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Speaker 1: Life Audio.

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Speaker 2: Did a lot of ugly crying at God in the

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Speaker 2: first few years watching him drink because knowing what it

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Speaker 2: was doing to his health. And so I think the

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Speaker 2: open communication, the boundaries, but also recognizing that this is

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Speaker 2: why we're having this conversation today is because this is

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Speaker 2: really hard. If this is something that your marriage is feeling,

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Speaker 2: it's like it's heavy. God's bigger right and he has

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Speaker 2: a plan, so keep asking it. Welcome to Love Life Sober.

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Speaker 2: I'm your host and your coach, Christy Osborne. This podcast

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Speaker 2: is for the woman who loves Jesus or is longing

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Speaker 2: to reconnect with him, and who knows deep down that

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Speaker 2: alcohol is no longer serving her. Here we talk honestly,

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Speaker 2: with grace and truth about how stepping away from alcohol

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Speaker 2: opens the door to the love, joy, peace and connection

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Speaker 2: you've been searching for. Because, Babe, those things were never

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Speaker 2: meant to be found in a bottle of wine. They're

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Speaker 2: found in Jesus. Through scripture, coaching and neuroscience, I'll help

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Speaker 2: you make sense of your habits, your nervous system, and

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Speaker 2: what you're really craving so that freedom feels not only

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Speaker 2: possible but sustainable. You don't have to do this alone, Babe,

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Speaker 2: Let's dive in.

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Speaker 1: Today.

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Speaker 2: We are going to be talking about one of the

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Speaker 2: most frequently asked questions I get both by my one

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Speaker 2: on one clients and in the love Life Sober community,

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Speaker 2: and that is what about my husband? What if he

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Speaker 2: still drinks? What if he doesn't support me? What if

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Speaker 2: we don't have fun together anymore? What if our intimacy changes?

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Speaker 2: What if alcohol has been part of a relationship for

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Speaker 2: our entire marriage than what And perhaps the question underneath

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Speaker 2: all of those questions, what if changing my relationship with

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Speaker 2: alcohol changes my marriage? Today We're going to dive into

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Speaker 2: all of it. I've welcomed on my friend John Seidel

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Speaker 2: and his wife Brett to join me, along with several

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Speaker 2: incredible women from the Love Life Sober Leadership team, for

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Speaker 2: a very honest conversation about what happens when alcohol is

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Speaker 2: no longer at the center of our marriages. Together, we

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Speaker 2: talk about the fears we had before giving up alcohol,

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Speaker 2: what it was like when our spouses continued drinking without us,

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Speaker 2: how we navigated triggers, boundaries, intimacy, communication, and the difficult

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Speaker 2: emotions that can surface when we're no longer numbing with alcohol.

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Speaker 1: In our marriages.

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Speaker 2: You'll hear stories from women whose marriages got stronger, and

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Speaker 2: also from women whose husbands weren't supportive, women who had

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Speaker 2: to learn to communicate in an entirely new way, and

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Speaker 2: women who discovered that the connection they were looking for

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Speaker 2: wasn't actually found in a glass of wine. Now, my

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Speaker 2: friend John Seidel is also going to be joining us

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Speaker 2: for the Aligned Conference in Holland, Michigan this September. If

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Speaker 2: you're interested in joining us at that incredible conference, we're

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Speaker 2: getting so excited about it. There is a link to

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Speaker 2: the show notes and if you want to go further

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Speaker 2: in this topic of the conversations we're having every single

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Speaker 2: day in our love life sober community. So if something

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Speaker 2: stirs in you and you want to talk about it,

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Speaker 2: that is the place to join us. There's a link

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Speaker 2: all about the community in the show notes as well. Okay,

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Speaker 2: my beautiful friend, let's dive into this special episode of

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Speaker 2: the podcast. We are going to be having a really

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Speaker 2: special conversation today. I'm basically co hosting this conversation with

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Speaker 2: my friend John Seidel, who you all know very well

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Speaker 2: by now and say hi hello everyone.

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Speaker 3: It's great to be on here. I'm so happy to

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Speaker 3: represents as.

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Speaker 1: The only man.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but we have your beautiful, beautiful wife with us

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Speaker 2: today too, Brett, do you want to say Hi?

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Speaker 4: Hi.

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Speaker 5: I'm excited to be on this podcast, and John's always

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Speaker 5: been on so many so it's kind of fun to

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Speaker 5: be able to have the other side.

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Speaker 2: So we have John and his beautiful wife, Brett, and

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Speaker 2: then we have a selection of gals from our Love

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Speaker 2: Life Sober Leadership team who were available to also have

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Speaker 2: this conversation. We want to talk all about being alcohol

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Speaker 2: free and our marriages and what we do about husbands

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Speaker 2: that are still drinking. What do we do when we

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Speaker 2: feel like our relationship is changed because we have been

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Speaker 2: drinking our whole marriage. We want to just like have

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Speaker 2: an open conversation without obviously like shaming any wives or

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Speaker 2: any husbands. But we've all been through it, and we

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Speaker 2: all have different perspectives, and we've all had frustrations, and

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Speaker 2: we've all, i mean, I'll speak for myself, had a

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Speaker 2: lot of tearful prayers at God about these questions that

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Speaker 2: were about to kind of just talk through, and so

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Speaker 2: I would just love to know from you guys, what

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Speaker 2: was the biggest fear with regard to your marriage going

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Speaker 2: into this journey, like when you decided I need to,

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Speaker 2: you know, take a break from alcohol, was their fear

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Speaker 2: about what was going to happen to your relationship?

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Speaker 4: Hi, I'm Amber. Marriage was a huge That was a

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Speaker 4: number one fear. And this whole thing about getting out alcohol.

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Speaker 4: I had met my husband, you know, in a drinking

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Speaker 4: face and continued ever since then. We driving go all

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Speaker 4: throughout dating, engagement, wedding, kids. Of course not we'll pregnant.

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Speaker 4: But our drinker was fround about everything in our marriage.

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Speaker 4: So it was my number one fear that I would

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Speaker 4: become boring or that we wouldn't even be like compatible,

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Speaker 4: Like what if we didn't have fun together anymore? It's

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Speaker 4: just who we were and I was changing and was

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Speaker 4: that going to be okay for our marriage?

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Speaker 2: And then what ended up happening. Our marriage was always

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Speaker 2: good and it got even better.

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Speaker 4: Our communication got better, We were had more respect for

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Speaker 4: each other, we were kinder to each other, more patient.

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Speaker 4: And he still does drink, he just drinks a lot

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Speaker 4: less and he thinks me for it.

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Speaker 1: He thinks me all the time for it.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad that you said that, Amber, because I

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Speaker 2: think so many girls have the same fears. And then

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Speaker 2: once you start walking this, especially if you're walking with

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Speaker 2: God and you have that communication with him, like it

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Speaker 2: just ends up being such a blessing. And I'm not

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Speaker 2: saying that that's true for everybody, but there are so

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Speaker 2: many benefits.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna have you really quick.

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Speaker 2: When John, I know that it was a different situation

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Speaker 2: where he got to a place where, like you guys,

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Speaker 2: knew this was like the right move for him. But

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Speaker 2: was there a fear there of then what would happen

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Speaker 2: in your relationship?

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Speaker 1: I don't think it was necessarily a fear of what

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Speaker 1: would happen in our relationship.

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Speaker 5: I think it was a fear of how you know,

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Speaker 5: for so long we were in survival mode and it

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Speaker 5: was like, just get through the day, Just get through

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Speaker 5: the day. And so I think it was this fear

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Speaker 5: where it was going to rock the structure and routine,

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Speaker 5: albeit a very dysfunctional one, but that it would just

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Speaker 5: rock the routine, like what is this going to look like?

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Speaker 1: Is this just going to be a disaster.

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Speaker 5: When he gives it up because he needs to fill

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Speaker 5: it with something else and he's trying to heal, and

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Speaker 5: so I think there was a very real fear of

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Speaker 5: what is our day to day going to look like

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Speaker 5: as he gives alcohol.

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Speaker 2: And then if you press fast forward on that, what

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Speaker 2: did it actually look like?

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Speaker 5: So year one of his sobriety, and he's told people

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Speaker 5: this too is I remember sitting down with just being

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Speaker 5: like John, like this, like this version of you is

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Speaker 5: the man that I had prayed for for fifteen years

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Speaker 5: and the man that I had thought I had married,

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Speaker 5: and then you know, alcohol came into the picture.

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Speaker 1: It was just night and day. I mean, he was

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Speaker 1: joyful again.

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Speaker 5: He was fun to be around, He listened, he was

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Speaker 5: great with the kid's night and day difference in all

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Speaker 5: the best ways.

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Speaker 3: I will say too, though, like there was some fear

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Speaker 3: on my part about you know, Brett wasn't called to

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Speaker 3: give up drinking, and Brett's not a big drinker.

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Speaker 1: I mean I.

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Speaker 3: Think, you know, like Britt brought up bought a Mike's

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Speaker 3: hard lemonade I don't know, like last week and took

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Speaker 3: like two SIPs of it and was like I'm not

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Speaker 3: feeling this and.

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Speaker 1: Just like dumped it out.

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Speaker 3: And I'm like the self control of that woman, because

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Speaker 3: I'm most like I just I just can't have one,

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Speaker 3: you know, And so I look at her, or I

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Speaker 3: think there was a fear of like, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 3: like what am I going to do when I see

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Speaker 3: her drinking? And honestly, it hasn't like it hasn't been

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Speaker 3: a struggle.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: It's like I look at her and I see her

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Speaker 3: have one glass of wine, and I'm like, good for you,

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Speaker 3: you know, like I love that for you, and in fact,

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Speaker 3: I'd love it for myself. And I don't look at

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Speaker 3: it as like a jealousy. I'm just like I just

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Speaker 3: look at that, and I just know, like I can't

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Speaker 3: do that. I can't do that. Like I've accepted the

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Speaker 3: only drink I can say no to is the first one.

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Speaker 3: And so I know that there are some people and

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Speaker 3: in you know, my encouragement to use that if you

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Speaker 3: have given up drinking and you have a spouse that

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Speaker 3: does it, and I don't say this lightly, and but

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Speaker 3: if you like have this resentment, let's let's explore that,

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Speaker 3: like be curious about like that, what is that inside

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Speaker 3: of you now? If your spouse is drinking, you know,

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Speaker 3: unhealthily right, and you are saying and hey, I really

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Speaker 3: like that's a different story, right, But you know, just

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Speaker 3: from my perspective, I think there was initially like a

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Speaker 3: fear of like what would it look like if my

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Speaker 3: wife kept drinking and I had to give it up?

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Speaker 3: And honestly, I feel like the Lord has worked in

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Speaker 3: that way that it's been nothing of the fears that

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Speaker 3: I thought, like, is that going to be so triggering?

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Speaker 1: Is that going to be like and it's just hasn't been. Yeah, Brittany,

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Speaker 1: were you gonna Yeah?

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Speaker 6: I think one of my fears would be would really

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Speaker 6: resonate with a lot of people, is that I had

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Speaker 6: a fear that if he didn't stop drinking, that I

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Speaker 6: wouldn't be able to stop drinking. Yeah, that because there

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Speaker 6: would be alcohol in the house all the time that

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Speaker 6: we go to a bar and sit together and he

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Speaker 6: has a beer, Like I'm gonna want to have a

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Speaker 6: drink with him. And my husband was so supportive of

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Speaker 6: me quitting drinking and so and I mean it was

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Speaker 6: part of our story, like from pretty much the time

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Speaker 6: we met.

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Speaker 1: That was a big thing.

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Speaker 6: I was like, I just really want to get alcohol

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Speaker 6: in my life permanently. It was something I wrestled back

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Speaker 6: and forth. So when I told him, I was like,

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Speaker 6: I'm like done with this. It wasn't and that I

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Speaker 6: wanted to do coaching. It wasn't a surprise to him.

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Speaker 6: He was completely on board, you know. He was like,

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Speaker 6: I don't understand it because I don't think it's a problem,

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Speaker 6: but you know, if it's what you feel like you need,

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Speaker 6: then I'm on board. And but my biggest worry was

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Speaker 6: that we enjoy so many of the same things, like

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Speaker 6: so many the same beers, so many the same cocktails.

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Speaker 1: We both love a dry London.

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Speaker 6: Gin, like you know that he would be drinking his

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Speaker 6: like Monkey forty seven gin and tonic and I would

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Speaker 6: be like, I miss that maybe just what you know,

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Speaker 6: and then it would derail my progress. And you know

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Speaker 6: if I fast forward that honestly, there's alcohol in our

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Speaker 6: house all the time and I never ever.

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Speaker 1: Think about it. And I remember, you know.

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Speaker 6: I worked with Christy, which was a big piece of it,

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Speaker 6: because that was expensive for us to embark on, and

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Speaker 6: we had to really talk about, like you know, budgeting

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Speaker 6: that coaching into our life.

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Speaker 1: And so that was like, well, I can't just do

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Speaker 1: this for nothing.

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Speaker 6: We can't send this money for me to like not

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Speaker 6: be really dedicated here to just given just because he's

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Speaker 6: having an ipa that appeals to me. So that was

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Speaker 6: really helpful and through that coaching and through like just

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Speaker 6: really having some skin in the game there.

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Speaker 1: I remember he.

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Speaker 6: Had left a like a cider, a Blake's hard cider

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Speaker 6: on our coffee table, and it was one that was

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Speaker 6: like one of my favorites is the spicy one. And

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Speaker 6: I remember I took a nap on the couch and

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Speaker 6: I woke up and that was all I could smell

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Speaker 6: and I and I had like really lost the desire

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Speaker 6: to drink and instead of being something enticing, I was like, oh,

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Speaker 6: that's discusting.

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Speaker 1: I can't believe I used to put that in my body.

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Speaker 6: And I was like that was the day. I was like,

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Speaker 6: it's gonna be okay. So I think we're okay with

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Speaker 6: you know. So you know, what I thought was impossible

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Speaker 6: was entirely possible, and it's it's all good.

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Speaker 2: We'll be back right after a quick word from our sponsors.

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Speaker 2: I hope that it's encouraging for the listener right now

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Speaker 2: who has basically had some of these fears to hear

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Speaker 2: like the last two or three people say this is

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Speaker 2: what I was really Scared's going to happen, and it

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Speaker 2: didn't actually come to fruition, right, Does anyone want to

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Speaker 2: add to that at all?

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Speaker 5: I had a lot of family members come to me

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Speaker 5: who felt like they they didn't know how to act

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Speaker 5: around him, and they felt like they need to kind

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Speaker 5: of tiptoe around, you know, family events where there was

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Speaker 5: alcohol ad like do we don't?

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Speaker 1: We like, how do we approach it?

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Speaker 5: And so every single one of them, you know, just

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Speaker 5: encourage them a ask John directly. He's very open about it,

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Speaker 5: and he'll tell to you. And so I think there

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Speaker 5: was there's a lot of fear with all of our

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Speaker 5: extended family because they wanted to honor him in his

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Speaker 5: sobriety journey and they didn't quite know what that meant

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Speaker 5: for them as well. So I think that that that

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Speaker 5: has come into play a lot.

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Speaker 3: And there was only I can say this, there was

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Speaker 3: only in the three years, there's only been one time

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Speaker 3: where I've been like where I struggled, and that was

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Speaker 3: it was a family event, and it wasn't because there

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Speaker 3: was alcohol there, but it was that the conversation of

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Speaker 3: the men turned to, Oh, this bourbon, it's so good

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Speaker 3: and it's so rare, and it tastes so and like

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Speaker 3: it was just like, you know, like for whatever reason,

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Speaker 3: that set of conversation points where it was just like

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Speaker 3: I walked out side.

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Speaker 1: I had to walk outside and bre It's like, what's

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Speaker 1: going on?

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Speaker 3: And I'm like, I don't know, like if it wasn't

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Speaker 3: seeing it, it wasn't smelling it, it was just like

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Speaker 3: when the conversation around it was just like I mean

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Speaker 3: because in the end it's like, yeah, I'm I missed

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Speaker 3: that taste, right, you know, you know. And so what

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Speaker 3: I would say is is like I I still like

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Speaker 3: there's still part of me that every once in a

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Speaker 3: while is like do you think you could just enjoy

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Speaker 3: one bourbon?

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Speaker 1: You know, like just one and just enjoy that, you know,

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Speaker 1: that burn once I just I just found horrible.

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Speaker 3: And I just know that, like I've done a lot

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Speaker 3: of research in this area, you know, and I know

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Speaker 3: that I can't, right, And and so I think that

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Speaker 3: was the only time. That was the only time. And

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Speaker 3: I think Brett kind of went to bat for me

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Speaker 3: in that in that arena, but you know, that was

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Speaker 3: really it.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And we have we have also figured out kind

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Speaker 5: of an open dialog between John and I when we

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Speaker 5: go to certain events, Like we have a lot of

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Speaker 5: breweries around where we are that are also like a

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Speaker 5: theater or a restaurant, but their breweries, and so we

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Speaker 5: just kind of go into a lot of those with

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Speaker 5: a pregame plan, like, hey, if you're starting to feel triggered,

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Speaker 5: say that you know this is the exit word or

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Speaker 5: like a safe word or something. So making sure that

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Speaker 5: where there are these places where he can potentially be triggered.

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Speaker 5: It's like we're on the same page, you know, we're

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Speaker 5: both aware of it going into it, so we have

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Speaker 5: that a lot. Yeah, that's helpful.

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Speaker 6: That That's something I found really helpful too, is like

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Speaker 6: having Zeb's support and like the one time that I

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Speaker 6: felt really like the most on the brink I've been in,

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Speaker 6: like drinking again was like after.

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Speaker 1: A kind of a hot day.

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Speaker 6: But I was really open with my husband through everything

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Speaker 6: I was learning.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'd read this Naked Mind, I'd.

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Speaker 6: Done Christie's curriculum, had a lot of conversations with Christy

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Speaker 6: and Christy You'll have to help me with the acronym here.

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Speaker 1: But it's like like.

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Speaker 6: Tired, angry, hungry, halt, they're halt, Yeah, hungry, angry, lovely, tired.

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Speaker 1: Only or tired are triggers.

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Speaker 6: And I had told zeb you know, I said, I

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Speaker 6: like every one of those has been a catalyst for

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Speaker 6: my drinking. And so we were like sitting down to

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Speaker 6: a restaurant after a round of golf and it was

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Speaker 6: like ninety five degrees out. We're grieving the loss of

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Speaker 6: my dad, and I sit down and I'm exhausted. And

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Speaker 6: we sit down and I was really cranky and I

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Speaker 6: was really hungry, and he ordered a beer and it

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Speaker 6: just it smelled so good, looked so good. It was

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Speaker 6: like all those all those like old triggers just came back.

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Speaker 6: And I was like, I said, Zeb, can I have

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Speaker 6: like just a little bit of that?

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Speaker 1: And he was like, he.

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Speaker 6: Goes, you could, but why don't you try to eat

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Speaker 6: something first? Why don't we order an appetizer and if

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Speaker 6: you still want it after the appetizer, like then you know,

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Speaker 6: we'll get you a glass. And I was like, and

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Speaker 6: it was funny because he kind of like did he

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Speaker 6: did the work that I needed to do, But he

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Speaker 6: was like, but having that openness with him to say

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Speaker 6: like this was this is a heart These are the

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Speaker 6: hard moments overall, like kind of cued him in too,

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Speaker 6: be like she's tired and hungry and angry.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, like, let's help.

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Speaker 6: With one of those things at least, And he was

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Speaker 6: right after that, we ate an aapetizer and I didn't

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Speaker 6: made it through and kind of never looked back.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, Heather, Yeah, I was just getting piggyback on something

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Speaker 7: John said about you know that Brett wasn't being called

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Speaker 7: to lay down alcohol, but he was. And I just

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Speaker 7: felt like God was, you know, putting that on my

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Speaker 7: heart for a long time before I was willing to

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Speaker 7: do it. And I kept my husband, my relationship with

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Speaker 7: my husband, and our drinking relationship as an excuse not

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Speaker 7: to lay it down because I knew God wasn't speaking

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Speaker 7: to him, he was speaking to me. And when I

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Speaker 7: finally did, you know, have the conversation with my husband

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Speaker 7: and I had it over. Actually it was several years.

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Speaker 7: I was like, you know, I would take a break,

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Speaker 7: I would do it fast, I would do dry January.

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Speaker 7: And he saw me, you know, put boundaries up a

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Speaker 7: lot to make sure I wasn't an alcoholic like my parents.

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Speaker 7: But I really did think it would ruin our marriage

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Speaker 7: if I completely stopped drinking.

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Speaker 1: And I really thought it would ruin our intimacy.

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Speaker 7: That was a huge one for me and I remember

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Speaker 7: on our anniversary it was October second, and he ordered

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Speaker 7: a bottle of wine, a really expensive bottle of wine,

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Speaker 7: and he was like, can't you.

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Speaker 1: Just have one glass? And it was, you know, a moment.

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Speaker 7: He's been super supportive, but you know, for him, he's like,

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Speaker 7: you know, we're celebrating. And I said, yes, I can

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Speaker 7: have that one glass, but then I'll want more, and

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Speaker 7: that the good is trying to teach me is the

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Speaker 7: self control. And so I didn't have a glass and

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Speaker 7: we got through that and he did say later that night,

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Speaker 7: you know, I miss drunk Heather. I miss miss her

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Speaker 7: and I I said, I miss her too, but I

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Speaker 7: love who I am more now. And when Britt was saying, like,

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Speaker 7: you're the man that you that you always wanted to

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Speaker 7: be married too, and I feel like for me, I'm

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Speaker 7: the wife that I've always wanted to be because I'm

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Speaker 7: more patient, I'm more kind, I'm more accepting, I'm more loving.

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Speaker 7: And that has been the fruit from laying down alcohol.

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Speaker 7: It has been so much more powerful than whatever connection

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Speaker 7: we had when we were drinking together. So just being

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Speaker 7: that witness too for my husband, because you know, I've

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Speaker 7: I've always been kind of the spiritual leader in our marriage,

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Speaker 7: and so that's been you know, he's watching me and

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Speaker 7: he's acknowledging. And the next day he said, I'm so

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Speaker 7: proud of you. You know, I'm so proud of you

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Speaker 7: for not drink.

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Speaker 8: Keep I love that you know that you're happier that

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Speaker 8: love yourself more because I think that, you know, the

400
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Speaker 8: hating of myself from drinking too much or doing things

401
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Speaker 8: or saying things that I regretted was taking up so

402
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Speaker 8: much energy, so much space, so much mental anguish that

403
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Speaker 8: I can now, you know, just be happier, love myself,

404
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Speaker 8: say nice things to myself, wake up with the joy

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Speaker 8: of the Lord and that I didn't have before.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad that you told that story, Heather. I

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Speaker 2: was really hoping that you would. So thank you for

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Speaker 2: sharing that and being so open and vulnerable, because I

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Speaker 2: know that's going to help whoever the gals that are listening.

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Speaker 1: I would love to spend a.

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Speaker 2: Few minutes encouraging the woman whose husband is still drinking, because,

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Speaker 2: as all of you Guals who are in the community know,

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Speaker 2: this is a question that we get all the time

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Speaker 2: my husband is still drinking, How in the world am

415
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Speaker 2: I going to do a fast or how in the

416
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Speaker 2: world am I going to start a life of sobriety

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Speaker 2: if he's still drinking all around me all the time.

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Speaker 2: And so I would just love to open up that

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Speaker 2: question everybody. What did that look like for you? Has

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Speaker 2: it gotten easier?

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Speaker 1: What is it?

422
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Speaker 2: What did it look like in the beginning versus now

423
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Speaker 2: do you put in boundaries with your spouse in order

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Speaker 2: to help you and what does that look like?

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Speaker 7: I just want to say real quick that one of

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Speaker 7: the things that helped me was that I had to

427
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Speaker 7: always have non alcoholic options on hand, just you know,

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Speaker 7: because at that five o'clock hour, six o'clock hour when

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Speaker 7: my husband was pouring his wine, I would need to

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Speaker 7: pour something that made me feel at least, you know,

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Speaker 7: like I was connecting in some way with him, even.

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Speaker 1: Even if it was a placebo effect. So that was

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Speaker 1: really really helpful for me.

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Speaker 7: And I have a variety because I think, like britt

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Speaker 7: there's you know, there's wine, there's fears, there's different drinks

436
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Speaker 7: that I liked. I didn't just drink one thing. So

437
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Speaker 7: having like a variety of options. And I think also

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Speaker 7: having the conversation and having this report of your spouse

439
00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:04,400
Speaker 7: is critical even if they're continuing to drink, that they

440
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Speaker 7: are mostly supportive.

441
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:07,640
Speaker 1: Of it.

442
00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:10,840
Speaker 3: So I will say, you know, there were times back

443
00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:12,680
Speaker 3: in the day, Yeah, I mean I tried to quit

444
00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 3: drinking so many times, and uh, and I will say, like,

445
00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:22,879
Speaker 3: now the non alcoholic space has just revolutionized and it's

446
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:24,640
Speaker 3: been encouraging.

447
00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:25,800
Speaker 1: I mean it's funny.

448
00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 3: Even last night my daughter we have this like I

449
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:34,119
Speaker 3: think it's toast and tost which is like a.

450
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:36,119
Speaker 1: Champagne kind of altim and she was danding, what's this?

451
00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:37,800
Speaker 1: Can we try it? And I was like, yeah, we can,

452
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:40,399
Speaker 1: we can, And so I was like, you know, she

453
00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:41,200
Speaker 1: like got a cup.

454
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:43,560
Speaker 3: Iuse like, no, baby, We're going to do wine glasses, right,

455
00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 3: So I got the wine glasses that I poured them

456
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,640
Speaker 3: and she's like this is really good, Like yeah, we

457
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:50,200
Speaker 3: and then she goes she goes, Danny, can we start

458
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:54,679
Speaker 3: making non alcoholic cocktails together? I said, absolutely, right, Like

459
00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:58,399
Speaker 3: we absolutely can, right, And So I just think that

460
00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:01,040
Speaker 3: non alcoholic space. I love that because you know I

461
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 3: always have like the Stella zero point zero. I'm like,

462
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,480
Speaker 3: you know, I joke with people. I'm like, I think

463
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:08,840
Speaker 3: it tastes exactly like it now. I haven't had one

464
00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:12,080
Speaker 3: in three years, so maybe I'm biased. I can't compare it,

465
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,400
Speaker 3: but man, the non alcoholic space, you know, you can

466
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 3: get a Stella zero point zero, so I think those

467
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,600
Speaker 3: options are really good. And I don't see and by

468
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 3: the way, no, like I know there are some people

469
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 3: I'm sure no one on this call but think that's

470
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,920
Speaker 3: like some sort of like cheating and I'm like, it's

471
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:34,560
Speaker 3: not you know that, like, oh well, if you have

472
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:36,760
Speaker 3: to have non alcoholic then you haven't really done.

473
00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,720
Speaker 1: And I'm like, no, like that by.

474
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 2: That rationale, I was cheating with Ben and Jerry's so yeah,

475
00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:46,959
Speaker 2: right exactly. Who else wants to kind of weigh in

476
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,520
Speaker 2: on that whole husband still drinking?

477
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,439
Speaker 1: How am I going to do this? It's around me.

478
00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:55,679
Speaker 9: I would say I had a slightly different experience in

479
00:23:55,720 --> 00:24:00,720
Speaker 9: the beginning. When I told my husband, she told me

480
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,280
Speaker 9: that he knew I had a problem. He didn't say

481
00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:07,920
Speaker 9: anything because then I wouldn't be as intimate with him,

482
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:13,120
Speaker 9: and so he's like, yeah, I saw the Hawaine bottles,

483
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:15,879
Speaker 9: like I was taking him out to the trash and

484
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:17,920
Speaker 9: this and that, and I knew you had a problem,

485
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,280
Speaker 9: and so he felt really bad. But I feel like

486
00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 9: I didn't have his support the whole first year. I mean,

487
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:28,080
Speaker 9: it was really through the community that I was able

488
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:34,120
Speaker 9: to get through and have that first month or so

489
00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 9: he stopped drinking, but then he did start drinking again,

490
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 9: and that was hard. Although I did tell him, I'm like,

491
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:45,159
Speaker 9: I'm being called to this, like you have to be convicted,

492
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:47,159
Speaker 9: and like what God caused you to?

493
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,160
Speaker 1: You know, this is me and this is what I'm

494
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:49,560
Speaker 1: going to do.

495
00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:52,520
Speaker 9: But I think he's always kind of waited, like are

496
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:53,440
Speaker 9: you going to drink again?

497
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 1: Are you going to drink again?

498
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:57,119
Speaker 9: Are we going to go to France and have because

499
00:24:57,119 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 9: of my husband's my mother in law's from France. And

500
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,640
Speaker 9: so it's been easy at times and then harder at

501
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:05,800
Speaker 9: other times. You know, it's just kind of certain times

502
00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,080
Speaker 9: it hits you and like, Nope, I don't want to

503
00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:10,480
Speaker 9: drink around you or hurt him to drink around me.

504
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,720
Speaker 9: And then other times it's fine, like go have a

505
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:15,880
Speaker 9: glass of beer, wine or whatever.

506
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:16,760
Speaker 1: I don't know.

507
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,040
Speaker 9: For me right now, it's still kind of hit or

508
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 9: miss how it triggers me.

509
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:23,679
Speaker 3: And that's okay, Like, I'm glad you shared that, right, Like,

510
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:26,640
Speaker 3: because I think there's a lot of other like, there's

511
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:28,240
Speaker 3: a lot of people listening to that that may be

512
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 3: their experience, and so hopefully what people don't hear is

513
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,320
Speaker 3: that if you're if you are triggered by your spouse drinking,

514
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:36,840
Speaker 3: be honest about that.

515
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:37,399
Speaker 1: You know.

516
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 3: Then I guess the question becomes and Christy, maybe this

517
00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:41,040
Speaker 3: is where you can come into you.

518
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:44,679
Speaker 1: It's like what do you do? Right? And you know,

519
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 1: like how do you react to that?

520
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,399
Speaker 3: How do you react if you are being triggered by

521
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:51,800
Speaker 3: a spouse who It's like, Okay, that's great for you.

522
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 3: I'm going to keep drinking, you know, because I think

523
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:57,720
Speaker 3: Brett even like you, I want to say that you

524
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:00,560
Speaker 3: stop drinking for a little bit, but you You've always

525
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 3: been to take it or leave it person. And then

526
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 3: finally I think we went out and she's like, do

527
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:05,960
Speaker 3: you mind if I progress? I'm like, yeah, that's fine.

528
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:08,720
Speaker 3: So yeah, I think that's interesting and put it to

529
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 3: the other ladies is like what do you do then?

530
00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:11,440
Speaker 1: Yeah?

531
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:15,159
Speaker 2: I mean for me, I have had to set boundaries

532
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 2: and luckily, as everybody by now knows, I started my

533
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 2: journey like right when COVID started, and so I said,

534
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:23,480
Speaker 2: no drinking in the house, and therefore we were locked

535
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 2: in the house, which was great because it meant no

536
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 2: one was coming into our house that were our friends

537
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,720
Speaker 2: who because we were at the party house and so

538
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 2: there was Chris was the very first person that I

539
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,240
Speaker 2: told before I told anybody else.

540
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 1: He was super, super supportive.

541
00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 2: He knew how depressed I was because he watched me

542
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:42,880
Speaker 2: cry myself to sleep, sleep, drunk, wasted for two years

543
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,480
Speaker 2: straight practically, so he was supportive. And then with him,

544
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:50,080
Speaker 2: he still drinks. He normally does it when he is

545
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:52,919
Speaker 2: out in London at a client thing or whatever. But

546
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 2: the boundaries have shifted over the last six six and

547
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:59,560
Speaker 2: something years where it was sometimes it's like it was

548
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:01,959
Speaker 2: no dres in the house for a while that it

549
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,240
Speaker 2: was please don't drink around the now teenagers, because the

550
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 2: now teenagers are going to parties and they're seeing, you know,

551
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 2: people drink that are fourteen, fifteen, sixteen, and mom is

552
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 2: saying it's not good for you, and so I'm like, Dad,

553
00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 2: let's be united here. So he does still drink, and

554
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 2: it's just been kind of that open conversation.

555
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 1: I also have to be totally honest, I did.

556
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 2: A lot of ugly crying at God in the first

557
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 2: few years watching him drink because knowing what it was

558
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,240
Speaker 2: doing to his health, knowing that like, yeah, that was

559
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 2: going to affect if he was drinking too much, going

560
00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:36,040
Speaker 2: to affect how our night went together.

561
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 4: You know.

562
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 2: And so I think the open communication, the boundaries, but

563
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 2: also recognizing that this is why we're having this conversation

564
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:46,680
Speaker 2: today is because this is really hard, and but God

565
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:48,800
Speaker 2: is in it, and he is bigger if it's if

566
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 2: this is something that you know your marriage is feeling

567
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,360
Speaker 2: it like it's heavy. God's bigger, right, and he has

568
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 2: a plan. So keep asking him, even if you feel

569
00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:00,240
Speaker 2: like you've asked him a million times, just to improve

570
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 2: that communication, that relationship, whatever it is, because he will.

571
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:06,679
Speaker 2: He will come through for you, and it might look different.

572
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:08,960
Speaker 2: Like I said, a lot of a lot of my

573
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 2: ugly crying was please take his desire to drink away.

574
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,040
Speaker 2: That has not happened yet, But we're in such a

575
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:17,680
Speaker 2: much better spot. And like I think it was Amber

576
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 2: who said, he's also he also drinks a lot less

577
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 2: now because he's not doesn't have someone pouring him tequila

578
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:27,320
Speaker 2: every time he turns her around, will be back right

579
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:29,440
Speaker 2: after a quick word from our sponsors.

580
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 3: Two things I would say too is one, I mean,

581
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 3: you know, Christine and I talk a lot about this

582
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 3: just offline together, but like when we talk about like

583
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 3: this idea of gospel centered recovery, right like putting Jesus

584
00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 3: first is I think Also is if your spouse who's like,

585
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:51,479
Speaker 3: you know, what that's you thing, you know, or if

586
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 3: they're refusing to kind of even maybe puld the space

587
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 3: for you to be that. I think more let's see

588
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:02,360
Speaker 3: pressing into root issues and root where it's just not

589
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 3: just about the sobriety, right, like where it's like, you know, like, man,

590
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 3: I'm reading like Haggy I this morning, like what the

591
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 3: heck you know? And it's like it's like, you know,

592
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,400
Speaker 3: Christine and I The Life Recovery Bible has been sponsors

593
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 3: of our podcast and it's actually been really good, and

594
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,440
Speaker 3: so like I open up Hagye right, and I'm like, oh,

595
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 3: I love how it connects that to recovery. And I

596
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 3: think the more that we can show that like hey,

597
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 3: this is a bigger, deeper thing, like this isn't just

598
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 3: about sobriety, I think the more our our spouses kind

599
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 3: of perk up and be like, oh okay, that's interesting, right,

600
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 3: And I think there's a deeper and greater respect because

601
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,760
Speaker 3: if it is just about like I mean, you know, like,

602
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:52,520
Speaker 3: how is it different than just not eating peanut eminem's right,

603
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:54,600
Speaker 3: and then you're like, oh, yeah, okay, you know, like

604
00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 3: maybe maybe they're in a not peanut eminem phase. Okay, right,

605
00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 3: But but if it becomes more were than just like

606
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,400
Speaker 3: not doing something, I think that can become such a

607
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:06,320
Speaker 3: bigger and better witness.

608
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 1: And then the second thing I would say is listen.

609
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:13,560
Speaker 3: Brett and I are still in marriage counseling, right, and

610
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,480
Speaker 3: so I think if if you have if you're listening

611
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:18,840
Speaker 3: to this and your spouse is like, eh, I don't

612
00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 3: really care, you know, I would just venture to guess

613
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 3: that I think there are maybe some deeper issues, right,

614
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 3: and deeper things that could be worked through. Right. Where again,

615
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 3: it's just not about the drinking. It's like, you know,

616
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 3: let's take it and separate it from drinking. But if

617
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 3: it was like if you were a cancer patient, right,

618
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:43,280
Speaker 3: and it's like, you know, my niece, for example, she has.

619
00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 1: Brett's sister's daughter.

620
00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 3: She had a heart transplant at like I don't know

621
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 3: how many, like a month old, and like there are

622
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,600
Speaker 3: certain things that we now do as a family in

623
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:58,520
Speaker 3: order to be around her that we like don't batany yet, right,

624
00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 3: It's like we have to make sure that we do

625
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 3: certain things because you know, like all the kids, for example,

626
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 3: they go to the my in laws have a lake house,

627
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 3: and she can't swim in the lake, right because she's

628
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,479
Speaker 3: on medication that if she gets you know someone meba

629
00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 3: goes up her nose like she's gonna die.

630
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 1: So what do we do?

631
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:19,120
Speaker 3: Like we rent a blow up and we put that

632
00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 3: in the backyard, and all the kids do that, and

633
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:22,840
Speaker 3: none of the kids go swim in the lake when

634
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 3: she's there, and like we're not like.

635
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:27,120
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, how awful this is. I can't believe

636
00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 1: we can't swim it. Like we're like, do we get

637
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: to do that? Right?

638
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 3: And so I think in the same way, like if

639
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,160
Speaker 3: your spouse is like, oh my god, I just can't

640
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 3: a like, hey, I think there may be some bigger,

641
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 3: deeper things that are worth exploring being curious about, probably

642
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:48,720
Speaker 3: in the context of a good Christian marriage counselor Yeah.

643
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:50,280
Speaker 2: I'm glad you said that, because I was what I

644
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 2: was gonna ask Brett next was because we've heard John's

645
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 2: story and that moment when you know, the come to

646
00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 2: Jesus moment if you will, and you you have that

647
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 2: conversation about him stopping, and John was like, I gotta quit,

648
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:03,680
Speaker 2: and you said something to the effect of, no, we

649
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 2: got to figure out, like why you're doing this?

650
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 1: Right? I want to know how how did you do that?

651
00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 1: How did you How did you know to do that?

652
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 5: I didn't, but by the grace of God, yeah I knew.

653
00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 1: And he even said it.

654
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 5: He had stopped alcohol so many times, given it up

655
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:30,640
Speaker 5: week here, a month here, so many times it never stuck.

656
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 1: And so I knew that it wasn't really about the

657
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: alcohol if he.

658
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,080
Speaker 5: Gave it up, and that's what I told him, If

659
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:43,239
Speaker 5: you give it up, great, I don't really care. I

660
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 5: need you to figure out why you're drinking in the

661
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 5: first place. Why has this become an addiction? Yeah, that

662
00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 5: truly wasn't me. That was that was all Holy Spirit,

663
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 5: because I was not in a good mental space at

664
00:32:55,160 --> 00:33:01,040
Speaker 5: that at that point. And so I think, like John said,

665
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 5: you know that a lot of it pointed to deeper

666
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 5: issues and for us as a.

667
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:09,080
Speaker 1: Married couple as well.

668
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 5: And so you know, that first year where he gave

669
00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 5: it up, it was glorious, it was so great.

670
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 1: I got my husband from Mack.

671
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 5: He was doing some deep, deep trauma therapy with empty r.

672
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 5: But what we don't often share is year two of

673
00:33:24,840 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 5: his sobriety was hell.

674
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: It was awful.

675
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 5: It was so hard because he had gotten too a

676
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 5: healthy place himself.

677
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 1: And then I realized, oh my gosh, I.

678
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 5: Had been in survival mode for fifteen years and I

679
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 5: had suppressed so much for fifteen years. And so for me,

680
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 5: it was like all of the emotions bubbled up for

681
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:55,960
Speaker 5: me and I all the anger, the resentment, the bitterness.

682
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 1: That came to service.

683
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 5: And so I had to go and do some deep

684
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 5: intent zive trauma therapy myself.

685
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,120
Speaker 1: And so once we both got to a place.

686
00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:08,960
Speaker 5: Where we could converse about it is when we decided

687
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 5: to do marriage counseling.

688
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 1: Because it's not it's not.

689
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 5: About the alcohol, it's what is behind alcohol? Why are

690
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 5: you needing to escape all the time? Why are you

691
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:23,359
Speaker 5: needing to escape me or the kids or your job?

692
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 5: Like what is the point behind that? And so that's

693
00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 5: that was kind of full circle what we were trying

694
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 5: to explore.

695
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:33,160
Speaker 3: And if I could add to that too is and

696
00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 3: then you know, I think that's you know, it's a

697
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:36,560
Speaker 3: quie work on my part, it's a quibe work on

698
00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 3: her part, right, because let's be honest, Like, you know,

699
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 3: I had a really tough week last week, just a

700
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 3: variety of things, and it's like, you know, three years ago,

701
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,320
Speaker 3: I could have just spent a night with my bourbon

702
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 3: and like, in a sense gotten through that. And conversely,

703
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:56,319
Speaker 3: like I basically had to spend a week kind of

704
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 3: sitting in that and guess what, it's hard on bread,

705
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:04,279
Speaker 3: right because I'm learning to sit with my feelings and

706
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,240
Speaker 3: I'm learning how to deal with them in a healthy

707
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:10,640
Speaker 3: way even still, right Whereas three years ago, it's like, Okay,

708
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 3: I'm gonna go out, I'm gonna treat myself. I'm gonna

709
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 3: I'm gonna have a bottle, and you know, I'll have

710
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 3: some shame and regret, but then I'll just drink that away.

711
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 3: And but now it's like, you know, it's it's become

712
00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 3: where she's had to learn, Okay, And I told her this,

713
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 3: I think it was yesterday, right, Brett, Like I was like, Hey,

714
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,440
Speaker 3: I just want to say thank you, thank you for

715
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 3: allowing me the space and the grace to just work

716
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:42,160
Speaker 3: through this, because it took a lot longer to work

717
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 3: through that without alcohol than it would have with alcohol, right,

718
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,319
Speaker 3: And so she's had to learn, now, Okay, how do

719
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:50,280
Speaker 3: I give him space?

720
00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:51,880
Speaker 1: What does that look like? You know?

721
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:54,799
Speaker 3: I mean she sat with me and hugged me and

722
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,879
Speaker 3: cried with me, you know, the first day, and then

723
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 3: the next couple of days she's like, he's going to

724
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,400
Speaker 3: sleep a little bit more, you know, And and what

725
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:05,480
Speaker 3: do I do. I'm just gonna I'm just gonna be

726
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:08,360
Speaker 3: okay with that. And so I think that's been a

727
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:09,439
Speaker 3: learning process as well.

728
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:13,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, I'm so glad you guys shared that. I

729
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:15,400
Speaker 2: just I was thinking back as you both were talking

730
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:19,640
Speaker 2: to a client who who is in a situation where

731
00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:22,799
Speaker 2: they had been drinking, her and her husband for many,

732
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:27,720
Speaker 2: many years, and when she decided to go on a fast.

733
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 2: We were talking about like the last time she had

734
00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 2: even been open and vulnerable and honest with her husband

735
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 2: about anything, and this particular galic couldn't even remember a

736
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 2: time when she was like open and honest and vulnerable

737
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 2: about something in the past, like you know, decade of

738
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,480
Speaker 2: their marriage. So you both bring up a beautiful point

739
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:48,719
Speaker 2: here of this is an opportunity, right to work on

740
00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:51,759
Speaker 2: our deeper stuff, to work on your communication together, to

741
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 2: work on what we always ask in the community over

742
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:56,200
Speaker 2: and over again, like to work blue in the face,

743
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:58,839
Speaker 2: what do you actually need right now? And so it

744
00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:01,520
Speaker 2: gives you that opportunity. We'll be back right after a

745
00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 2: quick word from our sponsors. Hey, babe, I just wanted

746
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 2: to pause us for one second to remind you that

747
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:13,799
Speaker 2: this September we are gathering in Holland, Michigan for the

748
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:18,080
Speaker 2: Aligned Conference. This is going to be the first ever

749
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:24,360
Speaker 2: Christian women's Alcohol Free conference, and I am so excited

750
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:27,960
Speaker 2: to be partnering with my friend Sherry Hoppin of Sala

751
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:31,160
Speaker 2: House Recovery. If you've ever wished there was a place

752
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:34,720
Speaker 2: where you could talk openly about freedom from alcohol, growing

753
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 2: closer to Jesus, and building genuine friendships with women who

754
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:42,240
Speaker 2: understand the journey, then this is your opportunity. We're bringing

755
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:48,319
Speaker 2: together incredible speakers, meaningful conversations, worship, prayer, practical tools, and

756
00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:51,280
Speaker 2: plenty of opportunities to connect with women who are pursuing

757
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 2: freedom and living aligned with God's best for their lives.

758
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 2: One of the things I'm most excited about is that

759
00:37:57,360 --> 00:37:59,719
Speaker 2: so many women from the Love Life Sover community are

760
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:02,400
Speaker 2: all already coming. If you've ever wanted to meet some

761
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:04,920
Speaker 2: of those amazing women in real life and get an

762
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 2: in person hug and spend a few days just hanging

763
00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:12,759
Speaker 2: out with women who are alcohol free or sober, curious

764
00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:17,719
Speaker 2: and love Jesus, then this is your chance. It doesn't

765
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 2: matter how long you've been free from alcohol, if you

766
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,880
Speaker 2: are just at the beginning of this journey or years in,

767
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:26,319
Speaker 2: we don't mind. We just want to get in a

768
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:27,680
Speaker 2: room with you, and we are.

769
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:28,800
Speaker 1: So so excited.

770
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:32,439
Speaker 2: All of the details and the ticket information is all

771
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,920
Speaker 2: at the link in the show notes. I am so

772
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:40,440
Speaker 2: so excited to get to hug some of you beautiful

773
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:44,359
Speaker 2: women in person this September. Okay, let's get back to

774
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 2: today's episode. I want to then kind of move on

775
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:50,680
Speaker 2: to We have gals in our community that don't have

776
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:55,720
Speaker 2: supportive spouses, whose spouses that are literally pouring them drinks

777
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,360
Speaker 2: every night while they are trying to go on a fast,

778
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,480
Speaker 2: and so I love if we just open up and

779
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:03,680
Speaker 2: encourage that woman, what would you say to her?

780
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 6: You know, as much as we you know, have stories

781
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:09,839
Speaker 6: of like, you know, what do you need as the

782
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 6: person drinking and engaging in this. It's like we hear

783
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:17,279
Speaker 6: so many stories of women whose husbands are resistant, and

784
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,319
Speaker 6: you know, I think it's an important question to ask.

785
00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 6: He's like, there's like no one needs their spouse to drink,

786
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 6: but there is a root need there that that is

787
00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 6: valid and worth exploring. And one of those things is

788
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 6: just for so many men we hear about is like

789
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,480
Speaker 6: a fear of loss of connection. We've heard it even

790
00:39:36,520 --> 00:39:40,080
Speaker 6: in this conversation. A fear of loss of intimacy. You know,

791
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 6: if that's like the only time you're feeling close to

792
00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 6: your wife, then that's a really big deal. And if

793
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:49,760
Speaker 6: you feel like alcohol is the catalyst, that's really worth

794
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:54,320
Speaker 6: exploring and making sure like that intimacy is still important,

795
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 6: that connection time, that shoulder to shoulder We do this

796
00:39:57,560 --> 00:39:58,320
Speaker 6: when we're drinking.

797
00:39:58,360 --> 00:39:59,879
Speaker 1: We go on vacation and we drink.

798
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:04,840
Speaker 6: Those things are all so important to dig into and say, Okay,

799
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:08,800
Speaker 6: we still need a connection point. It can't be alcohol anymore,

800
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:11,880
Speaker 6: but it can be something else, and like that is

801
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 6: still worth investing in if you're you and your spouse

802
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,720
Speaker 6: like wind down every night with a cocktail on the porch,

803
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,960
Speaker 6: Like grab the mocktail, have that wind down time, have

804
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 6: that deep time, and because that is those things, you know,

805
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:30,279
Speaker 6: like we always say it's not about the alcohol, right,

806
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:34,279
Speaker 6: It's just never really about the alcohol. And so you know,

807
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:37,359
Speaker 6: spouses still have needs, we still have needs, and there's

808
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:40,799
Speaker 6: always a root of what's going on there. Rat told John, like,

809
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 6: there's a root here to why you're drinking. There's probably

810
00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 6: a route to why your spouse is worried that you're

811
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 6: going to stop drinking.

812
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:50,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so good, So good, Brittany, I actually had

813
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:52,959
Speaker 2: a client with that exact same story, and she would

814
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:55,719
Speaker 2: sit with a mocktail and she would have maybe a

815
00:40:55,719 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 2: mocktail and a half and then you know, they ended

816
00:40:58,040 --> 00:40:59,760
Speaker 2: their their cocktail.

817
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 1: Hour on the porch early.

818
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:03,480
Speaker 2: You know, but she made the effort to still do that.

819
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:06,399
Speaker 2: And I think to your point too, is how can

820
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 2: you make an effort in other things like that was

821
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 2: something that Chris and I started taking walks. We take walks,

822
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 2: we walk the dog together and that's when we talk

823
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,000
Speaker 2: and then we do we try to do a Friday lunch.

824
00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 2: Every once in a while I had to make that

825
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 2: was me, like I'm the one who's like Friday lunch,

826
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 2: I'm putting it in your calendar, or like we're doing

827
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:25,560
Speaker 2: a dog walk today. I would just love to hear

828
00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 2: from anybody else too, like, well, how would you encourage

829
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 2: the gal who's listening whose husband isn't supportive.

830
00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 1: I will just say my husband has mostly been supportive.

831
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 7: But again, there's been times that in the beginning where

832
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:41,359
Speaker 7: I said I wanted to drink, and he would say

833
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 7: it then drink, Go ahead and drink. You know, no

834
00:41:44,040 --> 00:41:48,360
Speaker 7: one's stopping you. And it would actually make me pause

835
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 7: and think, why am I doing this? And I think

836
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:56,640
Speaker 7: that's where for me personally, it was between.

837
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:57,400
Speaker 1: Me and Jesus.

838
00:41:57,680 --> 00:42:02,080
Speaker 7: Yeah, God wasn't asked me to lay this down, then

839
00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:03,279
Speaker 7: I probably want to.

840
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 1: That's not the case for everyone.

841
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:07,279
Speaker 7: I mean, some people it is wrecking their life and

842
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:10,359
Speaker 7: they need to put the alcohol down. For me, it

843
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 7: wasn't wrecking my life. It was wrecking my relationship with Jesus.

844
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:18,239
Speaker 7: And so for me, I had to keep in front

845
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 7: of me why am I doing this? And then also

846
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:25,800
Speaker 7: just asking my husband, you know, having the conversations of

847
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:28,480
Speaker 7: you know, I need your support, this is how you

848
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 7: can support me, and this is how we can support

849
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:33,959
Speaker 7: our marriage, kind of like what Christy's saying, making suggestions

850
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:36,840
Speaker 7: like my husband loves to play pickball, so let's go

851
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:37,880
Speaker 7: play football together.

852
00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:40,839
Speaker 1: Or let's go out to dinner somewhere where I.

853
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,680
Speaker 7: Know I can get a mocktail, or because we love

854
00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:45,960
Speaker 7: to sit at the bar at a restaurant, so we

855
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 7: can still do that and still have our date night

856
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,440
Speaker 7: without me ordering a cocktail.

857
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:54,040
Speaker 1: But it has been really, really hard at times.

858
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,360
Speaker 7: But I love what John and Brett were talking about

859
00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:01,440
Speaker 7: getting to the deeper root of why is there an issue?

860
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 7: Like for me, the intimacy thing was a long history

861
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:09,400
Speaker 7: of dysfunction with you know, sexuality, because I had a

862
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:13,799
Speaker 7: lot of abuse early on in my childhood. But I

863
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:17,399
Speaker 7: also numbed a lot of that with alcohol. So I've

864
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 7: had to work through a.

865
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:21,360
Speaker 1: Lot of that. How do I feel comfortable in my

866
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 1: own skin?

867
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:26,080
Speaker 7: And that's hard doing that sober, doing the work is

868
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:30,239
Speaker 7: worth it, and that's what I've I've found. And you

869
00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:34,600
Speaker 7: can't change your partner, but you can come to them

870
00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 7: with love and grace and communication and you can build

871
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:43,759
Speaker 7: the relationship because Jesus is on your side and you

872
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:48,799
Speaker 7: know he wants your marriage to be strong. So I

873
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:51,359
Speaker 7: it's a lot of prayer time, like Christy said, a

874
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:54,799
Speaker 7: lot of time, a lot of time with tears and

875
00:43:54,840 --> 00:43:57,800
Speaker 7: prayers and just keeping the keeping the conversation open.

876
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 3: So from a husband's perspective, and I think you guys

877
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:03,920
Speaker 3: are sharing some great stuff and like the intimacy thing

878
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:07,520
Speaker 3: is real, right, And so I think one of the

879
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:11,840
Speaker 3: questions that I would encourage you wives who are listening,

880
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:16,120
Speaker 3: if that is you, is to go to your husband

881
00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:18,640
Speaker 3: and and not and not. You know, you can ask

882
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:21,480
Speaker 3: the same question two different ways, and it can mean

883
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:24,839
Speaker 3: two different things, right. So the question that I'm going

884
00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:26,880
Speaker 3: to encourage you to ask your husband is if he

885
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:29,000
Speaker 3: is resistant or if he's trying to pour you drinks.

886
00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, I would always try to get bread

887
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:31,080
Speaker 1: to drink more.

888
00:44:31,719 --> 00:44:35,040
Speaker 3: It make me feel better, you know, like I won't

889
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:37,360
Speaker 3: be as guilty, I won't feel as guilty, you know.

890
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:42,520
Speaker 3: Is to ask your husband, Hey, Hey, I'm I'm genuinely

891
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:46,279
Speaker 3: curious and I want to understand, like what if I

892
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:50,600
Speaker 3: stop drinking? What are you afraid of? Like like list, list,

893
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:53,239
Speaker 3: list your fears like, well, I'm afraid that, you know,

894
00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 3: we're not going to have sex as much. I'm afraid

895
00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:57,960
Speaker 3: that it's not going to be as fun. I'm not

896
00:44:58,239 --> 00:45:01,520
Speaker 3: like you can't address those things if you don't really

897
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:04,720
Speaker 3: know what's going on. And no, generally, like it's opposite

898
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:06,920
Speaker 3: in our relationship. I'm the one that tends to vomit

899
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:10,759
Speaker 3: my feelings more. But like you might have to try

900
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:15,440
Speaker 3: to really coax that out of him. But then it's like, okay, if, okay,

901
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:17,920
Speaker 3: he's afraid that we're not going to be intigeners, Okay,

902
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:21,960
Speaker 3: I can I just explain, like here's my plan for that, right,

903
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:24,480
Speaker 3: We're not gonna have as much fun. Hey what if

904
00:45:24,520 --> 00:45:28,040
Speaker 3: I told you that, like I'm gonna start planning a

905
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:30,239
Speaker 3: you know, I mean I don't know, right, but like

906
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 3: you can start then addressing those things. And then I

907
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:36,919
Speaker 3: think the opposite of that is say, hey, here's what

908
00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:40,839
Speaker 3: I'm really looking forward to for me. Aren't you even

909
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:43,359
Speaker 3: just some vanity stuff like I'm looking forward to less

910
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,880
Speaker 3: puffy's skin, I'm looking forward to this, like I'm looking

911
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:50,080
Speaker 3: forward to being fully present for the kids and the

912
00:45:50,120 --> 00:45:53,880
Speaker 3: grandkids because i feel like I'm not being that right now, Like,

913
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,480
Speaker 3: here's what I'm looking forward to, a more healthy spirituality

914
00:45:57,520 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 3: that I've been craving for so long, and let him

915
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:04,919
Speaker 3: know that, like, this is what I am really gonna

916
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:07,120
Speaker 3: get out of this. And then the final thing. And

917
00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:10,240
Speaker 3: this is what Brett would tell me all the time,

918
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 3: and it drove me crazy until I just realized, like

919
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 3: it's what needed to be done. And she would always

920
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:20,359
Speaker 3: say to me, I'm not the Holy Spirit for you,

921
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 3: and I think that's really hard, right, And so I

922
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:28,600
Speaker 3: mean there, let me put it this way. I probably

923
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:33,279
Speaker 3: would have stopped drinking earlier in my life if Brett

924
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:35,919
Speaker 3: would have like been the nagging wife, if she would

925
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:39,640
Speaker 3: have been like all on me, right, but A, I

926
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 3: don't know how long it would last. And yeah, I

927
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:45,239
Speaker 3: think there'd be resentment, right, And so Brett and this

928
00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 3: is you know, this is hard and it's different from

929
00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:50,680
Speaker 3: each person, right, some people need an intervention. But Brett,

930
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 3: and you can speak to this about why you kind

931
00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:55,480
Speaker 3: of chose to do this. But Brett's approach with me

932
00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 3: was always it's got to be him. I can't be

933
00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:00,440
Speaker 3: the Holy Spirit for like, like there were times I'd

934
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:02,680
Speaker 3: give it up for a month and then I'd be like,

935
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:04,279
Speaker 3: can I start drinking again?

936
00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 1: Like are you a killing? And she'd be like, that's

937
00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:07,840
Speaker 1: between you and the Lord.

938
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:10,319
Speaker 3: I'd be like, okay, I'm good, you know, and she

939
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:13,040
Speaker 3: was just always like, I can't be the Holy Spirit.

940
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:15,520
Speaker 3: And so I can say that when I finally did

941
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:17,919
Speaker 3: get to that point, the rock bottom, which we don't

942
00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 3: all need, but I did, then it.

943
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:22,680
Speaker 1: Finally the Holy Spirit was like this is it?

944
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:23,319
Speaker 4: You know?

945
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:26,239
Speaker 3: So Brett, I'd be curious, like that can't be the

946
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:26,880
Speaker 3: Holy Spirit?

947
00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:30,400
Speaker 5: Thing like your thoughts on that, it looks a little

948
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 5: bit different for everybody, kind of like you alluded to.

949
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:38,560
Speaker 5: I knew that for you an intervention was going to

950
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:42,640
Speaker 5: be not good at all, even to the point of

951
00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:46,240
Speaker 5: any time I approached the subject of hey you're drinking,

952
00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:48,040
Speaker 5: is king out of hand? Or even just if I'm

953
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:52,160
Speaker 5: brought aboord drink or alcohol, I mean, it was defense mode,

954
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 5: immediately put on the armor. This conversation is going to

955
00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 5: her fast. So I knew the intervention, Mambrige, it was

956
00:47:57,080 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 5: just not going to work. However, on the flip side

957
00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:03,680
Speaker 5: of that, yes, I did tell you all the time,

958
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:06,000
Speaker 5: I'm not the buy Spirit, but that doesn't mean that

959
00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:09,399
Speaker 5: I didn't have boundaries, and I think that that's really

960
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:12,000
Speaker 5: important too. I didn't, you know, just because I would

961
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 5: say that, Tim doesn't mean I let his drinking just

962
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:19,959
Speaker 5: trample all over me or the kids. Even to the point,

963
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,760
Speaker 5: as you know, when he hit his rock bottom moment

964
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:27,040
Speaker 5: and he had crossed a boundary that I had set

965
00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:31,799
Speaker 5: for myself. Had he not that night again but by

966
00:48:31,840 --> 00:48:35,840
Speaker 5: the grace of God just been so broken and humbled,

967
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:38,719
Speaker 5: and that night he reached out to a therapist for

968
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:42,399
Speaker 5: trauma counseling. Had he not taken those steps off that night,

969
00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:45,520
Speaker 5: I was going to ask for a separation because a

970
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:49,759
Speaker 5: boundary had been crossed and I needed to make sure

971
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:53,400
Speaker 5: that I was protecting myself and my kids emotionally. So

972
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:57,440
Speaker 5: I think, you know, it's definitely not okay to just

973
00:48:57,600 --> 00:49:01,319
Speaker 5: let things willingly, let the drinking get out of and then.

974
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:02,960
Speaker 1: Say I'm about the Holy Spirit. You need to figure

975
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:03,239
Speaker 1: it out.

976
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:05,400
Speaker 5: There definitely has to be boundaries in there, but it's

977
00:49:05,680 --> 00:49:06,920
Speaker 5: it's different for everybody.

978
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:11,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you for sharing that, Pape. I really appreciate it.

979
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:15,040
Speaker 1: I would just love to end kind of just quick

980
00:49:15,640 --> 00:49:16,480
Speaker 1: round robin.

981
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:21,920
Speaker 2: What has been the biggest gift to your marriage of

982
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:27,560
Speaker 2: living alcohol free. And I'll just start like we stopped fighting.

983
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:31,160
Speaker 2: We were fighting all the time when I was drinking.

984
00:49:31,239 --> 00:49:33,400
Speaker 2: I mean, you Cols and the listeners have heard me

985
00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:35,239
Speaker 2: say the story of like we would get in a fight.

986
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:37,719
Speaker 2: I would write notes on my phone to win the

987
00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:40,360
Speaker 2: argument as we were falling asleep, wake up. Tried to

988
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:42,799
Speaker 2: read the bullet points with one eye, couldn't read them,

989
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:44,719
Speaker 2: had no idea what the fight it was about. Not

990
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 2: speak the whole day because there was a fight the

991
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:50,320
Speaker 2: night before, and it goes on and on. So I

992
00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:53,080
Speaker 2: think that was one of the biggest gifts right away

993
00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 2: for us, is we just like kind of stopped fighting.

994
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:57,320
Speaker 1: There was immediately just like this piece.

995
00:49:57,960 --> 00:50:00,680
Speaker 2: And of course I'm not proclaiming to have the perfect

996
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:04,080
Speaker 2: marriage by any stretch, but it just has gotten so

997
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 2: so much better. So I'm curious for all of you

998
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:10,239
Speaker 2: gals and John, like, what's been the biggest gift to

999
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:12,960
Speaker 2: your marriage of living alcohol free?

1000
00:50:13,640 --> 00:50:13,920
Speaker 1: Nikki?

1001
00:50:14,160 --> 00:50:18,000
Speaker 10: Yeah, Hi, I haven't been talking much during this conversation

1002
00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:20,839
Speaker 10: because I've just been taking mental notes. It's been such

1003
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:23,560
Speaker 10: a rich conversation, But I believe the biggest gift has

1004
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:27,919
Speaker 10: been I've found my identity in Christ. We've been married

1005
00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 10: almost forty two years, and I really don't like to drink.

1006
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 10: I wasn't raised with it, and I picked up drinking

1007
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:38,440
Speaker 10: to fit in and to be a cool Christian and

1008
00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:43,000
Speaker 10: to be a better spouse and maybe support my spouse

1009
00:50:43,080 --> 00:50:44,160
Speaker 10: more in his business.

1010
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:47,759
Speaker 1: But when the Lord kept calling me to lay it down,

1011
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:49,320
Speaker 1: it was a struggle.

1012
00:50:49,520 --> 00:50:53,200
Speaker 10: When I finally decided to take my agenity in Christ

1013
00:50:53,280 --> 00:50:55,440
Speaker 10: and that and my husband, it really made me a

1014
00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:58,879
Speaker 10: happier person. It made me feel more healed and whole.

1015
00:50:58,960 --> 00:51:00,960
Speaker 10: There is still a lot of words to do, but

1016
00:51:01,560 --> 00:51:03,960
Speaker 10: my husband has noticed it too. I think I'm a

1017
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:05,240
Speaker 10: ship your personnel.

1018
00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:08,400
Speaker 2: You're such a happy person, Nikki, Like you're just one

1019
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 2: of the most encouraging, beautiful humans. So I can't even

1020
00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:13,560
Speaker 2: like even picture you unhappy.

1021
00:51:14,400 --> 00:51:18,600
Speaker 1: Oh thank you? It's sweep. Yeah yeah, bro, what about you?

1022
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:19,440
Speaker 1: What's been a gift?

1023
00:51:19,880 --> 00:51:22,520
Speaker 4: We were able to kind of shift the focus and

1024
00:51:22,719 --> 00:51:27,799
Speaker 4: meaning of our relationship and family. So everything we used

1025
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 4: to do used to be centered around alcohol. So that

1026
00:51:31,320 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 4: was kind of the goal of everything we did. If

1027
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:35,879
Speaker 4: we were on vacation, it's where's the bar, where's the drink,

1028
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 4: It's the coolest stocks for the beach. If we're at home,

1029
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:41,720
Speaker 4: you know, make sure we're at the porch with our drinks.

1030
00:51:41,800 --> 00:51:44,359
Speaker 4: If we're hanging out with friends, we're going to a gain,

1031
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:47,440
Speaker 4: where's the drinks at? And now we get to focus

1032
00:51:47,560 --> 00:51:50,719
Speaker 4: on either our relationship it's a date night, or our

1033
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:54,120
Speaker 4: kids if we're with our family, which just sounds so

1034
00:51:54,200 --> 00:51:56,279
Speaker 4: bad that back in the day the focus used to

1035
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 4: be where's the drink and not the kids. And seeing

1036
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:03,720
Speaker 4: that shift change isn't something that I had gone and expecting.

1037
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:06,360
Speaker 4: I don't think I saw that while I was drinking,

1038
00:52:06,480 --> 00:52:08,759
Speaker 4: But now looking back, I can see how much more

1039
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,760
Speaker 4: the focus is on relationships as a family together.

1040
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:13,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that.

1041
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:21,200
Speaker 2: It's my kids have got so enjoyable all of a sudden. Yeah, Heather,

1042
00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:22,879
Speaker 2: what's a gift?

1043
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:26,280
Speaker 7: So much more peaceful, I mean, there's so much less fighting.

1044
00:52:27,080 --> 00:52:30,359
Speaker 7: Like what Nikki's saying, I love myself more. I live

1045
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:35,120
Speaker 7: a more christ centered identity. But also I feel like

1046
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 7: I'm just a better wife and a better mom. I

1047
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:42,520
Speaker 7: can pray for my husband now, like if something's going on,

1048
00:52:42,840 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 7: you know, I'm not going to sleep intoxicated. I'm going

1049
00:52:47,080 --> 00:52:49,560
Speaker 7: to sleep present to the Holy Spirit, present to what

1050
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:52,600
Speaker 7: our needs are. I've prayed over my husband and with

1051
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:54,920
Speaker 7: my husband more in the last year than we ever

1052
00:52:55,040 --> 00:52:58,480
Speaker 7: have in our entire marriage, and that has truly been

1053
00:52:59,200 --> 00:52:59,919
Speaker 7: the biggest gift.

1054
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:01,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that.

1055
00:53:02,080 --> 00:53:04,759
Speaker 5: What about you, Brett Gosh, Yeah, I going all of this.

1056
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,480
Speaker 5: We fight less a lot, a lot less, I think too.

1057
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:12,400
Speaker 5: A lot of a lot of John's drinking always happened

1058
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:16,319
Speaker 5: in the evenings, which is prime family time.

1059
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:17,840
Speaker 4: So just.

1060
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:23,719
Speaker 5: I love watching him interact with the kids now in

1061
00:53:23,800 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 5: the evening and getting into the activities that they love.

1062
00:53:26,920 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 1: I mean, just yesterday I came home and he had.

1063
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 5: Done all this crafts with my daughter, and then he

1064
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:34,800
Speaker 5: went and had special time with my son, and I

1065
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:38,520
Speaker 5: just would never have happened before, or there would be

1066
00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:41,520
Speaker 5: these slices of it, but it would end badly because

1067
00:53:41,520 --> 00:53:44,239
Speaker 5: something would trigger him because he was already inebriated. So

1068
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,640
Speaker 5: it's been such a sweet time just watching watching him

1069
00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:49,720
Speaker 5: interact with the kiddos.

1070
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 9: Yeah, I love that, Lindsey, I would say it because

1071
00:53:56,040 --> 00:53:59,760
Speaker 9: my husband, the thing that he feared most was intimate

1072
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:03,839
Speaker 9: see or the alcohol would he thought he would get

1073
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:07,960
Speaker 9: more if I was drinking. Well, actually, since I've stopped,

1074
00:54:08,120 --> 00:54:12,640
Speaker 9: I feel more connected. When we're intimate, there's just more connection,

1075
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:15,480
Speaker 9: and so that was kind of counterintuitive.

1076
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:19,480
Speaker 2: So yeah, I'm glad you said that. I'm so glad

1077
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:21,120
Speaker 2: you said that because I know gals I've mentioned that

1078
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:22,759
Speaker 2: in the community too, that that's a fear.

1079
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:23,880
Speaker 1: So thank you.

1080
00:54:24,840 --> 00:54:27,200
Speaker 2: All Right, let's end with the representative of all the

1081
00:54:27,280 --> 00:54:29,400
Speaker 2: husbands and all the land lot of a male.

1082
00:54:30,680 --> 00:54:32,320
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think two things. I think.

1083
00:54:33,960 --> 00:54:38,480
Speaker 3: One is that our communication has gotten more open because

1084
00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:42,720
Speaker 3: I've had to write like I can't just drink away

1085
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:45,520
Speaker 3: my emotions. I can't just drink away to escape like

1086
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:48,799
Speaker 3: I have to sit with them. I have to express them.

1087
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:52,840
Speaker 3: Now that's not always like that hasn't always worked out perfectly.

1088
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:56,840
Speaker 3: And I think just in general, you know I've said this,

1089
00:54:57,000 --> 00:54:58,640
Speaker 3: and I know a lot of you have said this too,

1090
00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:00,960
Speaker 3: is like I stopped drinking. I feel like I took

1091
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:04,400
Speaker 3: a limitless pill, right like that, Like I got so

1092
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:09,719
Speaker 3: much more cognitive chitty back, right, And you just can't

1093
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:12,360
Speaker 3: put a price tag on how that. Yeah, that affects

1094
00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:15,879
Speaker 3: your marriage, but that affects your kids, that affects your work, right,

1095
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:19,239
Speaker 3: and so in so many ways, And you know, I

1096
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:21,520
Speaker 3: think that the what I write in the book. Is

1097
00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:25,840
Speaker 3: is that I just feel more present in all aspects

1098
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:28,920
Speaker 3: of life, and so I feel like I'm able to

1099
00:55:29,080 --> 00:55:33,239
Speaker 3: show up more and so I think, yeah, I would

1100
00:55:33,280 --> 00:55:34,560
Speaker 3: say that's that's the biggest.

1101
00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:36,279
Speaker 1: Thing for me. Yeah, so good.

1102
00:55:37,239 --> 00:55:40,000
Speaker 2: All right, my friends, this was such a beautiful conversation.

1103
00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:43,239
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for your time. I know how

1104
00:55:43,320 --> 00:55:45,400
Speaker 2: busy you all are, so I really really appreciate you

1105
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:48,480
Speaker 2: taking the hour to be with us and have this conversation.

1106
00:55:49,719 --> 00:55:51,879
Speaker 2: If you heard something that you want to chat about further,

1107
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:53,600
Speaker 2: please come hang out with us in the Love Life

1108
00:55:53,640 --> 00:55:56,880
Speaker 2: Sober Community. I'm gonna pop John's book in the show notes.

1109
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,400
Speaker 2: I'm also gonna pop our friend Caroline Buidler's book When

1110
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:01,480
Speaker 2: You Love Someone and Recovery in the show notes, because

1111
00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:03,239
Speaker 2: I think that would be a really good resource for

1112
00:56:03,360 --> 00:56:06,239
Speaker 2: some gal's listening. And I'll probably think of a few

1113
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:06,960
Speaker 2: others as well.

1114
00:56:07,719 --> 00:56:08,799
Speaker 1: Thank you for Chris.

1115
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 3: Go ahead, and I say, if you have a husband

1116
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:13,800
Speaker 3: who you like, maybe that he maybe he is feeling

1117
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:15,400
Speaker 3: convinctive right and.

1118
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:19,759
Speaker 1: Or maybe you want to encourage him, like you know.

1119
00:56:20,080 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 3: The Veritos Recovery is the nonprofit ministry that I started

1120
00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:27,799
Speaker 3: and where I especially love helping men. So you can

1121
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:30,560
Speaker 3: go to Veritasrecovery dot org and let me know or

1122
00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:31,880
Speaker 3: have them reach out.

1123
00:56:31,719 --> 00:56:32,279
Speaker 1: To me as well.

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00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:34,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you for saying that. I also put that

1125
00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:37,920
Speaker 2: link in our show notes. All right, friends, thank you

1126
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:41,160
Speaker 2: so much. We will see you next week. Thank you

1127
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:43,360
Speaker 2: for spending this time with me on Love Live Sober.

1128
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:46,959
Speaker 2: If today's conversation stirred something in your heart, don't rush

1129
00:56:47,040 --> 00:56:49,840
Speaker 2: past it, take it to prayer. If you're feeling ready

1130
00:56:49,960 --> 00:56:52,920
Speaker 2: for deeper connection and support, I'd love to invite you

1131
00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:56,280
Speaker 2: into the love Life Sober community, a grace filled, shame

1132
00:56:56,400 --> 00:57:00,680
Speaker 2: free space where real connection grows and lasting change takes root.

1133
00:57:00,920 --> 00:57:02,759
Speaker 2: You can find the link to join us in the

1134
00:57:02,800 --> 00:57:06,439
Speaker 2: show notes. Love Life Sober is part of the Life

1135
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:10,279
Speaker 2: Audio podcast network, where faith centered podcasts help you grow

1136
00:57:10,360 --> 00:57:12,919
Speaker 2: deeper in your walk with Christ. You can find more

1137
00:57:13,080 --> 00:57:17,280
Speaker 2: faith centered podcasts at lifeaudio dot com. Until next time,

1138
00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:21,080
Speaker 2: be gentle with yourself, stay curious, and trust God's promises.

1139
00:57:21,560 --> 00:57:22,920
Speaker 2: He has freedom waiting for you