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Speaker 1: Welcome to today's podcast sponsored by Hillsdale College. All Things

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Speaker 1: hillsdalet Hillsdale dot edu, or I encourage you to take

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Speaker 1: advantage of the many free online courses there, and of

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Speaker 1: course I'll listen to the Hillsdale Dialogue all of them

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Speaker 1: at q for Hillsdale dot com or just google, Apple

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Speaker 1: iTunes and Hillsdale Jority Leader Senator John Thune of South Dakota, Senator,

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Speaker 1: Merry Christmas to you. I hope you get out of

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Speaker 1: town soon, back to South Dakota. I suspect it's warmer there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Merry Christmas you. It's probably not warmer there, but

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Speaker 2: it's always better to be there than here.

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Speaker 1: Right, yeah, I would say so, thank you forgiving me

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Speaker 1: some time today. I want to look back at twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty five and a little bit forward and mostly good news,

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Speaker 1: some ongoing battles, and then a couple of disagreements I

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Speaker 1: want to talk to you about. Let me begin with

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Speaker 1: the best news. Since the reconciliation process came along in

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventy four, Republicans have successfully used it only four times,

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Speaker 1: including this year, So congratulations on that for the walks

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Speaker 1: out there, including me.

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Speaker 3: How difficult was that.

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Speaker 2: Very You know, the nice thing about reconciliation you as

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Speaker 2: you know, as you can do at fifty one votes

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Speaker 2: in the Senate would typically take sixty. So it is

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Speaker 2: an opportunity when you have unified control of the government

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Speaker 2: like we do right now, House, Senate and White House,

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Speaker 2: to do really big consequential things. And we used it

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Speaker 2: for that reason. We got a lot of really big

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Speaker 2: consequential things done. But just getting fifty one, you know,

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Speaker 2: keeping Republicans united to even pass something with a simple

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Speaker 2: majority was incredibly challenging, especially something is you know, it

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Speaker 2: has as far reaching and had as many moving parts

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Speaker 2: as the bill that we passed last summer did. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: you want to you want to make use of it

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Speaker 2: in a way that creates policy that's good for a

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Speaker 2: really long time. And most of the stuff that we

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Speaker 2: did in there, especially on the tax side, we made permanent.

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Speaker 1: So those oh, thank god the clip what it kell.

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Speaker 1: But for the people who are trying to keep score

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Speaker 1: at home two thousand and one, two thousand and three,

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Speaker 1: two thousand and seventeen, when it was Speaker Ryan and

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Speaker 1: Leader McConnell, and then twenty twenty five, do you think

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Speaker 1: there will be another one?

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Speaker 3: Later could be.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm open to that, and some of our

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Speaker 2: colleagues are interested in another reconciliation bills. Well, we actually

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Speaker 2: have a couple of vehicles available to us. The way

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Speaker 2: the Democrats finished up, there was a they didn't do

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Speaker 2: a budget that last year. So we took their basically

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Speaker 2: shell and legislative vehicle their budget and did it. So

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Speaker 2: we actually have two that we could still do this

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Speaker 2: next year if we wanted to, and if there's a

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Speaker 2: reason to, if we come together behind some healthcare proposal

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Speaker 2: that we think we want to make permanent and create

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Speaker 2: more affordable healthcare, I could see that happening. But I

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Speaker 2: think there it's really important that you know the stuff

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Speaker 2: that we did in this first one, which again you know,

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Speaker 2: if you look at the kind of categorize it as

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Speaker 2: safe streets, more money in people's pockets, and new opportunities

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Speaker 2: to get a hit for the American people and on

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Speaker 2: tax stuff, energy stuff, regulatory, you know, the newborn accounts,

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Speaker 2: school choice, childcare, things that the Democrats been trying to

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Speaker 2: do for years. We were able to get done in

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Speaker 2: this build, and only on our terms, and so it

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Speaker 2: was really really a consequential piece of legislation, and we'll

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Speaker 2: look for other opportunities if things come along in the

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Speaker 2: tax space, from the healthcare space, and we want to,

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Speaker 2: you know, do some things that can make policy that

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Speaker 2: will take us in a different direction, particularly on healthcare,

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Speaker 2: to make it more affordable than yes, we're open using it.

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Speaker 1: Well, I want to remind people what would have happened

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Speaker 1: had you not. And reconcilation was very hard this year

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Speaker 1: because the leader then had to work with Speaker Johnson.

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Speaker 1: And not only is it fifty one votes in the Senate,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's a close run thing. Everything in the

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Speaker 1: House is. So you two may have the best working

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Speaker 1: relationship in the years I've been doing this between the

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Speaker 1: House and the Senate. Would you will you think that

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Speaker 1: will stand up?

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Speaker 4: I do.

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Speaker 2: Mike Johnson is terrific in what he does and as

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Speaker 2: just a he's a character guy and so I really

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Speaker 2: enjoy working with him where we we have. He's got

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Speaker 2: he's got a really hard job, as you point out,

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Speaker 2: I mean talk about a narrow majority he has to

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Speaker 2: navigate there. We have a similar situation, but this is

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Speaker 2: even more I think complicated, frankly, but so we meet

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Speaker 2: every week. We're meeting later today. We talk regularly. I

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Speaker 2: talked to him on the phone yesterday, and so it's

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Speaker 2: a it's a really good working relationship you and one

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Speaker 2: that is conducive to getting things done. But I can't

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Speaker 2: tell you how hard and challenging and complicated it is

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Speaker 2: with those narrow majorities, just keeping people together, you know,

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Speaker 2: on on what are some very complicated and challenging issues.

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Speaker 1: And President Trump's not a shrinking violent he has opinions.

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Speaker 1: Well there is that has opinions. Let me go to

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Speaker 1: the second Big Deal, and again this is for want.

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Speaker 1: You used the nuclear option, and I applaud that was

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Speaker 1: a tough thing to decide to do, but you did it,

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Speaker 1: and I'm glad you did it. Again, Let's remind people

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Speaker 1: what you had to do right.

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Speaker 2: Well, and frankly, that was really hard to begin. You

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Speaker 2: had to get people who were in our conference. We

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Speaker 2: had to do it with fifty one days. We did

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Speaker 2: all with all Republicans, and honestly, we held every way together,

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Speaker 2: which I think was pretty remarkable. But we did a

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Speaker 2: ton of education and reforming and and you know, the

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Speaker 2: idea around how the nominations process historically worked and it's

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Speaker 2: supposed to work, and the Democrats had virtually blown it up.

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Speaker 2: I mean they literally President Trump's first president of history

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Speaker 2: not to have a single one of his nominees approved

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Speaker 2: by the voice fold or unanimous consent, which is typically

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Speaker 2: it's the expedited way of getting non controversial nominees through

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Speaker 2: the process. And MS were just forcing us to vote

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Speaker 2: literally on every you know, not just the top level

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Speaker 2: people the cabinet level, which we do, but sub cabinet

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Speaker 2: level and below. And it had change. Couldn't continue on

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Speaker 2: this pace. The president never would have got his people

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Speaker 2: in place. So we came up with a rules change,

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Speaker 2: you know, something refer it as a tactical nuke instead

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Speaker 2: of a strategic nuke. But we did some things that

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Speaker 2: created what frankly, had been the practice for a long

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Speaker 2: time in the Senate, and that is on these non

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Speaker 2: concert controversial noms being able to move them quickly in

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Speaker 2: an expedite way. So we're now stacking him. We're going

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Speaker 2: to move a stack later. Today there are ninety seven

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Speaker 2: and this bunch oh wow. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, you, however, have a disagreement with the president, and

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Speaker 1: I am on your side on this on preserving the

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Speaker 1: legislative filibuster. Have you persuaded him yet that we really

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Speaker 1: don't want to change that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, good luck with persuading him, Hugh. He is

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Speaker 2: he is very He has a strong view on it,

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Speaker 2: and which I appreciate and I'm sympathetic to because of

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Speaker 2: the obstacles the Democrat throw up against him. I mean,

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Speaker 2: the the way that they're playing this, the Trump derangement

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Speaker 2: syndrome is epic and real, and these Democrats are blinded

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Speaker 2: by their hatred of the President and so they are

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Speaker 2: not They don't want to do anything in any way

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Speaker 2: that works with us to achieve his objectives or his

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Speaker 2: goals or his agenda. And so I understand the presence frustration.

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Speaker 2: But I also know that at least historically, the filibuster

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Speaker 2: and as you know, since its inception, unlimited debate has

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Speaker 2: been a feature of the United States and then going

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Speaker 2: back to seventeen eighty nine and then now, it takes

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Speaker 2: a supermajority still to this day to do anything here.

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Speaker 2: And I think that makes sense on legislation. It forces collaboration,

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Speaker 2: it gives a voice to the minority, and I think

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Speaker 2: it's protected Republicans and conservatives in this country through the

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Speaker 2: years from a lot of really bad stuff the Democrats

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Speaker 2: would have done if they could have done in the

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Speaker 2: fifty one vote. So I know it's controversial, but I

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Speaker 2: think it's something that has protected Republicans way off more

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Speaker 2: often any benefit we might get from getting rid of it.

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Speaker 1: And it's a defensible line around the Supreme Court. And

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Speaker 1: I tell everyone, if they ever blow up the filibuster

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Speaker 1: and they moved to expand the court and pack the court,

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Speaker 1: we will have lost the rule of law. So the

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Speaker 1: filibuster is like the first trench they have to get

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Speaker 1: over to get to the court, and we can't have

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Speaker 1: that happen now. To my surprise, Leader Throne, two Congressional

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Speaker 1: Review Acts passed. I didn't even know that they were there.

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Speaker 1: I thought maybe people forgot about it. But I listened

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Speaker 1: to Dan Sullivan. That really has saved our bacon in Alaska.

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Speaker 1: I had totally forgotten about those things, and you got

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Speaker 1: two of them through last week.

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Speaker 2: We did, and that makes twenty four for the year.

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Speaker 2: And they're rolling back bard some Biden regulations that in

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Speaker 2: many cases, and as Dan Sullivan points out, there were

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Speaker 2: seventy if you can believe the seventy Biden regulations that

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Speaker 2: went after the Energy industry in the state of Alaska.

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Speaker 2: It was almost like he singled them out and it

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Speaker 2: was just, you know, had a specific team of blowing

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Speaker 2: up the state of Alaska. So we've restored some sanity,

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Speaker 2: particularly in the area of energy, but a lot of

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Speaker 2: these Biden error regulations that needed to go by the wayside.

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Speaker 2: We use the Congression Review Act, which is a legislative

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Speaker 2: vehicle available to do that, and twenty two of the

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Speaker 2: twenty four that we've passed through the Senate have now

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Speaker 2: been signed in the law by the President. So it's

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Speaker 2: a mechanism to undo a lot of the damage done

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Speaker 2: by the previous administration. We've used it, I think very

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Speaker 2: effectively got rid of the California the EPA waiver, which

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Speaker 2: would have required that electric vehicles be thirty five percent

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Speaker 2: of the cars in the country next year and twenty

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Speaker 2: thirty five one hundred percent, which is just virtually impossible

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Speaker 2: and crazy. And California had managed to export that policeyat

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Speaker 2: to eighteen other states around the country. So we came

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Speaker 2: up with a fairly creative way of taking that down.

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Speaker 2: But that's also something I think as we look back

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Speaker 2: on this past year as a real I think accomplishment,

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Speaker 2: Republicans together to undo a lot of the Biden your damage, a.

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Speaker 1: Lot of legislative wins. But sometimes it's also important just

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Speaker 1: not to lose. And you didn't lose. You didn't blink

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Speaker 1: in the shutdown. I don't know if that was ever

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Speaker 1: in doubt?

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Speaker 3: Was it?

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Speaker 1: Because you just couldn't blink there? And I'm so glad

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Speaker 1: you didn't.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's as you know, it's hard because

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Speaker 2: there's a lot of pressure and you've got people, i

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Speaker 2: mean people in our office. Every day you come in,

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Speaker 2: you aren't getting paid, and it's you know, becomes a

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Speaker 2: very personal issue. But what they did was just unprecedented

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Speaker 2: and completely uncalled for. I mean, they got themselves in

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Speaker 2: over their skis, and the left, the far left in

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Speaker 2: this country, was calling the shots and Chuck Schumer was

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Speaker 2: taking his orders put you know, walked us marshed us

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Speaker 2: into this thing. It was totally unnecessary, totally uncalled for,

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Speaker 2: and frankly unprecedented in historic what they did, you know,

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Speaker 2: and we, for forty three days endured it. The American

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Speaker 2: people had to endure it. But if we had even

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Speaker 2: given in and rewarded that kind of bad behavior, we

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Speaker 2: would just get more of it. You see more and

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Speaker 2: more of that. So it was important that we hold

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Speaker 2: the line. And you know, it's a but it's again

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Speaker 2: another indication of just the hatred that the left has

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Speaker 2: for the President of the United States. We see it playing

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Speaker 2: out every single day here in the Senate.

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Speaker 3: I want to add another category.

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Speaker 1: You don't have to do anything when the war power

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Speaker 1: is invoked by the president. I know the War Powers

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Speaker 1: Act I think is unconstitutional, But when he did Operation

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Speaker 1: Midnight Hammer, when we're doing the interdictions in the Caribbean

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Speaker 1: and the flotilla and who knows what's been announced at

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Speaker 1: five o'clock to night, you have led the Republicans in

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Speaker 1: standing behind the president. I don't think we've lost anyone,

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Speaker 1: with the exception perhaps of Senator Paul on a thing

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Speaker 1: or two. Am I right about that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's correct. I mean, there are others who were

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Speaker 2: sympathetic to the argument that's made on that particular issue.

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Speaker 2: But I think the presence perfectly within his rights as

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Speaker 2: the command in Chief to exercise the authority that he

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Speaker 2: has under the Constitution to protect Americans an American interest,

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Speaker 2: and that's certainly what he's been doing with these targeting

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Speaker 2: these terrorist cartels that are poisoning any American people with

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Speaker 2: the drugs that they've been bringing into this country. And

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Speaker 2: so you know, there's always going to be questions around that,

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Speaker 2: and of course, especially now because it's this president, the

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Speaker 2: Democrats have really hypercharged their attacks on him. But he's

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Speaker 2: had good support from Republicans here because we believe he's

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Speaker 2: on the right track when it comes to protecting Americans

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Speaker 2: and that's his peace. Whose strength is you know, the

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Speaker 2: policy he's adopted and one that I agree with and share.

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Speaker 2: It's a dangerous world and this president is not going

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Speaker 2: to shy away from doing what it takes to protect Americans.

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Speaker 1: I want to add as well. Anti Semitism is everywhere,

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Speaker 1: and we saw it in Bondai Beach in Australia. I

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Speaker 1: think it may have a role in the murder of

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Speaker 1: the mit professor. I don't know any anything about Brown.

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Speaker 1: I'm not ruling it out. But you've kept the caucus

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Speaker 1: together and united behind our ally Israel. That's getting tough

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Speaker 1: for every day given what's happening to the Democratic Party.

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Speaker 1: Is that on the agenda for twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 2: It is And I think that notwithstanding what is happening

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Speaker 2: to the and I don't understand, you know, with Democrats

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Speaker 2: in this country, that used to be a bipartisan issue,

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Speaker 2: but they have their political laugh. The Prohomas wing of

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Speaker 2: the Democrat Party is ascendant right now. It's where the

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Speaker 2: energy is and a lot of the money is in

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Speaker 2: Democrat politics. You see it playing out in some of

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Speaker 2: these elections around the country. And that's really unfortunate because

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Speaker 2: support for Israel is a time honored policy of this

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Speaker 2: country and our greatest ally in that part of the world,

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Speaker 2: and an ally with whom we have so much in

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Speaker 2: common on you know, going back to faith, tradition, to

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Speaker 2: the economy, to national security interests, into democracy. There are

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Speaker 2: just so many reasons why our support for is needs

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Speaker 2: to be on equivocal, especially to time when they are

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Speaker 2: constantly under attack. And so yeah, it's hard to explain

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Speaker 2: where the Dems are. But we will continue here at

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Speaker 2: least in the Senate on the Republican side of the aisle,

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Speaker 2: with continuing a very strong message of support and backing

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Speaker 2: it up with actions now later.

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Speaker 3: It's important for realize.

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Speaker 1: You not only have to move legislation and get the

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Speaker 1: caucus there, and you have to get stuff done and

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Speaker 1: stop stuff from happening.

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Speaker 3: But it's also important you got to look ahead.

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Speaker 1: You got to hold the majority, and that means Senator

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Speaker 1: Collins next year, Senator Houston, Ohio, even Senator Sullivan giving

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Speaker 1: their screwe voting system up there. And you've got open

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Speaker 1: seats in North Carolina, Kentucky and Iowa. A great Mitch

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Speaker 1: McConnell's stepping down, Jony Earns is stepping down. Tom Tillis

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Speaker 1: is stepping down. How do you feel about who you've

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Speaker 1: recruited and how it's going on those three vacancies in

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Speaker 1: our three target Senators Collins, Houston, and Sullivan.

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Speaker 2: We feel really about where those races all are. You

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Speaker 2: it's a it's a midterm election, and you you have

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Speaker 2: correctly as you always be diagnosed where the races and

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Speaker 2: where our challenges aren't vulnerabilities are around the country. But

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Speaker 2: you know, midterm elections there's typically you're you're facing a

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Speaker 2: little bit of a headwind. But these are really strong

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Speaker 2: incumbents and case of Senator Collins has run against you know,

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Speaker 2: so many times outperformed Republicans not only in her state

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Speaker 2: but all over the country. And Houston is a great

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Speaker 2: new senator from Ohio, really accomplished, hard working, and and

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Speaker 2: I think he's going to be in great shape there

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Speaker 2: and really important too because of who he's running against.

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Speaker 2: Democrats recruited Shard Brown and a far left Democrat and

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Speaker 2: somebody we need to make sure that doesn't come back

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Speaker 2: to the Senate. So we're gonna be working hard on

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Speaker 2: that one. Of course, Ashley Hinson's a great recruit in Iowa.

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Speaker 2: Were really delighted that she stepped up into that race.

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Speaker 2: We hate to lose Joni, but Ashley will be a

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Speaker 2: great replacement. But it's going to take a lot of resources.

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Speaker 2: And you know, clearly we need the President and being

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Speaker 2: out there helping these folks and then also having a

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Speaker 2: record of accomplishment to run on, which I think they do,

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Speaker 2: and then you know, we get those states. As you mentioned,

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Speaker 2: we've got some pickup opportunities too, and we're gonna be

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Speaker 2: working hard not only to protect and preserve our majority,

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Speaker 2: but hopefully to expand upon it. But that'll take a

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Speaker 2: huge team effort, you know, the President and our incumbents,

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Speaker 2: our challengers, all of our supporters out there and donors

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Speaker 2: working together to keep the team, to keep the team

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Speaker 2: on the field and make sure you have the ability.

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Speaker 1: I haven't forgotten Michigan and Georgia, maybe even Minnesota, but

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Speaker 1: that's for another time. You also have to start recruiting

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Speaker 1: an n RSC chair for the next cycle, don't you

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Speaker 1: have you got anyone in mind? Or you're talking to people,

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Speaker 1: there are.

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Speaker 2: Some folks who have an interest in that. And yeah,

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Speaker 2: we get some I believe it or not. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's a hard job. As you know, you're going out

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Speaker 2: every day every week basically trying to raise resources to

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Speaker 2: support the team, and takes an enormous amount of time.

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Speaker 2: So but we get people who are really I'm so

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Speaker 2: good grateful that we got people who really are difference

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Speaker 2: makers here and see that as an important role. And

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Speaker 2: I think we'll we'll have a good person in that spot.

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Speaker 3: Stand by.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to come back with the final part of

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Speaker 1: my interview with Leader Thune in a little bit.

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Speaker 3: Let me remind you.

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Speaker 1: Angel Tree, we're running out of time. We are down

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Speaker 1: to eight days, and we can take care of more kids.

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Speaker 1: Of the one point five million children whose mom and

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Speaker 1: or dad are in jail find bars. They get a bible,

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Speaker 1: a present, a note from mom or dad, about the President,

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Speaker 1: how much they love them, and most important of all,

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Speaker 1: the connection to Angel Tree. You can call Angel Tree

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Speaker 1: a triple A two oh six twenty seven sixty four.

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Speaker 3: Whether you give a.

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Speaker 1: Huge gift like my friends Carolyn jan did, or a

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Speaker 1: small gift like many of you have sent ten or

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Speaker 1: fifteen or twenty dollars. God sees, I see, we see,

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Speaker 1: and more important, those kids receive on Christmas something from their.

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Speaker 3: Mothers and fathers. Thank you an.

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Speaker 1: Opportunity to talk to my guy, Governor, Glenn Youngkin of Virginia.

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Speaker 1: I say my governor for another month. He's going to

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Speaker 1: be my governor, and I no doubt he's going to

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Speaker 1: run through the tape, but I wanted to get in

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Speaker 1: line early for all the exit interviews. Governor, thank you

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Speaker 1: for making time today. Good to see you, and Merry Christmas.

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Speaker 5: Merry Christmas.

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Speaker 2: You.

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Speaker 5: Thank you for making time for me.

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Speaker 6: And I got to tell you what an honor it

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Speaker 6: is to not only be with you on your great

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Speaker 6: radio show, but also to have a chance to reflect

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Speaker 6: on what's happened over the last four years, because it's

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Speaker 6: been just amazing.

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Speaker 1: Well that is my first question here. What do you

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Speaker 1: think are your greatest accomplishments and the state's greatest accomplishments.

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Speaker 1: And I want to give you the runway because there's

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Speaker 1: a lot that got done.

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Speaker 5: Well. Thank you for asking the question.

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Speaker 6: And Hugh, I think that the story of the last

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Speaker 6: four years has been one of massive transformation. It's been

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Speaker 6: one of competing and winning. It's been one of promises

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Speaker 6: made and promises kept, and it's.

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Speaker 5: Been a story of Virginia leading again.

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Speaker 6: I was humbled the other day when I I heard

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Speaker 6: someone described the last four years as the Great Virginia Renaissance.

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Speaker 6: But you have to go back to where we started

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Speaker 6: to really put it in perspective. Back in twenty twenty one,

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Speaker 6: Virginia was struggling. It was stalled and coming out of

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Speaker 6: the pandemic, we'd had twenty five thousand small businesses shut,

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Speaker 6: more people move away. We were forty seventh in the

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Speaker 6: nation and job recovery, we had a twenty year higher

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Speaker 6: murder rate. And by the way, Virginia was ranked top

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Speaker 6: in the country and learning loss in fourth grade reading,

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Speaker 6: in math because the schools were all shut. I mean,

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Speaker 6: that's what we walked into and we went to work,

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Speaker 6: and when Virginia's hired me. I told him that I

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Speaker 6: was going to go to work to transform things, to

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Speaker 6: change things.

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Speaker 5: And that's exactly what we've done.

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Speaker 6: We had to fix business in Virginia and open it up,

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Speaker 6: and Virginia's had just a remarkable run. We've had one

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Speaker 6: hundred and fifty six billion dollars of investment commitments from

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Speaker 6: companies over the last four years, and Hugh, that's as

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Speaker 6: much as the last six governors combined. It's led to

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Speaker 6: record job growth, that's led to record revenue growth for

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Speaker 6: the Commonwealth, and it's been that financial strength that's then

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Speaker 6: allowed us to turn around and provide record tax relief

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Speaker 6: nine billion dollars, a tax relief to Virginians beyond anything

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Speaker 6: that's ever been seen in Virginia before, and that I

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Speaker 6: think has really led to the biggest shift, which is

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Speaker 6: more people moving to Virginia from the other forty nine

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Speaker 6: states than moving away for the first time in a decade.

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Speaker 5: That's really the hearts of our effort.

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Speaker 6: But one of the things our record revenue allowed us

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Speaker 6: to do was tackle I think some of the most

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Speaker 6: challenging issues that Virginia had, which was education, and at

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Speaker 6: the top of the list was getting parents back in

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Speaker 6: front of their students and their children at the head

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Speaker 6: of the table. I mean, listen, number one in the

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Speaker 6: nation and learning loss in reading and math and fourth grade.

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Speaker 6: I mean, it's just stunning where Virginia was with parents

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Speaker 6: being shoved out the door in their kids' lives. And

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Speaker 6: on top of that, we'd seen the systematic degradation of

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Speaker 6: expectations of excellence.

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Speaker 5: So we went to.

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Speaker 6: Work, and I have to say today I signed the

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Speaker 6: bill to get the masks off of kids, to allow

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Speaker 6: parents to take sexual explicit materials out of their child's curriculum,

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Speaker 6: but on top of that, to totally transform the way

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Speaker 6: that we accredited our schools so that now we know

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Speaker 6: whether they are actually teaching the children or not. The

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Speaker 6: work we've done to get cell phones out of the

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Speaker 6: classrooms with bell to bell, cell phone free education across

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Speaker 6: the entire state, and finally we've led the nation and

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Speaker 6: reducing chronic absenteeism. All of that HUE has really been

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Speaker 6: part of re establishing expectations of excellence. And guess what,

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Speaker 6: we made the standardized tests harder and the students did better.

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Speaker 3: How about that?

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Speaker 5: And finally, this last year we were named the best

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Speaker 5: state in America. For teachers. So you know, education has.

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Speaker 6: Been one of our big, big, big opportunities, and I

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Speaker 6: think we've done fonstrated that you can transform a broken

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Speaker 6: educational system and for the benefit of students and parents.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, anecdotal evidence and evidence of anecdotes. Lawyers like to

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Speaker 1: say that, But my anecdote is my four grandkids who

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Speaker 1: are military kids, began in Virginia, went to California, could

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Speaker 1: not wait to get back to Virginia schools because of

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Speaker 1: the turnaround here and the emphasis on quality. I think

438
00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:27,680
Speaker 1: I don't know firsthand, but I also think you have

439
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:31,320
Speaker 1: left a mark on Virginia higher education, the state university

440
00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:31,880
Speaker 1: system here.

441
00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 3: Am I right about that?

442
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:36,720
Speaker 6: Yeah, We've gone to work in order to make it

443
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,719
Speaker 6: a system that's focused on merit, and to try to

444
00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:45,560
Speaker 6: match curriculum to job opportunities, and finally to bring the

445
00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 6: cost down because it's so hard for families in Virginia

446
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,840
Speaker 6: to afford these universities. And it's really just been the

447
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:55,560
Speaker 6: bully pulpit the Governor's office.

448
00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 5: I have really pushed them.

449
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,919
Speaker 6: We kept touish flat the first year and it's been

450
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:05,000
Speaker 6: an average of only two percent increases the last three years.

451
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:06,760
Speaker 5: Because there's plenty of money in the system.

452
00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 6: But I've also been so proud of our ability to

453
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:15,600
Speaker 6: match degree paths to the labor opportunities in Virginia. I mean,

454
00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 6: we've created hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of thousands of jobs,

455
00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:23,040
Speaker 6: and we need people to take those jobs. But to

456
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,400
Speaker 6: the blending of these two points is really important. We've

457
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:31,080
Speaker 6: created pathways for students to go straight to work, or

458
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:34,680
Speaker 6: go to college, or join our military, and that has

459
00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:37,840
Speaker 6: been one of our top priorities. There's not one size

460
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 6: fits all colleges and for everybody, and so now nearly

461
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 6: eighty percent of our students graduate from high school with

462
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:48,840
Speaker 6: an industry recognized credential, so they can go straight to work,

463
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 6: or they can go through one of our great JROTC

464
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:55,880
Speaker 6: programs and immediately enlist in the military, which, by the way,

465
00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:59,120
Speaker 6: is such a backbone of the Commonwealth of Virginia. This

466
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:03,640
Speaker 6: idea that going to work or joining the military should

467
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 6: be celebrated, I think is one of the big achievements

468
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 6: of the Commonwealth of Virginia. That's not the takeaway from

469
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 6: our great universities, but I do believe that there's a

470
00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:15,440
Speaker 6: pathway that's unique to every single Virginia kid.

471
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 5: And we got to open it up and let them

472
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:17,280
Speaker 5: chase it.

473
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:20,040
Speaker 3: Now you mentioned Billy Pulpit Governor.

474
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 1: I want to be the first, I'm sure among many

475
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 1: who also want to thank First Lady Youngkin for many things,

476
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 1: but especially one Pill can Kill campaign. I think she

477
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:31,560
Speaker 1: saved lives with that. I don't know where she came

478
00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:34,760
Speaker 1: up with it, but it's been brilliant. Also, bet she's

479
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 1: going to look forward to January eighteenth when you get

480
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:39,240
Speaker 1: a little break right.

481
00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 6: Well, I have to say the First Lady has been

482
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 6: extraordinary to serve with your wife and to see her

483
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:50,479
Speaker 6: do such amazing work. I mean, Virginia has led the

484
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 6: nation in reducing overdose deaths from fentnol, and she's been

485
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:59,360
Speaker 6: at the forefront. She's been traveling around the state speaking

486
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 6: with parents and students and coaches and pastors, making sure

487
00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 6: everybody understands the scourge of fentanyl. And then we've coupled

488
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,760
Speaker 6: that with a concentrated effort to interdict the drug trade.

489
00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:13,880
Speaker 6: We have seized enough fentanyl to kill every Virginia ten

490
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 6: times over. We have tried to really attack the gang

491
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 6: violence in Virginia. In our partnership with the federal government

492
00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 6: has been amazing. Through the Virginia Homeland Security Task Force,

493
00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:29,479
Speaker 6: we have arrested thousands and thousands and thousands of violent

494
00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:33,120
Speaker 6: criminals who are here illegally. We arrested the number three

495
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,120
Speaker 6: player in MS thirteen living right here in Virginia.

496
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:37,679
Speaker 5: And so it's been this combination of.

497
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,160
Speaker 6: The great work from my amazing wife Suzanne and law

498
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 6: enforcement that has enabled us to bring down fentanyl overdoses

499
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:46,160
Speaker 6: in such an extraordinary way.

500
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 1: Well, Governor, I hope after you are done, you'll come

501
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,280
Speaker 1: back and we'll take some time to talk about the media.

502
00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,480
Speaker 1: We'll kick Larry O'Connor around a little bit. But genuinely,

503
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 1: honestly thank you, because Virginia is a much better place

504
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,840
Speaker 1: to live for years after your governorship than when I

505
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 1: first got here. And I appreciate that you didn't have to.

506
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 5: Do this, and you did it.

507
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,639
Speaker 1: Neither did missus youngkin so on my behalf of my family,

508
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:11,640
Speaker 1: thank you. We appreciate your doing the time.

509
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 3: Greg.

510
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 5: God bless you, Hugh.

511
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 6: I wish you a very blessed Christmas, and most importantly,

512
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:18,920
Speaker 6: thank you for hiring me. What an honor it's been

513
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,920
Speaker 6: to see Virginia become the state that we all know.

514
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 1: She should be ay'm en to that Merry Christmas, Governor.

515
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:27,680
Speaker 1: Be well, I'll be right back in America. Stay two.

516
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 1: I've been a busy morning already, in a busy afternoon already,

517
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: but I did want to take a moment to say.

518
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:38,359
Speaker 1: I woke up this morning and opened up my text

519
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,960
Speaker 1: my emails, then I go to my ex account. It's

520
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: like a kick in the gut. Norman pod Hoortz had died.

521
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:50,199
Speaker 1: Now Norman pod Howartz is ninety six. His son is

522
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,720
Speaker 1: an acquaintance, a friend, a guest on this program known

523
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,119
Speaker 1: for a long time. I've only interviewed Norman Podhwarts a

524
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,880
Speaker 1: couple of times, but he's a giant in the American

525
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:04,359
Speaker 1: antheon of intellectuals and for different people. I heard this,

526
00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:06,600
Speaker 1: in fact, in real time. I listened to the commentary

527
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 1: pod today and John wasn't there sitting Shiven, no doubt.

528
00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:15,400
Speaker 1: But Abe Greenwald, Christine Rosen, and Eleanna Johnson were there

529
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:18,919
Speaker 1: and I was listening and taking notes. And they're all

530
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:21,840
Speaker 1: much younger than I am, right, so they all have

531
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 1: different understandings of Norman pod Hortz. For Abe Greenwald, Norman

532
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 1: pod Hoortz the great editor of commentary magazine for forever,

533
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:35,199
Speaker 1: great New York intellectual. For Abe, it's the guy who

534
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: introduced him to World War four, the guy who explained

535
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 1: what nine to eleven was about and what it meant.

536
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:48,679
Speaker 1: And for Christine Rosen, it was American intellectual history. And

537
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,919
Speaker 1: how much Norman pod Horts, who she got to know

538
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,399
Speaker 1: in person like I did not, how much he loves

539
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: the country, how he always used we versus I was

540
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:06,080
Speaker 1: absolutely a patriots patriot. And Eleana Johnson, who is young

541
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 1: enough to be my daughter, said about him, Look, he

542
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 1: was an editor's editor. And then they got to talking

543
00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,520
Speaker 1: about the fact that he was. He didn't need to

544
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:19,560
Speaker 1: have credit for what the work he did. They told

545
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:21,399
Speaker 1: him a couple of funny stories I had not heard,

546
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 1: including the fact that the famous Dictatorships and Double Standards

547
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,440
Speaker 1: article by Jane Kirkpatrick came in at one hundred pages,

548
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:36,920
Speaker 1: Harmon pod Hoort edited it down. Some magazines are writers magazines.

549
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: I think Eleana makes this point, or maybe Christine, or

550
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: maybe eight And you just send in whatever you send

551
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:44,400
Speaker 1: in and they check for typos, and they printed that's

552
00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 1: not commentary commentary, was it? But I'm a different age

553
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 1: and for me, Norman pod Horritz is one of the

554
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 1: two key intellectual figures of sort of growing up. There's

555
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 1: William F. Buckley and there's Norman pod Horitz. There's a

556
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: National View and there's common Jerry, And I can't say

557
00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:04,960
Speaker 1: this for sure.

558
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:07,680
Speaker 3: About either of them.

559
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 1: But I think I can say it about both of

560
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 1: them that if there hadn't been both of those guys,

561
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: there wouldn't have been a Reagan. The Reagan Revolution was

562
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: made possible by those two guys. And I'm not sure

563
00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 1: that Norman pod Hoorts that Reagan would have made it

564
00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 1: without Norman pod Hortz, because William F. Buckley had brought

565
00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 1: in and given voice to conservatives. But Norman pod Hortz

566
00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 1: brought in the neocons. And Richard Nixon used to say

567
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:43,960
Speaker 1: all the time about Goldwater people, you can't win without them,

568
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 1: but you.

569
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 3: Can't win with just them.

570
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:52,719
Speaker 1: So Norman pod Hortz brought in the neocons and broke

571
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 1: One of the key books of my intellectual growing up

572
00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: is Breaking Ranks, came out in nineteen eighty Already, you know,

573
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 1: I sort of solidified who I was when I read

574
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 1: Souls and Eatson. But to find out what the smart

575
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: people that neo cons were thinking. I had Buckley and

576
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 1: the regular conservatives, right, William F. Buckley, Catholic, Republican conservative

577
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 1: Yale for many of us, kind of our guiding light.

578
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:25,520
Speaker 1: And then Norman Podworts came in with the brass knuckles

579
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 1: and delivered the blow to the jaw. And I mean,

580
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:31,560
Speaker 1: New York intellectual life is not for the faint of heart.

581
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 1: And I only spent part of nineteen eighty there. But

582
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: that's why Nixon, when he left San Clementy, I was

583
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 1: working for him. Are n wanted to go back to

584
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:42,680
Speaker 1: New York because that's where the intellectual action was in

585
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:46,040
Speaker 1: the Cold War, and the Cold War went until eighty nine.

586
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:51,040
Speaker 1: So for me, I picked up commentary at college sometime

587
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 1: in the mid to late seventies and have never not

588
00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 1: been with it. But Norman pod Hoortz gave language to people,

589
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 1: taught them out to think about the Soviet Union along

590
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:01,680
Speaker 1: with Reagan.

591
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 3: Gave Reagan language. I mean, he gave.

592
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 1: Jeane Kirkpatrick the job because he published Dictatorships and double standards.

593
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 1: He published Daniel point Patrick moynihand he published James Q. Wilson,

594
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 1: every great thinker of the seventies. In the eighties wrote

595
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 1: for Commentary magazine and their symposium issues when they would

596
00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,000
Speaker 1: put one question on the table and they would get

597
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 1: fifty of the smartest people in the country to write

598
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,920
Speaker 1: about it, from all across the center right to the right.

599
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:37,720
Speaker 1: He may be with Buckley the two most important American

600
00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 1: intellectuals of the last hundred years.

601
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,400
Speaker 3: And I think I'm pretty comfortable saying that. More on him.

602
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 1: Go to the Commentary podcast today. Jay POD's not there today,

603
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:48,960
Speaker 1: but he'll be back eventually.

604
00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 3: Read up.

605
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 1: I see Tom Cotton has written a tribute to Norman

606
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,840
Speaker 1: pod Ortz. One of the giants, really one of the giants.

607
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,360
Speaker 1: We shall not see their like again until people rise

608
00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:05,400
Speaker 1: up to take on Jijon Ping in the Chinese communist parties.

609
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 3: Stay tuned, I'll be consumer.

610
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 1: Cellular is a great, great sponsor, and you ought to

611
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 1: check them out because you're probably paying too much for

612
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 1: your cell phone bill and it's not an expensive time

613
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:21,160
Speaker 1: of year, right Call one eight hundred four to one

614
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:24,960
Speaker 1: one forty four to fifty four to find out how

615
00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: much you can save and get your phone bill out

616
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:29,600
Speaker 1: before you do it, so you'll have it there and

617
00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: you'll see what you're paying for data and what they

618
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 1: can save you. Remember my promo code Hugh Hugh that

619
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,000
Speaker 1: will get you your second month for free. But do

620
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: you even know how much data you're paying for? Do

621
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 1: you even know how much you're paying? You get big

622
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 1: cell phone bills, but you'll mix up with your TV

623
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 1: bill and you might get a bundle. You have no

624
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,040
Speaker 1: idea what you're paying for cell phone bill. Well, they'll

625
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 1: walk you through it. And especially if you're fifty years

626
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 1: or older, you want to call one eight hundred four

627
00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 1: to one forty four to fifty four because they of

628
00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 1: an offer for people who are fifty that you'll love

629
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 1: two unlimited lines unlimited data for two lines for just

630
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 1: sixty dollars. That's just thirty dollars per line on limited.

631
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:15,440
Speaker 1: It's an easy way to manage your costs. It's great service.

632
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,440
Speaker 1: You don't have to sacrifice service for savings. You can

633
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,600
Speaker 1: have both. But you get your second month free when

634
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 1: you use the code Hues. So whether you go to

635
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:27,719
Speaker 1: Consumer Cellular dot com, slash shoe, or you call eight

636
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: hundred and four one one forty four fifty four, it's

637
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: time to check no. My exit interview, My interview with

638
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,120
Speaker 1: John Thune, I get an EGIT interview with Glenn Younkin,

639
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 1: and now I have my second exit interview of the

640
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:41,560
Speaker 1: day with Ohio's Attorney general and I think America's best

641
00:33:41,560 --> 00:33:45,080
Speaker 1: attorney general, David Yost, who's been laboring at that or

642
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 1: for eight years, and.

643
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,040
Speaker 3: I wanted to check in with him before he left town. Uh,

644
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 3: David Jos how are you in general and Jestic?

645
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 4: How are you?

646
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 3: Hugh? I'm good? Well, are we gonna win the National

647
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 3: champion You're the real buck guy. I'm just a fan.

648
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 1: You actually went there, You get two rings.

649
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 4: We're going to have a great run at the National Championship.

650
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 1: All right, I'm going out on a limb here and

651
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:10,720
Speaker 1: saying it's going to be two rings.

652
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 3: General. A couple of weeks ago, before.

653
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 1: I get to what you're going to do next and

654
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 1: what your greatest accomplishments are, you brought to my attention

655
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:21,279
Speaker 1: the City Club was going to cancel our friend Aaron Bear,

656
00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 1: and so I jumped on your bandwagon and they didn't

657
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:28,160
Speaker 1: cancel him. I guess they never even threatened to cancel

658
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:30,239
Speaker 1: them much. You're understanding of what happened there, but thank

659
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:31,359
Speaker 1: you for stepping into it.

660
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:33,480
Speaker 4: Well. I appreciate you picking it up.

661
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:38,799
Speaker 7: You put a national voice into the mix. Look, he

662
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 7: had been invited. He's an interesting guy. He's built an

663
00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:46,040
Speaker 7: incredible organization here called the Center for Christian Virtue, had

664
00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 7: been tremendously effective in the General Assembly. Doesn't win everything,

665
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 7: but he's made a lot of progress here in Ohio.

666
00:34:54,160 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 7: And the City Club, which fashions itself as a sitator

667
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:05,560
Speaker 7: free speech, invited him to come on January sixteenth and

668
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:09,279
Speaker 7: address their Cleveland audience. I don't need to tell you

669
00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:12,520
Speaker 7: that excuse maybe left of center a little bit a bit,

670
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:20,120
Speaker 7: and very appropriately he agreed.

671
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,560
Speaker 4: And then the word.

672
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 7: Got out and some lgbtq IA plus activists started passing

673
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 7: a petition and raising hell about the fact that this

674
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,120
Speaker 7: Christian activist was going to be allowed to come and

675
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:43,879
Speaker 7: address the City Club and asked for him to be deplatformed. Now,

676
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:48,200
Speaker 7: this is the same city club that had had a

677
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 7: national speaker in on gay rights during Pride Month last year,

678
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 7: So obviously they have already had that point of view

679
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:05,759
Speaker 7: in the BIGS. So it's a private organization. The First

680
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:09,280
Speaker 7: Amendment does not apply it to them. But I urged

681
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:14,200
Speaker 7: them to not abandon their position on free speech and

682
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 7: to not disinvite him, and that letter got out into

683
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 7: the wild, and fortunately, after a few days of consideration,

684
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 7: the board elected to confirm their invitation to airon He'll

685
00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:33,239
Speaker 7: be talking there in Cleveland to that audience on the

686
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 7: sixteenth of January. I was so pleased. I bought a

687
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 7: table and I'm going to bring some of my friends

688
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:42,240
Speaker 7: to you. He at least has a couple of folks.

689
00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:45,239
Speaker 1: I will be talking it out because City Club's a

690
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:48,840
Speaker 1: good organization. I didn't want them to actually bend or break.

691
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,480
Speaker 1: And so good for you for leading the fight, and

692
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 1: you've let a lot of fights. I wanted to talk

693
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:55,120
Speaker 1: to you about your eight years of Attorney General and

694
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,280
Speaker 1: then find out what you're going to do next, because

695
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 1: you've won a lot of big cases, especially on religious liberty.

696
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 1: What do you consider to be your triumphs in eight

697
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:06,359
Speaker 1: years as the age?

698
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:07,080
Speaker 3: Dad Yost?

699
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 4: Well, I've got another year to go before I leave office.

700
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 4: But you're right. I mean, we have been out there

701
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:15,560
Speaker 4: in the.

702
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 7: Trenches and some of the things are ones that have

703
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 7: been national and we led the Amika's effort on the

704
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:32,560
Speaker 7: Wisconsin Catholic Charities case that was about whether the government

705
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:36,680
Speaker 7: gets to decide whether your charity work is sufficiently religious

706
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:40,720
Speaker 7: enough to qualify for a tax exemption.

707
00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 4: Of course, Supreme Court said, no, government, you don't. You

708
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 4: don't get to use your your determination to decide what's

709
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 4: religious and what's not.

710
00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 7: But I think it's maybe the stuff I'm proudest of, Hugh.

711
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,719
Speaker 7: It's the little stuff that doesn't make the headlines. A

712
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 7: place called Dad's Place that stayed as a church in

713
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 7: downtown small town here in northwest Ohio, and the powers

714
00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 7: that they didn't like them staying open all night and

715
00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 7: ministering to people who were homeless and some of them,

716
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:23,319
Speaker 7: you know, quite tragic stories, and tried to use fire

717
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:27,880
Speaker 7: code and various municipal building codes to shut them down

718
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:34,879
Speaker 7: because they didn't want them there. First, Liberty Institute represented them,

719
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 7: and I was proud that we weighed in as well

720
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 7: at both the trial court level and the state appellate

721
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:48,880
Speaker 7: court level. That case was just remanded with instructions to

722
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 7: the local court that they could not use these laws

723
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 7: to harass Dad's Place in carrying out their their religious mission.

724
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:06,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, or generally every time I turn.

725
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 7: Around again here in Ohio, go ahead, Yeah, well, every

726
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:13,760
Speaker 7: time I turn around your turn around ce Liberty.

727
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 1: You just did it again and again. I think you

728
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:18,080
Speaker 1: did it with the Toledo school system. I think you've

729
00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:20,680
Speaker 1: done it Amika's briefs and you've been You've written a

730
00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:23,280
Speaker 1: lot of letters to stop people from doing dumb things.

731
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 1: And you do have a year left. You were going

732
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:27,799
Speaker 1: to run for governor and then you decided not to.

733
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 1: Are you eyeing one of the new congressional districts?

734
00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:34,400
Speaker 7: No Congress is so broken, I don't want to go

735
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 7: to Washington. Look, I'm going to stay involved in There's

736
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 7: no shuffle board court in my immediate future.

737
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:44,280
Speaker 4: But I'm going to be looking at some other options.

738
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:45,399
Speaker 4: Whether that's helping to.

739
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:49,080
Speaker 7: Train young the next generation of lawyers to stand up

740
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:54,719
Speaker 7: for our constitution, or whether it's entering, you know, some

741
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:58,600
Speaker 7: sort of public interest law firm and doing some work there.

742
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:04,480
Speaker 7: When I'm done as Attorney General next year, I will

743
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:05,359
Speaker 7: stay in the fight.

744
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:08,760
Speaker 3: Now, General, what I really wanted to ask you about?

745
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,920
Speaker 1: And it's kind of sneaky, tricky, I add on the

746
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:17,200
Speaker 1: President's ais are. Yesterday, David Sachs and the President issued

747
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 1: an executive order that I think it's unprecedented. And I

748
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 1: asked David and he's unaware of it, of any president

749
00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:28,279
Speaker 1: preempting state purporting to preem states from regulating AI out

750
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 1: of their state legislature. They of course want to stop

751
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: California from screwing up AI for everyone, just like they

752
00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:38,280
Speaker 1: screwed up cars for everyone, but that had to be repealed.

753
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:42,960
Speaker 1: You're a federalist, You're like, mister federalist, what do you

754
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 1: think of that executive order? And David was quick to say,

755
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 1: you know, Congress can did preempt under the Interstate Commerce Clause.

756
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:51,759
Speaker 1: I know that, but it's an EO from Article two.

757
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 1: Just I don't know if you've even thought it through yet.

758
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:56,319
Speaker 1: But what's your initial reaction to that?

759
00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:01,200
Speaker 7: Yeah, So, actually, when I heard the first news about this,

760
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:06,399
Speaker 7: I was immediately concerned. I don't think there is such

761
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 7: a thing as Article two preemption, but.

762
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 4: I understand the president's goal, and it's a worthy goal.

763
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 4: I've got a.

764
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 7: Team that's tearing THEEO apart, looking at the potential legislation

765
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:25,200
Speaker 7: that we have in the General Assembly. Here at the moment,

766
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 7: the federal government is not taking any action to prevent

767
00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 7: us from doing anything withholding any resources.

768
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 4: So it's a little.

769
00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:38,000
Speaker 7: Bit academic right now, But as somebody who plays an

770
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 7: academic occasionally on the media, I have to say, I've

771
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:45,839
Speaker 7: got I've got some concerns about this.

772
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:48,920
Speaker 4: That ultimately will be dependent upon.

773
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:53,320
Speaker 7: How does the President attempt to.

774
00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:55,359
Speaker 4: Implement that EO?

775
00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 7: And I question whether there's such a thing as Article two.

776
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 1: I've never seen one, and he can stand up task

777
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:08,240
Speaker 1: force the Department of Justice to sue for it takes

778
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:11,719
Speaker 1: to interfere with interstate commerce. But that bringing me my

779
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 1: last question, and I'm hitting you with cold and if

780
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:16,480
Speaker 1: you haven't thought about it, you don't have to answer it.

781
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:19,960
Speaker 1: There are district court vacancies, there are six circuit vacancies

782
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 1: coming up. Do you ever want to be a judge?

783
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 1: You're always in the fight? Would you want to be

784
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:24,560
Speaker 1: a judge?

785
00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:28,279
Speaker 7: You know, I wouldn't have wanted to even consider that

786
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 7: for most of my career because I'm an advocate.

787
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:32,560
Speaker 4: I'm too passionate to be a judge, I've said.

788
00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:36,279
Speaker 7: But as I've matured a little bit, I think I

789
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 7: might enjoy that work. Of course, questions in this day

790
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 7: and age, are my years to advance to qualify? And

791
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:46,680
Speaker 7: I guess that's for somebody else to decide.

792
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: You know, I would say that Senators Houston and Marino.

793
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 1: I'll bet you're good for twenty five.

794
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:54,359
Speaker 6: Yeah.

795
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 1: My grandfather stayed on the bench until he was eighty

796
00:42:57,640 --> 00:42:59,960
Speaker 1: eight or something like that. So he was a spiritual

797
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:03,400
Speaker 1: judge up in Jefferson County, in Ashonvilla County, in Jefferson City.

798
00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:06,799
Speaker 1: And I think it would be great. And I'm glad

799
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 1: to hear you not say no, not say yes. I

800
00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 1: want to do it, not say no, just that you

801
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:15,480
Speaker 1: would think about it. David Merry Christmas, thanks for your

802
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:18,520
Speaker 1: work on behalf of First Amendment issues and for the

803
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:22,680
Speaker 1: Center for Christian Virtue and for the Republican Attorney General's

804
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,399
Speaker 1: Association across the country. And I don't think you're too

805
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:28,479
Speaker 1: long in the twoth I hope somebody listening. David Joes,

806
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:31,399
Speaker 1: thank you friend. Stay tuned, America. I'll be right back

807
00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:37,640
Speaker 1: on the UWIT Show. Welcome back in America. I'm Hugh Hewitt.

808
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:38,320
Speaker 6: Sleepy.

809
00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:42,799
Speaker 1: After the massacre in Australia, I immediately began to think

810
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:46,520
Speaker 1: of Andrew McCarthy, longtime prosecutor with the Southern District of

811
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 1: New York. He put the blind shake fine bars and

812
00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:51,399
Speaker 1: broke up the ring and convicted the ring that blew

813
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 1: up the World Trade Center the first time. Then he

814
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:56,360
Speaker 1: wrote two books, one of them Willful Blindness. That was

815
00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:58,400
Speaker 1: his first book. I interviewed him for c SPAN on

816
00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:02,000
Speaker 1: that book and then the Grand Ge. Then after the

817
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 1: shooting at Brown I thought about him a second time,

818
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 1: and then after the subway attack in New York, I

819
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:10,960
Speaker 1: asked Danielle, our booking producer, to please get Andy, and

820
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:14,760
Speaker 1: he's available on short notice. Andy welcome. How are you doing.

821
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:16,760
Speaker 1: I mean, it's kind of a bad day for everyone.

822
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:18,919
Speaker 1: Could Norman bot Hortz died, But how are you doing?

823
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:25,279
Speaker 8: I'm doing fine. I was just telling General Listimo that

824
00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 8: you know, the world may be spinning off its access,

825
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:33,080
Speaker 8: but I'm fine. It's almost Christmas, so you know there's

826
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 8: a silver lining here someplace.

827
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:38,120
Speaker 1: I thought of you most recently before we get to

828
00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:42,320
Speaker 1: the Islamicism resurgent, when I was asked to do Winners

829
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:44,719
Speaker 1: and Loser of the Week on Special Report. And I'm

830
00:44:44,760 --> 00:44:47,040
Speaker 1: not a National League fan. I'm a Guardians fan, but

831
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:51,600
Speaker 1: I love the New York pet Met's New York Post cover.

832
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:54,640
Speaker 1: You gotta bereave. Did that hit hard?

833
00:44:57,719 --> 00:44:59,319
Speaker 6: That was stuff there.

834
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:01,919
Speaker 8: That's almost up there with the Ford to New York

835
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:02,719
Speaker 8: dropped dead right.

836
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:03,080
Speaker 3: I mean.

837
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:06,279
Speaker 8: People the whole same.

838
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 1: People went out and bought three copies so they could

839
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 1: frame them for each floor of their house.

840
00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 3: What happened to the matter, Like, I really.

841
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:17,720
Speaker 1: Don't know anything other than what Generalissimo tells me about

842
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:19,880
Speaker 1: the Angel and the Dodgers. I do not follow the

843
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 1: National League. How badly bet how much did they lose?

844
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 8: Well? The I think the thing that frustrates most of

845
00:45:28,719 --> 00:45:30,600
Speaker 8: us is that the big problem last year was the

846
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:34,560
Speaker 8: starting pitching, and that hasn't been addressed at all. I

847
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:37,440
Speaker 8: can't really you know, Searns is a smart guy, and

848
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 8: if he looked at the core of the team and

849
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 8: said this is not going to work, this group is

850
00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:44,480
Speaker 8: not going to win a World Series, I have to

851
00:45:45,080 --> 00:45:47,560
Speaker 8: say that you got to break it up. And because

852
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:51,320
Speaker 8: that's the goal. Even though I love Alonso and I

853
00:45:51,440 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 8: like Diaz and love Nemo, but you know, I think

854
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 8: they're not addressing They're not addressing what the consensus he

855
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 8: or his problem, which is starting pitching. So that's a

856
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 8: little frustrating.

857
00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 1: Well that's also the Angel. Even Dwayne can talk op

858
00:46:07,120 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 1: air during the break. Actually I want to talk to

859
00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:10,879
Speaker 1: during break. So next time, let's get to the key

860
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 1: subject at hand. Bondi Beach, and then we had the

861
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:18,320
Speaker 1: New York subway incident, and in between them the shooting

862
00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:18,880
Speaker 1: in Brown.

863
00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 3: I want to go out of sequence.

864
00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:23,640
Speaker 1: What are your thoughts about the shooting at Brown Because

865
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:25,680
Speaker 1: in all the years I've been in media, it's thirty

866
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:29,480
Speaker 1: five years, there's never been a mass shooting that they

867
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 1: didn't catch the purp within forty eight hours that I'm

868
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:33,239
Speaker 1: aware of.

869
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,279
Speaker 3: Are you aware of any?

870
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:38,840
Speaker 8: Off the top of my head, no, And I would

871
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:40,720
Speaker 8: have thought that if we were ever going to see

872
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:47,000
Speaker 8: that you I guess you know. Ramsey Usef got away

873
00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:51,560
Speaker 8: with the right after the World Trade Center bombing, but

874
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:54,920
Speaker 8: we did manage to arrest some people. He was the

875
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:56,839
Speaker 8: mass of mind, but he did manage to get out

876
00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:59,160
Speaker 8: of the country. But off the top of my head,

877
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:03,120
Speaker 8: not only know, but you would think that a college campus,

878
00:47:03,239 --> 00:47:08,359
Speaker 8: especially a modern American college campus, where their cameras just everywhere,

879
00:47:08,680 --> 00:47:10,920
Speaker 8: you would think it would be inconceivable.

880
00:47:11,600 --> 00:47:14,160
Speaker 1: Do you think it is possible he is holding someone

881
00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 1: hostage or that someone is hiding him.

882
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:23,200
Speaker 8: I think we can't discount anything, because it seems to

883
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 8: me that even though they don't have a didn't have

884
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:28,120
Speaker 8: a good look at his face. With all the different

885
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:32,120
Speaker 8: technology they have, including for you know, detecting people on

886
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 8: the basis of how they walk and other attributes, you

887
00:47:36,760 --> 00:47:40,880
Speaker 8: would think they could have struck gold with that, with

888
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,720
Speaker 8: the image that they did have, even if it wasn't facial.

889
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 8: So you would hope that even though they're not, you know,

890
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 8: they're holding back information, you would hope that they've narrowly

891
00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:57,759
Speaker 8: got the circle now of potential suspects, and if they

892
00:47:57,760 --> 00:48:01,600
Speaker 8: haven't been able to nab the person, that means that,

893
00:48:02,520 --> 00:48:05,880
Speaker 8: you know, anything could be going on that we you know,

894
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:09,359
Speaker 8: it'd be vacant speculation. What worries me is that they

895
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:12,840
Speaker 8: don't have a suspect, and I hope that's not true.

896
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:15,279
Speaker 1: Are you alarmed that they won't tell us what he

897
00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 1: was yelling in the room and everyone's speculating.

898
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:18,880
Speaker 3: I'm not.

899
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 1: But he was shouting something and it appears he targeted

900
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:24,560
Speaker 1: a few people and didn't shoot other people.

901
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:26,319
Speaker 3: What's that add up to you?

902
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:31,719
Speaker 8: I am distressed that they haven't told us what the

903
00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:33,960
Speaker 8: guy was yelling. I mean, I'm as aware as you

904
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:37,000
Speaker 8: are at the speculation about what it is and if

905
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:41,399
Speaker 8: it is, if it is indicative of jihadis terrorism. That's

906
00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:43,640
Speaker 8: a piece of information that you would think they would

907
00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 8: put out. I have to say, you know, putting out

908
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:49,160
Speaker 8: the picture of the second person, I really hope they

909
00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:52,479
Speaker 8: were very clear that that is not a person who's

910
00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:54,880
Speaker 8: a suspect, that it's just someone they think may have

911
00:48:55,680 --> 00:49:00,840
Speaker 8: information or may have seen something that's that's relevant. But

912
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:02,560
Speaker 8: I must say, if you're going to put out that

913
00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:06,160
Speaker 8: kind of obscure information to the public, and yet you

914
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:08,640
Speaker 8: have something he was yelling while he was shooting, and

915
00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:11,560
Speaker 8: you're withholding that, I don't understand that at all.

916
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:15,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes there are I know, two real lawyers,

917
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:17,080
Speaker 1: you and Kurt, and they're on both coachs, and you

918
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:19,000
Speaker 1: both say the same thing. I don't know anything about

919
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:21,719
Speaker 1: criminal law or the FBI getting involved. By the way,

920
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:24,160
Speaker 1: do you think the Bureau is involved and they're just

921
00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:27,640
Speaker 1: not telling us they're not at the press conferences.

922
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,319
Speaker 8: I think you that what may have happened here is

923
00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:34,160
Speaker 8: they really did kind of botch the first seventy two

924
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 8: hours of the Charlie Kirk aftermath. And what I'm hoping

925
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:43,040
Speaker 8: is that they oh the aftermath of that, talked about

926
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:46,440
Speaker 8: discipline and message discipline and let's not say anything or

927
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:49,480
Speaker 8: rear our heads till we have something helpful to contribute,

928
00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 8: because otherwise they just look inept. So I think it

929
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:56,760
Speaker 8: would be if that was the after action review after

930
00:49:56,840 --> 00:50:01,200
Speaker 8: the Charlie Kirk comicide. I think that's the that's beneficial.

931
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,960
Speaker 1: Okay, Now drawing the camera way out the three thousand

932
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,839
Speaker 1: feet do you tie up Bondai Beach with the New

933
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:12,440
Speaker 1: York City Subway? The Ani Semite's going after the Habadniks?

934
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:17,799
Speaker 1: Are we see an anti Semitism having its renaissance, its resurgence?

935
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:22,239
Speaker 8: Yeah, see don't. I've never seen it that way. And

936
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 8: you mentioned my books earlier. That interview we did almost

937
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:27,319
Speaker 8: twenty years ago.

938
00:50:27,560 --> 00:50:29,239
Speaker 3: I know it's remarkable about.

939
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:32,799
Speaker 8: Eighteen years ago, but I enjoyed that interview so much

940
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:36,319
Speaker 8: because we were able to talk about how in the

941
00:50:36,680 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 8: that was in the aftermath, even though the case happened

942
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:42,279
Speaker 8: in ninety five, it was in the aftermath of nine

943
00:50:42,320 --> 00:50:45,439
Speaker 8: to eleven, and the big difference then and I still

944
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:50,239
Speaker 8: think it's true, is that in our courtroom, presided over

945
00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 8: by Michael Mukasey, then a district judge later President Bush's

946
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:59,799
Speaker 8: Attorney General, there wasn't political correctness, and we were able

947
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:06,160
Speaker 8: to show the Drury a straight line between doctrine animating

948
00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:09,759
Speaker 8: figures like the blind Shake and the effect that it

949
00:51:09,840 --> 00:51:15,279
Speaker 8: had on young Muslims, and we were not forced to

950
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:22,320
Speaker 8: shy away from the doctrinal aspects of this. In later years,

951
00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:27,160
Speaker 8: the government tried to tamp down on the ideological basis

952
00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:30,359
Speaker 8: for all this because they thought that we couldn't walk

953
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:33,799
Speaker 8: into gum like if they said this was an interpretation

954
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:37,240
Speaker 8: of Islam, we were somehow smearing every Muslim on the planet,

955
00:51:37,280 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 8: which was ridiculous so to me because I had to

956
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:45,360
Speaker 8: go to school on that stuff back in the early nineties.

957
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:48,319
Speaker 8: This is Doc trinl. This is what the doctrine is.

958
00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:53,799
Speaker 8: And if you're going to have immigration policies and other

959
00:51:53,880 --> 00:52:00,000
Speaker 8: policies that enable a critical mass of immigrants from fundament

960
00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:05,359
Speaker 8: menalist Islamic countries and from hotbeds of radical Islam, and

961
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:08,279
Speaker 8: you're gonna let them collect in the big cities, not

962
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:10,320
Speaker 8: only in the United States but Europe, you're going to

963
00:52:10,360 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 8: get it.

964
00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 1: I'm going to talk with Andy during the break, we'll

965
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 1: put it on the podcast, and then he's coming back

966
00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:21,320
Speaker 1: after the break, so I'll saved Australian response for after

967
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 1: that o'cock doctrines during the break stay tuned America Andrews

968
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:26,360
Speaker 1: McCarthy on x Andy.

969
00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:27,720
Speaker 3: In recent.

970
00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:32,240
Speaker 1: Months years, actually since ten seven in Israel, I've become

971
00:52:32,520 --> 00:52:36,759
Speaker 1: quite a fan of Haviv reddhig Gore, and like you,

972
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:41,879
Speaker 1: he's always wanting to talk about the doctrine because it's

973
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 1: his belief. You can't understand, i'mascuse me, or any part

974
00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:49,200
Speaker 1: of the Jihad until you get Katub and the whole

975
00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:51,160
Speaker 1: fundamentalist Wahabism down.

976
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:54,680
Speaker 5: Have you followed him, I have.

977
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:58,160
Speaker 8: I agree with him. I've actually listened to a number

978
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:02,359
Speaker 8: of your interviews with him, and through that became more

979
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 8: of an avid follower. I think he's excellent, but I

980
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:10,640
Speaker 8: think what he would say, not to put words in

981
00:53:10,680 --> 00:53:13,440
Speaker 8: his mouth, is that this is pretty straightforward. What probably

982
00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:16,839
Speaker 8: frustrates him, as it frustrates me, is it's such an

983
00:53:16,840 --> 00:53:22,719
Speaker 8: obvious point. You know. I wrote a book called The

984
00:53:22,760 --> 00:53:26,600
Speaker 8: Grand Jihad, which was about the Muslim Brotherhood ideology and

985
00:53:26,680 --> 00:53:29,880
Speaker 8: its operations in the West, and I pointed out that

986
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:34,399
Speaker 8: the most successful project of the Muslim Brotherhood, which is

987
00:53:34,719 --> 00:53:38,560
Speaker 8: almost in the United States from like to the eighties,

988
00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:42,920
Speaker 8: on was dedicated to the flourishing of Hamas. Hamas is

989
00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:47,719
Speaker 8: the Palestinian branch of the Muslim Brotherhood. But the most

990
00:53:47,719 --> 00:53:50,080
Speaker 8: successful project that they had in the West was the

991
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:55,720
Speaker 8: Muslim Students Associations. In fact, they started with a handful

992
00:53:55,760 --> 00:53:59,319
Speaker 8: of chapters in the mid nineteen sixties and they now

993
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:02,239
Speaker 8: have one hundreds of chapters across North America, in the

994
00:54:02,360 --> 00:54:08,120
Speaker 8: United States and Canada. And that is not a social organization,

995
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:11,600
Speaker 8: that's a program. And my point is like, there are

996
00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:15,520
Speaker 8: a lot of people who woke up after ten seven

997
00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 8: and they couldn't believe the campus activism. And I just

998
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:21,759
Speaker 8: shook my head and said, you know, if you let

999
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:26,400
Speaker 8: this go on for three generations. And that program was

1000
00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:33,959
Speaker 8: so successful it gave way to another organization, the North

1001
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 8: American Islamic Society. I'm probably screwing up the name, but

1002
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:42,680
Speaker 8: the thing was, the Muslim Students Associations were so successful

1003
00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:45,719
Speaker 8: they had to have a successor organization, which is now

1004
00:54:45,760 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 8: the biggest Islamist organization in North America because so many

1005
00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:54,480
Speaker 8: people went through the program. So don't I don't. I'm

1006
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:58,000
Speaker 8: not remotely surprised by this. Which surprises me is that

1007
00:54:59,160 --> 00:55:02,560
Speaker 8: people don't want to understand what they believed. If you

1008
00:55:02,600 --> 00:55:05,520
Speaker 8: can think about like if we went into World War

1009
00:55:05,560 --> 00:55:08,560
Speaker 8: two and we didn't want to know what the Nazis

1010
00:55:08,560 --> 00:55:12,319
Speaker 8: believed or what the Shinto Japanese believed, we would all

1011
00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:15,400
Speaker 8: say that was insane, that you couldn't protect the country

1012
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:19,000
Speaker 8: without knowing what the enemy was trying to accomplish. And

1013
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:22,799
Speaker 8: yet here it's like institutionalized and always has been that

1014
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 8: we have to put our head in this thing.

1015
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:27,399
Speaker 1: You know that that's very well said when you say

1016
00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:31,080
Speaker 1: it again on the other side, Andy, not wanting to

1017
00:55:31,200 --> 00:55:33,279
Speaker 1: know what the other side.

1018
00:55:33,040 --> 00:55:35,200
Speaker 3: Believes is suicidal.

1019
00:55:35,640 --> 00:55:38,520
Speaker 1: And I got a letter from Harvard yesterday, an email

1020
00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:41,359
Speaker 1: asking for money or telling me that Graver is going

1021
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:43,399
Speaker 1: to be the president. And you know in that letter

1022
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:45,880
Speaker 1: they said, and he will continue the efforts against anti

1023
00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:51,279
Speaker 1: Semitism and anti Arab discrimination. And I thought, good lord,

1024
00:55:52,160 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 1: nothing's changed. There is no anti Arab discrimination in Harvard.

1025
00:55:55,960 --> 00:55:58,080
Speaker 1: Not the problem. I'll be right back on the other

1026
00:55:58,120 --> 00:56:00,799
Speaker 1: side with Andrew C. McCarthy. We'll talk about Australia and

1027
00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:02,920
Speaker 1: when the when is it going to happen in the

1028
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:10,960
Speaker 1: United States. Stay tuned, Welcome back in America. I'm Hugh

1029
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:14,360
Speaker 1: Hewitt with Andrews C. McCarthy, Fox News contributor, author of

1030
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:17,480
Speaker 1: Wilful Blindness, The Grand Gid. He has also got his

1031
00:56:17,560 --> 00:56:21,560
Speaker 1: own podcast with Rich Lowry, The McCarthy Report. Uh Andy,

1032
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:26,359
Speaker 1: it's I've got six minutes When and and Does an

1033
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:30,960
Speaker 1: Australian shootout like the one that happened on Saturday in

1034
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:34,200
Speaker 1: Australia at Bondey Beach happen in the United States?

1035
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:34,840
Speaker 3: Do you think.

1036
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 8: Happily? I think that there's less chance of it. I'm

1037
00:56:39,040 --> 00:56:41,680
Speaker 8: not going to say that there's there's zero chances of it.

1038
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:45,440
Speaker 8: But the big difference view I think between the United

1039
00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:51,719
Speaker 8: States and Europe, Canada and Australia is we don't have

1040
00:56:51,840 --> 00:56:57,680
Speaker 8: anything like no zones here. So far. The police, whether

1041
00:56:57,719 --> 00:57:03,520
Speaker 8: it's federal or municipal police, have not essentially surrendered sovereignty

1042
00:57:05,239 --> 00:57:10,560
Speaker 8: in particular areas where where you have cauldrons of jihadism.

1043
00:57:10,600 --> 00:57:14,960
Speaker 8: That's where you would expect this stuff to blossom. And

1044
00:57:15,719 --> 00:57:18,040
Speaker 8: what they've done in Europe, you know, this was Shake

1045
00:57:18,160 --> 00:57:22,040
Speaker 8: Caradali's strategy. He was the shake use of Carradali was

1046
00:57:22,080 --> 00:57:27,800
Speaker 8: the kind of the beacon for the Muslim brotherhood. His

1047
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:33,320
Speaker 8: idea was to tell Muslims integrate but don't assimilate, form

1048
00:57:33,400 --> 00:57:37,040
Speaker 8: up enclaves in major cities in the West, and once

1049
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:40,960
Speaker 8: you get to a critical mass, agitate in order to

1050
00:57:41,080 --> 00:57:46,120
Speaker 8: have Sharia autonomy in the local area. And once they've

1051
00:57:46,160 --> 00:57:49,439
Speaker 8: gotten to critical mass in a number of places, they're

1052
00:57:49,560 --> 00:57:53,760
Speaker 8: very hostile to the police and other agents of the States.

1053
00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:58,120
Speaker 8: And when you have an environment like that, that's where

1054
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:05,800
Speaker 8: the thementalists preaching can take place, the recruitment, the fundraising,

1055
00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:09,320
Speaker 8: and it lends itself to an atmosphere where you can

1056
00:58:09,360 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 8: actually train for Gihatti's activities. The difference mainly between successful

1057
00:58:15,120 --> 00:58:20,200
Speaker 8: and unsuccessful jihadist plots is training where you can have it.

1058
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:23,960
Speaker 8: You're much more likely to have terrorist attacks. Where the

1059
00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:27,920
Speaker 8: police can infiltrate, you're much less likely to have them now.

1060
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:30,200
Speaker 1: And I know you've been a critic of the Trump

1061
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:33,480
Speaker 1: Justice Department on a lot of different things. Do you

1062
00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:38,280
Speaker 1: think the Bureau and DOJ and State Attorney are they

1063
00:58:38,280 --> 00:58:42,480
Speaker 1: on my lookout for this? Are they still where we

1064
00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:44,760
Speaker 1: were on a nine to twelve. I think it's gone away,

1065
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:46,560
Speaker 1: but I could just be blind to the fact that

1066
00:58:46,560 --> 00:58:48,760
Speaker 1: it's better than I think it is, and it's everywhere

1067
00:58:49,120 --> 00:58:51,000
Speaker 1: surveillance and infiltration.

1068
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:54,520
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think the FBI and the Justice Department in

1069
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:59,800
Speaker 8: this administration are less apt to be captured by political correctness,

1070
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:03,400
Speaker 8: and they won't be afraid to take a shot if

1071
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:07,960
Speaker 8: there's you know, they won't be afraid to be proactive.

1072
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:11,320
Speaker 8: I mean, I think this plot that they just broke up,

1073
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:14,760
Speaker 8: the New Year's Day plot shows that I think they'll

1074
00:59:14,800 --> 00:59:16,760
Speaker 8: be active. I think this is the kind of thing

1075
00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:20,680
Speaker 8: they'll be good on. I worry about how well the

1076
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:24,479
Speaker 8: President grasps suria supremacism. You know, we're back to talking

1077
00:59:24,520 --> 00:59:28,440
Speaker 8: about the ideology again, because I think sometimes the President

1078
00:59:28,520 --> 00:59:32,880
Speaker 8: thinks that everybody has a price and everybody, you know,

1079
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:36,560
Speaker 8: can look beyond ideology and other things they care about.

1080
00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:38,720
Speaker 8: And I think there's a lot of evil actors in

1081
00:59:38,760 --> 00:59:43,240
Speaker 8: the worldview that you know, they're just they're captured by

1082
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:46,240
Speaker 8: evil ideology and they're not looking to make a deal.

1083
00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:47,280
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1084
00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:49,880
Speaker 1: I still ask first time guests if they've read The

1085
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:52,560
Speaker 1: Looming Tower. I've been doing that since Lawn's Right wrote it.

1086
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:56,040
Speaker 1: An astonishing number of people don't even know what it is.

1087
00:59:56,120 --> 00:59:57,800
Speaker 1: Some people have said they've read a part of it

1088
00:59:57,920 --> 00:59:59,760
Speaker 1: or heard about it and want to read it, But

1089
00:59:59,840 --> 01:00:04,680
Speaker 1: I I really think it's been twenty five years, right, yep?

1090
01:00:04,920 --> 01:00:06,200
Speaker 3: Are we off our guard again?

1091
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:12,200
Speaker 8: Well, it's a natural phenomenon when you go through a

1092
01:00:12,280 --> 01:00:17,040
Speaker 8: spate of time, you know. I think it's pretty remarkable

1093
01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:19,720
Speaker 8: that we haven't had a reprise of nine to eleven,

1094
01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:23,440
Speaker 8: given how hard they've tried. But the one thing I

1095
01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:26,160
Speaker 8: can say, and I you know, we're looking for a

1096
01:00:26,200 --> 01:00:31,480
Speaker 8: silver lining, hear you, I'll say this, the cooperation between

1097
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:35,040
Speaker 8: law enforcement and intelligence and the way that they take

1098
01:00:35,080 --> 01:00:38,360
Speaker 8: information from the public and move it up the chain

1099
01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:41,440
Speaker 8: is night and day better today than it was in

1100
01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:45,480
Speaker 8: nineteen ninety three. And I think haven't had a reprise

1101
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:49,960
Speaker 8: is because the guys on it, no matter what the

1102
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:52,400
Speaker 8: political people are saying, the guys on the front line

1103
01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:55,360
Speaker 8: to do this, the intelligence guys, the cops, the FBI

1104
01:00:55,520 --> 01:00:58,400
Speaker 8: agents in the field, they actually do a good job

1105
01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 8: and they share information with vital.

1106
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:05,080
Speaker 1: And the last silver lining we got thirty seconds. Do

1107
01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:07,640
Speaker 1: you think some of the Muslim majority countries are also

1108
01:01:07,800 --> 01:01:10,280
Speaker 1: all in with us and stopping the Brotherhood?

1109
01:01:11,840 --> 01:01:15,360
Speaker 8: No, I mean I think that the regimes are, But

1110
01:01:15,480 --> 01:01:18,080
Speaker 8: like Egypt is a very difficult country for us because

1111
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:21,600
Speaker 8: the regime is more or less pro American and pro Western,

1112
01:01:21,640 --> 01:01:25,640
Speaker 8: but it's a cauldron of fundamentalist Islam. It's the population,

1113
01:01:26,600 --> 01:01:26,960
Speaker 8: all right.

1114
01:01:27,040 --> 01:01:28,760
Speaker 3: Realism is what we get with Andy.

1115
01:01:28,800 --> 01:01:31,640
Speaker 1: I hope you take back the pen and I'll listen

1116
01:01:31,680 --> 01:01:34,240
Speaker 1: to McCarthy report this week when you and Rich get together,

1117
01:01:34,280 --> 01:01:36,400
Speaker 1: because it's going to be one for the ages. I

1118
01:01:36,440 --> 01:01:40,320
Speaker 1: think Andrew C. McCarthy on X the mccarthury Report wherever

1119
01:01:40,360 --> 01:01:43,720
Speaker 1: podcasts are, Thank you and a Merry Christmas, Andy, maybe

1120
01:01:43,720 --> 01:01:46,800
Speaker 1: the Mets will put a pitching a tree.

1121
01:01:47,440 --> 01:01:50,040
Speaker 3: Under your tree for you. Thank you friend. Don't go

1122
01:01:50,040 --> 01:01:53,920
Speaker 3: anywhere America. I'll be right back. It's beginning to go

1123
01:01:54,160 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 3: up like Christmas, Ey, were you Welcome back America.

1124
01:02:00,800 --> 01:02:03,080
Speaker 1: I'm Hugh Hewitt's actually beginning to look like the Bad

1125
01:02:03,160 --> 01:02:07,560
Speaker 1: Santa Movie. In the House of Representatives, it requires two

1126
01:02:07,600 --> 01:02:11,600
Speaker 1: hundred and eighteen signatures on a discharge petition to get

1127
01:02:11,600 --> 01:02:15,240
Speaker 1: a piece of legislation onto the House floor. Democrats have

1128
01:02:15,400 --> 01:02:20,200
Speaker 1: rounded up four Republicans to get a three year no

1129
01:02:22,120 --> 01:02:27,720
Speaker 1: Questions asked extension of the Obamacare subsidies. Brian Fitzpatrick of Pennsylvania,

1130
01:02:28,120 --> 01:02:31,919
Speaker 1: Rob Reresnehan of Pennsylvania, Ryan Mackenzie, a Pennsylvania and our

1131
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:35,240
Speaker 1: old friend maybe not any longer, Micha Lawler of New York.

1132
01:02:35,720 --> 01:02:38,960
Speaker 1: And so now the discharge petition has enough. I'm joined

1133
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:43,960
Speaker 1: by Sarah Bedford, Washington Examiner, political investigative reporter. Merry Christmas, Sarah,

1134
01:02:44,000 --> 01:02:47,600
Speaker 1: how are you.

1135
01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:47,440
Speaker 3: Merry Christmas? Thanks for having me.

1136
01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:50,760
Speaker 1: I'm always good to see you. Can they take their

1137
01:02:50,840 --> 01:02:52,400
Speaker 1: name off that discharge petition?

1138
01:02:54,640 --> 01:02:58,200
Speaker 9: Not once a discharge position petition has reached two hundred

1139
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:01,120
Speaker 9: and eighteen signatures. If they had a change of heart

1140
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:06,200
Speaker 9: before the discharge petition had gathered enough signatures, then they

1141
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:09,640
Speaker 9: could have done so. But it's frozen. It's locked in

1142
01:03:09,760 --> 01:03:11,840
Speaker 9: once they hit the two eighteen number. And so at

1143
01:03:11,880 --> 01:03:14,919
Speaker 9: this point, no, none of those four Republicans. It doesn't

1144
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:17,320
Speaker 9: look like they would be able to remove their signatures.

1145
01:03:18,160 --> 01:03:22,200
Speaker 1: What if they quit, because it's just quicker they can

1146
01:03:22,280 --> 01:03:24,440
Speaker 1: get their office moved out sooner because they're all going

1147
01:03:24,520 --> 01:03:28,240
Speaker 1: to lose. I mean, I'm as partisan as they come,

1148
01:03:28,320 --> 01:03:30,160
Speaker 1: but when you screw your party this way, this is

1149
01:03:30,160 --> 01:03:32,840
Speaker 1: pretty This is like the guys who tossed on McCarthy,

1150
01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:34,440
Speaker 1: only on the other end of the caucus.

1151
01:03:36,160 --> 01:03:39,800
Speaker 9: Well, there's a perennial complaint especially among conservatives, right that

1152
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:44,440
Speaker 9: moderates do things that depress the base overall for everyone

1153
01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:46,960
Speaker 9: in order to save seats that they may not even

1154
01:03:47,000 --> 01:03:49,200
Speaker 9: be able to hang on to either way, So you

1155
01:03:49,320 --> 01:03:52,880
Speaker 9: might as well fight for conservative principles. The way that

1156
01:03:52,920 --> 01:03:57,240
Speaker 9: the Republican Party has handled this moment with the expiration

1157
01:03:57,320 --> 01:03:59,680
Speaker 9: of the ACA subsidies is really baffling to a lot

1158
01:03:59,720 --> 01:04:02,919
Speaker 9: of servatives because they've had many, many years to come

1159
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:06,919
Speaker 9: up with ideas to perform a healthcare program that they've

1160
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:11,480
Speaker 9: been criticizing for more than a decade now, and yet

1161
01:04:11,840 --> 01:04:16,440
Speaker 9: they're scrambling at this last moment, and you have moderates

1162
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:20,040
Speaker 9: like Fitzpatrick saying that a clean extension of the substace

1163
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:23,080
Speaker 9: is better than no extension, which is not a very

1164
01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:26,680
Speaker 9: traditionally conservative position, And yeah, it's really angering to a

1165
01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:27,880
Speaker 9: lot of other Republicans.

1166
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:31,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, there is not a prayer that it will ever

1167
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:36,200
Speaker 1: get through the Senate. And I think these four were

1168
01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:38,080
Speaker 1: you know, I gave and so did a lot of

1169
01:04:38,080 --> 01:04:42,360
Speaker 1: people cover for them when they wanted assault cap increase

1170
01:04:42,720 --> 01:04:45,160
Speaker 1: because I understand the districts in the Northeast and all that,

1171
01:04:45,560 --> 01:04:47,880
Speaker 1: but then to turn around and vote for a dead

1172
01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:50,960
Speaker 1: on a rival bill, so all they want it's just

1173
01:04:51,040 --> 01:04:51,880
Speaker 1: really showmanship.

1174
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:52,120
Speaker 3: Right.

1175
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:54,680
Speaker 1: If there's a good case to be made for this,

1176
01:04:55,080 --> 01:04:57,160
Speaker 1: you can tell it to me. I am unaware of it.

1177
01:04:59,120 --> 01:04:59,160
Speaker 7: No.

1178
01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:01,800
Speaker 9: I mean, there are the more viable proposals in the

1179
01:05:01,840 --> 01:05:06,880
Speaker 9: House that have things like income caps or expanding hsas

1180
01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:10,400
Speaker 9: and things that would get other Republicans to get on board,

1181
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:12,840
Speaker 9: and that wouldn't be seen as a sort of betrayal

1182
01:05:12,920 --> 01:05:15,840
Speaker 9: of principles. And this really does sort of look like

1183
01:05:15,880 --> 01:05:19,040
Speaker 9: a middle finger to leadership because Speaker Johnson had said

1184
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:22,080
Speaker 9: he wasn't going to bring any of these compromises to

1185
01:05:22,120 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 9: the floor. I Fitzpatrick said, you know, I really tried

1186
01:05:24,840 --> 01:05:28,240
Speaker 9: to get some of my bipartisan or you know, more

1187
01:05:28,320 --> 01:05:31,600
Speaker 9: centrist compromises to the floor, and when that didn't happen,

1188
01:05:31,720 --> 01:05:33,560
Speaker 9: then I had to kind of just be like, screw you,

1189
01:05:33,600 --> 01:05:37,520
Speaker 9: I'll go aside with the Democrats. And you know, Johnson

1190
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:41,640
Speaker 9: was sort of put in an impossible position here, right

1191
01:05:41,720 --> 01:05:45,160
Speaker 9: because Trump and Jade Vance they didn't run on cutting.

1192
01:05:44,800 --> 01:05:46,080
Speaker 5: Subsidies for people.

1193
01:05:46,200 --> 01:05:46,320
Speaker 7: Right.

1194
01:05:46,360 --> 01:05:50,000
Speaker 9: But at the same time, it is not anywhere in

1195
01:05:50,000 --> 01:05:53,880
Speaker 9: the conservative playbook to allow a COVID era subsidy like

1196
01:05:53,920 --> 01:05:56,520
Speaker 9: this to continue. To prop up a broken healthcare system,

1197
01:05:56,960 --> 01:05:59,760
Speaker 9: and so leadership the White House was in a really

1198
01:06:00,080 --> 01:06:02,760
Speaker 9: awful position here. But they really did get undermined by

1199
01:06:02,800 --> 01:06:04,080
Speaker 9: these marporate members.

1200
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:07,400
Speaker 1: I think it is the mirror of Matt Gates and

1201
01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:10,280
Speaker 1: his knucklehead caucus what they did when they threw Kevin

1202
01:06:10,360 --> 01:06:15,000
Speaker 1: McCarthy out, which is they wanted some attention, the attention economy.

1203
01:06:15,440 --> 01:06:17,840
Speaker 1: They threw a fit. They threw out the most effective

1204
01:06:17,840 --> 01:06:20,200
Speaker 1: fundraiser of the Republican Party they've ever had, and they

1205
01:06:20,280 --> 01:06:22,160
Speaker 1: got nothing. Mike Johnson is a wonderful speaker, is a

1206
01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:26,640
Speaker 1: good speaker, but Lawler is and they're not going to

1207
01:06:26,720 --> 01:06:28,920
Speaker 1: get anything out of it. If there was any way

1208
01:06:29,000 --> 01:06:31,160
Speaker 1: that they would get anying out of this, I would say, okay,

1209
01:06:31,680 --> 01:06:33,040
Speaker 1: but it's not good politics.

1210
01:06:33,240 --> 01:06:36,520
Speaker 3: It's terrible paulitics. They'll probably get a primary challenge, will they.

1211
01:06:38,040 --> 01:06:41,360
Speaker 9: Well, the four of them are probably concerned about staying

1212
01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:44,000
Speaker 9: in Congress, right, And that's the only point of difference

1213
01:06:44,000 --> 01:06:45,800
Speaker 9: that I would say with Matt Gates, he was running

1214
01:06:45,840 --> 01:06:48,120
Speaker 9: in a very heavily Republican district. He never had a

1215
01:06:48,200 --> 01:06:52,320
Speaker 9: fear for his reelection prospects, whereas these four are probably

1216
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:55,440
Speaker 9: quite nervous about what's going to happen in November, and

1217
01:06:55,600 --> 01:06:58,000
Speaker 9: confident that it would be really difficult for anyone to

1218
01:06:58,040 --> 01:06:59,560
Speaker 9: primary them from the right.

1219
01:06:59,840 --> 01:07:02,320
Speaker 5: In those really competitive districts.

1220
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:04,840
Speaker 9: That they may end up losing no matter what they do,

1221
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:07,880
Speaker 9: But that was likely. The calculation here is that they

1222
01:07:07,960 --> 01:07:12,360
Speaker 9: fear leaderships not looking out for their interests heading into upbraaking.

1223
01:07:12,520 --> 01:07:15,000
Speaker 1: They think that the Republican Party had no choice but

1224
01:07:15,120 --> 01:07:16,560
Speaker 1: to support them because they're wrong.

1225
01:07:19,320 --> 01:07:20,600
Speaker 5: Well, I think that they were.

1226
01:07:20,640 --> 01:07:23,960
Speaker 9: Probably They probably don't fear a primary challenge from the

1227
01:07:24,040 --> 01:07:27,280
Speaker 9: right that would be extremely difficult in a district like Lawlors,

1228
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:30,160
Speaker 9: for example, in New York, which is very competitive.

1229
01:07:31,200 --> 01:07:33,880
Speaker 3: Come I got maybe maybe that's the case.

1230
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:37,160
Speaker 1: But come November twenty sixth, and the NRCC has to

1231
01:07:37,200 --> 01:07:40,959
Speaker 1: spend money and people want airtime and they're begging for help.

1232
01:07:41,600 --> 01:07:44,520
Speaker 1: Those four don't get any Sarah, I'll talk to you

1233
01:07:44,520 --> 01:07:47,160
Speaker 1: one more time. Be poor Christmas, stay well. No one

1234
01:07:47,160 --> 01:07:48,960
Speaker 1: else is Sarah Bedford.

1235
01:07:49,080 --> 01:07:49,480
Speaker 3: Thank you, mich