1 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:03,520 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:06,640 --> 00:00:09,520 Speaker 2: Welcome to the Love Offering Podcast. I'm your host, Rachel Adams, 3 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:12,320 Speaker 2: author of Everyday Prayers for Love, Learning to Love God, others, 4 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 2: and even yourself. Each week we dive into meaningful conversations 5 00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:18,320 Speaker 2: about how to live out the greatest commandment, loving God 6 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 2: with all of our heart's soul, mind and strength, and 7 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:24,760 Speaker 2: loving our neighbors as ourselves, whether through inspiring stories, practical wisdom, 8 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:27,319 Speaker 2: or biblical truth. My hope is to encourage you to 9 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:30,680 Speaker 2: love boldly, live faithfully, and reflect God's love in your 10 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:34,080 Speaker 2: everyday life. Today, I'm honored to welcome Christine Hoy to 11 00:00:34,159 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 2: the show. Christine is an author and speaker who helps 12 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 2: women trade perfectionism for peace and performance for presents. She 13 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 2: is the author of Peace Beyond Perfection, Overcoming the fear 14 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:47,879 Speaker 2: of not being enough and keeping company with Jesus, finding 15 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:51,839 Speaker 2: peace in His presence. Rooted in scripture and her signature message, 16 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 2: live Gentler, not Harder, Christine invites women into a faith 17 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 2: that feels less like performance review and more like an 18 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 2: unhurried conversation with Jesus. Well, Hello Christine, and welcome to 19 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 2: the Love Offering Podcast. I'm so happy to have you. 20 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 1: Hi, Rachel thank you for inviting me. 21 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: So we're going to have an unhurried conversation with one 22 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:15,000 Speaker 2: another about having unhurried conversations with Jesus. But you write 23 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 2: so beautifully about the difference between performing for Jesus and 24 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,399 Speaker 2: truly being with him. Was there a specific moment in 25 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:23,600 Speaker 2: your own life when you realized your faith had become 26 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 2: more about obligation than relationship. 27 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 1: Yes, So a turning point for me was it was 28 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: let me see about five years ago and I had 29 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:38,479 Speaker 1: just come through a very difficult season caring for my mom, 30 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:42,319 Speaker 1: and she had passed away from cancer, and then I 31 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 1: spent additional six months wrapping up her estate, which was 32 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 1: very time consuming. And I realized that I had been 33 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 1: relying on myself, and even though I loved God and 34 00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 1: loved God's word and was still faithfully going to church, 35 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 1: I had lost to my joy and my delight because 36 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 1: I was just persevering on my own. I was just 37 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:08,640 Speaker 1: relying on my own abilities. And I was aware that 38 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:12,079 Speaker 1: God was carrying me through that season, but I wasn't 39 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 1: leaning into him. I wasn't really fully relying on him. 40 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:18,520 Speaker 1: I was still doing it. Just when you've got just 41 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 1: this huge heavy burden that you're dealing with, that there's 42 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 1: a tendency to just take all that responsibility on and 43 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:29,320 Speaker 1: not just dust in him. And so I asked him 44 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 1: to give me back the delight that I had had before, 45 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:34,919 Speaker 1: and so he did that. 46 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 2: It's beautiful and he does. He cares about us and 47 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:41,600 Speaker 2: is our comforter and present with us in those times, 48 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 2: in all times, not just the times of struggle. Absolutely well, 49 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:47,959 Speaker 2: in keeping company with Jesus, use the imagery of the 50 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 2: vine and the branches from John fifteen. So why do 51 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 2: you think Jesus chose that picture to describe our relationship 52 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:54,079 Speaker 2: with him? 53 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: Well, first of all, it was very common. They were 54 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:02,799 Speaker 1: surrounded by vineyards, and they drank wine like today we 55 00:03:02,919 --> 00:03:05,640 Speaker 1: might drink coffee. So it was a very well known 56 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: the the culture, I believe, is how you say it. 57 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:14,480 Speaker 1: And because that relationship of the grapes the branches to 58 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: the mine is the most dependent relationship there is in 59 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: the plant world. And so I had the privilege of 60 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: talking to a friend of mine. She and her husband 61 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 1: live in Napa Valley and have tended a vineyard for years, 62 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,200 Speaker 1: and so I asked her some questions about that experience 63 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 1: to bring John fifteen to life. For me, she brought 64 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: up pruning and what that was like, and she was 65 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: saying that pruning doesn't weaken a healthy plant, it actually 66 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:50,360 Speaker 1: strengthens it. And so for me, I've you know, tried 67 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: to avoid pruning experiences with God, and she said, no, 68 00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 1: it's the plants that they prune that are the most 69 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 1: full of life. And so I'm like, okay, God, you know, 70 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:04,000 Speaker 1: maybe I wanted maybe I want to start praying for that. 71 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 1: And then the one that really drove it home for 72 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 1: me was the uh stress and what that did to 73 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:16,840 Speaker 1: concentrate fruit. So she said some of the soils that 74 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:21,880 Speaker 1: were the weakest, the grapes were the smallest, but that 75 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: concentration of flavor in those grapes was just incredible. And 76 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:29,359 Speaker 1: I likened that too. When we go through a difficult 77 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 1: season in our lives, that that fruit is strengthened. And 78 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:38,479 Speaker 1: so not to run from not to run from pruning, 79 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: not to run from difficult seasons, but to accept them 80 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 1: and even embrace them as God, our heavenly Father, being 81 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 1: our gardener, as him taking care of us. 82 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 2: Oh, that's so interesting. I've actually never been to a vineyard, 83 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:56,919 Speaker 2: sny to add that to my bucket list. So I 84 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 2: love the way that you've connected that. I think that 85 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 2: brings so much more depth to that passage. 86 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:02,160 Speaker 1: But we're going to. 87 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 2: Take a brief break to hear a word from today's sponsor, 88 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,360 Speaker 2: and when we come back, we'll talk about spiritual perfectionism, 89 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 2: the obstacles that keep us from abiding, and how we 90 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 2: can experience God's presence in practical ways every day. Welcome back. 91 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 2: I'm talking with Christine hoy about her book keeping company 92 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:23,280 Speaker 2: with Jesus, finding peace in his presence. You know, I 93 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,279 Speaker 2: think so many women love God deeply yet still feel 94 00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:29,160 Speaker 2: spiritually exhausted and emotionally depleted. So why do you think 95 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 2: so many of us struggle to experience the freely and 96 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 2: lightly life that Jesus offers In Matthew eleven. 97 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 1: I love that verse. It's actually where the title of 98 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,239 Speaker 1: the book came from. When I was reading Matthew eleven 99 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 1: twenty through thirty. In the message, Eugene Peterson translates that 100 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:49,279 Speaker 1: to Jesus inviting us to keep company with him. And 101 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:51,839 Speaker 1: when I read that, I just knew, like, Yes, that's 102 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: what I want to do, is keep company with him. 103 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 1: And I know that last month you had Kiara ray 104 00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 1: On with her new book Holy Leisure. I love that book. 105 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: I've been reading it and she really describes what I 106 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:08,240 Speaker 1: feel myself included. But a lot of women, especially those 107 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:12,719 Speaker 1: of us with perfectionist tendencies, we look at our quiet 108 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 1: time as not so much as an obligation, but it's 109 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 1: lacking delight. For years, I followed a reading plan, and 110 00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:25,159 Speaker 1: you know, I would check off those boxes each day 111 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:27,599 Speaker 1: of the chapters that I had read. I'd open my 112 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,320 Speaker 1: prayer journal and i'd you know, pray through the things 113 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:34,279 Speaker 1: on my prayer list. But then it was like I 114 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: closed that and then I could get onto the real 115 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:39,880 Speaker 1: part of my day. And I was missing the delight 116 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:43,799 Speaker 1: in Jesus. And so I spent a time just reading, 117 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 1: like repeatedly through the Gospels and just getting to really 118 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,839 Speaker 1: know Jesus and falling in love with him in a 119 00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:53,840 Speaker 1: brand new way where I was truly captivated by him. 120 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 1: And I think that's something that we need to keep 121 00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:01,000 Speaker 1: in mind. You know, if we're married or in a relationship, 122 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: we tend to be captivated by that other person. And 123 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 1: so I want to have that kind of relationship with 124 00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: Jesus where I desire to spend time with him. I 125 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: want to hang out with him. It's not where I'm 126 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: going to a meeting, showing up, going through our thing 127 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: and walking away. The cover of the book is to 128 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 1: at our on deck chairs on the beach, and I 129 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 1: just I wanted that kind of relationship with Jesus where 130 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 1: we're just hanging out together, watching the water and sharing 131 00:07:31,800 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: about our lives. And so that was what I was 132 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 1: That was the imagery I was trying to convey with that. 133 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I love that, and that's what I want too. 134 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 2: And I have those tendencies too to want to almost 135 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:47,400 Speaker 2: just check a box and things to become work almost 136 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 2: rather than just having that relationship that comfort with the Lord. 137 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 2: And I love that so much. And I also love 138 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:57,080 Speaker 2: your analogy about failing spiritually like a phone stuck at 139 00:07:57,080 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 2: fifteen percent. So what are some signs that we may 140 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 2: be running on empty spiritually without even realizing it. 141 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 1: Well, I think it's too easy to feel like, oh, 142 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:09,840 Speaker 1: I'm just in a busy season, whatever that may be. 143 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 1: I just came through a book launch that was certainly 144 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 1: a busy season. I watched my daughter with three children 145 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,800 Speaker 1: three and under. That's a busy season. But there's still 146 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: ways to spend time with Jesus even in those those 147 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 1: busy times. What we need to look for, the signs 148 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,840 Speaker 1: that we need to look for, is when scripture stops 149 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 1: speaking to us. And I think there's a tendency of 150 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:35,360 Speaker 1: if I don't have an hour to read my Bible 151 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:39,319 Speaker 1: every day, I shouldn't even bother And it's okay to 152 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: just read one verse at a time and focus on 153 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: one verse. And you know, Lord, what word do you 154 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:51,079 Speaker 1: want to speak to me through this? So for instance, 155 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 1: with John fifteen, there's the Greek word in there, and 156 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 1: I'm not sure I'm pronouncing this right. I should probably 157 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: know this, but meno me and and it means remain 158 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:06,439 Speaker 1: abide and just taking one word and just meditating on that. Lord, 159 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 1: what does that mean? What do you want me to 160 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: know from that? You don't have to read three to 161 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 1: five chapters every day and get through your Bible in 162 00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: the year. I mean, I've done that a few times. 163 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 1: But I love it when I just take time to 164 00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 1: respond to verse or a passage and just sit with 165 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 1: it for a while. I'll offen you know some of 166 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:28,720 Speaker 1: the shorter epistles like Philippians, and just read through it 167 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 1: every single day for a week or two and let 168 00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: that just reach my soul. 169 00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:37,319 Speaker 2: So that's really good because I get caught in that too. 170 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 2: There was a time when I read the Bible in 171 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 2: ninety days. There was a ninety day Bible reading challenge, 172 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 2: and it was wonderful just to see the entirety scripture 173 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 2: that quickly and how it all connects. But then after that, 174 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 2: I was just like, well, now what you know, I 175 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:52,439 Speaker 2: don't know what to do now, and so I think 176 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 2: we can get so caught up in like this legalistic 177 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 2: approach of I have to do these certain things in 178 00:09:57,440 --> 00:10:00,560 Speaker 2: this certain way. And so I love just the and 179 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 2: what you're saying, like the release of pressure. I think 180 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:06,000 Speaker 2: that that is just really important and something that I 181 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:10,400 Speaker 2: know that encourages me. And you also emphasize talking about abiding, 182 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:14,200 Speaker 2: that abiding isn't about adding more spiritual disciplines to our lives. 183 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 2: What does abiding actually look like in everyday life for 184 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 2: busy women juggling responsibilities, work, motherhood, ministry and caregiving all 185 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:22,200 Speaker 2: the mini roles that we have. 186 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:26,120 Speaker 1: Right, it means returning to Him throughout the day. If 187 00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 1: you're standing at your coffee pot in the morning, just 188 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: being that a reminder is just say Lord, good morning, 189 00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: Hi here I am, and just sharing what's top of 190 00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 1: mind with him at that point. I like breath prayers 191 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: Jennifer Tucker. She's actually has three books out, at least 192 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 1: three that I know of that I really like. But 193 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: breath is prayer, calm your anxiety, focus your mind, to 194 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:50,319 Speaker 1: renew your soul. And I keep this by my reading 195 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 1: chair and I'll just flip open too it and look 196 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:55,240 Speaker 1: for one of her prayers. And if you don't know 197 00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:58,640 Speaker 1: what a breath prayer is, it's inhaling, a short prayer 198 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 1: and then exhaling. Instance on the inhale, search me and 199 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 1: know my heart. On the exhale, I give you all 200 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: my anxious thoughts. It doesn't have to be a long 201 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: prayer time. I mean, there's definitely a place for those 202 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: where we bring things to him, things we're praying for 203 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 1: for other people. There's got to be those times too, 204 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:23,720 Speaker 1: But it's okay just to have that that time that 205 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:27,080 Speaker 1: just brings us back to him where we're pausing, just 206 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 1: stopping what we're doing in the middle of the day 207 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 1: and just pausing and engaging with him. That's what he wants, 208 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 1: is our presence, our stillness. 209 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 2: I think that's one of the things that I appreciate 210 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 2: so much about your message is just how grace filled 211 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 2: it is. So for the woman who feels like she's 212 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:45,200 Speaker 2: failing spiritually because she can't maintain the perfect quiet time 213 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:47,920 Speaker 2: or routine, what would you say to encourage her? 214 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:53,920 Speaker 1: I would encourage her to just stay, to just abide. 215 00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: I think it's so easy for us as women to 216 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:00,520 Speaker 1: fall into the trap of you know, it used to 217 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 1: be on my New Year's resolutions, which I don't even 218 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 1: do anymore, but every single year, you know, grow my faith, 219 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,800 Speaker 1: grow closer to Jesus, and year after year, and then 220 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:13,080 Speaker 1: when I'd review my you know, resolutions at the end 221 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:15,080 Speaker 1: of the year, I'd always feel like I failed, like 222 00:12:15,160 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 1: I'd fallen short on that. And there's just this huge 223 00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: drive to treat our relationship with Jesus like we treat 224 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:26,679 Speaker 1: everything else in our lives. How can I improve this? 225 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 1: How can I do more? Strive more, be more? And 226 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: Jesus is just saying, show up, just stop what you're 227 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:39,560 Speaker 1: doing and just spend time with me. And so that's 228 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:43,440 Speaker 1: really the message. It's not to do better and try 229 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:46,800 Speaker 1: to be better, it's just to experience the nearness of 230 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:47,880 Speaker 1: being in his presence. 231 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,800 Speaker 2: It reminds me so much of Mary and Martha. There 232 00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:54,079 Speaker 2: is a time to do. We can't just sit and 233 00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:57,680 Speaker 2: do nothing, ever, but this idea of how can we 234 00:12:57,760 --> 00:13:00,320 Speaker 2: just sit at his fee and be with him? Said 235 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:03,040 Speaker 2: that she chose the best thing, and so I love 236 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:06,559 Speaker 2: their example. And you also talk about practices of abiding 237 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 2: like you mentioned prayer, scripture, and then community. So how 238 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,840 Speaker 2: can we begin approaching those things less as duties and 239 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 2: more as invitations into a relationship. 240 00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:20,199 Speaker 1: I have discovered community is such an important part of 241 00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 1: our faith walk, and I've been blessed to be part 242 00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: of several different small groups connected to our different churches 243 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:32,000 Speaker 1: as we've moved several times in our marriage, and one 244 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 1: of the first things we do when we after we 245 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 1: find a church is get involved in a small group. 246 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 1: And those relationships are vital I believe to a relationship 247 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: with Jesus because they connect us when we're maybe not 248 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:53,040 Speaker 1: feeling it, maybe when we're struggling and just going through 249 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:55,440 Speaker 1: a rough time. These are the people that are there 250 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:58,679 Speaker 1: for us and praying for us and helping bring us 251 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:01,080 Speaker 1: back to God, bring us back to His word, and 252 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 1: keeping us in communion with Him as well as our 253 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:09,679 Speaker 1: small community. And also I have been really blessed by 254 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:11,800 Speaker 1: since we moved back to Michigan by about a year 255 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:14,839 Speaker 1: and a half ago, the small group of women that 256 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:18,079 Speaker 1: I know locally through speak up and we get together 257 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 1: once a month, and it's just been such a blessing 258 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 1: for me. I know that's where you and I met 259 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,040 Speaker 1: a couple of years ago, but little did I know 260 00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:28,120 Speaker 1: that moving back to Michigan. We moved back here to 261 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:32,200 Speaker 1: be near the kids and grandkids. But what I didn't 262 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 1: know that God had in store for me was just 263 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:38,240 Speaker 1: the blessing of this close relationship with other women that, 264 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 1: especially as Christian communicators, we need to support one another 265 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:45,240 Speaker 1: and be there for one another. And there's a core 266 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 1: group of us that have a prayer thread that where 267 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:51,840 Speaker 1: we share prayer requests and we're just checking in with 268 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:54,640 Speaker 1: each other regularly. And I'm just so grateful for that 269 00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:55,520 Speaker 1: group of women. 270 00:14:56,440 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, me too. It's so important community. We want to 271 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 2: keep in company with people that are keeping in company 272 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 2: with Jesus, people that encourage us in our walk. Is 273 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:09,040 Speaker 2: just so important so that we can bring more people 274 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 2: into the company of Jesus, not just so we're just 275 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 2: huddled up in our own little holy huddle. Yeah, and 276 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 2: we can bring other people into coming to know him 277 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 2: as well. 278 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:17,880 Speaker 1: Well. 279 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 2: So let's talk about some of the obstacles that we 280 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:25,120 Speaker 2: face into abiding, like the busy seasons, the divided hearts, 281 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 2: and spiritual winters. Which of those obstacles do you think 282 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 2: women struggle with most today? And why? 283 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 1: Well, I think all of them. Yeah, yeah, it most 284 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,640 Speaker 1: definitely the divided heart. And I truly believe that the 285 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:45,520 Speaker 1: enemy wants to keep us distracted. He wants to keep 286 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 1: us so focused on other things. The obvious, you know, 287 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:53,640 Speaker 1: culprit is our phones. We seem to be attached to them. Yeah, 288 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:59,800 Speaker 1: and we're just distracted. And I really encourage women, if 289 00:15:59,840 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 1: they are not serious about taking a sabbath rest to 290 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 1: do that. We started just as recently as Easter. We 291 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:09,480 Speaker 1: just started going to church on Saturday evening. There's a 292 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 1: five o'clock service. We have a actually we have three campuses, 293 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 1: but we have a large church, and they were just 294 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: trying to spread things out a little bit more. And 295 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:23,000 Speaker 1: I love this new rhythm because I had always started 296 00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 1: my Sabbath on Saturday evening and gone till Sunday evening. 297 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,520 Speaker 1: But then church was always Sunday morning, kind of right 298 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: in the middle of it all. And this is a 299 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 1: hard break because it's really tempting, you know, to work 300 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:37,320 Speaker 1: on a project or get involved in something on Saturday, 301 00:16:37,480 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 1: and you know that time to stop and take a 302 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: Sabbath rest keeps getting later and later and sometimes gets 303 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:49,240 Speaker 1: pushed a Sunday morning where we have church on Saturday 304 00:16:49,280 --> 00:16:55,160 Speaker 1: evening now and that's like the kickoff for our Sabbath practice. 305 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:57,960 Speaker 1: I had her friend sure once. He was a pastor 306 00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: for many years and growing up, he wasn't allowed to 307 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:05,080 Speaker 1: ride his bike on Sunday, but he could play ball, 308 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:07,560 Speaker 1: and the little boy across the street could ride his bike, 309 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:10,880 Speaker 1: but he wasn't allowed to play ball. We have all 310 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:14,680 Speaker 1: these man made rules around the Sabbath. I personally take 311 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,360 Speaker 1: it as we're just supposed to stop our work. So 312 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: whatever that means for us, that's, you know, what we 313 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:25,280 Speaker 1: shouldn't do. And so for me, I try to unplug digitally, 314 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:30,240 Speaker 1: unplug during my sabbath, rust and read, spend time with families, 315 00:17:30,240 --> 00:17:33,520 Speaker 1: spend time with friends, do a deeper dive on, you know, 316 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 1: Bible study. I don't do all these things at once. 317 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,639 Speaker 1: Maybe do an art project, spend time in nature but 318 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:43,399 Speaker 1: unplug and I have felt such a difference since I 319 00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 1: started doing this again regularly, and I just really encourage 320 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: people to do that. It's not just a nice idea, 321 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:52,399 Speaker 1: it's really how God designed us and our souls just 322 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: need that. 323 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, it's a good idea. He modeled that from 324 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 2: the very beginning in Genesis, and it's something I need 325 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:01,760 Speaker 2: to get better at. I always feel this pressure to 326 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,520 Speaker 2: perform and to produce, and I feel like God is 327 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:06,680 Speaker 2: really working in my heart in this area. And that's 328 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 2: why I like today's conversation so much, and I know 329 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:10,760 Speaker 2: I need it. But we're going to take another brief 330 00:18:10,760 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 2: break to hear a word from our sponsor, and when 331 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 2: we come back, we'll talk about the fruit of abiding, 332 00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:18,399 Speaker 2: finding peace beyond perfectionism, and what it means to truly 333 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 2: keep company with Jesus. Welcome back. I'm talking with Christine 334 00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:28,400 Speaker 2: Hoy about her book Keeping Company with Jesus. So, Christine, 335 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:30,680 Speaker 2: what does it look like to remain connected to Jesus 336 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:34,680 Speaker 2: during seasons when we don't feel spiritually motivated or emotionally 337 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:35,360 Speaker 2: close to him? 338 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 1: Well, I share a story in the book about a woman, Karen, 339 00:18:39,359 --> 00:18:43,640 Speaker 1: who's talking to her friend Carol, and she's feeling very 340 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 1: concerned that maybe she's even lost her faith, like she 341 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:51,359 Speaker 1: doesn't feel connected to God. She's really going through what 342 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 1: a lot of people have referred to as the dark 343 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,880 Speaker 1: Knight of the soul. And her friend wisely says to her, 344 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:03,320 Speaker 1: when in your marriage, you've been married for almost forty years, 345 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 1: are there seasons where you don't feel that close to 346 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:11,480 Speaker 1: your spouse where you're not feeling the honeymoon stage right 347 00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:13,879 Speaker 1: where you're not head over heels in love. The emotion 348 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 1: isn't there. But are you still married to them? And yes, 349 00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 1: obviously you are, and there's an underlying commitment you're doing 350 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: life with them. And I just encourage women to hang on, 351 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:33,360 Speaker 1: don't give up, stay committed, stay connected, and that desire, 352 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:39,080 Speaker 1: that delight in Jesus will come back, and honestly bring 353 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:42,399 Speaker 1: it to him and just say, you know, I'm not 354 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:45,120 Speaker 1: feeling it right now, and I know that loving you 355 00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: isn't always about emotions, but bring back the delight. And 356 00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:53,480 Speaker 1: Ashurita Susu has a wonderful book, Delighting in Jesus, and 357 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:57,720 Speaker 1: I got so much from that. But anyway, sorry, that 358 00:19:57,840 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 1: just reminded me of he. 359 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,119 Speaker 2: Asherada has actually been on the show and she's a 360 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,479 Speaker 2: personal friend of mine, and it is I would highly 361 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,399 Speaker 2: recommend that book. It was very helpful to me in 362 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,000 Speaker 2: that way, just taking the pressure off again, this sparese 363 00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:14,560 Speaker 2: equal man made approach, like just delighting and being with him. 364 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:17,240 Speaker 2: That's a very good example. Your books are very similar. 365 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:19,920 Speaker 2: I think in the heart of that message, that's so good. 366 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:22,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, we want to be captivated by him. Give me 367 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:26,359 Speaker 1: back the joy of being with you and help me 368 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 1: find that delight in your presence. 369 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. I can start with a simple prayer just like that, 370 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 2: and he's faithful to answer those prayers. That is a 371 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 2: prayer that I think will always one hundred percent be yes. 372 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:41,280 Speaker 1: Absolutely, you think are that kind of prayer? 373 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:46,080 Speaker 2: You're right. Well, so you've developed the REST framework through 374 00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:48,080 Speaker 2: your own journey, So can you walk us through what 375 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,360 Speaker 2: REST stands for and how it helps women move from 376 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 2: striving to peace? 377 00:20:53,560 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 1: Absolutely. Rust stands for release, embrace, surrender, and transform. So 378 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:03,399 Speaker 1: first we need to release our fears. For instance, in 379 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 1: Peace Beyond Perfection, I talk about the fear of not 380 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 1: being enough and what that's rooted in our false expectations 381 00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:13,800 Speaker 1: and our need for control. And then secondly, embrace our 382 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: identity in Christ. That is really just so key to 383 00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:22,639 Speaker 1: know that we are daughters of the King and not 384 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,480 Speaker 1: to listen to the lies of the world and what 385 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 1: we've been told from other people who we are, but 386 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: embrace who Jesus says we are. And then surrender, surrender 387 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,400 Speaker 1: our heart to God's healing work. That may be forgiving 388 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:40,760 Speaker 1: someone else or being willing to receive forgiveness, and sometimes 389 00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 1: that's forgiving ourselves and giving God the shame from the 390 00:21:46,359 --> 00:21:50,800 Speaker 1: past and truly accepting His grace in our lives. And 391 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 1: then finally, transform your daily rhythms to experience God's peace. 392 00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:59,280 Speaker 1: And that's really what this book keeping Company with Jesus 393 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:03,200 Speaker 1: focuses on, is our daily rhythms so that we can 394 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:07,280 Speaker 1: truly experience peace in His presence. 395 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,840 Speaker 2: I love how your books really go hand in hand. 396 00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:13,680 Speaker 2: They kind of, I feel like, complement each other really well. 397 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 2: And so let's focus on perfectionism for just a moment. 398 00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:19,359 Speaker 2: So perfectionism is such a heavy burden for many women, 399 00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,440 Speaker 2: and it is for me. It's something I've dealt with 400 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,880 Speaker 2: my whole life. I think we as Christian women, we 401 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:28,400 Speaker 2: want to honor God. So how can we recognize when 402 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,560 Speaker 2: our pursuit of holiness has quietly turned into unhealthy striving. 403 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 1: When the joy drains out of our service and resentment 404 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:41,200 Speaker 1: creeps in, when we keep showing up because people are 405 00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 1: counting on us, but we know that we're pouring from 406 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 1: an empty vessel. And when ministry feels more like a 407 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 1: weight than a calling. 408 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 2: Well, those were convicting, Those are good. Those are good. 409 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:57,680 Speaker 1: Holiness that flows from abiding produces overflow, energy, joy, purpose, 410 00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 1: even on hard days. Striving to guys this holiness produces depletion. 411 00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:05,800 Speaker 1: The question needs to be am I doing this from 412 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:07,879 Speaker 1: overflow or from obligation? Oh? 413 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:09,760 Speaker 2: My goodness, I need to all like sit with that. 414 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 2: I'm me have that on repeat in journal and go 415 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 2: to the Lord. That's really good, Christine. So for the 416 00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:20,159 Speaker 2: woman listening today who feels weary, spiritually dry or stuff, 417 00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:24,359 Speaker 2: just going through the motions, what simple first step would 418 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:25,959 Speaker 2: you encourage her to take today? 419 00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 1: I would say you going back to that breath prayer 420 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:33,920 Speaker 1: and just saying I return to you, I abide in you, 421 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 1: and you know, maybe holding her hands open on her 422 00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:41,439 Speaker 1: lap and or out in front of her and taking 423 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:45,400 Speaker 1: the time to just acknowledge Jesus and saying, I'm here 424 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 1: speak to me, and I want to hear what you 425 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,400 Speaker 1: have to say to me. And I share a story 426 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 1: in the opening chapter of Keeping Company with Jesus where 427 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:58,359 Speaker 1: I went to a women's retreat weekend and I was 428 00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:01,439 Speaker 1: struggling when I wanted. I'd been through a hard season 429 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,840 Speaker 1: and I felt like I had disqualified myself, that I 430 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,960 Speaker 1: had been, that I was just so far gone that 431 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:13,480 Speaker 1: Jesus had nothing left to say to me. And I 432 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:18,239 Speaker 1: went through this retreat weekend and Friday night, nothing all 433 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:21,760 Speaker 1: day Saturday, and I'm hearing and watching other women just 434 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:25,560 Speaker 1: coming away with all these things that you know, God 435 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 1: had been sharing with them, and I'm like, Okay, that 436 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: confirms it. God doesn't have anything else to say to me. 437 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 1: And I knew he still loved me, but I felt 438 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: like the black sheet. And so Sunday morning, the retreat 439 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:41,720 Speaker 1: speaker was talking about God giving us a new name, 440 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,719 Speaker 1: and she gave us some reflection questions, and I went 441 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 1: back to my room with that. I remember sitting on 442 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:49,240 Speaker 1: the in the middle of my bed, cross legged and 443 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,960 Speaker 1: just saying, Jesus, what's the name I've been buying into? 444 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,960 Speaker 1: And I realized it had been not good enough. My 445 00:24:57,040 --> 00:24:59,359 Speaker 1: mother had called me that, my grandmother had called me, 446 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:03,240 Speaker 1: that husband had called me that. And then I wept, 447 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:05,640 Speaker 1: and I hadn't been able to cry for a long time, 448 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:09,679 Speaker 1: and so that was very cathartic, and then I said, Okay. So, 449 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 1: following the questions that the leader had given us, said 450 00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:18,359 Speaker 1: what name do you have for me? And I wasn't 451 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:22,600 Speaker 1: really thinking that he would say anything because I'd just 452 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 1: been experiencing silence, and all of a sudden I heard 453 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 1: you are my precious pearl, and I was like, really, 454 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,320 Speaker 1: so you think I'm valuable and you know, something to 455 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 1: be treasured and that that just kind of really changed 456 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 1: the dynamics of my relationship with God. I'd been through 457 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,680 Speaker 1: a divorce and even though I'd been given a second 458 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,359 Speaker 1: chance with the new husband, and I just felt like 459 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,800 Speaker 1: that was love I didn't deserve and I didn't deserve 460 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:55,639 Speaker 1: God's love. And in that time alone with him and 461 00:25:55,800 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 1: just being open and surrendered and willing to receive, He's 462 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 1: spoken to my heart and I share that because it 463 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,120 Speaker 1: doesn't always happen like the first time you sit down 464 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:09,119 Speaker 1: with him. You know, he may want you to continue 465 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: to reach out and to ask him, but just to 466 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 1: persevere and keep showing up and keep holding your hands open, 467 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: having that posture of being ready to receive, and he 468 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:21,359 Speaker 1: will eventually, might be right away, it might be a 469 00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 1: while later, but he will tell you whatever the answer 470 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:25,959 Speaker 1: is to what you're asking. 471 00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:29,040 Speaker 2: I'm thankful that you were vulnerable to share that story, 472 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,560 Speaker 2: because I think that so many of us, even at 473 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:35,200 Speaker 2: church or in any circumstance, you're comparing even your relationship 474 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,200 Speaker 2: to other people's relationship with the Lord. And then even like, well, God, 475 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,440 Speaker 2: why are you being so silent? But as you were talking, 476 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,639 Speaker 2: I just kept thinking about Hagar and how she was 477 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:48,480 Speaker 2: in a really difficult place, but then she finally got alone, 478 00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:51,679 Speaker 2: and He saw her there, and he sees you, and 479 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:54,639 Speaker 2: he hears you, and he is faithful to love you 480 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 2: and be present with you. He wants to keep company 481 00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:59,920 Speaker 2: with you. That's the kind of God that we serve. Yeah, 482 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,120 Speaker 2: that's really good, Christine. Well, you know, on this podcast, 483 00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:05,200 Speaker 2: we always come back to love and because it is 484 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:07,920 Speaker 2: the greatest commandment. So how does abiding in Jesus help 485 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,040 Speaker 2: us to love God more deeply and love others more 486 00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:11,440 Speaker 2: freely and authentically? 487 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:15,840 Speaker 1: When we feel loved, when we see ourselves how God 488 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:19,400 Speaker 1: sees us, and we can only do that through spending 489 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 1: time with him. Then we're able to give to others 490 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,119 Speaker 1: out of fullness instead of from a place of exhaustion 491 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:30,160 Speaker 1: and depletion. And so I think that that's really important 492 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 1: to see how He loves us. And I love the 493 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,880 Speaker 1: verse first John three to one. See what great love 494 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,080 Speaker 1: the Father is lavish on us, that we should be 495 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 1: called children of God. He pours out his love on 496 00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:48,439 Speaker 1: us extravagantly. And when we recognize just the depths and 497 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,800 Speaker 1: the breath of his love for us, then we can 498 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 1: give to others out of fullness. 499 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:59,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, tell us something that you are living right now. 500 00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,640 Speaker 2: I think your heart is full after the weekend. 501 00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 1: This is That's exactly what I'm loving right now. In Michigan, 502 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:09,359 Speaker 1: we had a very long winter and I think we 503 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,040 Speaker 1: just skipped right over spring and we finally have warm weather. 504 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,160 Speaker 1: So I was loving having the family here this last 505 00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 1: weekend for Memorial Memorial Day weekend and all the grandkids 506 00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 1: and playing bubbles and playing in the water and going 507 00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 1: out on the boat, and so we just had a 508 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:29,800 Speaker 1: nice family time. So I'm very very thankful that I'm 509 00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:32,840 Speaker 1: living close to them now and we have a place 510 00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:35,359 Speaker 1: where everyone can gather and be together. 511 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, what a gift. Well, I know that I want 512 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,320 Speaker 2: to stay connected with you. I'm sure listeners are going 513 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 2: to want to, so tell us how we can best 514 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:43,720 Speaker 2: do that. 515 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 1: Absolutely. My website is Christine Carter Hoy dot com and 516 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:54,000 Speaker 1: on there you can find my substack. There's a link 517 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,200 Speaker 1: to my sub stack. You can see both of my 518 00:28:56,240 --> 00:29:00,560 Speaker 1: books on there, and based on the Rust work that 519 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: I talked about today, right on the homepage there is 520 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 1: a link to a Rust devotional that is a free 521 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: gift that people can download. 522 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 2: Wonderful. Well, we will include all of that in the 523 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 2: show notes. But would you do us the honor of 524 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 2: praying for us as we close today? 525 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 1: Absolutely, the Lord Jesus, thank you so much for the 526 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 1: invitation to come and keep company with you. And I 527 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,760 Speaker 1: just pray for the women that are listening to this 528 00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:35,720 Speaker 1: podcast that in their weariness, their exhaustion, they're just total 529 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 1: depletion spiritually, physically, emotionally, that you would come and meet 530 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,440 Speaker 1: them where they're at, that they would stop believing the 531 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 1: lie that they have to earn their place with you, 532 00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 1: that rather they can see that you've saved a seat 533 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 1: for them. You're patting the seat next to them or 534 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 1: next to you, and you're calling them over to come 535 00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:04,000 Speaker 1: and sit beside you, and that they don't have to 536 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 1: have permission to quit the striving, They don't have to 537 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: have permission to stop and take time with you. And 538 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 1: I just pray that they will find delight in you again, 539 00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 1: find delight in that relationship with you, and that they 540 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,880 Speaker 1: will become captivated by you so that, like Mary, we 541 00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 1: can sit at your feet and listen to what you 542 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:30,360 Speaker 1: have to share with us, whether it's a new name, 543 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 1: whether it's a word from a passage of scripture, whatever 544 00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:39,280 Speaker 1: it is that you have that will meet us in 545 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:44,000 Speaker 1: that moment. Lord, we're so thankful for you, and I 546 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 1: just ask for you to bless each of these women 547 00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:54,240 Speaker 1: and help them realize that there is nearness and connection 548 00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: just in being in your presence. And that's where we 549 00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:01,440 Speaker 1: find true peace, not through our striving, not through our performing, 550 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:05,320 Speaker 1: not through our achievements, but in your presence, Lord, and 551 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,920 Speaker 1: we thank you and your precious name. Amen. 552 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 2: Amen, As you were praying and just kept thinking, isn't 553 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,800 Speaker 2: it incredible that the God of the universe, the creator 554 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:20,400 Speaker 2: of everything, how majestic and mighty and wonderful he is 555 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:24,040 Speaker 2: wants to keep company with us. It's just incredible to 556 00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 2: think about. That's the kind of God that we serve. 557 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:28,600 Speaker 2: That's the kind of God that loves you. And so Christine, 558 00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 2: thank you, thank you for such a good conversation today 559 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,680 Speaker 2: and for your encouragement to find peace in God's presence 560 00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:36,600 Speaker 2: and to keep company with him. 561 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 1: Thank you, Rachel, I've enjoyed being with you. 562 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:41,880 Speaker 2: Thank you so much for listening to the Love Offering podcast. 563 00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:44,960 Speaker 2: I hope today's conversation reminded you that Jesus never intended 564 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:47,480 Speaker 2: for your relationship with him to feel like endless, striving 565 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:52,080 Speaker 2: or exhausting performance. His invitation is simple, yet profound. Remain 566 00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:56,280 Speaker 2: with him, stay connected to the vine, rest in his presence, 567 00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 2: and from that place of abiding, true peace and lasting 568 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:01,800 Speaker 2: free will grow now in your life. If you enjoy 569 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:03,680 Speaker 2: this episode, please share it with a friend and leaver 570 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:05,600 Speaker 2: of you. It helps others find the show and spread 571 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 2: some message of love even further. To connect with me, 572 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,360 Speaker 2: visit me on my website at Rachelcadams dot com, where 573 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 2: you can download the Love Always Devotional, a free resource 574 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:15,640 Speaker 2: to help you realize how beloved you already are. Be 575 00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 2: sure to check out Christine's book Keeping Company with Jesus 576 00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 2: finding Peace in his presence. A special thank you to 577 00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,280 Speaker 2: Life Audio for supporting this podcast and making it possible. 578 00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 2: To find more great podcasts, visitlifeaudio dot com. Until next time, 579 00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 2: let's make our lives an offering of love.