1 00:00:02,730 --> 00:00:03,710 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:04,590 --> 00:00:07,470 Speaker 2: Hey, Jad, thanks for joining me. Thanks for having me, Michael. 3 00:00:08,170 --> 00:00:11,770 Speaker 1: Jad Gillies, singer with Hillsong Worship, which has new music 4 00:00:11,810 --> 00:00:13,830 Speaker 1: for the first time, I think in about four years. 5 00:00:14,430 --> 00:00:16,350 Speaker 1: Three singles are out now, and they have a new 6 00:00:16,430 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: album coming out next year. Of course, the three singles, 7 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 1: I should say, are Praise the Lord, Hallelujah, Amen. That's 8 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:24,660 Speaker 1: one of them. It sounds like three songs. 9 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,860 Speaker 2: The second song is As You Are. 10 00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 1: The third one is Flood. 11 00:00:30,220 --> 00:00:31,140 Speaker 2: All recorded live. 12 00:00:31,220 --> 00:00:34,979 Speaker 1: I love live music. jad hillsong worship has helped shape 13 00:00:35,020 --> 00:00:39,269 Speaker 1: how churches around the world have sung for decades now 14 00:00:40,370 --> 00:00:43,250 Speaker 1: hundreds and hundreds of millions on spotify streams on spotify 15 00:00:43,270 --> 00:00:45,430 Speaker 1: i was looking at the numbers today it's incredible how 16 00:00:45,450 --> 00:00:49,229 Speaker 1: many streams you guys have on spotify after several years 17 00:00:49,270 --> 00:00:51,050 Speaker 1: out of the spotlight though you guys have new music 18 00:00:51,409 --> 00:00:54,430 Speaker 1: why is now the right time to release new music 19 00:00:54,470 --> 00:00:56,670 Speaker 1: jad yeah well that's i. 20 00:00:56,650 --> 00:00:59,670 Speaker 2: Mean that's a really good question i think which we're 21 00:00:59,710 --> 00:01:03,060 Speaker 2: still asking ourselves really um But I mean, the story 22 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:08,660 Speaker 2: goes is that after a long time of not releasing music, 23 00:01:08,700 --> 00:01:12,620 Speaker 2: and even we hadn't recorded a live project with Hillsong 24 00:01:12,660 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 2: Worship since 2018. So this time last year, we kind 25 00:01:17,420 --> 00:01:22,209 Speaker 2: of sneakily recorded an EP just to really see, should 26 00:01:22,250 --> 00:01:25,290 Speaker 2: we still be doing this? Is this something that God 27 00:01:25,330 --> 00:01:28,830 Speaker 2: still wants us to do? And we didn't really create 28 00:01:28,890 --> 00:01:32,959 Speaker 2: much swell around it. We just wanted to do it 29 00:01:33,380 --> 00:01:37,220 Speaker 2: and see how everything went and whether or not we 30 00:01:37,260 --> 00:01:41,759 Speaker 2: felt like God was with us or He was leading us. 31 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 2: And so we did that. And the feeling amongst our team, 32 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,560 Speaker 2: amongst our leadership, and even just our church in general was, yeah, 33 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:54,060 Speaker 2: we should still be doing this. We need to be 34 00:01:54,100 --> 00:01:56,500 Speaker 2: good stewards of what is still in our hand and 35 00:01:57,830 --> 00:02:01,490 Speaker 2: So we recorded a full album this year and the 36 00:02:01,550 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 2: process has been, you know, obviously we've had a bunch of, 37 00:02:05,330 --> 00:02:10,060 Speaker 2: you know, super talented and valuable team move on to 38 00:02:10,139 --> 00:02:13,919 Speaker 2: other things. And so it's been a challenge because those 39 00:02:14,020 --> 00:02:18,020 Speaker 2: trusted voices and some of those really kind of senior 40 00:02:18,060 --> 00:02:21,200 Speaker 2: people we haven't really been able to lean upon. So 41 00:02:21,780 --> 00:02:25,420 Speaker 2: there has been challenges, but we really feel like if 42 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:28,239 Speaker 2: no one was to listen to will sing these songs, 43 00:02:28,940 --> 00:02:31,919 Speaker 2: we would still have to do it, because we do 44 00:02:31,980 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 2: feel like this is what God wants us to continue 45 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 2: to do. 46 00:02:35,580 --> 00:02:37,980 Speaker 1: These songs are already being sung, I believe, in Hillsong 47 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:40,079 Speaker 1: churches throughout the world. Is that right? 48 00:02:40,900 --> 00:02:44,620 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. We started to introduce songs in February, 49 00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:49,100 Speaker 2: and I like to think of, you know, just as 50 00:02:50,260 --> 00:02:52,640 Speaker 2: a bit of a lighthearted approach, but I like to 51 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:55,239 Speaker 2: think of our church as the head of A & 52 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 2: R for our church. So, Because, you know, you introduce 53 00:02:59,780 --> 00:03:03,579 Speaker 2: a song and then you kind of, people are really gracious. 54 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 2: They want to sing a great song. And so our 55 00:03:06,500 --> 00:03:10,190 Speaker 2: church is very gracious. They'll give a song every opportunity 56 00:03:10,270 --> 00:03:14,609 Speaker 2: to do the job. But we'll always introduce a song 57 00:03:14,650 --> 00:03:16,790 Speaker 2: and then just kind of watch and see what people, 58 00:03:16,810 --> 00:03:20,390 Speaker 2: how people respond and how they, how easy it is 59 00:03:20,410 --> 00:03:22,150 Speaker 2: for them to pick up, things like that. And then 60 00:03:22,850 --> 00:03:27,380 Speaker 2: we make changes, necessary changes that hopefully we do. And then, 61 00:03:27,620 --> 00:03:30,600 Speaker 2: you know, just see how it goes. But I do 62 00:03:30,660 --> 00:03:33,040 Speaker 2: love the fact that our church definitely get a say 63 00:03:33,180 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 2: in how far a song would go. 64 00:03:35,540 --> 00:03:39,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, amen to that. I like that idea. You guys 65 00:03:39,260 --> 00:03:41,180 Speaker 1: are releasing a new album next February. I believe it's 66 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: called Holy is the Name, which I believe will be 67 00:03:44,460 --> 00:03:47,140 Speaker 1: the first one since 2018 or so. 68 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:51,820 Speaker 2: The first live recording. Yeah, that's been a couple of years. 69 00:03:52,190 --> 00:03:53,529 Speaker 1: I was going to ask you about your own view 70 00:03:53,570 --> 00:03:56,700 Speaker 1: of songwriting and worship songs. You said that a worship 71 00:03:56,720 --> 00:04:00,380 Speaker 1: song needs to be more than biblically correct. It needs 72 00:04:00,420 --> 00:04:03,740 Speaker 1: to be pointed toward God. Take me inside the songwriting 73 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:07,250 Speaker 1: process for this album. How do you determine whether a 74 00:04:07,850 --> 00:04:10,490 Speaker 1: song is truly going to be a congregational worship song 75 00:04:10,530 --> 00:04:12,990 Speaker 1: rather than simply just good music? 76 00:04:14,010 --> 00:04:16,350 Speaker 2: I'll take you back to even just the intention for 77 00:04:16,370 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 2: this recording. We really were sitting down and just thinking, 78 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:23,060 Speaker 2: what does our church need to sing? What is it 79 00:04:23,100 --> 00:04:25,240 Speaker 2: that you know, we're missing, what are the songs we 80 00:04:25,260 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 2: need to sing? Because I'd, you know, I'd noticed even 81 00:04:28,660 --> 00:04:31,489 Speaker 2: just over the years, the kind of a progression, if 82 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:33,849 Speaker 2: we're not careful, we can head down a lane of 83 00:04:34,690 --> 00:04:38,090 Speaker 2: how does God fit into my context or, you know, 84 00:04:38,130 --> 00:04:41,370 Speaker 2: what happens when I worship God, which is fine. There's, there's, 85 00:04:42,050 --> 00:04:45,250 Speaker 2: there is, you know, there's a time and there's, there's a, 86 00:04:45,270 --> 00:04:49,340 Speaker 2: a fit for all those kinds of songs because they, 87 00:04:49,540 --> 00:04:51,700 Speaker 2: they do encourage people and they do help with personal 88 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:55,950 Speaker 2: ministry and, But we were thinking, what does our church 89 00:04:55,990 --> 00:04:58,790 Speaker 2: need to sing? And we just kind of landed on 90 00:05:00,010 --> 00:05:02,450 Speaker 2: the concept that we should be singing the He Is 91 00:05:02,750 --> 00:05:07,570 Speaker 2: and the You Are songs. Because if we can really 92 00:05:07,630 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 2: get this concept of meditating on His character or magnifying 93 00:05:13,260 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 2: who He is and reminding ourselves of who God is 94 00:05:16,860 --> 00:05:18,700 Speaker 2: and what He's done and what He has said and 95 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 2: then whose we are, they're things that not only magnify God, 96 00:05:23,270 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 2: that only exalts his name, but they also remind us 97 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:29,760 Speaker 2: of who he is. And in Psalms it says, forget 98 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:32,060 Speaker 2: not all his benefits. It says, bless the Lord, all 99 00:05:32,100 --> 00:05:34,340 Speaker 2: my soul, with all that is within me, bless his 100 00:05:34,380 --> 00:05:36,630 Speaker 2: holy name, bless the Lord, all my soul, and forget 101 00:05:36,670 --> 00:05:39,810 Speaker 2: not all his benefits. And I believe the reason why 102 00:05:39,830 --> 00:05:43,310 Speaker 2: it says not to forget is because it's in our 103 00:05:43,390 --> 00:05:44,210 Speaker 2: nature to forget. 104 00:05:45,110 --> 00:05:45,450 Speaker 1: It is. 105 00:05:45,670 --> 00:05:50,300 Speaker 2: And, you know, Elijah forgot just one chapter from his 106 00:05:50,380 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 2: ordeal with the prophets of Baal, the next chapter he's 107 00:05:52,620 --> 00:05:55,800 Speaker 2: hiding in a cave. So we do forget. And so 108 00:05:55,820 --> 00:05:59,020 Speaker 2: I feel like that's a really gracious thing that God 109 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:04,450 Speaker 2: allows in this worship space is that we exalt his 110 00:06:04,510 --> 00:06:08,310 Speaker 2: name and you can magnify him, you can give him praise, 111 00:06:08,990 --> 00:06:11,909 Speaker 2: but all the while we're reminding ourselves of who he is. 112 00:06:12,190 --> 00:06:16,290 Speaker 2: And that really does stir confidence and faith in the personhood, 113 00:06:16,330 --> 00:06:18,730 Speaker 2: the character of God. And I just felt like that 114 00:06:18,770 --> 00:06:22,250 Speaker 2: was a great starting point for us is to really 115 00:06:22,290 --> 00:06:25,130 Speaker 2: go kind of go back to basics and ask god 116 00:06:25,170 --> 00:06:26,770 Speaker 2: what he wants his church to sing jad. 117 00:06:27,589 --> 00:06:28,789 Speaker 1: Do you have any do you have any thoughts on 118 00:06:28,830 --> 00:06:30,710 Speaker 1: what makes a good worship song and what a worship 119 00:06:30,730 --> 00:06:33,690 Speaker 1: song is and i'm asking that because we had this 120 00:06:34,350 --> 00:06:37,590 Speaker 1: genre in christian music called worship music and then we 121 00:06:37,630 --> 00:06:40,990 Speaker 1: have everything else but at some point i'm sometimes wondering 122 00:06:41,010 --> 00:06:42,849 Speaker 1: what is it some of the other stuff worship music 123 00:06:42,890 --> 00:06:45,140 Speaker 1: as well i mean what do you think makes a 124 00:06:45,150 --> 00:06:47,100 Speaker 1: good worship song and at what point does the song 125 00:06:47,140 --> 00:06:49,540 Speaker 1: cease to be a worship song That's. 126 00:06:49,380 --> 00:06:51,040 Speaker 2: A broad question. You might not have any doubts there, 127 00:06:51,060 --> 00:06:53,730 Speaker 2: but I just thought I would toss it there to you. Yeah, 128 00:06:53,820 --> 00:06:58,870 Speaker 2: and it's all blurring into one thing. You're correct in saying, 129 00:06:59,050 --> 00:07:02,450 Speaker 2: and my observations would be the same as well. You know, often, 130 00:07:02,930 --> 00:07:06,870 Speaker 2: you know, there was a worship thing and a CCM 131 00:07:07,029 --> 00:07:10,390 Speaker 2: thing and, you know, but now it kind of, it all, 132 00:07:11,330 --> 00:07:14,970 Speaker 2: and I think that's probably for the best. Because, you know, 133 00:07:14,990 --> 00:07:20,730 Speaker 2: there's probably weirdness on the fringes of both things. But 134 00:07:20,770 --> 00:07:25,130 Speaker 2: I feel like I think worship songs, they should honor 135 00:07:25,180 --> 00:07:28,420 Speaker 2: God and they should draw attention to who he is. 136 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:33,700 Speaker 2: But most of all, man, they should bless God. They 137 00:07:33,740 --> 00:07:39,730 Speaker 2: should allow people the language to magnify his name and 138 00:07:40,070 --> 00:07:42,110 Speaker 2: to exalt him. Because I think. 139 00:07:43,990 --> 00:07:48,010 Speaker 2: It's our calling. It's our calling to exalt him. It's 140 00:07:48,030 --> 00:07:51,210 Speaker 2: the angels are sitting there singing, holy, holy, holy is 141 00:07:51,230 --> 00:07:56,110 Speaker 2: the Lord God almighty, nonstop. I mean, it's an indication, 142 00:07:56,130 --> 00:08:00,310 Speaker 2: you know, we were made to worship him. So I 143 00:08:00,330 --> 00:08:04,410 Speaker 2: just feel like worship music, it's an important thing, but 144 00:08:04,950 --> 00:08:08,150 Speaker 2: I feel like we need to be careful that we 145 00:08:08,180 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 2: don't become the hero in the story. I think that's 146 00:08:11,580 --> 00:08:14,310 Speaker 2: a thing that we all should be wary of. Like 147 00:08:14,350 --> 00:08:16,690 Speaker 2: I said, all these songs have a place, you know, 148 00:08:17,490 --> 00:08:21,770 Speaker 2: songs that carry a narrative or a story, songs that 149 00:08:21,830 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 2: really do pull us and draw us near to God 150 00:08:25,140 --> 00:08:27,560 Speaker 2: and remind us of who He is. They all have 151 00:08:27,580 --> 00:08:31,540 Speaker 2: a place, and I would never knock that. But I 152 00:08:31,780 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 2: do think that sometimes we need to set aside the 153 00:08:35,059 --> 00:08:38,840 Speaker 2: intention that we worship songs, you know, songs that the 154 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:42,939 Speaker 2: church will sing. They should glorify His name. That's a 155 00:08:42,940 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 2: good answer. 156 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:46,280 Speaker 1: I like that answer. I'm glad you said that. I 157 00:08:46,950 --> 00:08:49,589 Speaker 1: felt the same. Let me ask you another question, a 158 00:08:49,630 --> 00:08:52,770 Speaker 1: couple more questions before we close here. It seems like 159 00:08:52,830 --> 00:08:56,089 Speaker 1: worship music and Christian music is having kind of a 160 00:08:56,150 --> 00:08:59,790 Speaker 1: moment right now in our culture. There's one or two 161 00:08:59,850 --> 00:09:03,339 Speaker 1: songs on the Billboard Hot 100 chart that are worship 162 00:09:03,360 --> 00:09:06,420 Speaker 1: songs right now. I think that happened also last year. 163 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:08,460 Speaker 1: It might not have been worship songs, but they were 164 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,060 Speaker 1: Christian songs. What do you think is driving this cultural 165 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,690 Speaker 1: embrace of, Christian music and worship music. What's going on 166 00:09:14,730 --> 00:09:15,010 Speaker 1: right now? 167 00:09:15,030 --> 00:09:27,420 Speaker 2: Do you have any thoughts? Yeah, and Christian music and 168 00:09:27,660 --> 00:09:28,620 Speaker 2: country music as well. 169 00:09:29,280 --> 00:09:31,140 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true. 170 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,300 Speaker 2: I think it's a really cool convergence, to be honest. 171 00:09:34,970 --> 00:09:39,870 Speaker 2: And I love country. I never did, but maybe eight 172 00:09:39,910 --> 00:09:43,359 Speaker 2: years ago, I was like, wait a minute. These are 173 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:46,079 Speaker 2: some of the best musicians in the world and the 174 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:49,420 Speaker 2: best writing. And I started to enjoy it and see 175 00:09:49,450 --> 00:09:54,230 Speaker 2: the parallels between that and worship music in terms of 176 00:09:54,270 --> 00:09:59,090 Speaker 2: structure and the ballad format and whatnot. But I do think... 177 00:09:59,820 --> 00:10:02,680 Speaker 2: we've just gone through a season in music generally where 178 00:10:02,940 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 2: there's a lot of programming, there's a lot of cult 179 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:09,030 Speaker 2: of personality. And if I was to take my son 180 00:10:09,050 --> 00:10:14,670 Speaker 2: as an example, he is now gravitating towards the more 181 00:10:15,110 --> 00:10:18,860 Speaker 2: human and real even in music that he would listen 182 00:10:18,900 --> 00:10:21,300 Speaker 2: to on Spotify or pop music or whatever, he is 183 00:10:21,340 --> 00:10:25,959 Speaker 2: gravitating towards something that he can identify with. And music 184 00:10:26,780 --> 00:10:30,560 Speaker 2: got crazy for a while. It was like, I don't 185 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,300 Speaker 2: know how this represents the human race, but it is 186 00:10:33,340 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 2: at the moment. And so I feel like that's the 187 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:43,349 Speaker 2: transformation that's happening. People want to be a part of 188 00:10:43,380 --> 00:10:46,150 Speaker 2: something and they want to be a part of something real. 189 00:10:46,860 --> 00:10:48,500 Speaker 2: I don't know if it's any more complicated than that. 190 00:10:48,540 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 2: I'm sure there's lots of nuance. But I really do 191 00:10:51,420 --> 00:10:54,179 Speaker 2: think that people are starting to go, what are we 192 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:58,760 Speaker 2: here for? What's the go here? And I do feel 193 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:06,770 Speaker 2: like that's where sincere and Christ-centered songs can really help 194 00:11:07,190 --> 00:11:10,949 Speaker 2: because there is no fluff. There is no look at me. Well, 195 00:11:10,970 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 2: hopefully there's no look at Pete. But I really do 196 00:11:13,780 --> 00:11:16,079 Speaker 2: feel like that strikes a chord with people, especially young 197 00:11:16,100 --> 00:11:16,780 Speaker 2: people these days. 198 00:11:17,860 --> 00:11:21,540 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think we're searching for the answers of life, 199 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 1: as you just said, and we are embracing music that 200 00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:27,610 Speaker 1: kind of feeds our souls. And so I think it's 201 00:11:27,620 --> 00:11:28,770 Speaker 1: a beautiful thing to see. 202 00:11:29,429 --> 00:11:31,050 Speaker 2: As we close, I do want to talk about what you. 203 00:11:30,990 --> 00:11:36,750 Speaker 1: Kind of referenced earlier, Hillsong going through difficult seasons, the 204 00:11:36,970 --> 00:11:40,210 Speaker 1: church going through difficult seasons, been in a you know, 205 00:11:40,230 --> 00:11:42,929 Speaker 1: the headlines for all the wrong reasons, I guess. What 206 00:11:42,950 --> 00:11:45,450 Speaker 1: do you want Christians who once listened to Hillsong's music 207 00:11:46,309 --> 00:11:49,429 Speaker 1: and were disillusioned to hear all these stories, what do 208 00:11:49,450 --> 00:11:53,700 Speaker 1: you want folks to know about the people behind these songs, 209 00:11:54,640 --> 00:11:55,380 Speaker 1: this new music? 210 00:11:55,880 --> 00:12:00,260 Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess I just, for us, and obviously I 211 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:02,739 Speaker 2: can't speak on behalf of our senior pastors, and I 212 00:12:02,780 --> 00:12:05,699 Speaker 2: wouldn't be qualified to make a statement on behalf of 213 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:08,730 Speaker 2: our church, but I would say we did grieve for 214 00:12:08,770 --> 00:12:13,350 Speaker 2: a season, and And as hard as this season was 215 00:12:13,410 --> 00:12:16,780 Speaker 2: that we went through, and as tough as it did 216 00:12:16,820 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 2: get at times, the season we find ourselves in now, 217 00:12:21,740 --> 00:12:23,959 Speaker 2: I really do see as a bit of a gift, 218 00:12:24,780 --> 00:12:28,420 Speaker 2: almost even for Ilsa worship, but also for our church, 219 00:12:28,780 --> 00:12:31,310 Speaker 2: a little bit of a reset. And the reason why 220 00:12:31,450 --> 00:12:33,569 Speaker 2: I say I see it as a gift is because 221 00:12:33,630 --> 00:12:36,490 Speaker 2: we now can go, well, who are we? Who is 222 00:12:36,570 --> 00:12:40,750 Speaker 2: God calling us to be? And if this is who 223 00:12:40,770 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 2: he's calling us to be, then this is how we 224 00:12:44,179 --> 00:12:47,900 Speaker 2: must behave. And I just feel like that's a really 225 00:12:47,980 --> 00:12:51,000 Speaker 2: kind thing, an opportunity for God to give us, is 226 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:54,699 Speaker 2: to take stock, figure out who we are, and then 227 00:12:54,820 --> 00:12:57,610 Speaker 2: behave accordingly, I think, is the language that we've been 228 00:12:57,730 --> 00:13:03,270 Speaker 2: using around our team. And I'm super grateful for our 229 00:13:03,290 --> 00:13:06,790 Speaker 2: senior pastors, Phil and Lucinda, but I'm also super grateful 230 00:13:06,870 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 2: for Brian and Bobby, who pioneered and pastored our church 231 00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 2: for more than three decades. And just the obedience and 232 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 2: the sacrifice it took to build that and to lead 233 00:13:18,380 --> 00:13:21,590 Speaker 2: us all somewhere special and to listen to God and 234 00:13:21,630 --> 00:13:25,930 Speaker 2: to follow God. And I would say to people now, 235 00:13:26,630 --> 00:13:28,990 Speaker 2: I'm not going to stand here and say, hey, we're different. 236 00:13:29,710 --> 00:13:34,429 Speaker 2: We're all better. Come on back. I feel like people 237 00:13:34,630 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 2: should seek God. and they should use whatever vehicle they 238 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:41,170 Speaker 2: can to draw near to God. And that's truthfully what 239 00:13:41,190 --> 00:13:44,970 Speaker 2: we're doing. We understand that going through a season like 240 00:13:45,010 --> 00:13:49,750 Speaker 2: that can really hurt people, and it can discourage people, 241 00:13:49,809 --> 00:13:52,500 Speaker 2: and it can also put people offside. And what I'd 242 00:13:52,540 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 2: say is, I totally understand. But if you would hear 243 00:13:57,340 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 2: anything that I would say, it would be draw near 244 00:13:59,059 --> 00:14:02,050 Speaker 2: to God. And if it's worship music that helps you, great. 245 00:14:02,470 --> 00:14:05,890 Speaker 2: If it's fellowship, then great. If it's just diving into 246 00:14:05,910 --> 00:14:09,929 Speaker 2: the Word, then do that. But my plea would be 247 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 2: joining to God, despite whatever's happened in your life and 248 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 2: in the lives of churches. There's so many people. We 249 00:14:17,940 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 2: were at a conference this week, and there's so many 250 00:14:19,740 --> 00:14:22,700 Speaker 2: people who have a story about the hardship or the 251 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 2: hard season that their own church has gone through and 252 00:14:26,020 --> 00:14:29,910 Speaker 2: really kind of said, we can really identify that. Although 253 00:14:30,170 --> 00:14:32,910 Speaker 2: they would say, we didn't go through it as publicly 254 00:14:32,950 --> 00:14:36,210 Speaker 2: as you guys. We still went through a trial. And 255 00:14:36,230 --> 00:14:40,460 Speaker 2: that's fine. But I do think that drawing near to 256 00:14:40,500 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 2: God is key in any kind of restoration or reconciliation. 257 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:50,060 Speaker 2: And so, yeah, humbly to you, I would just say, 258 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:54,000 Speaker 2: I understand. It's something that people have to navigate, and 259 00:14:54,020 --> 00:14:58,170 Speaker 2: we do too. I think one... If we have enough time, 260 00:14:58,270 --> 00:15:00,950 Speaker 2: the one story I'll tell is going through all of it. 261 00:15:01,930 --> 00:15:04,860 Speaker 2: Tough times. And, you know, when the church goes through 262 00:15:04,890 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 2: a massive, tough season, people are disappointed. They feel betrayed. 263 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,260 Speaker 2: They're discouraged. And then the worship leader still has to 264 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 2: get up on Sunday morning and say, Morning, church. How 265 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 2: good is God? And everyone just kind of goes, Yeah. 266 00:15:21,070 --> 00:15:22,750 Speaker 2: There was one of those times that I was like, 267 00:15:22,770 --> 00:15:25,670 Speaker 2: oh man, this is really tough. And I was standing 268 00:15:25,710 --> 00:15:29,790 Speaker 2: kind of next to our church platform as people are 269 00:15:29,820 --> 00:15:32,040 Speaker 2: walking in, you know, before the service five minutes before. 270 00:15:33,180 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 2: And I just was watching people come in and I 271 00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 2: was watching families come in and, you know, see friends 272 00:15:38,580 --> 00:15:40,860 Speaker 2: and then be relieved that they have someone to sit with. And, 273 00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:43,000 Speaker 2: you know, I saw people walk in that I hadn't 274 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 2: talked to in two years and I saw people walk 275 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,970 Speaker 2: in and you could see they're a bit self-conscious. And 276 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 2: I just got this picture that You know, this is 277 00:15:51,780 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 2: what this is for. That's what it's for. If leading 278 00:15:56,360 --> 00:16:00,260 Speaker 2: worship or writing songs or doing any of it is 279 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:03,860 Speaker 2: about anything, it's helping people draw near to God. And 280 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 2: I just really felt like God say, is that enough? 281 00:16:06,260 --> 00:16:10,030 Speaker 2: And I thought to myself, well, thank you for showing 282 00:16:10,070 --> 00:16:13,210 Speaker 2: me that because yes, it is enough. And that was 283 00:16:13,250 --> 00:16:14,150 Speaker 2: really powerful for me. 284 00:16:15,350 --> 00:16:19,690 Speaker 1: But to summarize, you guys still feel called to sing 285 00:16:20,230 --> 00:16:22,290 Speaker 1: and to write music. And you feel God has you 286 00:16:22,310 --> 00:16:24,050 Speaker 1: in this space for a reason, correct? 287 00:16:24,410 --> 00:16:27,890 Speaker 2: Yeah, we do. We do. And even with this project 288 00:16:27,970 --> 00:16:30,870 Speaker 2: coming up, you know, this year and next year, we 289 00:16:30,930 --> 00:16:33,710 Speaker 2: really did feel like, you know, God was with us. 290 00:16:33,910 --> 00:16:36,340 Speaker 2: There wasn't a real ease to what we were doing. 291 00:16:36,430 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 2: And even just, we felt like, we just felt like 292 00:16:39,780 --> 00:16:42,140 Speaker 2: he was kind of smiling on us. And that was 293 00:16:42,180 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 2: a really powerful and really reassuring thing at the time. 294 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:50,520 Speaker 3: If you liked today's episode, please subscribe and leave a 295 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 3: five-star review. That's how we help more people just like 296 00:16:53,900 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 3: you find the show. A big thanks to the team 297 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:59,820 Speaker 3: at Life Audio for their partnership with us on the podcast. 298 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,220 Speaker 3: If you go to lifeaudio.com, you will find dozens of 299 00:17:03,260 --> 00:17:05,570 Speaker 3: other faith-centered podcasts in their network. 300 00:17:06,180 --> 00:17:06,790 Speaker 1: See you next time.