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Speaker 1: Are there fake Jews in the Land of Abraham? Tucker

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Speaker 1: Carlson seems to think so. My curiosity is piqued. If

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Speaker 1: the Jews in Israel today are fake. If they are

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Speaker 1: not the Jews descended from the Jews of the Bible,

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Speaker 1: then who are they? And where are the real Jews?

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Speaker 1: Are the real Jews hiding some place while impostors have

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Speaker 1: taken their place? I don't mean this in a frivolous way.

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Speaker 1: It's a serious question of whether Jews have a right

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Speaker 1: to their ancestral homeland. It's part of a broader question.

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Speaker 1: How do any people anywhere get the tidal deeds to

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Speaker 1: a country? What gives them the right to live there?

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Speaker 1: To say it's theirs? If the Jews don't have a

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Speaker 1: right to Israel, do the Irish have a right to Ireland?

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Speaker 1: The Indians to India? Do we Americans have a right

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Speaker 1: to live in America? America? This is the fundamental and

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Speaker 1: important issue being raised here now. Tucker Carlson went to Israel. Well,

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Speaker 1: he went to the airport in Tel Aviv, and he

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Speaker 1: confronted US Ambassador to Israel, Mike Huckabee about this. The

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Speaker 1: conversation covered several topics but this was the central when

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Speaker 1: at least it was central for Tucker. Tucker even asked

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Speaker 1: why every Israeli has not taken a genetic test to

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Speaker 1: establish a connection to Abraham and the Jews of biblical times.

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Speaker 2: Abram's descendants are the ones who have the right to

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Speaker 2: have this land? Correct? Yes, okay, why don't we do

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Speaker 2: genetic testing on everybody in the land and find out

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Speaker 2: who Abram's descendants are? It's really simple. We've cracked the

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Speaker 2: human genome. We can do that. Why don't we do that?

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Speaker 2: Would you be against doing that?

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Speaker 1: I I have no idea what that would prove? I mean,

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Speaker 1: maybe it would be what.

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Speaker 2: Do you mean, what would it would prove? Who Abram's

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Speaker 2: descendants are and who has a right to live here

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Speaker 2: and who doesn't according to the theology that you yourself just explained.

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Speaker 2: And so I'm very confused as to why we don't

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Speaker 2: do that. If you believe the theology that you've just

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Speaker 2: explained to me, would we do.

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Speaker 1: That all over the world.

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Speaker 2: This is the only country the world that you've said

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Speaker 2: has this covenant with God that this people have a moral,

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Speaker 2: illegal right to the land.

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Speaker 1: Evidently, for Tucker, genetic lineage is a necessary prerequisite to

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Speaker 1: proving your entitlement to a country you can call your own.

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Speaker 1: Tucker seems obsessed with disproving the connection between the old

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Speaker 1: Jews and the New His goal is to be legitimize

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Speaker 1: the Jews claim to Israel. But there's a bit of

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Speaker 1: a contradiction here, and it's exposed by of all people,

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Speaker 1: Nick fluentes.

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Speaker 3: If the so called Jews of today are not really

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Speaker 3: Jews of the Gospel and the Old Testament, then what

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Speaker 3: does that mean? What does that imply? It means that

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Speaker 3: they did not kill Christ. They are not responsible for

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Speaker 3: the death of God. That's what it does for them.

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Speaker 1: Haha. Nick is upset that Tucker is undercutting another central

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Speaker 1: theme of the Jew haters, namely, the Jews killed Christ.

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Speaker 1: This is a problem for Tucker since he too is

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Speaker 1: into this Christ killer accusation.

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Speaker 2: Remember this, and Charlie would have loved this, not just

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Speaker 2: because he loved large groups of people, but because ultimately

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Speaker 2: he was a Christian evangelist. And it actually reminds me

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Speaker 2: of my favorite story ever. So It's about two thousand

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Speaker 2: years ago in Jerusalem and Jesus shows up and he

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Speaker 2: starts talking about the people in power and he starts

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Speaker 2: doing the worst thing that you can do, which is

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Speaker 2: telling the truth about people, and they hate it, and

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Speaker 2: they just go bonkers. They hate it, and they become

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Speaker 2: obsessed with making him stop. This guy's got to stop talking.

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Speaker 2: We've got to shut this guy up. And I can

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Speaker 2: just sort of picture the scene in a lamplit room

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Speaker 2: with a bunch of guys sitting around eating hummus, thinking

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Speaker 2: about what do we do about this guy telling the

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Speaker 2: truth about us?

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Speaker 1: We must make him stop talking.

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Speaker 2: And there's always one guy with the bright idea. I

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Speaker 2: could just hear him say, I've got ada.

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Speaker 1: Why don't we just kill him?

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Speaker 2: That'll shut him up, That'll fix the problem.

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Speaker 1: I must say. Life gets complicated when your anti Semitic

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Speaker 1: nostrums start crashing into one another. Back to Tucker's genetic argument.

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Speaker 1: Oddly enough, my original fallout with Tucker a few months

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Speaker 1: ago was over exactly this point. Tucker sent me a text.

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Speaker 1: He said that the genetic studies show that European or

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Speaker 1: Ashkenazi Jews have a lower genetic continuity with ancient populations

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Speaker 1: in the region than Palestinians do. His points seem to

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Speaker 1: be that the Palestinians are truly indigenous, and the Jews

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Speaker 1: are to a considerable degree fakers or impostors. Now here's

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Speaker 1: how I replied to Tucker, and I quote, in Biblical times,

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Speaker 1: the Philistines occupied the territory that is now Gaza. Well,

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Speaker 1: it was Gaza then too, but other cities were included,

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Speaker 1: like Ashdod and Gas. But the Philistines, I said, were

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Speaker 1: European settlers originally from the Aegean, not Arabs. Centuries later,

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Speaker 1: in some cases as late as the twentieth century, Arabs

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Speaker 1: moved into that region. Many of them came from Jordan,

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Speaker 1: from Syria and the Arabian deserts, so they are not

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Speaker 1: all caps the original inhabitants of Gaza. And Tucker replied,

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Speaker 1: and I quote, sure, I believe that. But then, in

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Speaker 1: classic Tucker fashion, he quickly withdraws his agreement. Quote, but

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Speaker 1: in order to determine who's actually inherited the land, we'd

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Speaker 1: have to conduct global genetic testing to award property on

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Speaker 1: the basis of the results. And then Tucker concludes, sounds

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Speaker 1: like a Nazi project. To me, as a Christian, I

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Speaker 1: reject that, I replied to Tucker, ha ha ha, I

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Speaker 1: don't think that's necessary any more than it's necessary to

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Speaker 1: genetically test Asian Indians to make sure their ancestors are

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Speaker 1: from India. Remember, Jews maintain their tribal identity very little

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Speaker 1: in a marriage. They didn't try to convert people as

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Speaker 1: Christians did. Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice conveys the picture very vividly.

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Speaker 1: The Jews don't mix, so their continuity as a group

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Speaker 1: is generally more secure than virtually any other group. Again,

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Speaker 1: Tucker says, I agree with all of that, but promptly

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Speaker 1: returns to his main theme quote. If the claim is

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Speaker 1: that Jews have a genetic right to certain pieces of land,

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Speaker 1: it's going to be necessary to do genetic testing. If

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Speaker 1: if the Jews are claiming a genetic right, then we

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Speaker 1: have to genetically examine them.

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Speaker 2: But are the.

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Speaker 1: Jews claiming a genetic right, I'm not sure they are. Well,

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Speaker 1: maybe some are, maybe some Christians agree with them. But

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Speaker 1: there are several other non genetic and in fact non

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Speaker 1: religious ways to establish the Jewish claim to the nation

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Speaker 1: of Israel. How do any people anywhere claim the title

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Speaker 1: deeds to a country. There are generally only three ways

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Speaker 1: to have legitimate possession of a country. If you look

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Speaker 1: at all the maps of the world. They are drawn

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Speaker 1: as they are drawn based on one of three criteria. First,

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Speaker 1: you get land because you were there first original or

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Speaker 1: aboriginal inhabitants. Second, you get land because it is given

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Speaker 1: to you as a result of some treaty or negotiation. Third,

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Speaker 1: you get land because of conquest, and that, by the way,

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Speaker 1: is the most common method for acquiring the tidal needs

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Speaker 1: to a country. You take the land by force and

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Speaker 1: you hold it. Most countries got their land in this way.

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Speaker 1: Now let's apply this threefold criteria to America. The case

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Speaker 1: of America, the native Indians were here first, but the

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Speaker 1: white men conquered the land by force, so there is

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Speaker 1: a sort of competing claim. Now, in practice, the white

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Speaker 1: man's claim is stronger because conquest usually takes precedence over

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Speaker 1: original inhabitancy. And this is true practically, but it's not

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Speaker 1: necessarily morally the case. This is why so many leftists

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Speaker 1: insists that the white men stole the land from the Indians.

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Speaker 1: The implication here is that conquest or force is an

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Speaker 1: illegitimate way to establish political right or political legitimacy. But

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Speaker 1: now apply the same threefold criteria to Israel. The Jews

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Speaker 1: were the original inhabitants of the land of Israel, going

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Speaker 1: back thousands of years. Even Tucker doesn't dispute this. His

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Speaker 1: question is whether today's Jews are truly descended from those

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Speaker 1: original and rightful occupants. Second, the United Nations gave the

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Speaker 1: land of the Jews through a proposed partition in nineteen

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Speaker 1: forty eight. By the way, the partition was accepted by

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Speaker 1: the Jews rejected by the Arabs, war broke out, and

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Speaker 1: so we reached the third criterion, which is conquest. And

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Speaker 1: here too, Israel prevails. In fact, Israel has fought at

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Speaker 1: least three wars nineteen forty eight, nineteen sixty seven, nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventy three to win and hold the land. My point

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Speaker 1: is that Israel checks all the boxes. Land obtained through

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Speaker 1: original inhabitancy, check, land given by negotiation, check land held

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Speaker 1: by conquest. Check. I cannot think of any other group

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Speaker 1: that has a stronger claim to the land than the Jews.

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Speaker 1: Quite frankly, Jews have a stronger claim to Israel than

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Speaker 1: the white man has to a man. And now I'm

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Speaker 1: sure Tucker wouldn't be happy with that conclusion. Remarkably, he

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Speaker 1: seems to ignore all the three criteria for land ownership

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Speaker 1: that I've spelled out here. Rather, he focuses on a

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Speaker 1: fourth criterion. God gave the land to Abraham and his descendants,

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Speaker 1: so we better do genetic testing to make sure who

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Speaker 1: those descendants really are. This, for Tucker, is the test

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Speaker 1: of Zionist legitimacy. But Zionism was never based on this

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Speaker 1: type of a biblical claim at all. As an Evangelical

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Speaker 1: Protestant and as a Christian, Mike Huckabee might attach a

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Speaker 1: strong significance to God's promises to the patriarchs, but the

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Speaker 1: early Zionists, who are not Christian, didn't care about this.

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Speaker 1: Theodore Herzel, the founder of modern Zionism, didn't care. Interestingly,

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Speaker 1: the early Zionists weren't even serious about their judaism. The

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Speaker 1: early Zionists were mostly secular, mostly socialists. They rejected biblical

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Speaker 1: claims to the Holy Land. In this respect, they were

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Speaker 1: like Tucker Carlson. Tucker doesn't want them to be the

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Speaker 1: chosen people, and they didn't want to be the chosen

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Speaker 1: people either. Their point is that every other group has

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Speaker 1: a homeland. The Hindus have India, the Muslims have lots

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Speaker 1: of countries. There are many Christian or nominally Christian countries,

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Speaker 1: So why shouldn't the Jews have a country too. In fact,

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Speaker 1: the zion Is considered several alternative locations for a Jewish homeland.

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Speaker 1: They looked at spots and Uganda, Nigeria, Mozambique, Argentina, Australia,

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Speaker 1: and Cyprus. They even looked at attractive land near Niagara Falls. Now,

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Speaker 1: in the end, they settled on the place their ancestors

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Speaker 1: came from. But the fact that they looked elsewhere shows

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Speaker 1: that they claim was not biblical. It was political. Give

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Speaker 1: us a piece of land that we can call our own.

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Speaker 1: That's it. My point, then, is that Israel's legitimacy can

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Speaker 1: be established in purely political and secular terms. I've just

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Speaker 1: tried to do it myself. But even so, just out

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Speaker 1: of curiosity, I thought, let's go down Tucker's rabbit hole.

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Speaker 1: Let's assume God gave the land to Abraham's descendants. Let's

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Speaker 1: even assume that it was the whole Middle from the

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Speaker 1: Euphrates to the Nile. Now what follows from that? Does

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Speaker 1: it mean Israel must run the Palestinians out of Judea

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Speaker 1: and Sabaria the so called West Bank or Gaza. Does

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Speaker 1: it mean Israel must seize Iraq or Jordan or Syria.

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Speaker 1: Here is where Tucker scored his only telling point against Huckabee.

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Speaker 2: So God gave that land to his people, the Jews,

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Speaker 2: or he didn't. You're saying he did. What does that mean?

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Speaker 2: Does Israel have the right to that land? Because you're

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Speaker 2: appealing to Genesis. You're saying that's the original deed.

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Speaker 1: It would be fine if they took it all. But

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Speaker 1: I don't think that's what we're talking about here today.

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Speaker 2: What would be fine, Well, it's exactly what we're talking

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Speaker 2: about today. But here's what I don't think. You think

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Speaker 2: it would be fine if the state of Israel took

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Speaker 2: over all.

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Speaker 1: You don't want to take it over. He got Huckabee

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Speaker 1: to say Israel could take all of it, and this

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Speaker 1: produced something of a furor, as leaders of several Arab

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Speaker 1: countries issued a statement full of bitterness and pomposity denouncing Huckabee.

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Speaker 1: But having a right to something is quite different from

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Speaker 1: exercising that right. Now, I have a right to vote,

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Speaker 1: but I'm not forced to vote. Whether I vote or

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Speaker 1: not has no bearing on my right to do it.

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Speaker 1: So too, having a right to land doesn't mean you

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Speaker 1: should or should not take that land by force. Even

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Speaker 1: if the land is entirely your control, it doesn't follow

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Speaker 1: that you should or should not grant local autonomy to

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Speaker 1: the people who live there. Israel controls Gaza, yet Israel

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Speaker 1: allowed the Arabs in Gaza to elect their own leadership.

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Speaker 1: That's how Hamas gained control over Gaza. Israel let them

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Speaker 1: have it, and by the same token, Israel can maintain

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Speaker 1: a biblical right to the Middle East while conceding that

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Speaker 1: in practical terms, it has no intention of exercising that right.

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Speaker 1: Hukkabi himself made the point that Israel is perfectly content

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Speaker 1: with its current borders as long as those borders are

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Speaker 1: secure from people who want to wipe Israel off the map. Now,

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Speaker 1: I don't think anyone, not even Hukkabi, is seriously contending

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Speaker 1: that Israel should occupy by force the whole Middle East.

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Speaker 1: Biblical rights are by their nature somewhat problematic, because no one,

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Speaker 1: not even the most dedicated pastor or rabbi, can expect

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Speaker 1: a biblical right to be acknowledged by people who don't

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Speaker 1: accept the authority of the Bible to confer such rights.

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Speaker 1: The Israelis know this, which is why they never, or

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Speaker 1: at least hardly ever make their claims on the basis

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Speaker 1: of the Bible. But even so, let's continue our investigation.

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Speaker 1: If God gave the land to Abraham and his descendants,

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Speaker 1: how do we know that today's Jews are the direct

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Speaker 1: descendants of Abraham? Well, in fact, we do not know,

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Speaker 1: and we do not know because we cannot know. Think

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Speaker 1: about it. In order to figure out if today's Jews

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Speaker 1: have the same DNA lineage as Abraham, we need Abraham's DNA.

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Speaker 1: Do we have Abraham's DNA? We do not. There is

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Speaker 1: no way to get Abraham's DNA. So consequently, how is

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Speaker 1: Tucker's criteria even viable in principle? It isn't. Now I've

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Speaker 1: surveyed the academic literature on Jewish ancestry, which is admittedly

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Speaker 1: quite complicated, and here's what we do know. Jews all

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Speaker 1: over the world are descended from Jews who were expelled

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Speaker 1: from ancient Israel and from people who converted to Judaism

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Speaker 1: during the Hellenic period, this is the centuries before Christ.

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Speaker 1: To the degree that such things can be measured, there

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Speaker 1: is a high genetic correlation down to some very specific

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Speaker 1: chromosomal characteristics between Jews now and Jews then. Remarkably, during

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Speaker 1: the Hellenistic and the early Roman period, Jews were active proselytizers,

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Speaker 1: very different from how they are now. Ancient Jews were

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Speaker 1: more like modern Christians and Muslims. They promoted their religion,

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Speaker 1: they tried to make converts. The Jewish historian Josephus estimates

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Speaker 1: the Jews converted ten percent of the Roman Empire, which

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Speaker 1: would be several million people now. Of course, the Jews

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Speaker 1: scattered after seventy eight when the Romans burned Jerusalem and

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Speaker 1: destroyed the Temple. Some Jews migrated to Europe, others to

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Speaker 1: North Africa, others to Asia. This is the great Jewish diaspora.

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Speaker 1: Yet each diaspora group maintained it's Jewish identity and culture.

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Speaker 1: The focus was now on preservation and self protection, not expansion.

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Speaker 1: Jews made some subsequent conversions, but not very many. They intermarried,

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Speaker 1: but not a lot. Mostly they maintain their insularity. They

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Speaker 1: protected their tribal uniqueness. Shakespeare captured this when he had

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Speaker 1: Shylock say he won't eat with Christians. Now, why not

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Speaker 1: because Jews don't mix? Because of Jews mix, Who knows

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Speaker 1: what might come next, God forbid, a Jewish girl might

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Speaker 1: even meet a Christian boy, and of course this is

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Speaker 1: Shakespeare in Irony. Shylock's daughter, her name is Jessica, meets

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Speaker 1: a Christian, she runs away with him, and for Shylock

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Speaker 1: this is traumatic, and this trauma is directly connected to

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Speaker 1: his eventual breakdown into barbarism and his ultimate destruction. Of course,

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Speaker 1: European or Ashkarazi Jews are genetically somewhat different from Asian

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Speaker 1: or Sephardic Jews. Ashkenazi Jews sometimes have blue eyes and

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Speaker 1: blonde hair because they occasionally married white Europeans, so made

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Speaker 1: converts among white European Saphardi Jews are darker in color.

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Speaker 1: They have darker hair and darker eyes. But Ashkenazi and

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Speaker 1: Saphardi Jews are more closely related to each other than

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Speaker 1: they are to outside non Jewish groups. Now, it would

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Speaker 1: be idiotic to expect Jews today to be an exact

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Speaker 1: genetic replica of the Jews of ancient times. Every group

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Speaker 1: has patterns of dispersal, intermarriage, misogenation, new recruits, new converts.

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Speaker 1: This is true of the Irish, the Italians, and Norwegians,

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Speaker 1: and also the Jews. Thus every group experiences some dilution,

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Speaker 1: especially over long periods, in this case, over a period

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Speaker 1: of four thousand years. Since Abraham lived around two thousand BC.

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Speaker 1: The ancient Israelites spoke Hebrew practice Jewish rights, celebrated Jewish holidays,

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Speaker 1: ate horrible Jewish food, and worship Yahweh, the God of Abraham,

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Speaker 1: Isaac and Jacob. Jews today speak Hebrew practice Jewish rights,

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Speaker 1: celebrate Jewish holidays, eat horrible Jewish food, and also worship

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Speaker 1: the religious ones, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

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Speaker 1: So Tucker might choke on this, but that's what it

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Speaker 1: means to be a Jew, and that Tucker might choke

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Speaker 1: on this, but that's what it means to be a Jew.

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Speaker 1: And that's what makes them the legitimate successors of their

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Speaker 1: great great great great great great great great great great

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Speaker 1: grandfather Abraham. And that's the way I see it. If

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Speaker 1: you haven't been following precious metals, well you might want

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Speaker 1: to start look at gold and silver. Gold last year

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five up over five thousand dollars announce, silver

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Speaker 1: over one hundred dollars an ounce, So that means gold

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Speaker 1: is up sixty four percent for the year. Is silver

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Speaker 1: one hundred and fifty percent. Now there's been a little

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Speaker 1: bit of a pullback since then, but that's normal. The

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Speaker 1: reason that people are doing this and the reason central

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Speaker 1: banks are buying gold they don't trust the government, they

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Speaker 1: don't trust the dollar, they don't trust the debt. You

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Speaker 1: need to find out more about this as you figure

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Speaker 1: out your own investments, and I recommend a kit from

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Speaker 1: gold Code. It's the twenty twenty six Kit on Precious Metals,

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Speaker 1: a guide to gold and silver, and there's an easy

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Speaker 1: way to get it. Just go to Dinesh Goold dot com.

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Speaker 1: That's Dinesh Goold dot com. I'm delighted to welcome Congresswoman

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Speaker 1: Nancy Mays. She's running for governor of South Carolina. Nancy, welcome,

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Speaker 1: Thanks for joining me from the beginning. You have been

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Speaker 1: a strong advocate for the full release of the Epstein files,

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Speaker 1: the Epstein information. Bring it out, let everybody see it,

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Speaker 1: let the chips fall where they may. And you're probably

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Speaker 1: as close as anyone to having looked at all this stuff,

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Speaker 1: even from the back end. And so my question to

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Speaker 1: you is, what is this Epstein thing really all about?

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Speaker 1: At the core? What is the Epstein story?

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Speaker 4: The Epstein story is a story of the haves versus

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Speaker 4: the have nots. It's about a two tiered system of

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Speaker 4: justice where the rich and powerful get one version of

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Speaker 4: the system of justice and everybody else gets something very

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Speaker 4: very different. And it's not just about sex trafficking. That

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Speaker 4: is a large part of it. But I believe that

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Speaker 4: there were financial crimes, insire trading crimes, Ponzi schemes. I

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Speaker 4: believe there may have been federal agents involved based on

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Speaker 4: some of the information that I've seen, and that there

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Speaker 4: are dignitaries or world leaders that potentially may be involved

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Speaker 4: with the entire scandal. And that's essentially what it is

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Speaker 4: at the end of the day. It's those that have

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Speaker 4: money and power and those that don't.

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Speaker 1: You suggested that they may even be a sort of

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Speaker 1: intel or spy element to this, that Epstein made be

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Speaker 1: an asset working for our government or a foreign government.

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Speaker 1: Have you seen any evidence that that is in fact

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Speaker 1: the case.

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Speaker 4: Well, I mean, he talks about a CIA dump in

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Speaker 4: some of the email in the files. We know that

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Speaker 4: one of his attorneys got an award from the CIA also,

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Speaker 4: and also in the early two thousands, when Alexander Acosta

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Speaker 4: did that deal where he got one charge one victim,

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Speaker 4: even though they knew there were hundreds of victims. He

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Speaker 4: would not face federal charges. There was something that just

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Speaker 4: overnight snap changed. They went from aggressively investigating him to

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Speaker 4: all of a sudden touching him with kid gloves. And

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Speaker 4: I do believe that he is some sort of an

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Speaker 4: intelligence agent. Maybe it happened after, at least on the

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Speaker 4: CIA side, after they found out all the information that

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Speaker 4: he had on certain leaders around the world, but I

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Speaker 4: wouldn't put it past him to have been an agent

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Speaker 4: of Israel or England to the UK or the United States.

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Speaker 4: I think he was a duel or multiple agent, which

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Speaker 4: is not out of the ordinary. And when they even

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Speaker 4: his attorneys, even Foyd the CIA, who said they can't

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Speaker 4: confirm or deny any files exist of him because it

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Speaker 4: was confidential or classified. So I think there is evidence

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Speaker 4: out there, There are breadcrumbs that he was involved with

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Speaker 4: some sort of way as an intel asset.

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Speaker 1: The whole thing to me seems so weird. You have

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Speaker 1: this guy who's like a math teacher at a prep

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Speaker 1: school and then magically he becomes an investor on Wall

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Speaker 1: Street and the victorious secret guy Wexner puts a bunch

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Speaker 1: of money, a giant amount of money for Epstein to

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Speaker 1: sort of play with, and then suddenly Epstein starts this

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Speaker 1: kind of elaborate ring. Do you have any sense, just

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Speaker 1: from a storyline point of view like this, how does

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Speaker 1: this happen? What is it about Epstein that enabled him

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Speaker 1: to lure people like Bill Gates, people like Prince Andrew.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's not like they needed Epstein to make

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Speaker 1: introductions for them. What was Epstein's kind of secret sauce

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Speaker 1: in your opinion?

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Speaker 4: Well, I think part of it is I've read in

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Speaker 4: both read stories documentaries he was very charismatic as an individual,

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Speaker 4: a little bit of an enigma people where he found

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Speaker 4: people found him interesting for example, and then of course

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Speaker 4: he was loaded. He appeared to have all these relationships,

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Speaker 4: he appeared to have all this money, and people with

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Speaker 4: access and wealth of course want to have more access

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Speaker 4: and wealth because it's a power play at the end

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Speaker 4: of the day. And I think that's part of it.

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Speaker 4: And you know, we're deposing the Clintons this week, and

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Speaker 4: I know people are going to ask, like, who is

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Speaker 4: the girl in the hot tub? Let's the you know,

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Speaker 4: everyone wants to know that, but I actually am very

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Speaker 4: interested in the power structure, the power relationships. What were

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Speaker 4: they getting from each other that was so good? They

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Speaker 4: had to hang out with a convicted pedophile, former president

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Speaker 4: of former prince, you know all these things. I think

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Speaker 4: those are answers people deserve. And also we need to

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Speaker 4: answer why no one has gone to jail there. There

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Speaker 4: are people being arrested in foreign country and we're just

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Speaker 4: sweeping it under the rug. Here. We haven't even released

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Speaker 4: all the files yet.

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Speaker 1: I saw a clip from Hillary Clinton where she was

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Speaker 1: I mean, what's interesting to me is this wasn't just Bill, right,

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Speaker 1: we could kind of make sense of why Bill is

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Speaker 1: in the Epstein files, but Hillary is also active and

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Speaker 1: she's minimizing her connection. She goes, oh, Gilan Maxwell, well,

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Speaker 1: I might have run into her once or twice. But

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Speaker 1: then there's a picture of Gilan Maxwell's standing right there

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Speaker 1: at Chelsea Clinton's wedding. So I think this supports your

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Speaker 1: point that even for Hillary, there was something into it.

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Speaker 1: And now we know, of course that Epstein was apparently

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Speaker 1: pretty instrumental in the founding of the Big Clinton Global

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Speaker 1: Initiative that brought a lot of money into the coffers

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Speaker 1: of the Clintons.

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Speaker 4: A lot of foreign money into the coffers of the Clinton's,

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Speaker 4: which really has never been fully investigated. But how does

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Speaker 4: someone you've only met once or twice end up with

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Speaker 4: an invitation to your daughter's wedding? So either the president

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Speaker 4: or former president's family didn't vet anybody like had instance

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Speaker 4: massive security failure, or she was a close relation to

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Speaker 4: the family for whatever reason, and I think we ought

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Speaker 4: to know why. That reason is she is a pedophile,

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Speaker 4: good Laine Maxwell, she was a sex trafficker. She was

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Speaker 4: part of the operation. She was introducing Epstein to individuals

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Speaker 4: who were then apparently insider trading or part of Ponzi schemes, etc.

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Speaker 4: What was really going on here and why and why

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Speaker 4: was that kind of money being exchanged and what did

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Speaker 4: Epstein get from it? What did the Clintons provide to

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Speaker 4: Epstein as a result of that relationship.

431
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:41,200
Speaker 1: Just recently a few days ago, big news, Prince Andrew

432
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:45,119
Speaker 1: was arrested. Now you've been actually calling for his arrest.

433
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,080
Speaker 1: I personally did not think it was going to happen.

434
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:52,880
Speaker 1: It did happen, and the news reports basically said it

435
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 1: was in connection with improper use of office in relation

436
00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:01,040
Speaker 1: to the Epstein files, Can you tell us what that

437
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,080
Speaker 1: actually means. Are they referring to the fact that he

438
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 1: used his power or what did Prince What is Prince

439
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:11,239
Speaker 1: Andrew arrested for? Well?

440
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,560
Speaker 4: Number one, I want to say, back in September, I

441
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 4: was the only member of Congress to call for his arrest,

442
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 4: and the press called me crazy like they always do,

443
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 4: And it turns out, like so many things, I hit

444
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,480
Speaker 4: the nail on the head a number one, and I'm

445
00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,119
Speaker 4: proud of being out there, out in front and doing

446
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:35,280
Speaker 4: what I believe was morally and ethically correct that call.

447
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:38,160
Speaker 4: And then to see him arrested. Number two, it sounds

448
00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:42,119
Speaker 4: like he was sharing private information. Possibly insider trading is

449
00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:44,919
Speaker 4: what I believe is being alleged in the arrest. What

450
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 4: is typical in England. They get arrested and within a

451
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:49,840
Speaker 4: few hours later, a few days later, they get released

452
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,359
Speaker 4: under investigation. And I believe these are related to potential

453
00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 4: financial crimes, not sex trafficking. And at this point, I

454
00:25:56,800 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 4: don't think it really necessarily matters. Needs to happen one

455
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,919
Speaker 4: way or another, and if it's bad publicity and somebody

456
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:07,440
Speaker 4: loses their job or loses their billions, or loses board

457
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:10,119
Speaker 4: seats or business deals, or someone goes to jail for

458
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:12,440
Speaker 4: a related crime, but not that crime. That is still

459
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:15,040
Speaker 4: a form of justice for those that are victims of

460
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 4: the Epstein debacle.

461
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:22,920
Speaker 1: Was there ever an Epstein list? Because for years people

462
00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 1: have been saying, let's see the Epstein list. Now through

463
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:29,040
Speaker 1: the files, we've got a pretty large number of names,

464
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,960
Speaker 1: some of the European names in America, a bunch of

465
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:37,119
Speaker 1: scientists have been implicated with Epstein. There are some people

466
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,720
Speaker 1: on the right, although it seems like more figures from

467
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:43,919
Speaker 1: the left and from the on the Democratic side. Was

468
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 1: there ever an Epstein list? And are there names still

469
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:50,880
Speaker 1: to come out? You've been looking at the unredacted files.

470
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,480
Speaker 1: What can you tell us about, either in general or

471
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:55,359
Speaker 1: specific terms. What have you found out?

472
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:59,400
Speaker 4: There are several lists, So anyone who says that there

473
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 4: is no list is simply covering it up. That is

474
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,960
Speaker 4: a false statement, That is a lie. Some of the

475
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 4: documents that you see that are completely fully redacted are

476
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 4: simply lists of names. Some of those lists are people

477
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 4: that have been interviewed one, two, three, or four times.

478
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,119
Speaker 4: Some of those individuals are listed as potential co conspirators.

479
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:23,000
Speaker 4: But make no doubt they have lists of people who

480
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:26,400
Speaker 4: are victims, lists who are co conspirators, lists who are perpetrators,

481
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,159
Speaker 4: lists of people who are on the flight logs. That

482
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 4: are plenty of lists to pull this together. But the

483
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 4: other thing I want to mention is that when it

484
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,920
Speaker 4: comes to the co conspirators and the sex trafficking operation,

485
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 4: those names are still redacted. So I'm going over to

486
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 4: the DOJ today, probably tomorrow too. When I go look

487
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 4: up some of these files, especially the ones from the

488
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,640
Speaker 4: Southern District of New York that specifically talk about co conspirators,

489
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,119
Speaker 4: I still die, Nash. I still can't read those names,

490
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,360
Speaker 4: and I have to make educated guesses about who they are.

491
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:02,320
Speaker 1: Isn't it crazy? The pretext before was, well, you know,

492
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 1: we've got some confidential victims who need to be protected.

493
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:09,200
Speaker 1: But what you're saying is that there is a list

494
00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:12,880
Speaker 1: of people that the government was looking into for direct

495
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 1: participation in the scheme, and even to now, not only I,

496
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: but even you haven't seen those names.

497
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 4: That is absolutely one hundred percent correct. And the other

498
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 4: shocking thing is too that I found in the files

499
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 4: there were a lot of women sex trafficking other women,

500
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,440
Speaker 4: and so For me, I see this as women were

501
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,040
Speaker 4: sex trafficking other women and girls and then the men

502
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:38,640
Speaker 4: were participating, and so this needs to be a twofold

503
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,680
Speaker 4: investigation that's going after those that were selling underage girls

504
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 4: and adult women what however you want to describe it

505
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 4: those individuals. Basically, everyone's gotten a deal, everyone walks free,

506
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:52,920
Speaker 4: No one goes to jail. That can't happen here because

507
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 4: I think that people see that as injustice and it's

508
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 4: just the Epstein case relates to a lot of different

509
00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 4: cases across the country, this two tiered system of justice.

510
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 4: But these people need to need to be indicted and

511
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:05,720
Speaker 4: they need to go to jail.

512
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,480
Speaker 1: Now, the women thing is really remarkable. What you're saying

513
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,040
Speaker 1: is it's not just Gilla, and you're saying that there

514
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 1: were other women who played that kind of building trust

515
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:20,239
Speaker 1: with young girl's role. Because I can't think of a

516
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 1: single name, and you're saying names need to come out.

517
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 4: Correct, there are do you know those names? I know

518
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 4: some of those names, and I will be naming those

519
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 4: women that I believe need to come in and answer

520
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,040
Speaker 4: questions before the oversight committee and need to be investigated.

521
00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 4: There's an email that you may be familiar with where

522
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 4: it talks about this new Brazilian nine year old, Well

523
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 4: that was a typo was actually a nineteen year old

524
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 4: and the attachment in that emails a woman who's undressed.

525
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 4: It was a model. But there was an agent at

526
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 4: a French or Parisian modeling agency of female and she

527
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 4: will be named, who was sending images to epscene of

528
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:59,440
Speaker 4: potential victims, I believe, And so it's really disgusting. There's

529
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 4: a special place in hell for women that were providing

530
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 4: Jeffrey Epstein women and girls.

531
00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:09,040
Speaker 1: I think I remember a case even of a Middle Eastern,

532
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: well connected woman who had made some reference in the

533
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 1: emails to providing a girl. This wasn't a group, but

534
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 1: just a single person. And I remember raising mybros And thinking, wow,

535
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:22,640
Speaker 1: this it does look like there is a sort of

536
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 1: larger circuit here. And Dylan Maxwell was maybe the primary

537
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 1: you could call her, you know, product acquisition manager. If

538
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:30,520
Speaker 1: you put a.

539
00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,520
Speaker 4: Crud on Adam, it was a big the number one madam,

540
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 4: I guess you could say. But she was recruiting women

541
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 4: to recruit other women and girls.

542
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,760
Speaker 1: Now some of the Europeans have paid a price already, right,

543
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 1: You've seen some big high level resignations in the UK,

544
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 1: but also I believe one in Norway and maybe a

545
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 1: couple of other other places in America. So far it

546
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:58,400
Speaker 1: has been pretty much public shaming with no further consequences.

547
00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: I think I hear you to be saying, hey, listen,

548
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:02,760
Speaker 1: to the degree that the laws are still in effect

549
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:06,240
Speaker 1: and the statutes haven't expired, we need to prosecute these

550
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: people to the full extent of the law.

551
00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 4: Yes, that is one hundred percent. I don't see much

552
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 4: of an appetite right now by the DOJ to do that,

553
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,240
Speaker 4: which is why I'm advocating for the release of all

554
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 4: the files. You can't hide behind privilege or privileges if

555
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:22,000
Speaker 4: you're not going to prosecute, not going to indict, not

556
00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 4: going to investigate. We're still missing millions of files. I

557
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 4: still think we're missing names because information is redacted. There

558
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 4: are audio and video I don't want to see ce Sam,

559
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:32,960
Speaker 4: but clearly there's video of people going in and out

560
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 4: of I believe massage rooms are coming in and out

561
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 4: of his properties that haven't been disclosed yet, hundreds of cameras.

562
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 4: There must be millions of files that we haven't seen,

563
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 4: terabytes of data that are being hidden from the American

564
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 4: public and from Congress. And at the end of the day,

565
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,440
Speaker 4: I want to know why this was covered up. And

566
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 4: this goes back to the Bush era. I mean we're

567
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:55,440
Speaker 4: talking not just the Obama administration or Biden. This is

568
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,719
Speaker 4: over two decades, and I believe that this is a

569
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 4: cover up. I think it was Perp. I think at

570
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 4: some point the CIA caught on to what he had

571
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 4: and converted him into an intel asset. And that's why

572
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 4: you got that sweetheart deal in Florida and more. Other

573
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 4: countries are doing more than we are to hold these

574
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 4: people accountable. And then when you look at the justice

575
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 4: system overall, if at the federal level we're letting these

576
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:18,760
Speaker 4: rich and powerful people walk free in the Epstein files,

577
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:22,280
Speaker 4: then you trickle on down. Stayed in local although there's

578
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 4: no reason why anybody would put a pedophile in jail

579
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:26,800
Speaker 4: or I was at a murder hearing in a case

580
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 4: last week in South Carolina, and I got when the

581
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 4: judge was going to rule against the family. I showed

582
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 4: up and did what I could to advocate for that family,

583
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 4: and the judge ruled in the right way. But you know,

584
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 4: you shouldn't just have to show up to court and

585
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,040
Speaker 4: get masses of people to show up in a court

586
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 4: room to get justice right. And I think it's just

587
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 4: a sense of the system is broken and we have

588
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 4: to fix it at the top so everybody knows at

589
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,040
Speaker 4: the state level on down that this doesn't slide anymore.

590
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 4: We don't just sweep it under the rug that when

591
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 4: people do bad things, they're investigated, they get indicted, there's

592
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 4: a hearing, there's a trial, they go to jail. We

593
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 4: need a system of justice in this country.

594
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 1: One surprising element to me, Nancy, from the files is

595
00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 1: the number of nerdy scientists and tech guys, I mean academics,

596
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:14,880
Speaker 1: A bunch of guys from Harvard uh. And it looks like,

597
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:17,000
Speaker 1: I mean, Bill Gates is probably the best sort of

598
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 1: exemplar of this, and a little bit of a surprise

599
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 1: because you don't, you know, you might expect powerful business guys,

600
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:28,560
Speaker 1: powerful political figures or diplomats, but to see these nerdy

601
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: academics in a very active circuit with Epstein is a

602
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 1: little strange. Do you think it is just basically the

603
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 1: phenomenon of the very weird kid who gets no attention

604
00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: from the girls in school and then here comes Epstein

605
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 1: and goes, hey, listen, you know I can fulfill your

606
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 1: wildest dreams, and you're going to be you know, you're

607
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 1: going to be the guy with the hot chick. Is

608
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:51,320
Speaker 1: is that what's going on here with these with these

609
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 1: nerdy scientists.

610
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:55,480
Speaker 4: It seems like here's the nerdy guy, the nerdy billionaire

611
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,239
Speaker 4: with the hot Russian model or whomever, you know, a

612
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:00,680
Speaker 4: foreign girl. I think that. I'm I think that's part

613
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 4: of it. I mean, you read that about that all

614
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 4: the time. There's nothing I think unusual about it. It's

615
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,560
Speaker 4: just a perk of being a billionaire, I suppose, but

616
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,839
Speaker 4: as long as it didn't implicate underage women, right. And

617
00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 4: I watched the interview with Melinda Gates, which is why

618
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,160
Speaker 4: I said, we need Bill Gates to come before the

619
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 4: Oversight Committee. I believe he's got questions that need to

620
00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 4: have answers based on her interview and that information. You know,

621
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 4: I want to get to the bottom of it. I

622
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:25,919
Speaker 4: don't care if you have a bee by your name

623
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,960
Speaker 4: for billions, or if you're a Republican or a Democrat

624
00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:31,520
Speaker 4: or a former president whatever it is, or a dignitary.

625
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:34,920
Speaker 4: We got to expose what's going on. And people have

626
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 4: to go. This is an end until people go to jail.

627
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:39,840
Speaker 4: This is going to be around for a while until

628
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 4: our country does the right thing.

629
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:43,840
Speaker 1: One last question, Nancy, and that is there was a

630
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: detail in the file about an FBI agent who kind

631
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 1: of went in and swapped out the recording device in

632
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:57,240
Speaker 1: the jail where Epstein was being held. Now, I've heard

633
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:01,800
Speaker 1: cash mattel Bongino say, Hey, they're satisfied that Epstein killed himself.

634
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:04,799
Speaker 1: I'm not satisfied. Are you satisfied?

635
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:08,719
Speaker 4: No, I'm not And I don't believe that Epstein killed himself. Now,

636
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 4: there were no pictures of him hanging, you know, on

637
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 4: his he was on his knees, Like how do you

638
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 4: break your neck when you're weight of your body's on

639
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 4: the floor. And the noose was like an inch or

640
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 4: two wide. It was like basically a single sheet that

641
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 4: was cut or stripped down, and it looked like it

642
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:27,400
Speaker 4: was three times the size.

643
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 1: Of his neck.

644
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 4: Like, I just you know these things on ADAP and

645
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 4: then all of a sudden, the data is whpe, the

646
00:35:32,239 --> 00:35:35,360
Speaker 4: cameras are white. The video. You have the biggest death

647
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 4: in prison history and at least in our lifetime, and

648
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,360
Speaker 4: you erase the video, you erase the data, and all

649
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 4: of a sudden, two weeks ago, there's a new video

650
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 4: that pops up that shows something orange, some kind of

651
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:47,719
Speaker 4: orange prison uniform, going up the stairs the night of

652
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 4: his death. No, I don't believe that he was that

653
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 4: he killed himself. And then you have the marks on

654
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 4: his neck that were midneck. If you're hanging yourself, my

655
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 4: understanding is from forensics, then marks would be above your

656
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:00,920
Speaker 4: chin or right under your chin. First is breaking bones

657
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 4: here midneck is more of a strangulation type of death,

658
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 4: which that's more believable to me, that he was strangled

659
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 4: to death than he committed suicide.

660
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: Nancy Mays, thank you very much, thank you, and God bless.

661
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:18,439
Speaker 2: Hey.

662
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:21,840
Speaker 1: I'm now on substack. It's kind of full circle for me.

663
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: I started out as a journalist, writing articles for National Review,

664
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:29,720
Speaker 1: the American Spectator, the Washington Post, lots of places. After

665
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 1: my stint in the Reagan White House, I pivoted to

666
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:34,879
Speaker 1: writing books, and that was way back in nineteen ninety one.

667
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 1: So I've been mainly known as an author and of

668
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:41,440
Speaker 1: course later as a filmmaker. But my first job journalist,

669
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:44,759
Speaker 1: and now I'm getting back to that on substack you'll

670
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:51,000
Speaker 1: get original articles on commentary, groundbreaking investigations, exclusive access to

671
00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:54,520
Speaker 1: film clips and show clips, and guess what, it's free.

672
00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 1: So check it out. Go to Dinesh DESUSA dot substack

673
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:07,400
Speaker 1: dot com. Roger Stone hardly needs any introduction. He is

674
00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 1: a legendary political strategist and also an author. And I

675
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:20,160
Speaker 1: was yesterday on Roger's radio show talking about the Epstein

676
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,960
Speaker 1: files and Steve Bannon, and I'm delighted to welcome Roger

677
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:29,239
Speaker 1: to my show. Roger. For many conservatives, they were very

678
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 1: surprised to see not just that Bannon is in these files,

679
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 1: but he's like all over them. There's a kind of

680
00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:42,480
Speaker 1: massive traffic, a buddy buddy swapping of ideas and suggestions

681
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:47,719
Speaker 1: and mutual self promotion going on in these files. And

682
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:51,160
Speaker 1: now Bannon, after kind of laying low for a little

683
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:54,400
Speaker 1: bit and maybe hoping for this storm to blow away,

684
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:58,880
Speaker 1: has come out and said, guess what, guys, I've merely

685
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:04,399
Speaker 1: been doing research for a film on Epstein. Now can

686
00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:08,279
Speaker 1: we begin by having you comment on the plausibility of

687
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: this research explanation?

688
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:16,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's of course ludicrous. Just right up front, I

689
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 5: think everybody understands what My essential beef with Steve Bannon

690
00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 5: is he and I both testified before the House Intelligence

691
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:30,239
Speaker 5: Committee under oath, and in his testimony he was specifically

692
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:34,920
Speaker 5: asked whether he had ever discussed Wiki leak's Julian Assange

693
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:39,919
Speaker 5: or the allegedly stolen emails with me, and he said, no, never,

694
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 5: on no occasion that was in fact the truth. You

695
00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:47,279
Speaker 5: can imagine my surprise when I was put on a

696
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 5: Soviet style show trial by the Mueller Brigade, when Steve

697
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 5: Bannon showed up as their surprise witness, swept to the

698
00:38:57,640 --> 00:39:01,440
Speaker 5: witness stand dressed kind of like a fat Johnny Cash,

699
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 5: all in black, a lot of dandruff, wouldn't look me

700
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 5: in the eye. But then when asked the exact same question,

701
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:11,520
Speaker 5: he said, oh, yes, I discussed it with Roger Stone

702
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:16,320
Speaker 5: in every phone conversation we had in twenty sixteen. Now,

703
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 5: Jonathan Turley, the very renowned George Washington University law professor,

704
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 5: looked at both transcripts and said that Steve had diametrically

705
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:31,839
Speaker 5: contradicted himself under oath. That was the beginning of the

706
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:35,279
Speaker 5: end as far as my concerns about Steve Bannon. Then

707
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:39,279
Speaker 5: I noticed that almost immediately after he was fired by

708
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:44,760
Speaker 5: President Trump, he popped up at Jeffrey Epstein's private home

709
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 5: in New York City, which, by the way, is the

710
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:53,400
Speaker 5: single most valuable private single residence in Manhattan. So I

711
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:57,440
Speaker 5: knew there was more to this. And now these incredible

712
00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 5: emails that detailed well, not a man doing research, but

713
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 5: a man a I think, searching for money and be

714
00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 5: seeking to coach Epstein through the making of a documentary

715
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:16,840
Speaker 5: on his rehabilitation. So I ask you what kind of

716
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 5: man reaches out to a convicted sex criminal and coaches

717
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 5: him on how he can recover his public rehabilitation.

718
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 1: Well, Roger, you and I both have had some dealings

719
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: with Ben and I think this is helpful because if

720
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: we hadn't and we just saw the files, we'd be like,

721
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:41,800
Speaker 1: all right, well that stuff is all out there. Maybe

722
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:44,839
Speaker 1: there's some explanation. But it's always helpful when you've had

723
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:47,480
Speaker 1: some direct contact with somebody, because then you can sort

724
00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:51,440
Speaker 1: of measure the public information against your own experience. In

725
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:55,759
Speaker 1: my own case, going back to really twenty eleven, when

726
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:59,319
Speaker 1: I was first making Obama's America, my very first documentary film,

727
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 1: and I was of course completely in the dark about

728
00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 1: how to go about doing this. Somebody said, well, you

729
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:07,279
Speaker 1: need to see this guy, Steve Bannon. He's got a

730
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:09,960
Speaker 1: film company. And so I sat down with Ben and

731
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 1: and basically Bannon offered to me the following proposition. He said, look,

732
00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:16,360
Speaker 1: why don't you go out there and raise the money

733
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 1: for this film and go ahead and make the film

734
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:24,000
Speaker 1: and be the narrator of the film and sort of

735
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:26,960
Speaker 1: get it ready, and then just sign over the rights

736
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 1: to me, meaning to Steve Bannon. This was one of

737
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 1: the strangest business propositions I've ever heard. I was befuddled

738
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:38,120
Speaker 1: at the time. Thankfully I didn't accept the deal, but

739
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:40,319
Speaker 1: of course, years later, knowing what I know, and of

740
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:42,879
Speaker 1: course knowing the massive success of that film it took

741
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:46,680
Speaker 1: in almost forty million dollars between the theater and digital

742
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,239
Speaker 1: and DVD and all that. I mean, this was a

743
00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:52,920
Speaker 1: straight out effort to rip it off, I mean to

744
00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: rip me off. And so I realized over the years

745
00:41:56,640 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 1: that this is a very slippery character, and that if

746
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:03,359
Speaker 1: Steve Bannon comes over to dinner, you know, you better

747
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 1: count your spoons.

748
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:08,399
Speaker 5: There's no doubt about it. Look, this is the same

749
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:14,640
Speaker 5: Steve Bannon who pled guilty to defrauding fifteen million dollars

750
00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 5: worth of donors to the Build the Wall Foundation. His

751
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 5: two co conspirators in that served long jail times, but

752
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:30,640
Speaker 5: for some strange reason, Steve pled guilty in Manhattan, the

753
00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:36,600
Speaker 5: most hostile jurisdiction for any Trumpe supporter, Republican free thinker

754
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:40,279
Speaker 5: in the country, and he got no jail time. That's

755
00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 5: very very curious. By the way, that crime had nothing

756
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:48,879
Speaker 5: whatsoever to do with Donald Trump. Then he goes on

757
00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 5: his new financial patron after he is fired by Donald Trump,

758
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:59,920
Speaker 5: seemingly doesn't get any funding from Jeffrey Epstein. Although we

759
00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:03,239
Speaker 5: don't know that. I don't think he was doing fifteen

760
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:09,040
Speaker 5: hours of videotaping for free, nor providing his coaching services

761
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,880
Speaker 5: for free. We know that he goes on to be

762
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:17,680
Speaker 5: charged as an unindicted co conspirator in the one billion

763
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:22,359
Speaker 5: dollar fraud perpetrated by his next financial patron, a man

764
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:27,680
Speaker 5: named Miles Guah. Now he's an unindicted co conspirator in

765
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:32,040
Speaker 5: that billion dollar fraud case, but once again, Steve Bidden

766
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:36,839
Speaker 5: himself is not prosecuted. I find this very curious. But Denesh,

767
00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:39,880
Speaker 5: the thing that is most shocking to me is that

768
00:43:39,880 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 5: Steve goes on the air on the war Room, a

769
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,560
Speaker 5: name that he stole from my show with Owen Schreyer

770
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,280
Speaker 5: on the on Info Wars, which appeared for over eighteen

771
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 5: months every day at five o'clock Eastern, So he kind

772
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,200
Speaker 5: of ripped off the name of our show. But on

773
00:43:56,239 --> 00:44:00,160
Speaker 5: his show he professes to be an unalloyed supporter of

774
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 5: President Donald Trump. But in these emails, he calls Trump stupid,

775
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 5: he calls for Trump's removal under the twenty fifth Amendment,

776
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:15,840
Speaker 5: he brads about undercutting President Trump's China trade policy, and

777
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 5: most interestingly, he says that he Steve Bannon, not Donald Trump.

778
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:24,160
Speaker 5: He Bannon is a centerpiece of the MAGA movement.

779
00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:28,839
Speaker 1: With the files themselves. I thought it's significant, and it's

780
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:33,240
Speaker 1: worth mentioning that there's no implication here that Steve Bannon

781
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:36,680
Speaker 1: is involved in any of the sex business with the

782
00:44:36,760 --> 00:44:41,560
Speaker 1: underage girls. The communication is entirely sort of a buddy

783
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 1: buddy and a business type, but there's also a friendly

784
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,000
Speaker 1: quality to it, and Bannon, as you said at one point,

785
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:55,759
Speaker 1: is very much coaching Epstein sort of here's how you

786
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:59,440
Speaker 1: should make your case, here's how you should dispel the

787
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:06,520
Speaker 1: whole pedophile image. And conversely, it seems like Epstein is

788
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:10,200
Speaker 1: giving ben In career advice because he says to Bean

789
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:12,920
Speaker 1: and things like, well, listen, you might want to consider

790
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 1: becoming more of a journalist because you're seeing more as

791
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 1: a political operator. But you can probably pull off the

792
00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:24,480
Speaker 1: stuff you're doing more easily under the banner of I'm

793
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,200
Speaker 1: a journalist. I'm just asking questions. So I think it's

794
00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:30,880
Speaker 1: really fascinating that these two guys are trying to boost

795
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:32,279
Speaker 1: each other's careers.

796
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:38,000
Speaker 5: I think that's a very very accurate reading of it.

797
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,960
Speaker 5: And yesterday for the first time ever, and there's a

798
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 5: lot of material here to go through. It takes hours

799
00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:48,040
Speaker 5: because they although they have not published everything, they published

800
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:51,440
Speaker 5: a great deal. It does appear to me like Bannon

801
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:56,120
Speaker 5: went to Epstein's island. There is no doubt that in

802
00:45:56,200 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 5: the email records you can see that Epstein made a

803
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:05,080
Speaker 5: a commercial flight reservation for Steve Bannon and twenty eighteen

804
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 5: to fly to the Virgin Islands, and he says within

805
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:13,120
Speaker 5: the email Bannon will be staying with me, presumably staying

806
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 5: on the island. So I think a very good question

807
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:19,840
Speaker 5: for Steve Bannon today, among many others, is did you

808
00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:22,760
Speaker 5: visit the island? And if you did visit the island,

809
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:26,400
Speaker 5: why did you visit the island? We know, based on

810
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,359
Speaker 5: the emails, that he was to visit the island two

811
00:46:29,440 --> 00:46:35,800
Speaker 5: days after Epstein was arrested, that trip being canceled. Now

812
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:41,399
Speaker 5: they've released two hours of the fifteen hours of the

813
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:44,680
Speaker 5: videotape that they did together. I'd like to see them

814
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:47,160
Speaker 5: release all of it because I think what you're going

815
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 5: to see is Steve Bannon coaching, as he does in

816
00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:57,160
Speaker 5: the emails, repeatedly coaching Jeffrey Epstein on how to redo

817
00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:01,840
Speaker 5: his image as a sexual check predator, as a child

818
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:07,839
Speaker 5: sex trafficker. Kind of a kinder gentler, Jeffrey Epstein, if

819
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:11,719
Speaker 5: you will. The whole thing is exceedingly creepy. But I

820
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:17,160
Speaker 5: don't understand how Steve believes he will now run for president.

821
00:47:17,600 --> 00:47:21,239
Speaker 5: It's pretty funny with all of these questions and not

822
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 5: have to answer them. You know, It's one thing to

823
00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:29,319
Speaker 5: be in the totally contained atmosphere of your own podcast,

824
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:33,000
Speaker 5: where you control the questions and you control your guests,

825
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:35,360
Speaker 5: But when you get out there on the hustings and

826
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:38,240
Speaker 5: you try to run for president, you have people answer

827
00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 5: questions any questions, and I don't think he can stand

828
00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 5: up to those questions.

829
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:44,000
Speaker 4: Roger.

830
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:46,760
Speaker 1: There's probably going to be some people watching this who

831
00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:51,759
Speaker 1: will say, man, Roger, man, denish. Don't you realize that

832
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 1: Bannon has been a big fighter for MAGA. Don't you

833
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:58,719
Speaker 1: realize that he's used the war room in a very

834
00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:03,960
Speaker 1: effective way to mobilized people. Why are you going after

835
00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:07,240
Speaker 1: this guy? Why don't we just sort of leave him alone?

836
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:11,000
Speaker 1: Maybe there's some explanation, Maybe there really isn't. Maybe he

837
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 1: made an error of judgment, But why are we piling

838
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:18,120
Speaker 1: on somebody who is quote on our side, to which

839
00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 1: you say, what, Well.

840
00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:22,920
Speaker 5: In my case may be a little different than your tsh.

841
00:48:23,480 --> 00:48:25,799
Speaker 5: He tried to send me to prison for seven to

842
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:29,759
Speaker 5: nine years for something I never did. I took three

843
00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:33,799
Speaker 5: different polygraph tests on that narrow question as to whether

844
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:37,120
Speaker 5: I had ever discussed what he leaks. And this entire

845
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:42,440
Speaker 5: false narrative put forward by the Democrats that the Democrat

846
00:48:42,560 --> 00:48:45,480
Speaker 5: National Committee have been the target of a hacked by

847
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:49,239
Speaker 5: Russian intelligence. By the way, there's no evidence of whatsoever.

848
00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:54,400
Speaker 5: That is a contrivance of John Brennan's brain, completely and

849
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:57,480
Speaker 5: totally false. But in my case, the judge would not

850
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:01,480
Speaker 5: allow me to produce expert test money from Billbinni, the

851
00:49:01,560 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 5: leading counter intelligence CIA operative of all time, would not

852
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:11,720
Speaker 5: allow me to produce forensic evidence, would approve definitively there

853
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:15,239
Speaker 5: was no online hack of the DNC, not by the

854
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,120
Speaker 5: Russians or by anything anyone else. And to the extent

855
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 5: that information had been stolen, it had been downloaded to

856
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 5: portable discs and taken out the backyard. So the Bible

857
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:32,360
Speaker 5: teaches us to forgive, it, doesn't teach us to forget.

858
00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:36,160
Speaker 5: I've forgiven Steve Bannon for the fact that he tried

859
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:38,560
Speaker 5: to send me to prison for seven to nine years

860
00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 5: and destroy my life. But I haven't forgotten it because

861
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 5: it is a cautionary tale for others who might think

862
00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:49,680
Speaker 5: about getting involved with him. And then there's a whole

863
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:52,640
Speaker 5: additional question which we haven't got into yet, which is

864
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 5: Steve's relationship with the very strange Chinese national Miles Glow,

865
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:03,759
Speaker 5: who find finances the war Room and his other operations

866
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:07,440
Speaker 5: after he leaves and is fired by the Trump administration,

867
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:12,040
Speaker 5: and where that money came from and what the purpose

868
00:50:12,239 --> 00:50:16,960
Speaker 5: of the money was. Mister Guoh in a federal proceeding

869
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:21,919
Speaker 5: in New York. When asked fifty five times what the

870
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:25,120
Speaker 5: source of that money is and what his relationships is

871
00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:30,240
Speaker 5: with William G who is a low level Communist Party

872
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:36,000
Speaker 5: Chinese Communist Party functionary, he takes the fifth fifty five times.

873
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:39,600
Speaker 5: Now I've seen the telephone records that show that mister

874
00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 5: Bennon spoke to mister G some ninety five times. They

875
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 5: should call toll records. They don't tell you the substance

876
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:50,400
Speaker 5: of the call, only the call was made. So I

877
00:50:50,440 --> 00:50:53,239
Speaker 5: think there's a lot more here to dig into. But

878
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 5: this is not the person who should be the leader

879
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 5: of the MAGA movement post Trump, to say, the lead Roger.

880
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:04,640
Speaker 1: I want to highlight this is based on a previous

881
00:51:04,680 --> 00:51:07,319
Speaker 1: conversation that you and I had a little detail that

882
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:12,960
Speaker 1: I think gives people some idea of how traumatic this

883
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:18,120
Speaker 1: kind of political persecution is against you and your family

884
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,239
Speaker 1: that in some way, Steve Bannon, as you say, tried

885
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:26,360
Speaker 1: to make a lot worse. You came with your wife

886
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,439
Speaker 1: to the premiere of my film Police State, which has

887
00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:35,440
Speaker 1: an opening scene of an FBI truck approaching a family

888
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:40,120
Speaker 1: that is placidly eating dinner together, and then in a sense,

889
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:43,600
Speaker 1: all hell breaks loose. The FBI agents are all over

890
00:51:43,640 --> 00:51:48,359
Speaker 1: the place. Everybody is screaming that children are terrified. Can

891
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:52,319
Speaker 1: you describe the effect of watching that opening scene on

892
00:51:52,440 --> 00:51:53,120
Speaker 1: your wife?

893
00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:59,920
Speaker 5: First of all, Denise, you're an extraordinarily effective and powerful filmmaker,

894
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 5: and that scene was so disturbing to her she ran

895
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,800
Speaker 5: to the ladies room, where she vomited and she couldn't

896
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:11,040
Speaker 5: come out for a while. It was that emotionally trying.

897
00:52:11,960 --> 00:52:16,600
Speaker 5: You really can't explain what it's like when twenty nine

898
00:52:16,680 --> 00:52:20,840
Speaker 5: heavily armed FBI agents storm your home at six o'clock

899
00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:24,279
Speaker 5: in the morning, when they bring a battering ram up

900
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:29,839
Speaker 5: to your front door, when they arrive in seventeen armored vehicles,

901
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:34,320
Speaker 5: including two amphibious units. Because I lived on a canal

902
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 5: at that time in Fort Lauderdale, my home was completely

903
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:45,560
Speaker 5: surrounded by FBI agents brandishing M four fully automatic assault weapons.

904
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:49,520
Speaker 5: They pound on your front door as if you're not

905
00:52:49,600 --> 00:52:53,799
Speaker 5: going to answer it. Then they purp walked me out

906
00:52:53,840 --> 00:52:56,200
Speaker 5: in the street. Okay, fine, I'm at least charged with

907
00:52:56,239 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 5: a crime, despite the fact that it is not a

908
00:52:58,640 --> 00:53:03,160
Speaker 5: legitimate one. Then dragging my wife out into the street

909
00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:07,280
Speaker 5: inner night clothes, making your stand twenty five feet away

910
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:10,680
Speaker 5: from me, taking away our cell phones. Of course, then

911
00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:14,600
Speaker 5: they ransacked my house for thirteen hours, looking for evidence

912
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:19,000
Speaker 5: of the Russian collusion that literally does not exist. They

913
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:23,279
Speaker 5: destroyed my home, and then of course they they bankrupt you.

914
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:28,440
Speaker 5: I lost my savings, my insurance, my car, my ability

915
00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:31,920
Speaker 5: to make a living, because like you, I make a

916
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:37,840
Speaker 5: living reading, speaking, writing, producing video. But I was banned

917
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:41,960
Speaker 5: from doing any of that. So they try to pressure

918
00:53:42,040 --> 00:53:47,000
Speaker 5: you into false testimony. This was what this was real about.

919
00:53:47,080 --> 00:53:50,400
Speaker 5: There's no real crime here on my part. There's no

920
00:53:50,520 --> 00:53:53,640
Speaker 5: Russian collusion to lie about. So what would be my

921
00:53:53,800 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 5: motive to lie if there's no underlying crime? To violate

922
00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:03,320
Speaker 5: the false statement, your a lie has to be wilful

923
00:54:03,440 --> 00:54:06,560
Speaker 5: and it has to be material. I did make mistakes

924
00:54:06,600 --> 00:54:10,600
Speaker 5: in my testimony, but none of them hid any underlying crime.

925
00:54:11,120 --> 00:54:16,360
Speaker 5: It is a wrenching, horrific experience. And it is only

926
00:54:16,400 --> 00:54:19,400
Speaker 5: the fact that I returned to the church. It is

927
00:54:19,480 --> 00:54:21,720
Speaker 5: only the fact that I was redeemed in the blood

928
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 5: of the cross. It is only the fact that I

929
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:28,640
Speaker 5: prayed for the mercy of God Almighty. That President Donald

930
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:32,359
Speaker 5: Trump saw that I was being politically persecuted, saw that

931
00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:35,560
Speaker 5: I was being squeezed to beget me to testify falsely

932
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:39,960
Speaker 5: against him, and gave me a full and unconditional pardon

933
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,919
Speaker 5: so I could begin rebuilding my life. But yes, your

934
00:54:44,040 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 5: film was a gut wrenching experience for both my wife

935
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 5: and I and actually temporarily made her ill.

936
00:54:52,239 --> 00:54:54,880
Speaker 1: Roger, do you think that the reason that Bannon was

937
00:54:54,920 --> 00:54:59,080
Speaker 1: willing to be a kind of well dishonest hit man

938
00:54:59,760 --> 00:55:04,680
Speaker 1: for are Mueller against you? What did he get out

939
00:55:04,719 --> 00:55:04,960
Speaker 1: of it?

940
00:55:06,719 --> 00:55:11,319
Speaker 5: Well, technically, of course, the government had an obligation to

941
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:14,880
Speaker 5: tell my defense lawyers that at the time of Abandon's

942
00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:20,239
Speaker 5: testimony he was under investigation himself in the Build the

943
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:25,680
Speaker 5: Wall matter, where he was charged specifically with defrauding investors

944
00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:29,120
Speaker 5: out of fifteen million dollars. By These aren't big rich people,

945
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:34,239
Speaker 5: by the way, these are small dollar donors. So my

946
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:37,360
Speaker 5: guess is he thought perhaps that if he had lied

947
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:40,000
Speaker 5: in his testimony against me, if he'd done with the

948
00:55:40,040 --> 00:55:45,440
Speaker 5: prosecutors wanted that they might have given him a break. Indeed,

949
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:50,640
Speaker 5: they indicted him anyway, so it was all for nought.

950
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:53,839
Speaker 5: But I think that was his motive at the time.

951
00:55:53,880 --> 00:55:57,560
Speaker 5: Perhaps he saw me as a political rival, since I

952
00:55:57,640 --> 00:56:04,200
Speaker 5: have extensively more campaign strategic and experience than he will

953
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:06,399
Speaker 5: ever have. In fact, I don't think he knows much

954
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:09,279
Speaker 5: about this at all, so that may have been a

955
00:56:09,600 --> 00:56:17,080
Speaker 5: secondary motive. But what he did is horrific. But what

956
00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:20,040
Speaker 5: he did to Donald Trump is even worse. In these emails,

957
00:56:20,520 --> 00:56:22,840
Speaker 5: he calls for the use of the twenty fifth Amendment

958
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:27,360
Speaker 5: to remove Donald Trump. He also calls for replacing Donald

959
00:56:27,400 --> 00:56:33,760
Speaker 5: Trump with Mike Pompeo, the ultimate globalist. Mike Pompeo, who

960
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:39,799
Speaker 5: the recent disclosures declassified documents by Telsey Gabbert show us

961
00:56:40,239 --> 00:56:44,160
Speaker 5: knew in advance that the Russian collusion hoax was coming

962
00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:48,320
Speaker 5: and did not bother to warn his boss, President Donald

963
00:56:48,360 --> 00:56:50,160
Speaker 5: Trump that Mike Pompeo.

964
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 1: Roger Stone, thank you very much for joining me.

965
00:56:55,880 --> 00:56:58,160
Speaker 5: This has been a great interview. I hope most people

966
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:01,000
Speaker 5: more people by the way, excellent rection to our radio

967
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:04,040
Speaker 5: interview yesterday, one of the biggest shows I've ever done

968
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:09,320
Speaker 5: there at seventy seven WABC. My hat is off to you, Denesh.

969
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:12,560
Speaker 5: As a filmmaker, I'm a huge fan and I'm very

970
00:57:12,600 --> 00:57:15,279
Speaker 5: excited about your new show, Denesh. So I'm honored to

971
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:15,960
Speaker 5: be here today.

972
00:57:16,560 --> 00:57:23,560
Speaker 1: Thank you so We all know that Steve Bannon was

973
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:29,400
Speaker 1: talking to Epstein about doing this promotional film to defend Epstein,

974
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:33,440
Speaker 1: but we haven't seen the film. So to help Steve out,

975
00:57:33,840 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 1: I've done for him a trailer of this upcoming blockbuster.

976
00:57:42,120 --> 00:57:46,280
Speaker 1: Bannon Productions presents a film that will shatter the lines.

977
00:57:47,040 --> 00:57:50,720
Speaker 1: This is the true story of Jeffrey Epstein.

978
00:57:51,520 --> 00:57:53,280
Speaker 4: I empowered young women, Okay.

979
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 5: I mentored them in entrepreneurship and connected them with movers

980
00:57:57,120 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 5: and shakers.

981
00:57:58,000 --> 00:57:59,600
Speaker 1: He gave them hope.

982
00:57:59,800 --> 00:58:02,480
Speaker 4: If I had never met Jeffrey, I'd still be an inceel.

983
00:58:02,880 --> 00:58:05,760
Speaker 1: He gave the involuntary celibate purpose.

984
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:07,920
Speaker 4: He's an inspiration.

985
00:58:08,920 --> 00:58:11,400
Speaker 5: With Jeffrey, there is always a happy ending.

986
00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:21,080
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein is the humanitarian step into the world of

987
00:58:21,120 --> 00:58:23,800
Speaker 1: the Dragon's Prophecy on a tour of the ancient land

988
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:26,440
Speaker 1: of Israel. I'm Denesh Jesuza, and I'm inviting you to

989
00:58:26,520 --> 00:58:29,960
Speaker 1: join me and Jonathan Kahn for the Dragon's Prophecy Tour.

990
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:33,480
Speaker 1: We'll walk the ancient streets of Jerusalem and visit iconic

991
00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:36,800
Speaker 1: landmarks like the Western Wall, the Sea of Galilee, and

992
00:58:36,840 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 1: the Mount of Olives, exploring the real world settings behind

993
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:42,960
Speaker 1: the mysteries and what they reveal about the days we're

994
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:46,600
Speaker 1: living in Book now at inspiration travel dot com, slash

995
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:50,600
Speaker 1: dragon or call eight four four seven one five two

996
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:58,360
Speaker 1: four two five. Hillary Clinton was interviewed by the BBC

997
00:58:58,640 --> 00:59:01,560
Speaker 1: about Jeffrey Epstein. I was not ready for what she

998
00:59:01,720 --> 00:59:02,280
Speaker 1: had to say.

999
00:59:03,120 --> 00:59:07,320
Speaker 6: We have a very clear record that we've been willing

1000
00:59:07,360 --> 00:59:10,360
Speaker 6: to talk about. My husband has said he took some

1001
00:59:11,640 --> 00:59:14,040
Speaker 6: rides on the airplane for his charitable work.

1002
00:59:14,280 --> 00:59:15,240
Speaker 1: Charitable work.

1003
00:59:15,520 --> 00:59:17,360
Speaker 6: I don't recall ever meeting him.

1004
00:59:17,880 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 2: Did you have a meet Delay and Maxwell?

1005
00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:21,640
Speaker 6: I did on a few occasions.

1006
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:26,160
Speaker 1: Sounds like she barely knew her. But if so, why

1007
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:29,360
Speaker 1: is Gillan Maxwell at Chelsea Clinton's wedding?

1008
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:34,040
Speaker 6: Thousands of people go to the Clinton Global Initiative.

1009
00:59:34,240 --> 00:59:36,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I don't see those thousands of people at

1010
00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:45,600
Speaker 1: your daughter's wedding. What a liar. Just recently, Barack Obama

1011
00:59:45,640 --> 00:59:48,320
Speaker 1: went on a podcast and spoke out against, you know,

1012
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:52,240
Speaker 1: the weaponization of the government. I kid you not.

1013
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:57,760
Speaker 7: Yeah, we don't want, you know, kangaroo courts and trumped

1014
00:59:57,800 --> 01:00:01,680
Speaker 7: up charges. That's what happens in other places that we

1015
01:00:01,760 --> 01:00:07,200
Speaker 7: used to scold, Yeah for doing that. We want like

1016
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 7: our court system, and our Justice Department and our prosecutors

1017
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:13,919
Speaker 7: to be and our FBI to be just playing things

1018
01:00:13,960 --> 01:00:17,200
Speaker 7: straight and looking at the facts and not meddling in

1019
01:00:18,040 --> 01:00:20,680
Speaker 7: politics the way we've seen later.

1020
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:24,320
Speaker 1: Yes, Well, in twenty twelve, I made a film called

1021
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:28,600
Speaker 1: Obama's America that got into Obama's world and into his head.

1022
01:00:28,960 --> 01:00:32,200
Speaker 1: I interviewed Obama's half brother, George Obama, who was living

1023
01:00:32,240 --> 01:00:35,760
Speaker 1: in slum conditions in Nairobi. Obama was going around saying,

1024
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:39,240
Speaker 1: we are our brother's keeper. But I exposed how he

1025
01:00:39,320 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 1: had not lifted a finger to help his own brother. Yeah,

1026
01:00:43,640 --> 01:00:47,360
Speaker 1: I ticked off the vindictive, narcissist Obama. How do I

1027
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:50,200
Speaker 1: know that? Because he was bashing me almost daily on

1028
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:53,960
Speaker 1: his website, Barack Obama dot com. And a few weeks

1029
01:00:54,000 --> 01:00:57,320
Speaker 1: after my film was released, the FBI was banging at

1030
01:00:57,400 --> 01:01:01,360
Speaker 1: my door. The Obama DOJ prossecutcuted me for a campaign

1031
01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:04,840
Speaker 1: finance violation, essentially giving away too much of my own

1032
01:01:04,920 --> 01:01:08,360
Speaker 1: money to a longtime friend running for political office. I

1033
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:12,760
Speaker 1: was convicted in a kangaroo court presided over by Richard Berman,

1034
01:01:13,040 --> 01:01:17,520
Speaker 1: a Clinton appointee judge. No American in the country's history

1035
01:01:17,600 --> 01:01:20,800
Speaker 1: has been charged, let alone locked up for doing what

1036
01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:24,200
Speaker 1: I did. Yet Obama and his henchman, Eric Holder Prite

1037
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:26,880
Speaker 1: Barara headed the Southern District of New York, did a

1038
01:01:26,960 --> 01:01:30,560
Speaker 1: hit job on me. They quote, went beyond the facts.

1039
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,560
Speaker 1: They quote meddled in politics. So Obama is like the

1040
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:36,800
Speaker 1: guy who poisons the wells and later shows up as

1041
01:01:36,800 --> 01:01:41,120
Speaker 1: the water commissioner, a total con man and hypocrite. I'd

1042
01:01:41,160 --> 01:01:43,000
Speaker 1: like to see this guy end up in the cell

1043
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:46,520
Speaker 1: where I once was. That would be karma, which is

1044
01:01:46,600 --> 01:02:04,160
Speaker 1: my favorite Indian dish.