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Speaker 1: I'm Josh Hammer and this is the Josh Hammersham. I

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Speaker 1: hope that you are all enjoying the nc DOUBA Tournament.

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Speaker 1: I certainly know that I am. A full weekend of March.

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Speaker 1: Man is certainly on the TV docket here in the

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Speaker 1: Hammer household. But as always, there is no shorter news

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Speaker 1: happening in the world. Sarah Hugby Sanders kicked out of

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Speaker 1: a restaurant kind of sort of by the insatiable woke

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Speaker 1: mob for not the first time, but this time it

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Speaker 1: happens in her own home states, in Little Rock, Arkansas.

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Speaker 1: The woke mob will never be satiated. Speaking of people

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Speaker 1: who will never be say siated, Jim comey, is that,

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Speaker 1: you know, facing a subpoena in a southern dish of Florida?

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Speaker 1: Doj probe? We've got the details on that later as well. Also,

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Speaker 1: Chuck Norris, the legend Chuck Norris has now sadly passed away.

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Speaker 1: He has met his maker and frankly death I think

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Speaker 1: has a lot to be scared of in the form

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Speaker 1: of Chuck Norris. We'll get to all of that and

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Speaker 1: more later on says show, but from now we begin

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Speaker 1: with this The price of oil and the Strait of Horne,

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Speaker 1: which is this narrow, twenty one mile wide, crucial chowpoint

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Speaker 1: through which roughly one fifth of the world's petroleum flows,

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Speaker 1: has been a topic of much conversation over the past

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Speaker 1: two weeks. The latest when it comes to the US

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Speaker 1: approach to the highly destabilized oil markets, came on Thursday,

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Speaker 1: when Secretary of the Treasury Scott Best's announced that he

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Speaker 1: was actually going to wave sanctions. The US will wave

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Speaker 1: sanctions on Iranian oil. You might say, how does this

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Speaker 1: possibly make sense. We'll think of it this way, as

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Speaker 1: the price of oil has skyrocketed since the war started

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Speaker 1: about three weeks ago. Now, the Irani regime was actually

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Speaker 1: profited from that because they are a petroleum exporting country,

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Speaker 1: that's the number one industry. China is a mass purchaser

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Speaker 1: of sanctioned Iranian crude. So if you're trying to hurt

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Speaker 1: the regime, you actually want to lower the price of oil,

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Speaker 1: which in this case has the effect of also benefiting

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Speaker 1: the United States consumers domestically. Here by trying to get

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Speaker 1: those prices down, that means waving sanctions on Iran.

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Speaker 2: So it's a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Of delectable four d Chess from Scott Bessen as far

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Speaker 1: as the war it self is concerned, actually, just another

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Speaker 1: high ranking figure from the besiege, from the Iranian paramilitary.

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Speaker 1: This s es Gestapo, s secret police, the intelligence minister

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Speaker 1: sitting on top of the besieged hierarchy was actually just

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Speaker 1: taken out on Friday morning. I believe it was from

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Speaker 1: Israel or was it not clear whether the Israel or

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Speaker 1: the United State. It's likely Israel, if I had to

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Speaker 1: guess there. So the war continues to be going quite well.

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump having a little bit of fun with his

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Speaker 1: Friday morning Iran briefing here as far as he stayed

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Speaker 1: a play in the war. Here is Donald Trump giving

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Speaker 1: an update as to how things are going in Operation

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Speaker 1: Epic Fury.

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Speaker 3: I want to begin, but I just say we're doing

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Speaker 3: extremely well in Iran. The difference between them and US

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Speaker 3: is they had a navy two weeks ago. They have

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Speaker 3: no navy anymore, so, all at the bottom of the sea.

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Speaker 3: Fifty eight chips knocked down in two days, and we

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Speaker 3: have the greatest navy anywhere in the world. It's not

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Speaker 3: even close. So, but we are doing really well. We're

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Speaker 3: not going to let them have nuclear weapons because if

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Speaker 3: they had them, they'd use them, and we're not going

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Speaker 3: to let that happen. It should have been done a

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Speaker 3: long time ago by other presidents. So it's an honor

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Speaker 3: to be here. This is fun.

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Speaker 1: So the straight Upoormus is at the center of this

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Speaker 1: whole oil price conversation. It's at the center really of

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Speaker 1: the war more generally, because Iran's choke hold over this

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Speaker 1: crucial waterway has always been their sort of damocles that

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Speaker 1: they hang and dangle over the world and have done

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Speaker 1: for many decades. There So, in recent days, the United

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Speaker 1: States has been putting a lot of pressure on various countries,

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Speaker 1: including some NATO countries including Japan, to come to help

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Speaker 1: the United's and try to secure the straight of horm Muse,

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Speaker 1: which is the number one way to try to get

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Speaker 1: oil prices in any more stable fashion. For a long time,

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Speaker 1: these NATO countries, places like the UK and France totally

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Speaker 1: equivocated completely and totally equivocated on this, and finally, finally,

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Speaker 1: as of Thursday, some of them have seemingly given into

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump. So as of Thursday, the UK, France, Germany, Italy,

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Speaker 1: Netherlands and Japan did all issue statements expressing quote A

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Speaker 1: readiness to contribute to appropriate efforts to ensure safe passage

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Speaker 1: of commercial and oil tankers and so forth through the

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Speaker 1: straight over moves has actually happened around same time, the

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Speaker 1: Prime Minister of Japan, Snai Takaichi, was actually meeting with

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump at the White House. So the pressure campaign

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Speaker 1: from Donald Trump seems to have worked, but it took

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Speaker 1: a lot. It really took a lot, and NATO has

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Speaker 1: not exactly come to the defense of the United States

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Speaker 1: and Israel foot it's worth in this conflict half day

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Speaker 1: in fact, NATO has been something of a total non starter,

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Speaker 1: and as things are heating up now in the straight

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Speaker 1: of form moves. In fact, the lead story on Friday

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Speaker 1: at the Wall Street Journal is how US warplanes and

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Speaker 1: helicopters are now starting this big battle to reopen this

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Speaker 1: straight This is going to be a big story to

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Speaker 1: watch this weekend. Is what is going to be the

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Speaker 1: state of play when it comes to this crucial waterway

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Speaker 1: on Monday? Will oil tankers be filling there and more

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Speaker 1: to the points, who will be helping there? Will it

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Speaker 1: just be the United States will just be US sense

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Speaker 1: com or by that time a few days from now

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Speaker 1: where you have any British ships, any French ships, any

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Speaker 1: German ships, Italian ships, Japanese ships. Heck maybe even South

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Speaker 1: Korea ships. It'll take them some times to employ there.

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Speaker 1: It takes physical time to actually sail to the Middle

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Speaker 1: East from places like Japan and South Korea, etcetera. There,

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Speaker 1: But what will be the say to play? Donald Trump

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Speaker 1: was worth none too happy when it comes to NATO.

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Speaker 1: He is not satisfied with the fact that the UK, France,

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Speaker 1: Italy and Germany out of the NATO countries. He's not

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Speaker 1: satisfied the fact that they have agreed in theory. At

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Speaker 1: least we'll see how it plays it in practice to

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Speaker 1: help the United States secure the Straight overmus which in

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Speaker 1: theory would necessity and entail actually physically escorting various oil

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Speaker 1: and natural gas tankers through the strait if need be.

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Speaker 1: Dal Trump taking two truth social on Friday with a

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Speaker 1: pretty scathing, blithering post. He writes, quote, without the USA,

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Speaker 1: NATO is a paper tiger. They didn't want to join

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Speaker 1: the fight to stop a nuclear power to on. Now

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Speaker 1: that the fight is militarily one with very little danger,

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Speaker 1: they complain about the high oil prices they are forced

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Speaker 1: to pay, but don't want to help open the Strait

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Speaker 1: of Hormuz, a simple military maneuver that is the single

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Speaker 1: reason for the high oil prices. So again, apparently they

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Speaker 1: are reluctantly agreeing at least some of them, a small handful.

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Speaker 1: Some of the bigger ones UK, France, Italy and Germany

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Speaker 1: are now saying that they will help the US securely straight.

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Speaker 1: The other countries essentially are completely Mia Canada will be

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Speaker 1: a good example where the heck is is Prime Minister

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Speaker 1: Carneese Canada. Well, they are totally missing an action here.

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Speaker 1: So Donald Trump is essentially done with NATO at this point,

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Speaker 1: and he has good reason to be done in NATO,

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Speaker 1: and that is our working thesis for now. NATO is

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Speaker 1: an ormization that was founded in nineteen forty nine. It

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Speaker 1: was founded for one explicit purpose. The purpose of NATO

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Speaker 1: was to defeat the Soviet Union, at least to contain it.

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Speaker 1: That you kind of want to go full realist Henry

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Speaker 1: Kissinger Nixon, or if you want to go full Reagan,

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Speaker 1: to defeat it. Obviously the latter is what historically happened there.

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Speaker 1: But the point of NATO for our present purposes was

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Speaker 1: to confront in some capacity and to roll back and

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Speaker 1: detain in some capacity the Soviet Here is the key point.

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Speaker 1: The Berlin Wall fell literally in the year I was born.

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Speaker 1: I am a grown dude, I am married, I am

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Speaker 1: a father. The Berlin Wall fell the year that I

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Speaker 1: was born. The Soviet Union formally dissolved into the Russian

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Speaker 1: Federation when I was two years old in nineteen ninety one.

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Speaker 1: With all due respects to the generations that preceded us,

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Speaker 1: and so forth. There the geopolitics today fundamentally are different.

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Speaker 1: What exactly is the stated purpose of NATO in the

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Speaker 1: year twenty twenty six. I do this for a living,

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Speaker 1: and I literally don't know that I could tell you

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Speaker 1: it's essentially just a transnational neoliberal boondoggle. Is NATO at

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Speaker 1: this point distinct in any meaningful way from the Nine Nations,

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Speaker 1: from the wto the World Trade Orgization, from the WHO,

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Speaker 1: the World Health Organization? How is NATO different?

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Speaker 2: I honestly have no idea. I really don't, you know.

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Speaker 2: Funny enough, this is morning.

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Speaker 1: I was reading up on some of the history of NATO,

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Speaker 1: and I know that they had a flag and the

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Speaker 1: organization is so in the background that I don't even

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Speaker 1: think I recognized the flag, so I couldn't tell you

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Speaker 1: what the mission is here. And look, this is a

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Speaker 1: very common thing when it comes to social andical activism.

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Speaker 1: If you have an organization and the raison to etstrau,

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Speaker 1: the reason for this organization's existence actually met, so you

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Speaker 1: had a successful operation there. Then there's all sorts of

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Speaker 1: vested interests. There are people with salaries, there are people

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Speaker 1: with reliance interests. There they want to keep it going.

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Speaker 1: So then you have some sort of mission creep to

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Speaker 1: a new fat or a new goal. I think sometimes

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Speaker 1: here as a bit of an analogy between NATO and

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Speaker 1: the Human Rights Campaign. You're gonna say, what's the similarity here?

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you so. The Human Rights Campaign HRC, which

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Speaker 1: was that yellow and blue equal sign, was a pro

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Speaker 1: same sex marriage organized human rights campaign successfully among other organizations,

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Speaker 1: god same sex marriage constitutionalized in the obergefellacision of twenty fifteen,

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Speaker 1: a horrific decision. But the legal merits of that are

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Speaker 1: neither here nor there for present purposes. The point is

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Speaker 1: that they achieved their raids on the extra they were

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Speaker 1: successful in redefining marriage forcefully by judicial fiat for the

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Speaker 1: entire country. Immediately then they shifted to not being a

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Speaker 1: same sex marriage advocacy organization, but to being a transgender organization.

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Speaker 2: You get it.

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Speaker 1: So the mission must go on in some capacity because

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Speaker 1: of salaries and health benefits and invested interest there. So

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Speaker 1: it's very similar for NATO. But if NATO is not

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Speaker 1: going to help the United States, and the United States

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Speaker 1: is the overwhelming, the overwhelming funder of NATO. Donald Trump, too,

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Speaker 1: his great credit, has always been clear out on this issue.

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Speaker 1: In his first term, he actually made tremendous progress in

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Speaker 1: getting more NATO countries to at least meet two percent

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Speaker 1: of GDP on defense bending. They really should have been

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Speaker 1: a lot higher than that there, but he got more

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Speaker 1: countries to meet that particular threshold. Actually, just a few

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Speaker 1: months ago, Don Trump had another huge victory in this

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Speaker 1: space when he visited the Hague in the Netherlands there

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Speaker 1: for the NATO summit, and at the time they actually

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Speaker 1: did announce it a few months ago in the Hague

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Speaker 1: that there is a new commitment to investing five percent

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Speaker 1: of GDP on defense bending. Currently, there are zero, literally

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Speaker 1: zero countries that invest five percent of GDP on defense spending.

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Speaker 1: Poland is the closest to their great credit at four

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Speaker 1: point four eight percent, Lithuania, Lafia Estonia. All these Eastern

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Speaker 1: European countries that are just scared out of their wits

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Speaker 1: by Russia are the ones that are spending a law

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Speaker 1: of defense there. But notably a lot of these countries

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Speaker 1: in the Baltic States, Lithuania, Lafia Estonia. These countries were

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Speaker 1: added to NATO after the collapse of Soviet Union by

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Speaker 1: definition because these were part of the Warsaw Path. These

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Speaker 1: were Soviet satellite states during communism. So why exactly after

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Speaker 1: NATO finished and was victorious and it's raison to Etra,

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Speaker 1: why were we adding more countries, littlelone countries that alone

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Speaker 1: country is right on the.

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Speaker 2: Border of Russia.

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Speaker 1: Look, it really does not require thinking along the evil

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Speaker 1: lines of Lamir Putin or his so called brain Alenxander Dugim.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't require thinking along those lines to suggest that maybe,

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Speaker 1: just maybe this ever eastward encroachment of NATO had something

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Speaker 1: to do with our present contratempts with Russia. Russia is

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Speaker 1: by far the blame worthy party here. We are not

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Speaker 1: apologist for Putin, who is a horrible, horrible human being,

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Speaker 1: but surely NATO's insatial desire to go ever eastward, essentially

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Speaker 1: right up until Belarus and Ukraine has something to do

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Speaker 1: with it. So Donald Trump is fundamentally correct about NATO.

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Speaker 1: I do not see what purpose NATO serves in its

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Speaker 1: current form. I really really really don't. And unless until

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Speaker 1: this organization is seriously reformed, and unless there is a

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Speaker 1: viable mission that meets today's challenges, whether it's a Chinese

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Speaker 1: Commuist party, whether it's transnational Islamism or some other threat

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Speaker 1: like that, there, I don't see how or why it

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Speaker 1: should continue. Donald Trump, f on the mentally is right

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Speaker 1: on this. Trump's NATO Tornado, frankly is pretty pretty sound

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Speaker 1: on the merits. Folks will be right back up the

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Speaker 1: a short commercial break, welcome back, So just a put

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Speaker 1: a button on our previous conversation. I am not saying

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Speaker 1: abolish NATO. Say what I would prefer to happen, or

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Speaker 1: see happen, is for NATO to actually adapt to the times.

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Speaker 2: Again.

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Speaker 1: I literally could not tell you what the organization purports

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Speaker 1: to stand for. And they are proving their fecklessness, their

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Speaker 1: worthlessness in real time, in real time by the fact

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Speaker 1: that they are not assisting the overwhelming funder and the

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Speaker 1: overwhelming dominant country of the organization in United States. As

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Speaker 1: we go to war with a country Roun that threatens

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Speaker 1: all of NATO, is a great test Operation empic theory

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Speaker 1: is a great test as to whether NATO means anything whatsoever. Now,

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Speaker 1: you know, what's about a time NATO kind of did

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Speaker 1: mean something. The Korean War back in the fifties was

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Speaker 1: largely a NATO war. Even during the Persian Gulf, for

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Speaker 1: during the early nineteen nineties, NATO was at least a

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Speaker 1: little more involved.

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Speaker 2: There.

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Speaker 1: They're totally out to lunch, take out to lunch. So

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Speaker 1: I'm not saying abolish it, but Trump should be using

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Speaker 1: a minimum even more pressure to get them to actually

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Speaker 1: articulate what they are for and to help a situation

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Speaker 1: like this. And if they can't do that, if they

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Speaker 1: can't define a coherent twenty first century mission, if they

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Speaker 1: can't actually help the overwhelming power of view US when

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Speaker 1: we are at war there, then forget At that point,

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Speaker 1: probably it actually should just go away there. You guys

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Speaker 1: served a purpose there bye, by sayanara, have a nice life.

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Speaker 1: So back here on the domestic front, it's not just

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Speaker 1: the war against the Ron that is raging, But it's

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Speaker 1: the domestic war against the wokarate that is continuing to

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Speaker 1: rage as well.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's funny a lot of our.

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Speaker 1: Domestic conversation has gravitated towards other issues outside of the

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Speaker 1: so called culture war of unless you count immigration as

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Speaker 1: a cultural issue, which to an extent it might be,

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Speaker 1: but our politics they are oftentimes discussed along the lines

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Speaker 1: of foreign policy, immigration, and economics. Well, it really wasn't

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Speaker 1: then long ago that the big conversation here domestically, at

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Speaker 1: least from my vanpoint, was heavily heavily focused around.

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Speaker 2: So cult cultural issues.

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Speaker 1: Whether this was the critical race theory era back in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, twenty twenty two, I live in Florida,

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Speaker 1: back when Ron de Santis was really the leader of

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Speaker 1: the anti woke, anti critical race theory crusade. There, those

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Speaker 1: are really the topics that really galvanize both sides of

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Speaker 1: the aisle during the bidministration, the bidministratio, which was peak woke,

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Speaker 1: that was absolutely peak woke during those four years National

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Speaker 1: Transgender Day and this and that, so many examples to

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Speaker 1: pick from there. The emphasis on the wol culture of

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Speaker 1: stuff has definitely died down a little bit since then,

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Speaker 1: Sure there are now different strands of it. There is

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Speaker 1: this whole rise of radical sob versa fifth column Islamism,

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Speaker 1: which would discussed a great length here on the show.

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Speaker 1: The recent terrorist attacks there. So it's transmographied a little

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Speaker 1: bit and now you find it under under different categories

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Speaker 1: and labels. But all these bread and butter culture issues,

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Speaker 1: especially including the LGBT Rainbow Jihad, a lot of this

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Speaker 1: really has tended to fade a little bit into the back,

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Speaker 1: at least that is until Thursday. So on Thursday March nineteen,

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Speaker 1: Sarah Hugby Sanders, who was the governor of Arkansas, one

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Speaker 1: of my favorite governors in the country. For whatever is

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Speaker 1: worthing that she is deeply underappreciated. She's now out in

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Speaker 1: the heartland. She's no longer the White House Press Secretary,

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Speaker 1: a role that she served prior to Kille mcadaey back

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Speaker 1: during the first Trump term. She was excellent, excellent in

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Speaker 1: that role actually, and she's been excellent as governor. She's

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Speaker 1: been a really really superb governor. And frankly, I think

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Speaker 1: that I think that Republicans could do a lot worse

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Speaker 1: one day than nominating her for president. I'm not saying

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Speaker 1: this is the card in twenty twenty eight. It's been

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Speaker 1: a very little discussion of that there. But if you're

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Speaker 1: looking at it and outside the box possibility, whether it's

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty eight, twenty thirty two, or in the future,

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Speaker 1: you could really do a lot worse than Hugby Sanders.

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Speaker 1: In fact, in twenty twenty four, she was easily in

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Speaker 1: my top two or three picks for what it's worth

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Speaker 1: to be Trump's running mate. Anyway, So, Sarah Hugby Sanders,

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Speaker 1: who was of course the daughter as he name would imply,

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Speaker 1: of Mike Cuckabee. She comes from eight very prominent Arkansas

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Speaker 1: Evangelical Baptist family. I think her views on a lot

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Speaker 1: of these so called cultural issues abortions, sames, as marriage

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Speaker 1: that are not exactly it's something that is hidden. She

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Speaker 1: is quite vocal and public about that with her faith

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Speaker 1: and with their convictions there. And she was asked to

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Speaker 1: leave a restaurant in a little Rock on Thursday. Stop

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Speaker 1: me if you've heard this story before. This actually happened

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Speaker 1: to Hockey Sanders back in twenty nineteen, back when she

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Speaker 1: was living in the DC area, because she was part

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Speaker 1: of the Trump administration as the press secretary. So it

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Speaker 1: happened to the restaurant in Virginia called the Red Hen

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Speaker 1: Back then they asked her to leave even before her

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Speaker 1: meal was served. It was a whole kerfuffle at the time. Well,

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Speaker 1: on Thursday, it was a little more peculiar because this restaurant,

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Speaker 1: which seems like a French restaurant based on the name

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Speaker 1: the Crossanctery in Little Rock, Arkansas. Essentially what they did

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Speaker 1: was they allowed her to eat, and then they kicked

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Speaker 1: her out or asked her to leave after she was done.

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Speaker 1: So what she actually said, the governor posted on x

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Speaker 1: on Thursday, She said, I was having lunch with two

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Speaker 1: other moms at a restaurant when the owner approached, a

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Speaker 1: member of the state Police Executive Protection Detail, said my

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Speaker 1: presence made their employees feel threatened. Again, the most hilarious

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Speaker 1: part of this is that they actually let her finish

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Speaker 1: the meal. So con just conjure up this image in

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Speaker 1: your head as to these total scaredy cats, these people

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Speaker 1: that are free of their owns, of their own shadow,

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Speaker 1: just chattering the kitchen. Oh my god, this right wing

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Speaker 1: trog lo died, this right wing fanatic, this governor is

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Speaker 1: dining here.

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Speaker 2: What are we gonna do. I feel microaggressed, I feel threatened.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna let her eat?

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Speaker 1: And you can just imagine how they're too afraid of

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Speaker 1: having a standoff prior to letting her enjoy her lunch

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Speaker 1: with these two other moms, and then they very cowardly

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Speaker 1: wait till the end to actually do it.

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Speaker 2: So the whole thing is utterly ridiculous.

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Speaker 1: By the way, the owners of this restaurant, I don't

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Speaker 1: necessarily know a ton about their biography, but I guess

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Speaker 1: I will just say this. The photos aren't making the

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Speaker 1: rounds on social media, I guess I will say that

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Speaker 1: they look like they are perfectly well suited to be

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Speaker 1: the spokespersons for a new Subaru tv AD, if you

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Speaker 1: catch my drift. Now, a lot of this raises some

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Speaker 1: legal questions and indeed some cultural questions. Let's start with

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Speaker 1: the legal questions. So a lot of the guests to

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Speaker 1: the very thorny intersection of anti discrimination and public accommodation

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Speaker 1: law on the one hand, versus the First Amendments and

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Speaker 1: your free speech and free free exercise of religion rights

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Speaker 1: on the other hand. The Court has litigated a lot

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Speaker 1: of these cases in recent years. You probably you probably

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Speaker 1: are familiar with the Bake the Darn Cake Bigot line

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Speaker 1: of cases primarily centered around Jack Phillips and Masterpiece Cake

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Speaker 1: Shop over in Colorado. Now, the court in seven twenty eighteen,

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Speaker 1: I believe it was had a somewhat of a procedural

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Speaker 1: narrow ruling on that case there, but they largely revisited

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Speaker 1: this topic in a similar case out of Colorado called

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Speaker 1: three or three Creative in twenty twenty three, which was

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Speaker 1: actually litigated as a free speech case, not a free

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Speaker 1: religion case, but it essentially had very similar overtones. And

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Speaker 1: in that case it was a Christian marriage website designer website,

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Speaker 1: and they were suing because they don't want to be forced

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Speaker 1: to use their talents to create marriage websites for same

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Speaker 1: sex couples. And in a six year opinion, the court

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Speaker 1: said that they cannot be forced to do this. Neil

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Speaker 1: Gorstich wrote the majority opinion, and he wrote, among other things,

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Speaker 1: he said that while public accommodation laws are not necessarily unconstitutional,

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Speaker 1: someone who is in a private business cannot be forced

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Speaker 1: to create a work of art which goes against the

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Speaker 1: values that they would not produce for any client. So

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Speaker 1: the relevant question is whether you are personally engaged in

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Speaker 1: a line of business in a service where your conscience

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Speaker 1: or your religious principles are deeply intrinsically implicated. If you

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Speaker 1: are just owning a restaurant, there's nothing faith based about this.

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Speaker 1: This is about as public a combination as it gets.

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Speaker 1: In fact, the literal reason for the origins of American

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Speaker 1: public public accommodation anti discrimination law aka the Civil Rights

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Speaker 1: Act on nineteen sixty four, which Democrats like strom Thurman

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Speaker 1: tried to filibuster. The very purpose of this statute was

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Speaker 1: to overcome discrimination in exactly places like this, the old

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Speaker 1: Jim Crow segregation lunch counters in places like North Carolina

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Speaker 1: and Georgia and Alabama, etc. There. But if you are

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Speaker 1: a lone Christian cake baker like Jack Phillips and Colorado there,

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Speaker 1: and you are pouring your hard and soul into baking

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Speaker 1: very hand crafty cakes, then yes, the first moment is implicated.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of a murky area there. So there's

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Speaker 1: absolutely no First Amendment basis whatsoever to kick someone like

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Speaker 1: Sarah Huvey Sanders out of the restaurant there. Again, they

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Speaker 1: later finished there was not gonna be like a loss

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Speaker 1: or anything there. But I did want to make that

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Speaker 1: the broader point though, to make I think is this,

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Speaker 1: at what points.

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Speaker 2: Will these people just get a life? Really? I mean,

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Speaker 2: can you imagine if.

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Speaker 1: The roles were reversed, like, can you foresee a situation,

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Speaker 1: especially in a red stately Arkansas? Can you imagine a

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Speaker 1: small mom and pop Christian restaurant where the husband and

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Speaker 1: wife are there and they see someone walk in and

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Speaker 1: maybe they're conspicuously homosexual, or maybe they have a lisp,

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Speaker 1: or they have some sort of other readily identifiable way

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Speaker 1: of knowing that they are LGBT or left wing and

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Speaker 1: said over there, can you imagine any Christian couple who

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Speaker 1: owns a restaurant or some similar stabishment who would try

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Speaker 1: to kick those people out as patrons? The answer is known.

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Speaker 1: The answer is known because every which way you look,

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Speaker 1: this level of intolerance only runs in one direction. They

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Speaker 1: hate us, They don't want anything to do with us.

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Speaker 1: It is simply not true. In the converse, we are

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Speaker 1: always happy to have conversations with these people, to break

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Speaker 1: bread and restaurants with them. Intolerance, unfortunately, in American politics,

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Speaker 1: say in American siding culture is a one Way Street. Sarahgaby Sanders,

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Speaker 1: yet again has learned that the hard way. It's highly,

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Speaker 1: highly unfortunate. Folks, stay with us through another quick merc rate.

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Speaker 1: We'll be right backa Moore on the other side, welcome back.

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Speaker 1: So let's finish our line of thought on the Sarah

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Speaker 1: Hugeby Sanders story, because it really is just it encapsulates

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Speaker 1: all that is wrong with the left. Many many years ago,

433
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:23,480
Speaker 1: Eric Erickson, who was a recent guest here on the

434
00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,720
Speaker 1: Josh Hammers Show, Eric wrote a blog post I believe

435
00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:28,560
Speaker 1: he turned into a book many years ago, and it

436
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,439
Speaker 1: is stuck with me after all these years. And he

437
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:33,879
Speaker 1: famously said in the context of the same sex marriage

438
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:35,960
Speaker 1: five and this is actually in twenty thirteen. So Supreme

439
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:38,600
Speaker 1: Court litigated multiple same sex marriage cases. There was a

440
00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:41,200
Speaker 1: twenty thirteen case of Windsor than the twenty fifteen case

441
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,879
Speaker 1: of Obergefel where they tragically constitutionalized for the whole country

442
00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 1: and the debate essentially has thus far ended there. But

443
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 1: in twenty thirteen and lead up to this Windsor case,

444
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:53,440
Speaker 1: a litigation that was about the Bill Clinton era Defensive

445
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,040
Speaker 1: Marriage Act. Yes, hard to believe, but it was actually

446
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:59,359
Speaker 1: Democratic Bill Clinton that signed into law the Defense of

447
00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 1: Marriage Act. Really, has there been any issue in our

448
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:06,320
Speaker 1: lifetime that just flipped on a dime with one major

449
00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:08,919
Speaker 1: political party and then the broader public in the polling,

450
00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:12,119
Speaker 1: like the same sis marriage issue. It's just astonishing stuff.

451
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:16,640
Speaker 1: In two thousand and eight, Barack Obama campaigns as being

452
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:19,399
Speaker 1: opposed to same sex marriage. You know, everyone in the

453
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:21,479
Speaker 1: right mind knew that he was lying through his teeth.

454
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,520
Speaker 1: He had supported things as marriage as a radical left

455
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:28,239
Speaker 1: wing Illinois state legislator round the same time that he

456
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:34,320
Speaker 1: was opposing mandatory protections for infants that survived botched abortions.

457
00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 1: He has Barack Obama voted against that back in the

458
00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 1: Illinois legislature, So even he felt compelled to lie doesn

459
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:44,720
Speaker 1: eight and say that he opposed same sex marriage. So really,

460
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 1: I mean, it's really astonishing. No other issue moved moved

461
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 1: quite this quickly, and in the context of these rapidly

462
00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 1: shifting wins. Eric Harrison wrote this log post twenty thirteen

463
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,560
Speaker 1: where he said you will be made to care, and

464
00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:01,240
Speaker 1: what he meant by this is that you might think

465
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:05,040
Speaker 1: that we are living in a live and let live

466
00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:09,560
Speaker 1: marketplace of ideas classical liberal free for all you have

467
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:12,320
Speaker 1: your opinion, you have your values. I have my opinion,

468
00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:17,320
Speaker 1: I have my values there and sure enough, there arguably

469
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:20,400
Speaker 1: at least was a time American history where that existed.

470
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,879
Speaker 1: That's not the case anymore. That is so so so

471
00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:26,840
Speaker 1: far removed from the case.

472
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:27,960
Speaker 2: Now.

473
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 1: This particular insidnt happened in Deep Read, Arkansas. You can

474
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 1: imagine if they were in a bluest they might have

475
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:35,960
Speaker 1: felt a little more emboldened by the whole thing there.

476
00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:40,320
Speaker 1: But there's really no reasoning with a lot of these people.

477
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that we should interact with them. We

478
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:44,760
Speaker 1: should absolutely should be willing to engage and break red again.

479
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 1: That's how we are in many ways different than them,

480
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 1: but they don't want to engage with us. The polls

481
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:51,680
Speaker 1: on this are actually overwhelming. There's been all sorts of

482
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:53,679
Speaker 1: reason polling in recent years where they sent where they

483
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 1: ask liberal women, liberal men, conservative women, conservative men, are

484
00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:00,399
Speaker 1: you more likely to unfriend someone on face book or

485
00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:03,160
Speaker 1: in real life? We're having different political views? By far,

486
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,359
Speaker 1: The highest percentage of all them are liberal women.

487
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:06,880
Speaker 2: By far.

488
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 1: Leftist women are the most intolerant people. Based on every

489
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:14,200
Speaker 1: statistically meaningful sample we've ever gotten in America. It's not

490
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 1: even close. Actually, liberal men are the second. Conservatives are

491
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:22,440
Speaker 1: considerably more tolerant. We see this time and time again again.

492
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:26,640
Speaker 1: This could have been a bigger stink, but they essentially

493
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 1: didn't ask her to leave until she was already gone.

494
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:33,639
Speaker 1: So we have obviated some of our problems down in Arkansas.

495
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,680
Speaker 1: In other news, in the broader South, this is here

496
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 1: in Florida where I live.

497
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:40,359
Speaker 2: Jim Comey.

498
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:42,200
Speaker 1: You might forgot about him, but Jim Comy has not

499
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 1: forgoten about you. Jim Comy is now facing a subpoena

500
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: from the Use Attorney's Office here in the Southern District

501
00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:52,240
Speaker 1: of Florida's the DOJ subpoening Jim Comey over his role

502
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 1: in the infamous January twenty seventeen what was known as

503
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:59,080
Speaker 1: the ICA the Intelligence Communy Assessment. This was the infamous

504
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:03,320
Speaker 1: documents Jim Comey wrote that laid the legal predicate for

505
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 1: for Russia, Gates, that laid the legal legal predicate for

506
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:09,040
Speaker 1: spying on the on the Trump campaign into the Trump administration,

507
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 1: and and that whole ordeal. And this this assessment that

508
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 1: Comy rushed through. He rushed through a total rushed process.

509
00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 1: It didn't even meet the right procedural thresholds. He concluded

510
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: that Russia sought to influence the twenty sixteen election, and

511
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 1: that's therefore that the Trump campaign was was compromised. That

512
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:31,359
Speaker 1: this this, this is this is the document that essentially

513
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 1: led to the Moller probe that handicapped two years of

514
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 1: the presidency. There and now Jim Comey is being subpoena

515
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 1: and they tried to indict Jim Comy last year. That's

516
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:41,640
Speaker 1: to say the do o jem. Thus far, the endloyment

517
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,639
Speaker 1: has not gone anywhere. We will see where this subpoena

518
00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:47,000
Speaker 1: goes as well. But this whole broad conversation as to

519
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:49,919
Speaker 1: Jim Comy and various other left wing officials, a lot

520
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 1: of folks have him saying, oh, what is what is

521
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:54,960
Speaker 1: Trump doing? They're going, this is this is retaliatory lawfair,

522
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:58,199
Speaker 1: this is terrible, This is fascistic, this, this is totalitarians.

523
00:26:58,280 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 2: This is that.

524
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 1: My longstanding thesis on this is that the only way

525
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:09,600
Speaker 1: out is through the rule of law is a delicate thing.

526
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 1: It is true, no doubt about that, and the rule

527
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,360
Speaker 1: of law is never going to be entirely truly neutral.

528
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 1: This notion of a wholy neutral rule of law is

529
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:21,160
Speaker 1: a mirage of FASA, the same way that the notion

530
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:25,880
Speaker 1: of entirely neutral anything is a mirage or facade. Neutrality

531
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:30,479
Speaker 1: is here, there, and everywhere. Ali is one of the

532
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:34,920
Speaker 1: great most important insights of the National Conservative movement, which

533
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 1: I've been a part of now for many years now.

534
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 1: There is always going to be at least some thumb

535
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 1: on the scale, some analytical prism, some lens through which

536
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,920
Speaker 1: to assess whether it's a law, the tax code, markets,

537
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:52,160
Speaker 1: everything ultimately comes down at some level and some levels

538
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: doing a lot of work here at some level to

539
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 1: which value system are we operating through the prism of.

540
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 2: Now?

541
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: I say all that because when it comes to prosecutions,

542
00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:05,439
Speaker 1: in particular, when it comes to launch of prosecutions, when

543
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 1: it comes to waging lawfare, that prosecutors do have a

544
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,719
Speaker 1: lot of leeway. There absolutely is such thing as proscutorial discretion.

545
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 1: You don't have to bring any particular case.

546
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 2: You don't.

547
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: There's been a feature of prosecutor's office going back hundreds

548
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: of years, ever since medieval England. There simply are not

549
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,800
Speaker 1: enough resources, not not enough money, not enough manpower. However,

550
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,720
Speaker 1: when this tends to be abused and abused and abused

551
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 1: and abused. And let's just briefly recount how Democrats have

552
00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 1: abused this in recent years. It really begins in earnest

553
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 1: with the second Obama administration, so the second Bomb administration.

554
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 1: After the DAKA Executive Anamaste of twenty twelve, Obama has

555
00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 1: the DAPPA Executive Amnesty of twenty fourteen, which was actually

556
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,600
Speaker 1: much more sprawling than the DACA amnesty that preceded by

557
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 1: two years.

558
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 2: What he essentially said was that.

559
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 1: He was not going to enforce large swaths of American

560
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:01,479
Speaker 1: immigration law, that if you were the of people here

561
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,880
Speaker 1: illegally and so forth, that you would not be deported.

562
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 1: But that's not prosecutor discretion. That is actually a full

563
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 1: fledge assault on they take care clause Article two, which

564
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: says that the president must take care that the laws

565
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 1: are faithfully executed. But it got a lot worse during

566
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,800
Speaker 1: the By administration. Infamously by now, this is when Merrik Garland,

567
00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,720
Speaker 1: teaming up with so called special consult Jack Smith, prosecuted

568
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 1: Donald Trump himself, prosecuted plenty of other people on the right,

569
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 1: people like Peer Navarro, people like Steve Bannon. They prosecuted

570
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:34,880
Speaker 1: their pro life grandmothers pranging outside abortion clinics on extraordinarily

571
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,520
Speaker 1: dubious sastroid grounds on the face sac for God's sake,

572
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:44,800
Speaker 1: there they took law fair to unprecedented extremes because, to

573
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:46,800
Speaker 1: take us back to an early conversation about you, you

574
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,240
Speaker 1: will be made to care because they don't want to

575
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 1: live with us, They don't want to rationalize with us.

576
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:58,000
Speaker 1: They want us incarcerated, they want us bankrupt. And in

577
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,000
Speaker 1: the most extreme case, I'm not saying this of all them,

578
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,440
Speaker 1: and the most extreme cases, people like Tyler Robinson now

579
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:06,440
Speaker 1: in Utah, they want us dead. So the question now

580
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:09,600
Speaker 1: is what should the Trump ministration do when it comes.

581
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:10,320
Speaker 2: To the issue of law fair.

582
00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: Look, I think it's all fun and games to say

583
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:17,400
Speaker 1: that we should aspire to a truly neutral rule of law.

584
00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 1: That absolutely is the load star of the aspiration. What

585
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 1: I am saying here is twofold. One is that in

586
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 1: reality that's really never the case. It's something of a mirage.

587
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:30,719
Speaker 1: It's a load starts and aspiration in reality is never

588
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:34,480
Speaker 1: the case, is never truly attainable. Two, most importantly is

589
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: what do we do to get there? And is my

590
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:40,560
Speaker 1: thesis for years now that the way to get there

591
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 1: is through mutually assured destruction. What I wrote in a

592
00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 1: column last year as mutually assured law enforcement destruction. You

593
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:53,480
Speaker 1: have to make sure that they know that the right

594
00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 1: is also willing to escalate in the short term in

595
00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 1: the service of a mid to long term truce. I

596
00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:04,480
Speaker 1: don't want them to be permanent escalation. Far from it. Again, Neutrality,

597
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 1: equ detection, all this this is absolutely the aspirational goal

598
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 1: the load star here, But to some extent it's just

599
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:14,880
Speaker 1: game theory. One on one, we had John You, the

600
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:17,360
Speaker 1: esteem constitution law professor of former Clarence Thomas Garp. We

601
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 1: had hit him on the show a few weeks ago

602
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:21,480
Speaker 1: over the time that the earon war started. Well, I

603
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 1: saw John You give a speech at the National Conserver

604
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: Conference about a year or ago where he said the

605
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:29,520
Speaker 1: same thing. He says, it's basic game theory. If you

606
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 1: want these results, then short term escalation makes sense. I'm

607
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 1: not saying you manufacture charges. That's stolen this garbage. What

608
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,080
Speaker 1: I am saying is that within the confines of the

609
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:42,719
Speaker 1: rule of law, within the confines of legitimate prosecutoral discretion,

610
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 1: it is not just appropriate, it is desirable. It is

611
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 1: necessary to put the left on their back feet to

612
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 1: make sure they know that the right can get their

613
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,320
Speaker 1: hands dirty when it comes to law. Fair and play

614
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:57,680
Speaker 1: this game as well again within the confines of the

615
00:31:57,760 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: rule of law and in the confine's discretion.

616
00:31:59,320 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 2: There.

617
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:01,959
Speaker 1: I'm not saying you make up charges. That's Joseph Stalin,

618
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:05,960
Speaker 1: but there was a role here for prudence, and frankly,

619
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,960
Speaker 1: I think this new comey subpoena in South Florida fits

620
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 1: very neatly into the realm of prudence. Folks, one fillo

621
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: commercial break, swailes, We'll be right back with more on

622
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:21,440
Speaker 1: the other side. Welcome back. So a man who passed

623
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 1: away over three decades ago is back in the news

624
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 1: and is for unfortunate reasons. And the man is Caesar Shapez.

625
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,280
Speaker 1: You might not know a whole lot about if you

626
00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:31,480
Speaker 1: are a conservative. If you are a liberal, you probably

627
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 1: know a whole lot about him. He was someone who

628
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:37,040
Speaker 1: grew up on the US Mexico border and became a

629
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 1: famed left wing labor leader for Latin American farm workers.

630
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 1: Probably above all, he was really really renowned in a

631
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 1: left wing labor circle, someone who can bind some some

632
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 1: of his more left wing economic views with some of

633
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 1: his so called social justice views. He's comed a social

634
00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 1: justice warrior. Frankly, decades before there ever was a thing

635
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 1: as the movement. He was very involved with left wing

636
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 1: politics and just a major labor leader. So the New

637
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,640
Speaker 1: York Times Elwier this week had a story essentially revealing

638
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:12,840
Speaker 1: that Caesar Chavez was not necessarily the man that many

639
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 1: people thought he was. In fact, he sexually abused and

640
00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 1: harassed numerous girls, people who were in their teens. So

641
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 1: one woman by the name of Dolores Clerta, who was

642
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 1: also a leader in the leftist farm worker labor union

643
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: movement at the time there has come out as if

644
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:35,520
Speaker 1: others essentially confirming that he basically said, don't tell anyone there,

645
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 1: we're gonna have like a little thing, and they did

646
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,120
Speaker 1: all sorts of terrible sexual things that we're not going

647
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 1: to talk about that. And it's awful. This is really

648
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:44,080
Speaker 1: terrible stuff. No one likes to hear these details. It's

649
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 1: really sordid and ugly stuff. Already, various left wing states

650
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:51,960
Speaker 1: Democrat blue states have started to rename their statewide Caesar

651
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:56,600
Speaker 1: Chavez Days or their state wide Caesar Chavez parks or

652
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:59,440
Speaker 1: minements or street names, street name is has actually been

653
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:02,760
Speaker 1: these image is people literally going around campuses and as

654
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 1: you're tearing down the Caesar Shavs like like the physical

655
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:09,960
Speaker 1: bus of the statue on campuses there the Governor Gavin

656
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: Newsmount in California essentially I had a statement saying that

657
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:15,600
Speaker 1: we are no longer going to recognize Caesars Shava is

658
00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 1: actually a very minor federal quote unquote holiday for Caesar Shaphas.

659
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 1: So all this conversation, to me raises a very interesting

660
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:26,600
Speaker 1: moral question. And the moral question is as follows, which is,

661
00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 1: how do we judge people so long after they have

662
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 1: died for terrible things that they did or said? And

663
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: here is the moral distinction that I like to make

664
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:39,440
Speaker 1: when I think about these matters. The moral distinction is

665
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,840
Speaker 1: as follows. If you are trying to anachronistically judge someone

666
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: from a very long time ago based on contemporary morals,

667
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:51,799
Speaker 1: and there is a notable difference between the morals of

668
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 1: that day and the morals of today, that thing that

669
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 1: that is inappropriate. So, for instance, Aristotle, Aristotle, the Greek

670
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 1: philosopher from a over two thousand years ago, one of

671
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 1: the most important philosophers in human history. He literally might

672
00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:07,880
Speaker 1: be number one. Actually, at least outside of the biblical inheritance,

673
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:13,799
Speaker 1: Aristotle was not exactly a lowercase the Democrat. He was

674
00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,440
Speaker 1: not exactly in favor of full scale e galitarianism, racial equality,

675
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:19,719
Speaker 1: things of that. There. Does that mean that his thoughts

676
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:22,960
Speaker 1: on political theory, on ethics of any sort can be

677
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: tossed out there? And the answer is obviously no. He

678
00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:28,359
Speaker 1: was living two thousand plus years ago in a totally

679
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 1: different context, So I can appreciate what he says about

680
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:36,840
Speaker 1: politics or ethics while understanding that his views about race

681
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:41,879
Speaker 1: or misogyny or for instance, are just totally not worth

682
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 1: engagement and taking seriously. Abraham Lincoln is another example here.

683
00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:49,680
Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln did more than anyone in American history for

684
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 1: racial quality, but in the eyes of some purists even

685
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:54,880
Speaker 1: he is really this is far out their stuff. In

686
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:56,799
Speaker 1: the eyes of people like the Black lives matter of that,

687
00:35:56,840 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 1: George Floyd Martyr, whole crowd, a lot of them things,

688
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:03,960
Speaker 1: than Lincoln is actually now a villain because Lincoln, even

689
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 1: though he literally freed the slaves, that whole Gettysburg Address thing,

690
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 1: the Emancipation Proclamation, all of it, despite all that they

691
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 1: think that he privately held some less than fully kosher

692
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 1: views on race. And I just look at that and

693
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:23,320
Speaker 1: I laugh. He was living in the middle of slavery.

694
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 1: Did you expect Nesley to have the purest views? Probably not,

695
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:32,880
Speaker 1: for God's sake, give this man a break. But in

696
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 1: a case like this, like Caesar Chavez, the morals in

697
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:40,000
Speaker 1: this particular case, when it comes to diddling little kids

698
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:44,359
Speaker 1: and teenagers and abusing them in a horrific fashion, the

699
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 1: morals of the day then were the exact same as today.

700
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,680
Speaker 1: Nothing has changed there. So I think it is totally fair, frankly,

701
00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:54,319
Speaker 1: to judge him in that light.

702
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 2: I actually really do.

703
00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:59,960
Speaker 1: It's a reminder, frankly, he probably shouldn't quickly go lionized

704
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,440
Speaker 1: people and make people an icon with these holidays and

705
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:06,759
Speaker 1: these busts and these centers. Look, I used to live

706
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:08,720
Speaker 1: in Texas. I spent a long time in Austin, Texas

707
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:14,560
Speaker 1: over the years. Great city and Caesar Chavez Street, Boulevard,

708
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 1: whatever it's called their Austin is a major thoroughfare. I've

709
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:19,640
Speaker 1: joined on that countless times. Before you go to all

710
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:23,239
Speaker 1: these lengths to name these streets signs there, maybe maybe

711
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: just think whether it's worth it, whether this individual is

712
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:26,640
Speaker 1: truly truly worth it.

713
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 2: You know.

714
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:30,160
Speaker 1: I saw someone joke on Twitter always say that all

715
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 1: the people that are trying to rename Caesar shaves Day

716
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:34,239
Speaker 1: and these bus there, they probably should put up a

717
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:37,759
Speaker 1: bust in a statue or whatnot of Chuck Norris. Chuck

718
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 1: Norris passed away earlier today at the age of eighty six.

719
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,439
Speaker 1: Just a tremendous loss. He was an incredible, incredible man.

720
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,919
Speaker 1: Originally known for his martial arts prowess that he became

721
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: something of an action icon when it came to television film,

722
00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:55,840
Speaker 1: perhaps most famously for Walker, Texas Ranger back in the

723
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 1: nineteen nineties. There someone who brought a lot of joy

724
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 1: to a lot of people. And I never met him, unfortunately,

725
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:05,759
Speaker 1: but I have been told by everyone who did that

726
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: he was a genuinely, very very good human being, a

727
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: man of deep faith, a born again Christian, who was

728
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:17,080
Speaker 1: a tremendous spokesman for the biblical worldsview, who did a

729
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:20,760
Speaker 1: lot to advance in Biblical principles in the public square.

730
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: I was very outspoken about his conservative leaning politics. There

731
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:26,720
Speaker 1: was a robust supporter actually of the State of Israel,

732
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 1: was a friend a primesternet to Yahoo's actually, but he

733
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 1: was just he was just a total icon and just

734
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 1: a total, total, total, really in particular icon of just

735
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,720
Speaker 1: macho manliness. And as I joked earlier when we started

736
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:47,919
Speaker 1: our show, Chuck Norris has passed away and he has

737
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 1: met death.

738
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:51,400
Speaker 2: But as Joel Berry the Babylon.

739
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:55,040
Speaker 1: B I saw joke see Jojoli today on X death

740
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 1: is Aldi surely now struggling with Chuck Norris, Because if

741
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:01,600
Speaker 1: I know anything at all about Chuck Norris, I'm pretty

742
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:05,839
Speaker 1: sure that he could beat the everlasting crap frankly out

743
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 1: of the Grim Reaper. And it's on that religious note

744
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 1: that I want to close today's show. So I want

745
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:14,240
Speaker 1: to talk a little bit about this week's tour portions.

746
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 1: So the tour a portion of course, this is the

747
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:18,280
Speaker 1: five Books of Moses at the beginning of the Bible,

748
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:22,720
Speaker 1: books of Genesis through Deuteronomy the Jews, we Jews read

749
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:24,880
Speaker 1: it over the course of an annual cycle. Begin with

750
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,320
Speaker 1: Genesis chapter one, conclude with the passing way of Moses

751
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:30,640
Speaker 1: at the very end of Deuteronomy. So just as past week,

752
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:32,920
Speaker 1: we actually finish the Book of Exodus, and now now

753
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: this week we are beginning the Book of Leviticus and Leviticus,

754
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:39,920
Speaker 1: which is the third of the five books in the Torah.

755
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,880
Speaker 1: In the fop books, Moses is probably the most skipped

756
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 1: and glossed over of the five books. Genesis, I mean,

757
00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 1: Genesis is absolutely incredible. There's there's Creation, there's Adam, there's

758
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: canaan Abel, there is Noah. There's Abraham, Isaac and Jacob

759
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:55,480
Speaker 1: and Joseph in Egypt. I mean, there's a million things

760
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:58,480
Speaker 1: happening in Genesis. Exodus is Exodus. I mean there is

761
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 1: the exodus from Egypt and Pharaoh and and then the

762
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 1: plagues and the crossing of the sea. The Book of

763
00:40:02,760 --> 00:40:06,200
Speaker 1: Numbers is in the wilderness, the crossing in the wilderness.

764
00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:08,040
Speaker 1: A lot of very fastness of happening there as well.

765
00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:10,680
Speaker 1: Duterami has a ton of prophecy, a ton of moralizers there.

766
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:15,960
Speaker 1: Leviticus lapel think very hard line sexual codes, levitical sexual morays.

767
00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:18,440
Speaker 1: A lapiol kind is just gloss over it there. But

768
00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: there's a lot happening in the book of Leviticus, a

769
00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 1: lot of deeply deeply important things happening. Among other things,

770
00:40:24,080 --> 00:40:27,080
Speaker 1: actually the origin of the Golden Rule itself true today

771
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:29,400
Speaker 1: stranger as your own fellow was actually right here in Leviticus,

772
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:33,320
Speaker 1: chapter nineteen, verse eighteen. But the book of Leviticus begins

773
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 1: with what might superficially seem to be a very dry

774
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: emphasis on the various types of offerings, the offerings that

775
00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:42,400
Speaker 1: were brought to God back in the tabernacle, back of

776
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:45,439
Speaker 1: the wilderness, ultimately to be brought in the Temple upon

777
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 1: the Jews crossing into the Holy Land there and founding

778
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:52,480
Speaker 1: the temple, establishing it in Jerusalem. And the important lesson

779
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:55,760
Speaker 1: here is to wonder why there is such an intricate,

780
00:40:55,800 --> 00:41:01,200
Speaker 1: elaborate system of various offerings that that man is making

781
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:05,680
Speaker 1: and offering animal sacrifices to God. Does God really need

782
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 1: this level of detail when it comes to sacrifice? Does

783
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:12,319
Speaker 1: God really need anything? And the answer, of course is no.

784
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,280
Speaker 1: God is God, God is omniscienty is omnipotentity is all powerful.

785
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 1: He doesn't need anything. The purpose of this very elaborate

786
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:23,759
Speaker 1: system of sacrifices is not for God, It's for us.

787
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,319
Speaker 1: Because the lesson here that the Torah is teaching us

788
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 1: is that when you bring an offering, when you bring

789
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:33,960
Speaker 1: a gift, the person receiving it, it's not the ultimate winner.

790
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:37,120
Speaker 1: The winner is you benefits.

791
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:38,920
Speaker 2: You are brought closer to that.

792
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:43,160
Speaker 1: Person by the act of giving your value, your esteem,

793
00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:47,400
Speaker 1: your worth, your view of your relationship and the relationship

794
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 1: of self is all bolstered by your act of selflessness.

795
00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:53,840
Speaker 1: So that's the core lesson here. Whether it's your whether

796
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 1: it's your you and God, whether it's you and your wife,

797
00:41:56,719 --> 00:41:59,160
Speaker 1: you and your kids, you and your friends. There, think

798
00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:01,080
Speaker 1: a little bit more about gu think it's a very

799
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 1: important lesson. I think that the time of you in particular,

800
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:04,839
Speaker 1: especially as we gear up towards the holidays, coming off

801
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 1: of Easter and Passover as well. Folks, have a great weekend,

802
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:10,759
Speaker 1: enjoyed that college basketball. We'll be right back Monday. Josh

803
00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 1: Shammers signing off on SILL. Then