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Speaker 1: Life audio hey paul thanks for joining me hi michael

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Speaker 1: good to be here thank you dove winning singer and

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Speaker 1: songwriter all the lush is our guest today you have

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Speaker 1: written so many songs paul i'll name a few of

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Speaker 1: them here open the eyes of my heart above all

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Speaker 1: hosanna i love those three you have a new album

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Speaker 1: as well that's why i wanted to have you on

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Speaker 1: yes we believe recorded live at a church in dallas

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Speaker 1: i want to talk about your career in songwriting but

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Speaker 1: let's talk about the album first what was your goal

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Speaker 1: with the new album and why name it Yes We Believe?

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Speaker 2: Good question. What was my goal? You know, I've been

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Speaker 2: with Integrity now 30 years, and the goal has always been,

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Speaker 2: you know, as a worship pastor, I find that a

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Speaker 2: lot of worship songs oftentimes kind of rise up or

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Speaker 2: begin in the midst of worship time, maybe a Friday

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Speaker 2: night prayer meeting or a Sunday morning. There's sometimes a

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Speaker 2: phrase that comes out of your mouth in the midst

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Speaker 2: of leading worship, or you hear someone pray. a certain

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Speaker 2: phrase and you're like, Ooh, Ooh, that's, that's me. That

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Speaker 2: could be potentially something that we sing. So the goal

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Speaker 2: would be, it was the same to this project was

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Speaker 2: the opportunity to just sort of take some of those

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Speaker 2: songs that have collected over the last couple of years

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Speaker 2: and try to choose the best ones. And, you know,

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Speaker 2: kind of where do I want to do this? I'm

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Speaker 2: not on staff at a church at this season, like

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Speaker 2: I was for, for 25 years, like I said, um,

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Speaker 2: So this was an opportunity, Christ for the Nations. It's

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Speaker 2: been there 70 years, and they have students from 50

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Speaker 2: different nations. And that got me excited, the possibility of

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Speaker 2: working with next generation kids that are excited about the Lord,

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Speaker 2: pursuing the Lord, pursuing education from nations around the world.

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Speaker 2: And I thought, yeah, let's move toward this. So it

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Speaker 2: turned out to be a perfect place to do a

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Speaker 2: live recording with a lot of the band members or

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Speaker 2: guys I've played with for over two decades. We've toured places,

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Speaker 2: you know, from India to Malaysia and Singapore, Korea, South Africa,

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Speaker 2: you know, just dear friends. So it just meant a

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Speaker 2: lot to do. And also live, there's something dynamic about

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Speaker 2: a live experience. And yes, we believe the bottom line

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Speaker 2: is real quick that the songwriting, the song itself, him

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Speaker 2: about in a conversation with the co-writer, and he was

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Speaker 2: just in conversation, said something like, you know, blah, blah, blah, but,

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Speaker 2: you know, do we really believe, you know, that it's

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Speaker 2: going to be this or that? And after he finished,

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Speaker 2: I said, you know, that's an interesting phrase. You said,

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Speaker 2: do we really believe? Like, that would actually be a

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Speaker 2: good beginning to a song. Like, do we really believe

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Speaker 2: in a man named Jesus, that he died to save

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Speaker 2: us on a Roman cross? Do we really believe in

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Speaker 2: the resurrection, in a place called heaven that waits for us.

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Speaker 2: Do we really believe so? It just became kind of

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Speaker 2: like an inventory of like, what do we really believe?

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Speaker 2: Maybe from a new believer to a mature believer, you know, like, huh.

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Speaker 2: So anyway, of course, the response on the chorus had

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Speaker 2: to be, yes, yes, we believe, you know, so.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of a declaration. That's a declaration for the

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Speaker 1: audience there, I guess. It's kind of a declaration in

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Speaker 1: a secular society, kind of like Daniel in his friends

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Speaker 1: there in Babylon. I don't know. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: I'm pushing there, but it seems like that's kind of

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Speaker 1: what it is with me. What was the audience? Was

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Speaker 1: it cross section of the church or was it mostly students?

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Speaker 2: Good cross section. A lot of young people, all of

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Speaker 2: the students were there. I don't know if they had

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Speaker 2: to be there, but it was again, quite beautiful to

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Speaker 2: look out. Some of them sort of brought along their

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Speaker 2: nation's flag, you know, so it was interesting throughout the

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Speaker 2: night to see certain flags at times. And, just sort

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Speaker 2: of a reminder that every nation, tribe, and tongue, as Revelation,

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Speaker 2: the book of Revelation describes, worshiping the Lord. And there

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Speaker 2: was just a lot of youthful energy. The church that

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Speaker 2: I was at for all those years in Texas, it

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Speaker 2: was close to a YWAM, Youth with a Mission base,

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Speaker 2: and teen mania. And so I've always loved and you

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Speaker 2: kind of feed off of just that, that young 20 something,

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Speaker 2: just met the Lord, just got to know the Lord,

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Speaker 2: reaching out, pressing into God. So, yeah. And then there was,

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Speaker 2: in addition to that, of course, a lot of folks

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Speaker 2: from just the, they call the Metroplex.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. The Metroplex. I know what you're talking about. So

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Speaker 1: how did you choose what tracks have been on this album? Some,

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Speaker 1: some of them are ones that I've, I've loved for years.

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Speaker 1: Stand it all to him has sits on the throne.

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Speaker 1: I think some of them are newer than that. So, yeah.

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Speaker 2: So interesting that you mentioned those because they were not intended.

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Speaker 2: You know, it was pretty much all new songs. And

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Speaker 2: yet in the midst of rehearsing for a day or two,

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Speaker 2: we sort of get to the end of this one

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Speaker 2: song that was very much written around the book of

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Speaker 2: Revelation and really a picture of, yeah, to him, to him,

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Speaker 2: to him who sits on the throne. And when we

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Speaker 2: finish that, of course, that's a direct verse in the Bible.

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Speaker 2: When we finished that song, it was just like this

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Speaker 2: holy hush. And I just, we were in that key

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Speaker 2: and we're just kind of staying there. And I just

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Speaker 2: could hear, to him who sits on the throne. And

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Speaker 2: eventually asked the worship leader at Christ for the Nations

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Speaker 2: to lead that. Maria, her name is. She's from Nigeria.

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Speaker 2: And boy, when she sings, there's something really deep and

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Speaker 2: special there. So that became like, let's do that tomorrow night.

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Speaker 2: During the recording, let's see what happens. So I love, again,

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Speaker 2: that's what I love about a live project is you're

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Speaker 2: leading worship, but you're open to anything could happen. You know,

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Speaker 2: anything we may, we could go into this old course

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Speaker 2: or we could just stay here and we could repeat

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Speaker 2: that or we could do an acapella moment or so. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I love that.

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Speaker 1: I love live recordings. One of my first ones that

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Speaker 1: I really fell in love with, there's a couple actually,

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Speaker 1: Hillsong had one years ago, like one of the first ones.

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Speaker 1: that Darlene Check came out with. And then Michael W.

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Speaker 1: Smith had a couple that were so good. And so

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Speaker 1: I love, love live recordings. There's something powerful about it.

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Speaker 1: It's almost indescribable, really. Two of your more popular songs

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Speaker 1: were Above All, which was covered by Michael W. Smith,

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Speaker 1: and Open the Eyes of My Heart. I always like

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Speaker 1: asking songwriters who saw something grow bigger than they thought

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Speaker 1: it could ever be, what they thought when they wrote it.

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Speaker 1: So when you were writing these two songs, Above All

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Speaker 1: and Open the Eyes of My Heart, I mean, they

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Speaker 1: might be years apart, but when you were writing those songs,

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Speaker 1: did you have a sense they could become bigger than

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Speaker 1: the average song?

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Speaker 2: Not necessarily, to be honest, especially Open the Eyes. And

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Speaker 2: the proof is it was on my second live album

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Speaker 2: I did with Integrity Music. And it was song, you know,

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Speaker 2: that's when we had cassettes and CDs. And it's song

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Speaker 2: number eight. So out of like 14 songs, there's something

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Speaker 2: in me that said, oh, let's make sure we do

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Speaker 2: this one. Yeah, this feels like we should probably put

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Speaker 2: this on the record. You know, if I had known

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Speaker 2: that the song would resonate with people as much as

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Speaker 2: it has, then I probably would have, like, put it

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Speaker 2: first or second, entitled the album, Open the Eyes of

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Speaker 2: My Heart. So I think that's proof that I think

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Speaker 2: at the time it was just one of many songs,

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Speaker 2: you know, there was a real fervent prayer movement happening

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Speaker 2: in our church. A lot of times, you know, Friday

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Speaker 2: nights as a worship band were just There was no

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Speaker 2: tracks or anything like that. We're just playing and providing

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Speaker 2: some background music and familiar choruses as people are praying.

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Speaker 2: And then so often just that phrase I had for

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Speaker 2: a couple of years, open the eyes of my heart.

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Speaker 2: It's from Ephesians 1.18. But, you know, Lord, we want

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Speaker 2: to see you. God, open our eyes. God, to see

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Speaker 2: you high and lifted up. God, pour out your power

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Speaker 2: and your love. You know, those were the kinds of prayers.

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Speaker 2: Pour out your Holy Spirit, Jesus. We call out to you,

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Speaker 2: you know. So it wasn't like, you know, sitting down,

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Speaker 2: I'm going to write a song. It was more of a,

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Speaker 2: almost a byproduct, just an unction and cry of the heart.

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Speaker 2: And then quickly, above all, I always sort of had

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Speaker 2: a place in the back of my journal as the

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Speaker 2: last page for any like title ideas, song title possibilities,

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Speaker 2: even in a conversation like this, or maybe a sermon

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Speaker 2: or whatever. Being in a prayer meeting, I'd hear something

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Speaker 2: and go, oh, that could be an interesting song title, maybe.

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Speaker 2: So I would always keep that. So I remember sitting

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Speaker 2: down in my little church there on Tuesday morning and

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Speaker 2: just opening up that and looking at some of the

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Speaker 2: titles and thought, above all, above all. And I just

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Speaker 2: remember thinking, what could I say about the Lord or

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Speaker 2: to the Lord with that phrase? You know, you're above all,

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Speaker 2: you're above all. kingdoms and you're above all powers you're

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Speaker 2: above all all education and wealth and treasures and so

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Speaker 2: I just began kind of writing down some of those

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Speaker 2: things that our culture esteems and it's like just to

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Speaker 2: declare that began to become clear like oh it'd be

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Speaker 2: cool to to write a song that just sort of

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Speaker 2: declares you're above all of this and you're above all

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Speaker 2: you know etc and then I ended up after playing

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Speaker 2: with that for a not two weeks straight, sitting at

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Speaker 2: the piano. But that's how songwriting works. You kind of

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Speaker 2: get a good start. And then an hour, I got

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Speaker 2: to go pick up my son from soccer practice or something.

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Speaker 2: But it's in the back of your mind and you're prayerfully,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's bouncing around. And I had a different

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Speaker 2: chorus for that. And we sang it at our church

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Speaker 2: for about a year. And it was almost a shout

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Speaker 2: to the Lord kind of a chorus. You know, there's

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Speaker 2: no way to measure what's you were. And then it

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Speaker 2: was like a real, but every time we sang it,

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Speaker 2: I just felt like something in my heart was like,

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Speaker 2: I think there's a better chorus.

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I think there's, I really believe in this A section.

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Speaker 2: So bottom line is I kind of pulled it off the,

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Speaker 2: out of rotation. And a few months later, Happened to

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Speaker 2: meet with Lenny LeBlanc, an old friend that, you know,

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Speaker 2: we hadn't seen each other in a while. Spent the

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Speaker 2: night at his house and kind of, let's try to

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Speaker 2: work on a few songs. I threw out some ideas

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Speaker 2: and he wasn't crazy. Threw out just that above all section.

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Speaker 2: And he was like, let me mess with that. And

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Speaker 2: the next morning he had that first line. What do

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Speaker 2: you think of that? Like, there's no way to measure

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Speaker 2: what you were. And crucified, laid behind a stone. You know,

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Speaker 2: you lived. to die, rejected. And so then we, you know,

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Speaker 2: jumped in there probably in 20 minutes, pretty much wrote itself.

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Speaker 2: And we were filled with emotion. We could just feel

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Speaker 2: the emotion of just, Lord, you know, whatever. Your brain

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Speaker 2: isn't immediately like, oh, this might catch on someday or

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Speaker 2: be on a CD. It's more of just like, wow, like, Lord,

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Speaker 2: receive this worship, receive this praise. God, you're, you know,

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Speaker 2: it really felt like that. So I'm sorry it's a

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Speaker 2: long answer, but.

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Speaker 1: That's an amazing answer. So above all, it began with

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Speaker 1: a different tune that you sang at your church for

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Speaker 1: a year. And then you thought, no, it needs to

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Speaker 1: be a little different. That's a great story. I always

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Speaker 1: think a song is a song when it gets its

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Speaker 1: own Wikipedia page. Both of these have their own Wikipedia pages.

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Speaker 1: That means nothing to you. But I think that's always funny. Paul,

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Speaker 1: what was the first song that you wrote that really

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Speaker 1: became big, though? I don't think it was these two.

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Speaker 1: It was years before that. So what was your first

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Speaker 1: big one?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good question. You know, like big, it's

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Speaker 2: hard to, you know, to find big per se. I

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Speaker 2: know what you mean. It's a fair question. Again, I'm

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Speaker 2: a worship leader at this little non-denominational church, kind of

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Speaker 2: a YWAM kind of church. It's very loose. It was very,

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Speaker 2: it's a great place to sort of grow as a

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Speaker 2: worship leader. There was a lot of grace. It was

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Speaker 2: all volunteers. So there was a lot of, um, Well.

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Speaker 1: Let me rephrase the question. What was the first song

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Speaker 1: you wrote that was sung outside your church by other people? Yeah, good.

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Speaker 3: Good.

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Speaker 2: Thanks. It was on the first Integrity album I did

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Speaker 2: with them, a live album called He Is Faithful. And

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Speaker 2: the first song was called I Love To Be In

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Speaker 2: Your Presence. And that really gave me a taste of

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Speaker 2: writing songs. I just finished a song in the key

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Speaker 2: of G. It was like, woo, yeah. All right, Lord,

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Speaker 2: we've And just out of my mouth came, Lord, we

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Speaker 2: love to be in your presence, just with your people,

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Speaker 2: just singing praises. And as that came out of my mouth,

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Speaker 2: it was one of the first times I had ever

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Speaker 2: gone and said, hey, I don't know, it sounds like

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Speaker 2: a song. I said on the mic, like, and I

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Speaker 2: looked at my drummer, it was like, I was like,

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Speaker 2: just follow me here. I was like, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: let's just sing that little phrase together. Love to be

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Speaker 2: in your presence with your people singing praises. I didn't

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Speaker 2: have words for that. And then, you know, so it

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Speaker 2: was the kind of church that was like, yeah, sure,

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Speaker 2: let's do it. And I clapped along and eventually finished

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Speaker 2: the song, writing it, you know, over the next week

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Speaker 2: or two with Ed Carr, our piano player. And that

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Speaker 2: was the first song on our first album I ever

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Speaker 2: did with Integrity. And that song got translated into Spanish

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Speaker 2: quickly and it was sung all over Latin America and

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Speaker 2: really caught on in the U.S. Now it's not as popular.

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Speaker 2: A lot of folks may not have heard that, but

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Speaker 2: That was a kind of a taste of, also on

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Speaker 2: that album, it was the first live version of Lord,

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Speaker 2: I lift your name on high. And there'd never been

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Speaker 2: a live worship version. It was still pretty new. And

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Speaker 2: most of the songs on that album I had written,

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Speaker 2: but not that one. So for years, people would think, oh,

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Speaker 2: I love your songs, especially Lord, I lift your name

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Speaker 2: on high. And I'd be like, I'll tell the author

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Speaker 2: you said that, you know, I'll pass that along. But Anyway,

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Speaker 2: that was a taste, and then the next album opened

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Speaker 2: the eyes of my heart, and there were some other

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Speaker 2: songs on there as well.

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Speaker 1: Let me ask you a question that's often debated, and

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Speaker 1: I know you've thought about this a lot, but what

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Speaker 1: makes a song a worship song? Is it the lyrics?

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Speaker 1: Is it the heart behind it? Is it whether the

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Speaker 1: congregation can sing it? Is it all of those things?

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Speaker 1: what makes a song a worship song?

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Speaker 2: Probably all of those would be included in the definition.

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Speaker 2: And you're very good, Michael. Who is to say for sure?

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Speaker 2: I guess just off the top of my head, my

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Speaker 2: instinct is a song that feels like you're singing a

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Speaker 2: prayer to the Lord. Of course, worship songs can be much,

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Speaker 2: you know, that's such a narrow definition. But for me,

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Speaker 2: even as a songwriter, when I'm finishing a song, I

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Speaker 2: ask myself, you know, does this feel like an authentic prayer?

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Speaker 2: Does this feel and sound like a sincere, authentic prayer

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Speaker 2: to the Lord? And to me, that feels like a

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Speaker 2: worship song or a praise song. Now, there are songs

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Speaker 2: where we sing about the Lord, you know, we're like, hey,

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Speaker 2: let's stand together and we love, you know, about the Lord.

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Speaker 2: And then there's songs to the Lord. So I guess

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Speaker 2: all of those can fall under the category of a

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Speaker 2: worship song. But I know that's a question. I don't

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Speaker 2: know if we'll ever have a definitive answer, but that's

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Speaker 2: my take is that, does it feel like you're singing

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Speaker 2: a prayer? Okay.

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Speaker 1: I'm just curious how, you know, we have this genre

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Speaker 1: in Christian music right now, and it seems like it

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Speaker 1: lacks a definition and everybody has their own definition, which

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Speaker 1: is fine because it's, it's, it's difficult to, I think biblically,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of difficult to define in the first place.

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Speaker 1: Like you said, it could have a lot of definitions.

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Speaker 1: And so, yeah, that, That's an interesting topic. Are there

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Speaker 1: any songs that you thought would be big that didn't

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Speaker 1: go big? Once again, that you thought, this is so good,

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Speaker 1: but other people didn't like it as much as you

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Speaker 1: liked it. Right.

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Speaker 2: I would say, yes, there's at least a handful of

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Speaker 2: songs over the years, talking many years, that I had

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Speaker 2: this feeling like, man, this feels like it's really going

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Speaker 2: to resonate with people. You know, it's really going to.

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Speaker 2: I think they'll grab onto it quickly and it could be,

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Speaker 2: it feels like a prayer they might want to sing

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Speaker 2: to the Lord. And quite often I'm wrong. I was

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Speaker 2: wrong most of the time. Maybe one other example, you

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Speaker 2: may have heard the song, Your Name. Your name is

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Speaker 2: a strong and mighty tower. Your name. And that was

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Speaker 2: a song written right from scripture. It came really quick

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Speaker 2: and I immediately demoed that. And I was surprised how...

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Speaker 2: I was almost not surprised that I remember we finished

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Speaker 2: that with Glenn Packham. He's a pastor now in Southern California.

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Speaker 2: But it was just him and I in a room.

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Speaker 2: We're reading scripture out loud, just kind of prayerfully. And that,

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Speaker 2: as morning dawns and evening fades. Bottom line, the song

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Speaker 2: was done in 20 minutes. And there was a sense like,

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Speaker 2: I think people are going to connect with this. And

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Speaker 2: I would say I probably sing that song anytime I

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Speaker 2: do a.

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Speaker 1: Night of worship.

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Speaker 2: And people... people love to sing that. So I'm, I'm,

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Speaker 2: I'm grateful. That's the goal is to try to write

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Speaker 2: songs that people can say, Oh, this feels like a

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Speaker 2: prayer to the Lord, you know?

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Speaker 1: But what, what does that tell you though? Cause you've

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Speaker 1: had songs that you didn't think would go big that did.

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Speaker 1: And then what songs that you thought would be, would

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Speaker 1: resonate worldwide and, and did not. I mean, is that,

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Speaker 1: is there a lesson? Is there a spiritual lesson there

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Speaker 1: about what God breathes all in?

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Speaker 2: Great question is I have no idea. And most of

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Speaker 2: us have no idea. There's really not a formula as

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Speaker 2: much as we would like to think there is. I

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Speaker 2: think just showing up with your loaves and fishes, that's

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Speaker 2: always like this mental image I have is like, you know,

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Speaker 2: we don't know if this whatever we write today is

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Speaker 2: going to resonate and really connect with people all over

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Speaker 2: the world. We have no control over that. But we

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Speaker 2: do have control over showing up. We can show up

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Speaker 2: with some ideas and open up the scriptures and and

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Speaker 2: maybe ideas that we've got from sermons that we've heard,

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Speaker 2: or podcasts, or even above all, it's funny, I think,

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Speaker 2: where did I get that? Occasionally, I'll see a commercial,

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Speaker 2: even like a drug commercial, and it'll be like, oh, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,

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Speaker 2: it has these benefits and that, but above all, it blah, blah, blah, blah,

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Speaker 2: you know, it'll help with your indigestion, and every once

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Speaker 2: in a while, I'll see a commercial where they'll like say,

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Speaker 2: but above all, and I'll go, hey, I mean, I

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Speaker 2: don't even remember where that title came from, but it

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Speaker 2: could have been from a commercial, but the point is

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Speaker 2: collecting these inspired ideas and then making time showing up

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Speaker 2: to kind of prayerfully sing these ideas to the Lord

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Speaker 2: and see if, you know, maybe you get another line

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Speaker 2: and maybe there's a phrase or, Oh, this makes me

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Speaker 2: think of a scripture or someone, let me go to

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Speaker 2: that scripture.

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Speaker 1: And, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 2: And so it's a mystery, you know, and that's the,

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Speaker 2: That's the joy. It's almost fishing-like. You show up with

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Speaker 2: your rod and your reel and your aster. But you

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Speaker 2: don't know if you'll catch anything or not. But at

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Speaker 2: least you showed up. And if you don't show up,

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Speaker 2: you're definitely not going to catch anything. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: If God breathes on it, it works. That's the answer.

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Speaker 1: That's the answer. But you never know what God's going

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Speaker 1: to breathe on it from your side. What advice? You've

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Speaker 1: been in this business for decades, this ministry for decades.

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Speaker 1: Maybe I should rephrase it. What advice would you give

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Speaker 1: today's Christian singers, those who are well-known and those who

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Speaker 1: want to do what? you've done for a living? What

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Speaker 1: advice would you give them?

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Speaker 2: It'd be good to know if you're called. Are you

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Speaker 2: part of a fellowship and are there people in your

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Speaker 2: life who have sort of affirmed that there's a calling

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Speaker 2: on your life? You may love to sing, you may

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Speaker 2: love to do this, but actually maybe your primary gift

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Speaker 2: is administration, or it might be sales, or it might be,

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Speaker 2: you know, some kind of legal or technical mind where you,

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Speaker 2: are you called? It's interesting. I'm not prepared for that question,

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Speaker 2: but that's the first thing that comes to mind. You know,

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Speaker 2: it says in 1 Chronicles that David appointed the Levites.

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Speaker 2: They were appointed and they would, says in 1 Chronicles 25,

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Speaker 2: that they were trained and skilled in music for the Lord.

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Speaker 2: So that implies that if you do feel called, then

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Speaker 2: make sure you're putting in the time and effort. You

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Speaker 2: be trained and skilled. Make sure you're practicing every day,

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Speaker 2: whatever that might be, vocally, keyboards, guitar, you know, just

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Speaker 2: doing that consistently. So that's the skill part. Psalm 33.3 says,

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Speaker 2: play skillfully. And it doesn't say, just play. Just play.

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Speaker 2: It doesn't matter. Just play. No, play skillfully if you're called.

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Speaker 2: But you want to make sure at the same time

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Speaker 2: you're cultivating a sincere, authentic, devotional life. with Jesus, that

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Speaker 2: you're in the scriptures, that you are in a group

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Speaker 2: of people, could be a small group, could be a handful,

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Speaker 2: hopefully a part of a larger group, but a few

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Speaker 2: close friends who are pursuing God in the way that

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Speaker 2: you want to pursue the Lord and, you know, meet

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Speaker 2: for prayer, meet for Bible study, hang out. It's so important.

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Speaker 2: We can't do this by ourselves. We need to surround

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Speaker 2: ourselves with other people that are fervent and sincere in

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Speaker 2: their pursuit of the Lord.

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Speaker 1: Final question for you then. You discussed just then what

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Speaker 1: advice you would give potential Christian singers or those who

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Speaker 1: want to get in this ministry. What about those who

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Speaker 1: are already on stage and maybe give them some lessons

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Speaker 1: you've learned over the past several decades of doing what

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Speaker 1: you've done?

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Speaker 2: Great question. Again, off the top of my head, I

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Speaker 2: think there's sometimes we see these YouTube videos and everybody

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Speaker 2: looks amazing. They sound amazing. They're just like, then I

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Speaker 2: would go back to my little church in Texas and

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Speaker 2: we're all volunteers. And, you know, different age groups. I

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Speaker 2: think we will never look like that. We'll never be

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Speaker 2: as cool as that YouTube situation there. So part of

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Speaker 2: it is taking stock of who you are and believing

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Speaker 2: and trusting how God made you and not feeling like

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Speaker 2: you have to be like this person. You can be

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Speaker 2: inspired by the singer or inspired by that person. But

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Speaker 2: if you try to be Phil Wickham, that's going to

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Speaker 2: be weird. Be the most authentic version of yourself. And

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Speaker 2: I think that happens when you're in the midst of

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Speaker 2: a healthy fellowship environment, as I just mentioned earlier, where

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Speaker 2: you're growing in the Lord and don't feel like you

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Speaker 2: have to put on some presentation, performative thing. Yes, practice

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Speaker 2: and play well and all that, but be who you are.

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Speaker 2: Be that person. Be the most authentic version of yourself. Yeah, so...

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Speaker 2: If I came to your house and knocked on your door,

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Speaker 2: you would be like, hey, what's up, Paul?

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Speaker 1: How you doing?

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Speaker 2: Praise the Lord.

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Speaker 1: You guys ready to worship the Lord? Yeah.

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Speaker 2: You know what I mean? Like, I don't think so.

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Speaker 2: I think you'd be more, hey, good morning. Hey, thanks

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Speaker 2: for being here. Good morning. Hey, let's stand together. Like,

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Speaker 2: whatever best authentic version of yourself. I keep coming back

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Speaker 2: to that, I guess, is don't try to be like

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Speaker 2: these other people. Trust how the Lord made you and

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Speaker 2: be that. be the best version of that too. You know,

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Speaker 2: you don't want to get up there and be like,

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Speaker 2: if you had a bad week, you know, tell everybody

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Speaker 2: about your bad week. You know, you can say, hey,

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Speaker 2: good morning. Let's stand together. We're going to worship the Lord.

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Speaker 2: And some of you may have had a difficult week.

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Speaker 2: Maybe some of you had a mountaintop week, you know,

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Speaker 2: but nonetheless, either way, let's sing our prayers to the

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Speaker 2: Lord this morning. And I'd begin that first song and boom,

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Speaker 2: you know, anyway, that's my advice.

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Speaker 1: That is good advice. I love that advice. Be authentic.

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Speaker 1: I think the next generation wants authenticity, and I think

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Speaker 1: that's what you're saying there. The album is Yes, We Believe.

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Speaker 1: We've been talking to Paul Belash. Paul, thanks so much.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Michael. Thank you for your time.

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Speaker 3: If you enjoyed today's interview, please make sure to subscribe

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Speaker 3: and share the episode with a friend. A big thanks

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Speaker 3: to the team at Life Audio for their partnership with

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Speaker 3: us on the podcast. If you go to lifeaudio.com, you

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Speaker 3: will find dozens of other faith-centered podcasts and their network.

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Speaker 1: See you next time.