1 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:03,680 Speaker 1: Life Audio. 2 00:00:04,720 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 2: Hey Sam, thanks for joining me my pleasure. 3 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 1: Thanks for having me. 4 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 2: Sam Eaton, speaker, author and mental health advocate, founder of 5 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:16,720 Speaker 2: Recklessly Alive, an organization debted to suicide prevention, author of 6 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:20,080 Speaker 2: the new book. Also, the book's name is you Can 7 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:24,759 Speaker 2: Do This Daily affirmations to live Recklessly Alive. Recklessly Alive 8 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 2: dot com as the website. Sam, You've been an advocate 9 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 2: for mental health for years now. You didn't always want 10 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 2: to talk about it, of course, what changed for you 11 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:37,240 Speaker 2: and why did you want to write this new book 12 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 2: You Can Do This. 13 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: I started my career as a public school teacher. I 14 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,520 Speaker 1: taught music, and while I was teaching, we actually lost 15 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:47,479 Speaker 1: four people in our community to suicide. We had two students, 16 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:49,600 Speaker 1: a teacher, and a principal who all took their own 17 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:52,479 Speaker 1: life back in twenty sixteen. And this is something that 18 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 1: I had struggled with personally. I had never talked about 19 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:58,360 Speaker 1: or told anyone about. But with each of those losses, 20 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 1: I just felt like this push in my like I 21 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 1: had to do something to help, and I didn't know 22 00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 1: what that would be. And over the last ten years, 23 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:07,920 Speaker 1: I've learned how much help and support is needed in 24 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:10,759 Speaker 1: the mental health space. Whether you struggle with your mental 25 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:13,959 Speaker 1: health or not, there's tools and trips, tools and tricks 26 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 1: that we can all learn and implement into our daily lives. 27 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:18,400 Speaker 1: And so that's what I wrote the new book for, 28 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,720 Speaker 1: to help everybody with those little practices every day that 29 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: I've learned to feel better and to feel fully alive. 30 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:28,280 Speaker 2: Amen to that. Let me read some data here. More 31 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 2: than one billion people worldwide live with mental health disorders, 32 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,600 Speaker 2: according to the World Health Organization. Many of them, of course, 33 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:37,679 Speaker 2: have considered suicide. Sam, you've spoken in more than two 34 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 2: hundred and fifty events across the country about depression, about 35 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:44,640 Speaker 2: suicide prevention. What are you hearing from this generation that 36 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 2: perhaps older generations still fully understand about mental health struggles Today? 37 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 1: We've made a lot of really good progress in talking 38 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 1: about mental health and the awareness space, and now we 39 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 1: need to take steps into giving practical tools on what 40 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:01,600 Speaker 1: that looks like. We hear all the time it's okay 41 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 1: not to be okay, and absolutely it is, But what 42 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 1: does that look like? How does someone take those daily 43 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:10,240 Speaker 1: practices and move their way through it. I think the pressure, 44 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 1: especially on our younger generations, is so different than even 45 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: I understand. I'm in my thirties. Facebook didn't come out 46 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:20,000 Speaker 1: until I was a senior in high school. Even just 47 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 1: the simple, the simple fact that when we were in school, 48 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:26,080 Speaker 1: when you went home at three o'clock, nobody could find 49 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:28,239 Speaker 1: you or reach you until the next day. And now 50 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: these kids, it's twenty four to seven, that they're seeing 51 00:02:30,600 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: these messages that they're not enough, that their bodies aren't enough, 52 00:02:33,800 --> 00:02:36,800 Speaker 1: that whatever they're doing in their life isn't enough, and 53 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 1: people are out there are better than them. So we're 54 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:43,119 Speaker 1: fighting a totally different war than what it was when 55 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 1: even just ten fifteen years ago, And so we have 56 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 1: to understand it as a baseline that it's easy for 57 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:51,200 Speaker 1: us to give advice on what our young people should do, 58 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:53,920 Speaker 1: but the truth is we have almost no clue what 59 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: it actually feels like to live in their body and 60 00:02:56,040 --> 00:02:58,519 Speaker 1: their brain in this time of our lives. 61 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,960 Speaker 2: Absolutely well, you're speaking the truth because the world has 62 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 2: changed so much in the last ten or fifteen years. 63 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 2: And I'm older than you, and it's changed even more 64 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:10,280 Speaker 2: than that since I was young. The building on that, 65 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 2: then what world has social media and smartphones played in 66 00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:17,639 Speaker 2: the decline of mental health in the past decade? 67 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 1: Then, so we obviously can't blame everything on social media, 68 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:23,959 Speaker 1: but the Surgeon General did come out last year and 69 00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:28,360 Speaker 1: declare youth in teen mental health a national emergency. In fact, 70 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: they've shown that anything over three hours a day of 71 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:35,120 Speaker 1: social media doubles your risk for depression and anxiety. And 72 00:03:35,160 --> 00:03:37,760 Speaker 1: the average teenager is spending three and a half hours 73 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 1: a day on social media. And I think if we 74 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:43,480 Speaker 1: looked at most of our teenagers, or even just ourselves, 75 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 1: my own screen time, right, these companies have spent billions 76 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:49,880 Speaker 1: of dollars making these things as addictive as possible, and 77 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 1: then their solution is to tell a teenager who's at 78 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:55,640 Speaker 1: a point in their life developmentally when they're not they 79 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 1: don't have the self control and the impulse control to 80 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: combat these things. And then we try to put the 81 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:03,640 Speaker 1: blame on them and say, oh, well, you're not limiting 82 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 1: your time. It's like, oh, well, we have tools, we 83 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 1: have you know, you can, you can put screen limits 84 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 1: on it. But the problem is that they don't have that. 85 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: They don't have that ability in their development. So we 86 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 1: absolutely have to find ways to teach them how to 87 00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: use it responsibly and model that ourselves. Right, if we 88 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 1: as adults are looking at our speen twenty four to seven. 89 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 1: We certainly can't expect a fourteen year old to do 90 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 1: the same. 91 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 2: Amen, you're spitting truth this morning. Man. That's so true. Sam. 92 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:33,840 Speaker 2: Let me ask you a couple of questions about that. 93 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 2: Just I mean, when parents come up to you and 94 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 2: they say, my kid is whatever, eight, ten, twelve, just 95 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 2: fill in the age. What should I do about their 96 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 2: request for smartphone? What do you tell them? 97 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 1: I mean, Australia just banned social media for anyone under 98 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:53,919 Speaker 1: the age of eighteen. Obviously this needs to be a 99 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:58,000 Speaker 1: family decision. And I also think it doesn't help if 100 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 1: we don't train them what to do after they turn eighteen. 101 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:02,680 Speaker 1: If we just say absolutely not and then hand them 102 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 1: a phone at eighteen, they also don't have the skills. 103 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:07,920 Speaker 1: So I think it's really important as parents in all things, 104 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:10,479 Speaker 1: that you're using that time to walk through these things 105 00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:14,160 Speaker 1: with them, help them interpret what they're seeing, what they're experiencing, 106 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 1: And you can't expect these platforms to not show them 107 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:20,479 Speaker 1: really graphic things. Just on my own TikTok, I've seen 108 00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 1: people getting shot, I've seen nudity and like they can 109 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: say it doesn't happen, but it is, it's there and 110 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,360 Speaker 1: it is happening. So how do we in a responsible 111 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,280 Speaker 1: way say, hey, I trust you and these things are 112 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: really pretty messed up and we need to figure this 113 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:38,200 Speaker 1: out together on how how we can use this for 114 00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 1: good and make sure that it's not causing making our 115 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 1: lives worse. 116 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:44,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, just let me speak here, just as just as 117 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 2: the host of the show, there there are and as 118 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,839 Speaker 2: a parent afore gets there are companies who make phones 119 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 2: without Internet. Names are like Gab and Bark and I 120 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 2: think true me there's other There's plenty of alternatives out there. 121 00:05:56,880 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 2: If you're kid is needing a device to call you 122 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 2: when the soccer practice is over, you don't have to 123 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 2: give him a Rolls Roye in order to just you know, 124 00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 2: it's kind of the same thing, you know, that's what 125 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,840 Speaker 2: a smartphone is in terms of technology. It's a Rolls Royce. 126 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:11,479 Speaker 2: You're giving a kid a Rolls Royce instead of just 127 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 2: giving him a bicycle. But anyway, that's just me talking 128 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:19,320 Speaker 2: your organization, as Sam is called recklessly alive. What does 129 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 2: it look like to live recklessly? A lie for you? 130 00:06:23,320 --> 00:06:25,320 Speaker 1: So, I think so. I grew up with an alcoholic 131 00:06:25,400 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 1: father and as a result, of that disease. He just 132 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 1: caused a lot of pain in my life. I used 133 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 1: to hide under the table in kindergarten because I was 134 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:35,600 Speaker 1: afraid of the world and afraid to live, and that 135 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 1: followed me well into my twenties. And so after I 136 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:43,159 Speaker 1: attempted my own attempt, I had to figure out, Okay, 137 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:45,120 Speaker 1: what is my life going to look like going forward? 138 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 1: What am I going to change so that I enjoy living? 139 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,360 Speaker 1: And so I truthfully recklessly a live is going to 140 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:53,840 Speaker 1: mean something different to everybody. For me, it meant I 141 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 1: needed to take some bold action in my life and 142 00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:58,839 Speaker 1: live in a way live and create a life that 143 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: I was proud to live. So at first I did 144 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 1: a bunch of crazy things. I like ran a marathon 145 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 1: and I jumped out of an airplane. And while those 146 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:08,119 Speaker 1: things did make me feel alive, pretty quickly I found 147 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:10,120 Speaker 1: that the best way to be recklessly alive is to 148 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 1: find something in the world that you can make a difference. 149 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: For me, it was how do you reach back into 150 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 1: your story in a place that you were really hurting 151 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 1: and find other people who are there and give them 152 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: the tools, the education, the help that they need. And 153 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 1: that's the most alive that I've ever felt is in 154 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 1: serving and in giving back to other people, And so 155 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,559 Speaker 1: that is what I focus on now. Is recklessly alive 156 00:07:32,760 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: just means creating a life that you enjoy living that 157 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 1: you wake up excited to experience in a way that 158 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 1: makes the world a better place for those around us. 159 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 2: How did you get to that point though? Because you 160 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 2: were you're rid a low point in your life and 161 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 2: thought about ending your life. What was the turning point 162 00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 2: for you in your life to get to the point 163 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 2: where you are today? Or was it multiple steps? 164 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:58,720 Speaker 1: You know, for some people it is one big low moment, 165 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:02,160 Speaker 1: maybe it's a break up that sometimes that's really can 166 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: be a warning sign for something like that, just a 167 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: big event, and for some people it's a long, slow 168 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 1: degrading process. For me, it was I had a really 169 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 1: negative self talk. The voices in my head were really 170 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 1: constantly attacking me and telling me how worthless I was. 171 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 1: I also had made some choices that were not helping 172 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 1: me live the best life. I was spending a lot 173 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 1: of time binge drinking, I was not exercising, taking care 174 00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:30,760 Speaker 1: of my body, wasn't I hadn't processed the trauma that 175 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:33,520 Speaker 1: I had been through all those really the abuse and 176 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:35,720 Speaker 1: the bullying that I experienced that was still just like 177 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:39,280 Speaker 1: rooted in me. So I think there's so many factors 178 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 1: that can lead to it, but suicide at its most 179 00:08:41,559 --> 00:08:43,920 Speaker 1: basic level is just when your pain is higher than 180 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 1: your ability to cope. And having talked to thousands of 181 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 1: people who feel that way, we lose almost fifty thousand 182 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: people a year in the US, by the way, But 183 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:53,880 Speaker 1: having talked to so many people, almost everybody says they 184 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:55,839 Speaker 1: don't actually want to die, they just don't know how 185 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 1: to end the pain that they're experiencing. And so that's 186 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,680 Speaker 1: what we're fighting against. And that's where I was too. 187 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:06,319 Speaker 1: It was I couldn't see another way through it. And 188 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: the truth is, your brain gets sick. They've done brain 189 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:12,119 Speaker 1: scans of people who have mental illness or who feel suicidal, 190 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:14,000 Speaker 1: and parts of your brain don't light up the way 191 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:15,960 Speaker 1: that it should, including the part of your brain that 192 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:20,040 Speaker 1: controls empathy. So you're already feeling hopeless, you're not experiencing life, 193 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 1: you're not feeling the hope and the love of your 194 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 1: family and friends. You're kind of distorted, honestly, like your 195 00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:28,439 Speaker 1: brain is a little bit sick and twisted and you're 196 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:31,840 Speaker 1: not seeing and experiencing things that they really are. But 197 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 1: the good news is that we can talk about this stuff. 198 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 1: You know, all the research shows talking about it doesn't 199 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:38,840 Speaker 1: make it any more likely someone will attempt. In fact, 200 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:41,440 Speaker 1: it makes it much more likely they'll seek help. That's 201 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:43,520 Speaker 1: just kind of an old lie that's out there and 202 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:46,080 Speaker 1: old myths like these things are okay to talk about. 203 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 1: We know that it's everywhere, and so the more that 204 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,200 Speaker 1: we normalize it, the more that we make it okay 205 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 1: to open that door. The more that we talk about 206 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:57,440 Speaker 1: ways to get through it, whether that's therapy, maybe that's medication, 207 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 1: maybe that's just lifestyle changes. All of that is so 208 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 1: important so that someone in their lowest moment can see 209 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: other people like me who've been through it, who've gotten 210 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:08,440 Speaker 1: through it, then they can make a choice. They can 211 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: make a choice to reach out for help, to open 212 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,040 Speaker 1: up and to keep fighting through the pain that they're experiencing. 213 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 2: How did you get to this point of wanting to 214 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:27,679 Speaker 2: live of living recklessly aligned? Though? I mean, what did 215 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 2: you do in your life to get to this point? 216 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 1: So it is something I still struggle with, you know, 217 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: I wish I could tell you that after I survived, 218 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 1: it was just immediately healed. And I do believe that 219 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: God can do that in people's lives, but for a 220 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 1: lot of us that's not the case. And so it 221 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: was a couple of things. Immediately after the attempts. The 222 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:45,640 Speaker 1: first thing I did was and this is a challenge 223 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 1: that I give in the first week of my book, 224 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 1: but I say, just do one simple thing every day 225 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 1: to make your life better or make the world a 226 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 1: better place. Just one and then take a picture of it. 227 00:10:55,120 --> 00:10:58,240 Speaker 1: Whether that's texting a friend, cleaning out one closet, doing 228 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:01,240 Speaker 1: one pay one bill that you've been a whatever that 229 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:03,760 Speaker 1: long list of stressful things are in your life. Do 230 00:11:03,880 --> 00:11:06,320 Speaker 1: one each day, take a photo and then keep that 231 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:08,440 Speaker 1: in an album. And after my attempt I did that 232 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 1: for almost five months, and anytime I was feeling low, 233 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:14,240 Speaker 1: I would just look at the pictures in my phone 234 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 1: as proof that I can make my life better. We 235 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,839 Speaker 1: all have the power. Depression loves to lie to us 236 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 1: and say that you're stuck, that you're worthless, things will 237 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 1: never get better, and that's just not true. We have 238 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 1: the power to take small daily actions to make our 239 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 1: lives better, and that's the heart behind the book is 240 00:11:30,760 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 1: I wanted something each morning that someone could read or 241 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:36,800 Speaker 1: listen to. I also recorded the audiobook that's just Little 242 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:38,920 Speaker 1: Stories of My Life, those little things that I talk 243 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 1: about self talk, self worth, resilience, and just soundbites Little Morning, 244 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: Little Morning, kind of a devotional that says, Hey, whatever 245 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:50,079 Speaker 1: you're going through, you can make it through. Believe in yourself, 246 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:52,199 Speaker 1: and one day at a time things can get better. 247 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 2: Did you see there was a viral video in the 248 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 2: past couple weeks of a police officer talking a man 249 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:01,400 Speaker 2: off a bridge in Florida? Did you see that? And 250 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 2: that was pretty powerful to me because it was selling 251 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:07,200 Speaker 2: that man who was on the bridge the truth that 252 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:11,199 Speaker 2: you're feeding yourself lies, that you're going to hurt people, 253 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 2: and that people need you. What did you see in 254 00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 2: that video that you thought was the right thing to do? 255 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 2: And that would that is useful for other people to 256 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:21,440 Speaker 2: to kind of duplicate. 257 00:12:22,520 --> 00:12:27,960 Speaker 1: I think just the human connection, the empathy that taking 258 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 1: a moment to stop and listen to someone and look 259 00:12:30,679 --> 00:12:33,439 Speaker 1: them in their eyes. I think our lot, our world 260 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 1: is so lost around this idea of connection. We're so busy, 261 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:40,840 Speaker 1: we're so buried in our devices, and when I'm struggling. 262 00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:42,880 Speaker 1: The best gift you can give me is just a 263 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 1: listening year. You don't have to fix it, you don't 264 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: have to have the right words. It can simply just 265 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 1: sound like, wow, thank you so much for telling me 266 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 1: all that I didn't I didn't know you were in 267 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:53,559 Speaker 1: so much pain. I'm here for you. We're going to 268 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:56,400 Speaker 1: figure it out together. I'm not afraid of this and 269 00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:59,160 Speaker 1: just letting someone have that moment to feel seen and 270 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:02,320 Speaker 1: to feel heard, because that's what so many people need 271 00:13:02,360 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 1: in their pain. At least that's what I needed in 272 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,240 Speaker 1: my pain, was just people to understand it, to try 273 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 1: to be in it with me, and then to not 274 00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: be afraid to take those next steps and help me 275 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 1: on my path to feeling better. 276 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 2: Just talk for a brief moment about what scripture says 277 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:21,960 Speaker 2: or how scripture addresses depression and suicide. For a believer 278 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:24,080 Speaker 2: who's listening to this and struggling with their mental health 279 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:28,679 Speaker 2: right now, what would you tell them about what God thinks? 280 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,840 Speaker 1: The Bible has so many examples of While we don't 281 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:36,920 Speaker 1: have the language of depression and suicidal thoughts, there's so 282 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:40,560 Speaker 1: many places in scripture where you read people say things 283 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:43,080 Speaker 1: like oh, I'm not sure I want to be alive. 284 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 1: The psalms are filled with them. Jonah Jonah said, now, o, Lord, 285 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:50,280 Speaker 1: take away my life, for it is better for me 286 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:53,120 Speaker 1: to die than to live. Job said, why did I 287 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:55,440 Speaker 1: not perish at birth and die as I came from 288 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: the womb? There's just psalms. I am worn out from 289 00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 1: my groaning All night long, I fled my bed with 290 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,640 Speaker 1: weeping and drenched my couch with tears. My eyes grow 291 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: weak and sorrow. They fail because of all my foes. 292 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 1: And so when I after my attempts, I started to 293 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: read more scripture, I started to decide, Hey, I need 294 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 1: to I'm going to run through all my decisions through God. 295 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:19,440 Speaker 1: You know, I'm gonna ask God. Like clearly, all the 296 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 1: choices I was making led me to a place where 297 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:24,240 Speaker 1: I didn't even want to be alive. So I started saying, Okay, 298 00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 1: I'm gonna ask God. If this feels like something God 299 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 1: will want me to do, I'm gonna do that. And 300 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 1: in that process is I spent more time in a scripture. 301 00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 1: I realized, Oh, like, this isn't something new to God. 302 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:37,320 Speaker 1: This has been a part of the human experience for 303 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 1: thousands of years. We maybe didn't have the language, and 304 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: we maybe didn't have the science that we had today. 305 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 1: But a lot of these things very much sound like 306 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: what it sounds like when I am struggling, and that, 307 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:50,680 Speaker 1: strangely gave me a lot of comfort because it showed 308 00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:52,800 Speaker 1: me that, hey, this is an okay thing to talk about. 309 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:55,360 Speaker 1: God's been giving us stories. Job's one of the oldest 310 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 1: stories in the entire Bible, and it's all about a 311 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: guy who talks about maybe I don't want to alive. 312 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: And so I think, if you are struggling a we 313 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,920 Speaker 1: can't expect just faith to fix it all the time. Absolutely, 314 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,920 Speaker 1: use scripture and use God, but also please reach out 315 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 1: to the medicine and the tools that we have. We 316 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: want both of those things to work together. I felt 317 00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 1: like I was failing spiritually for a long time when 318 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 1: I was suicidal, and that wasn't true at all, and 319 00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:22,560 Speaker 1: in fact, I was leaning on God more than ever, 320 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:24,800 Speaker 1: But yet I had this deep emptiness in me. And 321 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 1: it's because my brain was sick, not because I was 322 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:30,000 Speaker 1: doing something wrong or I wasn't following Jesus correctly. So 323 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:32,480 Speaker 1: both of those things can be true, but to anybody listening, 324 00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: it's you don't need to abandon or lose your faith 325 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 1: and maybe seek out some of those parts of the 326 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 1: Bible that feel like what you feel like, whether that's 327 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 1: psalms or job or something like that. 328 00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:48,040 Speaker 2: What role does community play in combating mental health and 329 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 2: depression and suicide. 330 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 1: I think it's essential. I think we weren't meant to 331 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: spend so much time by ourselves that I don't even 332 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 1: think we were meant to live alone as much as 333 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:00,920 Speaker 1: so many of us do. And for a lot of 334 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 1: us who struggle, it's like we don't want to have 335 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 1: to go out and fake it. That's how I felt. 336 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: It was like when you go to church and there's 337 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:09,280 Speaker 1: like this idea that we all have to be happy 338 00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:11,400 Speaker 1: all of the time. And so it's how do we 339 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:13,680 Speaker 1: allow people into our spaces to just show up as 340 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:15,880 Speaker 1: they are. We don't have to expect them. You know, 341 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 1: you're welcome here. Whether you're having the best day of 342 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 1: your life or the worst day of your life, you 343 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: don't you don't have to pretend that everything's okay. So 344 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:24,920 Speaker 1: it's not just the community peace that is important, but 345 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: because you but you can feel completely alone in a 346 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: crowded room if nobody wants to see you and actually 347 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 1: check in with how you are. So it's both things. 348 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:36,080 Speaker 1: It's those of us that struggle. We do need to 349 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 1: push ourselves out into the world. We need to get 350 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:41,800 Speaker 1: into spaces where there are more people, and even when 351 00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 1: we don't feel like it, probably especially when we don't 352 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:47,320 Speaker 1: feel like it. This psychology term is opposite to emotion, 353 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:49,560 Speaker 1: so it's sometimes you have to do the thing you 354 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 1: don't feel like doing in order to feel better. And 355 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: sometimes that's just I'm going to go to church and 356 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 1: I'm going to decide when I get there how I'm 357 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 1: going to experience it. You know, maybe you do want 358 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 1: to sit alone, but usually once I get there, I 359 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:04,639 Speaker 1: feel better. I've gotten through that brain fog of like 360 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,680 Speaker 1: I don't want to do this. And then it's finding 361 00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:09,560 Speaker 1: a few people that you can trust that you can 362 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 1: check in with. And not everybody's perfect, not everybody's going 363 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:14,320 Speaker 1: to have the tools to sit with you in some 364 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: of these deep things. But that also doesn't mean that 365 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:18,800 Speaker 1: everyone's bad and that they don't care about you or 366 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 1: they don't want you there. Both of those things can 367 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 1: be true. So we all need to be a good 368 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,159 Speaker 1: person to listen to you and not expect everyone to 369 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 1: be happy and perfect all the time, and those of 370 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:30,440 Speaker 1: us that struggle need to be brave, and we need 371 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 1: to put ourselves out there a little bit and see 372 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 1: what the world and what God might have for us. 373 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:38,879 Speaker 2: Perhaps this is the final question where you sam, what 374 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 2: is the biggest takeaway and that you want readers to 375 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 2: take away from this book. You can do this. 376 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:49,240 Speaker 1: So the book itself isn't about suicide at all. It 377 00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:52,919 Speaker 1: is about self care, it's about purpose, it's about resilience. 378 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:55,439 Speaker 1: But really I designed it to feel like a friend 379 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 1: sitting with you each morning, and even more so, I 380 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 1: hoped that it would be a gift of connection. I 381 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:05,920 Speaker 1: meet so many parents, grandparents, teachers, community members who see 382 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:07,840 Speaker 1: someone in their life who is struggling and they don't 383 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:09,879 Speaker 1: know what to do. And so my hope is that 384 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: the book can be that moment of connection where you 385 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:14,400 Speaker 1: can just give them this gift, whether maybe it's graduation 386 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 1: or a birthday, and you're just saying, hey, I am 387 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 1: here for you, I see you, I want to encourage 388 00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:22,960 Speaker 1: you through this. Because that's what I wanted. I wanted 389 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:26,399 Speaker 1: moments of connection. I didn't want just cold advice. I 390 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:31,120 Speaker 1: wanted a friendly support system. And so that's my hope 391 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:33,240 Speaker 1: for you can do this, that people feel seen, that 392 00:18:33,280 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 1: they feel encouraged, and that caregivers also have something that 393 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:38,360 Speaker 1: they can share with the people they love. 394 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 2: If you like today's episode, please subscribe and leave a 395 00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 2: five star review. That's how we help more people just 396 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 2: like you find the show. 397 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:50,200 Speaker 3: A big thanks to the team at life Audio for 398 00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:53,159 Speaker 3: their partnership with us on the podcast. If you go 399 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 3: to lifeaudio dot com, you will find dozens of other 400 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,160 Speaker 3: faith centered podcasts in their network. 401 00:18:58,600 --> 00:18:59,400 Speaker 2: See you next time.