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Speaker 1: My name is Charlie kirk I run the largest pro

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Speaker 1: American student organization in the country, fighting for the future

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Speaker 1: of our republic.

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Speaker 2: My call is to fight evil and to proclaim truth.

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Speaker 1: If the most important thing for you is just feeling good,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna end up miserable. But if the most important

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Speaker 1: thing is doing good, you'll end up purposeful. College is

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Speaker 1: a scam, everybody. You got to stop sending your kids

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Speaker 1: to college. You should get married as young as possible

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Speaker 1: and have as many kids as possible. Go start at

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Speaker 1: turning point. You would say college chapter. Go start aturning point,

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Speaker 1: yould say high school chapter.

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Speaker 3: Go find out how your church can get involved. Sign

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Speaker 3: up and become an activist.

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Speaker 1: I gave my life to the Lord in fifth grade,

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Speaker 1: most important decision I ever made in my life, and

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Speaker 1: I encourage you to do the same.

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Speaker 3: Here I am.

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Speaker 2: Lord, Use me.

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Speaker 1: Buckle up, everybody, Here we go. Noble Gold Investments is

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Speaker 1: the official gold sponsor of the Charlie Kirkshaw, a company

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Speaker 1: that specializes in gold I rays and physical delivery of

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Speaker 1: precious metals. Learn how you could protect your wealth with

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Speaker 1: Noble Gold Investments at noblegold investments dot Com. That is

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Speaker 1: Noblegoldinvestments dot Com.

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Speaker 4: All right, welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show. I'm Andrew Colvid.

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Speaker 4: I'm in our Nation's lovely capital, and Blake is holding

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Speaker 4: it down in the y REFI Studios and Phoenix, Arizona.

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Speaker 3: How we doing.

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Speaker 5: Mike's mine? The mic flag is mine once again.

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Speaker 4: You know it's eventually Daisy's going to figure this out

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Speaker 4: and we're all gonna be able to share multiple mic flags.

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Speaker 4: Until then, Blake's holding it down in the y REF Studios.

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Speaker 4: We had an amazing weekend in DC, and what a

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Speaker 4: blessing it was to Blake because obviously the week was

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Speaker 4: super challenging. All you and I did was basically watch

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Speaker 4: the preliminary hearing we posted about on social we covered

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Speaker 4: it during this show, or we watched it live on

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Speaker 4: this show, and then we covered it at night. So

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Speaker 4: thank you so much to all of you who tuned

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Speaker 4: into that. Those episodes did monster numbers, so I know

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Speaker 4: a lot of you were interested in hearing about it

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Speaker 4: and bringing in Graham Allen and Brandon Tatum and Jack

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Speaker 4: Pasobic and all those who were in the courtroom, along

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Speaker 4: with all the experts that we brought in to help

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Speaker 4: break it all down. So in all, it was a

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Speaker 4: really tough week. And you know, Erica had you know,

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Speaker 4: we had planned CLS Chapter Leadership summit in DC a

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Speaker 4: long long time ago, and then the judge postponed the

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Speaker 4: preliminary hearing. Was originally supposed to be in April, and

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Speaker 4: it was in May, and then it got moved to

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Speaker 4: this front part of July. So it just fell right

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Speaker 4: in the middle of it. And actually I said this

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Speaker 4: to some people, Blake, it ended up being I feel

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Speaker 4: like providential timing because it gave us an opportunity and

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Speaker 4: gave Erica an opportunity to go from what was a

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Speaker 4: really challenging, emotional week watching and reliving those details from

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Speaker 4: that terrible day, to then going to be around thousands

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Speaker 4: of students in Washington, d C. Getting too experience firsthand

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Speaker 4: what turning point is building all across the country chapter

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Speaker 4: by chapter and then getting to meet them. And then

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Speaker 4: Blake and I had the opportunity to sit down for

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Speaker 4: multiple roundtables with high school students, with college students all

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Speaker 4: across the country to hear directly from them. And we're

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Speaker 4: Blake and I'm sure we'll get a chance to tell

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Speaker 4: you more about that, but we'll be releasing that.

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Speaker 3: Footage very soon.

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Speaker 4: In the meantime, I want to play some of these

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Speaker 4: clips because they're excellent from Erica, who just gave such

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Speaker 4: an amazing, amazing speech at CLS and by the way,

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Speaker 4: just made us so proud. I'm sure she made Charlie

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Speaker 4: so proud. Top five.

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Speaker 6: You do the hard thing, you do the right thing,

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Speaker 6: and that's what my husband did every single.

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Speaker 4: Day's she's just really just hitting home run after home

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Speaker 4: run in this thing.

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Speaker 3: Let's go ahead, SOT six.

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Speaker 6: My husband built this movement.

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Speaker 5: He built this machine.

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Speaker 6: And I watched him do it, and I stood by

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Speaker 6: his side through every sleepless night, through every moment of concern,

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Speaker 6: through every phone call, through every high, through every low,

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Speaker 6: of the things he could control and the things he couldn't.

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Speaker 6: I was there, and I have seen my husband build this,

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Speaker 6: and he has entrusted it to all of us.

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Speaker 4: Blake any thoughts as we go through these, no, I

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Speaker 4: just think it's it really speaks to everything we're aiming

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Speaker 4: to do here.

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Speaker 7: Last week we considered it incredibly important, of course to

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Speaker 7: cover the hearing, make sure everyone's following that, but at

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Speaker 7: the same time, the work does go on, and Charlie's

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Speaker 7: work is not being We're not pursuing Charlie's work in

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Speaker 7: a courtman in Utah. We're pursuing it across the country

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Speaker 7: with the young people, the schoolers, the college kids, the

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Speaker 7: young adults who are trying to transform this country, revitalize

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Speaker 7: this country, change the change the course of this country,

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Speaker 7: and bring about a faith revival.

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Speaker 5: And you do that through the work of Turning Point USA.

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Speaker 7: And one of the key ways we do that is

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Speaker 7: through our chapters and through our events, and you put

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Speaker 7: those things together and the chapter leadership something.

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Speaker 5: It was just tremendous.

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Speaker 7: I had a tremendous time there, not just in those

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Speaker 7: panels that you and I were doing, but I when

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Speaker 7: we weren't doing those, I tried to just wander around

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Speaker 7: the floor and talk to the different people, and I

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Speaker 7: heard so many incredible testimonies. I talked to students who said,

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Speaker 7: I got baptized after what happened to Charlie. I completely

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Speaker 7: transformed my life. I met person after person with testimony

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Speaker 7: like that. And I think it speaks immensely to Erica

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Speaker 7: that she spent that whole exhausting week in Utah and

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Speaker 7: immediately turned around flew out to run and speak at

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Speaker 7: this event, because that is that's what needs to get done.

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Speaker 7: That's that's how the work is going to be continued

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Speaker 7: in the years and we hope decades to come.

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Speaker 3: Blake. Uh.

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Speaker 4: One of the things I was struck by was there

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Speaker 4: was a reporter there that I spoke to briefly, and

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Speaker 4: his line to me was pretty profound. He said, I

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Speaker 4: just love interacting with these students. They are so untouched

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Speaker 4: by cynicism, They're so enthusiastic. And I'm telling you everybody

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Speaker 4: in this audience that maybe is looking at the chaos

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Speaker 4: on social media.

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Speaker 3: Or what's going on in Iran or and we're going

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Speaker 3: to get.

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Speaker 4: Into, you know, Lindsey Graham, maybe even some of the

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Speaker 4: conspiracies around that story, which which are were inevitable.

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Speaker 3: Let's be honest.

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Speaker 4: But if you get distracted or you get discouraged, if

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Speaker 4: you spend some time around some Turning Point students, it

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Speaker 4: will give you hope, like you wouldn't believe. It is

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Speaker 4: an absolute white pill. How dedicated they are there, the

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Speaker 4: way they speak about their faith, the way they speak

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Speaker 4: about what Charlie meant to them, what Turning Point means

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Speaker 4: to them.

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Speaker 3: It is an absolute.

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Speaker 4: White pill and I can't wait to get those panels

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Speaker 4: out Blake, because it was really fascinating. You get inside

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Speaker 4: the mind of a gen Z. And by the way,

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Speaker 4: some of these high school students we talked to in

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Speaker 4: that one panel, Blake, they're born in two thousand and eight,

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Speaker 4: two thousand and nine.

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Speaker 5: It was incredible.

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Speaker 3: I remember the tail end of gen Z.

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Speaker 7: They were, yeah, they're born They're born in two thousand

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Speaker 7: and eight, so they they basically have no memory even

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Speaker 7: of Barack Obama living winning an election.

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Speaker 5: And you mentioned they're so upbeat, and that's so tremendous.

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Speaker 7: To me because I feel that nostalgia is such a

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Speaker 7: big part of magets, people who think, wow, America was

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Speaker 7: winning so hard in the eighties, in the nineties, post

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Speaker 7: nine to eleven went downhill.

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Speaker 5: These are kids who never had the blessing.

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Speaker 7: To live through it where it just felt like America

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Speaker 7: was firing on all cinders and cylinders. And for them

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Speaker 7: to still be so upbeat, to believe so powerfully in

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Speaker 7: what this country can do and how we can revitalize that,

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Speaker 7: that's tremendous.

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Speaker 5: It's such a testament to Charlie.

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Speaker 7: I want to make sure we play another one of

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Speaker 7: these Eric eclips because I think it really speaks to

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Speaker 7: the dynamic we were going for.

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Speaker 5: Let's play clip eate.

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Speaker 6: This past week, I have seen something I will I'm

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Speaker 6: still trying to unpack and put into words. And someone

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Speaker 6: asked me do you still want to go to the

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Speaker 6: Chapter leadership summit? And I sat there and I thought,

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Speaker 6: if you don't fight for what's right, I would much

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Speaker 6: rather our country look like this room than the inside

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Speaker 6: of that courtroom.

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Speaker 5: And that got it.

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Speaker 7: That got a huge cheer afterwards, which it was cut

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Speaker 7: off there. But it really is that we want, we

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Speaker 7: want this country to be all those kids in that

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Speaker 7: room who believe in faith, who believe in America, who

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Speaker 7: believe that whatever challenges there are, they can be overcome.

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Speaker 5: And I just love this event.

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Speaker 7: You see so much youthful energy, you see so much optimism.

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Speaker 7: Uh I I found myself odd by the people who

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Speaker 7: come out who want to pursue Charlie's legacy.

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Speaker 5: They are they are better people than I am, I

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Speaker 5: can say.

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Speaker 4: And for those who are just wondering, no, this is

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Speaker 4: not There's no adults at this event. It's just thousands

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Speaker 4: of students. There's no, there's no nothing. It's just students

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Speaker 4: doing training, getting together, meeting each other, getting equipped to

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Speaker 4: go back out and take their chapters to the next level.

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Speaker 4: And it was over two x the largest chapter leadership

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Speaker 4: summit in Turning Boyt history. So lots to be grateful

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Speaker 4: for today. All right, So we have we have some

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Speaker 4: polling that we did there, just getting their top issues

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Speaker 4: in rank order. So it's kind of a The graph

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Speaker 4: is tricky, so the top is the most important, the

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Speaker 4: bottom is the least important.

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Speaker 3: Right, So they're I guess relative confidence.

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Speaker 4: So free speech was actually young people's at cls's biggest concern,

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Speaker 4: which I think was interesting simply because they're I think,

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Speaker 4: being inundated with information and news stories like the UK

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Speaker 4: is banning social media.

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Speaker 3: They're being told what they can and can't look at.

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Speaker 4: One of the things that emerged from our conversations we

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Speaker 4: asked a bunch of high school kids and college kids,

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Speaker 4: what do you think about, you know, banning social media

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Speaker 4: for young people? And I think they were all basically

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Speaker 4: against it, right, but they wanted to pursue other ways

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Speaker 4: of how do you use it responsibly? How do we

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Speaker 4: be taught to look at source information and things like that.

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Speaker 4: But they acknowledged that there's a lot of slap and

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Speaker 4: a lot of disinformation on social media, but they certainly

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Speaker 4: don't want to be limited in their ability to use it.

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Speaker 4: Am I addressing that correctly?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, exactly, And yeah, just to emphasize to people, so

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Speaker 7: smaller number. It was all they were asked to rank

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Speaker 7: all of these issues in order, and it's sort of

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Speaker 7: their average number. So free speech on average was around fourth,

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Speaker 7: but rankings were all over the place, so that was

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Speaker 7: enough for first place. I think it's reassuring. Number two

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Speaker 7: here is right to life and abortion number two issue.

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Speaker 7: I think that speaks to the type of people who

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Speaker 7: are getting who it speaks to the type of people

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Speaker 7: who really get invested in politics, that young people still

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Speaker 7: care a lot about that issue, they still want to

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Speaker 7: pursue it. And I know Charlie cared a lot about that.

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Speaker 7: You care a lot, I care a lot. So I'm

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Speaker 7: very glad to see that. The third issue political violence. Obviously,

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Speaker 7: that's all very personal to us, and I think that's

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Speaker 7: exactly what all of them were thinking about when they

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Speaker 7: decided where to place that. I would say one that

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Speaker 7: continues to surprise me. AI never ranks very high on this.

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Speaker 7: I think when we asked people at Amfest last year,

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Speaker 7: it may literally have been dead last in terms of

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Speaker 7: issues people were thinking about. And here it's near dead last,

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Speaker 7: ahead only ahead of only the environment and legacy media.

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Speaker 7: I'm not I'm not even sure what that means. And

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Speaker 7: not surprisingly, it was basically in dead last there. So

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Speaker 7: I find all of those numbers. Yeah, confidence in legacy media. Uh,

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Speaker 7: I guess maybe trying to rebuild confidence that might be

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Speaker 7: what it means. But uh, cost of living only about

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Speaker 7: about in the middle I would have been. I wouldn't

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Speaker 7: have been surprised if that was higher.

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Speaker 5: Uh. So that's what stands out to me in this one.

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Speaker 4: That's what's something That's something that came up a lot

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Speaker 4: in our conversations actually, is how much these young kids

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Speaker 4: were focused on the economy, affordability, housing in conversation. They

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Speaker 4: certainly seem to be fixated on it, and it's and

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Speaker 4: it's it really is how much is that tank of

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Speaker 4: gas going to cost me to fill up my car?

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Speaker 6: It?

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Speaker 4: How much did that burrito I bought at lunch cost me.

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Speaker 4: That's the way that these kids are processing economics and

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Speaker 4: affordability because it's it's you know, they're not necessarily investing

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Speaker 4: in equities yet, they're not ready to buy a home.

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Speaker 3: They're not thinking about this.

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Speaker 4: And by the way, all of the kids that we

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Speaker 4: spoke to, every single last one of them, are going

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Speaker 4: to be voters in twenty twenty eight. Most of them

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Speaker 4: will be voters in twenty twenty six, so for the midterms.

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Speaker 4: So when we talk about these issues, I think it's

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Speaker 4: really helpful for the larger audience to understand and bring

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Speaker 4: it home for them of you know, it's literally that

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Speaker 4: that's what they mentioned. A burrito should not cost twenty bucks,

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Speaker 4: and they're right, a burrito shouldn't cost twenty bucks. But

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Speaker 4: then you educate them on, you know, what it means

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Speaker 4: to print money and to inflate the value of equities.

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Speaker 4: Economic incumbents have the advantage when inflation strikes. So when

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Speaker 4: you educate them on these things, they sort of pick

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Speaker 4: it up and they go, yeah, you're right, you're right, Okay,

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Speaker 4: that makes sense. We you know, twenty nine twenty eight

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Speaker 4: percent inflation over four years with Joe Biden money printing

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Speaker 4: out the wazoo during COVID, all of these things make

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Speaker 4: sense to them. Once you explain it to them, but

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Speaker 4: sometimes you have to explain the basics before you get

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Speaker 4: to write thinking and proper thinking.

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Speaker 7: Danny points out something pretty smart, which is cost of

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Speaker 7: living was only in the middle. But he points out

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Speaker 7: if they're in high school, even if they're in college,

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Speaker 7: a lot of them, they still live at home. They

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Speaker 7: might get subsidized by their parents. It's not quite real yet.

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Speaker 7: It's when you get thrown into the pool on the

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Speaker 7: deep end of adulthood that it really starts to stand

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Speaker 7: out to you. And then if we were doing this

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Speaker 7: event for people who were twenty seven, this might be

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Speaker 7: all the way.

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Speaker 5: Up at the top.

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Speaker 7: As a result, I think another thing worth flagging foreign affairs.

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Speaker 7: Foreign policy in general, it's in the bottom third of

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Speaker 7: the list on average, ranked almost tenth place, and national

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Speaker 7: security is a bit higher. But you can link that

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Speaker 7: to immigration, which it's right alongside. I think something we

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Speaker 7: saw repeatedly was people do want a government that's very

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Speaker 7: focused on America, on American issues, on domestic stuff. A

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Speaker 7: lot of them when we had those panels, they said

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Speaker 7: they were willing to trust President Trump's decision making on

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Speaker 7: Iran on foreign policy questions, but their ideal was still

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Speaker 7: a government that is very clearly domestically focused in its orientation,

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Speaker 7: and I think that this list bears that out.

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Speaker 4: One of the things it's interesting is a lot of

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Speaker 4: these kids are pretty radical on immigration, but to see

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Speaker 4: it in the aggregate where it's the fact that it's

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Speaker 4: not a top three issue, I think speaks to the

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Speaker 4: fact that it is one of those issues when you

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Speaker 4: have success with it, we close down the border and

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Speaker 4: the illegal crossings that unfortunately people forget about it. It's

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Speaker 4: just one of those things where if you fix a problem,

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Speaker 4: it's almost hard to get credit for it because it's

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Speaker 4: not in the headlines anymore. So it falls off people's

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Speaker 4: top list. Now there is much more interest in when

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Speaker 4: you start talking about H one b's when you start

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Speaker 4: talking about job prospects, when you start talking about legal immigration,

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Speaker 4: the kid's ears perk up, and there is a lot

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Speaker 4: of interest in that. But I just one observation that

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Speaker 4: it's not higher simply because it's not a dramatic crisis.

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Speaker 4: You know, you're not seeing images of caravans crossing over

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Speaker 4: the southern border anymore like we were seeing under Biden,

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Speaker 4: and so it's falling down the priority list and I

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Speaker 4: just hope that we can translate that electorally and make

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Speaker 4: sure that President Trump gets the proper credit for it,

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Speaker 4: and the Conservatives do. If you could go back in

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Speaker 4: time and buy oil before the world relied on it,

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Speaker 4: would you?

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Speaker 5: Of course you would.

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Speaker 4: Anybody would, So why aren't you buying silver right now?

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Speaker 4: The people who recognized oil early didn't just make money,

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Speaker 4: They got ahead of one of the biggest economic shifts

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Speaker 4: in history, and today a similar opportunity is unfolding with silver.

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Speaker 4: Silver is more than a precious metal. It's a critical

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Speaker 4: resource used in solar panels, electric vehicles, defend systems AI infrastructure,

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Speaker 4: in the massive data centers powering that digital world. While

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Speaker 4: demand keeps growing, it's still affordable enough that the average

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Speaker 4: American can start accumulating it right now. That's why investors

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Speaker 4: are turning to silver to protect against inflation and to

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Speaker 4: own one of the world's most important strategic resources. Don't

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Speaker 4: be the person who looks back in ten years and

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Speaker 4: says I saw it coming, I just didn't act. Visit

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Speaker 4: Noble Gold Investments dot com slash Kirk and learn how

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Speaker 4: easy it is to own physical silver. That's Noblegold Investments

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Speaker 4: dot Com. Slash Kirk own the metal. The future depends

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Speaker 4: on all Right, guys, we've got Graham Allen. He's a

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Speaker 4: great guy, great patriot, he's been a great friend, and

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Speaker 4: he was in the courtroom all last week. So I

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Speaker 4: want to get to that eventually. But first, Graham, you

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Speaker 4: are living in South Carolina. You've run for office in

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Speaker 4: South Carolina and obviously we lost.

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Speaker 5: Lean Were you named after Lindsay Graham?

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Speaker 8: Not to my knowledge, No, No, I think.

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Speaker 3: You predate his political rise, maybe Graham. Yeah, so tell

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Speaker 3: us the ground. Yeah, what are you hearing on the

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Speaker 3: ground in South Carolina.

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Speaker 8: Well, the President just made a post that he recommended

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Speaker 8: the governor McMasters that Lindsy Graham's sister be the interim

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Speaker 8: to serve out the end of their term. Look, it's

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Speaker 8: pretty simple. This is going to be a three week race,

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Speaker 8: the filing period of July twenty first through the twenty eighth,

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Speaker 8: and then the special election or special primary election will

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Speaker 8: be August eleventh. I mean that's a a three week so,

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Speaker 8: I mean this is going to be Honestly, it's whoever

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Speaker 8: gets the President's endorsement is who it's going to be.

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Speaker 8: I've heard names float around pan evet, Ralph Norman, Nancy Mace.

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Speaker 8: I've even heard former congressman, former governors things like that.

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Speaker 8: Here's what I'll say, and this is a Graham Allen take.

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Speaker 8: And this is one reason why me and the sc

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Speaker 8: GOP don't always see I. I don't think that people

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Speaker 8: that just got skull dragged in a statewide race should

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Speaker 8: be given a consolation prize of a Senate seat. Senate

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Speaker 8: seats do not come open often in South Carolina. I

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Speaker 8: think that this is an opportunity for the president to

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Speaker 8: take a moment, Susie Wiles, James Blair, all of them

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Speaker 8: to take a moment. The President gets to make a

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Speaker 8: decision on who to put his endorsement behind without the

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Speaker 8: concern of potentially ticking off the scg OP because he's

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Speaker 8: not he is not putting together a presidential campaign. This

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Speaker 8: is the first time in a long time that the

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Speaker 8: president has a chance to make a selection based off

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Speaker 8: who he thinks the best fighter will be. As we know,

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Speaker 8: we have a whole new era of Democrats socialists that

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Speaker 8: are making it through their primaries right now. We've got

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Speaker 8: a whole new fight going on the hill, in the

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Speaker 8: House and in the Senate. I think that this is

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Speaker 8: an opportunity to take just a minute, and hey, I

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Speaker 8: think it needs to be somebody younger. I don't think

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Speaker 8: we need to put a seventy year old person in

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Speaker 8: the Senate seat. I think we need somebody that there's

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Speaker 8: got to be. There's got to be somebody in the

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Speaker 8: state of South Carolina that can be a fighter for

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Speaker 8: the President and the American First agenda. And there's got

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Speaker 8: to be somebody that can be agile and adapt to

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Speaker 8: the battles that are coming very soon to DC at

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Speaker 8: the House floor and in the House, in the Senate.

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Speaker 8: That's my personal opinion.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, no, I think that's I think that's right. I'm

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Speaker 4: not opposed. I think Blake and I were talking before

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Speaker 4: the show to his sister. You know, for those who

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Speaker 4: aren't aware, his sister was often featured in campaign ads.

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Speaker 3: He adopted.

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Speaker 4: So I guess they grew up in the back of

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Speaker 4: a of a bar, like a house on the backside

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Speaker 4: of a bar or something like that in central South Carolina,

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Speaker 4: and he both their parents died pretty young, and so

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Speaker 4: Lindsay Graham adopted his then thirteen year old sister, and

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Speaker 4: they were devoted to each other and it was actually

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Speaker 4: kind of a touching story. I had a ton of

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Speaker 4: political disagreements with Lindsay Graham. As a matter of fact.

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Speaker 4: As soon as I got the news, I was like, man,

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Speaker 4: I definitely tweeted some harsh things about Lindsey Graham in

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Speaker 4: the last couple of months, and you know, I so.

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Speaker 4: But whatever my disagreements were with the guy, it sounds

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Speaker 4: like from people's recounting of their interactions their friendships with him,

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Speaker 4: that he was amicable, that he was willing to let

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Speaker 4: political disagreements not in impact his friendship towards people. By

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Speaker 4: the way, I heard a crazy stat you know, the

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Speaker 4: guy died with apparently a one point two million dollar

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Speaker 4: net worth, Right, So this was not a guy that

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Speaker 4: was enriching himself off of the war machine that he

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Speaker 4: celebrated so much. Right, And so for all his faults,

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Speaker 4: you know, we want to say nice things about the dead,

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Speaker 4: and I don't gloat or rejoice in his passing.

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Speaker 5: There's several funny stories.

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Speaker 7: Al Franken, who was a colleague of his in the Senate,

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Speaker 7: has has repeatedly told people Lindsey Graham is the funniest

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Speaker 7: person he knew in the Senate. Apparently at one point

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Speaker 7: he met him in a bathroom or something and told him, Hey,

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Speaker 7: if I were a Republican, i'd vote for you in

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Speaker 7: the presidential election. And he immediately replies, that's my problem.

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Speaker 7: And he had a few fun stories like that. He

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Speaker 7: was You can see how he was such a formidable

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Speaker 7: figure for a long time, despite a lot of critics,

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Speaker 7: including Charlie here. We called him Lady Graham for a reason.

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Speaker 7: He often aggravated us. But he was funny, he was genial,

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Speaker 7: He was a hard worker, and.

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Speaker 5: He didn't give up.

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Speaker 7: And we're grateful for the times where that was to

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Speaker 7: the benefit of this country. We're all remembering how he

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Speaker 7: fought very hard on the Brett Kavanaugh case when it

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Speaker 7: was looking bad. You don't remember that it looked like

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Speaker 7: that nomination might fail, and he stepped up and he

436
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Speaker 7: absolutely destroyed those incredibly bogus allegations against Kavanaugh, fought hard

437
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Speaker 7: for him, and had an amazing photo of him adjusting

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Speaker 7: his tie while some liberal shrieked in the background.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so let's get into just his cause of death though,

440
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,080
Speaker 4: all right. President Trump admitted that he was even confused

441
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:53,399
Speaker 4: about it because he had just been in Ukraine the

442
00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 4: day before, visiting a drone factory. He was scheduled to

443
00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,320
Speaker 4: do Meet the Press on Sunday. This is President Trump

444
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:00,880
Speaker 4: reflecting on that sought four.

445
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,359
Speaker 8: President Trump, thank you for joining us, and my condolences

446
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 8: to you.

447
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,040
Speaker 9: Well, thank you. He's a tough one to lose. He

448
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,800
Speaker 9: was great, he was unique and every way. Actually, what

449
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,720
Speaker 9: makes it even strangers that I got a call last

450
00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 9: night sometime and you know, the early evening, maybe in

451
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 9: the sevens, and he called and he said, we're all

452
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,199
Speaker 9: set for the Save America Act. He was pushing the

453
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 9: Save America Act like crazy. He got back, said he

454
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,520
Speaker 9: just landed from Ukraine, bud. He wanted to pass the

455
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:35,200
Speaker 9: Save America Act. And I said, well, we're going to

456
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 9: get it done, Lindsey, We're going to get it done.

457
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,160
Speaker 9: I'll see you like soon. We thought we might even

458
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 9: meet today, and then that was it.

459
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,159
Speaker 3: So axios is reporting.

460
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:48,199
Speaker 4: A person who spoke with Graham shortly afterwards said that

461
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:50,840
Speaker 4: the senator complained that he was feeling unwell. When the

462
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,000
Speaker 4: person urged him to seek medical attention immediately, Graham said

463
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 4: he would do it Sunday morning, after his scheduled appearance on.

464
00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,120
Speaker 3: Meet the press. Graham then joked, I can't die now.

465
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:01,960
Speaker 4: I still need to do the Russian sanctions, get Aron

466
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 4: sorted out, and do Israeli Saudi normalization.

467
00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:06,280
Speaker 3: He passed away several hours later.

468
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:11,440
Speaker 4: The IRGC then posted a video one of their lego

469
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:16,680
Speaker 4: animation videos depicting Lindsey Graham's sudden death, sort of claiming

470
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:20,640
Speaker 4: credit for it. I tend to be persuaded that this

471
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:22,359
Speaker 4: is not conspiratorial in nature.

472
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:23,360
Speaker 3: He was seventy one.

473
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,320
Speaker 4: It looks like he died of hardening of the arteries,

474
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 4: and the most common cause of death people don't know this,

475
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,960
Speaker 4: especially when you're over a certain age when doing long

476
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 4: international flights, is some sort of cardiac death, whether it's

477
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:39,200
Speaker 4: a heart attack or in this case, an Arctic aortic

478
00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 4: fissure or whatever. So Blake, I see you wanting to

479
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,120
Speaker 4: chime in, Well, it's just yeah, it's if you look

480
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:49,080
Speaker 4: at his family history, his father died of I believe

481
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:52,000
Speaker 4: the exact same thing at the age of sixty nine.

482
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,760
Speaker 4: You have the story here where if he'd gone to

483
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:57,919
Speaker 4: the hospital right away, they probably would have caught that

484
00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 4: this was happening, rushed him into surgery. He might have survived,

485
00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,880
Speaker 4: but he downplayed it, thought it's probably no big deal.

486
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:07,119
Speaker 4: And yeah, aortic dissection a order is the gigantic blood

487
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:11,040
Speaker 4: vessel running directly into your heart dissection coming apart that

488
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 4: if that happens, you.

489
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:14,960
Speaker 5: Are going to die very quickly.

490
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:19,080
Speaker 7: And I understand it's tempting because a lot of people

491
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,720
Speaker 7: didn't like Senator Graham. A lot of people are grossly

492
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,960
Speaker 7: just celebrating his death. But in the end, it is

493
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,520
Speaker 7: a common thing for men in their seventies to die

494
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:33,360
Speaker 7: abruptly of heart attacks, and I think that's likely the case.

495
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:34,880
Speaker 3: Here, Bram.

496
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 4: I want while we have you here, there was you.

497
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 4: You were in the courtroom, and I just I know

498
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 4: this is a brief and a kind of a pivot,

499
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 4: but you saw the enhanced video, and much was made

500
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,640
Speaker 4: over the weekend on social media about this enhanced video

501
00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:52,320
Speaker 4: of Tyler Robinson. I wanted to give you a chance

502
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 4: before we lose you. I know you've got a busy day,

503
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 4: just to chime in on that.

504
00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:56,760
Speaker 3: What was it.

505
00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,080
Speaker 4: It feels like it's a whole exercise in splitting hairs.

506
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 4: But I wanted you get give you a chance, just

507
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 4: to sort of set the record shap what was in

508
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 4: that video?

509
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 3: What do you see and what can you not see?

510
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:05,960
Speaker 3: One minute?

511
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:09,679
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, again to your point, it's semantics. There's a

512
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 8: group of people that, no matter what the evidence is,

513
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 8: they do not believe that the person in that video

514
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:18,040
Speaker 8: was Tyler Robinson. I, based off the evidence I've seen,

515
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 8: do believe that the person in that video is Tyler Robinson.

516
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:24,679
Speaker 8: And in that zoomed in video, like I said, you

517
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,400
Speaker 8: clearly see the individual whom I believe to be Tyler

518
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:31,800
Speaker 8: Robinson get on the roof, get in the pro position.

519
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 8: The time stamps match exactly when we know Charlie was shot.

520
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,360
Speaker 8: Person gets up, individual runs and jumps off the other

521
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,879
Speaker 8: side of the building, just like we've all seen. The

522
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 8: zoomed in portion is the part that makes it so

523
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:51,080
Speaker 8: damning for Tyler Robinson, because you see this individual get

524
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,960
Speaker 8: into that prone stiper position at the exact time stamps

525
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 8: that we know Charlie was shot. That's what I saw

526
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 8: and what you're right, we're splitting semantics on this. There's

527
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,920
Speaker 8: a group that, no matter what you show, they do

528
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,600
Speaker 8: not believe that was Tyler Robinson. I believe all the

529
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 8: evidence points to Tyler Robinson, and I believe that with

530
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 8: the DNA plus the testimony, plus the confessions, all of this,

531
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 8: and we haven't even got to his confession to the police.

532
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:18,679
Speaker 8: We haven't even got to his parents talking about it.

533
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,440
Speaker 8: I think it all paints a very clear picture. And yeah,

534
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,000
Speaker 8: I think we have a lot of people that are

535
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:25,720
Speaker 8: just arguing for the sake of arguing.

536
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, as well said so, I mean, the we can

537
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 4: leave it there, Graham. But I just appreciate you being

538
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 4: just very matter of fact, very down you know, just

539
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 4: the facts here.

540
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 3: We don't need to go further than what the facts are.

541
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 4: But I think what it what it really I think

542
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:44,919
Speaker 4: what it really relates is that it we need to

543
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:47,960
Speaker 4: see this stuff. The public should have access to it,

544
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 4: so there's no discussion, no argument or about what's actually available.

545
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 3: When it comes to evidence.

546
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 4: And so anyways, I'm glad that you got to see

547
00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 4: it and got to relate that to us. But Graham,

548
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 4: I know you got a busy dam gonna let you go,

549
00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:02,679
Speaker 4: But thank you for making the time calling.

550
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,360
Speaker 8: In anytime, guys, I appreciate it.

551
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,360
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587
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 4: just want to finish our discussion about Lindsay Graham here

588
00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 4: really quick.

589
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 3: So that yeah.

590
00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:13,120
Speaker 4: So, why it's fascinating is the IRGC put out sort

591
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:17,040
Speaker 4: of some social media with targets around people's heads, including

592
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:22,080
Speaker 4: Lindsay Graham, which obviously is you know, disconcerting.

593
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 3: It included Ben Shapiro.

594
00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 4: I think, uh Laura Loomer, Lindsey Graham, some other people,

595
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:29,600
Speaker 4: and they're they're claiming credit for it, and I think

596
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 4: that that is just that's just a bunch of talk. Candidly, Yeah,

597
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 4: you see that image right there. I think that this

598
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:40,080
Speaker 4: plays into a narrative that they want to sell, and

599
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 4: so they're they're going for it. The other thing that

600
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 4: I want to show is Anna Casparring from the Young Turks. No,

601
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:51,560
Speaker 4: I don't really know her personally. I've met her, believe

602
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 4: it the Republican National Convention when Charlie sat down with

603
00:30:56,680 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 4: chenk And and Anna Kasparion, but I didn't interact with her,

604
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 4: by the way at all. She was kind of stand office,

605
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 4: whereas Chank was very engaging and wanted to chat. But

606
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 4: she put out this just really nasty tweet after Graham

607
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 4: Lindsey Graham died and said good riddance.

608
00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 3: Then some other people called her on it.

609
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:19,920
Speaker 4: Said that's a disgusting thing to do, and she doubled

610
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 4: down on it and it got even worse. She said,

611
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:28,000
Speaker 4: let me be perfectly clear, she's really glad that this happened.

612
00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:29,360
Speaker 4: I can't see it on screen, so I got to

613
00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 4: bring it up on my laptop here, but she she

614
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,440
Speaker 4: doubles it, doubles down, and she says, are you offended?

615
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 4: Let me clarify, I'm elated that he's dead, overjoyed, just

616
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 4: like he was elated at seeing countless.

617
00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 3: Children throughout the Middle East.

618
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 4: But then she got called out on it because in

619
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 4: November of twenty twenty, she tweeted this, what kind of

620
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:49,840
Speaker 4: monster thinks gloating about dead people is ever?

621
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 3: Okay?

622
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 4: I guess apologists for ethnic cleansing. So she's just a

623
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 4: giant hypocrite. And I'm glad that the Internet called her

624
00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 4: on it, that this tweet is just I think it's

625
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 4: of a larger societal rot. When people get on social media,

626
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 4: they're just willing to say the craziest stuff. They're willing

627
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 4: to be reckless, mean and cruel and vicious. And she

628
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 4: got called on it because it's a hypocritical thing to do.

629
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:13,960
Speaker 4: And again, Blake and I will be the first to

630
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 4: admit we have had very public political disagreements with Lindsey Graham.

631
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 3: We didn't like his war positions. But don't do that.

632
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:27,320
Speaker 4: Don't be anachisparian, Have some dignity, have some class, Blake,

633
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:29,160
Speaker 4: I don't know if you want to comment on any

634
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:30,920
Speaker 4: of that, or if you want to sort of take

635
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 4: us into the recent updates on Iran, Well, it does sneak.

636
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 7: To It speaks to a lot, which is I think

637
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 7: there's been an unfortunate general trend towards greater nastiness in politics,

638
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 7: and that includes celebrating the deaths of people who politically

639
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:48,720
Speaker 7: offend you in some way.

640
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 5: I think this is a bad trend.

641
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 7: I think it's something we should push back against because

642
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 7: celebrating someone's death eventually turns into justifying someone's death.

643
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:01,800
Speaker 5: If they were in some way. We saw that with Charlie.

644
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 7: It turns into justifying other hateful actions against your political opponents,

645
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 7: and that's just that's incompatible with the type of country

646
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 7: we want to live in. One of the reasons America

647
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 7: is such as a successful and amazing country and has

648
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 7: been for so long, is we are a country where,

649
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:22,960
Speaker 7: by and large, we don't resolve our political differences with

650
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 7: extreme hatred, with violence, with celebrating and that's something you

651
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:30,479
Speaker 7: do see in countries that are far less blessed than

652
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 7: our own. But you did mention how Lindsey Graham might

653
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 7: feel about war in general, and so we have recent

654
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 7: developments in that we should pay attention to it. President

655
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 7: Trump announced just before this show began that the Strait

656
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,360
Speaker 7: of Horror Moves is open and will remain open with

657
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:52,160
Speaker 7: or without Iran. But he says we are reinstating via

658
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:55,480
Speaker 7: Iran blockade. We had that blockade going for several months

659
00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:57,840
Speaker 7: on Iranian ships, and he says it's been brought back.

660
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:01,479
Speaker 7: He also announces, quote, the USA will be from this

661
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:05,440
Speaker 7: point forward known as in all caps in quotes, the

662
00:34:05,560 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 7: Guardian of the Horror Moves straight. But as such and

663
00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 7: as a matter of fairness, will be reimbursed, the President says,

664
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:17,320
Speaker 7: at a rate of twenty percent on all cargo shipped

665
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:20,600
Speaker 7: for any and all costs necessary to do the job

666
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:24,720
Speaker 7: of providing safety and security to this very volatile section

667
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,440
Speaker 7: of the world. The process will begin immediately. Thank you

668
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 7: for your attention to this matter. This is interesting in

669
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,800
Speaker 7: a few ways. It's US returning to a more assertive

670
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,359
Speaker 7: position in Iran. And Andrew, I know you and I

671
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 7: are both worried about this. We spoke to students in

672
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 7: our panels. They repeatedly said, young people in their high schools,

673
00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:48,320
Speaker 7: at their colleges, they aren't super excited about the Iran conflict.

674
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,920
Speaker 7: They would like for it to end, and this is

675
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 7: I feel this is the President trying to navigate that

676
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:57,279
Speaker 7: he doesn't want boots on the ground in Iran. I

677
00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:01,240
Speaker 7: think he realizes that would be deeply unpopped and deeply risky.

678
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:06,319
Speaker 7: But he's also aware these long term conflicts you need

679
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 7: to take some sort of progress towards an end, and

680
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:12,160
Speaker 7: so he's hoping that this can up pressure on Iran's economy.

681
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,359
Speaker 7: He's also probably hoping this is a way he can

682
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:18,319
Speaker 7: sell this as not expensive for the United States, that

683
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:20,759
Speaker 7: this is a way People have said, why doesn't the

684
00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 7: Middle East pay more for its own defense? Why doesn't

685
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,280
Speaker 7: the Middle East pay more for this conflict with Iran

686
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 7: when they're overall in the long term going to be

687
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,759
Speaker 7: the chief beneficiaries of it. So when President Trump announces this,

688
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 7: I think his hope is either we can pay for

689
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 7: the war itself, or we can put pressure on our

690
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,520
Speaker 7: allies in the Middle East to help us reach a permanent,

691
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 7: long term end to this. And we just have to

692
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 7: continue to hope that President Trump has good judgment on this,

693
00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:50,440
Speaker 7: because I do think we saw that with the Chapter

694
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 7: leaders that there is a lot of political gain to

695
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,239
Speaker 7: be made from finally bringing this conflict to an end,

696
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:57,280
Speaker 7: and they thought it would.

697
00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 5: Be a pretty immediate gain if we were able to

698
00:35:59,480 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 5: do that.

699
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 4: So, just to be clear, between China, India, Japan, and

700
00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 4: South Korea, that accounts for about seventy to seventy five

701
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 4: percent of the of the energy that flows through the

702
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:11,840
Speaker 4: Strait of Horn moves. So I think you know Europe

703
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 4: gets a lot of that too. So President Trump is

704
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:16,839
Speaker 4: basically saying, we'll keep it open, but Asia, you're going

705
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 4: to be footing the bill, So fair enough. Good conversation

706
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 4: is about respect. It's how we create a space where

707
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 4: people are able to share their ideas and be heard.

708
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 4: Charlie knew that turning Point still knows that, and TikTok

709
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 4: has always strived to build the kind of place that

710
00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 4: thrives on respectful connection, where curiosity fuels connection and we

711
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:40,279
Speaker 4: can share what's on our minds and learn from each other.

712
00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:42,800
Speaker 4: When ideas meet respect, good things happen.

713
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 3: On TikTok.

714
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:46,160
Speaker 4: You can find a mechanic explaining the why behind a

715
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 4: problem most of us wouldn't even know how to name,

716
00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:51,480
Speaker 4: or a father sharing a lifetime of knowledge with his viewers.

717
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:54,960
Speaker 4: Viewers who listen discuss, and then they respond. TikTok turns

718
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 4: connection into community through small acts of understanding. You can

719
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,279
Speaker 4: feel it in the comments in the thing thank you

720
00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:03,319
Speaker 4: from a stranger halfway across the world. TikTok is a

721
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:06,759
Speaker 4: place where respect opens the door for discussion, and discussion

722
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:13,759
Speaker 4: helps us build something real. We have Oran McIntyre. He's

723
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:18,480
Speaker 4: a really deep thinker. He's really into philosophy. He's of

724
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 4: course a host that the ballets check out his stuff.

725
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 4: He's done actual interviews and debates with a man that

726
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 4: has I think become a fascination of some on the

727
00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:32,919
Speaker 4: right in larger political circles, just because he's apparently he's

728
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 4: been described as Putin's brain. Now Putin loyalists will contest

729
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 4: that and say that that's an overstatement, certainly, but nevertheless,

730
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:46,720
Speaker 4: he's become an important flashpoint in this Eurasian cultural block,

731
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:49,839
Speaker 4: and I think it can explain a lot for us

732
00:37:50,160 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 4: here in America as we try to understand some of

733
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,759
Speaker 4: the ideas that are shaping our current moment. So Oran McIntyre,

734
00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:57,719
Speaker 4: welcome back to the show.

735
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,600
Speaker 3: My friend, explain this.

736
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 4: I think we should start with Alexander Dugan's most seminal

737
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:07,400
Speaker 4: work is most famous work, which is the fourth political theory.

738
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,240
Speaker 4: Explain in broad strokes what it is so our audience

739
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:11,960
Speaker 4: can understand the basic premise.

740
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 10: Sure, So, Andrew Alexander Dukean is trying to find a

741
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:18,480
Speaker 10: way beyond liberalism. He sees us as living in a

742
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 10: postliberal world and he wants to find a different political theory.

743
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:26,040
Speaker 10: He sees liberalism as the first political theory of modernity,

744
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 10: and then communism and fascism as the second and third

745
00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 10: political theories that attempt to address the problems of liberalism.

746
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,440
Speaker 10: He rejects liberalism, but he also recognizes the shortcomings of

747
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:40,960
Speaker 10: both communism and fascism, and so he does something he

748
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,040
Speaker 10: calls breaking the Hermineutic circle, which is saying he wants

749
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 10: to discard some of the worst elements of fascism or

750
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:50,480
Speaker 10: communism and see if there are any other alternative ideas

751
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 10: that could be found inside those ideologies once we have

752
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 10: shorn them of the worst parts of them. For him,

753
00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 10: the atheism and materialism of communism is the worst, and

754
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:04,800
Speaker 10: kind of the ethnic centering in fascism is the worst,

755
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 10: and he's trying to find a way forward with those Now.

756
00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:11,480
Speaker 10: The problem with This is a couple different things, but

757
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 10: ultimately the thing you need to remember with all of

758
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,279
Speaker 10: Dugan's work is you have to read it in the

759
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 10: frame of a man who is first and foremost centering

760
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:23,520
Speaker 10: his Eurasian project, the idea that the Russian Empire should

761
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:25,960
Speaker 10: have a natural dominance, it should be allowed to ascend,

762
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:28,800
Speaker 10: but the West is ultimately going to have to lose

763
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 10: ground so that Russia and other countries can flourish. I

764
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:36,839
Speaker 10: think there is some real genuine philosophical insights in Dugan's work.

765
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 10: We always have to remember that you are dealing with

766
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 10: a propagandist as you are going through this, You can't

767
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 10: just read it as some kind of objective assessment of

768
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:47,480
Speaker 10: where we are philosophical, right.

769
00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:53,839
Speaker 4: So, basically the fourth political move in his estimation here,

770
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,560
Speaker 4: as you had communism, he rejects that, we had fascism,

771
00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:58,480
Speaker 4: he rejects that, and then we had liberalism, which he

772
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:03,720
Speaker 4: acknowledges sort of on the twentieth century. And so he's saying,

773
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,399
Speaker 4: you know, you can't fight back against liberalism without being

774
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 4: called a fascism, a fascist basically. But there is a

775
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 4: fourth way, if you will, which is really just third

776
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:17,440
Speaker 4: third way positionism. Actually, but he's calling it a fourth way,

777
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,120
Speaker 4: which is ironic. You talk about the fact that he

778
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:22,760
Speaker 4: is a political propagandist at his heart.

779
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 3: Why do you say that.

780
00:40:24,320 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 10: Well, if you read the fourth political theory, Duke is

781
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:28,720
Speaker 10: not really hiding the ball. He says that the West

782
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 10: must be destroyed, that America must be destroyed. The man

783
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:35,680
Speaker 10: has no love for Anglo civilization. He sees it as

784
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:38,719
Speaker 10: something that ultimately came to dominate the world and has

785
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 10: driven nations like Russia into some kind of artificial second place,

786
00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:46,120
Speaker 10: and that they should have flourishing once they're freed from

787
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:50,239
Speaker 10: kind of this cage of Anglo domination. So it's very

788
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 10: clear that he's very passionate about his political project. And

789
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:55,480
Speaker 10: I think the best way to look at Dugan is

790
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:58,920
Speaker 10: perhaps to look at someone like Machiavelli. Machiavelli wrote The

791
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,400
Speaker 10: Prince because he was looking for a job interview, and

792
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:06,680
Speaker 10: because ultimately he had a project of Italian unification. Everything

793
00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 10: he writes in that book is oriented towards that goal.

794
00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 10: That doesn't mean there aren't certain deep insights we can

795
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 10: draw from The Prince. I have read a lot of Machiavelli,

796
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 10: and I use his work quite a bit, but we

797
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 10: always have to remember that he is writing in that

798
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:22,080
Speaker 10: context and is famously known as a teacher of evil.

799
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,400
Speaker 10: I think we could probably at some level apply the

800
00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:28,000
Speaker 10: same frame to Dougan, someone who does have deep philosophical insights,

801
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:31,160
Speaker 10: but we always have to keep what he's saying in

802
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 10: that context of his project of kind of eventual Russian

803
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 10: emergence after Western collapse.

804
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 4: So and I want to get Blake in here because

805
00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 4: this is sort of his sweet spot too. But my

806
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 4: last question is, and the reason I want to talk

807
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 4: about this today orin is because I think there is

808
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 4: some confusion if you're just like a normy American Conservative,

809
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 4: which is nothing bad, by the way, we want you

810
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 4: spending most of your time raising your family, raising your kids,

811
00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:59,359
Speaker 4: like volunteering at church, all those things, teaching little league,

812
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:01,359
Speaker 4: but there is like if you just kind of check

813
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:05,200
Speaker 4: in on social media, like why why are certain movements

814
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:08,719
Speaker 4: seeming to happen? Why are people surprising me with their

815
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:12,480
Speaker 4: position on Russia, for example. I think I don't want

816
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 4: to give him too much credit, but I think he's

817
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:17,759
Speaker 4: a piece of the puzzle of why some of these

818
00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 4: ideas that he's suggesting. Because the critiques of modern liberalism

819
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:25,720
Speaker 4: are valid in many respects us as American conservatives would

820
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,880
Speaker 4: share those critiques, and they can be seductive to a

821
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:33,879
Speaker 4: larger narrative or agenda that he's got. He's so kind

822
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:36,360
Speaker 4: of break that down, like, why is it seductive what

823
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:40,560
Speaker 4: he's saying to an American conservative. Maybe it's an influencer,

824
00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:43,879
Speaker 4: maybe it's a podcaster, a think or commentary person. Why

825
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 4: is it seductive? But why should we, in your opinion,

826
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:47,880
Speaker 4: reject the larger premise?

827
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:50,920
Speaker 10: Well seductive because frankly Dugan is right about some things.

828
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:54,359
Speaker 10: He is drawing on more classic thinkers. He's drying on

829
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:58,000
Speaker 10: a Vola, He's drying on a Guanan, He's drying on

830
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:01,279
Speaker 10: Carl Schmidt, He's drying on Oswald Spangler. He's drawing on

831
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 10: people who have made real and important insights. And so

832
00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 10: some of the things that he's bringing to the table

833
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:08,520
Speaker 10: are things that you do have to grapple with. But

834
00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:11,759
Speaker 10: like I said, ultimately this his project is one of

835
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:15,280
Speaker 10: destroying the West. It is anti American in every way.

836
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:18,239
Speaker 10: He really does see America as the great Satan. He

837
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:20,920
Speaker 10: does see the need for it to basically die in

838
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:25,799
Speaker 10: a conflagration. He often uses these apocalyptic terms that we

839
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:29,799
Speaker 10: need kind of this in times destruction of America and

840
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:33,800
Speaker 10: the West to ultimately allow these other nations to flourish.

841
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:35,960
Speaker 10: A lot of times, even though Dugan will note the

842
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 10: differences between civilizations, he blames the natural outcomes of their

843
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:43,120
Speaker 10: decisions on the West, as if we are somehow singularly

844
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 10: responsible for the bad decisions and bad outcomes of other

845
00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:49,840
Speaker 10: people's way of being. And so I think it's just

846
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 10: important to remember that while those conversations can be important,

847
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:56,480
Speaker 10: while that criticism can be valid, because he is drawing

848
00:43:56,560 --> 00:44:00,719
Speaker 10: from older thinkers that I think do have solid points, Ultimately,

849
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,839
Speaker 10: I think he's coming to a very dangerous conclusion, one

850
00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:07,720
Speaker 10: which is deeply anti American. We can address the issues

851
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:11,759
Speaker 10: of modernity without burning down our heritage. Those things do

852
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 10: not have to coincide well or in What.

853
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:16,600
Speaker 7: Stands out to me is, as you said, he's super

854
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:18,799
Speaker 7: anti American. So it stands out to me that some

855
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:21,960
Speaker 7: Americans they like to fixate on this guy.

856
00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:23,320
Speaker 5: I think they like to find.

857
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:28,160
Speaker 7: Philosophers who are aggressively outside America's orbit. And yet at

858
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 7: the same time he seems to me like someone for

859
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:33,960
Speaker 7: someone who's supposedly outside of America. He's totally guided to

860
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 7: me by currents that are in Western, in American, in

861
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 7: our ideological stuff, and he just takes the position of

862
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:48,920
Speaker 7: America as terrible using the justifications they provide. This is

863
00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:50,880
Speaker 7: one and we can get into this in the next segment.

864
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 7: He just tweeted this the other day. The very concept

865
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:57,880
Speaker 7: of success is deeply immoral. If you are successful, the

866
00:44:57,920 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 7: other is a loser. We shouldn't accept it. We should

867
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:06,480
Speaker 7: prosper or suffer together. Otherwise it is satanic. Honestly, that

868
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:08,719
Speaker 7: just sounds like he could be the court philosopher for

869
00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:12,319
Speaker 7: like Zoron Mamdani, he could be the court philosopher for

870
00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:16,799
Speaker 7: any radical leftist. It basically just sounds like communism. And

871
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:19,759
Speaker 7: so it's funny to me that this would appeal to

872
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 7: anyone in America. Well, I just don't get I say,

873
00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:25,239
Speaker 7: anyone on the American right.

874
00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 4: It sounds what you just got to Blake is super important.

875
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 4: And let's just throw this tweet up here. The very

876
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 4: concept of success is deeply a moral. If you are successful,

877
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:38,200
Speaker 4: the other is a loser. We shouldn't accept it. We

878
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:42,279
Speaker 4: should prosper or suffer together. Otherwise it is satanic. This

879
00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 4: doesn't sound like a fourth way. That just sounds like,

880
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:48,440
Speaker 4: you know, a communist rehash or something, or and how

881
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 4: is this seductive?

882
00:45:50,520 --> 00:45:56,040
Speaker 10: I think that again, it's very attractive to people because

883
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 10: a lot of Dugan stuff does attack that decadence of irnity.

884
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 10: It does have realistic and reasonable criticisms of certain aspects

885
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:11,440
Speaker 10: of modern society. But his prescriptions can often be very terrible,

886
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:13,400
Speaker 10: as we see here. One of the things that Dugan

887
00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:16,680
Speaker 10: does is take the idea from Martin Heidegger of daw

888
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:20,560
Speaker 10: sign and apply to individual civilizations. And he believes that

889
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:24,720
Speaker 10: all of these individual civilizational das signs are the same

890
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:26,560
Speaker 10: and have the same value in the same worth, that

891
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:29,600
Speaker 10: we can't judge each other because we do not have

892
00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:33,680
Speaker 10: each other's experiences. This is if it sounds like postmodernism

893
00:46:33,719 --> 00:46:35,680
Speaker 10: to people. In many ways it is. It's a kind

894
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:39,439
Speaker 10: of a synthesis of traditionalism and postmodernism, which I think

895
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:41,560
Speaker 10: again lures a lot of people in because they hear

896
00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:44,440
Speaker 10: the traditionalism, they see the critiques, they feel that, you know,

897
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:47,719
Speaker 10: to be correct, But then ultimately they get led down

898
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:51,880
Speaker 10: some of these sideways paths that are ultimately very influenced

899
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:53,680
Speaker 10: by things like critical Theory. If you read the Fourth

900
00:46:53,920 --> 00:46:57,239
Speaker 10: Political Theory, it has chapters on why basically you need

901
00:46:57,239 --> 00:47:00,319
Speaker 10: to abolish the differences between genders and why you can't.

902
00:47:00,520 --> 00:47:03,000
Speaker 10: You know, you have to abolish the evils of racism

903
00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:06,000
Speaker 10: across the world. So these are in the Fourth Political Theory.

904
00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:08,200
Speaker 10: They aren't just in the man's tweets. They've always been

905
00:47:08,239 --> 00:47:09,359
Speaker 10: a part of his philosophy.

906
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:14,840
Speaker 4: Interesting here's another tweet from him. The tradition is the East.

907
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:20,279
Speaker 4: Eastern Christianity is tradition. Western Christianity is modernized. The far

908
00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:25,160
Speaker 4: West Christianity Protestantism is more modern than simply Western Christianity,

909
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:29,320
Speaker 4: which he labels his Catholicism. The West is the thrash

910
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:33,040
Speaker 4: of history, the black hole in the bottom of reality.

911
00:47:34,600 --> 00:47:37,279
Speaker 4: I also have to just point out here that his

912
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:40,800
Speaker 4: whole worldview is putting sort of philosopher kings, the guys

913
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 4: like him at the very top of the hierarchy. In

914
00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 4: a civilization, this multipolar civilizational world that he's advocating for,

915
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:53,879
Speaker 4: with Eurasia as a singular block, he would be the

916
00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:56,839
Speaker 4: ruler of said civilization. So that's something to always keep

917
00:47:56,880 --> 00:48:00,440
Speaker 4: in mind. Now you've met this guy, or at least

918
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:03,160
Speaker 4: interviewed him. I don't know if it was you know,

919
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,840
Speaker 4: over zoom or something right, but you did a debate

920
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 4: with him.

921
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 3: What did you perceive in that debate? Is he quick

922
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:10,200
Speaker 3: on his feet?

923
00:48:10,400 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 4: Did he was he able to answer criticisms of his philosophy,

924
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:15,600
Speaker 4: whether well or not?

925
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 10: So Interestingly, I have both interviewed him and then I

926
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:20,720
Speaker 10: was able to arrange a debate between him and another

927
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:23,000
Speaker 10: philosopher by the name of Nick Land. People who are

928
00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:27,200
Speaker 10: on Twitter have probably seen him post pretty regularly, but

929
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 10: it was a very interesting discussion. I think again, I

930
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:33,800
Speaker 10: don't think Dugan is stupid. I think it's a poor

931
00:48:34,120 --> 00:48:37,160
Speaker 10: It's a bad idea to underestimate your enemy on this one.

932
00:48:37,520 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 10: He is a very intelligent guy. However, when he was

933
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:43,719
Speaker 10: in that debate between himself and Nick Land, it was

934
00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:46,320
Speaker 10: very interesting because because Nick Land is in many ways

935
00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 10: a hyper Anglo philosopher. He is extremely interested in the

936
00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:52,239
Speaker 10: West and believes in the mission of the West and

937
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:54,880
Speaker 10: perhaps a way that many people are not as serious

938
00:48:54,920 --> 00:48:57,800
Speaker 10: when it comes to kind of the hyper modern understanding

939
00:48:57,800 --> 00:48:59,600
Speaker 10: of the West as where Dugan was very much a

940
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:02,359
Speaker 10: East traditionalist, and so the clashing between the.

941
00:49:02,280 --> 00:49:03,400
Speaker 2: Two was very interesting.

942
00:49:03,560 --> 00:49:06,360
Speaker 10: I found that while Dugan was intelligent and was able

943
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:08,680
Speaker 10: to defend many of his positions, it did seem like

944
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:11,440
Speaker 10: Land was operating at a higher level that ultimately there

945
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 10: were several times where he kind of ran into a barrier,

946
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 10: and I think that Land very much got the best

947
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 10: of him. I did not debate him directly because I

948
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:20,640
Speaker 10: think Nick lann is a much more intelligent guy who

949
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:24,600
Speaker 10: can bring those criticisms and those questions far more sharply

950
00:49:24,600 --> 00:49:26,759
Speaker 10: than I can. But if people want to catch that,

951
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:30,279
Speaker 10: it is an absolutely fascinating discussion and I think will

952
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:33,279
Speaker 10: help you understand a little bit of where the differences

953
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 10: are between these two world views.

954
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 7: So orn, I don't know that too many of our

955
00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:41,080
Speaker 7: listeners are going to race out and read this guy's books,

956
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 7: but so that they can understand him better. Maybe what's

957
00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 7: a good takeaway if you encounter a podcasters into this,

958
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 7: an ex poster who's into this, just someone in real

959
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:57,719
Speaker 7: life who's an enthusiast for Dugan, who's American, this guy

960
00:49:57,760 --> 00:49:59,440
Speaker 7: who wants to basically destroy America.

961
00:49:59,600 --> 00:50:03,120
Speaker 5: What's it maybe indicate about them? For lack of a

962
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:03,920
Speaker 5: better word.

963
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:07,080
Speaker 10: Well, I think that again, the fact that there are

964
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:10,479
Speaker 10: truths in Dugan's work does make it attractive to people.

965
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:12,799
Speaker 10: I don't think it's ridiculous to find insights there. I

966
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:15,840
Speaker 10: have personally found insights in Dugan's work that are helpful.

967
00:50:16,040 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 10: But ultimately we have to remember again that the frame

968
00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 10: is always one of you know, the Western imperialism is evil,

969
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:25,760
Speaker 10: It is going to crush all societies. It must be defeated,

970
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:28,800
Speaker 10: The United States must be destroyed, and you ultimately cannot

971
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:32,439
Speaker 10: side with that. Just because someone has some insights into

972
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:35,040
Speaker 10: something important doesn't mean that they're right. You know, Karl

973
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:37,759
Speaker 10: Marx was right that there were some issues with capitalism,

974
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:42,360
Speaker 10: that the alienation of labor ultimately does cause certain impacts

975
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:45,719
Speaker 10: to people that are negative. However, his solution is horrific

976
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:49,000
Speaker 10: and killed hundreds of millions of people and absolutely has

977
00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:51,839
Speaker 10: to be rejected. And I would see Dugan in very

978
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 10: much as a similar light. It's a guy who has

979
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:57,280
Speaker 10: certain insights and you can you can find those insights

980
00:50:57,360 --> 00:51:00,239
Speaker 10: outside of Dugan. Remember, most of his stuff is synthesizing

981
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:02,640
Speaker 10: other people's work, so there are plenty of thinkers he's

982
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:05,319
Speaker 10: drawn from that you can look at and understand without

983
00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 10: necessarily having to go to Dougan. And if even if

984
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:10,759
Speaker 10: you do read Dugan, you should always remember that he's

985
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,759
Speaker 10: ultimately an enemy of your civilization. And no matter what,

986
00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:16,759
Speaker 10: no matter what you critiques he has that have might

987
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:20,880
Speaker 10: have some important insight. Ultimately, you can never ever side

988
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:23,640
Speaker 10: with the solutions that the man has because they are

989
00:51:23,719 --> 00:51:26,480
Speaker 10: directly aimed at destroy your own civilization. You should never

990
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 10: become a traitor to your own civilization, even if there

991
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:32,160
Speaker 10: are some problems with it. We should be trying to

992
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:34,799
Speaker 10: renew our civilization, not destroy it.

993
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, and our critiques are more pointed at radical progressivism,

994
00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:41,960
Speaker 4: radical egalitarianism, where you know, everybody gets the same outcome

995
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:44,279
Speaker 4: in life. We don't agree with those things. Less so

996
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:48,960
Speaker 4: with liberalism, which is you know, our tradition in the West,

997
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:53,000
Speaker 4: which is you know, the individual matters. Yet I think

998
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 4: you can go into a hyper individualist worldview and materialism

999
00:51:57,080 --> 00:51:58,879
Speaker 4: and all these things can be very destructive as well.

1000
00:51:58,880 --> 00:52:00,759
Speaker 4: And I think the Bible answers so much of that.

1001
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:03,239
Speaker 4: We are part of a community, a community of faith.

1002
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:05,759
Speaker 4: We are brothers and sisters in Christ. We are not

1003
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 4: hyper individuals, but we have individual rights enshrined in our constitution.

1004
00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:10,399
Speaker 3: That's a beautiful thing.

1005
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 4: Orin McIntyre check out his show and check out his

1006
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:15,320
Speaker 4: Alexander Dugan debates and interviews.

1007
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:17,319
Speaker 3: That's fascinating. Thank you, Oren.

1008
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:23,040
Speaker 4: All right, I'm so excited. The weather is finally warming up,

1009
00:52:23,120 --> 00:52:26,719
Speaker 4: which means grilling season is basically here and sorry, if

1010
00:52:26,719 --> 00:52:28,759
Speaker 4: you live in a colder part of the country where

1011
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,320
Speaker 4: I'm at, it's grilling season. And if you're anything like me,

1012
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 4: you're already thinking about planning your first backyard barbecue of

1013
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:37,200
Speaker 4: the year. For me, I already know what's going on

1014
00:52:37,200 --> 00:52:39,880
Speaker 4: the grill, and that's Good Ranchers. Good Ranchers partners with

1015
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,680
Speaker 4: local farmers and ranchers to deliver one hundred percent American

1016
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:47,440
Speaker 4: meat straight to your door. It's past you're raised, no antibiotics,

1017
00:52:47,719 --> 00:52:49,920
Speaker 4: and no added hormones. It's the kind of quality that

1018
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 4: you can actually feel good about serving other people around

1019
00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:55,920
Speaker 4: your table. And they just launched custom boxes. Now you

1020
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:59,240
Speaker 4: can build your own box with the cuts your family loves,

1021
00:52:59,440 --> 00:53:02,759
Speaker 4: steaks for grilling, chicken for weeknight dinners, or whatever you

1022
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:05,640
Speaker 4: reach for the most. Start your plan today and you'll

1023
00:53:05,640 --> 00:53:08,680
Speaker 4: get free meat included with every order. And with our

1024
00:53:08,719 --> 00:53:11,879
Speaker 4: code Charlie, you'll get twenty five dollars off your first order.

1025
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:14,840
Speaker 4: That's free meat with every order and twenty five dollars

1026
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:17,560
Speaker 4: off your first order with code Charlie when you start

1027
00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:21,480
Speaker 4: your plan at good ranchers dot com. Good ranchers dot

1028
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:24,120
Speaker 4: com American meat delivered.

1029
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:26,399
Speaker 3: All right.

1030
00:53:26,440 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 4: So I want to bring in Joshua car He's a

1031
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:32,640
Speaker 4: political commentator. You can find him at x at Joshua

1032
00:53:32,719 --> 00:53:36,920
Speaker 4: Underscore the Underscore car with one R and he attended

1033
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:41,800
Speaker 4: Tyler Robinson's preliminary hearing and had all kinds of interesting

1034
00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:43,360
Speaker 4: and fascinating.

1035
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:45,879
Speaker 3: Observations. We'll put it that way.

1036
00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:49,600
Speaker 4: And you've been so good and loud, Joshua, You've even

1037
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:52,640
Speaker 4: received death threats for being so loud. So just tell

1038
00:53:52,719 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 4: us thirty thousand foot view what you saw in that

1039
00:53:55,680 --> 00:53:57,440
Speaker 4: courtroom and around that courthouse.

1040
00:53:57,880 --> 00:53:59,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's good to be with you guys. Thanks for

1041
00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 2: inviting me today.

1042
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:02,880
Speaker 11: I really wanted to be in the courthouse on a

1043
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:05,359
Speaker 11: day where a lot of the information was coming out

1044
00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:06,960
Speaker 11: that the public wouldn't be able to see, because I

1045
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:09,480
Speaker 11: knew there would be bad actors inside the courtroom that

1046
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:11,879
Speaker 11: day that were trying to lie. Fortunately, I was able

1047
00:54:11,880 --> 00:54:14,200
Speaker 11: to be there on Thursday, which is when a massive

1048
00:54:14,239 --> 00:54:16,960
Speaker 11: portion of the evidence was coming out. Some of that evidence,

1049
00:54:17,000 --> 00:54:19,520
Speaker 11: as we know, and I'm sure you've talked about, was

1050
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:21,560
Speaker 11: leaked to the public. And when I say leaked, it

1051
00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:23,719
Speaker 11: was a mistake that happened in the courtroom, So I

1052
00:54:23,719 --> 00:54:25,160
Speaker 11: know you guys have seen a lot of that. But

1053
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:27,560
Speaker 11: beyond what was actually shown in the courtroom that day,

1054
00:54:27,640 --> 00:54:30,080
Speaker 11: I was able to see the emotions on people's faces.

1055
00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:33,640
Speaker 11: I was able to see, frankly, a human side of

1056
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,880
Speaker 11: the defense and the Tyler Robinson side that I didn't realize.

1057
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:40,400
Speaker 11: I've always been a strong defender of TPUSA, I've been

1058
00:54:40,400 --> 00:54:43,040
Speaker 11: a strong defender of Erica Kirk and all of you guys.

1059
00:54:43,040 --> 00:54:45,680
Speaker 11: But what I didn't realize was that at no point

1060
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:48,400
Speaker 11: did the Tyler Robinson family, which was sat directly in

1061
00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:52,120
Speaker 11: front of me, by the way, look defiant against the prosecution,

1062
00:54:52,960 --> 00:54:55,440
Speaker 11: look angry. They were simply and I could see it

1063
00:54:55,480 --> 00:54:57,200
Speaker 11: in their eyes because I stared into their eyes. They

1064
00:54:57,200 --> 00:55:00,759
Speaker 11: were sad at seeing what Tyler Robinson had done. And

1065
00:55:00,840 --> 00:55:03,960
Speaker 11: looking at Tyler Robinson, he was completely stone cold. He

1066
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:06,520
Speaker 11: did not move a muscle the entire time that I

1067
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:08,480
Speaker 11: was there, And again I was watching him and had

1068
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:11,399
Speaker 11: a clear view of him for at least eight hours.

1069
00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, I've talked to some reporters

1070
00:55:13,600 --> 00:55:15,120
Speaker 4: who were in the room. I've obviously talked to some

1071
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:17,719
Speaker 4: of the team that was in the room, and it's

1072
00:55:17,719 --> 00:55:21,440
Speaker 4: interesting that part you're zeroing in on, which is Tyler

1073
00:55:21,480 --> 00:55:25,560
Speaker 4: Robinson's family. I was told a story. Maybe you could

1074
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:28,440
Speaker 4: confirm it, I'm not sure. But when they were recounting

1075
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:31,960
Speaker 4: some of those text messages that were going back and forth,

1076
00:55:32,200 --> 00:55:34,240
Speaker 4: and I want to be somewhat vague, just to respect

1077
00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:37,400
Speaker 4: the privacy of his family as well, because they're not

1078
00:55:37,840 --> 00:55:42,080
Speaker 4: the criminals here, right, or the alleged criminals, And candidly,

1079
00:55:42,160 --> 00:55:45,480
Speaker 4: his parents from all accounts, did a brave thing and

1080
00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:48,640
Speaker 4: it must be terrible, right, And I led to believe

1081
00:55:48,680 --> 00:55:51,320
Speaker 4: that they're probably on the conservative end of the spectrum.

1082
00:55:51,880 --> 00:55:55,680
Speaker 4: But when that text message was read about Gramp's gun

1083
00:55:56,239 --> 00:55:58,480
Speaker 4: looks like it's doing just fine or did just fine,

1084
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:01,400
Speaker 4: I'm told that one of the family members that was

1085
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:06,680
Speaker 4: there basically just his head hit the floor, because obviously

1086
00:56:06,760 --> 00:56:10,879
Speaker 4: he must have had a relationship with Grandpa. And again,

1087
00:56:10,880 --> 00:56:13,040
Speaker 4: I'm sorry to be vague. I'm just saying I want

1088
00:56:13,080 --> 00:56:16,560
Speaker 4: to be respectful of their privacy. But when that text

1089
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:19,480
Speaker 4: was read, that the head just hit the floor. Just

1090
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:23,560
Speaker 4: complete devastation to kind of realize that his family member

1091
00:56:24,040 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 4: and his family member's gun, somebody that probably had a

1092
00:56:26,239 --> 00:56:30,000
Speaker 4: relationship with was used to kill somebody of such important

1093
00:56:31,080 --> 00:56:35,080
Speaker 4: a legend of American conservative American Charlie Kirk. You know,

1094
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:36,920
Speaker 4: did you see any of that?

1095
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:37,680
Speaker 9: Yeah?

1096
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:38,080
Speaker 2: I did.

1097
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:40,879
Speaker 11: That was probably the most emotional part of the entire

1098
00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:42,840
Speaker 11: day was when they read that specific text that you

1099
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:45,200
Speaker 11: just referenced. And like I said, I had a perfect

1100
00:56:45,280 --> 00:56:49,399
Speaker 11: view of the entire Robinson family and I won't say

1101
00:56:49,400 --> 00:56:51,120
Speaker 11: who it is either to be respectful to them, but

1102
00:56:51,160 --> 00:56:54,279
Speaker 11: this individual hung their head at that point, and it.

1103
00:56:54,239 --> 00:56:56,799
Speaker 2: Was hung pretty much the entire time after that.

1104
00:56:57,080 --> 00:56:59,319
Speaker 11: In fact, towards the end, I think maybe the last

1105
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:02,120
Speaker 11: two or three hours, they didn't come back inside the courtroom.

1106
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:05,080
Speaker 11: They were clearly very upset. I also heard a lot

1107
00:57:05,120 --> 00:57:07,439
Speaker 11: of emotion behind me. I was right in front of

1108
00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:11,000
Speaker 11: Erica Kirk and Charlie's parents, And you know, one of

1109
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:13,560
Speaker 11: the directives that we got being in there was you

1110
00:57:13,600 --> 00:57:16,000
Speaker 11: cannot turn your head, You cannot react in any way.

1111
00:57:16,240 --> 00:57:17,920
Speaker 11: If you try to look at somebody to the left

1112
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 11: or right, you will be kicked out of the courtroom

1113
00:57:19,760 --> 00:57:22,680
Speaker 11: out of respect to the victims, And so I had

1114
00:57:22,680 --> 00:57:25,560
Speaker 11: this moment of just having to look forward and here

1115
00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:29,560
Speaker 11: the family of Charlie Kirk weep behind me, And it

1116
00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:31,800
Speaker 11: was honestly one of the hardest things I have ever

1117
00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:33,040
Speaker 11: had to listen to in my life.

1118
00:57:33,080 --> 00:57:35,240
Speaker 2: And I was quite emotional as well.

1119
00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:39,080
Speaker 4: You received some death threats to Joshua because you have

1120
00:57:39,280 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 4: been outspoken. You were, I guess planned as scheduled to

1121
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:47,840
Speaker 4: speak at You've used campus after a court hearing one

1122
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:49,640
Speaker 4: day you ended up having to cancel that.

1123
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:50,760
Speaker 3: Tell us the details.

1124
00:57:51,280 --> 00:57:53,480
Speaker 11: Yeah, so you know, I've been in this business a

1125
00:57:53,520 --> 00:57:55,840
Speaker 11: few years now. We receive death threats from time to time.

1126
00:57:55,840 --> 00:57:58,200
Speaker 11: I'm sure both of you are fully used to that,

1127
00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:01,720
Speaker 11: especially in the last ten months, but it's definitely been

1128
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:03,280
Speaker 11: increased over the last few months.

1129
00:58:03,360 --> 00:58:05,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, sadly, but it's been increased over.

1130
00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:07,680
Speaker 11: The last few months as I've continued to push back

1131
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:11,200
Speaker 11: harder and harder against the conspiracy crap that Baron Coleman

1132
00:58:11,280 --> 00:58:13,800
Speaker 11: and Candice Owens and the likes are spreading, and so

1133
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:17,000
Speaker 11: that kind of reached ahead this week. Again, I'm used

1134
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:20,400
Speaker 11: to getting those messages online, but it was a little

1135
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:23,520
Speaker 11: different this week. On Friday, right before I was going

1136
00:58:23,560 --> 00:58:25,960
Speaker 11: to go to this event at UVU again in the

1137
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:29,360
Speaker 11: same place that Charlie Kirk was murdered, I received a call,

1138
00:58:29,400 --> 00:58:31,800
Speaker 11: actually on my personal cell phone from someone who was

1139
00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:35,960
Speaker 11: impersonating a police officer. They were using phishing tactics I

1140
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:38,360
Speaker 11: won't go into too much detail on and they were

1141
00:58:38,840 --> 00:58:42,400
Speaker 11: essentially trying to get my address using public records. Fortunately,

1142
00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:44,040
Speaker 11: this person does not know where I live, They do

1143
00:58:44,080 --> 00:58:46,640
Speaker 11: not know my location. But in the moment, frankly, I

1144
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:48,640
Speaker 11: didn't even realize what they were trying to do. It

1145
00:58:48,680 --> 00:58:51,320
Speaker 11: wasn't until they abruptly hung up that it occurred to

1146
00:58:51,320 --> 00:58:53,320
Speaker 11: me that they were openly trying to dos me, and

1147
00:58:53,520 --> 00:58:56,000
Speaker 11: I saw some other evidence of that online. So my

1148
00:58:56,080 --> 00:58:59,200
Speaker 11: wife respectfully asked me not to attend the event at

1149
00:58:59,280 --> 00:59:00,680
Speaker 11: UVU that night with.

1150
00:59:00,600 --> 00:59:01,480
Speaker 2: All of that going on.

1151
00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:03,360
Speaker 5: That's unbelievable.

1152
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:06,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's horrible, and I'm sorry that you had to

1153
00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:10,640
Speaker 4: experience that, just for standing up for what you believe in,

1154
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:14,160
Speaker 4: standing up for facts and evidence, which is something that

1155
00:59:14,680 --> 00:59:18,000
Speaker 4: unfortunately in the online space so often gets cast aside.

1156
00:59:19,280 --> 00:59:23,200
Speaker 3: Why did you feel so moved to be so vocal.

1157
00:59:23,760 --> 00:59:24,880
Speaker 2: That's a really great question.

1158
00:59:25,720 --> 00:59:28,280
Speaker 11: Yes, yeah, and I don't mean to say that in

1159
00:59:28,280 --> 00:59:30,600
Speaker 11: any sort of comparison way, but all the way back

1160
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:33,560
Speaker 11: in September, I started seeing conspiracies come out and it

1161
00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:35,800
Speaker 11: really ticked me off. And if you look at any

1162
00:59:35,800 --> 00:59:37,960
Speaker 11: of my social media or my YouTube channel, you know

1163
00:59:37,960 --> 00:59:40,120
Speaker 11: that really has been my work for the last ten.

1164
00:59:39,960 --> 00:59:41,720
Speaker 2: Months is trying to debunk these theories.

1165
00:59:41,960 --> 00:59:43,400
Speaker 11: I think part of the reason for me, and I

1166
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:45,480
Speaker 11: can't really claim any credit for this, is that I

1167
00:59:45,560 --> 00:59:47,760
Speaker 11: live a few minutes away from UVU, and I grew

1168
00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:51,160
Speaker 11: up in Provo, Utah, and I know literally over one

1169
00:59:51,200 --> 00:59:54,439
Speaker 11: hundred people who are at this event with Charlie. In fact,

1170
00:59:54,560 --> 00:59:56,640
Speaker 11: I myself wanted to be at the event that day

1171
00:59:57,040 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 11: and wasn't able to because I had a doctor's appointment,

1172
01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:03,480
Speaker 11: and so it being close to home is what has

1173
01:00:03,560 --> 01:00:08,080
Speaker 11: particularly enraged me, frankly with the conspiracy theories. Just knowing

1174
01:00:08,240 --> 01:00:11,240
Speaker 11: individuals that Candice Owens and others that brought up, well,

1175
01:00:11,240 --> 01:00:13,760
Speaker 11: I know for a fact that she is lying about

1176
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:17,840
Speaker 11: that really take me off. On another personal note, when

1177
01:00:17,880 --> 01:00:20,240
Speaker 11: I was eighteen years old, I lost my father in

1178
01:00:20,320 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 11: a work accident that was very tragic and sudden, and

1179
01:00:23,640 --> 01:00:25,160
Speaker 11: so my mother is a widow.

1180
01:00:26,040 --> 01:00:27,560
Speaker 2: I have a fierce.

1181
01:00:27,600 --> 01:00:31,040
Speaker 11: Loyalty to widows and feel that, you know, I've just

1182
01:00:31,080 --> 01:00:33,680
Speaker 11: never seen this attack on someone, and I know how

1183
01:00:33,680 --> 01:00:35,640
Speaker 11: hard it was for my mother to lose her husband,

1184
01:00:35,960 --> 01:00:38,439
Speaker 11: and so to see someone lose their husband and then

1185
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:42,000
Speaker 11: be viciously attacked and not support it has really just

1186
01:00:42,160 --> 01:00:44,280
Speaker 11: made me emotional and made me want to be a

1187
01:00:44,320 --> 01:00:46,760
Speaker 11: strong defender of Erica as well as the truth.

1188
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:52,800
Speaker 4: Thank you for that, And genuinely, what was was it?

1189
01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 4: What was it like around the courthouse, Joshua, Because I've

1190
01:00:55,240 --> 01:00:57,240
Speaker 4: seen you interacting with some of these other people that

1191
01:00:57,280 --> 01:01:01,320
Speaker 4: were more on the conspiratorial side of things and pushing

1192
01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:05,880
Speaker 4: alternative theories, right, What was it like around the courthouse?

1193
01:01:05,960 --> 01:01:06,360
Speaker 3: Was it?

1194
01:01:06,400 --> 01:01:08,680
Speaker 4: Was it kind of a circus environment? Was it pretty subdued?

1195
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:11,720
Speaker 4: Did you see them? Were they trying to recruit people?

1196
01:01:12,040 --> 01:01:13,680
Speaker 4: I'm just curious what it was like out there.

1197
01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:16,560
Speaker 11: Yeah, so I was there Monday morning when everyone came,

1198
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:19,720
Speaker 11: and Monday morning was actually quite subdued. The mainstream media

1199
01:01:19,960 --> 01:01:22,200
Speaker 11: was kind of the dominant force there. Everyone was watching

1200
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:25,800
Speaker 11: people come in. I did notice one person who I

1201
01:01:25,880 --> 01:01:28,760
Speaker 11: knew was a notable kind of Candice Owans fan or

1202
01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:32,080
Speaker 11: loyalist but she was quite quiet and subdued, and I thought,

1203
01:01:32,120 --> 01:01:34,440
Speaker 11: this is very good. You know, it was either people

1204
01:01:34,440 --> 01:01:37,480
Speaker 11: there to support Erica Kirk or the mainstream media, and

1205
01:01:37,520 --> 01:01:39,520
Speaker 11: that was great. But as time went on, and when

1206
01:01:39,520 --> 01:01:41,960
Speaker 11: I was there on Thursday all day, there were more

1207
01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:44,720
Speaker 11: and more Candice Owens fans kind of coming out of

1208
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:47,320
Speaker 11: the woodworks. I would say it was mostly respectful outside,

1209
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:49,400
Speaker 11: but I will say in order to get in the

1210
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:53,600
Speaker 11: courthouse on Thursday, I had to camp out for so

1211
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:56,080
Speaker 11: I actually had someone go for me at nine pm

1212
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:58,520
Speaker 11: the previous day and get a spot, and then I

1213
01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:01,040
Speaker 11: showed up at two am morning of Thursday.

1214
01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:02,440
Speaker 2: And when I.

1215
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:06,840
Speaker 11: Got there, there was bickering and these people were essentially

1216
01:02:06,840 --> 01:02:10,600
Speaker 11: trying to debate other people in line with random conspiracy theories.

1217
01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:12,280
Speaker 11: Of course, they didn't want to engage in any of

1218
01:02:12,360 --> 01:02:15,200
Speaker 11: the facts that had been presented by the prosecution. Instead

1219
01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:18,520
Speaker 11: they brought up ancillary, brazy things that had nothing to

1220
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:22,200
Speaker 11: do with the actual case. So it certainly increased over time,

1221
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:24,480
Speaker 11: and I did hear them actively talking about being at

1222
01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:25,760
Speaker 11: the September first hearing.

1223
01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:27,520
Speaker 3: Were there police.

1224
01:02:27,560 --> 01:02:31,720
Speaker 4: There were there security in that line waiting to get in.

1225
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:34,600
Speaker 11: There were police kind of around since it was in

1226
01:02:34,640 --> 01:02:36,680
Speaker 11: the early morning, you know, there were police cars that

1227
01:02:36,680 --> 01:02:37,720
Speaker 11: would occasionally come in.

1228
01:02:37,800 --> 01:02:40,280
Speaker 2: I felt relatively safe there. The lights were on.

1229
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:43,480
Speaker 11: As it got closer towards the day, around six o'clock,

1230
01:02:43,560 --> 01:02:47,600
Speaker 11: the police force was very strong, very present. The head

1231
01:02:47,640 --> 01:02:51,600
Speaker 11: of security came out told everyone, you know, we're doing

1232
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:54,000
Speaker 11: this by the book. If you want to do any shenanigans,

1233
01:02:54,040 --> 01:02:56,760
Speaker 11: you're immediately off the premises. And then what really stunned me,

1234
01:02:56,800 --> 01:03:00,120
Speaker 11: frankly was in the courthouse. In the courtroom itself, I

1235
01:03:00,120 --> 01:03:03,080
Speaker 11: think there are eight police officers kind of staring us

1236
01:03:03,080 --> 01:03:06,560
Speaker 11: down at any time, And to be honest, I appreciated

1237
01:03:06,600 --> 01:03:08,600
Speaker 11: it because as someone who's now a public figure and

1238
01:03:08,600 --> 01:03:10,560
Speaker 11: who is getting these death threats, it was nice to

1239
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:13,080
Speaker 11: be able to be in that setting and feel safe

1240
01:03:13,080 --> 01:03:15,360
Speaker 11: and feel like I can actually watch the evidence being

1241
01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:17,400
Speaker 11: presented without something crazy going down.

1242
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:20,760
Speaker 7: Joshua, I was just a few questions that I think

1243
01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:24,000
Speaker 7: it's good to build upon this because you faced targeting

1244
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:26,640
Speaker 7: people trying to dox you who seem to be coming

1245
01:03:27,120 --> 01:03:31,880
Speaker 7: from this side of the issue, and especially the doxing

1246
01:03:31,960 --> 01:03:35,560
Speaker 7: part that stood out to me that's a tactic we're

1247
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:38,480
Speaker 7: familiar with from the far left that they'll try to

1248
01:03:38,520 --> 01:03:42,240
Speaker 7: get people's identities so they can swat them, so they

1249
01:03:42,280 --> 01:03:45,480
Speaker 7: can pick at their home. Nothing good is ever going

1250
01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:47,520
Speaker 7: to come of that, and it's never something that would

1251
01:03:47,520 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 7: occur to Andrew or myself or people we know here.

1252
01:03:51,800 --> 01:03:57,040
Speaker 7: So I've sometimes nicknamed those supporters Cantifa because they remind

1253
01:03:57,080 --> 01:04:01,080
Speaker 7: me of Antifa, But maybe you've had other encounters. What's

1254
01:04:01,120 --> 01:04:04,840
Speaker 7: their ideological makeup of people who are really committed to

1255
01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:09,840
Speaker 7: these conspiracy theories about the case, what's driving them, what's

1256
01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:11,800
Speaker 7: motivating them in your view.

1257
01:04:12,120 --> 01:04:13,360
Speaker 2: That's a really great question.

1258
01:04:13,640 --> 01:04:15,560
Speaker 11: I used to get more death threats from the left,

1259
01:04:15,600 --> 01:04:17,320
Speaker 11: and it feels like now I'm getting it more from

1260
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:19,160
Speaker 11: the far right. It seems to me that these people

1261
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:22,760
Speaker 11: are more far right isolationists. But I think for the

1262
01:04:22,760 --> 01:04:25,280
Speaker 11: most part, it's actually not as political as we think

1263
01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:27,040
Speaker 11: it is. I think the far left is always going

1264
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:28,720
Speaker 11: to docks, they're always going to send the death threats,

1265
01:04:28,760 --> 01:04:31,600
Speaker 11: But I think for this case specifically, it's so much

1266
01:04:31,600 --> 01:04:34,520
Speaker 11: more occult of personality for them. It's more about the

1267
01:04:34,560 --> 01:04:37,760
Speaker 11: political commentators and the podcasters that they're following. I think

1268
01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:40,840
Speaker 11: there's a huge loneliness epidemic. Frankly, you know, I was

1269
01:04:40,880 --> 01:04:43,240
Speaker 11: watching Charlie Kirk just now in the commercial break, and

1270
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:46,800
Speaker 11: he had so much timeless wisdom he's speaking in this clip.

1271
01:04:46,800 --> 01:04:49,760
Speaker 11: I just watched two young women talking about what is

1272
01:04:49,920 --> 01:04:51,800
Speaker 11: going to give them fulfillment, what's going to make them

1273
01:04:51,800 --> 01:04:52,520
Speaker 11: satisfied in life.

1274
01:04:52,520 --> 01:04:53,440
Speaker 2: They're talking about having.

1275
01:04:53,360 --> 01:04:57,120
Speaker 11: Kids, and unfortunately there are so many women specifically right now,

1276
01:04:57,160 --> 01:04:58,920
Speaker 11: but still men as well, but I'm seeing it more

1277
01:04:58,920 --> 01:05:02,680
Speaker 11: from women that are not pursuing the things that give

1278
01:05:02,720 --> 01:05:06,240
Speaker 11: them life and satisfaction and happiness, and so instead they're

1279
01:05:06,280 --> 01:05:10,520
Speaker 11: turning to things like crazy podcasters who give them conspiracy theories.

1280
01:05:10,560 --> 01:05:13,040
Speaker 11: And the reality is all of us love a good story,

1281
01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:16,720
Speaker 11: we love interesting things to look into, and so unfortunately

1282
01:05:16,760 --> 01:05:18,800
Speaker 11: that can really take a part of the worst parts

1283
01:05:18,800 --> 01:05:20,960
Speaker 11: of us as humans. And I think that's what's happened

1284
01:05:20,960 --> 01:05:22,440
Speaker 11: for a lot of these people. I don't even really

1285
01:05:22,520 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 11: know if it's a left or right wing kind of thing.

1286
01:05:25,320 --> 01:05:26,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, I actually don't. I don't.

1287
01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:29,240
Speaker 4: I think this is actually an important point because I

1288
01:05:29,240 --> 01:05:32,680
Speaker 4: don't ascribe any of this movement or whatever it is

1289
01:05:32,800 --> 01:05:36,480
Speaker 4: you want to call it a social media scene as

1290
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 4: right coded at all. It's conservative at all. It actually

1291
01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:42,480
Speaker 4: feels very left coded. To Blake's point, I mean, I

1292
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:45,880
Speaker 4: think the nickname he applied is probably apt, right, because

1293
01:05:46,160 --> 01:05:49,360
Speaker 4: so much of what we're seeing, you know, collective guilt

1294
01:05:49,480 --> 01:05:53,240
Speaker 4: for all Jewish people, right, just completely going like every

1295
01:05:53,280 --> 01:05:56,600
Speaker 4: answer it's like a Sunday Skit Sunday school kid where

1296
01:05:56,600 --> 01:05:59,120
Speaker 4: every answer is Jesus, you know, it's like every answer

1297
01:05:59,160 --> 01:06:00,760
Speaker 4: is Israel or jew Andrew.

1298
01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:03,480
Speaker 7: I'd be really interested if there was a way we

1299
01:06:03,520 --> 01:06:07,160
Speaker 7: could dissect this, For example, whether a lot of these

1300
01:06:07,160 --> 01:06:11,000
Speaker 7: people maybe they were originally apolitical or somewhat to the left,

1301
01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:13,600
Speaker 7: they identified as moving to the right, maybe during COVID

1302
01:06:13,680 --> 01:06:16,360
Speaker 7: as an example, where that was that realigned a lot

1303
01:06:16,400 --> 01:06:19,320
Speaker 7: of people politically. I'd be really interested if a lot

1304
01:06:19,360 --> 01:06:22,480
Speaker 7: of the people who are getting involved in this had

1305
01:06:22,600 --> 01:06:25,320
Speaker 7: that arc of starting on the left moving to the right.

1306
01:06:25,360 --> 01:06:28,600
Speaker 7: They maybe still identify as on the right, but these

1307
01:06:28,720 --> 01:06:32,000
Speaker 7: tendencies are resurfacing in some way. I think it'd be

1308
01:06:32,240 --> 01:06:36,880
Speaker 7: so interesting to unpack because this phenomenon is so alien

1309
01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:40,480
Speaker 7: to anything I've seen come out of the right anytime

1310
01:06:40,520 --> 01:06:44,240
Speaker 7: in the past twenty years. There's been sometimes they've gotten

1311
01:06:44,240 --> 01:06:47,080
Speaker 7: into theories, but the very personal aspect of it of

1312
01:06:47,160 --> 01:06:50,520
Speaker 7: really going after Erica, going after Turning Point, going after

1313
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:53,440
Speaker 7: people Charlie Knew, doxing them.

1314
01:06:53,480 --> 01:06:56,280
Speaker 5: It's just it's so left coded to me. Just I

1315
01:06:56,280 --> 01:06:58,439
Speaker 5: don't know where they're learning these habits from.

1316
01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:03,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I'm thinking of Bill Ayers and you

1317
01:07:03,080 --> 01:07:08,520
Speaker 4: know the idea of going after your political opponents personalizing it.

1318
01:07:08,880 --> 01:07:09,680
Speaker 3: I'm thinking of.

1319
01:07:11,720 --> 01:07:18,520
Speaker 4: The tactics where you use personal insults, where you personalize

1320
01:07:18,520 --> 01:07:22,040
Speaker 4: the attacks, and then you kind of make a sport

1321
01:07:22,080 --> 01:07:24,480
Speaker 4: out of terrorizing and harassing. That does seem to be

1322
01:07:25,000 --> 01:07:27,320
Speaker 4: a left wing tactic that we're seeing play out from

1323
01:07:27,440 --> 01:07:29,440
Speaker 4: right coded accounts.

1324
01:07:29,960 --> 01:07:31,400
Speaker 3: But I think to your point.

1325
01:07:31,120 --> 01:07:33,080
Speaker 4: Blake, there probably a lot of these people have been

1326
01:07:33,120 --> 01:07:36,800
Speaker 4: so journals on the political journeys and have been shape shifters,

1327
01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:40,600
Speaker 4: and they're returning to their neutral position, their default position.

1328
01:07:40,920 --> 01:07:41,560
Speaker 5: Very possible.

1329
01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:44,840
Speaker 7: I have another question, Joshua, since you're from that area

1330
01:07:45,080 --> 01:07:48,680
Speaker 7: around UVU, I know something we're all worried about is

1331
01:07:49,120 --> 01:07:52,120
Speaker 7: this will likely go towards a trial. They will be

1332
01:07:52,440 --> 01:07:57,000
Speaker 7: filling a jury. We asked Andrew Burkhart about this. What's

1333
01:07:57,040 --> 01:08:00,800
Speaker 7: the overall environment like in the area around where the

1334
01:08:00,800 --> 01:08:04,080
Speaker 7: shooting happened, where are there is there a high risk

1335
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:09,040
Speaker 7: that if you just selected twelve random registered voters from

1336
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:12,640
Speaker 7: Utah County that will get someone who'd just be very

1337
01:08:12,680 --> 01:08:15,320
Speaker 7: committed to I'm going to vote for an acquittal no

1338
01:08:15,440 --> 01:08:19,000
Speaker 7: matter what, because I just will never ever believe that

1339
01:08:19,080 --> 01:08:21,559
Speaker 7: Tyler Robinson did this. Should we worry about that?

1340
01:08:21,880 --> 01:08:23,040
Speaker 2: It's a concern I've had as well.

1341
01:08:23,040 --> 01:08:25,920
Speaker 11: It's something that's constantly in my mind, especially over the

1342
01:08:26,000 --> 01:08:29,479
Speaker 11: last seven days. I think the good news is that

1343
01:08:29,600 --> 01:08:32,280
Speaker 11: most people, if you ask them, do you know, like,

1344
01:08:32,320 --> 01:08:34,640
Speaker 11: have you looked into this a ton? Most of them

1345
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:37,320
Speaker 11: are gonna say, oh, I've heard these weird things about

1346
01:08:37,360 --> 01:08:40,280
Speaker 11: it online because unfortunately Canniston's has done a fantastic job

1347
01:08:40,280 --> 01:08:43,400
Speaker 11: of propagandizing all of this. But the good news is

1348
01:08:43,600 --> 01:08:46,439
Speaker 11: most people, to be honest with you, really don't know

1349
01:08:46,479 --> 01:08:48,880
Speaker 11: anything about this. And if they don't know anything about

1350
01:08:48,920 --> 01:08:51,680
Speaker 11: it one hundred percent, the prosecution is going to do

1351
01:08:51,760 --> 01:08:54,120
Speaker 11: a fantastic job convincing them. So I think that needs

1352
01:08:54,120 --> 01:08:57,240
Speaker 11: to be the strategy from the prosecution and picking the

1353
01:08:57,320 --> 01:08:59,639
Speaker 11: jury is they want people who really know as little

1354
01:08:59,640 --> 01:09:03,120
Speaker 11: as pop possible because it's just such a slam dunk.

1355
01:09:03,160 --> 01:09:05,479
Speaker 11: I mean, the preliminary hearing alone was enough evidence to

1356
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:08,240
Speaker 11: really bring a conviction pretty much, and I know for

1357
01:09:08,320 --> 01:09:10,320
Speaker 11: a fact they're going to have a lot more when

1358
01:09:10,320 --> 01:09:12,920
Speaker 11: they go to trial. So I guess overall, to answer

1359
01:09:12,920 --> 01:09:15,519
Speaker 11: your question, no, I'm not concerned. I think there are

1360
01:09:16,560 --> 01:09:19,960
Speaker 11: a lot of people, a meaningful group of people, who yes,

1361
01:09:20,000 --> 01:09:22,160
Speaker 11: they know a lot, Yes they are very bought into

1362
01:09:22,200 --> 01:09:24,760
Speaker 11: the conspiracies, but I think the prosecution can wead them

1363
01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:28,320
Speaker 11: out in an effective way. And the vast majority, I mean,

1364
01:09:28,320 --> 01:09:31,000
Speaker 11: I would say upwards of ninety to ninety five percent

1365
01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:35,080
Speaker 11: heard about this shooting thought it was awful, and beyond

1366
01:09:35,160 --> 01:09:37,080
Speaker 11: that they really don't know a lot about it.

1367
01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:41,200
Speaker 7: That's very reassuring to hear, and I can only hope

1368
01:09:41,200 --> 01:09:45,639
Speaker 7: this will grow because I just feel the nasty behavior

1369
01:09:45,680 --> 01:09:47,200
Speaker 7: that comes out of this, I feel it has to

1370
01:09:47,200 --> 01:09:51,320
Speaker 7: be very alienating. Again, I think back twenty twenty, for example,

1371
01:09:51,360 --> 01:09:54,040
Speaker 7: there was a lot of sympathy towards towards like the

1372
01:09:54,040 --> 01:09:58,599
Speaker 7: BLM movement, for example, and then they start torching cities,

1373
01:09:58,600 --> 01:10:02,000
Speaker 7: they start smashing shops, they start terrorizing people, and it

1374
01:10:02,040 --> 01:10:05,759
Speaker 7: turns people against that, and I just feel there's really

1375
01:10:05,800 --> 01:10:09,320
Speaker 7: nothing likable about this entire movement to me, So I

1376
01:10:09,360 --> 01:10:10,800
Speaker 7: just have to hope that I have to hope that

1377
01:10:10,840 --> 01:10:12,880
Speaker 7: you're correct about how this will evolve well.

1378
01:10:12,920 --> 01:10:15,720
Speaker 4: And Joshua, did you feel that the last week was

1379
01:10:15,760 --> 01:10:19,240
Speaker 4: a seminal week in the tide turning? Did you feel

1380
01:10:19,240 --> 01:10:22,120
Speaker 4: a discernible difference thirty seconds one percent?

1381
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:23,760
Speaker 11: Yeah, I mean there's a part of me and I

1382
01:10:23,840 --> 01:10:26,280
Speaker 11: this is totally a selfish human part of me that

1383
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:28,559
Speaker 11: is seeing all of the tides turning, and I'm like, well, dang,

1384
01:10:28,560 --> 01:10:30,080
Speaker 11: it would have been really awesome if you guys had

1385
01:10:30,120 --> 01:10:32,920
Speaker 11: like joined in in September when some of us actually

1386
01:10:32,960 --> 01:10:35,000
Speaker 11: just took a stand and had the courage to do that.

1387
01:10:35,240 --> 01:10:35,960
Speaker 2: But it's fine.

1388
01:10:36,080 --> 01:10:37,559
Speaker 11: At the end of the day, it's good that the

1389
01:10:37,560 --> 01:10:41,160
Speaker 11: tides are turning one hundred percent both with normal average

1390
01:10:41,200 --> 01:10:44,000
Speaker 11: people it's turning, but also you're seeing it all over x.

1391
01:10:44,240 --> 01:10:47,479
Speaker 11: I think Candice and her hole are are pretty much done.

1392
01:10:47,240 --> 01:10:50,240
Speaker 4: For Joshua Carr, thank you for being brave and for

1393
01:10:50,320 --> 01:10:51,360
Speaker 4: being brave early.

1394
01:10:51,600 --> 01:10:52,400
Speaker 3: We appreciate you.

1395
01:10:56,720 --> 01:10:58,800
Speaker 5: For more on many of these stories and news you

1396
01:10:58,800 --> 01:11:00,759
Speaker 5: can trust, go to Charlie her dot com.