:36,840 --> 01:01:39,200
Speaker 2: in haven't done this yet and it makes a huge

1050
01:01:39,200 --> 01:01:41,960
Speaker 2: difference in helping us reach and equip more people and

1051
01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:46,400
Speaker 2: build community. And please consider leaving a podcast review. Every

1052
01:01:46,600 --> 01:01:49,720
Speaker 2: review helps. Thanks for listening to The Sean McDowell Show,

1053
01:01:49,840 --> 01:01:53,680
Speaker 2: brought to you by Talbot School of Theology at Biola University,

1054
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:57,040
Speaker 2: where we have on campus and online programs and apologetic

1055
01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:00,360
Speaker 2: spiritual information, marriage and family, Bible, and so much more.

1056
01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 2: We would love to train you to more effectively, live, teach,

1057
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:06,360
Speaker 2: and defend the Christian faith today, and we will see

1058
01:02:06,400 --> 01:02:11,840
Speaker 2: you when the next episode drops. Hm hmm.