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Speaker 1: Life audio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, everybody, welcome back into the build different podcast. I'll

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Speaker 2: be your host today, Dr. Zach Clinton. And I just

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Speaker 2: want to begin by thanking you so much for taking

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Speaker 1: I appreciate your feedback.

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Speaker 2: And I always love hearing how these conversations are impacting

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Speaker 2: your life. Built Different is proudly sponsored by Liberty University.

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Speaker 2: Liberty University has impacted my life greatly. My friend, I'm

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Speaker 2: All right, my friend, let's dive into today's conversation with

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Speaker 2: a very special guest.

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Speaker 1: Hello, everybody.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back into the Built Different podcast. As always, we'll

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Speaker 2: be your host today, Dr.

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Speaker 3: Zach Clinton. Dr. Tim Clinton.

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Speaker 1: We are so excited to.

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Speaker 2: Be kicking off our AACC 2026 Faith and Flourishing Mega

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Speaker 2: National Christian Counseling Conference this evening at the Lowe's Arlington

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Speaker 2: Hotel in Dallas, Texas. We have 2,500 counselors and medical

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Speaker 2: professionals and ministry leaders, coaches coming from all over the

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Speaker 2: world to gather, to grow in a relationship with God,

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Speaker 2: but also to commune in fellowship with one another, to

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Speaker 2: be educated, equipped, empowered, encouraged, to just to continue to

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Speaker 2: walk in and walk out the calling God has placed

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Speaker 2: on their life. That being said, we have some incredible

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Speaker 2: partnerships and sponsorships, but we have friends that are here

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Speaker 2: at the event presenting alongside of us, ministry leaders from

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Speaker 2: around the world. And one of them that is here

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Speaker 2: with us today to jump on this episode is Rodney Holmstrom.

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Speaker 2: He's from Celebrate Recovery. He is actually the global field

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Speaker 2: director of CR. He's a licensed professional counselor. He served

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Speaker 2: the past 18 years as CR pastor of Fellowship Bible

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Speaker 2: in Northwest Arkansas. And I love this. He's enthusiastic about

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Speaker 2: helping families and communities break the cycles of dysfunction to

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Speaker 2: help them in finding purpose in their pain from their hurts,

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Speaker 2: from their habits. and from their hangups. Rodney, our friend,

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Speaker 2: thank you so much for joining us today.

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Speaker 3: Oh man, so good to be here with you guys. So,

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Speaker 3: so appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: We look forward, not just to what God has in

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Speaker 2: store over the next couple of days, but what God

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Speaker 2: has in store over the next couple of moments. You know,

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Speaker 2: I'm just thinking, this is National Recovery Month, as of

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Speaker 2: this recording, the month of September. I know that you

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Speaker 2: guys have a lot of initiatives, a lot of advancements

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Speaker 2: through CR. I just want to ask, when you're in spaces,

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Speaker 2: like when we walk in tonight to our opening plenary,

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Speaker 2: 2,500 leaders in the medical, mental health, and ministry fields,

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Speaker 2: I just want to know from a guy like you

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Speaker 2: who does so much in that world of addiction and

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Speaker 2: mental health, what are just some words that come to

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Speaker 2: mind that you would want to share with those people?

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Speaker 3: Yeah. First off is excitement.

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Speaker 4: Having people that are lifelong learners that want to grow

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Speaker 4: and just understanding how do we meet people in their brokenness.

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Speaker 4: And Celebrate Recovery is just one of those incredible tools.

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Speaker 4: I mean, you guys know this, the church is and

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Speaker 4: should be the greatest resource for the world. And to

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Speaker 4: be able to provide a ministry like Celebrate Recovery and

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Speaker 4: a partner with AACC, it's just exciting to just put

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Speaker 4: all this together, to come together, to meet people in

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Speaker 4: their brokenness, reminding them that they're not alone, that, hey,

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Speaker 4: it's okay not to be okay. but let's help you

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Speaker 4: get on the right track regardless of what your struggle is,

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Speaker 4: regardless of the hurt, the hang up the habit type deal.

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Speaker 4: So I'm excited that we get to have this relationship

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Speaker 4: to help educate so that we can be more informed

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Speaker 4: to help those people that are coming that God puts

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Speaker 4: in our lap to say, give me the resources, give

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Speaker 4: me the tools, and we get to give them those tools.

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Speaker 3: How cool is that?

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Speaker 1: It's amazing. Rodney, I like that first side of Isaiah

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Speaker 1: 43 where God says, behold, I'm doing a new thing.

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Speaker 1: I really believe God is doing something special. I want

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Speaker 1: to go back a little bit to the early days

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Speaker 1: of CR, Celebrate Recovery.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Hurts, habits, hang-ups. Rodney, you know, growing up as a kid,

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Speaker 1: if you were messed up or you were struggling with something,

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Speaker 1: you and the church didn't really fit together.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And the message of CR was counterintuitive. We're going to

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Speaker 1: go out and it shouldn't be counterintuitive, but it was.

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Speaker 1: In terms of where the church was.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: You know that bringing in people who are struggling with addiction?

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Are you kidding me?

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Speaker 1: They're messed up. Rodney, talk to us about how the

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Speaker 1: whole organization was birthed.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And why it exploded from your perspective.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Well, it's kind of cool because it didn't start as a, hey,

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Speaker 4: let's go make this big organization.

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Speaker 3: It started out of brokenness.

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Speaker 4: And John Baker, just a broken man, struggling in his marriage,

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Speaker 4: on the brink of probably losing his family because of

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Speaker 4: his own addictions.

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Speaker 3: He's since passed away. Great. He's one of my spiritual fathers.

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Speaker 1: I really like John.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, such a great man. But he had this brokenness.

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Speaker 4: And the church design, and you're so right, is to

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Speaker 4: send you a way to go get help. And then

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Speaker 4: when you get things together, then we have these great

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Speaker 4: discipleship tools and all this stuff to help you, not

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Speaker 4: realizing that this is a part of discipleship, right?

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Speaker 3: We need this.

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Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, talk about your conversation, your addiction to

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Speaker 1: porn somewhere else, or your addiction to drugs or alcohol

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Speaker 1: or whatever. Do that down the street, but don't bring

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Speaker 1: it to the church.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So I love that Pastor John, he was going to

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Speaker 4: traditional recovery meetings and he was getting the help, but

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Speaker 4: he realized God just, and I think it was God,

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Speaker 4: just placed it on his heart. Why can't we have

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Speaker 4: this in the church? So His whole heart was, I'm

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Speaker 4: going to write this strategy and say, what if you

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Speaker 4: guys did this and provide a safe space for people

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Speaker 4: in recovery? And his pastor said, I love this. Why

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Speaker 4: don't you do it, John Baker? And totally caught him

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Speaker 4: off guard. And his wife, Cheryl Baker, they were kind

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Speaker 4: of in this posture of, we're in a big church.

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Speaker 4: We just kind of want to hide out and do

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Speaker 4: our thing and let the church go do this.

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Speaker 3: But God had other plans.

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Speaker 4: And so they started this there in California and started producing,

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Speaker 4: literally writing the curriculum as they went. People are asking, hey,

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Speaker 4: what about step four? Can you do something on spiritual,

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Speaker 4: moral inventory and all that stuff? So they began writing this,

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Speaker 4: and God just birthed this amazing movement.

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Speaker 1: It exploded.

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Speaker 3: It exploded. Yeah. It's not just a ministry. It's become

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Speaker 3: this movement.

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Speaker 4: Close to 50 countries, I think close to 20 different languages.

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Speaker 4: I mean, they started out in their garage just trying

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Speaker 4: to help people around them, and.

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Speaker 3: It just exploded.

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Speaker 4: God will grow healthy things, right? He's in control of

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Speaker 4: kind of the breath. Our responsibility is just to go

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Speaker 4: to Him, and I think that's what Pastor John and

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Speaker 4: Cheryl Baker did. They just went to the Lord and said, hey,

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Speaker 4: we're going to start this. We don't know what's going

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Speaker 4: to happen with it, And it has just exploded. Now

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Speaker 4: we're ministering to people in the military. We call it

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Speaker 4: Welcome Home. You guys know this, the PTSD and the

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Speaker 4: mental health struggles with our veterans coming home from combat.

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Speaker 3: They need a safe space.

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Speaker 4: Mental health initiative, Pastor John Baker's heart in that was,

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Speaker 4: how do we break the stigma of mental health in

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Speaker 4: the church? Yeah. Because it's scary. I think a lot

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Speaker 4: of it is just we don't know what to do

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Speaker 4: with those people. It's interesting because recovery, in general, alcoholics

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Speaker 4: were those people.

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Speaker 3: And then that became normalized.

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Speaker 4: And now mental health, in some ways, has become those

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Speaker 4: people with the church. And not intentionally, I don't think.

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Speaker 4: It's just we don't know what to do with it.

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Speaker 4: So what we're scared of, we run away from. And

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Speaker 4: so that's what I love about Celebrate Recovery is it

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Speaker 4: gives this tool to equip our pastors and churches to

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Speaker 4: be able to have our door wide open to say, hey,

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Speaker 4: come on in. It's okay that you're not put together.

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Speaker 4: Now let's help you get on track through this discipleship

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Speaker 4: model that is Celebrate Recovery. So Pastor John Baker, Cheryl Baker,

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Speaker 4: they never dreamed it would become this. They kind of

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Speaker 4: sit back and go, This is amazing. This is not

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Speaker 4: what we had in mind. We're not that smart.

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Speaker 3: But look what God did. I mean, it's that but

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Speaker 3: God moment.

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Speaker 1: I had the privilege of attending a recent event of

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Speaker 1: yours in Tennessee. And it was electric. I heard all

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Speaker 1: about it, Rod.

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 3: No, amazing.

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Speaker 1: I came. I was in the green room. And I thought, no,

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Speaker 1: you know what? I want to go out and sit

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Speaker 1: in the audience. I want to feel this community. I

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Speaker 1: want to see what really is taking place. And the

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Speaker 1: church was packed. There were a couple thousand people in there.

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Speaker 1: They were worshiping the Lord. But there's something about people

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Speaker 1: who have been set free.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And in that room, it wasn't that their journeys were over.

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Speaker 3: You know that?

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Speaker 1: Probably still battling. But this freedom in Christ, when they

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Speaker 1: have tasted it, and you go back and look at

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Speaker 1: all the research in mental health, it all goes back

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Speaker 1: to AA and everything. You know that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And the whole faith piece is powerful. As a matter

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Speaker 1: of fact, a lot of what we stand on, is

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Speaker 1: a lot of that early research that was there that says, hey,

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Speaker 1: faith matters. And I'm telling you, there's a dynamic that's

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Speaker 1: different than, quote, just everyday run-of-the-mill people who are trying to...

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure I'm communicating it exactly the way, but

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Speaker 1: there was a spiritual vibrancy That was different.

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Speaker 3: I love that.

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Speaker 4: You know, I love that you're picking up on that

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Speaker 4: because I think it's, you know, the Celebrate Recovery principles

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Speaker 4: are birthed out of the Beatitudes. And Jesus, the very

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Speaker 4: first thing he says is, you're blessed when you realize

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Speaker 4: you're spiritually poor. And that picture of, I just have

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Speaker 4: this picture of a poor man on the corner that's

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Speaker 4: not eating for days and he's holding out an empty cup.

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Speaker 4: The desperation is, if you don't put something in my cup, Lord,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to die. And that's the posture, and I

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Speaker 4: think that's what you're expressing, Dr. Clinton, is this desperation.

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Speaker 4: When you have somebody that realizes the only one that

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Speaker 4: can fill my cup is Jesus, it changes you. It

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Speaker 4: doesn't mean that your circumstances change, but your posture toward

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Speaker 4: your circumstances as you work through and trust the process,

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Speaker 4: trust Him through the process, is a beautiful thing of, Lord,

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Speaker 4: today again, I'm coming to you, fill my cup, because

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Speaker 4: if you don't, I'm going to die.

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Speaker 3: And that's a game changer, as.

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Speaker 4: Opposed to, I've got to figure out ways and strategies

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Speaker 4: on my own power to fill my cup, which we

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Speaker 4: know doesn't work. Then it's giving me a pat on

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Speaker 4: the back. And then when things don't go right, who's

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Speaker 4: the one that's getting the torture?

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Speaker 3: It's me, right?

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Speaker 4: God, you're in control of all things. And I'm going

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Speaker 4: to trust you again today, which is a beautiful posture.

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Speaker 4: It's a beautiful posture.

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Speaker 2: I think of Galatians 5.1, it is for freedom that

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Speaker 2: we have been set free, right? And a lot of

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Speaker 2: people view that through the lens of addiction, not being

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Speaker 2: bound again by a yoke of slavery. Really, it's the

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Speaker 2: idea of being freed from this legalistic, religious mindset and posture.

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Speaker 2: And it's more in relationship with God. And when we

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Speaker 2: find freedom in Christ, that it's not about what we

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Speaker 2: do or don't do. It's about what has been done

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Speaker 2: for us. There is a freedom in that relationship because

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Speaker 2: then it's like, okay, I don't have to fight and

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Speaker 2: scratch and claw for victory. I get to live from

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Speaker 2: a place of victory because of what has been done

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Speaker 2: for me. And that's why I love Celebrate Recovery. Because

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Speaker 2: like you said, it's not just a ministry thing. And really,

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Speaker 2: it's not just a movement. It is equipping people everywhere

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Speaker 2: with the mental health tools. And that's why the partnership

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Speaker 2: that we've been able to launch alongside of you guys

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Speaker 2: at Addiction Mental Health Recovery Coaching Program, we're so excited

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Speaker 2: because 42 hours of curriculum material to equip the church

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Speaker 2: at large, the best of CR, the best of AACC

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Speaker 2: coming together.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's an honor.

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Speaker 2: It's a privilege for us to sit in a room

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Speaker 2: with you and to share these types of moments together.

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Speaker 2: But it just makes me think about this isn't just

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Speaker 2: coming from a guy. who has lived a polished, pristine life.

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Speaker 2: Like I've read your story. I've listened to your testimony.

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Speaker 3: I'm a pretty messed up guy.

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Speaker 2: But going back some difficult years, your teenage years out

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Speaker 2: there in Arizona, a lot going on, probably a lot

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Speaker 2: of loneliness, spending a lot of time by yourself. I'm

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Speaker 2: just thinking to myself, if I was listening, I would

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Speaker 2: want to hear what maybe were some of the hardships

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Speaker 2: and what were some of the habits and the hooks

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Speaker 2: and the hangups that Ronnie Holmstrom had to work from

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Speaker 2: his own life.

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Speaker 4: I love sharing that because I'm one of those satisfied customers,

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Speaker 4: I like to say. I did come from a really

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Speaker 4: broken home. I had the multiple stepfathers. My mom, at

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Speaker 4: that time, it was diagnosed as manic-depressant. They've since changed

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Speaker 4: it to bipolar 1 and 2. So she had this

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Speaker 4: roller coaster. And so I learned at a young age,

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Speaker 4: one of five boys, My oldest brother got adopted out.

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Speaker 4: That's a whole other story. My mom was too young

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Speaker 4: to keep him. So I, in essence, became the oldest

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Speaker 4: of four boys in the home. Total chaos. Lots of brokenness.

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Speaker 4: And so with that, it was a rough thing. So

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Speaker 4: I was forced to grow up really fast. And with that,

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Speaker 4: trying to manage and keep peace, I was a peacekeeper,

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Speaker 4: not a peacemaker. I was trying to keep everything together.

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Speaker 4: And with that, there was a high cost on that.

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Speaker 4: And so as a young teenager trying to carry the

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Speaker 4: weight of the world of keeping my mom happy, my

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Speaker 4: brothers together, keeping my stepdad at the time from blowing up,

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Speaker 4: the common threat of addictions from my stepfathers, alcohol, drugs, anger, rage, abuse, physical, verbal, emotional,

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Speaker 4: sexual abuse. So all of that is in my home.

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Speaker 4: So imagine a teenager trying to keep all that together

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Speaker 4: and can't do it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So I started reaching for things. Multiple times seeing my

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Speaker 4: mother attempt suicide. And so this little boy who thinks

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Speaker 4: he's a man inside is trying to deal with this,

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Speaker 4: all the while dealing with my own abuse from a

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Speaker 4: couple of my stepfathers toward me. And so what I

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Speaker 4: like to tell people is I was, one of my

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Speaker 4: big pain points was at the kitchen table where I

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Speaker 4: was abused nightly. And that little boy hid underneath that

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Speaker 4: table and I grew into a man, a young man,

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Speaker 4: but I was still a little boy emotionally. And I

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Speaker 4: went to drugs and alcohol. I started using it at 10,

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Speaker 4: 11 years old. I was trying to escape from what

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Speaker 4: was broken inside of me, not knowing that I needed

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Speaker 4: the Lord in my heart. I'm just trying to survive.

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Speaker 4: And we talk about that a lot. A lot of

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Speaker 4: these strategies with addictions are... Just my brain's way of

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Speaker 4: creating ways to stay alive.

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Speaker 3: They're killing me, but it makes sense.

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Speaker 1: But it seems like it's the only thing that brings

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Speaker 1: any calm into your life. And what people don't understand

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Speaker 1: is the power of it, too. If we're made for

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Speaker 1: a relationship and our relationships are broken, this becomes a surrogate,

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Speaker 1: if you will, that we think really matters. And the

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Speaker 1: old country music song, The More I Drink, what?

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Speaker 3: The More I Drink. The More I Drink. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: You know why? Because, again, it seems like the only

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Speaker 1: thing that gives me some sense of relief.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. It numbs me.

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Speaker 1: From this insanity that I'm living in.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. So I pretty much, anything I could put in

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Speaker 4: my body, I was putting in my body to escape.

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Speaker 4: And ended up homeless on the streets of Phoenix, Arizona,

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Speaker 4: hanging out with some bad people.

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Speaker 3: Too much to go into there. Yeah.

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Speaker 4: By the grace of God, I didn't end up in

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Speaker 4: prison or dead. And that feels like kind of hyperbole,

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Speaker 4: but it's really the reality that that's part of when

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Speaker 4: I wake up today. Now it's like, God, thank you

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Speaker 4: for giving me another day. You woke me up today.

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Speaker 4: And so now it's, it's, I tell people all the

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Speaker 4: time with a newcomer that comes in, it is, it

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Speaker 4: is good to be able to help other people, but there.

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Speaker 3: Is an element of selfishness too.

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Speaker 4: If I don't, If I don't reach for that guy

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Speaker 4: behind me at the door, I'm one choice away from

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Speaker 4: being back in that hellacious place that I lived before.

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Speaker 4: So I'm trying to stay and work my own recovery

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Speaker 4: and living out the mission and call that God's given

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Speaker 4: me so that I don't go back and I can

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Speaker 4: help other people. And part of my mission now is

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Speaker 4: just trying to help my brothers get on that same road.

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Speaker 4: They're still kind of in the ditches, seeing some steps

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Speaker 4: toward healing and growth. towards Jesus, but some brokenness there.

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Speaker 4: So that's, I'm the satisfied customer, right? I want, I've

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Speaker 4: experienced it. Now I want to help other people so

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Speaker 4: that they can taste and see, as the scripture says,

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Speaker 4: what is good as I have. I want them to

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Speaker 4: experience that. And that's why I get excited about this

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Speaker 4: because the mental health capacity or situation, the struggles are

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Speaker 4: a big part of why people will go to these

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Speaker 4: numbing agents. And it just It just compounds the problem.

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Speaker 4: As you guys, I'm kind of preaching to the choir here.

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Speaker 1: People don't understand how hard it is to break free.

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Speaker 3: It is.

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Speaker 1: It's because this has become, in essence, the replacement of

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Speaker 1: my desperate longing and need for God and for just

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Speaker 1: loving relationships to love and be loved. And so I reach,

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Speaker 1: as you said earlier, for anything to calm or soothe

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Speaker 1: the chaos that's inside. And if it gives me even

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Speaker 1: the smallest sense of relief, I run to it.

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Speaker 3: I race to it.

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Speaker 1: And that's where people, when they come back and they say,

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Speaker 1: what's the matter with you? Just stop. And it's like,

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Speaker 1: you have no idea the insanity of my life.

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Speaker 3: If we could have stopped, we would have already done it.

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Speaker 2: Hey, my friend, before we jump back into today's conversation,

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Speaker 2: I just want to remind you that Built Different is

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Speaker 2: proudly sponsored by Liberty University. This partnership means a lot

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Speaker 2: to me personally. You know, I was born and raised

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Speaker 2: in Lynchburg, Virginia, and I've watched Liberty grow tremendously over

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Speaker 2: the years, but I've also experienced firsthand the impact this

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Speaker 2: university can have on a life. I graduated from Liberty.

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Speaker 2: I played four years of Division I baseball here. I

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Speaker 2: met some of my closest friends and most influential mentors here.

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Speaker 1: I met my wife, Evelyn, here.

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Speaker 2: And most importantly, I met my wife, Liberty became part

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Speaker 2: of the story God used to deepen my relationship with

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Speaker 2: Jesus Christ. Today, I have the privilege of continuing that

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Speaker 2: story by serving Liberty Athletics and investing in the lives

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Speaker 2: and mental health of our student-athletes. That's why I believe

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Speaker 2: so deeply in Liberty's mission to train champions for Christ.

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Speaker 2: With more than 16,000 residential students and 600 online programs,

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Speaker 2: Liberty gives you the opportunity to pursue your education alongside

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Speaker 2: faculty who want to help equip you for your calling

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Speaker 2: on campus, online, and around the world. To learn more

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Speaker 2: and to take that next step, all you have to

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Speaker 2: do is go to liberty.edu forward slash built different today.

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Speaker 2: I want you to really dive in, Ronnie, to a

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Speaker 2: lot of people don't understand the epidemiology of addiction. Like

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Speaker 2: they just don't get it. They think it's just, you know,

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Speaker 2: the choices that we make, but really as we make

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Speaker 2: those choices, like you said, the more I drink, the

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Speaker 2: more I drink, that's neuroplasticity. Neuroplasticity is both for the

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Speaker 2: good and for the bad. It literally choices begin to

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Speaker 2: rewire brain chemistry to where now it's all of a

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Speaker 2: sudden it's beyond just a, Hey, you're an addict type

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Speaker 2: of thing. It's like, I feel like I cannot stop.

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Speaker 2: I've heard it said this way. motivation is I want

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Speaker 2: to do something. Discipline is I will do something. Obsession

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Speaker 2: is I can't not do something. And a lot of people,

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Speaker 2: when they become obsessed or addicted, it's like they can't

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Speaker 2: not do it because it's what they naturally revert to

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Speaker 2: in times of need.

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Speaker 1: Speak to that if you would.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: And I think the addiction, and it goes back to

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Speaker 4: kind of those things inside of us that we don't

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Speaker 4: know how to organize. And so, Addiction is I'm going

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Speaker 4: back to the same strategies to deal with the things

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Speaker 4: that I'm running from. Yes. So sometimes there is a

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Speaker 4: physiological response too. I mean, sometimes it can be dangerous

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Speaker 4: just to cut cold turkey, right? Because my body's become

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Speaker 4: so accustomed to it.

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Speaker 1: There's a level of toxicity that's in here that we

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Speaker 1: often have not looked at or thought about or maybe

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Speaker 1: gave full understanding to.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 1: And we've been chaotic in then how we treat addicts.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Not trying to give an excuse. Not trying to give,

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Speaker 1: you know, runway for people just to do or continue

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Speaker 1: in patterns. We want to break those patterns, but we're

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Speaker 1: talking about some serious rutting that's taking place.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it takes time, right?

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Speaker 4: I mean, this length of time I'm using, you're not

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Speaker 4: going to be able to flip the switch and just

440
00:21:52,510 --> 00:21:55,390
Speaker 4: stop it. You know, that's why I think that's why

441
00:21:55,430 --> 00:21:59,400
Speaker 4: they educating the church is so important because as you

442
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:01,860
Speaker 4: come in, you think, okay, the old is gone.

443
00:22:01,900 --> 00:22:02,600
Speaker 3: The new has come.

444
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,540
Speaker 4: We know that spiritually that is true, but what did

445
00:22:06,619 --> 00:22:09,639
Speaker 4: I do? What were the habits in the old that

446
00:22:09,660 --> 00:22:12,650
Speaker 4: are still stuck to me that I'm trying to rewire

447
00:22:12,690 --> 00:22:13,550
Speaker 4: the rewire in the.

448
00:22:13,510 --> 00:22:14,310
Speaker 3: Brain that you're talking about?

449
00:22:14,330 --> 00:22:17,150
Speaker 4: That's a beautiful thing is God knows how he knows

450
00:22:17,230 --> 00:22:18,270
Speaker 4: he created this.

451
00:22:18,630 --> 00:22:20,470
Speaker 3: He knows how to rewire it and he has the

452
00:22:20,510 --> 00:22:23,169
Speaker 3: power to do that, but it is a process. So

453
00:22:23,210 --> 00:22:25,790
Speaker 3: it's the decision. I trust you, God.

454
00:22:26,460 --> 00:22:29,260
Speaker 4: And then trust the process, can we as a church

455
00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:30,580
Speaker 4: be patient with that?

456
00:22:30,619 --> 00:22:31,560
Speaker 1: For example, detoxing.

457
00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:33,060
Speaker 3: Yes. Step number one.

458
00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:34,900
Speaker 1: That's a journey.

459
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:36,850
Speaker 3: Yep. It takes time.

460
00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:40,230
Speaker 4: Your body's literally saying, if you don't take this, you're

461
00:22:40,270 --> 00:22:43,590
Speaker 4: going to die. That's what it feels like. That's why

462
00:22:43,750 --> 00:22:47,970
Speaker 4: opioids are such a big thing. It literally feels coming

463
00:22:48,109 --> 00:22:50,450
Speaker 4: off of it. Your body's saying, if you don't keep

464
00:22:50,510 --> 00:22:53,929
Speaker 4: this in your body, you're going to die, Rodney. And

465
00:22:53,950 --> 00:22:55,690
Speaker 4: so why wouldn't you keep putting it in your body?

466
00:22:55,710 --> 00:22:57,250
Speaker 4: And then you have someone, what are you doing that?

467
00:22:57,290 --> 00:22:57,830
Speaker 3: Just stop it.

468
00:22:57,830 --> 00:23:01,190
Speaker 4: And it's like, well, but my body is saying this.

469
00:23:01,470 --> 00:23:03,700
Speaker 4: So how do we bring it all together to say, hey,

470
00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 4: it makes sense. It makes sense why you go to that.

471
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,020
Speaker 4: And it's going to take time to move you in

472
00:23:10,060 --> 00:23:10,899
Speaker 4: this different direction.

473
00:23:10,940 --> 00:23:14,020
Speaker 1: I know for years in AACC, when it comes to

474
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,679
Speaker 1: mental health, we have, boy, we've come a long way, baby.

475
00:23:18,980 --> 00:23:22,170
Speaker 1: In other words, the earlier lectures that we used to do,

476
00:23:23,250 --> 00:23:26,760
Speaker 1: They were great, but we were just scratching the surface

477
00:23:26,820 --> 00:23:31,020
Speaker 1: of something that was monstrous, like this massive iceberg down

478
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,760
Speaker 1: under the water, you know that? And through the years,

479
00:23:33,900 --> 00:23:40,590
Speaker 1: we really have evolved in our awareness, our understanding, our strategies,

480
00:23:40,630 --> 00:23:44,430
Speaker 1: and so much more. We've gotten issue-specific. We've learned that

481
00:23:44,770 --> 00:23:48,229
Speaker 1: there are different ways to treat different disorders, et cetera,

482
00:23:48,250 --> 00:23:51,320
Speaker 1: you know that? And at the same time, we've even

483
00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:56,160
Speaker 1: been pushed— to think even more theologically, critically in this

484
00:23:56,220 --> 00:24:01,540
Speaker 1: whole process. And we never dismiss No, we're pressing more

485
00:24:01,619 --> 00:24:05,220
Speaker 1: now into faith than we ever have. You would think, man,

486
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:08,540
Speaker 1: are you serious? Yes, I'm serious. You know why? Because

487
00:24:08,619 --> 00:24:13,340
Speaker 1: even the research around faith is exploding. CR, you guys

488
00:24:13,619 --> 00:24:16,060
Speaker 1: are— and I'll use the word evolving, too. A lot of

489
00:24:16,100 --> 00:24:19,980
Speaker 1: your understanding, what you were talking about now, is very

490
00:24:20,030 --> 00:24:21,570
Speaker 1: different than we would have talked 20 years ago.

491
00:24:21,590 --> 00:24:22,330
Speaker 3: Oh, for sure.

492
00:24:22,790 --> 00:24:24,850
Speaker 1: Oh, wait a minute, Ron. They had to run us

493
00:24:24,910 --> 00:24:25,630
Speaker 1: out the church.

494
00:24:25,710 --> 00:24:27,270
Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. I'm serious.

495
00:24:27,310 --> 00:24:30,370
Speaker 4: You're not allowed to kind of collide these two worlds.

496
00:24:30,770 --> 00:24:32,570
Speaker 4: This is what we do here, and this is what

497
00:24:32,590 --> 00:24:37,160
Speaker 4: you do out there, which is sad and unfair because

498
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:41,100
Speaker 4: God is the one that created these brains and these hearts,

499
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,850
Speaker 4: and he knows the broken world that so desperately needed

500
00:24:44,930 --> 00:24:47,950
Speaker 4: a Savior in Jesus Christ. So why wouldn't we bring

501
00:24:47,990 --> 00:24:52,250
Speaker 4: these two together and You talk about evolving. There used

502
00:24:52,270 --> 00:24:53,929
Speaker 4: to be something we would say in one of our

503
00:24:53,970 --> 00:24:57,869
Speaker 4: lessons that loneliness is a choice. And with the mental

504
00:24:57,950 --> 00:25:01,850
Speaker 4: health just focus trying to break the stigma, we realize

505
00:25:02,710 --> 00:25:07,730
Speaker 4: loneliness is what I feel. It is an experience maybe

506
00:25:07,790 --> 00:25:13,879
Speaker 4: as a result of choices. But I'm feeling lonely. And

507
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,560
Speaker 4: what is going on around side me or inside of

508
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:18,859
Speaker 4: me that might be contributing to that? How can I

509
00:25:18,900 --> 00:25:21,160
Speaker 4: bring the body of Christ? How can I bring Jesus

510
00:25:21,220 --> 00:25:23,610
Speaker 4: into that? What are the tools that I can use

511
00:25:23,670 --> 00:25:28,050
Speaker 4: to help combat the loneliness inside of me? Because Jesus

512
00:25:28,070 --> 00:25:30,590
Speaker 4: doesn't want us to feel alone. Come to me, all

513
00:25:30,630 --> 00:25:33,149
Speaker 4: of you and your brokenness, your weariness. I will give

514
00:25:33,190 --> 00:25:36,770
Speaker 4: you rest. Whatever's going on, bring it to me. But loneliness,

515
00:25:36,790 --> 00:25:40,420
Speaker 4: so that's one of those examples of Loneliness is a choice, right?

516
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:42,840
Speaker 3: It's like, oh, no, maybe that's not a choice. We

517
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:43,880
Speaker 3: need to reframe that.

518
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:48,180
Speaker 4: So we changed our curriculum from 35 years ago.

519
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:49,510
Speaker 3: That's like, oh, that made sense.

520
00:25:49,590 --> 00:25:52,629
Speaker 4: But as we've evolved, to your point, we've realized, oh,

521
00:25:52,670 --> 00:25:55,410
Speaker 4: we need to speak a little bit differently in how

522
00:25:55,470 --> 00:25:57,390
Speaker 4: we communicate that principle.

523
00:25:57,570 --> 00:25:59,709
Speaker 2: Yes, you know, what I'm hearing you say throughout this

524
00:25:59,750 --> 00:26:02,970
Speaker 2: entire conversation, a lot of addiction are secondary issues. There's

525
00:26:03,010 --> 00:26:06,300
Speaker 2: always an underlying issue. There's always something that really feeds

526
00:26:06,380 --> 00:26:10,389
Speaker 2: that need or that desire to numb, to anesthetize, to

527
00:26:10,430 --> 00:26:12,410
Speaker 2: be able to drown out the pain as we seek

528
00:26:12,450 --> 00:26:13,929
Speaker 2: for relief. But at the same time, what I heard

529
00:26:13,950 --> 00:26:17,030
Speaker 2: you say is that recovery, not just a choice, it's

530
00:26:17,050 --> 00:26:17,550
Speaker 2: a journey.

531
00:26:18,070 --> 00:26:18,930
Speaker 3: It's a process.

532
00:26:18,990 --> 00:26:19,990
Speaker 1: It's a daily decision.

533
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:22,520
Speaker 2: I think of dying to self every single day, sometimes

534
00:26:22,580 --> 00:26:25,479
Speaker 2: multiple times a day, or else we will potentially allow

535
00:26:25,540 --> 00:26:28,420
Speaker 2: those footholds to become strongholds again. So we have to

536
00:26:28,980 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 2: lean into community. We have to ask for help. We

537
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:34,879
Speaker 2: have to seek, we have to knock in order to

538
00:26:34,940 --> 00:26:38,660
Speaker 2: receive the help that we so desire. And honestly, we deserve.

539
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:40,700
Speaker 2: And so I just want to share for a moment

540
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,460
Speaker 2: to the person out there, this journey of recovery. Like,

541
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:47,640
Speaker 2: what are some practical steps that people can begin taking?

542
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,100
Speaker 2: I know when it comes to the steps of CR

543
00:26:50,140 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 2: and all of these things, what are the first places

544
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:55,060
Speaker 2: that they need to turn to be able to receive

545
00:26:55,100 --> 00:26:56,199
Speaker 2: that help that they desire?

546
00:26:56,220 --> 00:26:57,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's so good.

547
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:00,420
Speaker 4: The thing that kind of comes to my mind right

548
00:27:00,460 --> 00:27:05,800
Speaker 4: off the bat is just honesty. When we can acknowledge

549
00:27:05,900 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 4: what is, that's a game changer, right? We say this

550
00:27:10,060 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 4: when we're talking about the amends and forgiveness process, which

551
00:27:13,300 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 4: is deep into the process, but it is a part

552
00:27:15,780 --> 00:27:23,190
Speaker 4: of it. Excuses protect my image. Honesty and responsibility protects

553
00:27:23,250 --> 00:27:27,670
Speaker 4: my recovery. So to be honest and take responsibility, like

554
00:27:27,750 --> 00:27:29,850
Speaker 4: even in my case, and my brothers kind of get

555
00:27:29,890 --> 00:27:33,110
Speaker 4: stuck in this still. Yeah, but we had a hard childhood.

556
00:27:33,980 --> 00:27:37,090
Speaker 4: So we excuse a way where we are because of

557
00:27:37,190 --> 00:27:40,690
Speaker 4: our circumstances. It's not my fault or my brother's fault

558
00:27:40,730 --> 00:27:43,010
Speaker 4: for the abuse that happened in our life. It's not

559
00:27:43,070 --> 00:27:46,270
Speaker 4: my fault that my mother was a manic depressant. But

560
00:27:46,310 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 4: I do have to take responsibility for what I do

561
00:27:48,910 --> 00:27:52,220
Speaker 4: with that. And so for me, that would be the

562
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,760
Speaker 4: first thing is just acknowledge what is.

563
00:27:56,859 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 3: That I have an empty cup. Maybe I have a

564
00:27:59,820 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 3: polluted cup, right? And God.

565
00:28:03,050 --> 00:28:05,690
Speaker 4: I don't have to clean this up before I bring

566
00:28:05,730 --> 00:28:08,470
Speaker 4: it to you. I just want to acknowledge where I am.

567
00:28:08,490 --> 00:28:12,720
Speaker 4: This is the state of the condition of my heart,

568
00:28:12,859 --> 00:28:15,580
Speaker 4: my life, and I just need to be honest with that.

569
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:20,580
Speaker 4: That's the beauty of surrender is, Lord, my way, that

570
00:28:20,660 --> 00:28:25,100
Speaker 4: repentance is my way of mending the situation.

571
00:28:24,460 --> 00:28:27,100
Speaker 3: Is not working, and I give it to you, Lord.

572
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 3: That's the spiritual support.

573
00:28:29,020 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 1: Why is my soul cast down?

574
00:28:30,619 --> 00:28:30,879
Speaker 3: Yeah.

575
00:28:31,710 --> 00:28:34,619
Speaker 1: Why am I depressed, distressed? Hope thou in God.

576
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,660
Speaker 3: That's what the psalmist said. Go there. Yep.

577
00:28:37,820 --> 00:28:39,900
Speaker 1: Ronnie, I want to stay right there just for one second.

578
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:40,240
Speaker 3: You bet.

579
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,620
Speaker 1: Because as I began to understand addiction, I think I

580
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 1: struggled early on. I was more hardcore about just change.

581
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:48,060
Speaker 1: Just change.

582
00:28:48,100 --> 00:28:48,660
Speaker 3: Just change.

583
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:53,530
Speaker 1: And it was the predetermined pattern, like you're going to

584
00:28:53,550 --> 00:28:57,930
Speaker 1: be forever like this, versus predisposed to something where, okay,

585
00:28:57,950 --> 00:29:01,310
Speaker 1: there's patterns. and issues that really do make this journey

586
00:29:01,450 --> 00:29:04,750
Speaker 1: difficult to get out. But there's always hope. You know

587
00:29:04,770 --> 00:29:08,230
Speaker 1: what I'm saying? And so just understanding that, hey, you're right.

588
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:13,140
Speaker 1: I'm not to blame, but responsibility for the road forward

589
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:15,820
Speaker 1: is still right here. If hope isn't looking you in

590
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:17,800
Speaker 1: the mirror, you're in trouble.

591
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:18,860
Speaker 2: Right?

592
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 3: Exactly.

593
00:29:19,780 --> 00:29:23,020
Speaker 4: And this is kind of a vivid picture, but in

594
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:27,070
Speaker 4: my brain, my mind goes to this. If a sniper

595
00:29:27,190 --> 00:29:31,650
Speaker 4: were to shoot me, from the rooftop and my leg

596
00:29:31,710 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 4: is literally bleeding out and rotting, from infection. If I

597
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:42,690
Speaker 4: focus on the shooter, I'm missing. You're going to die.

598
00:29:42,810 --> 00:29:45,390
Speaker 4: I'm going to die. My leg is going to literally kill.

599
00:29:45,490 --> 00:29:47,530
Speaker 4: It's going to infect the rest of my body. So

600
00:29:47,650 --> 00:29:51,150
Speaker 4: I can't deal with the broken world around me. I

601
00:29:51,190 --> 00:29:54,210
Speaker 4: can't control that. That was, for me, my stepdad. Well,

602
00:29:54,230 --> 00:29:56,250
Speaker 4: if you could just get them to change, maybe I

603
00:29:56,490 --> 00:30:00,190
Speaker 4: will do something. All my attention was on the snipers

604
00:30:00,250 --> 00:30:03,390
Speaker 4: in my life. I had to focus on the wound

605
00:30:03,470 --> 00:30:06,990
Speaker 4: going on inside of me. And trauma, wounds, from a

606
00:30:07,030 --> 00:30:12,020
Speaker 4: biblical sense, that has an effect on how we view today.

607
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 4: If I look through the lens of yesterday and unaddressed wounds,

608
00:30:17,420 --> 00:30:21,010
Speaker 4: which is feeding my addiction, usually there's a wound there

609
00:30:21,070 --> 00:30:27,150
Speaker 4: that's feeding into that, then it will distort my presence.

610
00:30:27,990 --> 00:30:31,670
Speaker 4: And it will completely shape my future. So what we're

611
00:30:31,730 --> 00:30:35,590
Speaker 4: trying to do in Celebrate Recovery is address the brokenness,

612
00:30:35,630 --> 00:30:38,390
Speaker 4: the wounds of the past. How did I learn to

613
00:30:38,450 --> 00:30:40,450
Speaker 4: relate to people? It took me a long time to

614
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:45,340
Speaker 4: trust men because men were my abusers. And to say, oh,

615
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 4: just go into this group and talk about your trauma

616
00:30:48,420 --> 00:30:51,420
Speaker 4: and your wounds and your addiction. It's like, that's the

617
00:30:51,460 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 4: last thing I want to do. But I had to

618
00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:57,650
Speaker 4: take a risk. And so to your point, what do

619
00:30:57,710 --> 00:31:02,090
Speaker 4: I do? Would you even consider the possibility that it's

620
00:31:02,170 --> 00:31:05,190
Speaker 4: worth taking this risk? What do you have to lose, Rodney,

621
00:31:05,450 --> 00:31:08,510
Speaker 4: as I'm talking to my younger self? What do you

622
00:31:08,550 --> 00:31:11,540
Speaker 4: have to lose? Acknowledge what it is and then take

623
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:15,700
Speaker 4: the risk to take a step forward. Because if we don't,

624
00:31:15,740 --> 00:31:19,240
Speaker 4: we're always going to look today through the lens of yesterday.

625
00:31:20,110 --> 00:31:22,350
Speaker 4: And it's going to distort what God has in store

626
00:31:22,370 --> 00:31:24,390
Speaker 4: for me today and what he has in store for

627
00:31:24,430 --> 00:31:29,300
Speaker 4: me moving forward. And so I'm trying to address the

628
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:33,980
Speaker 4: brokenness from the past that is feeding into my coping

629
00:31:34,060 --> 00:31:38,540
Speaker 4: mechanisms to help me escape pain that I don't know

630
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:41,330
Speaker 4: how to put in words. So the emotional maturity that

631
00:31:41,410 --> 00:31:44,910
Speaker 4: comes through this process, even from the little kids, it's

632
00:31:44,950 --> 00:31:48,430
Speaker 4: a family ministry. Hearing kids talk about their emotions.

633
00:31:48,450 --> 00:31:48,810
Speaker 2: Yes.

634
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 4: We're trying to get ahead of the game so that

635
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,430
Speaker 4: they don't become addicts, that they learn how to talk

636
00:31:54,490 --> 00:31:57,170
Speaker 4: about their feelings and their pain. So I don't know

637
00:31:57,190 --> 00:31:59,670
Speaker 4: if that answers your question directly, but yeah.

638
00:32:00,110 --> 00:32:03,370
Speaker 2: I love the idea of taking responsibility because there's no

639
00:32:03,430 --> 00:32:05,470
Speaker 2: accountability without responsibility.

640
00:32:05,990 --> 00:32:06,370
Speaker 3: There's not.

641
00:32:06,690 --> 00:32:09,100
Speaker 2: Because we could go and make all of these decisions

642
00:32:09,150 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 2: and we could tell everybody that we're doing these things,

643
00:32:11,300 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 2: but if we're really not behind closed doors, then it

644
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:15,400
Speaker 2: doesn't mean a hill of beans. If somebody's coming into

645
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 2: my life trying to hold me accountable if I'm not

646
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,390
Speaker 2: being responsible. While at the same time, we hear in culture,

647
00:32:21,770 --> 00:32:24,890
Speaker 2: nobody's coming to save you, but you need some people

648
00:32:24,930 --> 00:32:25,890
Speaker 2: to help sustain you.

649
00:32:26,130 --> 00:32:26,930
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?

650
00:32:26,970 --> 00:32:28,750
Speaker 1: You need that. You have to, yes.

651
00:32:29,290 --> 00:32:31,390
Speaker 2: Let's get up. Let's make that step. I'm thinking of

652
00:32:31,430 --> 00:32:34,530
Speaker 2: the guy yesterday that we were interviewing, Albany Eugene Jr.

653
00:32:34,570 --> 00:32:38,130
Speaker 2: He wrote a book, 100 Devotions on Momentum. And he

654
00:32:38,170 --> 00:32:41,900
Speaker 2: mentioned that maybe it's not an effort problem. Maybe it's

655
00:32:41,940 --> 00:32:45,600
Speaker 2: a focus problem. Maybe your focus is just in the

656
00:32:45,660 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 2: wrong place, like what you mentioned, looking at the sniper

657
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,380
Speaker 2: rather than the wound. I want to share this story

658
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:53,750
Speaker 2: with you because this thought came into my mind last night.

659
00:32:54,830 --> 00:32:58,190
Speaker 2: One of my favorite pastors, Preston Morrison, he's out of Glendale, Arizona,

660
00:32:58,650 --> 00:33:01,730
Speaker 2: and he was sharing a message a couple years back

661
00:33:02,170 --> 00:33:06,710
Speaker 2: about why does a fisherman bait a hook? And everybody

662
00:33:06,990 --> 00:33:10,730
Speaker 2: would probably respond to catch a fish. And he said, wrong.

663
00:33:11,570 --> 00:33:15,780
Speaker 2: It's to hide the hook. that's exactly what the enemy

664
00:33:15,820 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 2: does in our lives. What he does is he will

665
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 2: take something. He was really referencing the story of David

666
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:24,160
Speaker 2: and that David, he didn't reveal to David in a

667
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:28,220
Speaker 2: strange dead sun on a battlefield. He doesn't reveal the

668
00:33:28,260 --> 00:33:31,490
Speaker 2: whole chain, but what he does always offer is he

669
00:33:31,550 --> 00:33:34,550
Speaker 2: offers just simply a choice. He hid the hook through

670
00:33:34,570 --> 00:33:36,190
Speaker 2: the beauty of Bathsheba.

671
00:33:36,530 --> 00:33:36,750
Speaker 4: Wow.

672
00:33:36,970 --> 00:33:39,709
Speaker 2: And so that's what he does in our lives is

673
00:33:39,750 --> 00:33:40,630
Speaker 2: that he hides everything.

674
00:33:41,100 --> 00:33:41,460
Speaker 3: The hooks.

675
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,700
Speaker 2: And so what he was getting at is don't take

676
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:45,940
Speaker 2: the bait. Satan is not a creator.

677
00:33:45,980 --> 00:33:46,900
Speaker 3: He is a counterfeiter.

678
00:33:46,940 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 2: He takes good God-given desires. A lot of addictions are

679
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,940
Speaker 2: God-given desires, wrongly aligned. And so when we realize how

680
00:33:53,980 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 2: we get them back, hijacked, that's the biggest step. Awareness.

681
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:00,870
Speaker 1: It's asking for help. Being honest.

682
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:02,680
Speaker 2: You're only as free as you're willing to be honest,

683
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,450
Speaker 2: as my friend Joshua Broom always says. But then at

684
00:34:05,490 --> 00:34:07,570
Speaker 2: the same time, Rodney, you're not defined by the worst

685
00:34:07,610 --> 00:34:09,930
Speaker 2: thing you've ever done. You're not defined by the best

686
00:34:09,950 --> 00:34:13,060
Speaker 2: thing you'll ever do. Because as Josh mentioned, you don't

687
00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:17,799
Speaker 2: get to define you. Talk about just to somebody out

688
00:34:17,820 --> 00:34:22,350
Speaker 2: there who's been taking the bait, who has bitten a

689
00:34:22,410 --> 00:34:25,750
Speaker 2: hidden hook in their life. They've been believing the lies,

690
00:34:26,030 --> 00:34:28,410
Speaker 2: and that's all the enemy is, the father of lies.

691
00:34:28,890 --> 00:34:31,330
Speaker 2: Help us get back to the truth of our identity

692
00:34:31,410 --> 00:34:32,410
Speaker 2: anchored and rooted in Christ.

693
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,140
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I love that. I love that story, by

694
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:35,360
Speaker 3: the way.

695
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:38,520
Speaker 4: I may steal that one later in other circles, but

696
00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:43,660
Speaker 4: I love that because that's the enemy strategy, that hijacking, right?

697
00:34:43,700 --> 00:34:46,180
Speaker 3: God created us for connection. Yeah.

698
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,509
Speaker 4: And the enemy comes along and says, let me give

699
00:34:49,570 --> 00:34:52,890
Speaker 4: you a different way to connect that will be better, right?

700
00:34:53,310 --> 00:34:56,770
Speaker 4: So are you feeling weak today, Rodney? Here, this will

701
00:34:56,810 --> 00:35:00,140
Speaker 4: make you feel strong. Are you feeling lonely today? Let

702
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:02,980
Speaker 4: me give you a sense of identity, right? So he's

703
00:35:03,020 --> 00:35:07,259
Speaker 4: trying to fill these out of need. The enemy has

704
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:11,800
Speaker 4: hijacked you. He's hijacked the strategies that don't even come

705
00:35:11,890 --> 00:35:16,690
Speaker 4: close to God's strategy. But in your dysfunction, in your

706
00:35:17,330 --> 00:35:21,630
Speaker 4: distorted thinking in the path that you're on, your body,

707
00:35:21,710 --> 00:35:26,620
Speaker 4: your brain has learned some unhealthy ways of living that

708
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:30,299
Speaker 4: aren't even close to what God has for you. So

709
00:35:30,460 --> 00:35:33,440
Speaker 4: I would say this, that if you're there, and it

710
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,210
Speaker 4: can jolt people sometimes when I say this, that It

711
00:35:36,310 --> 00:35:39,390
Speaker 4: makes sense why you're there. There's good reasons. It doesn't

712
00:35:39,410 --> 00:35:43,140
Speaker 4: mean they're right, but there's good reasons based on your story,

713
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 4: these markers in your life that you learn this is

714
00:35:46,660 --> 00:35:49,879
Speaker 4: the way I face the pain in my life. This

715
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 4: is the way I deal with my sense of feeling

716
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:58,270
Speaker 4: like I'm worthless or whatever the enemy's lies. It reminds

717
00:35:58,310 --> 00:36:02,170
Speaker 4: me when God is having this conversation with Adam and

718
00:36:02,390 --> 00:36:05,500
Speaker 4: Eve in the garden, right? And he asks those questions

719
00:36:05,540 --> 00:36:08,299
Speaker 4: he already knows the answers to, right? But I love

720
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:12,259
Speaker 4: that because it speaks to this. He says, after they've

721
00:36:12,300 --> 00:36:14,060
Speaker 4: eaten of the apple and they're hiding in the bushes,

722
00:36:14,100 --> 00:36:18,089
Speaker 4: he says, where are you? He knows exactly where they are.

723
00:36:18,110 --> 00:36:21,730
Speaker 4: I think he's talking about their heart. Where's your heart, Rodney?

724
00:36:22,969 --> 00:36:26,230
Speaker 4: I know it's been shattered. I know it's been broken.

725
00:36:26,290 --> 00:36:30,370
Speaker 4: And people have taught you that no one is safe

726
00:36:30,430 --> 00:36:31,260
Speaker 4: on this planet anymore.

727
00:36:32,510 --> 00:36:34,549
Speaker 3: But there is a new way. There is a new way.

728
00:36:34,570 --> 00:36:37,410
Speaker 3: Where is your heart? And then, well, we're in the

729
00:36:37,450 --> 00:36:41,090
Speaker 3: bushes because we ate the apple. We're naked. Second question,

730
00:36:41,140 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 3: who told you that? Which I think speaks to the lies, right?

731
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:44,799
Speaker 3: Nailed it.

732
00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:48,420
Speaker 4: What lies are you believing about yourself, Rodney? What do

733
00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:51,239
Speaker 4: you believe in about me, which is kind of the

734
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 4: heart of the first part of this journey in Celebrate Recovery?

735
00:36:55,300 --> 00:36:58,910
Speaker 4: Do you believe I have the power, Rodney? Do you

736
00:36:58,950 --> 00:37:01,230
Speaker 4: believe that you matter to me even in spite of

737
00:37:01,430 --> 00:37:04,330
Speaker 4: everything that you've done? And I've made some horrific choices

738
00:37:04,370 --> 00:37:09,230
Speaker 4: in my life. You still love me, Lord. I'm a failure.

739
00:37:09,250 --> 00:37:12,310
Speaker 4: I used to think I was going to die at

740
00:37:12,330 --> 00:37:15,110
Speaker 4: a very, very young age. I was convinced. I was

741
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:16,960
Speaker 4: just going to live my life and just be reckless,

742
00:37:17,020 --> 00:37:21,100
Speaker 4: and then I would die. Who told you that? Who

743
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:23,719
Speaker 4: told you that I was not going to use you

744
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:28,330
Speaker 4: in spite of the brokenness and all the all the

745
00:37:28,370 --> 00:37:31,130
Speaker 4: stuff that you went through. And then the third question

746
00:37:31,150 --> 00:37:31,870
Speaker 4: is important.

747
00:37:32,969 --> 00:37:33,629
Speaker 3: What did you do?

748
00:37:34,570 --> 00:37:37,470
Speaker 4: And it's not to shame. It's almost like this loving father.

749
00:37:37,489 --> 00:37:38,690
Speaker 4: I think we can get in our head and go,

750
00:37:38,730 --> 00:37:41,810
Speaker 4: what did you do? I think his heart posture is,

751
00:37:41,830 --> 00:37:44,290
Speaker 4: Hey son, Hey daughter.

752
00:37:44,350 --> 00:37:46,630
Speaker 3: What'd you do? It makes sense.

753
00:37:47,010 --> 00:37:50,340
Speaker 4: But if you stay on that path, it's literally going to,

754
00:37:50,430 --> 00:37:53,919
Speaker 4: it makes sense, but it's going to kill you. So

755
00:37:54,540 --> 00:37:57,710
Speaker 4: if I'm talking to someone, it's, Come to this posture

756
00:37:57,989 --> 00:38:01,330
Speaker 4: of maybe just being open-handed to say, hey, the enemy's

757
00:38:01,410 --> 00:38:06,129
Speaker 4: hijacked you. But here's the good thing. But God, there

758
00:38:06,430 --> 00:38:10,390
Speaker 4: is a higher power in Jesus Christ. And there are tools.

759
00:38:10,489 --> 00:38:12,860
Speaker 4: And that's why we need these kind of partnerships. To

760
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:17,299
Speaker 4: come together to help people find their purpose again. To

761
00:38:17,340 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 4: bring glory to God through the brokenness. Through the brokenness.

762
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 4: Because we're all broken.

763
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 3: And we need it.

764
00:38:23,540 --> 00:38:25,859
Speaker 4: We need a higher power in Jesus Christ. And he's

765
00:38:25,900 --> 00:38:27,719
Speaker 4: not done with you. He's going to actually use what

766
00:38:27,739 --> 00:38:30,700
Speaker 4: you're going through right now to use.

767
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:33,070
Speaker 3: It for his glory. How cool is that? A messed

768
00:38:33,130 --> 00:38:34,989
Speaker 3: up guy like me. Yeah, like us.

769
00:38:35,030 --> 00:38:38,810
Speaker 4: Yeah, that he could use us to help other people.

770
00:38:39,150 --> 00:38:40,149
Speaker 4: Only God could do that.

771
00:38:40,489 --> 00:38:43,390
Speaker 3: How cool is that? Honesty.

772
00:38:44,330 --> 00:38:45,550
Speaker 1: Hard getting honest.

773
00:38:45,989 --> 00:38:46,270
Speaker 4: It is.

774
00:38:46,290 --> 00:38:49,089
Speaker 1: About where I'm at. Because we've been taught to white

775
00:38:49,150 --> 00:38:51,730
Speaker 1: knuckle it our whole life. You just suck it up, buttercup,

776
00:38:52,140 --> 00:38:55,810
Speaker 1: and keep grinding. But the truth is, I don't have

777
00:38:55,850 --> 00:39:01,410
Speaker 1: the power. I'm powerless. I can't make it. I'm going

778
00:39:01,450 --> 00:39:06,940
Speaker 1: to die in this insanity. And I'm dependent, God. I

779
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:10,399
Speaker 1: desperately need. And this is where faith has become so

780
00:39:10,460 --> 00:39:17,220
Speaker 1: powerful in the recovery movement. When I acknowledge my utter,

781
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 1: complete need for God, to do something, the game can

782
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:29,670
Speaker 1: begin to change. Hell, it makes sense then with love.

783
00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 1: to keep you from believing that God actually loves you

784
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,339
Speaker 1: and cares about you. Virtually every man I've ever met

785
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:40,609
Speaker 1: doesn't really believe God loves him. Boy, if he can

786
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,430
Speaker 1: go there, he's an explosion of power. If he can

787
00:39:43,450 --> 00:39:46,270
Speaker 1: believe that God loves him, it's a game changer. So

788
00:39:46,350 --> 00:39:49,440
Speaker 1: it makes sense that isolation or loneliness is going to

789
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,220
Speaker 1: be a tool of hell. I want to keep you alone.

790
00:39:52,580 --> 00:39:54,160
Speaker 1: And by the way, I want you to wallow in

791
00:39:54,180 --> 00:39:58,490
Speaker 1: your shame that God doesn't love you, doesn't care about you,

792
00:39:58,530 --> 00:40:02,669
Speaker 1: that you're one nasty stick person. You should never show

793
00:40:02,730 --> 00:40:06,310
Speaker 1: up at church. People don't want you at church. God

794
00:40:06,330 --> 00:40:07,290
Speaker 1: doesn't want you at church.

795
00:40:07,310 --> 00:40:08,430
Speaker 3: God hates you.

796
00:40:08,989 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 1: That's the stuff that keeps us locked up in hell.

797
00:40:13,420 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 3: Seriously. Seriously.

798
00:40:14,870 --> 00:40:19,550
Speaker 4: And can we embrace the gospel message, Zephaniah 317, that

799
00:40:19,590 --> 00:40:23,069
Speaker 4: he is singing a new story over you? This is

800
00:40:23,110 --> 00:40:25,790
Speaker 4: your story, but it's not the end of the story.

801
00:40:27,290 --> 00:40:31,830
Speaker 4: It's just information. It's not the prosecution. It's not the

802
00:40:31,950 --> 00:40:34,950
Speaker 4: end of the story. It's just information. Could I look

803
00:40:35,030 --> 00:40:37,970
Speaker 4: at it less as a prosecution and more as a teacher?

804
00:40:37,989 --> 00:40:40,839
Speaker 3: I want to learn from you. so that he can

805
00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:41,700
Speaker 3: sing a new story.

806
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,060
Speaker 1: I've had a lot of conversations about how these worlds

807
00:40:45,100 --> 00:40:50,770
Speaker 1: then come together. What ultimately our fields are about are

808
00:40:50,910 --> 00:40:56,330
Speaker 1: uncovering all this chaos and these patterns that have, quote,

809
00:40:56,790 --> 00:41:00,150
Speaker 1: taken root and gone deep into our lives. And how

810
00:41:00,170 --> 00:41:02,969
Speaker 1: do we interrupt them? How do we rip them out

811
00:41:03,010 --> 00:41:06,070
Speaker 1: from the core and get us back to good soil

812
00:41:06,610 --> 00:41:09,660
Speaker 1: where we can begin to flourish? And the beauty is, Hey,

813
00:41:09,950 --> 00:41:12,110
Speaker 1: I am come, Jesus said, that you might have life

814
00:41:12,570 --> 00:41:15,630
Speaker 1: and have life to its fullest. Oh, God, that we

815
00:41:15,670 --> 00:41:18,430
Speaker 1: could go there. You know that? That's what I think

816
00:41:18,590 --> 00:41:22,450
Speaker 1: I saw and experienced in that event the other day.

817
00:41:22,830 --> 00:41:24,930
Speaker 1: I'm looking around and there was a bond in the

818
00:41:24,969 --> 00:41:28,149
Speaker 1: room that was different. It was like they were all

819
00:41:28,750 --> 00:41:31,690
Speaker 1: one in the sense that God had done something and

820
00:41:31,770 --> 00:41:36,469
Speaker 1: they knew it. And they were celebrating his presence and

821
00:41:36,530 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 1: his power in their life. And as we come together,

822
00:41:40,180 --> 00:41:44,800
Speaker 1: wouldn't it be amazing if we could raise up a generation?

823
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:45,439
Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh.

824
00:41:45,940 --> 00:41:50,140
Speaker 1: A generation who want to radically alter the outcome of

825
00:41:50,180 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 1: the game.

826
00:41:50,780 --> 00:41:51,339
Speaker 3: You know that?

827
00:41:51,660 --> 00:41:54,660
Speaker 1: Who want to, quote, blow up all this stuff that's

828
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:57,900
Speaker 1: around us that keeps pulling us and sucking life from us.

829
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:01,239
Speaker 1: We think it's giving life to us. It's just destroying us.

830
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 1: We're rotting from the inside out. And take us to

831
00:42:04,180 --> 00:42:06,970
Speaker 1: a freedom that's never been experienced.

832
00:42:07,219 --> 00:42:07,930
Speaker 3: Really. Really.

833
00:42:08,770 --> 00:42:11,830
Speaker 1: By the people who are frantic to know him.

834
00:42:11,910 --> 00:42:13,050
Speaker 3: Oh, man.

835
00:42:13,790 --> 00:42:16,130
Speaker 2: I can't wait to see what God has in store

836
00:42:16,510 --> 00:42:19,410
Speaker 2: just for the journey ahead, for the partnership that we've

837
00:42:19,430 --> 00:42:22,009
Speaker 2: been able to create, for what's going to come of this.

838
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:27,680
Speaker 2: And I'm just thinking as we wrap up about that

839
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,180
Speaker 2: light is not reserved at the end of the tunnel.

840
00:42:30,420 --> 00:42:31,980
Speaker 2: That's a word that I feel like God placed on

841
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:33,840
Speaker 2: my heart a while ago in a dark season in

842
00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:35,870
Speaker 2: my life. Because we hear it all the time, like,

843
00:42:36,010 --> 00:42:38,860
Speaker 2: light's at the end of the tunnel. You'll get through this.

844
00:42:39,590 --> 00:42:41,900
Speaker 2: And I'm like, but I need to experience God in

845
00:42:41,940 --> 00:42:45,520
Speaker 2: the midst of it. That light and hope and help

846
00:42:45,700 --> 00:42:48,759
Speaker 2: and healing are available wherever people are at in the

847
00:42:48,820 --> 00:42:51,130
Speaker 2: middle of their story today. The story doesn't have to end.

848
00:42:51,140 --> 00:42:54,280
Speaker 2: You're not at the end of your story. And oftentimes

849
00:42:54,300 --> 00:42:56,500
Speaker 2: when we get to the end of our rope, we

850
00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:59,460
Speaker 2: experience the very beginning of God's. And so I'm just

851
00:42:59,500 --> 00:43:03,980
Speaker 2: thinking if somebody out there today, Rodney, who's struggling, who

852
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 2: needs a fresh word, who needs to know that, man,

853
00:43:08,500 --> 00:43:15,359
Speaker 2: God is alive, that hope is accessible, that help is

854
00:43:16,010 --> 00:43:19,150
Speaker 2: available in a moment such as this. What's just the

855
00:43:19,370 --> 00:43:21,930
Speaker 2: final word that you want to leave with that person today?

856
00:43:22,489 --> 00:43:23,069
Speaker 3: I love that.

857
00:43:23,090 --> 00:43:26,069
Speaker 4: And then, yeah, I always go back to my mind

858
00:43:26,110 --> 00:43:28,690
Speaker 4: goes to my brothers because it's the most real thing

859
00:43:28,730 --> 00:43:32,770
Speaker 4: because someone listening might be there. Is there just thinking

860
00:43:32,830 --> 00:43:36,029
Speaker 4: about this pile of garbage that's in front of us?

861
00:43:37,090 --> 00:43:40,790
Speaker 4: My mindset back to the church is I've got to

862
00:43:40,989 --> 00:43:43,820
Speaker 4: clean up this garbage so that I can get to Jesus.

863
00:43:45,100 --> 00:43:46,859
Speaker 4: And here's the thing that I learned and I would

864
00:43:46,900 --> 00:43:51,620
Speaker 4: say to you is Jesus wants to be invited into

865
00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:57,149
Speaker 4: the process. Invite him around the pile. Come, let's look

866
00:43:57,190 --> 00:43:59,509
Speaker 4: this over. No matter how deep the stain of your

867
00:43:59,550 --> 00:44:03,760
Speaker 4: sin is, There's a lot of trash here. But because

868
00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:05,940
Speaker 4: I died on the cross, we're going to face whatever

869
00:44:05,980 --> 00:44:09,379
Speaker 4: this trash is, whatever has happened to you, whatever you've done,

870
00:44:09,420 --> 00:44:12,240
Speaker 4: whatever you're struggling with, whatever inside of you you don't like,

871
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:16,430
Speaker 4: Jesus loves, and he's going to use it. So let's

872
00:44:17,010 --> 00:44:20,780
Speaker 4: address the trash together. You don't have to do this alone.

873
00:44:21,140 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 4: You weren't designed to do it alone, nor should you

874
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:26,060
Speaker 4: even attempt to do it alone. I did that too

875
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:29,660
Speaker 4: often in my life. It's much better inviting him around

876
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:31,770
Speaker 4: the pile and let him put his arm around you.

877
00:44:32,150 --> 00:44:35,230
Speaker 4: And through his power, we'll see lots of fruit come

878
00:44:35,390 --> 00:44:36,529
Speaker 4: and healing come through that.

879
00:44:36,750 --> 00:44:36,989
Speaker 2: Amen.

880
00:44:37,170 --> 00:44:41,510
Speaker 1: It's for freedom that Christ has come to set us free.

881
00:44:41,590 --> 00:44:41,890
Speaker 3: Amen.

882
00:44:41,969 --> 00:44:43,590
Speaker 1: Think of Jesus, my peace.

883
00:44:44,510 --> 00:44:45,940
Speaker 3: I want to give to you. Amen.

884
00:44:47,140 --> 00:44:48,060
Speaker 1: There's beauty in that.

885
00:44:48,380 --> 00:44:51,000
Speaker 2: My favorite story in scripture, Daniel chapter 3, what I've

886
00:44:51,060 --> 00:44:53,899
Speaker 2: learned as I've read that over and over and over

887
00:44:53,980 --> 00:44:56,900
Speaker 2: again with that even if mindset is that Shadrach, Meshach,

888
00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:58,980
Speaker 2: and Abednego when they were thrown into the fiery furnace,

889
00:44:59,540 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 2: they didn't even have to invite Jesus in because he

890
00:45:02,660 --> 00:45:04,960
Speaker 2: already lived there. And I think that's what I would

891
00:45:05,100 --> 00:45:07,239
Speaker 2: want somebody to hear is that you don't even have

892
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:10,219
Speaker 2: to invite God into your mess. He's already living in

893
00:45:10,260 --> 00:45:13,190
Speaker 2: your mess. Would you just pray for a fresh revelation

894
00:45:13,230 --> 00:45:16,169
Speaker 2: for him to open your eyes to his presence right

895
00:45:16,290 --> 00:45:19,870
Speaker 2: where you're Pat, Rodney, our friend, we're grateful again for

896
00:45:19,890 --> 00:45:22,070
Speaker 2: this partnership. We cannot wait to see what God is

897
00:45:22,110 --> 00:45:25,350
Speaker 2: going to continue to do through Light University 42-hour coaching

898
00:45:25,390 --> 00:45:28,450
Speaker 2: course curriculum on addiction and mental health recovery. God has

899
00:45:28,510 --> 00:45:31,450
Speaker 2: special plans in store. But my friend, where can our

900
00:45:31,510 --> 00:45:33,890
Speaker 2: audience go just to find out more about you and

901
00:45:33,930 --> 00:45:36,140
Speaker 2: what God is continuing to do through Celebrate Recovery?

902
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, celebraterecovery.com is your best starting point.

903
00:45:40,380 --> 00:45:41,219
Speaker 3: Go check that out.

904
00:45:41,260 --> 00:45:42,799
Speaker 4: If you want to find a group near you, go

905
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:48,779
Speaker 4: to crlocator.com. We have thousands of groups out there. And

906
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:51,460
Speaker 4: my email is on the website. You can email me directly.

907
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:53,300
Speaker 4: I'd love to hear from you, tell you more of

908
00:45:53,340 --> 00:45:57,200
Speaker 4: my story, connect you with this army of warriors that

909
00:45:57,640 --> 00:46:00,469
Speaker 4: want to point you to Jesus through healing from our hurts, hang-ups,

910
00:46:00,510 --> 00:46:03,149
Speaker 4: and habits. CelebrateRecovery.com is a great starting point.

911
00:46:03,390 --> 00:46:05,489
Speaker 2: We're grateful for you, Ronnie. Thank you for your time today.

912
00:46:05,530 --> 00:46:06,549
Speaker 2: Thank you for joining us here.

913
00:46:06,710 --> 00:46:07,569
Speaker 3: Thank you so much.

914
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:12,860
Speaker 2: To our Built Different audience, as Ronnie mentioned, please visit CelebrateRecovery.com. Also,

915
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:16,739
Speaker 2: if you're in need of clinically excellent, distinctively Christian care

916
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:19,100
Speaker 2: and counsel today, Christian Care Connect. Just type in your

917
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 2: zip code, type in your city of origin, wherever you're at,

918
00:46:21,989 --> 00:46:25,090
Speaker 2: and you can find a clinician, a coach, a church

919
00:46:25,130 --> 00:46:29,130
Speaker 2: that's offering Celebrate Recovery opportunities in that local area.

920
00:46:28,890 --> 00:46:31,049
Speaker 1: To give you the help, to give you the.

921
00:46:31,010 --> 00:46:34,810
Speaker 2: Hope to start that healing and that recovery journey that

922
00:46:34,850 --> 00:46:38,670
Speaker 2: you so desire today. My friend, you are not alone. Again,

923
00:46:38,790 --> 00:46:44,120
Speaker 2: help is available, healing is accessible, and hope is alive.

924
00:46:44,300 --> 00:46:45,140
Speaker 2: Thank you for joining us.

925
00:46:45,340 --> 00:46:46,319
Speaker 3: We love being a part of your life.