1 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:03,620 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:16,010 --> 00:00:18,950 Speaker 2: You're listening to Everyday Prayers with Million Praying Moms, where 3 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:21,060 Speaker 2: we help you pray God's Word for your family in 4 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:24,160 Speaker 2: the areas you need it most. I'm your host, Nicolette Bell. Here, 5 00:00:24,250 --> 00:00:26,620 Speaker 2: we believe prayer isn't a last resort. It is our 6 00:00:26,700 --> 00:00:30,620 Speaker 2: first and best response in parenting. It is a partnership 7 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,520 Speaker 2: that God invites us into for the hearts of our children. 8 00:00:34,020 --> 00:00:37,300 Speaker 2: I am so excited today to have a special guest 9 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:40,480 Speaker 2: on the podcast as we continue our Friday Conversation series. 10 00:00:40,909 --> 00:00:43,450 Speaker 1: I have Reverend Susan Eaton here on the podcast. 11 00:00:43,510 --> 00:00:46,550 Speaker 2: Susan is a dear personal friend of mine and has 12 00:00:46,590 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 2: been a mentor of mine for years. But Susan, I 13 00:00:49,780 --> 00:00:52,979 Speaker 2: want you to tell everybody else about you. And I'm 14 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:54,640 Speaker 2: just so glad you're here. Welcome to the show. 15 00:00:55,080 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 3: Nicolette, thank you so much. 16 00:00:57,800 --> 00:00:58,610 Speaker 1: I love you. 17 00:00:58,620 --> 00:01:01,810 Speaker 3: I love your ministry. I love the words you put 18 00:01:01,830 --> 00:01:05,690 Speaker 3: into the world. I just, I'm so proud of you. 19 00:01:06,050 --> 00:01:09,590 Speaker 3: And I'm so appreciative of the support that you're giving 20 00:01:09,630 --> 00:01:18,340 Speaker 3: me as well. I live in Hattiesburg, Mississippi. I'm an 21 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:23,410 Speaker 3: ordained clergywoman at Parkway Heights United Methodist Church. I've been 22 00:01:23,430 --> 00:01:29,949 Speaker 3: at this church for 14 years now. My job is 23 00:01:29,990 --> 00:01:33,410 Speaker 3: discipleship pastor. What does that mean? It means I get 24 00:01:33,510 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 3: to do anything I want, basically. I work with all 25 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,320 Speaker 3: of the age groups. We have a children's minister. We 26 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:42,920 Speaker 3: have a youth pastor, but I get to oversee and 27 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:48,660 Speaker 3: work with them and women's ministry, college age folks, just 28 00:01:48,780 --> 00:01:53,540 Speaker 3: adult Bible studies, preaching, special worship services, all of those 29 00:01:53,800 --> 00:02:00,010 Speaker 3: beautiful things I am honored to do in the church vocationally. 30 00:02:00,030 --> 00:02:04,870 Speaker 3: And it also affords me time to write, which is 31 00:02:04,910 --> 00:02:08,570 Speaker 3: something I really love to do and create resources that 32 00:02:08,630 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 3: other people can use. I'm married. My husband, Stuart, is 33 00:02:12,910 --> 00:02:18,350 Speaker 3: a therapist. And together we have two pretty much adult children, 34 00:02:18,450 --> 00:02:25,150 Speaker 3: ages 24 and 21. And we have a seven-year-old miniature 35 00:02:25,290 --> 00:02:29,910 Speaker 3: Labrador mix named Mabel, who is the one who keeps 36 00:02:29,990 --> 00:02:31,230 Speaker 3: us on our toes the most. 37 00:02:32,770 --> 00:02:36,710 Speaker 2: I love following Mabel on Instagram. I feel like I 38 00:02:36,750 --> 00:02:38,290 Speaker 2: know Mabel and I've never met her. 39 00:02:38,669 --> 00:02:39,910 Speaker 3: People say that a lot. 40 00:02:40,169 --> 00:02:42,669 Speaker 1: I feel like I know her and Well, Susan, thanks 41 00:02:42,710 --> 00:02:43,450 Speaker 1: for being here. 42 00:02:44,090 --> 00:02:48,089 Speaker 2: And you have written many books over the years, but 43 00:02:48,370 --> 00:02:50,220 Speaker 2: you have a new book that has just come out 44 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:50,850 Speaker 2: into the world. 45 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:52,540 Speaker 1: It is called Even in Exile. 46 00:02:53,180 --> 00:02:55,180 Speaker 2: And I had the pleasure of getting to read this 47 00:02:55,260 --> 00:02:58,400 Speaker 2: kind of in its beta phase as you were working 48 00:02:58,580 --> 00:03:01,900 Speaker 2: on it and getting to come alongside and say, you 49 00:03:01,940 --> 00:03:05,500 Speaker 2: have got to write this book. Like this is something 50 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:10,000 Speaker 2: that the world needs. And so the title, even just 51 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 2: in the title, Even in exile, rediscovering hope and joy 52 00:03:13,040 --> 00:03:15,360 Speaker 2: when your world turns upside down. It's a beautiful cover. 53 00:03:17,060 --> 00:03:18,639 Speaker 2: My Josie asked me, I meant to tell you this. 54 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:20,780 Speaker 2: It's a girl dancing in the rain, for those of 55 00:03:20,820 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 2: you who are not watching the video but are just 56 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:27,780 Speaker 2: listening with your ears. Josie asked me, Mom, is this 57 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:28,920 Speaker 2: a book about ballerinas? 58 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:30,380 Speaker 3: Oh. 59 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:34,990 Speaker 1: And I said, what? No, not really, but it is 60 00:03:35,050 --> 00:03:35,990 Speaker 1: about dancing. 61 00:03:36,050 --> 00:03:37,190 Speaker 2: And then I kind of got to tell her what 62 00:03:37,230 --> 00:03:38,860 Speaker 2: your book was about and whatever, but it was just 63 00:03:38,900 --> 00:03:39,339 Speaker 2: so cute. 64 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: She thought it was a ballerina on your book. 65 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 3: Well, I mean, you know, I would tell Josie, you know, 66 00:03:45,260 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 3: what would happen if a ballerina got sad? Does that 67 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:49,810 Speaker 3: mean she has to stop dancing? 68 00:03:49,820 --> 00:03:50,470 Speaker 1: Stop dancing. 69 00:03:50,870 --> 00:03:54,070 Speaker 3: Or can she find a reason to keep dancing even 70 00:03:54,130 --> 00:03:58,100 Speaker 3: when things are kind of sad? And so that's what 71 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:02,090 Speaker 3: that rain, dancing in the rain to me, that really, 72 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,150 Speaker 3: that image captured me so much. You know, you see 73 00:04:05,190 --> 00:04:08,510 Speaker 3: the swirl around her, which could be the wind coming 74 00:04:08,590 --> 00:04:12,310 Speaker 3: against her or it could be the Holy Spirit surrounding her. 75 00:04:12,690 --> 00:04:16,140 Speaker 3: The rain coming down, those hard times, the seasons when 76 00:04:16,180 --> 00:04:19,860 Speaker 3: we're like, I don't want it to rain. She's dancing 77 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:24,130 Speaker 3: in it. And that's incredible. picture seemed to capture the 78 00:04:24,170 --> 00:04:26,210 Speaker 3: whole message of the book. 79 00:04:26,470 --> 00:04:29,450 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I would agree. I would agree. So let's 80 00:04:29,510 --> 00:04:30,870 Speaker 1: talk about the title. 81 00:04:30,930 --> 00:04:33,409 Speaker 2: The subtitle is Rediscovering Hope and Joy When Your World 82 00:04:33,470 --> 00:04:37,409 Speaker 2: Turns Upside Down. But the word exile, it's not one 83 00:04:37,450 --> 00:04:42,500 Speaker 2: we hear a lot about in our modern day vocabulary. 84 00:04:42,510 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 1: So what does it mean to be in exile? 85 00:04:47,060 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 2: And what are you talking about when you're talking about 86 00:04:50,220 --> 00:04:51,260 Speaker 2: exile in this book? 87 00:04:51,860 --> 00:04:55,460 Speaker 3: So exile is the loss of home. It's the loss 88 00:04:55,500 --> 00:05:01,370 Speaker 3: of familiarity. It's when everything has been going along smoothly. 89 00:05:01,390 --> 00:05:04,070 Speaker 3: We feel like we have some semblance of control. We 90 00:05:04,110 --> 00:05:07,919 Speaker 3: know what to expect from everyday life. That's home. Exile 91 00:05:08,250 --> 00:05:12,900 Speaker 3: is when all of that is suddenly gone. flipped upside down, 92 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:18,420 Speaker 3: when what was familiar territory now looks very foreign. We 93 00:05:18,460 --> 00:05:20,940 Speaker 3: don't know what to do next. Maybe we don't even 94 00:05:20,990 --> 00:05:25,210 Speaker 3: know what just happened. We don't know what to think 95 00:05:25,250 --> 00:05:25,969 Speaker 3: about God. 96 00:05:25,990 --> 00:05:27,390 Speaker 1: Who are you, God? 97 00:05:27,470 --> 00:05:30,630 Speaker 3: Did you do this? Did you allow this? How could 98 00:05:30,690 --> 00:05:33,610 Speaker 3: you allow this? How do I connect with you? What 99 00:05:33,670 --> 00:05:37,490 Speaker 3: do I do next? It's any season in life that 100 00:05:38,010 --> 00:05:43,810 Speaker 3: that disrupts us and it leaves us disoriented and just 101 00:05:44,420 --> 00:05:48,160 Speaker 3: longing for things to go back the way they were 102 00:05:48,180 --> 00:05:53,180 Speaker 3: or for an ease of the pain, the suffering, the chaos. 103 00:05:54,260 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 3: It's just, that's what it is. Your world has turned 104 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 3: upside down. And that word exile was not the word 105 00:06:04,100 --> 00:06:08,150 Speaker 3: that I ever held in my mind. for seasons like that. 106 00:06:08,490 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 3: But it is when I found myself in a season 107 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:15,920 Speaker 3: like that, and I went straight to the Word of 108 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:20,260 Speaker 3: God for hope and clarity, the Spirit led me to. 109 00:06:21,900 --> 00:06:23,710 Speaker 1: Read the book of Ezekiel. 110 00:06:23,870 --> 00:06:28,090 Speaker 3: I just suddenly became very curious. And what is Ezekiel 111 00:06:28,170 --> 00:06:32,270 Speaker 3: all about? A people in exile, God's people stripped away 112 00:06:32,310 --> 00:06:36,330 Speaker 3: from their home and taken 500 miles away to live 113 00:06:36,370 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 3: in a foreign land as refugees, as foreigners. All of 114 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 3: their identity stripped away, everything they knew to expect from 115 00:06:44,460 --> 00:06:47,980 Speaker 3: life gone. And what do we do now? And so 116 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:51,980 Speaker 3: that word exile from their story rose to the surface 117 00:06:52,020 --> 00:06:58,030 Speaker 3: for me and helped me see that's, in essence— the 118 00:06:58,070 --> 00:07:01,330 Speaker 3: way I feel. And that's what it is with all 119 00:07:01,370 --> 00:07:04,980 Speaker 3: of us. We don't have to literally be exiled people 120 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 3: to experience a spiritual exile. Yeah. 121 00:07:10,480 --> 00:07:14,740 Speaker 2: And so this comes from a deep personal experience in 122 00:07:14,780 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 2: your life when you found yourself in exile. 123 00:07:17,180 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: When you open Susan's. 124 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:24,530 Speaker 2: Book, it begins immediately introducing the story that you found 125 00:07:24,570 --> 00:07:27,250 Speaker 2: yourself in exile as a mom. 126 00:07:28,470 --> 00:07:30,290 Speaker 1: Caring for your son. 127 00:07:30,430 --> 00:07:33,750 Speaker 2: And so I want you to share a little bit 128 00:07:33,910 --> 00:07:37,850 Speaker 2: with us about that because it's such a powerful, just 129 00:07:38,570 --> 00:07:42,650 Speaker 2: kind of opening to what you teach in the Word 130 00:07:43,010 --> 00:07:45,910 Speaker 2: through that personal learning of yourself. You said you didn't 131 00:07:45,930 --> 00:07:48,230 Speaker 2: really want to write this book, right? You avoided writing 132 00:07:48,250 --> 00:07:48,750 Speaker 2: this book. 133 00:07:48,770 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: Yeah. I put it off. 134 00:07:51,740 --> 00:07:55,179 Speaker 3: I think Pete Down wanted to write the book, but 135 00:07:55,420 --> 00:08:01,590 Speaker 3: it was intimidating and scary. And when you're writing a 136 00:08:01,690 --> 00:08:05,130 Speaker 3: book and you're telling stories and you're trying to convey 137 00:08:05,170 --> 00:08:07,670 Speaker 3: to other people what you felt, you have to go 138 00:08:07,710 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 3: back into it. You have to relive things. And that 139 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:14,500 Speaker 3: was one of the things my editor pushed me on 140 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:20,190 Speaker 3: was tell more, tell more. But yes, when our oldest, 141 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:25,930 Speaker 3: who's 24 now, was 17, we became aware of some 142 00:08:26,490 --> 00:08:30,740 Speaker 3: serious mental health struggle that was going on. Now we 143 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 3: have diagnoses, generalized anxiety disorder, some pretty severe social anxiety 144 00:08:37,940 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 3: and major depressive disorder. But that I mean, this was 145 00:08:43,400 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: the beginning and all we saw was a child suffering 146 00:08:47,100 --> 00:08:54,479 Speaker 3: that was once very active and interested in being places 147 00:08:54,620 --> 00:08:59,680 Speaker 3: and enjoying music and and games and friends and suddenly 148 00:08:59,740 --> 00:09:03,839 Speaker 3: didn't leave the room. The smile had gone. It was 149 00:09:03,860 --> 00:09:11,410 Speaker 3: just it was so slow that. you just thought, am 150 00:09:11,490 --> 00:09:14,130 Speaker 3: I seeing this or am I not seeing, you know, 151 00:09:14,190 --> 00:09:14,650 Speaker 3: is this. 152 00:09:14,570 --> 00:09:16,530 Speaker 1: Just teenage stuff? Yeah. 153 00:09:17,370 --> 00:09:20,330 Speaker 3: Or is there really something going on here? And I 154 00:09:20,350 --> 00:09:23,730 Speaker 3: would say that to any moms of teenagers, if you 155 00:09:24,250 --> 00:09:28,089 Speaker 3: are wondering, you know, am I seeing this? Do all 156 00:09:28,110 --> 00:09:30,870 Speaker 3: teenagers act this way? Just go ahead and lean in 157 00:09:30,890 --> 00:09:36,270 Speaker 3: and don't just write it off as, as nothing. It 158 00:09:36,350 --> 00:09:39,190 Speaker 3: could be just a phase. It could be just temporary 159 00:09:39,250 --> 00:09:42,950 Speaker 3: circumstantial kinds of things, but get curious and lean in. And, 160 00:09:43,420 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 3: and so, um, that's what I did. I, I chose to, 161 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:51,320 Speaker 3: to lean in and knock on the door and show 162 00:09:51,380 --> 00:09:54,330 Speaker 3: up in the dark rooms. Um, but you know what, 163 00:09:54,550 --> 00:09:58,210 Speaker 3: even that is very hard because it is very hard 164 00:09:58,250 --> 00:10:01,239 Speaker 3: to sit with someone in their darkness. It's a lot 165 00:10:01,380 --> 00:10:04,980 Speaker 3: easier to just go, I can't deal with that and 166 00:10:05,020 --> 00:10:08,699 Speaker 3: go get on your phone or go binge watch something 167 00:10:08,780 --> 00:10:12,780 Speaker 3: or say I'm too busy and avoid it. But when 168 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 3: our children are suffering, they desperately need their parents or 169 00:10:18,260 --> 00:10:23,010 Speaker 3: parent to come in, lean in, and speak the words 170 00:10:23,170 --> 00:10:26,689 Speaker 3: over them that say, I am here. I am not 171 00:10:26,790 --> 00:10:29,950 Speaker 3: leaving you. There is nothing you can say or do 172 00:10:30,010 --> 00:10:31,929 Speaker 3: right now that will make me love you less. 173 00:10:32,550 --> 00:10:33,290 Speaker 1: I love you. 174 00:10:33,670 --> 00:10:36,349 Speaker 3: And if they're struggling with faith and even believing in 175 00:10:36,429 --> 00:10:40,650 Speaker 3: God to say, I believe God loves you. I will 176 00:10:40,710 --> 00:10:44,290 Speaker 3: have faith for you while you cannot have it. I 177 00:10:44,330 --> 00:10:48,020 Speaker 3: will hold that for you. until you can. Um, and 178 00:10:48,059 --> 00:10:51,579 Speaker 3: so that's, that's what I did. But while I was 179 00:10:52,140 --> 00:10:55,500 Speaker 3: seeking to hold my child up and carry my child 180 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:58,979 Speaker 3: through that, you know, who was holding me up, right? 181 00:10:59,220 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 3: During the pandemic, we were all locked away in our homes. Um, 182 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 3: and I didn't feel like I should share a lot 183 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:10,170 Speaker 3: of my, my kids' personal struggle with a whole lot 184 00:11:10,210 --> 00:11:14,750 Speaker 3: of other people. So I felt lonely. Um, So it 185 00:11:14,790 --> 00:11:17,910 Speaker 3: was just a very hard time. And so the Lord 186 00:11:17,990 --> 00:11:21,910 Speaker 3: is the one who's there always. And He is the 187 00:11:22,030 --> 00:11:26,410 Speaker 3: one who held me up. And so I processed all 188 00:11:26,450 --> 00:11:28,590 Speaker 3: of what I was going through, what I was seeing, 189 00:11:28,630 --> 00:11:30,929 Speaker 3: what I was experiencing, how I felt as a mother. 190 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 3: I'm a failure. I'm a bad mom. I should have 191 00:11:34,780 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 3: seen this coming. I should have known how to prevent this. 192 00:11:37,700 --> 00:11:39,620 Speaker 3: What did I not do I should have done that 193 00:11:40,740 --> 00:11:45,170 Speaker 3: maybe could have stopped this? Those aren't helpful things. And 194 00:11:45,690 --> 00:11:50,540 Speaker 3: what the Lord invited me to ask was, what's the 195 00:11:50,620 --> 00:11:56,199 Speaker 3: invitation here? And how can I lean in, even in 196 00:11:56,240 --> 00:12:00,610 Speaker 3: the hard times, to God, to His Word, to the 197 00:12:00,660 --> 00:12:04,030 Speaker 3: hope we have there, so that I can keep showing 198 00:12:04,170 --> 00:12:07,530 Speaker 3: up in the dark space and in the hard times 199 00:12:08,130 --> 00:12:11,830 Speaker 3: to be there for my child, even when I was very, 200 00:12:11,870 --> 00:12:14,990 Speaker 3: very uncomfortable. I was hearing and seeing. 201 00:12:15,870 --> 00:12:19,080 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. And you say in the book, you are 202 00:12:19,100 --> 00:12:23,520 Speaker 1: a pastor. Your husband is a counselor. You feel like, 203 00:12:23,740 --> 00:12:25,820 Speaker 1: you know, man, we should have the tools to be 204 00:12:25,940 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 1: able to step in here to prevent this or whatever. 205 00:12:29,900 --> 00:12:32,199 Speaker 1: And to me, that was reading. 206 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 2: That was such a reminder of me, mom of young kids, 207 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,840 Speaker 2: but of serving in youth ministry for many years and 208 00:12:39,920 --> 00:12:42,880 Speaker 2: watching many children suffer through and you talked about this 209 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:46,660 Speaker 2: like as a pastor you can step in with families 210 00:12:46,990 --> 00:12:50,969 Speaker 2: and love them and care for them but when at 211 00:12:50,990 --> 00:12:52,470 Speaker 2: the end of the day you get to go back 212 00:12:52,750 --> 00:12:56,429 Speaker 2: home to your home and your safe place and your 213 00:12:56,490 --> 00:12:59,349 Speaker 2: peace and whatever and when it's your own child in 214 00:12:59,370 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 2: your own home that's a very different experience um and 215 00:13:04,620 --> 00:13:06,969 Speaker 2: so I wonder if we could talk a little bit 216 00:13:07,010 --> 00:13:10,560 Speaker 2: to the mom that feels like, you know, to me, 217 00:13:10,570 --> 00:13:12,130 Speaker 2: this is an issue of control, right? 218 00:13:12,170 --> 00:13:14,490 Speaker 1: Like we think we can control. 219 00:13:13,790 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 2: The outcome of our children's lives and continually we are 220 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 2: reminded that we cannot do that as moms. How do 221 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:25,240 Speaker 2: we release that control? And like you said, that's not 222 00:13:25,300 --> 00:13:28,100 Speaker 2: helpful dialogue. How do we have maybe some more helpful 223 00:13:28,300 --> 00:13:29,960 Speaker 2: dialogue as moms? 224 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 3: Such a good question. And I'm really glad you asked 225 00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:37,979 Speaker 3: it because There seems to be floating around, you know, 226 00:13:38,020 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 3: and we hear it from time to time. And maybe 227 00:13:40,059 --> 00:13:44,200 Speaker 3: I've even been guilty of sort of conveying this in 228 00:13:44,220 --> 00:13:46,420 Speaker 3: the past before we went through what we went through. 229 00:13:46,450 --> 00:13:49,510 Speaker 3: I don't know. But there seems to be a narrative 230 00:13:49,990 --> 00:13:54,170 Speaker 3: that teaches us that if you do everything right, if 231 00:13:54,210 --> 00:13:57,730 Speaker 3: you do these parenting tricks, if you parent these very 232 00:13:57,750 --> 00:14:01,349 Speaker 3: specific ways and you You trust the Lord with your children. 233 00:14:01,590 --> 00:14:05,490 Speaker 3: Everything will go smoothly. They will never have a struggle 234 00:14:05,710 --> 00:14:08,270 Speaker 3: or they won't have a big one and they won't 235 00:14:08,330 --> 00:14:10,569 Speaker 3: lose their faith. They won't, you know, none of these 236 00:14:10,630 --> 00:14:15,330 Speaker 3: things will happen. And unfortunately, we are not in control. 237 00:14:15,950 --> 00:14:18,850 Speaker 3: of how our children will feel, what will go on 238 00:14:18,910 --> 00:14:23,950 Speaker 3: with them emotionally, mentally, even spiritually. What we can do 239 00:14:24,050 --> 00:14:28,430 Speaker 3: is create the best environment possible for them to thrive 240 00:14:28,810 --> 00:14:31,580 Speaker 3: and to know truth and to hear truth and to 241 00:14:31,700 --> 00:14:35,380 Speaker 3: know that at home, even if nowhere else, they're certain 242 00:14:35,420 --> 00:14:39,830 Speaker 3: about belonging and acceptance and love. they will know beyond 243 00:14:39,930 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 3: a doubt that at home I am loved, right? And 244 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 3: so to release the idea that there are very clear 245 00:14:49,420 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 3: things I can do to prevent my child's suffering or 246 00:14:53,540 --> 00:14:57,310 Speaker 3: even to prevent my child, I don't know, straying from 247 00:14:57,430 --> 00:15:01,350 Speaker 3: the faith, making choices we disagree with, you know, anything 248 00:15:01,410 --> 00:15:05,670 Speaker 3: like that. Releasing that and saying, you know what, Lord, 249 00:15:05,690 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 3: I trust you. my child to you. I trust that 250 00:15:11,460 --> 00:15:15,470 Speaker 3: no matter what happens in our lives as a family 251 00:15:15,550 --> 00:15:22,350 Speaker 3: and in my child's life, in their minds, emotionally, mentally, spiritually, 252 00:15:22,370 --> 00:15:26,790 Speaker 3: that you love them. You love them and you care 253 00:15:26,830 --> 00:15:30,250 Speaker 3: for them and you know how to lead them. My 254 00:15:30,330 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 3: job as a parent, again, create the best environment I 255 00:15:34,700 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 3: know how to. And that shouldn't be um, something that, 256 00:15:39,580 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 3: that makes us feel like we have to be perfect either. 257 00:15:41,780 --> 00:15:45,630 Speaker 3: You know, we, we are going to make mistakes as parents. 258 00:15:46,190 --> 00:15:51,650 Speaker 3: And so knowing how to apologize, when to apologize, um, 259 00:15:51,750 --> 00:15:54,210 Speaker 3: not only do you set an example for your children, 260 00:15:54,650 --> 00:15:59,390 Speaker 3: but you know, you're, you're owning the fact that, yeah, 261 00:15:59,450 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 3: I haven't done everything right either, you know, so it's 262 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:07,580 Speaker 3: not perfection, but I would say love and, um, You know, 263 00:16:07,630 --> 00:16:12,660 Speaker 3: it's like as moms, you know, we carry those children 264 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 3: inside of us for nine months and we dream dreams 265 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:21,739 Speaker 3: for them and we envision their future and we have 266 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:24,300 Speaker 3: all of this going on. And then they come into 267 00:16:24,330 --> 00:16:27,410 Speaker 3: the world. And even if we've adopted a child, right, 268 00:16:27,670 --> 00:16:30,550 Speaker 3: they come into the world and we look at them 269 00:16:30,990 --> 00:16:34,489 Speaker 3: and they are just the love of our lives. They're 270 00:16:34,510 --> 00:16:37,990 Speaker 3: the center of our universe is. And we want to 271 00:16:38,030 --> 00:16:41,230 Speaker 3: do everything for them. And do we imagine how much 272 00:16:41,290 --> 00:16:46,770 Speaker 3: we love our children? How much more does God love 273 00:16:46,860 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 3: our children and see them as special and see them 274 00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 3: as beautiful and see good and beautiful things He has 275 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:57,040 Speaker 3: for them and want that to be a reality for them? 276 00:16:57,380 --> 00:17:00,540 Speaker 3: So I can trust God with my child because as 277 00:17:00,660 --> 00:17:04,180 Speaker 3: much as I love them and see that, God sees 278 00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 3: it even more. 279 00:17:05,609 --> 00:17:07,190 Speaker 1: And loves them more. Yeah. 280 00:17:08,030 --> 00:17:11,169 Speaker 3: So we should be the ones who know them better 281 00:17:11,630 --> 00:17:14,550 Speaker 3: than other adults do. So we're the ones that can 282 00:17:14,570 --> 00:17:17,010 Speaker 3: bring all of that love and all of that energy 283 00:17:17,030 --> 00:17:20,010 Speaker 3: and all of that hope and all of the dreams 284 00:17:20,170 --> 00:17:23,890 Speaker 3: into prayer to God and then surrender that to God, 285 00:17:23,910 --> 00:17:28,510 Speaker 3: knowing that He knows it even better than we do. Yeah. 286 00:17:29,980 --> 00:17:32,220 Speaker 1: That's so good. That's so good. So I want to 287 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:33,540 Speaker 1: get a little practical here. 288 00:17:33,780 --> 00:17:36,380 Speaker 2: And we talk a lot about prayer on the Everyday 289 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,399 Speaker 2: Prayers podcast. And I want to talk about, you know, 290 00:17:39,580 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 2: in that season, if a mom is listening to this 291 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:47,600 Speaker 2: and she's thinking, like, exile describes where I'm at. And 292 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 2: for the one who's listening that may not think that 293 00:17:50,220 --> 00:17:51,790 Speaker 2: that describes where they are, they might can think about 294 00:17:51,830 --> 00:17:54,550 Speaker 2: a season that they were in, or there's probably a 295 00:17:54,570 --> 00:17:57,530 Speaker 2: season that's coming, right? We can kind of be pretty 296 00:17:57,590 --> 00:18:01,030 Speaker 2: confident that we're going to face that because we are 297 00:18:01,690 --> 00:18:05,660 Speaker 2: truly exiles because this is not our forever home, right? 298 00:18:05,740 --> 00:18:09,180 Speaker 2: We are aliens in a foreign land. We are walking 299 00:18:09,260 --> 00:18:12,120 Speaker 2: around in this land that is not the way that 300 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:15,080 Speaker 2: God intended it. to be at this point, right? And 301 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:18,199 Speaker 2: He is coming back to make all things new. And 302 00:18:18,270 --> 00:18:20,810 Speaker 2: we see glimpses of the kingdom breaking in, but this 303 00:18:20,890 --> 00:18:23,850 Speaker 2: is not our citizenship, right? Our citizenship is in heaven. 304 00:18:24,190 --> 00:18:27,449 Speaker 2: So we are technically in exile, even if we are 305 00:18:27,490 --> 00:18:30,050 Speaker 2: just kind of feeling like we're just living our everyday 306 00:18:30,270 --> 00:18:34,379 Speaker 2: life right now. We are all in that season, but 307 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:37,619 Speaker 2: sometimes there's these moments that, like you're describing, that are 308 00:18:37,660 --> 00:18:41,420 Speaker 2: just true seasons of Everything I thought about my life 309 00:18:41,460 --> 00:18:45,340 Speaker 2: has been turned upside down. And how do I respond 310 00:18:45,380 --> 00:18:47,979 Speaker 2: in this way? So for that mom that's walking through that, 311 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:52,859 Speaker 2: how do you pray? How did you pray? How did 312 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 2: you keep showing up to God even when you felt 313 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 2: like maybe you weren't getting the answers you thought you 314 00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:00,940 Speaker 2: should get or maybe not in the timing that you 315 00:19:00,980 --> 00:19:02,750 Speaker 2: thought it should be happening in? 316 00:19:02,810 --> 00:19:04,230 Speaker 1: How do we keep being. 317 00:19:04,130 --> 00:19:08,010 Speaker 2: Faithful prayer warriors for our children when we maybe aren't 318 00:19:08,050 --> 00:19:08,750 Speaker 2: seeing the fruit? 319 00:19:09,310 --> 00:19:09,730 Speaker 1: Yeah. 320 00:19:09,830 --> 00:19:14,220 Speaker 3: Oh, my gosh. So in the third chapter, I believe, 321 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,520 Speaker 3: I talk about lament. A lot of us do not 322 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:23,960 Speaker 3: know what lament is and how to lament. So when 323 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 3: I had the eight women that served as beta readers 324 00:19:26,530 --> 00:19:29,010 Speaker 3: for me and they read two chapters a week for 325 00:19:29,070 --> 00:19:32,150 Speaker 3: six weeks and we met together and processed that chapter, 326 00:19:32,170 --> 00:19:35,790 Speaker 3: the topic of lament was the one that they pulled 327 00:19:35,970 --> 00:19:39,010 Speaker 3: out as like, I had no idea what this is. 328 00:19:39,660 --> 00:19:45,650 Speaker 3: So I think understanding that lament is not only allowed, 329 00:19:45,690 --> 00:19:48,550 Speaker 3: but is crucial, will help us in our prayer life 330 00:19:48,609 --> 00:19:52,740 Speaker 3: when we do not know how to pray. Lament says 331 00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:59,830 Speaker 3: you can bring your grief, your pain, your fears, your complaints, 332 00:20:00,310 --> 00:20:05,740 Speaker 3: your anger, your frustrations, all to God. You can bring 333 00:20:05,780 --> 00:20:09,020 Speaker 3: it to Him. You can name what's lacking. You can 334 00:20:09,100 --> 00:20:13,010 Speaker 3: name what's broken. You can name what's missing. Sometimes I 335 00:20:13,070 --> 00:20:16,109 Speaker 3: wonder if we don't think, okay, I've got to pray 336 00:20:16,190 --> 00:20:20,020 Speaker 3: for my family, my child, my loved one who's hurting. 337 00:20:20,420 --> 00:20:23,340 Speaker 3: And I have to already feel confident. I have to 338 00:20:23,580 --> 00:20:27,280 Speaker 3: already feel like, oh, I can envision the good and 339 00:20:27,300 --> 00:20:30,340 Speaker 3: beautiful future. I have to already be there. But often 340 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:34,510 Speaker 3: we cannot do that. And will that prevent us then 341 00:20:34,530 --> 00:20:37,350 Speaker 3: from praying if we feel like we can't do it right? 342 00:20:38,070 --> 00:20:41,650 Speaker 2: Or if we're disappointed in God's response, we'll just be like, okay, 343 00:20:42,710 --> 00:20:43,730 Speaker 2: why would I ask again? 344 00:20:43,750 --> 00:20:44,770 Speaker 1: You're not listening to me. 345 00:20:45,130 --> 00:20:49,750 Speaker 3: Exactly. And so like lament says, You come to me 346 00:20:49,930 --> 00:20:54,700 Speaker 3: as you are. You bring to me everything inside of 347 00:20:54,780 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 3: you because prayer isn't transactional. Lord, I pray this and 348 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 3: you give me this. Like he's a cosmic vending machine. 349 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:07,879 Speaker 3: We don't do that. No relationship survives or thrives or 350 00:21:07,940 --> 00:21:12,970 Speaker 3: even is real if it's transactional only. Prayer says your 351 00:21:13,070 --> 00:21:17,439 Speaker 3: opportunity is, is to have a real relationship with God. 352 00:21:17,560 --> 00:21:22,550 Speaker 3: And lament says, you can even bring what you think 353 00:21:22,650 --> 00:21:27,530 Speaker 3: is shameful or ugly or rude. You can even bring 354 00:21:27,550 --> 00:21:31,389 Speaker 3: that to God and God will hear you and God 355 00:21:31,450 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 3: will receive that. And He may, and He will, give 356 00:21:37,060 --> 00:21:41,119 Speaker 3: you a new perspective. He will ask you to wait. 357 00:21:41,700 --> 00:21:44,850 Speaker 3: Sometimes silence is a great answer because It's in the 358 00:21:45,010 --> 00:21:50,389 Speaker 3: tension and the dissonance we feel between what's not right 359 00:21:50,750 --> 00:21:57,230 Speaker 3: and the resolution. That's where we are often transformed and strengthened, 360 00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 3: and we learn lessons as we listen to God. So 361 00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:05,659 Speaker 3: how do I pray for my child? I come to 362 00:22:05,700 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 3: the Lord honestly. I name what I see and pray. 363 00:22:10,369 --> 00:22:12,570 Speaker 3: I can name what I hope for. I can name 364 00:22:12,590 --> 00:22:16,210 Speaker 3: what I want to see. And I can just go 365 00:22:16,270 --> 00:22:18,649 Speaker 3: ahead and say that too, because it is okay to 366 00:22:18,690 --> 00:22:22,210 Speaker 3: have desires and longings and dreams for your child. But 367 00:22:22,250 --> 00:22:25,730 Speaker 3: you know what? Just not make it an expectation that 368 00:22:25,770 --> 00:22:30,470 Speaker 3: has to be met, but to surrender it as an offering. 369 00:22:31,070 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 3: This is the way I see things and the way 370 00:22:34,780 --> 00:22:38,590 Speaker 3: I want things, but I trust you that that you 371 00:22:38,630 --> 00:22:40,570 Speaker 3: know exactly what is best and right and you know 372 00:22:40,630 --> 00:22:45,090 Speaker 3: when and you know how. And so we're in a 373 00:22:45,250 --> 00:22:47,060 Speaker 3: relationship with God that way. 374 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:53,800 Speaker 1: It's that posture of humility and of surrender to the Lord. 375 00:22:54,220 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 2: When we're coming on behalf of our children, it's not saying, Lord, 376 00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:02,440 Speaker 2: this is what I want to see. I'm asking for this, this, this, this, 377 00:23:02,530 --> 00:23:02,900 Speaker 2: and this. 378 00:23:04,010 --> 00:23:04,770 Speaker 1: You know their. 379 00:23:04,730 --> 00:23:07,170 Speaker 2: Heart more than I can know their heart. You see 380 00:23:07,210 --> 00:23:10,680 Speaker 2: their thoughts. You know every hair on their head. You 381 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:11,800 Speaker 2: know them more than I do. 382 00:23:11,859 --> 00:23:15,250 Speaker 1: So would your will be done? in their lives, but 383 00:23:15,290 --> 00:23:15,850 Speaker 1: then not be. 384 00:23:15,790 --> 00:23:18,830 Speaker 2: Afraid to ask for the good things that He's told 385 00:23:18,869 --> 00:23:21,300 Speaker 2: us we can ask for, right? Here on the Everyday 386 00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:23,940 Speaker 2: Prayers podcast, we talk about praying scripture for our kids 387 00:23:24,340 --> 00:23:26,919 Speaker 2: because we think if we can understand the scriptures in 388 00:23:26,940 --> 00:23:29,500 Speaker 2: the way that they're intended, don't take them out of context, 389 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,560 Speaker 2: don't grab a verse and just pull it over here 390 00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:34,020 Speaker 2: and pray it. But if we understand the scripture and 391 00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:36,359 Speaker 2: then we begin to pray the scripture for our kids, 392 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:39,830 Speaker 2: we can be confident that we're praying within God's will 393 00:23:39,990 --> 00:23:40,649 Speaker 2: for our kids. 394 00:23:41,010 --> 00:23:41,949 Speaker 1: Yes, yes. 395 00:23:42,430 --> 00:23:47,409 Speaker 3: But to release all of the dreams and the expectations 396 00:23:47,910 --> 00:23:52,100 Speaker 3: of how we believe life should go for children and 397 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:55,159 Speaker 3: what our children should think and how they should behave 398 00:23:55,180 --> 00:23:59,239 Speaker 3: and all of these things, really, we need to remember 399 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:04,140 Speaker 3: that they are individuals who can make choices. And if 400 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:10,609 Speaker 3: I set an expectation as the ultimate way that defines 401 00:24:10,850 --> 00:24:15,629 Speaker 3: success for my child or says that makes me a 402 00:24:15,670 --> 00:24:21,250 Speaker 3: successful parent, I can end up with a broken relationship 403 00:24:21,300 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 3: with my child. Maybe blame them or blame God or 404 00:24:26,100 --> 00:24:30,700 Speaker 3: blame ourselves and sit in shame when something different comes about. 405 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 3: We love our child first for who they are 100%, 406 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:41,870 Speaker 3: not the dream, not the expectation. And so that's what 407 00:24:41,970 --> 00:24:47,680 Speaker 3: I would encourage all parents to remember is you love 408 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:51,980 Speaker 3: your child. That's the bottom line. So love your child. 409 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:53,820 Speaker 1: And what does love do? 410 00:24:54,220 --> 00:24:58,810 Speaker 3: Love shows up and love gives grace and love speaks 411 00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:01,830 Speaker 3: hope and light and truth and never gives up. 412 00:25:03,650 --> 00:25:05,030 Speaker 1: So I want to dig into that a little bit 413 00:25:05,070 --> 00:25:08,070 Speaker 1: more because you share you know, you were present with 414 00:25:08,090 --> 00:25:10,669 Speaker 1: your child in the darkness and you kept knocking on 415 00:25:10,690 --> 00:25:12,869 Speaker 1: the door and opening the door and sitting in the 416 00:25:12,890 --> 00:25:17,209 Speaker 1: darkness and sitting in places of uncomfortable. And that's what 417 00:25:17,250 --> 00:25:19,280 Speaker 1: you're describing there is that love shows. 418 00:25:19,230 --> 00:25:22,100 Speaker 2: Up and love, you know, what do you say? 419 00:25:22,700 --> 00:25:25,740 Speaker 1: Was your son receptive to that? What about when a 420 00:25:25,780 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 1: mother gets pushed back to that? How do you do 421 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:32,140 Speaker 1: that gracefully in a way that honors God, like really 422 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:35,100 Speaker 1: practically for somebody that's listening and says, I want to 423 00:25:35,140 --> 00:25:36,830 Speaker 1: be there. I want to meet my child where they are. 424 00:25:37,260 --> 00:25:40,359 Speaker 1: But how do I do that even when I feel defeated? 425 00:25:40,820 --> 00:25:46,220 Speaker 3: Yeah. So when your child is struggling and they push 426 00:25:46,260 --> 00:25:52,169 Speaker 3: back against you and your efforts, remember they are in 427 00:25:52,250 --> 00:25:57,030 Speaker 3: a struggle every day, maybe even every moment of every day. 428 00:25:57,050 --> 00:26:00,270 Speaker 3: And so a lot of the pushback and the tension 429 00:26:00,350 --> 00:26:05,050 Speaker 3: that you will receive, it isn't about you. It's their 430 00:26:05,070 --> 00:26:09,370 Speaker 3: struggle and struggle is what they know. And if we 431 00:26:09,410 --> 00:26:12,729 Speaker 3: can all think back to when we were teenagers and 432 00:26:12,790 --> 00:26:15,620 Speaker 3: how we did the same thing, I know I did 433 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 3: that as a teenager. What I really wanted was for 434 00:26:20,660 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 3: my parent to keep showing up, to receive it, receive 435 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:27,340 Speaker 3: the pushback, let me do it, give me the space 436 00:26:27,380 --> 00:26:29,830 Speaker 3: when I needed it, but to keep showing up. And 437 00:26:29,950 --> 00:26:33,409 Speaker 3: so how do we do that respectfully? When I say 438 00:26:33,430 --> 00:26:36,970 Speaker 3: I kept knocking on the door, I literally knocked on 439 00:26:37,030 --> 00:26:40,230 Speaker 3: a door. I didn't barge in a room. Now, there 440 00:26:40,290 --> 00:26:44,810 Speaker 3: were times because our situation got pretty severe where if 441 00:26:44,890 --> 00:26:47,410 Speaker 3: I knocked and knocked and I got no response for 442 00:26:47,430 --> 00:26:49,929 Speaker 3: a while, I knew how to open the door and 443 00:26:50,100 --> 00:26:53,360 Speaker 3: I would cautiously open, but I would go on in anyway. 444 00:26:54,130 --> 00:26:57,970 Speaker 3: Because it can reach a point where you want to 445 00:26:58,010 --> 00:26:59,970 Speaker 3: know your child is safe and you need to be 446 00:27:00,030 --> 00:27:04,610 Speaker 3: in there. But yeah, I would say that you just 447 00:27:05,210 --> 00:27:11,970 Speaker 3: literally keep showing up. Listen and pray for discernment. Lord, 448 00:27:12,030 --> 00:27:14,370 Speaker 3: when do I need to give space and back off? 449 00:27:14,390 --> 00:27:14,460 Speaker 4: Yes. 450 00:27:15,250 --> 00:27:19,190 Speaker 3: Maybe I'm applying too much pressure here, but how can 451 00:27:19,230 --> 00:27:21,310 Speaker 3: I show up? So one of the things that I 452 00:27:21,390 --> 00:27:24,770 Speaker 3: did was I don't think I watched a show I 453 00:27:24,810 --> 00:27:26,820 Speaker 3: wanted to watch for a year and a half. I 454 00:27:26,900 --> 00:27:30,000 Speaker 3: think that I was like, what are you interested in watching? 455 00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:34,020 Speaker 3: Let's get out of the room. Let's go downstairs where 456 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:38,010 Speaker 3: the family is. And let's, what's your favorite series? And 457 00:27:38,050 --> 00:27:42,400 Speaker 3: let's watch it together. So Star Wars, I know every 458 00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 3: single thing about every Star Wars movie and every episode 459 00:27:46,780 --> 00:27:51,740 Speaker 3: of every TV series, because that's what interested my kid. 460 00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:55,320 Speaker 3: And so we did that together. You know, I found 461 00:27:55,460 --> 00:28:01,450 Speaker 3: something that was interesting and brought joy. And I offered 462 00:28:01,550 --> 00:28:05,270 Speaker 3: to be a part of that too. And so that 463 00:28:05,330 --> 00:28:08,290 Speaker 3: was a way that we could spend time. And then 464 00:28:08,450 --> 00:28:14,990 Speaker 3: often in that space of just doing something else, opportunities 465 00:28:15,130 --> 00:28:20,980 Speaker 3: arose to have a conversation, to ask a question, to say, oh, like, 466 00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:23,580 Speaker 3: you know, they might bring up something. Your kid, you'll 467 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:26,900 Speaker 3: notice they might then start talking about an interaction with 468 00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,540 Speaker 3: a friend or something that bothered them. They'll start bringing 469 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:34,820 Speaker 3: it up. And then... You know, it's a casual kind 470 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:38,450 Speaker 3: of environment you've set up where you're just hanging out. 471 00:28:38,550 --> 00:28:41,370 Speaker 3: It's not always supposed to be so intense. It doesn't 472 00:28:41,430 --> 00:28:41,910 Speaker 3: have to be. 473 00:28:42,010 --> 00:28:44,470 Speaker 1: Yeah. Like we're having a family meeting at the dinner 474 00:28:44,490 --> 00:28:47,870 Speaker 1: table or whatever. Yeah. Exactly. 475 00:28:48,070 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 3: We always have to be on a level 10 alert, 476 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,580 Speaker 3: you know, just to have fun. 477 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: Yeah. And I'd say, like, we can ask the Lord 478 00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:56,780 Speaker 1: for that, right? 479 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 2: Father, show me a way that I can connect with 480 00:29:01,660 --> 00:29:02,140 Speaker 2: my child. 481 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:02,620 Speaker 1: Like, yeah. 482 00:29:03,100 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 2: Give me a divine idea of what can I do 483 00:29:07,100 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 2: to connect with my child here. And I think, you know, 484 00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 2: that is a prayer that he would love to answer 485 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:16,210 Speaker 2: on behalf of a mom and to be able to 486 00:29:16,290 --> 00:29:19,310 Speaker 2: step forward, you know, in that and to meet our 487 00:29:19,350 --> 00:29:23,190 Speaker 2: children where they are and keep us interviewing somebody the 488 00:29:23,210 --> 00:29:25,260 Speaker 2: other day. And she talked about, you know, our job 489 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 2: as moms is to kind of just keep tilting their 490 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,229 Speaker 2: head back up to the Lord. Like just keep turning 491 00:29:31,250 --> 00:29:34,330 Speaker 2: their little chin just a little bit back up to 492 00:29:34,390 --> 00:29:38,090 Speaker 2: the Lord, just steadily reminding them like God is here. 493 00:29:38,450 --> 00:29:41,680 Speaker 2: God loves you. even in your pain, even in your struggle, 494 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:42,600 Speaker 2: like God is here. 495 00:29:42,700 --> 00:29:43,300 Speaker 1: He loves you. 496 00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:45,860 Speaker 2: And that's our job to be the little chin turners, 497 00:29:45,940 --> 00:29:48,580 Speaker 2: you know, just slowly tilting that head back up. And 498 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,670 Speaker 2: I really loved that image because it's gentle and powerful 499 00:29:52,810 --> 00:29:53,630 Speaker 2: at the same time. 500 00:29:54,230 --> 00:29:59,030 Speaker 3: Yeah. So I would write notes every day and it 501 00:29:59,070 --> 00:30:02,130 Speaker 3: was just, something I had been praying and then a 502 00:30:02,250 --> 00:30:06,950 Speaker 3: scripture and very, very short. And I just, I gave 503 00:30:06,970 --> 00:30:10,550 Speaker 3: them to my kiddo every day. They went off to 504 00:30:10,610 --> 00:30:13,490 Speaker 3: school or didn't, you know, it was either in the 505 00:30:13,530 --> 00:30:16,030 Speaker 3: backpack or it stayed in the bedroom, you know, but 506 00:30:16,090 --> 00:30:21,530 Speaker 3: there they were. And I compiled all of that. And 507 00:30:21,610 --> 00:30:24,340 Speaker 3: that was actually the book before this book, You're Going 508 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,990 Speaker 3: to Be Okay. I thought, you know what, this is, 509 00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:32,070 Speaker 3: These are tools a lot of parents can use. It's 510 00:30:32,550 --> 00:30:37,850 Speaker 3: got relaxation techniques and breathing exercises. It's got journal prompts. 511 00:30:37,910 --> 00:30:43,130 Speaker 3: It's got ideas of how to make yourself feel better. Scripture, prayers, 512 00:30:43,690 --> 00:30:47,970 Speaker 3: music links. And we put all of that together so 513 00:30:48,020 --> 00:30:51,940 Speaker 3: that if parents are wondering, how do I talk to 514 00:30:51,980 --> 00:30:56,760 Speaker 3: my child about spiritual things or difficult things? And how 515 00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:00,720 Speaker 3: can I help my child through a breathing exercise, I thought, 516 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 3: you know, let's put it all together in a resource. 517 00:31:03,580 --> 00:31:06,180 Speaker 3: The main idea was like our kid can take it 518 00:31:06,220 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 3: to college and have everything we've done together in a 519 00:31:09,940 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 3: book to access. But then also parents can use that 520 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,530 Speaker 3: and give one to their kid. They can use it. 521 00:31:18,250 --> 00:31:21,210 Speaker 3: And that can be a conversation starter. Let's read the 522 00:31:21,230 --> 00:31:26,150 Speaker 3: scripture together. Let's talk about worry and what that feels like. 523 00:31:26,190 --> 00:31:29,750 Speaker 3: Let's talk about anxiety and what it looks like and 524 00:31:30,110 --> 00:31:33,250 Speaker 3: how God helps us in those things. And, you know, 525 00:31:33,370 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 3: so yeah, you just do what you know and, and 526 00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:39,940 Speaker 3: trust the Lord. And like you said, give me the 527 00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:44,540 Speaker 3: divine ideas, Lord, help me know how to do this 528 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:47,160 Speaker 3: and the discernment and the wisdom will come. 529 00:31:47,700 --> 00:31:49,080 Speaker 1: To be able to walk in it. Okay. So I'm 530 00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:50,540 Speaker 1: glad you mentioned you're going to be okay. 531 00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:52,540 Speaker 2: So talk to us a little bit about how you 532 00:31:52,580 --> 00:31:55,880 Speaker 2: see these two books working together. You rushed the last 533 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:57,570 Speaker 2: one to get it to your son before he was 534 00:31:57,970 --> 00:32:00,530 Speaker 2: headed to college. You got it done quickly. And then 535 00:32:00,590 --> 00:32:04,390 Speaker 2: this can be a companion book to that. So talk 536 00:32:04,410 --> 00:32:05,530 Speaker 2: about how those work together. 537 00:32:05,950 --> 00:32:10,800 Speaker 3: Yeah. So You're Gonna Be Okay is specifically written with 538 00:32:10,900 --> 00:32:14,020 Speaker 3: the person, the teen. I mean, I had a 17-year-old 539 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:18,010 Speaker 3: in mind, right? But I've had middle schoolers, senior adults, 540 00:32:18,170 --> 00:32:24,160 Speaker 3: college students, all get it. Military men get it and say, 541 00:32:24,300 --> 00:32:28,100 Speaker 3: this helped me so much. So it's for the person 542 00:32:28,380 --> 00:32:31,700 Speaker 3: who is in a struggle, who doesn't know how, I 543 00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:33,660 Speaker 3: don't know where to read scripture. I don't know what 544 00:32:33,700 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 3: to pray. And it puts the scriptures right there for you. 545 00:32:37,780 --> 00:32:41,450 Speaker 3: And it gives you prayers to pray. And it gives 546 00:32:41,510 --> 00:32:44,870 Speaker 3: you a breathing exercise. And it is a little devotional thought, 547 00:32:45,010 --> 00:32:49,670 Speaker 3: very short, because when we're struggling, anxious, depressed, whatever, you 548 00:32:49,730 --> 00:32:52,790 Speaker 3: can't focus on much for very long. And you certainly 549 00:32:52,830 --> 00:32:56,630 Speaker 3: don't want to read for very long. So that was intentional. 550 00:32:56,970 --> 00:33:00,290 Speaker 3: And also, like I said, for parents to use with 551 00:33:00,310 --> 00:33:04,790 Speaker 3: their struggling child. But even in exile is really from 552 00:33:04,830 --> 00:33:11,800 Speaker 3: the perspective of how I had to learn How do 553 00:33:12,100 --> 00:33:16,320 Speaker 3: I thrive and how do I find joy in my life? 554 00:33:16,420 --> 00:33:20,140 Speaker 3: Because I have a life. My child is struggling, but 555 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:24,130 Speaker 3: I have a life to live. That's not my identity. 556 00:33:24,190 --> 00:33:27,770 Speaker 3: It's not my whole identity. It is something that I'm 557 00:33:28,450 --> 00:33:31,590 Speaker 3: struggling through and it pains me to see my child 558 00:33:31,770 --> 00:33:36,190 Speaker 3: in so much pain and struggle and grief. But what 559 00:33:36,210 --> 00:33:38,560 Speaker 3: do I do? How do I connect with God and 560 00:33:38,620 --> 00:33:45,120 Speaker 3: how do I then understand that broader idea of God 561 00:33:45,170 --> 00:33:50,380 Speaker 3: is present with us in all of the circumstances and 562 00:33:50,460 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 3: life is not guaranteed to always be smooth and easy. 563 00:33:55,940 --> 00:34:00,320 Speaker 3: So how do I learn to pray when the seasons 564 00:34:00,500 --> 00:34:03,660 Speaker 3: are hard? And that's like the lament piece. How do 565 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:10,000 Speaker 3: I thrive and find joy when nothing has changed in 566 00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:13,360 Speaker 3: my circumstances, but the Lord is still here and I 567 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:15,640 Speaker 3: still have a calling over my life and I still 568 00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:19,180 Speaker 3: have things I can do. How do I understand the 569 00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:23,969 Speaker 3: difference between control and agency? I don't have control, but 570 00:34:24,930 --> 00:34:28,710 Speaker 3: I have a lot of agency, things I can do 571 00:34:28,790 --> 00:34:34,509 Speaker 3: to partner with God for healing, wholeness, and transformation. And 572 00:34:34,570 --> 00:34:39,020 Speaker 3: so that's what Even in Exile is. is aimed at. 573 00:34:39,140 --> 00:34:43,240 Speaker 3: So you're struggling, but you also want to learn how 574 00:34:43,820 --> 00:34:47,719 Speaker 3: life goes on and there can still be thriving and 575 00:34:47,780 --> 00:34:50,589 Speaker 3: joy and beautiful things that come up in the rubble 576 00:34:51,660 --> 00:34:53,270 Speaker 3: and the ashes of your exile. 577 00:34:54,410 --> 00:34:57,489 Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that thought because, I mean, you didn't 578 00:34:57,530 --> 00:35:01,270 Speaker 2: stop being a pastor. Your husband didn't stop being a counselor. 579 00:35:00,770 --> 00:35:04,160 Speaker 3: When you were going through it. We have a second kid. 580 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:07,180 Speaker 2: We have another child that needs your love and affection 581 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,700 Speaker 2: and care the same way, right? Life doesn't just stop 582 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:11,680 Speaker 2: when these things happen or when a loved one is 583 00:35:12,100 --> 00:35:14,400 Speaker 2: struggling or when we lose a loved one, whatever that 584 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:18,350 Speaker 2: might look like in our lives. And so I remember specifically, Susan, 585 00:35:18,370 --> 00:35:21,790 Speaker 2: when I was serving as a youth pastor and I 586 00:35:22,390 --> 00:35:25,819 Speaker 2: lost a baby. And so our youth group knew that 587 00:35:25,900 --> 00:35:29,739 Speaker 2: we were expecting a baby and then we lost that 588 00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:32,160 Speaker 2: baby and I had to be out to have surgery 589 00:35:32,260 --> 00:35:34,920 Speaker 2: and to recover and all of those pieces. And I 590 00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:37,259 Speaker 2: remember my lead pastor at the time calling me and saying, 591 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:40,170 Speaker 2: you know, what do you want me to tell the students? 592 00:35:41,150 --> 00:35:46,390 Speaker 2: And I responded, the truth. You know, I want you 593 00:35:46,430 --> 00:35:51,379 Speaker 2: to tell them the truth. Because I knew I wasn't 594 00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:53,660 Speaker 2: going to be okay for a while. Like I was 595 00:35:53,700 --> 00:35:57,029 Speaker 2: going to be different. than I was before. And they 596 00:35:57,050 --> 00:36:00,569 Speaker 2: were going to be, be, um, notice that because kids 597 00:36:00,610 --> 00:36:03,870 Speaker 2: are very, uh, observing and they notice things about the 598 00:36:03,930 --> 00:36:06,989 Speaker 2: adults in their lives that care for them. And, um, 599 00:36:07,150 --> 00:36:08,629 Speaker 2: you know, I remember saying, you know, I'm just not, 600 00:36:08,830 --> 00:36:10,609 Speaker 2: I'm not gonna, I'm not going to be okay for 601 00:36:10,650 --> 00:36:12,870 Speaker 2: a while. And like, that's gonna, that has to, they 602 00:36:12,890 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 2: have to know, um, what I'm walking through now. That 603 00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:19,020 Speaker 2: doesn't mean on when I'm, you know, teaching them on 604 00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:22,810 Speaker 2: Wednesday nights, I'm not up there talking about, um, you know, 605 00:36:22,870 --> 00:36:25,469 Speaker 2: exactly what I'm experiencing in that moment, right? There's a 606 00:36:25,510 --> 00:36:27,460 Speaker 2: reason you wrote this book and this book is coming 607 00:36:27,540 --> 00:36:31,680 Speaker 2: out years after. Your son and your family went through 608 00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:34,759 Speaker 2: this struggle together, but we still have to show up 609 00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:38,580 Speaker 2: in the spots that God has placed us in, in 610 00:36:38,620 --> 00:36:42,770 Speaker 2: our lives. And there's something about that authenticity of showing 611 00:36:43,110 --> 00:36:47,630 Speaker 2: up even in the hard stuff and continuing to be faithful, 612 00:36:48,030 --> 00:36:50,710 Speaker 2: not fake, we're not called to be fake, but to 613 00:36:50,750 --> 00:36:53,879 Speaker 2: be faithful. And that can look different. And there's something 614 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:55,620 Speaker 2: about our kid that's watching us. 615 00:36:56,420 --> 00:37:00,070 Speaker 3: Yes. Do that. And the last thing we want to 616 00:37:00,090 --> 00:37:03,770 Speaker 3: do is, and you know, gosh, we can't like get 617 00:37:03,810 --> 00:37:07,610 Speaker 3: ahead of everything, but I want to be careful not 618 00:37:07,750 --> 00:37:12,029 Speaker 3: to teach my child that faith in God means you 619 00:37:12,070 --> 00:37:12,950 Speaker 3: never struggle. 620 00:37:13,469 --> 00:37:13,709 Speaker 2: Right. 621 00:37:14,070 --> 00:37:17,989 Speaker 3: You know, faith in God means in all of life, 622 00:37:18,180 --> 00:37:22,859 Speaker 3: the joys and the struggle, right? I follow Jesus. I 623 00:37:22,980 --> 00:37:26,399 Speaker 3: trust God. I listen to Him. You know, I don't 624 00:37:26,460 --> 00:37:31,830 Speaker 3: want to never show my pain, struggle. Our kids need 625 00:37:31,850 --> 00:37:37,339 Speaker 3: to learn that the faithful men and women, the adults 626 00:37:37,390 --> 00:37:41,299 Speaker 3: in their lives who say they follow Jesus, they need 627 00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,540 Speaker 3: to see a struggle and they need to see how 628 00:37:43,580 --> 00:37:47,029 Speaker 3: we handle it. the good, the bad, the ugly, you know, 629 00:37:47,070 --> 00:37:50,310 Speaker 3: like I said, apologize when you're like, God didn't handle 630 00:37:50,350 --> 00:37:54,629 Speaker 3: that well at all, you know, but we don't want 631 00:37:54,670 --> 00:37:57,130 Speaker 3: to set them up to think, well, if I'm struggling, 632 00:37:57,170 --> 00:37:58,730 Speaker 3: I've done something wrong. 633 00:37:58,850 --> 00:37:59,150 Speaker 1: Right. 634 00:37:59,390 --> 00:38:00,470 Speaker 3: I've done something wrong. 635 00:38:00,969 --> 00:38:02,240 Speaker 1: Right. Thing wrong. 636 00:38:02,989 --> 00:38:03,950 Speaker 3: Struggles happen. 637 00:38:03,969 --> 00:38:07,399 Speaker 1: Yeah. That's so good. 638 00:38:07,860 --> 00:38:11,550 Speaker 2: So for the, for the mom season, that is just, um, 639 00:38:12,870 --> 00:38:16,490 Speaker 2: feeling like the exile is going to go on forever. 640 00:38:18,310 --> 00:38:22,089 Speaker 2: Talk to us about how did you return back to 641 00:38:22,130 --> 00:38:23,350 Speaker 2: that place of home? 642 00:38:24,070 --> 00:38:25,090 Speaker 1: What did that look like? 643 00:38:25,550 --> 00:38:27,910 Speaker 2: You know, when you experience something like you guys experienced, 644 00:38:27,950 --> 00:38:30,450 Speaker 2: I don't know that you ever get over it, right? 645 00:38:30,489 --> 00:38:33,590 Speaker 1: But you get through it. You go through it. It's different. 646 00:38:33,630 --> 00:38:38,110 Speaker 1: And so what does that look like for people? 647 00:38:38,130 --> 00:38:43,879 Speaker 3: Yeah. So Here's an important concept. When I talk about 648 00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:49,480 Speaker 3: resurrection in the book, often what we want is for 649 00:38:49,540 --> 00:38:53,850 Speaker 3: things to go back the way they were before everything 650 00:38:53,890 --> 00:38:58,190 Speaker 3: turned upside down, before our little worlds blew up. We 651 00:38:58,230 --> 00:39:01,930 Speaker 3: want to take that back. And resurrection isn't about going 652 00:39:02,110 --> 00:39:05,790 Speaker 3: back to the way things were. It's about going forward 653 00:39:06,150 --> 00:39:11,939 Speaker 3: into the new thing. And so— Our situation is not 654 00:39:11,980 --> 00:39:14,219 Speaker 3: tied up in a neat little bow, and we have 655 00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:18,460 Speaker 3: not gone back to the way things were before. But 656 00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:23,330 Speaker 3: we are in a new space where we have learned 657 00:39:23,770 --> 00:39:27,130 Speaker 3: to love one another in a way we could not 658 00:39:27,230 --> 00:39:29,950 Speaker 3: have learned had we not done it through. 659 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:30,950 Speaker 1: The struggle. 660 00:39:32,060 --> 00:39:38,100 Speaker 3: The Lord has literally remade us as a family, and 661 00:39:38,460 --> 00:39:43,670 Speaker 3: we are in a new space, and we have been formed, 662 00:39:43,830 --> 00:39:47,090 Speaker 3: and we have been strengthened, and we have been shaped. 663 00:39:47,370 --> 00:39:50,410 Speaker 3: And we are not perfect. And we still bump into 664 00:39:50,450 --> 00:39:55,430 Speaker 3: each other and have, you know, some tough times. And 665 00:39:55,450 --> 00:39:58,040 Speaker 3: there's still things that we are navigating. And I think, 666 00:39:58,420 --> 00:40:00,899 Speaker 3: you know, when you have a child who has mental 667 00:40:00,940 --> 00:40:04,280 Speaker 3: health struggles or anyone in your family or even friends 668 00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,899 Speaker 3: who struggle with their mental health, that doesn't necessarily just 669 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:12,690 Speaker 3: go away and get fixed. You're going to navigate that. 670 00:40:12,730 --> 00:40:17,270 Speaker 3: You're going to live with that. And so that's where 671 00:40:17,330 --> 00:40:22,060 Speaker 3: we are. We are stronger and we are in a 672 00:40:22,260 --> 00:40:27,100 Speaker 3: new space. And the Lord has brought so many beautiful 673 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:32,739 Speaker 3: things out of our journey. And the journey that we 674 00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:39,189 Speaker 3: continue to be on. And so I forget your question exactly. 675 00:40:39,489 --> 00:40:42,610 Speaker 3: But what did I do to get through that? 676 00:40:43,050 --> 00:40:47,350 Speaker 1: Yeah. What's kind of the light at the end of 677 00:40:47,390 --> 00:40:50,350 Speaker 1: the tunnel? Or when did you maybe pick up on like, okay, 678 00:40:50,830 --> 00:40:57,440 Speaker 1: I'm going to be okay. Yeah. I'm headed towards something different, 679 00:40:57,460 --> 00:40:57,860 Speaker 1: you know. 680 00:40:58,770 --> 00:41:02,320 Speaker 3: It was so gradual, Nicolette. It really was so gradual. 681 00:41:03,070 --> 00:41:04,460 Speaker 3: And we don't like that, do we? 682 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:06,260 Speaker 2: We just want it to be just like we prayed 683 00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:09,100 Speaker 2: and then it's like this magical healing and it happens 684 00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:10,440 Speaker 2: all the, you know, and. 685 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:13,060 Speaker 1: God certainly can do that, but He often doesn't. 686 00:41:13,500 --> 00:41:17,240 Speaker 3: Yes. And so I share a piece in here titled 687 00:41:17,300 --> 00:41:20,940 Speaker 3: Trust the Slow Work of God. And we don't want 688 00:41:20,980 --> 00:41:26,489 Speaker 3: things slow. The slow work is the one that really 689 00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:30,720 Speaker 3: gets in us. And so Trust what God is doing. 690 00:41:30,860 --> 00:41:35,939 Speaker 3: Even when you can't see Him, sense Him, see anything changing, 691 00:41:36,460 --> 00:41:40,700 Speaker 3: trust the slow work of God and trust that wherever 692 00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:44,879 Speaker 3: you are, God is there. God is with you. So 693 00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:47,509 Speaker 3: there's a lot of agency we have, like I said, 694 00:41:47,590 --> 00:41:52,830 Speaker 3: in chapter 11 of the book, names, very critical things 695 00:41:52,910 --> 00:41:56,930 Speaker 3: for us to do, to build into our daily rhythms. 696 00:41:57,350 --> 00:42:01,490 Speaker 3: and our lives so that we are actively engaging with God, 697 00:42:01,590 --> 00:42:05,110 Speaker 3: partnering with God, but also paying attention to our bodies, 698 00:42:05,290 --> 00:42:08,650 Speaker 3: our mindsets, all of that. And at the end of 699 00:42:08,730 --> 00:42:13,350 Speaker 3: each chapter, I have three spiritual formation practices that you 700 00:42:13,370 --> 00:42:20,170 Speaker 3: can choose from that will help you engage in practical 701 00:42:20,890 --> 00:42:23,430 Speaker 3: things that you can set as rhythms in your life 702 00:42:23,550 --> 00:42:26,529 Speaker 3: to connect you with God and to remind you that 703 00:42:27,450 --> 00:42:32,350 Speaker 3: that there is a way to thrive even here. And 704 00:42:32,430 --> 00:42:38,930 Speaker 3: so there's no magic formula. There's no instantaneous fix. It's 705 00:42:39,190 --> 00:42:43,070 Speaker 3: not quick fix. It is how do I become a 706 00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:50,819 Speaker 3: person who grows and thrives even when everything is difficult 707 00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:52,640 Speaker 3: and not perfect around me. 708 00:42:52,660 --> 00:42:53,359 Speaker 1: Yeah. 709 00:42:54,540 --> 00:42:58,880 Speaker 2: It's so good, that slow work of Christ in our lives. 710 00:42:59,260 --> 00:43:00,700 Speaker 1: And we can really only see that a lot of 711 00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:02,180 Speaker 1: times on the other side of it, right? 712 00:43:02,219 --> 00:43:05,120 Speaker 2: We can look back and go, wow, that's the way 713 00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,710 Speaker 2: that God was working there. I didn't see it at 714 00:43:08,730 --> 00:43:11,610 Speaker 2: the time, but He was there and He was working. 715 00:43:11,670 --> 00:43:14,890 Speaker 2: And as I continued to just show up in His 716 00:43:14,950 --> 00:43:17,730 Speaker 2: Word and in prayer, He was doing that slow work 717 00:43:17,930 --> 00:43:22,790 Speaker 2: in my heart. And, you know, that's just the... That's 718 00:43:22,830 --> 00:43:25,109 Speaker 2: the promise that we have of even when we don't 719 00:43:25,190 --> 00:43:28,810 Speaker 2: feel it, that we cling to the faithfulness of God 720 00:43:29,410 --> 00:43:32,490 Speaker 2: in our lives and in our children's lives, and that 721 00:43:32,530 --> 00:43:34,990 Speaker 2: we can be confident in His love for us and 722 00:43:35,070 --> 00:43:37,620 Speaker 2: for them, and that He's going to help us in 723 00:43:37,660 --> 00:43:40,140 Speaker 2: what we're walking through. And I love that you mentioned 724 00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:42,700 Speaker 2: the practical resources in your book. That's one thing I've 725 00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:46,440 Speaker 2: always loved about Susan's writing and her podcast and all 726 00:43:46,460 --> 00:43:49,880 Speaker 2: of the ways that she connects with people because it 727 00:43:49,980 --> 00:43:53,650 Speaker 2: is always practical, and I just appreciate that. as somebody 728 00:43:53,690 --> 00:43:55,730 Speaker 2: who often reads things and goes, okay, that sounds great, 729 00:43:55,750 --> 00:43:57,410 Speaker 2: but what do you want me to do with that? 730 00:43:58,050 --> 00:44:00,029 Speaker 2: I feel like you always answer that question for me. 731 00:44:00,090 --> 00:44:03,210 Speaker 2: And so I love that about your work. So do 732 00:44:03,270 --> 00:44:05,950 Speaker 2: tell us where we can find the book. And then Susan, 733 00:44:05,989 --> 00:44:08,690 Speaker 2: if you would, please pray for our listeners as we 734 00:44:08,830 --> 00:44:10,609 Speaker 2: close out our conversation. 735 00:44:11,340 --> 00:44:16,220 Speaker 3: You can find it anywhere you buy books. Amazon, Barnes & Noble, 736 00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:20,660 Speaker 3: Books A Million, probably Walmart, Target, you know, any online bookseller, 737 00:44:20,900 --> 00:44:25,070 Speaker 3: it'll be there. Even in Exile, Reverend Susan Eaton. I 738 00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:27,770 Speaker 3: know there's some other authors named Susan Eaton. So if 739 00:44:27,790 --> 00:44:30,950 Speaker 3: you put the R-E-V in front of it, it'll pull 740 00:44:30,989 --> 00:44:38,670 Speaker 3: me up. But yeah, it's everywhere. And my website is RevSusanEaton.com. 741 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,759 Speaker 3: So if you go there, you find the books, you'll 742 00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:47,440 Speaker 3: find the podcast, the Embodied Holiness podcast. You can access 743 00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:49,440 Speaker 3: it through my website as well. Awesome. 744 00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:52,239 Speaker 2: I've been a guest on it a couple of times. 745 00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:56,020 Speaker 2: So always thankful for Susan's work with that. And you 746 00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:58,140 Speaker 2: guys definitely want to check that out and grab a 747 00:44:58,180 --> 00:44:59,570 Speaker 2: copy of Even in Exile. 748 00:44:59,989 --> 00:45:02,290 Speaker 1: And you're going to be okay as they go so 749 00:45:02,310 --> 00:45:03,090 Speaker 1: well together. 750 00:45:03,790 --> 00:45:05,750 Speaker 2: And I think this would be a great gift to 751 00:45:05,810 --> 00:45:08,529 Speaker 2: give to somebody too, Susan, that maybe is walking through 752 00:45:08,550 --> 00:45:11,109 Speaker 2: a season of heartache and you don't know how to 753 00:45:11,390 --> 00:45:12,870 Speaker 2: help them or what you can do. 754 00:45:12,850 --> 00:45:15,799 Speaker 1: As a friend or as a family member. You know, 755 00:45:15,820 --> 00:45:18,200 Speaker 1: giving somebody a resource a lot of the times is great. 756 00:45:19,170 --> 00:45:21,450 Speaker 1: putting something in their hands that's tangible and that you 757 00:45:21,469 --> 00:45:24,170 Speaker 1: can trust is a great option for us. 758 00:45:24,630 --> 00:45:27,050 Speaker 3: And read it with a friend or a small group 759 00:45:27,110 --> 00:45:31,540 Speaker 3: because there's questions you can use for that. And it's 760 00:45:32,219 --> 00:45:34,520 Speaker 3: a good personal study. It's also a good group study. 761 00:45:36,140 --> 00:45:38,100 Speaker 1: Thank you, Susan, for being here today. And would you 762 00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:39,680 Speaker 1: pray for us as we close out our time? 763 00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:45,180 Speaker 3: Absolutely. Lord Jesus, I thank you this morning for every 764 00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:49,390 Speaker 3: mother who is listening today. to this conversation and you 765 00:45:49,430 --> 00:45:54,779 Speaker 3: know their fears and you know their dreams for their children. 766 00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:58,980 Speaker 3: You know their desires and the longings that they carry. Father, 767 00:45:59,020 --> 00:46:03,180 Speaker 3: I pray that right now your Holy Spirit would speak 768 00:46:03,260 --> 00:46:07,180 Speaker 3: to them and draw near and comfort and give them 769 00:46:07,219 --> 00:46:12,790 Speaker 3: a sense of your great love and your nearness, God. 770 00:46:13,730 --> 00:46:18,360 Speaker 3: And the fact that you know best, you know our children, 771 00:46:18,380 --> 00:46:23,640 Speaker 3: you know them, you've known them from the moment they 772 00:46:23,660 --> 00:46:26,739 Speaker 3: were a little cell, Lord, to the beautiful people they 773 00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:30,590 Speaker 3: are today. We trust you with our children, God, and 774 00:46:31,260 --> 00:46:34,250 Speaker 3: we thank you for their lives. And we pray that 775 00:46:34,330 --> 00:46:37,570 Speaker 3: as you continue to mold and shape us, your children, 776 00:46:38,110 --> 00:46:41,290 Speaker 3: that you would teach us how to love with your love, 777 00:46:41,870 --> 00:46:42,880 Speaker 3: to be present in. 778 00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:46,640 Speaker 4: And the power, and the joy of your spirit, and 779 00:46:46,660 --> 00:46:51,890 Speaker 4: to trust you even with our agony, Jesus. We love you, God, 780 00:46:52,250 --> 00:46:54,850 Speaker 4: and we thank you for this opportunity to speak your 781 00:46:54,910 --> 00:46:55,830 Speaker 4: truth into the world. 782 00:46:56,370 --> 00:46:58,810 Speaker 1: In Jesus' name, amen. 783 00:46:58,969 --> 00:46:59,510 Speaker 2: Amen. Amen. 784 00:46:59,570 --> 00:47:00,390 Speaker 1: Thank you, Susan. 785 00:47:01,550 --> 00:47:03,549 Speaker 2: My guess is that if you're here listening to the 786 00:47:03,650 --> 00:47:07,370 Speaker 2: Everyday Prayers podcast, you kind of care about praying. 787 00:47:07,550 --> 00:47:08,770 Speaker 1: For your children. 788 00:47:09,570 --> 00:47:13,000 Speaker 2: My newest book, Everyday Prayers for Moms, Praying God's word 789 00:47:13,020 --> 00:47:16,680 Speaker 2: from your children from newborn to emptiness is a great 790 00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:20,660 Speaker 2: resource for moms who desire to pray for their kids. 791 00:47:21,060 --> 00:47:22,480 Speaker 2: I don't know if you've ever looked up at the 792 00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:24,800 Speaker 2: end of the day and realized that you didn't pray 793 00:47:24,820 --> 00:47:28,969 Speaker 2: at all. So often we have this desire to pray. 794 00:47:29,410 --> 00:47:31,350 Speaker 1: But we may not know how. 795 00:47:31,410 --> 00:47:35,730 Speaker 2: To put that desire into practice. I'm learning in motherhood 796 00:47:35,790 --> 00:47:38,290 Speaker 2: that my prayers adapt and change based on. 797 00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:40,300 Speaker 1: The season that we're in as a family. 798 00:47:40,739 --> 00:47:45,080 Speaker 2: I'm also learning to give myself grace in those different seasons. 799 00:47:45,340 --> 00:47:48,859 Speaker 2: I know God isn't after perfect, polished prayers. He's after 800 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:53,490 Speaker 2: my heart. And He's after yours, too. So my plan 801 00:47:53,630 --> 00:47:57,130 Speaker 2: is to be intentional, whatever that looks like, in this season. 802 00:47:57,150 --> 00:47:59,089 Speaker 1: I hope that is your plan. 803 00:47:59,560 --> 00:47:59,899 Speaker 3: As well. 804 00:48:00,820 --> 00:48:04,399 Speaker 1: God sees our hearts. He's honored by our desire to. 805 00:48:04,340 --> 00:48:08,160 Speaker 2: Connect with Him. If you're feeling stuck in your prayer life, 806 00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:13,900 Speaker 2: I've got a new free download, a five-day prayer reset. 807 00:48:14,300 --> 00:48:18,860 Speaker 2: It's a great guide to help you get started, jump 808 00:48:18,910 --> 00:48:21,610 Speaker 2: back in, stay consistent, grow. 809 00:48:21,370 --> 00:48:23,190 Speaker 1: Deeper in your prayers for your kids. 810 00:48:23,590 --> 00:48:26,470 Speaker 2: It's also a great tool to share with with your 811 00:48:26,570 --> 00:48:30,000 Speaker 2: friends or with your family members that may be seeking 812 00:48:30,500 --> 00:48:33,240 Speaker 2: to know God deeper in prayer. 813 00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:35,839 Speaker 1: As they're wanting to pray for their kids. I hope 814 00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:36,340 Speaker 1: you will. 815 00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:40,690 Speaker 2: Grab your copy today at millionprayingmoms.com. We'll also put a 816 00:48:40,750 --> 00:48:41,890 Speaker 2: link in our show notes. 817 00:48:43,290 --> 00:48:46,609 Speaker 1: Until next time, friends, may the Lord bless. 818 00:48:46,310 --> 00:48:49,710 Speaker 2: You and keep you. Make His face shine upon you 819 00:48:50,090 --> 00:48:53,160 Speaker 2: and be gracious to you. May the Lord look with 820 00:48:53,300 --> 00:48:56,239 Speaker 2: favor upon you and give you his peace.