1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: Hi everyone. I'm Danielle Gill and I am so delighted 2 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:04,640 Speaker 1: to be back on the show today for the Danielle 3 00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: Gill Show. Today, we have a lot of topics to 4 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:09,639 Speaker 1: get to. We are actually going to be talking about abortion, 5 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,639 Speaker 1: the state of the pro life movement and where we 6 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:15,600 Speaker 1: are with that. We're also going to talk about medically 7 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: assisted dying, which has become the fifth most common cause 8 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:23,560 Speaker 1: of death in Canada, which is frightening. And we have 9 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: a lot to talk about today. We're going to talk 10 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:30,000 Speaker 1: to Frank Pavone from Priest for Life all about these topics. 11 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:33,800 Speaker 1: This is the Danielle Gill Show. I am delighted to 12 00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:38,040 Speaker 1: welcome our guest today, Frank Pavone. He is an amazing author, 13 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 1: leader in the pro life movement. He's been on here before. 14 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: So Frank, thanks for coming back on. We appreciate it. 15 00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 2: Oh, Danielle, you do a great job. Thank you for 16 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:47,880 Speaker 2: having me once again. 17 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,879 Speaker 1: Oh will we go way back? Because he invited me 18 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:55,000 Speaker 1: to speak in the past to the Priest for Life 19 00:00:55,040 --> 00:00:58,880 Speaker 1: prayer kind of prayer, what would you call it? Is 20 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 1: it like a prayer, Sarah. 21 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 2: The prayer service. Yes, On the day of the March 22 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:04,560 Speaker 2: for Life in Washington. 23 00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, And it's really just fascinating and such a 24 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:13,400 Speaker 1: such a fun, meaningful experience where you are in Washington 25 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 1: for the March for Life but also get to spend 26 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 1: time in prayer with other people in the same situation. 27 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 1: Here amazing music. So thank you for your leadership in 28 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:27,479 Speaker 1: the pro life movement and wanted to ask you where 29 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,000 Speaker 1: do you think the pro life movement is now? Where 30 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,280 Speaker 1: is it going? Because I think when we did this, 31 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 1: this was maybe the first one right after Roe went down, 32 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:39,759 Speaker 1: and so that was kind of the you know, the theme. 33 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: Everybody was talking about what that would look like in 34 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,080 Speaker 1: a post row America. Now it's been a few years, 35 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 1: So where do you kind of how do you take 36 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 1: stock of things since then? 37 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 3: Well, you know, Danielle, things continue to progress for the 38 00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 3: protection of the unborn in various states. We just saw 39 00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 3: a few days ago in Wyoming the governor signed another 40 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:08,520 Speaker 3: heartbeat bill. So Wyoming joins Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, and 41 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:13,840 Speaker 3: Iowa in protecting babies starting around six weeks when the 42 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:16,919 Speaker 3: heartbeat can be detected. Of course it starts much earlier 43 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:21,040 Speaker 3: than that, but this is great to see states continuing 44 00:02:21,200 --> 00:02:24,360 Speaker 3: to advance the protection of the unborn, and many of 45 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 3: others of them working on things like that. A big 46 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 3: concern for the pro life movement, of course, continues to 47 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 3: be the chemical abortions, and we have seen more legislation 48 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 3: introduced in Congress to do something about that. 49 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 2: On the federal level. 50 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 3: Many states are taking actions, as Texas has done, as 51 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 3: you know, very well, with the laws that would say, hey, 52 00:02:50,520 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 3: you know what, we've got to stop permitting in any way, 53 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 3: shape or form, the selling of these drugs that kill 54 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 3: babies and harm women. So Texas is leading the way 55 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:05,640 Speaker 3: in many respects on legislation like that because a lot 56 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:07,520 Speaker 3: of people are saying, well, what can we do? You know, 57 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 3: these drugs are going all over the place, although I 58 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,320 Speaker 3: think it's important for people to understand there's still something 59 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 3: like eighty five percent of the abortion drugs are still 60 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 3: being distributed in brick. 61 00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:20,919 Speaker 2: And mortar facilities. 62 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 3: So while the mailing is a key problem, we've still 63 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 3: got it happening basically from these clinics. However, I would 64 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,120 Speaker 3: say this that the pro life movement I think has 65 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 3: been there's two concerns I have. Number One, we don't 66 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 3: we shouldn't be as confident as many speakers are about 67 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:49,520 Speaker 3: the statistics because we really don't know. Since Dobbs, since 68 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 3: you and I addressed the fall of REVW eight, abortion 69 00:03:55,040 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 3: statistics have become even less reliable and more cloudy than 70 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 3: they were before. First of all, a number of states, 71 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 3: including California, Maryland, you know, or a lot of abortions 72 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:10,200 Speaker 3: happening in both of those places, don't even report their 73 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 3: statistics to the CDC, and we've. 74 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 2: Got to do something about that. But furthermore, with the. 75 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:23,000 Speaker 3: Further protections advanced in many states, and people traveling across 76 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:28,839 Speaker 3: state lines to do abortions, and abortion businesses recalculating the 77 00:04:28,839 --> 00:04:33,040 Speaker 3: way they do things, the statistics are just we really 78 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 3: don't know. So we know that chemical abortions are on 79 00:04:36,279 --> 00:04:39,040 Speaker 3: the rise, but we don't know the exact percentages. 80 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:42,920 Speaker 2: You know, the fact that an abortion drug is sold, Danielle, 81 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:45,400 Speaker 2: doesn't mean that it was taken. It doesn't mean that 82 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 2: an actual abortion occurred. 83 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 3: Many people are stockpiling these drugs, and so we have 84 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 3: to take a little bit of of an agnostic view 85 00:04:57,080 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 3: when it comes to statistics. 86 00:04:58,720 --> 00:04:59,720 Speaker 2: But the second. 87 00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:03,240 Speaker 3: Concern have is this that where we can make the 88 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:08,720 Speaker 3: most progress in this movement in terms of actually protecting 89 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,120 Speaker 3: these babies is on the other end of the spectrum, 90 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 3: the late term abortions. And I have discussed this, and 91 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 3: you know, we we're going to be doing some projects 92 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:22,920 Speaker 3: in the coming year really shining a spotlight on late 93 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:23,560 Speaker 3: term abortion. 94 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 2: But there's already a consensus across America. 95 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:31,279 Speaker 3: There's always has been, and it crosses political lines that 96 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 3: you know, if you're talking about a healthy baby of 97 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 3: a healthy mother thirty weeks into pregnancy, people should not 98 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 3: be able to make an appointment to have that baby killed. 99 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 3: People who think there should be the choice do it 100 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 3: earlier in the pregnancy. 101 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 2: They say there should be a cutoff point. 102 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:53,279 Speaker 3: And yet in so many places in America still these 103 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 3: babies are being legally killed even in the late second 104 00:05:56,960 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 3: and early third trimester. So those are in a nutshell 105 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,160 Speaker 3: some of my current concerns. But there's been a lot 106 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 3: of great progress, and you can be sure the pro 107 00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 3: life movement is not in any way backing down or 108 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 3: slowing down. 109 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 1: Absolutely, do you see it as the pro abortion side, 110 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: Are they really focusing on these pills? Are they focused 111 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:22,880 Speaker 1: on the laterm abortion? Of course, they don't want to 112 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 1: give up any of it. They if you say, hey, 113 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 1: you know, we need to stop abortion a month before 114 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,360 Speaker 1: the birth or whatever, thirty weeks like you said, they 115 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 1: still don't want to agree to that. So they want 116 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:35,040 Speaker 1: to be able to do you know, the abortion nine months. 117 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 1: They want the whole thing, and they'll never make a compromise. 118 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: Where do you think they are setting their sides? Because 119 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,280 Speaker 1: sometimes maybe they're on the defense. We saw that, you know, 120 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:47,359 Speaker 1: Planned Parenthood I think got defunded for a year. And 121 00:06:47,440 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 1: then we have, of course these laws in certain states 122 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:52,839 Speaker 1: that may be causing them to reshuffle there. But where 123 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:55,599 Speaker 1: are they focusing their efforts. Are they focusing on the 124 00:06:55,680 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: liberal states? Are they focusing on you know, certain alts. 125 00:07:00,480 --> 00:07:01,559 Speaker 1: I don't know. What do you think? 126 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:05,040 Speaker 3: Well, of course, the the elections are crucially important for 127 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 3: both sides, and we should talk more about that. They're 128 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,120 Speaker 3: very going to be very determinative of what we can 129 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 3: do going forward. But what they're doing this still doubling 130 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 3: down on their extremism in the sense that in various 131 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 3: states Virginia is going to be one of the next ones. Uh, 132 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:28,200 Speaker 3: and even places like Idaho. Uh, the pro abortion forces 133 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:29,680 Speaker 3: are trying to get these amendments. 134 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 2: Uh. 135 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 3: You know, thrust into these constitutions on the state level. 136 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 3: And it's an interesting strategy because they they law when 137 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 3: when when when Roe felt they lost on the federal 138 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 3: level the idea that there was any kind of a 139 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:46,840 Speaker 3: right to abortion or right to privacy that includes abortion 140 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:51,040 Speaker 3: in this in the federal constitution. Of course, Dobbs said, Look, 141 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 3: it was never there to begin with. 142 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 2: It's nowhere in the history. And Dobbs went on. 143 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 3: To say, uh, nor has it been in the state constitutions. 144 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:01,040 Speaker 3: So what they love so lust on the federal level, 145 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 3: now they're trying to insert on the state level. Because 146 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 3: once they do that, and I've always pointed out this 147 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 3: is not a sign of their strength, it's a sign 148 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:12,520 Speaker 3: of their weakness and their fear. And what I mean 149 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 3: by that is, as you know, once you put something 150 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 3: in a constitution, then legislators, judges, executive level of positions 151 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 3: in that state, all of them have to abide by 152 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 3: the limits that are prescribed in the constitution. So they 153 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:33,839 Speaker 3: can't initiate any kind of action legislative or executive or 154 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 3: judicial that would limit the so called right to abortion. 155 00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 2: So what you do, in other words, is you short 156 00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 2: circuit the whole process. 157 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:47,559 Speaker 3: By which, as Dobbs rightly indicated, the American people should 158 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 3: be sorting out abortion policy and having the arguments, the moral, 159 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 3: the philosophical, the legal arguments about this issue. But putting 160 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,559 Speaker 3: it in the constitution as a right short circuits all 161 00:08:59,600 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 3: of that. 162 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 2: And that's what the other side wants to do, because 163 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 2: they're afraid of that process. 164 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:06,319 Speaker 3: They're afraid when you and I and others engage with 165 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:09,079 Speaker 3: you as an author yourself, you know, engage in the 166 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,439 Speaker 3: discussion that should be happening on abortion. They're afraid when 167 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:16,280 Speaker 3: legislators introduce bills because what they're afraid of is that 168 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:19,719 Speaker 3: the people actually are going to take advantage of the 169 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 3: new found I hate to say permission. I mean we've 170 00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 3: already we always have had the right, but the new recognition, 171 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:32,959 Speaker 3: we might say, or affirmation that, yeah, abortion policy should 172 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,520 Speaker 3: be set by the people and they're elected representatives. 173 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 2: The other side knows that we're going to continue doing that. 174 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 3: The other side knows that our arguments are more persuasive, 175 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 3: so they don't want to have the debate to begin with. 176 00:09:42,160 --> 00:09:44,880 Speaker 3: So they say, let's cut it off. By putting the 177 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 3: right in the constitutions. We can expect to see more 178 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 3: of this. Unfortunately, some of this will be on the 179 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 3: ballot in twenty twenty six and going forward, they want 180 00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 3: to do this more and more, although they are limited 181 00:09:56,640 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 3: in as much as not every state allows this kind 182 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:04,719 Speaker 3: of it is an initiated ballot measure process. A lot 183 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:06,839 Speaker 3: of the states say, look, it's sich go through the 184 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:09,680 Speaker 3: legislative process, and that is in fact. 185 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 2: Where we believe we can make the most progress. 186 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:16,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, as people have people's views shifted at all on 187 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 1: abortion because sometimes I know people bring up the you know, 188 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:22,320 Speaker 1: most people are against the late term, but not this 189 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,200 Speaker 1: with the first term and so on. But I think 190 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 1: as technology has advanced, ultrasounds have advanced, we know more 191 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 1: about what goes on in the womb. People and certainly 192 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: women who view those are much likely to choose an abortion. 193 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: Do you think that's the case for public perception? Is 194 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 1: there more we can be doing with I know you 195 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 1: will share images often. Is there more we can do 196 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 1: with science things like that to show that this is 197 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,440 Speaker 1: human beings, there is life in the womb, and people 198 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: will hopefully accept that and change their views on this. 199 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:59,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, very much depends on what the conversation is. That's 200 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:01,839 Speaker 3: initialate when you look at the polling. I mean, there 201 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 3: are some disturbing trends where we see more people calling 202 00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:12,440 Speaker 3: themselves pro choice, but that's the label, and people can 203 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:17,440 Speaker 3: manipulate a lot about how people feel about the labels 204 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:20,280 Speaker 3: pro life or pro choice. But when you look at 205 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 3: the actual you dig down a little deeper and say, okay, 206 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 3: under what circumstances do you think that abortion should be permitted? 207 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:31,520 Speaker 2: Those are the more helpful questions to see. 208 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 3: Where people are at now, even in polling like that 209 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 3: when you say, well, should it be always legal or 210 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 3: mostly legal or sometimes legal in a lot of places, 211 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 3: I mean I'm seeing polling where the number of people 212 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:45,720 Speaker 3: saying well, it should be legal all or most of 213 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:48,720 Speaker 3: the time has been has been increasing. 214 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:51,840 Speaker 2: But a lot of this is because of the propaganda. 215 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 3: Campaigns that for example, these amendments that we were just discussing. 216 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 2: Conduct and they make people. 217 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 3: Here's what the other side has been doing, very very forcefully, 218 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:09,320 Speaker 3: is making people afraid that emergency medical situations related to 219 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 3: pregnancy aren't going to be handled, you know, because of 220 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:18,079 Speaker 3: these laws that the you know, these anti choice Republicans 221 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 3: are passing, and that I mean that affects how people 222 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:24,079 Speaker 3: feel about the issue overall, and yet. 223 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:26,959 Speaker 2: When you dig into that, you see that it is mythology. 224 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:30,680 Speaker 3: You know, we saw this happen in Texas, you know, 225 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 3: these people who were coming forward, you know, in reaction 226 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:38,320 Speaker 3: to the to the pro wife laws and saying, oh, 227 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:41,440 Speaker 3: you know, I'm gonna die, and has happened in Georgia too, 228 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:44,079 Speaker 3: where people were highlighting these cases. 229 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 2: Biden even highlighted it during one of his State of 230 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:47,840 Speaker 2: the Union addresses. 231 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:50,840 Speaker 3: Oh, these people are dying because you know, we don't 232 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 3: have choice anymore when it comes to a person. 233 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:53,679 Speaker 2: That's nonsense. 234 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:57,160 Speaker 3: There's no law in the country where where people who 235 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:00,199 Speaker 3: are in a medical emergency won't be able to get 236 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:06,240 Speaker 3: emergency treatment and get their life preserved because of something 237 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 3: that went wrong with their pregnancy. None of the pro 238 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:12,000 Speaker 3: life laws prohibit that. And so what we're dealing with 239 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 3: is obviously a lot of deception. But the polling does 240 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 3: indicate that, you know, people do get spooked by that, 241 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:21,199 Speaker 3: they do get afraid of that. On the other hand, 242 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 3: when you look at things like what these pro life 243 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:27,400 Speaker 3: laws do, as Texas did and as Florida we did 244 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:31,120 Speaker 3: here in Florida, when we strengthen the protections for the unborn. 245 00:13:31,320 --> 00:13:37,319 Speaker 3: We're also strengthening funding for alternatives to abortion, and that 246 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 3: really polls very very well. And that's why we see, 247 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 3: for example, we see the administration speaking so much about 248 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:48,319 Speaker 3: let's help moms and dads have children when they want to. 249 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 3: Helping families have the children they want is a very 250 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 3: very popular. 251 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 2: Notion. People back it in the polling, and they back 252 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 2: it in practice. 253 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 3: I think the pro life movement will continue to not 254 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,760 Speaker 3: primarily because of polling, but primarily because. 255 00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 2: This is what we do. 256 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:12,320 Speaker 3: We stand with families that are having difficulty having children, 257 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:16,280 Speaker 3: or facing financial obstacles in having children, or just facing 258 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 3: fears and confusions. We are there to help them get 259 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 3: through those fears and have the courage and the joy 260 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 3: of welcoming new life. 261 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: Yes, definitely. And you've been such a leader in this 262 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,880 Speaker 1: movement for so many years. How do you first get 263 00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 1: involved in this and what inspired you to make this 264 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:37,880 Speaker 1: one of your main issues that you champion. 265 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 2: I was a high school student. 266 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:46,760 Speaker 3: I went to public schools, and I became aware of abortion. Well. 267 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,280 Speaker 2: I was a senior in high school in nineteen seventy six. Now, 268 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 2: Roe v. 269 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,360 Speaker 3: Wade had just come down three years prior to that, 270 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:56,520 Speaker 3: and I became aware of the March for Life. I 271 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,480 Speaker 3: went there as a senior in high school with a 272 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:03,320 Speaker 3: bus that was leaving from our county pro life group, 273 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 3: and just seeing that march really inspired me to realize, 274 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 3: wait a minute, this is a big issue. This is 275 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:14,600 Speaker 3: a big movement in response to this issue. This is 276 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 3: something I should get involved in. And I got involved 277 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:21,160 Speaker 3: at that point, and one thing led to another where 278 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:22,960 Speaker 3: I came to the point that I wanted to do 279 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:23,760 Speaker 3: this full time. 280 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 2: So it was, you know, a series of very ordinary events. 281 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 3: And I always point out to people because we have 282 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 3: many marches now taking place, not just our annual federal 283 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 3: level marches, but these state marches that are happening. I 284 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 3: point out to people that, you know, when we do this, 285 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 3: we are inspiring a whole new generation of pro life 286 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 3: activists and eventually. 287 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:55,040 Speaker 2: Leaders, because the events do something to us. 288 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 3: You know, we always hope that the media will pay attention, 289 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:00,880 Speaker 3: that the lawmakers will pay attention, that you know, our 290 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 3: fellow citizens will pay attention. But it's we ourselves who 291 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:10,280 Speaker 3: participate in these marches who also get more inspired and transformed. 292 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:14,880 Speaker 3: Even though we're already in the right position philosophically, but 293 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 3: to get more active, to make it more of a priority. 294 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:18,640 Speaker 2: And that's what happened to me. 295 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,720 Speaker 3: I became a priest at the same time, and as 296 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:24,760 Speaker 3: a priest, you know, when I was preaching about this 297 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 3: pretty regularly, I began to see the beautiful reaction from 298 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 3: the people. Yes, you know, we're going to get more involved. 299 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 3: The preaching has an effect. So I started to think, well, 300 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 3: what if we helped all the priests around the country 301 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 3: to be more vocal about this. And that's what led 302 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 3: me to my work with Priests for Life to say, look, 303 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 3: we've got to help the clergy to find their voice. 304 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 3: We've got to help the church to find its voice 305 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 3: on this issue, because then people will respond and we 306 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 3: will bring this problem to an end. We've seen great 307 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 3: progress on that front, but we continue to make that 308 00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 3: a priority, and I want to invite our listeners, our 309 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:01,720 Speaker 3: audience to. 310 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 2: Partner with us in that. 311 00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 3: You know, let let your pastors know the resources that 312 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,119 Speaker 3: are available to help them preach on this and pray. 313 00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:12,959 Speaker 2: We've got a wide variety of resources. 314 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 3: There's a website called ProLife dot Church and a pro 315 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,399 Speaker 3: life dot Church. All the things people could want, whether 316 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 3: it's prayer, preaching activities for the people across denominational lines. 317 00:17:26,400 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 2: Is there. 318 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 3: That's how I got involved again, to think that, Wow, 319 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:35,399 Speaker 3: the church has the not only the resources, but the 320 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:40,879 Speaker 3: divine guarantee of victory over the culture of death, and 321 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 3: many people thirst for that, Danielle. They want to see 322 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 3: that happen, and we can give them the tools that 323 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 3: are needed. 324 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 1: Definitely also wanted to ask you a little bit about 325 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:54,959 Speaker 1: not just abortion, but medically assisted dying. This is an 326 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,879 Speaker 1: aid in Canada and they call it this, which is 327 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:02,680 Speaker 1: really just a youism for euthanasia, and it's hard to 328 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 1: believe that it's only been legal since twenty sixteen and 329 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,920 Speaker 1: in very short order it became the fifth largest cause 330 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:12,400 Speaker 1: of death for Canadians. What do you make of this? 331 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 1: I guess just legally. Morally, this is related to abortion 332 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:22,359 Speaker 1: my mind, because it affects the you know, the killing 333 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:26,719 Speaker 1: of a human soul. What do you make of that 334 00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:27,880 Speaker 1: becoming so popular. 335 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:32,480 Speaker 3: Well, first of all, we wouldn't see an increase in 336 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:36,640 Speaker 3: euthanasia without what has happened on. 337 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 2: The front of abortion. 338 00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 3: Because when we deny any group of people the protection 339 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 3: of their right to life, or weaken it in any way, 340 00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 3: we break that principle for the whole of life. You know, 341 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 3: you can't take away protection from one group of people 342 00:18:52,119 --> 00:18:54,480 Speaker 3: and expect to keep it for yourself. So that the 343 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 3: vast holocaust that we have seen against the children in 344 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 3: the womb has led now to this idea that, well, 345 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 3: you know, if a mother can kill her innocent, unwanted child, 346 00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 3: a child can kill his innocent, unwanted mother. If choice 347 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 3: prevails over life, and if we're no longer constrained by 348 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:15,479 Speaker 3: the idea that no one can ever take a life, 349 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:19,120 Speaker 3: but rather instead we replace that with the idea that, well, 350 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 3: we can take a life to solve a problem. Well, 351 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,440 Speaker 3: then the problems faced, and they're very real problems by 352 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:29,720 Speaker 3: people who are facing terminal disease. They want to avoid 353 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,679 Speaker 3: pain and suffering at the end of their life, and 354 00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 3: of course we want to help. 355 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:37,639 Speaker 2: We have the greatest compassion for people like this. 356 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 3: But if you start to inject the idea that, well, 357 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 3: you know, one of the ways you can get rid 358 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:46,520 Speaker 3: of your suffering is to just end your life altogether. Well, 359 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 3: first of all, that idea can be very very attractive, 360 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 3: and then when the law starts to weaken you end 361 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,399 Speaker 3: up you can end up unleashing a tidal wave of this, 362 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,560 Speaker 3: and that's what we're seeing not only in Canada, but 363 00:19:58,600 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 3: in certain states in America. 364 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 2: You know, we dodged a bullet. 365 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:05,119 Speaker 3: Back in nineteen ninety seven, there was a Supreme Court 366 00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:08,280 Speaker 3: case that could have become like a Roe v. Wade 367 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,920 Speaker 3: of euthanasia and assistant suicide in the United States. But 368 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 3: fortunately the Court ruled the right way in that case 369 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:20,080 Speaker 3: and did not unleash an unlimited right to die. You know, Danielle, 370 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 3: when people talk about the right to die, you know 371 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 3: what I say to them, don't worry, you won't miss 372 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:25,360 Speaker 3: out on it. 373 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:27,800 Speaker 2: Death is not a right. 374 00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:31,920 Speaker 3: It's not we don't have a claim on death. Death 375 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 3: has a claim on us. Everybody dies. The question is 376 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 3: how are we going to care for the person who 377 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 3: is dying, for the person who is suffering, to offer them. 378 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,440 Speaker 3: On the one hand, you've got the carrot and the stick, 379 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,120 Speaker 3: you know. On the one hand, it's like, ooh, we're 380 00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:50,680 Speaker 3: going to give you this new way to. 381 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:51,879 Speaker 2: Escape your suffering. 382 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 3: And this is terrible because it's not helping them, it's 383 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:57,960 Speaker 3: not helping their families. On the other hand, it's the 384 00:20:58,080 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 3: generation of fear. The fear mongering that goes along with 385 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:05,640 Speaker 3: and the mythology. Just like we have so many mythologies 386 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:10,280 Speaker 3: about about abortion and pro life laws, does this mythology 387 00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:15,679 Speaker 3: surrounding the so called right to die mythologies about you 388 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:18,920 Speaker 3: know how we oh, you know, you you're going to 389 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:21,399 Speaker 3: be connected all sorts of machines. You're not going to 390 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 3: be able to refuse treatments, You're not going to be. 391 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:27,720 Speaker 2: Able to manage the pain. That is all false and fake. 392 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:30,960 Speaker 3: People have the right, and we support the right to 393 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,240 Speaker 3: say no to medical treatments that are not going to 394 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 3: have some kind of benefit to them or some kind 395 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 3: of advantage, or that. 396 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:41,480 Speaker 2: Are going to be you know, overly burdensome. 397 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:44,640 Speaker 3: And at the same time, you know, we are much 398 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:49,440 Speaker 3: much more able in our day and age to handle 399 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 3: and manage pain than many people realize. And it's just 400 00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:57,160 Speaker 3: unfair to people when groups that are pushing for assistant 401 00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:01,719 Speaker 3: suicide and euthanasia to you know, propagate these notions that, oh, 402 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:06,280 Speaker 3: you're going to be you know, trapped in un unmanageable pain. 403 00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:08,680 Speaker 2: We see a lot of this happening. It's just not right. 404 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 2: We also see. 405 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 3: Food and water being reclassified under the laws in many 406 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:17,240 Speaker 3: states in some countries as medical treatment. 407 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:20,159 Speaker 2: Food and water are not medical treatment. 408 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:22,680 Speaker 3: When we come back from lunch or dinner, we don't say, oh, 409 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 3: I just had my latest medical treatment. 410 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,520 Speaker 2: It's not a medical treatment. It's bored in there. It's 411 00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 2: like breathing air, you. 412 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 3: Know, oxygen medical treatment. It's what we need to stay alive. 413 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 3: And this is one of the ways we can fight 414 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 3: back against these trends. It's like when we look at 415 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 3: the laws and policies in place, if food, if the 416 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,879 Speaker 3: administration of food, of nutrition and hydration are considered medical treatment, 417 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,400 Speaker 3: there's got to be a shift there in how we 418 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,000 Speaker 3: categorize that, and we need to look at that just 419 00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:55,920 Speaker 3: as basic humane care that is always obligatory, always obligatory morally, 420 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:01,760 Speaker 3: unless and until the body itself is no longer assimilating 421 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 3: that nutrition and hydration. But this is one of the 422 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:10,639 Speaker 3: ways that this death cult slips in to end of 423 00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:11,560 Speaker 3: life medical care. 424 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's definitely a defficult. And it's interesting because you 425 00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 1: would think the left wouldn't like, why would someone care 426 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: about this so much? Why would they want to push 427 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 1: it so much? What is the ideology behind it? Of 428 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 1: course we would say it's evil, it's anti the way 429 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 1: that God designed human life, and it is ending human 430 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: life is the complete opposite of what God would want. 431 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,560 Speaker 1: How do you think, at least because you're just so 432 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:40,920 Speaker 1: experienced in all of these issues and all these matters, 433 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:43,440 Speaker 1: how do you think people think about it? Who maybe 434 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:46,679 Speaker 1: you're priests who are probably pro life and all of this, 435 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 1: but maybe they don't. Maybe they don't feel about as 436 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,080 Speaker 1: strongly as you do about it, or maybe they needed 437 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:56,200 Speaker 1: more guidance, like you were saying, you said, a priest 438 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:59,679 Speaker 1: for life to kind of provide some tools there. Do 439 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:04,440 Speaker 1: you think I think that these issues are maybe they 440 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:08,080 Speaker 1: just need more explanation, even for our spiritual leaders to 441 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,639 Speaker 1: understand more, because in my mind, I'm like, and if 442 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:13,480 Speaker 1: you're a spiritual leader, this is like black and white issue. 443 00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 1: This is very clear, and of course for everybody else, 444 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 1: we have to get the message out to them. But 445 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,439 Speaker 1: what has that been like kind of administering this to 446 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,960 Speaker 1: other people who are you know, priests or made pastors 447 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 1: who are involved in this matter. 448 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's an insightful question. 449 00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 3: I find a lot of the clergy you're conflicted on 450 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:35,000 Speaker 3: this because you know, it's not as straightforward in their 451 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 3: mind and their experience as abortion is. For example, I mean, 452 00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 3: you never kill a baby, period a and m end 453 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:43,159 Speaker 3: of story. But when it comes to the end of 454 00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 3: life and people are dying of a terminal illness or 455 00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 3: you've got all kinds of questions there about whether certain 456 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,399 Speaker 3: treatments are going to work or not, then it introduces 457 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:56,760 Speaker 3: a whole series of questions. And there's a big distinction 458 00:24:56,880 --> 00:25:02,240 Speaker 3: that has to be made between with droy treatment and 459 00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 3: killing someone. 460 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:05,880 Speaker 2: They're not the same thing. 461 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 3: We do believe in a person's medical freedom to refuse 462 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:14,119 Speaker 3: treatment as long as, like we were just saying in 463 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 3: the previous question, you're not considering food and water to 464 00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 3: be medical treatment, then withdrawing treatment becomes equivalent to starving 465 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:24,879 Speaker 3: or dehydrating person a person. We can think of the 466 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 3: Terry Shivo tragedy back in twenty oh five. I was 467 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,840 Speaker 3: very involved in that case, in that family and with 468 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:35,200 Speaker 3: Terry directly. But putting situations like that aside, I think 469 00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 3: that spiritual leaders are they're very often confused, and you know, 470 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,639 Speaker 3: I don't blame them for being confused, because with the 471 00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:45,199 Speaker 3: advancement of medical technology, we can do things today in 472 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:49,480 Speaker 3: terms of keeping people alive, even if they're in the 473 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 3: dying process that we couldn't have dreamed of decades ago. 474 00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,960 Speaker 3: We're in a it's a whole new ballgame in terms 475 00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:58,760 Speaker 3: of what we are able to do the fact that 476 00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:02,240 Speaker 3: we're able to do it doesn't mean necessarily that we 477 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:03,360 Speaker 3: have to do it. 478 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:05,000 Speaker 1: But I. 479 00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,240 Speaker 2: See, I see clergy and spiritual. 480 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,880 Speaker 3: Leaders just very very confused by where do you draw 481 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:15,919 Speaker 3: the line? And let me answer that confusion by saying 482 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:20,520 Speaker 3: simply that don't try necessarily to answer that question in 483 00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:25,439 Speaker 3: advance what we have today. And I've seen it with 484 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:29,280 Speaker 3: you know, situations regarding you know, my own family, and 485 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 3: and you know, the doctors so often are are they're 486 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 3: pushing so hard for people to fill out these living 487 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:41,879 Speaker 3: wills and and you know, advanced directives for you know, 488 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,360 Speaker 3: health care. The wisest thing to do when it comes 489 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 3: to an advanced directive for healthcare is that you choose 490 00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:54,480 Speaker 3: the person you trust who understands your preferences, your moral beliefs, 491 00:26:54,520 --> 00:27:01,160 Speaker 3: your spiritual convictions. They understand you, and you would trust 492 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,119 Speaker 3: them to answer questions and make decisions if you're in 493 00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 3: a medically compromise situation and you can't speak. 494 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:10,160 Speaker 2: For yourself anymore, and leave it at that. 495 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:14,719 Speaker 3: Don't try to answer questions in advance above and beyond 496 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:18,439 Speaker 3: saying hey, you know what, you know, if my body 497 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 3: is accepting nutrition and hydration, please don't starve me, don't 498 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:25,360 Speaker 3: dehydrate me, you know, don't give me a lethal injection. 499 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:25,960 Speaker 2: You know. 500 00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 3: Obviously we can say, we can draw the line on 501 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,600 Speaker 3: those things. But when it comes to you know, oh, 502 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:32,760 Speaker 3: I don't want to be put on a ventilator, don't 503 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,439 Speaker 3: say something like that. Don't put that in a medical 504 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 3: in a legal document. You know why, because yeah, there 505 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:41,399 Speaker 3: might be a situation where if someone is put on 506 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 3: a ventilator, you know, they're never going to get off 507 00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:47,800 Speaker 3: of it, versus someone might need it for twenty four 508 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 3: to forty eight hours and then they can recover and 509 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:51,359 Speaker 3: live a healthy life. 510 00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:54,160 Speaker 2: You can't. Nobody knows the future. And I think that's 511 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 2: the most important. 512 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 3: Assertion to make when we're talking about how do we 513 00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 3: make these ends of life, you know, decisions, or deal 514 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,920 Speaker 3: with these things. Usually the answer is you don't deal 515 00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:06,399 Speaker 3: with them until you're actually in the situation and you 516 00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:07,399 Speaker 3: know the medical details. 517 00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:08,400 Speaker 2: You know the treatments that. 518 00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 3: Are available, and you know the disease that you have 519 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 3: and what can be done about it. That's the smartest 520 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:15,200 Speaker 3: thing is to say, Look, I don't know. If I'm 521 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 3: not going to be able to speak for myself, I 522 00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:19,960 Speaker 3: am going to appoint a person that can speak for me, 523 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,040 Speaker 3: and then you make sure that person understands. 524 00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,119 Speaker 2: Your moral your moral convictions. 525 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. Well, thank you so much, Bother Frank. I 526 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 1: appreciate you being with us today and sharing all this 527 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,520 Speaker 1: with us because I think these issues of abortion, of 528 00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:39,400 Speaker 1: you know, medically assisted dying and all of this are 529 00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:42,200 Speaker 1: very troubling and sometimes it's hard for people to make 530 00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 1: sense of these matters. So we appreciate you explaining it 531 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 1: in more detail and so that we understand what we 532 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 1: are facing here today. So appreciate you being on the 533 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:54,640 Speaker 1: show with us and look forward to talking again soon. 534 00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:58,200 Speaker 2: God bless you, Danielle. Thanks for having me. God bless 535 00:28:58,240 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 2: our audience. 536 00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: Well that wraps up today's show. If you enjoyed the show, 537 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: make sure to find me on social media. I am 538 00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:09,280 Speaker 1: Danielle Desuza Gil. I am always posting on Facebook, Instagram, 539 00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:13,440 Speaker 1: x YouTube, Rumble, Truth, social all the places, so make 540 00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:15,240 Speaker 1: sure to find me on there and I will see 541 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: you next time.