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Speaker 1: So as sail though, isn't it tell me this? Because

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Speaker 1: I often wonder as I'm scrolling through X and I'm

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Speaker 1: seeing it all, and I wonder if I went to

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Speaker 1: the shops and asked ten people, you know, who were

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Speaker 1: lining up behind me to pay for groceries, if they'd

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Speaker 1: heard of these people, or if they'd read anything or

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Speaker 1: seen anything they've done, if they cared, if they like,

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Speaker 1: would they all say no? Like, how do we determine

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Speaker 1: what is real and what we need to fight versus

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Speaker 1: what's just taking up space? It is chaotic and doesn't

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Speaker 1: deserve attention.

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Speaker 2: The million dollar question is how big of a problem

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Speaker 2: is this? Is it just online? As they say, I

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Speaker 2: think that's a little bit of a false dichotomy, because,

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Speaker 2: especially if we are talking about how it's affecting the

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Speaker 2: youth or even just twenty something year olds, their life

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Speaker 2: is online. That is where they get their ideas from.

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Speaker 1: So true.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So I don't think there's as much of a

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Speaker 2: distinction as people would like to point out. That being said,

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Speaker 2: all we really have in terms of how big this

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Speaker 2: is on the is anecdotal evidence. And I can tell

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Speaker 2: you that I've interviewed almost one hundred people now for

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Speaker 2: my book, Christians, non non Jewish, just individuals that are

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Speaker 2: part of either church going or conservative communities. And they

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Speaker 2: are telling me that they are seeing this, that they

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Speaker 2: are seeing this from their peers. And even I was

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Speaker 2: at an event the other day and Ted Cruz was

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Speaker 2: speaking and he said he has seen more anti Semitism

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Speaker 2: coming from Christians in this last year than he's seen

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Speaker 2: in his whole life. And he was speaking to a

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Speaker 2: room full of Christian Zionists and he said to them, now,

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Speaker 2: you all might feel very comfortable in your churches and

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Speaker 2: you might think, oh, this is not affecting me. My

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Speaker 2: pastor is very supportive of Israel, supportive of America, supportive

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Speaker 2: of the West. But if you talk to the younger

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Speaker 2: people in your churches, you're going to see some of

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Speaker 2: this stuff coming out of them. And like I told

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Speaker 2: you before we started talking, it's not just anti Semitism.

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Speaker 2: These people are pushing pro China, pro Russia, pro Venezuela,

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Speaker 2: and pro Iranian narratives. They are denying that.

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Speaker 1: These well that because often people will say, oh, well,

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Speaker 1: you know, if it's anti Semitic, that's still not something

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Speaker 1: I like. But it doesn't impact me. So if I

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Speaker 1: go on my merry way, well that's not the case.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, it's not at all. And as we've

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Speaker 2: seen from history, as soon as anti Semitism takes hold,

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Speaker 2: everything else just begins to rot and disintegrate. And I

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Speaker 2: think another thing to think about when you're trying to

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Speaker 2: determine how big of a problem this is is you

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Speaker 2: don't really need a big critical mass in order for

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Speaker 2: the needle to be moved. For example, everyone knows it

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Speaker 2: only takes ten percent of a population to start a revolution,

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Speaker 2: Well how much.

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Speaker 1: Does it take? How much?

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Speaker 2: What percentage of the population does it take to change

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Speaker 2: a party? I would I would take a gander that

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Speaker 2: it's less than five percent. So if you have, you know,

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Speaker 2: less than five percent, but still something nearer that of

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Speaker 2: the Republican Party that is now pushing a very different

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Speaker 2: vision of America, then I would argue what Trump has

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Speaker 2: been fighting for since his first term, then that could

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Speaker 2: have a real impact. Because politics is downstream for culture.

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Speaker 2: So if they impact the culture a significant amount, it's

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Speaker 2: only a matter of time before there's state sanctioned policy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so we look at young people in particular, and

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Speaker 1: you're right, And I used to fight for this. When

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Speaker 1: I was fighting for these Online Safety Act in Australia,

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Speaker 1: the social media laws to try and keep kids safe online,

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Speaker 1: and I would say to you know, archaic parent types, Well,

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Speaker 1: there's no longer a difference between life online and offline.

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Speaker 1: It's just you move seamlessly between the two. In fact,

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Speaker 1: probably more so online than anything else. How do we

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Speaker 1: reverse the rot or do we have to just ride

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Speaker 1: off an entire generation that you're even in Australia, kindergarten

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Speaker 1: kids are told we're racist, we're colonizers, we came here,

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Speaker 1: we're awful people. We must say sorry everywhere we go.

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Speaker 1: We must acknowledge this is not our land. You know,

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Speaker 1: all of these things just chip away at your sense

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Speaker 1: of self and the way in which you view your country.

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Speaker 1: And we need kids in this country to love Australia

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Speaker 1: to the point they're willing to fight for it. Why

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Speaker 1: would any child in my country now, when I see

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Speaker 1: the rotten, the decay, stand up and say I'm going

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Speaker 1: to fight to save Australia when we have been telling

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Speaker 1: them for a decade, for two decades, that Australia is racist, awful,

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Speaker 1: It sucks that we're bad people. No wonder.

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Speaker 2: It's such a challenge, especially because we know that the

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Speaker 2: left is playing into those tropes of wanting to hate

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Speaker 2: your country because they believe it is imprealistic or sinful.

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Speaker 2: But as we're increasingly increasingly saying, as we're increasingly seeing

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Speaker 2: excuse me, young people who are as sensibly conservative or

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Speaker 2: America first, and they're putting forth the same talking points

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Speaker 2: of America being imperialistic, responsible for all of the problems

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Speaker 2: that we're seeing around the world, and putting forth these utopian,

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Speaker 2: kind of pacifistic ideas that if we just hermetically seal

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Speaker 2: ourselves off in a giant dome in twenty twenty five,

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Speaker 2: that somehow all of our problems will go away. It's

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Speaker 2: so unrealistic. I mean, it's a very convenient answer to

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Speaker 2: the society's problems, but unfortunately the world just doesn't work

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Speaker 2: that way. And I think that's one of the reasons

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Speaker 2: why it's so attractive, is because when you have young

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Speaker 2: people that are so economically shortchanged, so full of shame

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Speaker 2: just for being male or white, and not able to

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Speaker 2: assert their manlyhood, obsess with screens, so not even getting

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Speaker 2: the proper oxytocin that they need from real interactions with

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Speaker 2: human beings. They're looking for somebody to blame for their

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Speaker 2: raid and their depression. And when you have a generation

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Speaker 2: that's brought up in despair and not taught to embrace

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Speaker 2: personal responsibility, like Charlie Kirk would have said to them,

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Speaker 2: then they're going to look for a convenience scapegoat. And

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Speaker 2: that scapegoat more often than not ends up being the Jews.

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Speaker 2: So how do we fight this? I mean, I think

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Speaker 2: that's really a bigger problem in terms of our society's

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Speaker 2: obsession with screens and just the horrible influence that has.

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Speaker 2: And I would encourage everybody to read This is quite

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Speaker 2: off topic, but I would encourage everybody to read Claire

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Speaker 2: Morrel's book, and you should have her on your show.

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Speaker 2: She wrote a book called The Tech Exit, and she

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Speaker 2: actually elucidated how there are communities all over the world

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Speaker 2: and these are not like hermetic, amish like communities. They're regular,

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Speaker 2: integrated people like you and I who have committed to

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Speaker 2: a lifestyle away from screens, particularly with their children. And

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Speaker 2: she shows you that it's much much easier than you

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Speaker 2: would imagine that it would be. I mean, people are

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Speaker 2: so turned off by this idea because they're like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I could just never do that. But you know, but

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Speaker 2: if you read her book, you actually see these incredible

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Speaker 2: innovative solutions that you would have never thought about. So,

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Speaker 2: you know, I think that speaks to that kind of

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Speaker 2: rot of our young people. Speaks to a much bigger

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Speaker 2: problem than just politics.

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Speaker 1: I think you're right, absolutely. Who are they turning to? Then?

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Speaker 1: So is it like for intense like surely Tucker Calson's

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Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I'm not saying I'm a spring chicken,

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Speaker 1: but if you're aighteen, do you really look at Tucker

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Speaker 1: and go, yeah, he's my man? I mean Candice as well, Like,

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Speaker 1: is she really still I remember a girl at an

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Speaker 1: exercise place, not a gym, but where they put like

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Speaker 1: machines on you and give you like abs, which doesn't work,

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Speaker 1: by the way, I tried that, but the young girl

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Speaker 1: was saying he was saying something to me, and she

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Speaker 1: was putting on this machine. You know about how amazing

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Speaker 1: Candice owns is. And she would have been a twenty

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Speaker 1: one year old. It's about six months ago, and she

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Speaker 1: was just talking with such excitement. Yeah, she just calls

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Speaker 1: out all the lies, Yeah, all the lies that we've

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Speaker 1: been taught. You know, who poses the greatest threat out

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Speaker 1: of all of these types the types that we've heard of.

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Speaker 2: Right, it's a great question, and I think it depends

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Speaker 2: on the sphere of influence. So Candace is actually very

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Speaker 2: very attractive to young girls and also single moms. She

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Speaker 2: does a lot of content that relates to like pop culture,

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Speaker 2: and I think people are very attractive to that because

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Speaker 2: she does it in this very edgy sort of way,

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Speaker 2: and then they end up getting sucked into all of

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Speaker 2: her conspiratorial politics. So I think people who write her

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Speaker 2: off just because the political class has sort of disowned her,

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Speaker 2: I think they're making an error and doing so because

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Speaker 2: if you like, like anecdotally, if you just talk to

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Speaker 2: people like you were doing, there's a lot of people

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Speaker 2: who are attracted to her for her cultural heart takes, and.

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Speaker 1: So it helps her the same thing where you kind

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Speaker 1: of lure people in with stuff that you know is

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Speaker 1: kind of neither he nor they're not too controversial. It's

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Speaker 1: pop culture. It's my take. Yeah, I'm clever, I'm funny,

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Speaker 1: I can you know, And then once they're in there

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Speaker 1: and they're engaged and they trust you, then it's filtered,

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Speaker 1: just you feed them little bits of the other stuff

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Speaker 1: that is just that. Normally, if you just heard cold

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Speaker 1: turkey from a stranger, you be like, what, But she

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Speaker 1: thinks so?

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Speaker 2: I think. So she did a whole thing about Blake Lively.

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Speaker 2: I know housewives were really into that thing. And when

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Speaker 2: I talk to men, they'll say, yeah, my wife is

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Speaker 2: really into Candae And I don't know. I mean, Tucker

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Speaker 2: is a different story, right, because he appeal appeals to

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Speaker 2: people that are more I would say, politically aware, but

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Speaker 2: you know, I mean people are attracted to them because

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Speaker 2: they are capitalizing on your own emotions, and they are

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Speaker 2: weaponizing the rage and the anger and the confusion and

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Speaker 2: the bitterness that you feel. And they're instead of teaching

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Speaker 2: you not to play into your worst instincts and actually

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Speaker 2: to be reflective and to channel what you are feeling

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Speaker 2: in a very positive way, people like Candice and Tucker

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Speaker 2: are actually validating all of those feelings and essentially saying

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Speaker 2: to channel it into some sort of revolutionary activity, just

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Speaker 2: like the left does a sort of tear it all

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Speaker 2: down mentality. And this is so damaging for a functioning,

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Speaker 2: flourishing society.

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Speaker 1: It's such a good point because I mean, I'm less

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Speaker 1: so now that I'm older, but you know, when you're younger,

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Speaker 1: anyone that's trying to hold you to account, you avoid,

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Speaker 1: like the plague right Like it's exhausting. I would sometimes

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Speaker 1: say to my partner, you know, I would say, oh gosh,

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Speaker 1: like this person just cut me off in a car,

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Speaker 1: like what an asshole? And he'd be like, well, to

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Speaker 1: be honest, you were actually driving a little bit of

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Speaker 1: radically and to be honest, you probably And I'd be like,

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Speaker 1: can you just say yes, he's an asshole and move on?

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Speaker 1: Like I just I don't you know. That's kind of

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Speaker 1: the equivalent of what they do.

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Speaker 2: They have those instincts within us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, and whatever you're feeling, they actually just they

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Speaker 1: they may they reassure you that it's not your fault,

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Speaker 1: that it's something bigger at play that's evil. It's generally

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Speaker 1: the Jews, depending on who you're talking about, and.

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Speaker 2: You're the victim, there's a huge victim.

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Speaker 1: And then even and you can apply it to anything

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Speaker 1: in your life. When they say they're like cannons, they're

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Speaker 1: lying to you. They you know what they are, That

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Speaker 1: speeding ticket was not legitimate. They're life you know, you

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Speaker 1: can actually use the basis of what they're trying to do,

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Speaker 1: and it's like, what a what a decay in society

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Speaker 1: if we all some no personal responsibility and this blame culture.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely As you said, I think you touch and use

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Speaker 2: the word accountable, and there's no personal accountability in the

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Speaker 2: world of Candice and Tucker.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and there's when she chases receipts coming this will

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Speaker 1: drop it this time. Oh my gosh, just got off

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Speaker 1: the phone. I've got evidence, we never see it, and

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Speaker 1: then we never have it. Guys, I stuffed up yet,

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Speaker 1: Like there's no accountability there. No.

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Speaker 2: I think that's a really good point, and I think

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Speaker 2: that points to just how overloaded and inundated we are

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Speaker 2: in the information space that there's no recall anymore. I

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Speaker 2: don't think our brains have been developed to be able

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Speaker 2: to process the amount of information via the Internet that

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Speaker 2: we take in every single day. So when we're seeing

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Speaker 2: content from dozens and dozens of influencers just for scrolling,

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Speaker 2: just from scrolling five minutes on X, how are we

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Speaker 2: going to remember all of that stuff? And so a

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Speaker 2: lot of these influencers can get away with things because

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Speaker 2: they're not going to be held to account for their words.

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Speaker 2: There's no there's nobody.

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Speaker 1: Hey what about this? Because we've had ten thousand other

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Speaker 1: things exactly up until Wow, this is I mean, it feels,

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Speaker 1: it feels enormous, the enormity of this issue. When does

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Speaker 1: your book come out and does that kind of the

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Speaker 1: final chapter solve the problem?

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Speaker 2: Wouldn't that be amazing If I could publish a book

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Speaker 2: and just come just it would just be like my

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Speaker 2: magic wand it would be my magic book and we

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Speaker 2: could and we could get back to how excited everybody

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Speaker 2: was when Trump had just won the election. Yeah, for

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Speaker 2: his second term. But I don't know exactly when it

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Speaker 2: will come out. I know it will be sometime in

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty six because I'm missing the deadline for the

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Speaker 2: first manuscript, so it's taking a while. I'm doing a

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Speaker 2: lot of other things, a lot of other projects, but

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Speaker 2: all having to do with this kind of stuff. So

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to move the needle the best I can,

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Speaker 2: and hopefully the book will just provide more exposure in

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Speaker 2: terms of what's going on behind the scenes. I'm really

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Speaker 2: talking to maga conservatives and the pulitical class because I

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Speaker 2: believe that they not so much have their head in

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Speaker 2: the sands, but I just think that they're largely unaware

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Speaker 2: of what's happening in the details of it and who's

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Speaker 2: and who's contributing to it. So hopefully it will move

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Speaker 2: the needle in among those people. Because I'm not some

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Speaker 2: never Trumper or some Bulwark Republican like I really believe

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Speaker 2: in MAGA principles, though I know those can be hard

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Speaker 2: to pin down sometimes since Trump is so transactional, but

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Speaker 2: I want us to be reminded of those and I

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Speaker 2: want us to be asserting our redlines so we don't

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Speaker 2: allow people to hijack them for their nefarious purposes of

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Speaker 2: taking power and building America and their own authoritarian image.

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Speaker 1: Brilliant. You are so brilliant. You see this like no

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Speaker 1: one else, and I've covered the topic on so many occasions,

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Speaker 1: but the context and the clarity and the insights you

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Speaker 1: provide our world class. So thank you so much. We

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Speaker 1: can't waite Field Bullcay and come h wonderful.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much for having me